Motorcycle tire rule change

[46champ]

There is a lot of difference between a 205 mph record and a 270 mph record.

[Beairsto Racing]

I respect the SCTA's decision and their committment to safety, a rule change was inevitable.

I've emailed Tom, Van and Lee...I would just like to know what tire manufacturer's and "race" models are SCTA legal, in addition I want to know if shaving these race tires, to improve the profile for traction, will be permitted?

It was always my understanding that no tire manufacturer would go out on a limb and recommend running over 200mph on their tires, that our best choices were ZR rubber designed for heavy high speed bikes like Busa's and ZX-14's. Road race slicks don't work, Road race rain tires chunk, what else is available, what has changed? I believe Michelin Pilots are available in a race compound but it certainly doesn't say LSR approved on the sidewall. Although race tires certainly see fast speeds on GP bikes, they are not subjected to those speeds for the length of time that we see on the long course, nor the weight.

Regardless, its just another hurdle to jump and better to know now than later.... Those of us with late model bikes will likely find legal tires for 17" rims. What about the fast guys with 18" wheels, their options must be even fewer?

This subject has come up before when guys were first running over 250 and quietly went away. My 2 cents..I'd like to see shaved ZR rubber allowed for below 220 and other solutions required for above.

Cheers,
Scott

[2fast4u2c]

If SCTA has this rule this year, then ECTA will surely pounce on it for next.  I better get new tires pretty quick as soon as someone can tell me which ones to buy that is acceptable.

Guy

[gearheadeh]

I respect the SCTA's decision and their committment to safety, a rule change was inevitable.
 Road race slicks don't work, Road race rain tires chunk, what else is available, what has changed? I believe Michelin Pilots are available in a race compound but it certainly doesn't say LSR approved on the sidewall. Although race tires certainly see fast speeds on GP bikes, they are not subjected to those speeds for the length of time that we see on the long course, nor the weight.

Regardless, its just another hurdle to jump and better to know now than later.... Those of us with late model bikes will likely find legal tires for 17" rims. What about the fast guys with 18" wheels, their options must be even fewer?

This subject has come up before when guys were first running over 250 and quietly went away. My 2 cents..I'd like to see shaved ZR rubber allowed for below 220 and other solutions required for above.
Cheers,
Scott

Great post Scott, Summed up what I would have had to say!!!

[sockjohn]

Those of us with late model bikes will likely find legal tires for 17" rims. What about the fast guys with 18" wheels, their options must be even fewer?

This subject has come up before when guys were first running over 250 and quietly went away. My 2 cents..I'd like to see shaved ZR rubber allowed for below 220 and other solutions required for above.

I remember looking at road race tires and noticed a lot of the skinnier tire options lacked hard compounds as well.  Maybe that has changed in the past few years, or my search was not thorough enough.  I won't speculate as to what is safer, a soft road race tire or a ZR tire, but it is worth pondering for those with the right knowledge and data.

I know that the Goodyear LSR tires have been ran both front and rear on more than one motorcycle, both fairly recently and decades ago.  I have discussed this with a few people in the past.  Again, I don't really know if that is a better solution, but it is another option to consider and weigh the benefits and drawbacks.   

[dw230]

As anticipated many questions have come up.

May I direct you to the original post:

Please contact the following for further info:
Van Butler- catherinejuneau3@mac.com

Tom Evans- oileaky2@yahoo.com

Lee Kennedy- lee.kennedy@avmeterics.net

Good information coming from John Noonan, Kent and Scott B. Maybe those that are on the motorcycle advisory committee can post more info that resulted from the discussions.

DW
 
 
« Last Edit: May 22, 2010, 11:25:51 AM by dw230 » 
 

[Dean Los Angeles]

If the tire is made for motorcycle road racing and doesn't have a DOT number then that is the tire you are looking for. It isn't rocket science.
Are they rated for over 200? Yes, no, maybe. I think the general idea is that the racing tires are made to a higher standard then the gazillions of ZR tires and have less chance of failing.
Tires for LSR? Stop looking now. There isn't ever going to be one. They make more tires for a MotoGP weekend than they ever will for 200+ LSR.

Bridgestone racing tires
http://www.motorcycle-karttires.com/racing/2008RoadRaceBrochure.pdf
Bridgstone racing dealers
http://www.motorcycle-karttires.com/RoadRacing.aspx
Dunlop racing tires
http://www.dunlopracing.com/DETAIL-SLICKS.html
Continental
http://www.conti-online.com/generator/www/de/en/continental/motorcycle/themes/press/press_releases/conti_raceattack_slick_en.html
Metzeler
http://www.us.metzelermoto.com/web/catalog/moto/moto_catalogoDett.page?categoria=/catalog/moto/racing&vehicleType=MOTO&menu_item=/products/catalog/racing
Shinko
http://www.shinkotireusa.com/product/product.php?id=49

[bak189]

Roadrace tires are made using a fairly soft compound of rubber......and are made to go around corners.....
But what I see as the biggest problem is all the weight most of our over 200mph bikes have onboard in order to get better traction...........roadrace tires may well hold up for over 200mph plus.....but NO WAY
will they hold up on the rear wheel that is carrying all that lead.

PS. John and Kent.......You still have not told us what and who's tires you would recomend and/or use.
      or does "insurance not allow" you to tell us..................................................................

[thundersalt]

Not a bike guy but applaud the rule change for safety. Just curious why it wasn't announced before May 15th

[Beairsto Racing]

I asked Tom Evans to define a race tire so that I can purchase new legal tires. His response today was:
-racing tires
-road racing tires
-DOT road racing tires
-DOT racing tires

I was also concerned if shaving was permitted and yes it is, if done in a safe manner. Nate Jones always looks after me.

I'll likely buy some used "DOT race tires" that still have some life in them and send them to Nate. I've had new tires blister and chunk, that's why I'm a firm believer in seasoned tires and have had no more problems since we started getting them shaved. Your results may vary.

I'm not running the twin engine bike this year, not because of the tire rule, I wanted bigger engines and there have been lots of delays with machine work. The Double was designed around skinny 18" wheels, not sure what we'll do there. I'd like to hear what race tire options the 18" wheel crowd finds.

I encourage all of you who are affected by the rule change to contact Tom, Van and Lee, they were quick to respond to my questions.

Cheers,
Scott

[wobblywalrus]

Last summer I ran over something on the freeway in Portland.  I felt the little "bump bump" under the tires and it did not seem to be serious.  I continued to ride.  I lubed my chain when I got home and noticed a big cut on the tire that went in to the steel belt and stopped.  I replaced the tire.  The steel belt saved my butt and I run steel belted radials now.  A similar cut could happen at the speed trials if I run over a bolt or something.

Slim, when you contact the tire guys next week, ask them if there are any approved racing tires with steel belts.

[John Noonan]

Roadrace tires are made using a fairly soft compound of rubber......and are made to go around corners.....
But what I see as the biggest problem is all the weight most of our over 200mph bikes have onboard in order to get better traction...........roadrace tires may well hold up for over 200mph plus.....but NO WAY
will they hold up on the rear wheel that is carrying all that lead.

PS. John and Kent.......You still have not told us what and who's tires you would recomend and/or use.
      or does "insurance not allow" you to tell us..................................................................

Looks like the new bike will have LSR tires..

[bak189]

That's great John.....you have just told us nothing.......OR are you saying that you will be using special
made M/C LSR tires......if so what make and where do we get them...............................................

Regarding, 18 inch wheel roadracing tires......rcbtires@bellsouth.net....Vintage roadracing tires.............

[RIFLEMAN]

I asked Tom Evans to define a race tire so that I can purchase new legal tires. His response today was:
-racing tires
-road racing tires
-DOT road racing tires
-DOT racing tires

I was also concerned if shaving was permitted and yes it is, if done in a safe manner.
I encourage all of you who are affected by the rule change to contact Tom, Van and Lee, they were quick to respond to my questions.

Cheers,
Scott

OK,let the confusion continue. Dean says "a tire with no DOT #'s is what your looking for(so a tire with a NHS stamp),then according to the quote,Tom Evans says a "DOT race tire" is OK,which IS going to have a DOT # . Shaving is OK,but what about grooving? Don't see a slick getting much bite at EM.

And bak139 has made a valid point about the compound. Even the "hardest" NHS tire is soft by normal standards and is designed to be on a sub 400lbs bike with a 160lbs rider on its back,not a 550lbs 'Busa or ZX12/14 with a cornfed pilot and 80lbs of ballast onboard. Especially when you check the recommended pressures which are usually in the low 20's If those parameters are not taken into consideration this new rule is probably going to cause more problems than it solves. Unfortunately it'll probably take a spectacular failure of a 'safe' tire to get recognition of this fact. As far as a racing tire being built to a higher standard,what do you think a tire mfg is more worried about-a tire failing under race conditions,or a tire failing on an open class bike out on the highway with a potential litigant on the back?
 Look,I'm like everybody else,I have a family that really needs me to make it home from a meet to go to work and pay the mortgage,but I believe that this ruling was a little rushed without adequate undertanding of what the solution was going to be.  Yes,with bikes now in direct view if a 300mph pass,tires are a huge issue. But for bikes under 225 the old rule has gotten everybody home. Tires aren't like making a metal chainguard or adding a steering damper,we can't "make" a tire in order to comply.
 Unless someone like M/T Tire(they build DOT legal drag tires for sub 7 second bikes) decides to do something for us the only logical progression(if 'safety' is the cause) is to ban bikes over 200 until a purpose built tire is available. And since by anyones admission that isn't going to happen,looks like bike racing is over
 BTW,If I can get my hands on some,looks like the Dunlop N-Tec slick with the Daytona compound is the best bet.

[gearheadeh]

[/quote]

I believe that this ruling was a little rushed without adequate undertanding of what the solution was going to be.  Yes,with bikes now in direct view if a 300mph pass,tires are a huge issue. But for bikes under 225 the old rule has gotten everybody home. Tires aren't like making a metal chainguard or adding a steering damper,we can't "make" a tire in order to comply.
 Unless someone like M/T Tire(they build DOT legal drag tires for sub 7 second bikes) decides to do something for us the only logical progression(if 'safety' is the cause) is to ban bikes over 200 until a purpose built tire is available. And since by anyones admission that isn't going to happen,looks like bike racing is over
 BTW,If I can get my hands on some,looks like the Dunlop N-Tec slick with the Daytona compound is the best bet.

[/quote]


It seems to be the possible sunset for bikes!