Jack Dolan on rules

[DahMurf]

Soooooooo................. about this Amo P/S rule....

I'm still waiting too hear which one it is, what we wanted it to be and what it ended up being.
This information will help me better understand the process and thought process. I'm not going
to blindly submit rule change thoughts without having some understanding of the target audience.
It's just bad business.

Deb

[bak189]

Kent, I really think you need to tell us how you
really feel............................and do remember that
Scott G likes to be addressed as the "Great Scott"  (as I noted many, many posts ago).......

PS. Thanks for your input on this forum it is helpfull, the more discussion......the better.........

[willieworld]

yes lets all agree to disagree or disagree to agree or disagree to disagree  you know what i mean --the only rules i would like to change have an impact on me and someone else in my class  the rules that dont concern me i dont have that much intrest in --i mean the car rules dont effect the sidecar class (saftey rules)  i dont think that someone should get a rule changed and go and set 5 records because of it either it has to be fair to each one or its fair to none  --an example is that stupid wheel cover on my sidecar wheel --i cant run a solid wheel on the front or sidecar if the wheel is open but i have to cover the inside of the wheel (rim) which makes it a solid wheel --if i race bub i have to cover the rim and tire  --unless the rule makers have driven a side car in a cross wind they have no way of knowing of the danger it poses --but if thats what i have to do to race i will but i will try and get that rule changed this year or i wont complain about it next year   thanks everyone for makeing 07 a memorable year in my life  willie buchta

[bak189]

Hey Willie, unless the rules have again been changed since 2002...........we ran 3 "solid" wheels
all the way back to 1979 w/SCTA/BNI.................
As I noted before we have raced only BUB since 2003 and have been "out of the loop" on SCTA/BNI sidecar rules.  BUB allows "No Spoke"
wheels all around on sidecars......and, yes, the rule makers have driven a sidecar in a cross-wind........and the danger is about the same as running a dustbin fairing on the sidecar.  On a properly built outfit, and a driver and passenger
with experience it has proven to be no big problem.

[1212FBGS]

willie your inturpitation of the rules are a little wrong there buddy...you can run solid wheels on a SC you can even totaly enclose the wheels and almost all the driver....it would be to your advantage to cover the wheel....

deb
I still have the proposal on my computer but i feel it is not my place to publish it here.... if Joe says ok, i will post it, otherwise here it is in a nut shell....
The Amo rule was submitted to Dan Warner by Joe Amo in july '05...it was a pretty extensive proposal to allow the rear of the bodywork to extend past the then legal verticle plane of the rear tire, increase the allowed heigth, and i think remove the 180 deg rear tire visability.....Joe went to alot of trouble in explaning his reasoning for his change and provided the proposed future wording....it was kicked around quite a bit and adopted with some changes.....I dont have an 07 book handy but the results are in the "A" p/s sections
kent

[John Noonan]

Kent,

When ya want to "enclose" the wheel on a stick bodywork...?

J

[1212FBGS]

as soon as your wife will let your goofy ass out long enough to bring #1 down for a make over
kent

[willieworld]

kent i try not to interperate the rules I just read them and try to follow as best as i can and yes sometimes they are confusing but in the MOTORCYCLE TECHNICAL SPECIFICATIONS AND REQUIREMENTSin 7.B 10 Non-cross ventilated front wheels are not allowed except in the sidecar and streamliner classes if the wheel is fully enclosed by the body work.It is required that front wheels be cross ventilated by an area equal to at least 25% of nominal rim circle area. Non cross ventilated wheels rear wheels are allowed. No wheel discs are permitted. The sidecar class falls in the motorcycle category so if I read the rule correctly you can't run a solid rim unless its completelycovered by body work. I have a wire front wheel on my bike with no body work. My sidecar wheel is a wire wheel with a disc on the inside which is required but its not allowed. Because it says that in section 7.I.10 the inside of the sidecar wheel must have a cover. Seems like a contradiction to me. But thats ok I don't have a problem with it . But it seems like they should disregard the cover on the wheel. Theres no difference in that then running a solid wheel. I think the intent of the rule was to origially keep the passengers fingers out of the spokes. It's kinda like the rule that says your sidecar must carry the weight of a forward facing kneeling passenger yet you don't have to carry one. You can bet this year that I'm going to submit some rule changes. Better buy some new reading glasses. Just some thoughts...
Willie Buchta

[Stainless1]

Well Jack, there ya go, open an old can of worms and surprise, they are still fresh. 

Bak, you need to re-read those posts, it is grate Scott, not great Scott,    Oh come on Scott, that is still funny...

Kent, keep up the good work buddy, have fun, be safe, keep going fast and being more than ballast.... 

[bak189]

Back in the 1980's and 1990's we were the only
sidecars racing with SCTA/BNI. (of course somewhat later some solo bikers found it was a easy way to make SCTA club points, and thus the wheel on a stick came about) Even after 1987,
when passengers were "outlawed" we still ran a full passenger platform, at times using our
"dummy" Elmo..........fast forward to the late 1990's
at that time (with my input) the rules committee
felt that in order to keep a somewhat resemblance to a "real sidecar" a 12" by 32" platform and a cover for the sidecar wheel was written into the rules.  
As I noted before I am no longer involved with
SCTA/BNI sidecar rules.  Willie,do  feel free to submit sidecar rule changes,  BUT keep in mind
that you have only been racing your sidecar for 1 year and I would think you still have a lot to learn.......I know I do... and I have been building and racing sidecars now for more than 53 years.

[1212FBGS]

stainless
i add ballast one bite at a time
kent

[willieworld]

Bob, 
You're right, I have only been racing the sidecar for one year and you're right, I still have a lot to learn about a lot of things. Landspeed racing is not my life. Its a very important part of it. I've had a very adventurous life and will continue to do so. Of all my adventures I think that landspeed racing will be the thing that I'll settle into for the duration. If it is I will try to better the sport by my contributions whatever they may be. If at some point I can't do that then I will leave and go do something else.
This year I felt that I was the new kid on the block and as you know you could be landspeed racing for 20 years and still be the new kid on the block. I've always said that if you're not going fast enough to scare yourself you are not going fast enough. When I started all this I was only going to do it for one year. But I find myself making plans into the '09 season already. Hope to see ya bub.
Willie Buchta 

[JackD]

A MC steering stop has a number of valid uses and control of a tank slapper is NOT 1 of them.
One valid intent is to keep the hands that should be required to stay on both handlebar grips (the exception might be a jockey shifter that should be restricted to a Production bike that was originally equipped with one), for the entire duration of the run, be protected with a suitable steering stop that allows the rider to maintain that grip and not have their hands be smashed against any of the structure.
If you are falsely depending on a 15 degree steering limit to retain control of a bike that has already shed the rider to save something, you have defied the laws of physics.
Try again.

[joea]

i have no problems if the rules change request is posted ..........

my frustration is in having it changed without any review by the
committee for its input........as it was presented to us on the committee
that, it was indeed the intent of such a committee........

great intentions by all at scta......that i know.......but seriously....the committee
has largely been a puppet...........haste makes waste.......and its tough to
have desired discussion and input to more effectively facilitate durable rules
changes......when rules are changed in closed door meetings without allowing
the proposed rules changes to get a look by more than the handful behind those
doors......

and no scta doesnt have to utilize their proposed rules advisory committee......

just because they set it up, I know they arent obligated to use it.........

the thing speaks for itself.......

[JackD]

It is apparent to me the system isn't working.
Am I missing something ?
Perhaps it is time to go back to something that does work.
The racer mindset is not compatible with the system they have been recently suffering from, and in my experience, that is not likely to change anytime soon.
Like anything else, the Internet can be abused, but this forum, while it tends to drift of the mark sometimes, is a really good sounding board isn't it.
When the conversation drifts off center, it is usually a signal that the horse has been beaten into submission  already.
If one chooses to not participate at all (" I don't have time for that foolishness."), it also signals something.
A recent attempt to follow the system in place was greeted with no response and well documented.
A further escalation caused an immediate response, and further identifies a basic error in judgement that was documented some time ago.
That kind of handling, from the first error during entry inspection to the explanation of it by the principal, speaks volumes. 

"It has failed as designed, or perhaps was designed to fail."
(That quote is not original with me, but certainly applies)

NOTE: Study this entire chapter, it is going to be on the test.