Author Topic: air shifters  (Read 8532 times)

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Offline 2stroke

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air shifters
« on: April 29, 2008, 10:37:22 PM »
As a new member of ECTA (since last week), and a long time drag racer, I'm looking for a new challenge.  I'd like to run my dragbike (with modifications to fit the rules) and was wondering if air shifters were legal.  I've read through the rule book several times and saw nothing specifically prohibiting their use.  Also, where should I go or who should I talk to about putting together a machine just for events at Maxton?  How much different is the standing start mile than the 1/4 mile?  Aside from an engine that has to stay together for a much longer period of time, what else is needs to be changed?  I suppose these are pretty basic questions, but I'd appreciate a little "schooling" so I don't make too many rookie mistakes......

2Stroke

Offline Stainless1

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2008, 10:54:46 PM »
Welcome to LSR, yep you can air shift, regear, different back tire probably unless you are using a ZR street tire already. 
The big difference is about 3/4 more running room, lots of time at WOT.  Have fun, be safe, go fast
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, Bockscar Lakester #1000 with a little N2O

Offline ol38y

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2008, 11:52:12 PM »
2stroke,

    I'll agree you can run an air shifter. But, last year there was a guy at the BUB meet with one and every time he ran he couldn't get off the track cuz his shifter wouldn't down shift. So, he held the meet up waiting for his crew to get there to push him outta the way. You have plenty of time to get to speed so they're not really nesesary.  Just something to think about. My 2cents  :-D

Larry
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2010 BUB 1350 M-PG record
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Offline isiahstites

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #3 on: April 30, 2008, 12:59:24 AM »
2stroke,

    I'll agree you can run an air shifter. But, last year there was a guy at the BUB meet with one and every time he ran he couldn't get off the track cuz his shifter wouldn't down shift. So, he held the meet up waiting for his crew to get there to push him outta the way. You have plenty of time to get to speed so they're not really nesesary.  Just something to think about. My 2cents  :-D

Larry

Typically air shifters are not set-up to shift down, did the guy not have a foot shifter?

Scott

landracing

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #4 on: April 30, 2008, 03:09:04 AM »
The guy at BUB who couldn't get off the darn track is why the meet has been getting bad talk, at least one of the reasons... you had to get down to 50 mph before you stopped the bike, steer the darn thing off the track and coast to where ever you need. Just a lack of common sense and should have been kicked out of the meet if it was a regular occurance.

Why aren't air shifters made to work to shift down???? Most have a port at the top or bottom and be made to work either way... I know several teams that use then that way.. One specifically in a lakester, never had a problem with it, up or down...

Jon

Offline 2stroke

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #5 on: April 30, 2008, 09:26:38 AM »
Thanks to all, I appreciate the feedback.  My airshifter is set to upshift only, but I have never had a problem downnshifting at the end of a run.  I think I'll stick with the shift mechanism on my bike.

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Offline ol38y

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #6 on: April 30, 2008, 10:06:51 AM »
Jon

   I agree, that guy should have been told to change that before he rode again, but he wasn't. I also wondered why they didn't make it downshift as all the air cyls. would have 2 ports.

Scott

  I guess they did not put any provisions for foot shifting, just the air cyl.. Seemed foolish to me.

  I just noticed this is ECTA rules questions... Duh :roll:  Well then, it would probably be even more important to be able to shift down.
Larry Cason
Bakersfield,CA    It's a dry heat!

2010 BUB 1350 M-PG record
2012 Speedweek  1350 A-PG record 169.975
2014 El Mirage Dry Lake  1350 A-PG  172.651

Offline Seldom Seen Slim

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #7 on: April 30, 2008, 11:02:54 AM »
Yup -- at Maxton you want to be able to choose as much braking as you want to have -- brakes, wind (sit up!), and compression, so downshifting is a good idea.  As for why have an airshifter at Maxton?  Well, a second here and a second there (time when you're not accelerating due to gear shifting) means time you don't have in the top gears to let the engine wind towards it's peak.  There';s one reason.  Another is why we've got a shifter on our nitrous bike:  Because the clutch pull is pretty stout and Nancy's already stretched out to hold on, pulling in the clutch when shifting into sixth gear leads to a bobble in the steering input.  Push a little button with left thumb -- no wobble, and bingo, we're in the next gear. 

Our shifter is "up only", with the regular peg on there for getting into first and going back down through the gears. 
Jon E. Wennerberg
 a/k/a Seldom Seen Slim
 Skandia, Michigan
 (that's way up north)
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Offline Beairsto Racing

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #8 on: April 30, 2008, 11:18:41 AM »
Welcome to the sport. We'd like to hear about your bike and which class you'll be running in.

Scott
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Offline Stan Back

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #9 on: April 30, 2008, 11:49:31 AM »
(Non-biker question.)  Would air shifters be legal in Production classes?  Or just hidden?
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Offline DahMurf

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #10 on: April 30, 2008, 12:16:41 PM »
(Non-biker question.)  Would air shifters be legal in Production classes?  Or just hidden?

(biker answer) I would think that if you could find a way to completely hide it that you could use one in production. That being said, good luck trying to hide all of that!  :-D I think you *might* be able to do it, but boy is that a lot of work!

I would imagine that the use of an air shifter at Maxton would be much more beneficial then on the salt due to the short distance for acceleration. Some of us gimps in the sport have other reasons for using them with a positive side effect that it's quicker anyway!  8-)

As for 2Strokes original questions;

yes air shifters are legal. I don't think many, if any, people are using an air down shift at maxton. Can be used, just for the most part not necessary.

Gearing will need to be different.

Body position is much more important in LSR.

Launch is different (or should we say, you don't need to launch like a drag racer!  :lol: )

Like Jon said brakes are important!

Our track has a 2 slight turns so being able to turn the bike is a helpful thing!  :-o

As for general chat on setup & what to do, you're in a fine place. Talk & ask away & we'll all help as much as we can. If you're looking for a little one on one chat or more private chat, that is available too. Just say so & you'll be contacted!

When do you plan to come run with us?
Care to share (generally) what you'll be running?
Oh & FYI, we're much more open about things in the LSR world then the Drag world. We are very competitive but we help each other any way we can... even to beat ourselves!  :-)

Welcome aboard!
Deb
Miss you my friend :-* - #1302  Twin Jugs Racing
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Offline Rick Byrnes

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #11 on: April 30, 2008, 12:29:56 PM »
I don't see any reason why an air shifted clutchless gear box would not be legal, but after having run a T5, and TREMAC in the Merk, the Ford GT in the Fusion, and, the Jerico air shifted trans in the lakester, I wouldn't think the air shifting would really be a benefit.  In low 200 mph cars, you have shifted into 4th gear by the end of the first mile, and I think moderately good manual shifting is adequate.
With a rear engine manual gearbox, the air shifter is much simpler relative to linkage, but the air system is quite cumbersome and leak prone.  I have replumbed with aeroquip and sealed up well, but still having to rely on a 2#bottle of CO2 is not my prefrence.  I'm now looking to update with a small on board compressor and aluminum bottles.
Anybody know of a 200 psi 12 volt compressor thats not too large and heavy?


Rick Byrnes

Rick

Offline 2stroke

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #12 on: April 30, 2008, 09:10:42 PM »
My current bike would fit into A/G400-2, it is a Yamaha RD400, stretched, lowered, and new enough that I'm still working out the bugs.  I hope to attend either the Sept. or Oct. meet, work will dictate which one will get the nod. This looks to be a pretty interesting process, I can do some testing at the local drag strip (Indianapolis Raceway Park, now known as O'Reilly Raceway Park at Indianapolis) and perhaps even be semi-ready for some late summer fun in NC.  I appreciate all the kind words and look forward to meeting everyone this fall.   
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Offline Stainless1

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #13 on: April 30, 2008, 09:44:39 PM »
Hey Deb, you forgot to tell him to watch out for the cones, but not to focus on them.... Just kidding... good to see you are racing naked this season, looked like you were enjoying yourself.

2stroke, you are going to be running a 1 mile drag race, at Bonneville we run a 2 1/4 mile drag race.  In our lakester we shift up and down with air, it was the best way to plumb the shift linkage from the drivers area to the motor in the back.  If you run out of power work on your tuck, aero is a big factor in LSR.
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, Bockscar Lakester #1000 with a little N2O

Offline Larry C

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Re: air shifters
« Reply #14 on: May 01, 2008, 01:43:32 PM »
We have tried two  electric shifters on our sidecar and by far the Pingle unit is the best. It shifts up and down flawlesley and is a very quality unit.