Fatal and serious injury crashes statistics

[divenpuke]

Hello,
   Just got back from Bonneville and while I've been diagnosed with terminal LSR disease since '04, it's been fully refreshed.  I'm looking at building a small 4 wheeled streamliner and I'm in charge of safety on the thing.  I'm very interested in any videos, pictures, or first hand information on any serious injury or fatal crashes, specifically wrt streamliners.  I know videos and pictures aren't usually given out of fatal incidents because of bad juju, but in this case I'm trying to avoid being the person that will become street pizza and knowing the failure modes at Bonneville will only help. 

Jason

[bvillercr]

there is a better way to ask for help than to post an obscene subject and expect someone to send pictures.  This may be your only reply.  Do it differently!

[landracing]

Personally, I think if you build to the rules, you will have a safe vehicle. Secondly the rules only state the minimum needed for safety. you can build more systems that make your vehicle safer there are no restrictions to that.... I have seen more accidents that people walked away from at Bonneville, because of attention to detail, no shortcuts and just a well built machine...

I would be thinking, what can I do to make my vehicle safer....

I understand what you are asking in your question, but I don't think you are going to get any pictures or videos.. Every accident is different..

Your best friend would be use wisdom, build as best as you can, bring it for inspection, ask the veterans their input while on the salt with the vehicle (just for inspection), write a list of concerns you may have, ask questions and dont be afraid to not run the vehicle.

Jon

[divenpuke]

My very sincere apologies to all.
    I meant no disrespect and am only interested in these things from a purely scientific point of view and don't actually *want* to see or hear about them.  Another way to consider the question:

How many fatal or serious injuries have there been in the last 5 years? 

Thanks again and apologies,
Jason.

[JackD]

Performance as well as safety rules are written from experience.
When you have some experience, you may wish to contribute to the evolution of the sport to help preserve it's longevity.

[1212FBGS]

where are you located?
kent

[Dean Los Angeles]

All forms of racing are inherently dangerous. If you want safety stick with driving on the street.

Oh wait, there are 600,000 accidents and 40,000 deaths every year on the street.

It looks like you have no interest in safety, only looking for gory videos. There have been injuries and fatalities in this sport and they are rare. Get a rule book and read it. The primary goal is safety.

[wolcottjl]

Perhaps a better question would be --Could anyone provide any post crash analysis or documentation on crashes involving streamliners, lakesters or specialty built vehicles that resulted in a serious injury within the past 5 years? 

There could be circumstances when this information might not be able to be shared.  Reasons perhaps having to do with insurance claims, lawsuits, privacy etc.....   

I understand the desire to gather as much information as you can to build something as safe as possible.  As others have pointed out the rules are based upon information derived from experience with our sport and other motorsports as well.   But - As many on the list have pointed out repeatedly - These are the minimum requirements for safety.  Kind of a catch 22.  Build it to the rules but remember this is only a minimum.  My advice- If in doubt and you are not satisfied with the answers from the board perhaps you might want to look in the rule book and look for help from those companies that advertise safety equipment, chassis work etc....

[Ro Yale]

I ditto the post about the rules and minimum requirements. Example is that our frame and roll bar tubing is double the thickness. Your not worried about weight in this sport so build it in with structure. I highly advise professional engineers for design because this is a dangerous activity.

[1212FBGS]

why look at something that allowed a fatality..?.... it obviously didn't work.... why not look at something that survived a 293mph crash..?...
kent

[wolcottjl]

I couldn't leave this alone.   Just to give an example of why I recommend hiring or using a shop that advertises in the rule book is that they specialize in chassis and or safety and are usually racing at Bonneville.  Does this mean you have to outsouce everything- Probably not but I am sure that someone would be willing to consult for a fee.  


I fiddle around in a class with records under 150.  I could have built my cage following the rule book and would be fairly safe.  But I am a little uncomfortable with my knowledge in this area so I took my vehicle to a shop that specializes in building chassis and safety cages.  Their recommendation was to add more than the minimum requirements (quite a bit actually) based upon experiences with unibody's similar to mine involving crashes in the 140-170MPH range.  Granted these crashes were primarily in road and drag racing but they did involve roll overs and tumbles.  For the safety gear I used the advertisers in the rule book.  First they know what is required, second they are involved in our sport, third they do carry the best available and have a pretty good handle on future changes that might be coming so that your risk of having something this year being obsolete next year.  

Last but not least - Quite a few of the racers in this sport seem to be engineers by training or profession.  Some of the best in their respective fields.  The rules for this sport have a lot of experience and education behind them.

[divenpuke]

Perhaps a better question would be --Could anyone provide any post crash analysis or documentation on crashes involving streamliners, lakesters or specialty built vehicles that resulted in a serious injury within the past 5 years?
[/fontYES!  THANKYOU!  That is a much better way of asking the same question.  DON'T SEND ME VIDEOS OR PICTURES, SEND ME THAT.  Should I start a new thread?
I must say I really didn't expect to get outright flamed like this for what has now become a numerical question.
After considering the question more, the reason I'm asking for statistics is to determine IN MY MIND if I NEED to add additional safety.  Yes, motorsports are dangerous, gotcha.  I just want to be able to design for a likely or unlikely type of crash. 
The only reason I'd look at something that went 293 and crashed and walked away was if it had safety that wasn't in the rules.  That would interest me.  I'd look at injury crashes BECAUSE they didn't work and they got through tech inspection and I don't want to make the same mistake!

Jason
California

[1212FBGS]

where in California?
kent

[836dstr]

I'm surprised Jack didn't say " statistics are meaningless unless you become one".

Accidents do happen but injuries don't have to. Overbuilding is a good thing. My car has been inspected by a number of SCTA Inspectors. Each comes from different perspectives and experiences. I never had any major squawks, but every suggestion about how to do something better or safer has been incorporated, even if I didn't it was necessary. The more people that give input the better. I've even had Inspectors that looked at the car multiple times that come up with new stuff.

A personal philosophy is that if there is a problem with the car or course it's better to shut down and fix it in the Pits ( obviously not course conditions) than to be picking up pieces at the top end.

[dieselgeek]

notsure if you saw this before posting, but Sumner keeps some good things online:

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/bvillecar/bville-tburkland-1.html