partial streamlining facts

[hawkwind]

This has been prompted from another thread where this topic was touched upon , I believe that it deserves its own thread and some definitive  answers
From some research I have done , I believe that some fairly radical M/C streamlining , well beyond what is permitted in the "rules" eventuated  starting around the mid 1930's   examples  Gilera  "flying pillar box " and BMW machines piloted  by Ernst Henne , after WW 2 ,NSU , Moto Guzzi and Gilera continued with there superior aerodynamics ,to set some very impressive records with what amounted to very little HP and quite small capacity motors , the last of these seems to be Wilhelm Hertz  in 56 ,after this date  the start of th "streamliner " as we now know it started its acendency , during the 50's the FIM banned dustbin type fairings  on "SAFETY" reasons , But Im one amongst many who believe that Safety was an "excuse" for banning this type of streamlining ,it had far more to do with "Money and politics" as Moto Guzzi was winning everything and the " British Lion " was pissed  though I will admit that there are safety concerns under certian conditions , these can also be reduced with carefull application of physics / aerodynamics  and some common sense .
Now I need some data and facts from those with much more information than I have
1. How many deaths have occured that are DIRECTLY the result of "dustbin fairings " and "extended boatails " ?
2. how many injuries have resulted  ( as above )
3. how many crashes  not causing injuries ( as above )
lets look at LSR events  for facts if they exist
IMHO one would expect all of the above to have happened at least once    before you could ban on "safety reasons "  if the above has not happened then what other reasonable  "excusses " can be used to ban the use of this type of streamlining Tradition  ? an FIM decision made 50 years ago ? please let me know .
The sucess of the Bussa is due to 1. a small improvement in CdA and a massive increase in RWHP,  from what has gone before  how much more power do you think bikes can make and USE  and how much many improvements in aerodynamics with the current rules ( maybe a few % points ?) again IMHO  we are only left with aerodynamics   yes  the "streamliner " is an option  but lets be fair dinkum and call a spade a spade , this route is only an option for the Wealthy , they cost a motza ( large amounts of cash )
I will continue to fight for the implementation  of rules that allow the use of streamlining that our Grandfathers used " back in the day"  for special construction sit in/on bikes
so let the jousting begin  
Gary

[John Noonan]

Lets see what 2007 or 08 holds for us..

J

[Malcolm UK]

If there is evidence of crashes in the LSR world then this group should know of it.  Just be aware that the FIM has responsibility for road racing where such faired bikes also ran and for duration speed records on oval tracks, so they may need to write a 'special' rule.

My experience of rule changing was as follows.  The FIM had a ban on tow starting of streamliners in lsr because of one fatal accident.  Team Maximum Impulse rider Richard Brown and I were supported by our National governing body (the ACU) in lobbying 'face to face' with the technical committee representatives to allow the rocket bike to be towed for our riders safety (obtain balance before ignition).  We obtained confirmation of the new rule two days before we left to run at Bonneville in 1999.  The bike had already been on board a container ship for four weeks!

Will the Australian bike federation, or whatever it is called, support you in the quest for a rule change?  If they will then the process of convincing the FIM for LSR work may be helped.

The key Brit bikes in Britsh & World LSR such as those of George Brown used a fairing similar to your descriptions.

Good luck in your quest.

[Malcolm UK]

I forgot that the new jet bike project in the UK will be fully streamlined with the rider 'sitting' over the jet motor.  Perhaps you need to be in contact with them as to this ruling because they will have to run FIM.

[rosemeyer]

Hawkwind, I suppose that the bikes you mentioned (Henne's BMW, Hertz's NSU and Taruffi's Gilera) would technically now be classified as 'streamliners', since they don't allow the rider to be "completely visible from both side and above, apart from hands and wrists" according to the famous definition of a partially streamlined motorcycle (FIM & SCTA/BNI).
But they wouldn't pass the tec' as streamliners, since they don't have a firewall between engine/fuel compartment and the rider.
I believe that was introduced in 1970/71 in the regulations after several streamliners crashed (Vesco, Leppan, Rayborn) without fatality, thanks.

[rosemeyer]

The last sit-on bike with enclosed front wheel and boatail seen at Bonneville that I know of was Burt Munro's Indian Special, and that was banned in 71, I believe; poor Burt hadn't read the new rules and was told to remove the fairing!
As it stands at present, front and rear wheels must be visible on 180 degree, and that especially forbids 'dustbin' fairing, while the tail section cannot go beyond the extremity of the rear tyre.
The only way I can see to improve the aerodynamics of a sit-on bike at present and still stay within the rules is by reducing the frontal area, which means lowering the rider position, probably by an increase in the wheelbase (maximum 72 inches in modified).  Almost everything that is possible within the rules has been done with the adoption of the Charlie Toys type fairing (courtesy of Airtech) and lengthening the rear swinging arm to increase wheelbase.
There may be no logical basis for these rules, but probably that the power to be wanted to differentiate partial-streamlining and streamliners.
There may be a case to challenge the rules.

[Dean Los Angeles]

I did a small analysis of the current Bonneville speed records comparing gas/fuel and non/partial/full streamlining in the special construction category.

I tossed the speeds where the fuel record is slower than the gas record or partial streamlined was slower than non and where the record was much faster because one of the records was pretty slow.

I found that gas/fuel non-streamlined was good for 12.33 mph and partial streamlining gas to fuel was good for 17.33 mph.

Partial streamlining was good for 16 mph on gas and the same on fuel.

Streamliner was good for 29.25 over partial streamlining on gas and 37 on fuel.

So I can see why you would want to work on the aerodynamics.

Since it is such an advantage, I wonder why the Special Construction bikes still look like bikes? Think streamliner with partial or no streamlining. Special Construction doesn't have a wheelbase limitation, so reducing the frontal area and CD is easy.

I think the modified frame partial streamlining rules are fine as is. Any thing else doesn't look like a motorcycle.

[alphabet]

Gary so if i built a dustbin fairing out of totally see/through plastic i take it that i'd be well in the confines and spirit of the law as both wheels and rider would be clearly visible.  

[JackD]

Gary so if i built a dustbin fairing out of totally see/through plastic i take it that i'd be well in the confines and spirit of the law as both wheels and rider would be clearly visible.  

Read it again. The rule requires the rider be able to shed the bike clean in the event of an upset, If you go down with it for whatever reason including excess reaction to side winds, you are required to have all the rider protection with you.
The drawing resembles the "Ironing Board" except in his case the head was forward.
The reclining position shown would prevent the rider from exiting the bike clean. Forward steering hardware would not be in the way.
Take a look at the recumbent pedal bikes for a steering method that does not restrict your exit.
That is an example of innovation that does not go against the laws of nature that have dictated the limits of streamlining.
If you try to fool Mother Nature , She will often reward you with at least a Face Plant.

[hawkwind]

This is a production M/C  called an ecomobile ( sp) no deaths or acidents  caused by sidewinds it is stable and they actually race them as well

these are some of the record breakers I have been refering to



I have also designed some bikes around these two concepts
the flying fish kneeler and a feet forward rear engine


another concept by BMW


with all due respect I believe the "SAFETY " card is over played ,its about time the special construction class is made precisly that  "special construction " cut out the bovine feaces and lets do it  

[JackD]

The first 3 are not survivable in a high speed crash any more than winds from all directions and speeds during a long run at Bonneville.
The safety record is just part of what is considered when it is decided to allow them to run.
Don't you find it curious the OEM bikes have limits that represent extensive testing and measured liability ?

[alphabet]

Malcolm UK here's a pic of George Brown i took of him possibly at Elvington disused airfield in Yorkshire in the mid 1960's while i lived in Leeds prior to him using a dustbin. enjoy

[alphabet]

JackD please accept my apologies  

[Salty Blaster]

Alph ... someone might have woken up with a rather large chip on their shoulder?

Chill out. Inference, tongue in cheek and innuendos do not translate well on boards. Mr D can say things rather strangely at times but once you begin to understand what he says it usually makes pretty good sense. Trust me I too learned over time.

[Malcolm UK]

Alphabet

A great shot of the period with the team starting the bike on the rollers, turned by the driven axle of the van.  Already George was a world record holder then but he nearly made it to 200 mph on an airfield before the age limit came into force.

I did not move to Leeds until 1970 but Elvington has remained a record setting location to the present day.