Milwaukee Midget

[wobblywalrus]

In reference to post 4621, the lobe center angle and other aspect of cam timing can be adjusted to bring your peak torque and HP rpms down to reasonable levels.

[Milwaukee Midget]

In reference to post 4621, the lobe center angle and other aspect of cam timing can be adjusted to bring your peak torque and HP rpms down to reasonable levels.

The advantages of a DOHC arrangement and adjustable LCAs will be fully utilized, even if it means buying intake and exhaust cams from different manufacturers to optimize things. 

We're looking at about a 2 1/2 inch stroke on this thing - motorcycle territory.  Given the dimensions, it would be easy to accidentally build a 12,000 RPM engine - it'll be trickier building a really strong 8-9k motor with a fat power band.

And while we could build a 12k screamer out of it, we'd be then looking at a different transmission - I doubt the ribcage Spridget transmission would be happy at those revs - a new clutch arrangement, probably 4:55 gears rather than the 4:22s, a stronger driveshaft.  Everything else gets complex really quickly.

We still need to generate some numbers.  Mark has the head, we'll start with the flow numbers.  Wossner has a part number for a hi comp piston for the 1.4 Rover with 75 mm bores, so they've got the head shape in their files, and they're on my list of visits at PRI in a few weeks.

I'm hoping to have a bit more info in place before we go to Indy.

 

[Koncretekid]

I don't understand why you would worry more about your transmission, clutch, and driveshaft with the 12,000 RPM version than you would with the 8-9,000 RPM motor.  If the horsepower is the same, then the lower RPM motor will have a higher peak torque which is what your clutch, tranny, and driveshaft will need to sustain.  Unless the higher RPM is detrimental to gears and bearings, the strength requirement should be reduced with the higher RPM motor.
Tom

[Milwaukee Midget]

I don't understand why you would worry more about your transmission, clutch, and driveshaft with the 12,000 RPM version than you would with the 8-9,000 RPM motor.  If the horsepower is the same, then the lower RPM motor will have a higher peak torque which is what your clutch, tranny, and driveshaft will need to sustain.  Unless the higher RPM is detrimental to gears and bearings, the strength requirement should be reduced with the higher RPM motor.
Tom

Fair comment.  Here are my rationales -

Yes, I've upgraded the transmission with straight cut gears, and while similarly modded transmissions routinely handle 135-140 hp in vintage racing, they don't often get buzzed past 9k, except by accident.  While I did a 9500 rpm launch with a push off last year, 12 k would be uncharted territory.  It's a screw-type lubricating system, and I don't know if it would properly lubricate itself at those rpms, or if it would just shuck the oil.  There's a lot of potential windage in there, so the additional RPM might well be detrimental to gears and bearings.  

The clutch is stock.  I haven't had it apart yet, but we're talking riveted friction material and a stamped cover.  Yeah, I probably should be looking at an upgrade.

As far as the driveshaft is concerned, even with a 5:1 rear end, 130 equals less than 10k, but that's still 25% faster than it has spun before.  That's a lot of revs for a driveshaft attached to a sprung axle through U-joints.  If it were an IRS setup, with the pumpkin secured to the same frame as the transmission, yeah, that'd likely be okay.

I want to be incremental.  An additional 1000 rpm would be incremental.  I think an additional 4000 RPM would just be mental.  

Although it would sound awesome . . .  

[Rex Schimmer]

Not sure that I would be concerned about the drive shaft, when I was working for a Mazda team we would buzz them to 11,000 in sprint races and with the tranny having a 15% over drive the drive shaft would typically see 12,000+ and we never had a problem. Your concern about tranny lubrication is warranted, a few additional rpm would not be a problem but a 25%+ increase is probably to much. Yes rpm if properly applied make horse power and it is horse power that makes speed but you don't need to make new problems that require large development when staying in the 9-10 grand area will get you to your goal. Ever seen a clutch explode at 12K, messy, very messy even with a good shield.

Rex

[Milwaukee Midget]

Not sure that I would be concerned about the drive shaft, when I was working for a Mazda team we would buzz them to 11,000 in sprint races and with the tranny having a 15% over drive the drive shaft would typically see 12,000+ and we never had a problem. Your concern about tranny lubrication is warranted, a few additional rpm would not be a problem but a 25%+ increase is probably to much. Yes rpm if properly applied make horse power and it is horse power that makes speed but you don't need to make new problems that require large development when staying in the 9-10 grand area will get you to your goal. Ever seen a clutch explode at 12K, messy, very messy even with a good shield.

Rex

I'd forgotten the rear ends or the early RX-7s were a live axle arrangement, but I will argue they were more securely located than a with pair of leaf springs and lever shocks, and less prone to monkey motion.

And the 944 ran a driveshaft at engine speed all day.

[Jack Gifford]

Is the stock clutch in a can (or shielded)?

[Milwaukee Midget]

I had a ballistic blanket approved for it by SCTA - Aluminum transmission case/bellhousing combination.

The clutch is - as I recall - about 7".

[4-barrel Mike]

Another for your collection, Chris: http://butte.craigslist.org/cto/4768845918.html

I wonder if the top and upholstery are savable?  

What would the nose alone be worth?

Mike

[Peter Jack]

Does that mean they're paying someone $4,800.00 to take it? It would take that much just to get around the color and the upholstery. 

Pete

[Stan Back]

But it's the rare "2-Door Convertible" model.

[Seldom Seen Slim]

Do I sense some negativity here?  My first (and brief) look had me thinking how cool it'd be to have, to squire Nancy around, to ride up and down the highways up here, hair blowing in the arctic air.  After reading these comments I might just change my mind.  Anyway -- $4800 is a long way from being in our "frivolous" stuff account.

[Milwaukee Midget]

What would the nose alone be worth?

Mike

$1495, FOB, San Fernando . . .

http://www.speedwellengineering.com/fiberglass/

Although it looks more like a Devon clip than a Speedwell . . .

For the time being, I'm limiting my efforts to the Kettle and getting the Bugeye screwed together for spring.  The MGB is already stowed away at my sister's house in Madison, the attic is full, and I've got half of Alcoa's GM castings output from 1962 in the basement . . .

Anybody need a spare 215 Oldsmobile or Buick?

[manta22]

Those are nice little V8s. What are you asking $

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

[Milwaukee Midget]

Those are nice little V8s. What are you asking $

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

I see prices on these all over the map, and they're a natural for MGB and TR7 conversions.  Personally, while I'm a tad short on the resources, I'd love to put one of these in an S-10 frame with a Willys pickup body, an MG Magnette or a modified Morris Minor Panel Van.

I still have to inventory the parts.  There are two Buick blocks, an Olds block, a total of 10 heads (one Olds set), valves, rockers, springs, con rods, 5 manifolds (I think one is a turbo manifold) and a JC Whitney 300 degree cam, still in the box.  Most of the pile is disassembled and in coffee cans and boxes.

The assembled rebuilt unit is going into the Bugeye, and I built a warm solvent tank to soak everything else and assess parts.

Until I know what I've got, it would be unfair to anybody to even guess.  I intend to get everything cleaned up, get pertinent measurements, assess the quality of the parts, bag 'em up and try to put reasonably complete kits together.  Once that's in place, the leftovers will either go on eBay or to the recycler.

Yeah, they are cool little engines, but right now, I'm looking at boxes of worm cans.

I'm sure the prices will be reasonable once I get to the point that I can give honest information about them.