Author Topic: Milwaukee Midget  (Read 3275375 times)

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Offline wheelrdealer

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4350 on: September 09, 2014, 01:19:27 PM »
This project started in 2008 if you can believe we wasted that much time on this poor bastard.  :evil:

Chris started with more than the average guy when he started this build. In other words, about 5% of what he needed.

The net result was 22 MPH.

Stir in Mark and thousands of posts of advice from this gnarly crowd and BAZINGA!

Next time a newby chimes in we need to direct him here and tell him to come back after he has read the whole thing, redesigned his entire program because of it, and has gained a whole lot of respect for the Grenade.

Tell me YOU didn't learn something from all of this. I sure as hell did.

Chris! You da man!


I did too, I want a car I can turn upside down, set it on the cage and work on the chassis! Darn the rotisserie  stuff.

Thanks for bringing the Midget Record back to the US! And in style I should say.

BR
ECTA    Maxton D/CGALT  Record Holder 167.522
ECTA    Maxton D/CBGALT Record Holder 166.715

WWW.WHEELRDEALER2100.COM

Offline gas pumper

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4351 on: September 09, 2014, 02:02:51 PM »
 :cheers:
Crew for 608 AA/GL.
Crew for The Flying Seven, 7207, XO/GCT, V4/FCT Loring.

Offline Finallygotit

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4352 on: September 09, 2014, 03:15:54 PM »
Dan
Tucson, AZ

gkabbt

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4353 on: September 09, 2014, 04:58:10 PM »
landracing.com "like" button --->  :cheers:

Mike  :mrgreen:

GREAT ONE Mike! ROTFLMFAO!   So apropos for this crowd!  :-D  :-D  :-D
:cheers:

Gregg
« Last Edit: September 09, 2014, 05:11:14 PM by gkabbt »

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4354 on: September 10, 2014, 02:30:19 PM »
Rambling musings from a Bonneville virgin . . . . . . .

Followers of MM's build diary might recall that the previous best run for the "Milwaukee Midget" was 118.693 mph.  This year's new "Best Run" was 126.684 mph

So during the 1600 miles and 21 hours crammed into the "Dodge" (masquerading as a tow vehicle) the conversation inevitably turned to: "THE QUESTION"

"Where the hell did the 8 mph come from?"

Some obvious thoughts that occurred to us:

1)  Old bhp 95.1;  new bhp 99.1, for a 4.2061% increase.  Since velocity increases as a cube function of power, 1.62 mph could be allotted to power increase.   :-)
2)  Push start to 30/35 mph.   This probably helped, but how do you quantify it?   :?
3)  Tail wind at the start line.   Pretty constant 7-9 mph with gusts to 14 mph.   This undoubtedly helped, but again, how do you quantify it?   :?    Also, consider that the
     backup run was into a 8-10 mph headwind, and that did not totally kill it.   So ? ? ? ?   :?
4)  Aero gains.  This year the car is about 1 inch lower in the rear and 2.5 inches lower in the front.   Had to help overall CD number, but how much? ?   :?
5)  Drag reduction gains.   :-)
     A)  Lower viscosity fluids; engine, trans, diff.   :-)
     B)  Higher fluid temps.  Used magnetic heaters to preheat engine oil and diff fluid.   :-)
     C)  Brake drag reduction.  Well, no more front brakes!!   And backed off on the rears.   :-)
     D)  Trick wheel bearing grease.   Some NASA developed stuff used for racing bicycles.   :-)
     E)  Change front toe-in from 1/8" in, to zero.   :-)
     F)  Change tire pressure from 50 psig to 70 psig.  Seemed to help rolling resistance, but again,   :?
     G)  On a totally subjective note, 'the car' has become quite easy to push.   Once it's rolling, one person can keep it going with a mere two fingers . . . .   :-)

I guess I'm going to have to start punching numbers in to my copy of "Bonneville Pro" to try to gain some insight on this.

In the meantime, I'm going with part of my signoff remarks, (the one I changed the color on this morning):

"Does paying attention to all the 'little details' matter?"   "I dunno, but I think you should ask the guy who finishes second . . . . ."
 :cheers:
Fordboy
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline manta22

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4355 on: September 10, 2014, 02:35:42 PM »
5G might be a good indicator.

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

Offline Old Scrambler

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4356 on: September 10, 2014, 03:25:00 PM »
Congrats :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: and I TOTALLY AGREE with the details that resulted in 5-G 8-)
2011 AMA Record - 250cc M-PG TRIUMPH Tiger Cub - 82.5 mph
2013 AMA Record - 250cc MPS-PG TRIUMPH Tiger Cub - 88.7 mph
2018 AMA Record - 750cc M-CG HONDA CB750 sohc - 136.6 mph
2018 AMA Record - 750cc MPS-CG HONDA CB750 sohc - 143.005 mph
2018 AMA Record - 750cc M-CF HONDA CB750 sohc - 139.85 mph
2018 AMA Record - 750cc MPS-CF HONDA CB750 sohc - 144.2025 mph

Chassis Builder / Tuner: Dave Murre

Offline Peter Jack

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4357 on: September 10, 2014, 03:52:42 PM »
All I can say is that you guys with your attention to all the little details did a h-e-l-l of a job! Congratulations to the team!  :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

Pete

Offline Ron Gibson

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4358 on: September 10, 2014, 05:29:52 PM »
Congratulations Chris. I intended to get by to see you but obviously that didn't happen. I don't think anyone worked harder or deserves it more than you, with proper credits to your helpers. Well done.  :cheers: :cheers:

Ron
Life is an abrasive. Whether you get ground away or polished to a shine depends on what you are made of.

Offline Kiwi Paul

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4359 on: September 10, 2014, 09:17:30 PM »
Fordbro...Tailwind vs Headwind really provides the lions share of the differential. A long time ago at El Mirage, I helped a fellow set a Street Roadster record with a barely safe tailwind that enabled the said roadster to run almost 20mph faster than it ever had before......That said, I suspect your small differences still would have got you that record in still conditions--probably with an average close to what was achieved. Or I could be broadcasting out of my tailpipe..... :-D

Offline Sporty Dan

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4360 on: September 10, 2014, 09:32:42 PM »
Great Job Midget and Fordboy!  :cheers: As far as the increase in speed, it IS in the details. Every little bit added up. Sometimes when you add several of those together, you get more than what each one individually would be due to the changes complementing each other. How you guys gathered data and documented everything is fantastic.  :-D That is how you are able to squeeze all of the available power and efficiency out of the car. Well Done!!

Offline Koncretekid

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4361 on: September 10, 2014, 10:42:03 PM »
In trying to quantify the headwind vs. tailwind thing, I have noticed that I get about 1/3 to 1/2 of the actual wind speed advantage or disadvantage. In other words, a 2-3 mph tailwind will add about 1 mph, and a 2-3 mph headwind will reduce the speed about 1 mph.
Tom
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Life's uncertain - eat dessert first!

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4362 on: September 11, 2014, 12:11:02 AM »
Okay – the story.

On Thursday, September 4th, Kate dropped me off at my sister Tracy’s house in Madison.  I was able to book a direct flight out of Madison to Denver for a lot less money than a flight with stops out of Milwaukee.  The downside was the flight left Madison at 5:45 in the morning – an hour of the day I usually don’t see unless I’m coming around to it from the backside of the previous day.  You know you’ve arrived for a flight too early in the day when the Starbucks kiosk isn’t open yet.  Tracy, thank you for getting up at oh-god thirty to see me off.

The upside to a ridiculously early flight is that with the time change, I arrived in Denver at 7:00 AM, leaving plenty of travel time to get to Salina and pick up the car from Wayno and Gus.

It was misty and raining when I landed in Denver, and within 2 minutes of stepping out to the passenger loading line, Nick rolled up with his beautifully patinaed (is that a word?  It should be) 1963 Chevy C-10 short bed.
 
350, Turbo-Hydro, bench seat?  I’ve admitted to my romanticism before, but I can’t think of any better way to roll to Wendover than in a well preserved rat rod.

And roll, this thing does.  I was worried about coming down out of Vale with only drum brakes, but this was as competent a vintage driver as I’ve ever encountered.  Nick let me take a shift behind the wheel, and it was a sheer delight to drive.

Of course, vintage tin brings vintage complications.  The squeaky windshield wiper motor was made silent with a proper application of WD-40, and who cares if the speedometer cable broke before we conquered the Continental divide?  One less clicking sound to worry about.  Windows down, no radio - stereo exhaust tips are all you really need.

But there is a stretch on I-70 in Eastern Utah – one we were both aware of – that goes for what should be an illegal distance without services.

We should have stopped in Green River.

14 miles east of the Salina exit, the Chevy stuttered.  I’ll take the blame on this one – we had pulled off about 38 miles out of Salina where a sign indicated fuel available 12 miles off the interstate – a half-hour diversion I made the wrong decision on.  “We’ll make it”, I said.

And we almost did!  It’s pretty much downhill into Salina, with the exception of an area that flattens out as you approach Gooseberry Road.  And that’s where the Chevy came to a complete standstill, after coasting for 7 miles – right into a cell-phone service free valley.

We were able to thumb a ride into Salina, where I contacted Wayno – who was delighted to hear from us – probably not so much to see us, but to be able to endlessly rib me for my inability to understand time/distance/fuel consumption formulas.  Indeed, every call I received from him last weekend contained some reference to fuel.  He brought us a gas can and got us back to where we needed to be – an escort to the Rodge Mahal.

Nick was enamored with the nickel tour – Wayne’s place is a research library and museum to land speed racing, and there could be no finer or better read curator.

Wayne had intended to compete at World of Speed, but his insistence on moving forward on the fuel injection set-up put him behind the curve.  That said, Gary Lowstetter was well along with the wiring, and the wiring work on Wayno’s tank is flawless.  It may be a Flathead, but the fuel injection and ignition are completely modern.  This is yet another aspect of this sport that I find so fascinating – technology blending in a way that a Ford Flathead would look right at home in a Formula 1 chassis.  Once this system is sorted, I’m pretty certain Wayno will be trading in his pith helmet for a red hat. 

The Dodge, trailer and Midget were stored over at Gus’ place, so we went over, checked the air in the tires, and were off to Wendover.  Gus and Tom had already taken off.  I want to say Nick and I arrived at the Rainbow about 10:30 that night.  For me, it had been a long day.

Fordboy had already flown into SLC earlier in the day, rented a car, and took a drive out to Lands End.  He didn’t cross the pond to get to the salt – Fordboy rule # 1 being “STOP DOING STUPID SH*T”.  The new Kia rental was spared the potential hazards a dip in the brine can have on a car, and the impact on a credit card a salt covered rental vehicle can impart.

Despite my lack of sleep, I was awake at 5:30 on Saturday.  I let Nick sleep – Mark was over at the Knight’s Inn, likely awake, but I needed to provision up.  A trip to Smiths, and there was Pork Pie, doing the same.  I beat him to one of the last bags of ice – I was told more was available, but this was a competition weekend, and given the bad luck we all had during August, I was leaving nothing to chance.

A quick trip to the Pilot station for gas and coffee and a return to the hotel found Mark parked and ready to ride in.  I got Nick, handed him coffee, and we were on our way.

I’m aware that Lands End can be a mess at times, but nothing prepared me for the mess we wound up driving through to get to the salt.  There were spots at least 8” deep, if not deeper, and the process of dragging a VERY LOW riding trailer with a VERY HEAVILY LADEN Dodge Magnum becomes a test of patience, strategy and will.  There were islands of salt that we attempted to use as we pulled through about a half mile of brine, and there were times I thought for certain we’d be waterlogged and in need of a tow.  We did make it, but the Dodge is going up on Craig’s List as soon as I get it cleaned.  It will never be the same, and I’m not that curious as to its future, nor am I willing to invest in it any further.  Nick’s t ruck fared much better, but those drums are going to need attention this week.

Arrival put all of us to work setting up a pit, which Mark finished while Nick and I attended the drivers meeting.  They started out by asking who were the first timers to the World of Speed.  A number of hands went up – many I’m sure being folks who had been skunked at Speedweek.  Then they asked who’d been coming out to the salt for 10 years or more.  I raised my hand – as did a number of people.  Then they asked who had been coming out for 20 years.  My first trip to Bonneville was ’94, so my hand went up again.  Then they asked 30 – 40 – 50 years.  That’s when I realized I’m still VERY MUCH a greenhorn.

Tech came next – a short line on Saturday, then over for fuel. 

The lines were backed up, and the issue was that there was only one ambulance available for the meet on Saturday.  An accident earlier had sent one racer to the hospital, and normally, there are multiple ambulances available.  The Air Show at Wendover field had tied up one, and we were all in a holding pattern until one could be made available.   

There were two tracks, the short course for rookies, 130 and 150 mph club members, and slower cars.  I started heading over to the short course when Gus and Tom happened by and reminded me that the long course was actually a combination course.  This is where knowing the smart kids comes into play – we headed straight over to the shorter line.

And we waited there – as did everybody – I’ve often said it’s both the fastest sport on earth, as well as the slowest – until we were about 8 vehicles back.  Nick said, “Time to get you suited up”.

About this time, the wind started picking up.  I’ve been through this drill before - if it gets too breezy, the track gets closed down.  I waited until the last minutes before I actually got into the car – SF15 suits are a little on the warm side in an enclosed car – but things continued to move, and next thing I know, Monte’s checking my seat belts.

I question the timing slip at this point - it indicates a wind speed from the northeast at 14 mph.  That would have been a headwind.  I was certainly not fighting a headwind – I’m certain if wind was involved, it was a 14 mph tail wind from the southwest.

This year, we planned to do a push start.  The Midget simply has no torque below 6k, and after studying last year’s runs, it was clear that if I wasn’t winding hard in 4th by the 1 marker, it would be a huge struggle to push it between the 1 and the two for an average through the 3 that would be anywhere close to where I needed to be.

I instructed Nick to evenly but assertively push the Midget to 30 mph, at which point, I buried the gas and sidestepped the clutch in 1st.  The rear lost traction, I gathered it up, and just wound it as tight as I could in first, second and third.

That strategy seemed to work.  At the one mile, I was just .700 off of the record, by the quarter, I was at 125, and pulled out after the three at 126.684.

Impound bound!

This is where Fordboy’s rule # 2 came into play – “If it’s working, DON’T F*CK WITH IT”.  We checked the plugs, checked the valve lash, put a can over the exhaust pipe, and Mark planned a jet change in the morning.  Other than steaks at the Rainbow, that was it.

Just as well – after 2 days with about 9 hours of sleep, and a parade to attend at 8:00 AM the next day, I doubt I would have been up for much else.

Got to impound, Mark assessed the temp and adjusted altitude, then screwed in a richer set of jets.  Nick hooked up the oil pan heaters to the sump and the diff, and at 8:00, we rolled over to the starting line.

The backup run – 118.397, had three things going against it.

1.   The Midget prefers thinner air.  Despite what few airflow tricks that can be done with the car, the thinner air has always been a speed bonus for this body package, regardless of any advantage a denser air charge provides for the engine.

2.   The track had deteriorated.  Let’s face it, the longer course takes a real beating by more powerful cars in the first three miles, it was rutted by this time, and it was loose.  I had a very difficult time keeping it between the fence posts.

3.   I was tired, and not on my game.  I struggled to keep it straight, I didn’t push as hard at the start, and I short-shifted on the 2-3.  I was 7 mph slower at the 2, and 8 mph slower at the three.  The consistency between those two figures indicates I lost the edge in the first mile – because it was still pulling at three.

Nevertheless, it was sufficient for the record.

As we waited for certification – the engine pumped spot on – we discussed what we were going to do.

It wasn’t likely we were going to see another 126 run.  I was short slept and I wasn’t comfortable with the way the car was handling, the wind had clearly switched to a headwind, and we had achieved everything we had hoped to do.  On top of that, we were leaving with nothing broken on the car.
 
By striking the tents early, I walked away with saleable components I can sell off to help build the K-engine.  Mark’s engine component selections and corrections have proven reliable, but the design is 62 years old.  I wasn’t interested in finding out where the weak link might be.
 
The car needs further suspension development to be safe at 125+, and with the potential of a DOHC 4 valve under the hood, I expect that speed to become a repeatable number.  The platform is solid, so starting from scratch is an option I don't need to explore.  Refinement is the obvious direction.

There’s more – it’ll dribble out over the next few days – but suffice to say that we’re all really pleased with the outcome.

I’m working down the list of Thank-You notes, but collectively, to all of you who have read this mind-bogglingly long series of posts, to all who have chimed in and let me know I’m right/wrong/crazy/brilliant/stupid/drunk/goofy/etc., thank you.  This is an ongoing education process for me, and for anybody who wants to figure it out with me. 

The first e-mail I sent out today was to Martin McGlone, the owner of the Abarth that held the Bonneville record for 22 year.  We met last year, and while he had mixed thoughts about his car potentially losing the record, he encouraged me to make it happen.  He was also here last month for the rain-out.
 
He was in the room directly below us at the Rainbow, and I took him down an Old Speckled Hen.  We talked Sprites for about an hour.  He’s in the process of rebuilding the Abarth for the 100th Anniversary Targa Florio event, which will hopefully occur in 2016.
 
Part of the heritage of Martin’s car, which was an Abarth factory team racer in 1963 and debuted at the Targa Florio, will be a 22 year reign as a Bonneville Class champion.

That’s pedigree, and that’s one vintage racer I’m going to be keeping an eye out for.

I took the picture of “The Highlander” down from my dart board today.

I think I’m just going to paint “125” on it . . .
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

Offline Elmo Rodge

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4363 on: September 11, 2014, 12:44:56 AM »
Dig it.  :cheers: Wayno

Offline Kiwi Paul

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #4364 on: September 11, 2014, 01:11:16 AM »
What a thrilling Read.Great from Start to Finish. Really enjoyed the Introduction of the `Fordboy` character part way through. Rises to a suspenseful Climax,and a ride-into the Sunset Finish. I`d recommend it to all my Book Club Members..........



Errr...Wait a sec...There`s going to be Volume Two? Peter Jackson to Direct? Guest Stars Include The Mayor, Voice-Overs by Doc Freud, Kate wrings her hands as Our Hero rides off ...well.....back into the GARAGE??


Where are my Pipe and Slippers.....Volume Two could be a Nail Biter....and bound to be a Classic!!