Getting ready for Bonneville(rebuild)

[Seldom Seen Slim]

Joe:

I think, in all due honesty, that I should be the first donor.  After all, it was sometime in the late 90's, according to Nancy, that I started whining about "I want to go 200 on a bike".  And it was she that got me steered towards Bonneville, me being so busy growing my little business that I didn't think of much else.  Ah, but that was then -- wouldja look at me now?

Sidebar comment:  If everyone that uttered that phrase sends one buck -- it'll be all of us that get to stay wealthy 'cause I wouldn't have to beg you for donations to run this site.  Checks go to landracing.com, not to me.  Thanks.

[jl222]

  Thanks Paul...yea..that's what we originally wanted to do, go 200 mph in a 57 chev 

  But my cousin said why don't you get a firebird and go real fast.

  Couldn't find Firebird but found Camaro.

  Originally wanted to use Blown chev but Jay Roach of J AND S East Valley garage said why don't you put a real
motor in it

  Thats how we ended up with a Kieth Black hemi Chrysler in a Chev

  Stronger block and mains-replaceable sleeves o-ring block and heads Ect. [ at that time ]

                   JL222

             

[jl222]

We took a couple videos of our tune up on our computer and wanted to share a little data with everyone.  First video is of our record return run in 2011, and then we compare it to our 2010 qaulifing run. 

http://youtu.be/dg2DmDHkkRU


http://youtu.be/V5y06dM5Sg4

  In the data logs above we deleted some of the data lines for clarity, but each item your logging has its own line and color.

   We just click on data results on bottom of screen and it takes the line away, click again and its back.

  JL222

[jl222]

  We were able to borrow some indivdual wheel scales from one of our crew members, after weighing, the left front and right rear were heavier, to see what would happen I screwed the right shock spring perch up 1/4''
and that made the left front 15 lbs lighter the RF 14 lbs heavier, RR 14 lbs lighter and LR 16 LBS heavier.

  Decided to upgrade all shocks with double adjustable type with new spring rates. New rates on back because
of increase in downfoce from adding Gurney type metal to rear spoiler.

  Looking at Chassis Works Vari Shocks right now but checking on price.

           JL222

[SPARKY]

Why would you not want those 2 corners heavier?

[jl222]

Why would you not want those 2 corners heavier?

  Sparky... reread '' to see what would happen'' I wasn't even in the car with those weights.

  I also want to fire the car up [sometime next year] and see what happens to the scale weights when I blip the throttle.

            JL222

[Stan Back]

Please share those results.

[bvillercr]

We have been racing this car for more than 20 years and it's been thru a lot of upgrades.  The last two years we have had some problems with getting loose, out of shape and even spinning.  This is very unlike this car!! . We decided that we needed another upgrade!  We haven't changed our springs and shocks since the car was built and think this may be a contributing factor in the latest handling of the car.  New products on the way!!

[Rex Schimmer]

John,
Just looked at your post regarding using corner scales and what happened when you lifted the collar on the right front. From the changes that you saw on the scale I would say that you have a pretty stiff chassis. Flexi flyer chassis will not give you this type of change. When you scale a car you need to disconnect the anti roll bars,  and make sure the driver is in the car.  Adjustable shocks should be a good addition but you need a good starting point so whom ever you buy them from you need to  give them an idea of the car and what you are looking for and if they have a shock dyno (and they should) they can give you a good starting place for making adjustments.

Rex

[jl222]

 
  Yea Rex, It's a complete Alston prostock chassis, front end modified by PRO-Chassis for a Stock Car Chassis Co.
  A-arm assembly which came with an anti-roll bar. We had to take off the anti-roll bar when we went to a 3 in
blower pulley [dang], but car seems to handle spins at 270 + MPH.

  Alston double adjustable shocks were ordered Friday along with new springs, a little lighter in front and heavier
in back. Heavier in back because we want to add a gurrney type lip for more downforce.

  Alston did give me some shock settings to start with and they come with their shock dyno charts.

  We found that the original springs were sagging so much that part of the rearend housing was contacting the
sheetmetal under the intercooler tank causing the spring rate to go up.

  In 2010 we had a 280 mph 21/4 time, on a previous run we were 10+ mph faster in the mile before the 21/4, [the second mile from start, with no more than 50% throttle untill high gear.
 
  Hopefully these changes will help us apply more throttle

            JL222
 
 

[jl222]

 
 Double adjustable shocks and new springs came today along with a booklet explaining were to start with settings
for different types of use.

  Might install fronts tomorrow.

          JL222

[Peter Jack]

John, did it start to spin out after you removed the front anti roll bar? If so maybe you should run stiffer front springs to compensate. Softening the front roll stiffness gives the front more bite and would encourage the rear end to come round. Similarly if you soften the back it should have more bite and might stay in line better. Stiffening the rear should have the opposite effect. Basically stiffer in roll front to rear should make it go straighter while softer in roll front to rear will make it less stable in the back end.

That's all theory, so it pays to test after you've made the changes rather than putting your full leg in it right away.

Good luck!

Pete

[jl222]

John, did it start to spin out after you removed the front anti roll bar? If so maybe you should run stiffer front springs to compensate. Softening the front roll stiffness gives the front more bite and would encourage the rear end to come round. Similarly if you soften the back it should have more bite and might stay in line better. Stiffening the rear should have the opposite effect. Basically stiffer in roll front to rear should make it go straighter while softer in roll front to rear will make it less stable in the back end.

That's all theory, so it pays to test after you've made the changes rather than putting your full leg in it right away.

Good luck!

Pete

  Pete the roll bar has been removed for years with no spin out problems and the front springs are [were] a lot heavier than backs.

  When I spun on record return run this year, after the 21/4, the bottom panels of chute were completely soaked wet.

  So, course conditions and bottoming of suspension is what [I think] happened.

  Yea..not going to get to crazy with settings at first. Would like to go to El Mirage on off weekend to test 1st and 2nd
gears.

      JL222

[quick331coupe]

Ive read through most of your 106 page long thread, and see pics, but what trans and ratios are you using?  Are you using an overdrive in the car or just a direct 1:1 high gear with what rear gear?  Thanks!

[jl222]

Ive read through most of your 106 page long thread, and see pics, but what trans and ratios are you using?  Are you using an overdrive in the car or just a direct 1:1 high gear with what rear gear?  Thanks!

  We run an Owens 4 speed air shifted [3 units bolted together] planetary trans type, similar to Lenco except if air pressure is lost it shifts up not down. The last of the bolted on units has a 26% Scot Owens overdrive as part of modified unit [ in other words it doesn't just bolt on without changes to another unit and does not shift seperately] it ups all the units 26%.
 Ratios are 45% low  35% 2nd  25% high or 2.45 low 1.68 2nd 1.25 3rd and 1.00 high with 26% overdrive in all gears.
  The rear gear is a 2.50 9'' Ford that has given us no problems. Now watch it break after bragging on it

  Final drive is 1.85 with 28'' rear tires that I estimate to grow to 1'' to 29'' but earlier version of tire grew 11/2'' at 275mph
according to exit speed and tach. We haven't made it to 5 mile exit trap with new tires to check tire growth.

  jl222