Author Topic: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt  (Read 35473 times)

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Offline Roland6250

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Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« on: June 25, 2008, 11:19:23 AM »
I am looking for some advice on land speed record motorcycle tires.  I will be returning to Bonneville Salt Flats this year with a 1200cc Harley-Davidson® Powered Streetluge that I have been running on MIR’s ¼ mile track.  I have been having a problem with traction off the line at the drag strip and I am looking for advice before I go to Bonneville.

I am running a 15” Sportster® rear wheel with a load of 315 pounds.  The frame is solid so there will be no squate but there is flex in the frame so it does not bounce either.

I need suggestions on make, model and tire pressure for the most traction I can get.

For more info check out the websites below and the YouTube video.

http://www.gravitydb.com/speed

http://www.poweredstreetluge.com

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FBBK9L8VfQ

Thanks,
Roland
Roland6250@hotmail.com

Offline V8Pinto

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #1 on: June 25, 2008, 11:39:40 AM »
Check with Scott Stites.  He just went through a Harley/Tire selection cycle. 
Shane
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Offline Roland6250

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #2 on: June 25, 2008, 12:18:17 PM »
How do I contact Scott Stites?

bak189

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #3 on: June 25, 2008, 12:49:12 PM »
Buy a.....M&H Racemaster  3.6-24.0-15...................

Ratliff

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #4 on: June 25, 2008, 12:50:42 PM »
I am looking for some advice on land speed record motorcycle tires.  I will be returning to Bonneville Salt Flats this year with a 1200cc Harley-Davidson® Powered Streetluge that I have been running on MIR’s ¼ mile track.  I have been having a problem with traction off the line at the drag strip and I am looking for advice before I go to Bonneville.

I am running a 15” Sportster® rear wheel with a load of 315 pounds.  The frame is solid so there will be no squate but there is flex in the frame so it does not bounce either.

I need suggestions on make, model and tire pressure for the most traction I can get.

For more info check out the websites below and the YouTube video.

http://www.gravitydb.com/speed

http://www.poweredstreetluge.com

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FBBK9L8VfQ

Thanks,
Roland
Roland6250@hotmail.com


Your traction at Bonneville will be at best about half of what it is on pavement.

On good salt your traction coefficient will be about .50. Your rear tire will develop a forward thrust equal to about half the weight resting on the tire.

The whole idea looks cool as hell.
« Last Edit: June 25, 2008, 01:01:39 PM by Ratliff »

Offline John Noonan

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #5 on: June 25, 2008, 01:05:45 PM »
What are you going to run for a front tire and when are you going to Bonneville also what class?

John

Super Kaz

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2008, 01:18:47 PM »
Roland,
also RIGID is gonna be Terrifying if your gonna go over 150 mph on a HD ANYTHING :-o! The SALT{Bonneville} is Nothing like a Drag strip,but WTF do I know about either :|!
Good Luck,and Stay Safe,
SK..... 8-)

Ratliff

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2008, 02:25:33 PM »
What are you going to run for a front tire and when are you going to Bonneville also what class?

John

http://www.nsdra.org/rules.htm

Asphalt drag racing snowmobiles have run 180+ mph using what amount to high tech rollerblades on the front.

Offline DahMurf

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2008, 02:46:44 PM »
Don't have any thoughts on the tires. I'll have to see if we can get to MIR & watch you run though. That thing looks cool.

My question (to those that might know) is if that rig will have a place/class to run at Bonneville? Will it be allowed to run just for time?

Maybe at Bub? I'm just not sure with all the little wheels. Wouldn't it be considered a car & then need to have a roll cage. I don't know I'm just wondering.

Deb
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Ratliff

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #9 on: June 25, 2008, 03:04:07 PM »
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tiAZWM1Fs7k&NR=1

Video of Roland at the Texas Mile.

Offline Roland6250

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2008, 03:16:24 PM »
The front wheels that I will run on the salt will be drag racing snowmobile wheels that are IHRA approved and have been run at over 170mph.  The previous wheels failed twice around 137mph at the Texas Mile event in October 2007. 

I attended World of Speed in 2006 and ran a 100cc Powered Streetluge to 105mph.  Being a bike guy I would love to attend Bub's but Bub's has not replied to three requests.  If anyone has a good contact at Bub's I would still love to attend their bike event.  Speed Week (SCTA) said absolutely no. Maxton said qualify under SCTA rules and I can run, translation no.

World of Speed and Texas Mile are happy to have me come out and I would highly recommend each event to anyone because both groups treated us very well and with great respect. I will be attending the World of Speed event in September and running on the 130mph course.

I know that a Powered Streetluge looks insane but it is a very stable and comfortable vehicle to ride. Event when the front wheels came apart at over 135mph at the Texas Mile event it remained under control. Do that with a car or cycle.  As for the 1.5 inch ground clearance, being a downhill Streetluge racer I can attest that at that height when you come off on a straight course what you end up with is a very long slide unlike most motorcycle accidents where you immediately begin to tumble.

Thanks Ratliff for the good tech info, I have nothing to compare with so base line info like that will be helpful.

Offline willieworld

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2008, 03:26:57 PM »
deb i think he is talking about BUB he mentioned the 130 club and said the drivers meeting was on wednesday --if he showes up at an SCTA event his rig will never make it through tech --not as a motorcycle and not as a car --although the scta rules do say if you can pass tech you can run ( TIME SLIP ONLY) even if there is no class ------ then there is   7.b.14   ----it cant run as a motorcycle mininum rim size is 15 in. --it cant run as a motorcycle streamliner or a car  no roll cage or fire ext.system -------------willie buchta

as far as bub a motorcycle has 2 wheels unless its a sidecar then 3 
willie-dpombatmir-buchta

Ratliff

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2008, 03:43:25 PM »
deb i think he is talking about BUB he mentioned the 130 club and said the drivers meeting was on wednesday --if he showes up at an SCTA event his rig will never make it through tech --not as a motorcycle and not as a car --although the scta rules do say if you can pass tech you can run ( TIME SLIP ONLY) even if there is no class ------ then there is   7.b.14   ----it cant run as a motorcycle mininum rim size is 15 in. --it cant run as a motorcycle streamliner or a car  no roll cage or fire ext.system -------------willie buchta

as far as bub a motorcycle has 2 wheels unless its a sidecar then 3 

That doesn't mean what Roland is doing is invalid. It means SCTA rules have catching up to do. Snowmobiles are another type of machine where SCTA rules haven't kept pace with progress.

I think comments made by Sir Malcolm Campbell in 1946 when he wrote regarding his upcoming attempt with the first turbojet boat are applicable to the question. "Well, it goes rather deeper than the mere desire to set up a new record. Standing by themselves, these speed records may mean much or little, as the case may be. Of course, there is a great sense of personal satisfaction in setting a figure which challenges the opposition but, if that were all, I should without much hesitation say that the effort was scarcely worth the time, trouble and expense involving in building a world-beating car or boat or aeroplane. It certainly would not be worth while if the achievement did not constitute a landmark on the road of progress. Every time we set up a new record of speed, either on land or water or in the air, we have learned something which can be applied to development and have travelled another distance towards that relative perfection of the machine which is the goal of human endeavor."

Do vehicles such as a powered land luge constitute a "landmark on the road of progress"? Can we learn something which can be applied to development and travel another distance towards that relative perfection of the machine?

Offline willieworld

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #13 on: June 25, 2008, 04:13:29 PM »
franklin  its pretty simple the SCTA has about 1000 classes for motorcycles and probibly that many for cars of the 1000 classes for motorcycles there about 300 records  the rest are open so whatever you run you get the record--if you dont want to compete against anyone and go for your personal best run on an open record--if you want to compete for a record pick a class that has more than 1 entry --if you want to race a unicycle-luner lander-rickshaw thats o k just not at a SCTA event --roland looks to be a smart fellow with good fabrication skills let him and everyone else build something that will fit in a class like everyone else has to do     just some thoughts  willie buchta
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John Romero

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Re: Motorcycle Tire Traction on Salt
« Reply #14 on: June 25, 2008, 04:42:18 PM »
I think it's kind of neat. I wouldn't ride it but to each his own.

I do have one question. The front wheels are quite small (duh!). What if you hit a section of soft salt at speed? I have seen sections of salt that could be best approximated as sand and they can be 25 feet across. Hitting it with a full size tire at speed just causes a wobble but I can imagine that hitting it with a super small tire would dig in and cause all sorts of havok. When you ran at WOS in 2006 how did it handle the bumps? Also, 2006 is remembered for it's excellent salt conditions (Hard as a concrete and smooth as silk). 2005 was like riding a 10 speed across a sand box peppered with large rocks.