Author Topic: Fossett- Go Home!  (Read 38582 times)

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Offline JackD

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BUY AND BYE BYE
« Reply #15 on: October 23, 2006, 09:07:51 PM »
1 His efforts, while interesting to watch will have no effect
on the Salt Sport and won't even be contested at Bonneville.
2. TV wrestling is not real.
3. There is no Santa Clause.
 :wink:
"I would rather lose going fast enough to win than win going slow enough to lose."
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Offline Tom Slick

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Fossett- Go Home!
« Reply #16 on: October 23, 2006, 09:59:45 PM »
Quote from: Flyboy


Yes, many guys have broken 200 mph and left the sport but your analogy is flawed. What if at Speedweek most of you guys are doing 200-240 mph on your bikes costing probably $15-25K and a man shows up on a $300,000 bike and does 295 mph.  Then he walks away with the record and never shows up again. How would you feel? But then again this is a bad analogy. Flying in a enclosed cockpit is very safe as compared to going 295 mph on the salts. If he could do that  I would applaud him.

I think now he has bit off more than he can chew by this 800 mph speed announcement. If he comes here next year and goes even 500 mph I will applaud him. This will be the most dangerous of his challenges and there's not going to be any crewmembers to keep him out of trouble.


Isn't Steve Fossett an American that is going to try and take back the Unlimited Land Speed Record from the British?  Why should he go home, if he's already home and is going to drive an American built race car on American soil?  

In regards to him bringing all of this money to do it?  Doesn't it take millions of dollars to put together an effort as large as this to go after this record?  I'm not sure what you are trying to get across with this thread, but you are way out of sorts when it comes to having any clue of what it takes to go after such a record, and to criticize a man for trying, rich or poor is ridiculous.  You are also making lame analogies as well, as the Thrust SSC team and the JCB Dieselmax team also came over, spent a bunch of cash, set a record and left.  I'm guessing these guys out spent other competitors in their class too.

By the way, you better start applauding him for going 295mph, because he already ran 298mph last month at Bonneville in Ron Main's car.  I think you will also have to drop to your knees next year, as I bet 500mph is attainable as well, considering that 500mph is basically a shake down run in the Spirit of America.

I'm glad to see that there is someone out there that finally has the funding to go after the holy grail of land speed racing and it's going to be very interesting to follow.  Craig Breedlove tried, but the all mighty dollar got the best of him, so it will be great to see this project continue even with someone else behind the helm.  Good luck to Fossette and crew.

landracing

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Fossett- Go Home!
« Reply #17 on: October 23, 2006, 11:24:52 PM »
Flyboy,

You have it all wrong. This is the greatest american dream. If I had the money I would do it too. This guy has done everything that he has set out too. With Success.

He is an accomplished pilot more so then you will ever be im sure of it. Flown around the world if different ways. This guy is an adventurist with money and records to prove it.

I hand this guy my hat. He showed up at the private FIA meet in Sept and made three really fast passes two around 300 mph. NO prior training, just showed up and did it.

I even was part of the event that set sail to him in the Statrobowl in Rapid City South Dakota in his hot air ballon. We (the National Guard) set up generators and lighting for the night liftoff. He didn't get very far, but when I heard he was coming to the salt during the FIA meet i got to talk to him about that evet.

I say go for it Fossett.

Jon

Offline jimmy six

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« Reply #18 on: October 23, 2006, 11:39:11 PM »
Who said he was coming to Bonneville and go 800MPH?
First GMC 6 powered Fuel roadster over 200, with 2 red hats. Pit crew for Patrick Tone's Super Stock #49 Camaro

Offline desotoman

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« Reply #19 on: October 24, 2006, 12:19:50 AM »
Quote from: landracing
Flyboy,

I hand this guy my hat. He showed up at the private FIA meet in Sept and made three really fast passes two around 300 mph. NO prior training, just showed up and did it.

Jon


Jon, do you feel that was right. I know it was not an SCTA event but from what I can gather he was issued a license of some sort for 300mph. I guess when you pay $8000 to make 3 runs you get rewarded.  :roll:
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Offline Bob Jr.

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« Reply #20 on: October 24, 2006, 12:28:29 AM »
[/quote]

Jon, do you feel that was right. I know it was not an SCTA event but from what I can gather he was issued a license of some sort for 300mph. I guess when you pay $8000 to make 3 runs you get rewarded.  :roll:[/quote]

Desoto I am with you this is not right.  If he wants to come and compete he needs to licence correctly not buy it.  The wolds fastest man had to go throught thr steps at speed week before he got that go old grease burner well over 300mph..
Bob Sights Jr.

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"Worlds fastest to the cooler of beer"

landracing

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« Reply #21 on: October 24, 2006, 12:40:34 AM »
If feel that is incorrect. This is no different then a guy showing up at BUB FIM meet and go 200 mph. He raced on the salt. And showed he could handle the vehicle on the salt.

In respect Andy had never raced on the salt before. Fossett now has.

In my opinion, and for all purposed Fosset probably has no plans to run on the salt again. I dont know the fact of that statement. But his plans are for the outright record of 800 mph + and this wont be done at Bonneville.

Jon

Offline Freud

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Where to race?
« Reply #22 on: October 24, 2006, 12:50:14 AM »
Who said that he planned to run it at B'ville?

There may be no place to run on this continent if Black Rock's surface can't be repaired.

Someone that's been to Black Rock corrrect me if my impression after Burning Man is wrong.

I'd rather kick the potash mining operation off the salt than a racer.

Sure doesn't take some people long to think they are at home up there.


FREUD
Since '63

Offline John Burk

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« Reply #23 on: October 24, 2006, 01:02:28 AM »
Steve tried 5 times unsucsessfully to fly a balloon solo around the world and made it on the 6th . On the 3rd try he made a terminal decent  into Tasman Sea when the envelope failed and survived by lying in the floor of the capsul . He didn't inherit his money , he made it as a clever futures trader . My neighbor is in that buisness and knows him . Rich playboy , no .

Offline esqeddy

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« Reply #24 on: October 24, 2006, 01:55:49 AM »
I'm a rookie.  A newbie to LSR.  But with the help of the great people of the ECTA and SCTA I've managed to do OK for a rookie and proudly hold a record.  However, I do not over value my opinion or underestimate how much I don't know.  So usually I keep my opinions to myself.  However, I will stick my head out and toss my 2 cents worth in on this one.  I do so since I can relate to a complete outsider who wants to come in and set a record.

...........

Actually, I'm quite delighted that he is coming to land speed race.  With all that he has accomplished, he now turns his sights to our sport.  What does this say for our sport?

To me it says, its worthy.  Very worthy.  And anyone, and I mean anyone, who can take their vehicle down the track and take a record has made a mark.

Maybe not an 800 mph mark.  But so what.  A mark is a mark.  

Yes, some people will always have more money to spend than others. But that's a good thing.  Generally speaking, the higher the speed, the more money you are going to have to spend.  Being the exception to that rule earns an extra pat on the back. To me, one of the most remarkable things about the Burt Munroe story was how tight his budget was and what he accomplished none the less.  But the flip side of that is the pat on the back to someone willing to spend $$$ on the same dream I have and go for the really big marks.  The high speed records I'll never have the budget to attempt.  How much did JCS spend this year?

Some records are fast and some records are faster.  But all the records are the fastest.  And there isn't a single record that doesn't come with some risk.

This guy isn't coming here to piddle, we all know he could have thumbed through the records and found a soft record to tackle.  One which with his money would be an easy mark.  No, this boy's going to bite off the biggest chew of all. And let's face it, he'll either swallow it.... or not.

And risk?  I don't care how much money you have or how many accomplishments you have under your belt.  When you go down the salt at that speed none of that matters.  Its just you, the vehicle, the speed, and the salt.

I take my hat off to you and welcome you Steve Fossett.  I wish you, just like everyone else here who has the dream of a record, be it big or bigger, the greatest of good fortune and success.  I thank you for bringing attention to this sport, and thus to me and all my friends here....

and we'll all be expecting you to toss a really big party for us if you succeed!

Ed Morrison

Offline F104A

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Fossett
« Reply #25 on: October 24, 2006, 02:10:05 AM »
If anyone should be concerned about Fossett buying SOA it should be me. We've been working on the NAE for 9 years now, on a shoe string budget with volunteers. We're finally in the test run stages and working out the bugs. With a little luck and a good sponsor or three we figure on running fast next fall, finally! Steve won't be running at Bville but will run on a private lakebed somewhere in Nevada. We, of course, don't have access to that location so we will have to be contented with paying the big bucks and running at Black Rock. Who knows how this will all turnout but maybe it will give a shot in the arm to land speed racing to get a competition going between the two of us. We may not have the money but we sure as hell have the determination. I'm sure Steve is determined too. Seabiscuit wasn't supposed to win either!....Ed
Ed

Offline hawkwind

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« Reply #26 on: October 24, 2006, 02:56:19 AM »
All very interesting ,brings to the fore some fundamental differences between the American Vs traditional Australian ethos ,almost to a man you have backed ,applauded and seem to have a great respect for wealth and those who posess it ,especially if it is self made and regardless of how  :shock: ,whereas us antipodeans,have the same affection for the "battler",as I believe you do not have a similar concept over there below describes what "battler " means
In Australian culture the term  "Aussie Battler" refers to anyone who continues to struggle in the face of hardship.It is a term of respect and endearment.especially in regard to the working poor /working class.
The aussie battler is at the very core of the australian ethos and is an indelliable part of the National psyche.The battler is more than merely a hard working class bloke who never earns his due,the battler is the salt of the earth,the foundation of a frontier society .the battler is not resigned to the hard grind of life but unaware of it ,considering it his due without bitterness,trundles forward with unstoppable force and strength coupled with humility and blood ,sweat and beer approach to life ,the battler is the quintessential 'little guy' with an indomnable spirit and a bottomless well of fight.

Following on from that Burt Munro is the quintessential (IMHO) landspeed racer and the blueprint that all others must be measured against ,whereas this Fossett Bloke is the antithesis of "Battler" ,another Aussie quirk is called the tall poppy syndrome ,Fossett and all his ilk are in Australia "tall poppies " and despised by many especially the salt of the earth battler and we make great sport of cutting down "tall poppies"

so on this topic Im of a same mind as flyboy ,above I have attempted to show my reasons ,though I doubt many will understand ,as I find it very difficult to understand your respect for wealth and as I call it checkbook  racing and checkbook racers ,at best they leave me very cold ,anyway thats my opinion and im sticking to it  
Gary ( a proud Aussie Battler)
slower than most

Offline KeithTurk

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Fossett- Go Home!
« Reply #27 on: October 24, 2006, 04:21:27 AM »
Hawk...  actually we have the exact same respect for the little guy ( your battler )...  

 we value success of the little guy and honor those among us who "cut down a few tall poppies " on the way to acquire wealth.

I really enjoyed your battlers over there... they are the back bone of your sport...  and ours here...  The guys your talking to here don't have incredible wealth Gary... they are the battlers of our sport,  They are looking up at this guy saying... " Go For it "... because by his efforts he'll inadvertently draw attention to the sport of land speed racing in a positive light. This guys publicity will add value to what our little guys do year after year and give more stature to our efforts.

Gary ...  The DLRA is exactly like the SCTA ... it's all about the little guy...  We are simply applauding the efforts of this big guy and saying go for it buckwheat... have at it... oh and by the way... it might make that trip around the world a freaking cakewalk ....
Keith Turk
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 246.555 mph

Robin UK

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Go Home Fossett ? He is home!
« Reply #28 on: October 24, 2006, 08:09:17 AM »
Well since you ask Flyboy, here?s an opinion from across the ocean about somebody who, as most people know, is actually ?one of yours.? I think you?re being slightly disingenuous in a later post when you imply that you were just trying to start the debate with your comments. The tone of your original post seems reasonably heartfelt. But at least you had the grace to own up to getting it wrong about Fossett not attempting things that have been personally or physically challenging as well as financially challenging.

I don?t know any of the other regular members of this forum other than by reputation as racers at Bonneville. I?ve visited Bonneville many times, but never as a competitor, and as I think you are finding out this is a tight knit community open to new comers but with a healthy respect for others irrespective of what they want to achieve. As Pat Kinne says on another thread; for some, building a vehicle will be enough, for others turning up to run every year does it for them, others want a Bonneville record or a red hat. I was there when my friend Jim Travis finally made it into the 2 Club after years of racing and you never saw a more contented man even though he already had the respect of many of his peers. For a few, the ultimate goal is what many consider to be the pinnacle of land speed racing - the record for unlimited vehicles.  I say many rather than all, because as some other threads about rules and the clubs that apply them for those wanting to run at Speedweek highlights, the hot rod approach to going fast at Bonneville now has little to do with the unlimited LSR.  That doesn?t mean that one is better than the other, simply that they are as different as they are similar.

For me, Bonneville racers still epitomise the hot rod spirit. The person who gets hold of a vehicle or a bunch of parts and then applies varying degrees of ingenuity, science, technology, others people?s knowledge and money to the goal of going fast commands my respect. And that doesn?t matter if it?s a 50cc bike or the Vesco team with Turbinator. Sam Wheeler?s bike is a great example. It?s built to aerospace standards but it?s essentially built to hotrod principles in my book. Sure there are people and companies with deeper pockets who turn up to run at Bonneville, but that doesn?t guarantee success. I?m proud of what the JCB team did and I?m even prouder that they did it the way that they did. They had no need to run at Speedweek. They could have done all their runs in private but they wanted (Andy Green especially) to run at Speedweek and take their chances as part of probably the greatest collective gathering of speed knowledge on the planet. And it could have gone horribly wrong. Ask those who remember the Kenwood electric project that spent a fortune but bombed completely. You?re right about one thing in your first post. If  I?ve read your posts correctly, you used your money to buy an off the shelf Japanese product and technology to go to the heartland of hot rodding and buy yourself a record. I accept of course that you still need nerve and skill to ride the bike. I don?t deny you the right to do this in the same way that I don?t deny Steve Fossett the right to try the same with the unlimited record.

I?ve been lucky enough to meet, and in some cases work with, many of the key players involved in the unlimited record. Apart from a desire to achieve their personal goals, the one thing that Art Arfons, Craig Breedlove, Ken Norris, John Ackroyd, Pete Farnsworth, Dick Keller, Ron Ayers, Glynne Bowsher, Richard Noble or Andy Green all had in common from what I learnt about them, was a genuine desire to see others get involved and succeed. And they have respect for others. You are being na?ve if you think that breaking the ThrustSSC record can be done simply by applying ingenuity and know-how. Ask Craig, Ed Shadle or Rosco McGlashan and they?ll tell you that it also needs somebody like Fossett with the interest and the money, whatever his motives. Even so, it doesn?t have to be as much as you might imagine. In a recent article, Jay Leno says that SSC may have spent ten of millions in order to get the record. In fact, it was ?2.5m or about $4.5m ? a lot of money but probably only Ferraris catering budget for the year.  :) The biggest corporate sponsor stumped up 10% of that budget while all the other companies that Richard and others tracked down provided much smaller but still much needed amounts. The biggest single sponsor was the Mach 1 Club (made up of around 5,000 individual enthusiasts) and the merchandising sales at events or via the website which collectively provided 20% of the budget.

So I for one welcome Steve Fossett and his money into the fray. It?s about time that somebody other than one of us from over the ocean had a stab at taking the record again. And since you mention your respect for those involved in the war-bird movement or racing at Reno, then take a closer look at Fossett?s press release. His aerodynamicist is Eric Ahlstrom of Renaissance Research in Reno. They?ve designed a plane very similar to the MachBuster of ten years or so ago for racing at Reno. He?s also part of the Rare Bear crew.  Of course, this doesn?t guarantee success. As they may find out, all the money they have may not be enough to get the job done, but we should applaud them for trying.

Robin

LittleLiner

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Fossett- Go Home!
« Reply #29 on: October 24, 2006, 09:30:57 AM »
This is all very interesting . . . but . . . . what in the world does it matter to anyone interested in "real" land speed racing?  

Hey, I think it is neat that someone can build and ?pilot? a machine that can go that fast without leaving the ground.  I could probably do that except admittedly I lack the money, knowledge, skill, determination and nerve to even try.  Other than FIA, what LSR group even recognizes these "cars?".   You remember the FIA - they are that group that can't even run a full field of F1 cars at Indy

So, until SCTA-BNI, ECTA, DLRA, BUB, USFRA or some other real LSR group adds jet and rocket cars to the rule books, I feel that the NAE or Fossett or Andy Green?s jet car are actually fighter planes that can?t (an hopefully won't) get off the ground.

Sacred cows make the best hamburgers . . . .