Saving the Salt

[kustombrad]

Has anyone researched how much money the racers and spectators bring IN to the local economy every year (food, lodging, fuel, etc.)?

[hotrod]

It is clear from that chart that temperature at which the salt gets wetted by run off makes a big difference for some of the salts.

Magnesium sulfate is much more soluble at high temps than at low temps, which explains USFRAMONTES comment about the salt mush on the top of the salt after a rain event being mostly magnesium sulfate. Magnesium chloride is the most soluble across all common temperatures, the sulfate salt is also very soluble at high temps but rapidly drops its solubility as the brine cools. It is more easily dissolved when the salt receives rainfall in the summer time and the surface is warm and the last to fall out of solution as the brine evaporates at high temperatures. On the other hand if the weather cooled dramatically it would be the first salt to fall out of solution.

This is part of how they separate the various salts in the evaporation ponds as in cold weather all the salts except sodium chloride (common table salt) fall out of solution first as the ponds cool each night and as the seasons change.

This also implies that as the rain waters flood the salt they would tend to dissolve those salts first and carry them into the subsurface brine pool, depleting the surface crust of those more soluble salts leaving behind mostly pure NaCl (sodium chloride) salt.

Then I suspect as the salt flats go through their daily temperature cycle and moisture gets drawn to the surface of the salt during the heat of the day, it should bring back those more soluble salts to the surface, which would drop out of solution as the sun sets and the surface cools. This redeposition of the more soluble salts might explain the cementing action that makes for hard durable salt, vs the course easily crumbled salt we have right after the salt gets washed down by run off, and has just recently dried.

Just a random observation to mix into the pot of considerations about how best to manage the salt restoration.

[Bob Drury]

  Tom, thanks for posting that.  You just got to love those wonderfull politicians in the State of Utah and Nevada.  Sell off part of a National Treasure located in their own damn State for a nice big political contribution (often disguised as defrayed seat on the board or free use for life of some Island).
  I assume that the esteemed Mayor of West Wendover also has the backing of The Casino Consortium which is somewhat confusing.  One is left to wonder if the Revenue from reduced rate rooms for gamblers (Four or five years ago I paid $200. for a room at the Rainbow and when I reserved it online I got the same identical room for $40 bucks including the ten dollar discount for reserving online and yes that was in October not August) will offset the total net earnings of fleecing the racer's out of over $200 bucks a night.  I would venture to guess that We also outspend the gamblers Food and Beverage sales by a wide margin during the same period.
  I guess they would rather clean up puke on the poker tables than vacuum the carpets.

[Koncretekid]

"To produce Metal Recovery Salt (MRS), which is a combination of potash and salt, the ore from the harvest ponds is sent directly to the dryer to be dried and screened. The final products are conveyed and stored in bulk storage warehouses. From the warehouses, potash and MRS are loaded directly into railcars or trucks for shipment."

This statement from the above report verifies that Intrepid are removing salt (presumedly the salt mentioned in the foregoing statement is NaCl) and shipping out railcars full. I wonder how much of this product is being extracted.  Is it enough to be significant to our arguments that they are destroying the salt flats?

Tom

[Bob Drury]

  In my opinion even if the new venture is stopped, the future of racing on the Salt in the future looks dismal at best.  This leads me to believe that it is even more important to get off our butt's and take the BLM to court.  If we lose and they are allowed to go with the Status Quo, it will mean continued pumping and further degradation of the Salt, and if We win that suit it will set a precedent in Federal Court that should cause the New Venture's effort null and void.  And if the Federal Court suit (assuming We win at the District level) decision is appealed by the BLM the appeal should hold up any action by the New Venture.
  This may sound like nothing more than stalling off the eventual outcome but by the time the first or second level rulings  were to be appealed (and hopefully wouldn't be) it could only go to the Supreme Court of the United States who would first review the appeal before deciding to even considering the case.
  My opinion is that the Public Outcry by that time might change the course of History of the United States by reeling in Private Mining of Public Lands in Federally protected areas.  This is a current issue in the State of Oregon  where Gold Mining is threatening the fisheries and ecosystems of Public Lands and Water Resources.
  At this time the BLM is in one hell of a pickle.  The recent outcry that The Salt Lake Tribune's articles have brought to light means that any and all Testing Reports they have offered (Or possibly been ordered by the Department of the Interior?) to do will be under scrutiny by the Public for the first time.  They can't bull sh*t their way out of this quagmire or spend months waiting for the "heat" to be off.  
  If they agree to immediately start Hauling all the Salt back to the Salt Flats from  the Potash plant, and sign a agreement to continue and to review the present damage being done by brine removal, then we still need to follow thru with the suit that would force them to reverse  the impact and destruction  by returning the Salt to usable condition,because in my opinion, we have a better chance of winning a precedent setting suit in Federal Court (which should kill the new venture) where the Politicians have no say than we do of keeping Oren Hatch and the New Venture from striking first and forcing Congressional legislation.  If He beats us to the punch, its all over for the Salt Flats. And if we don't have the evidence to win the BLM suit at the District Level We are doomed anyway.                                                                                              
  There is absolutely no way the BLM can hold off the New Venture suit when you have the political clout of Oren Hatch and his cronies.
                                                                   Just my opinion and with regards,
                                                                       Bob Drury

[vette#128]

Letter from Jim Dunn.........

Hi All,
 
A lot is happening with regard  to the challenge SCTA/BNI has with the unfavorable weather and salt conditions at Bonneville in preparation for running Speed Week starting on August 8th. Two weeks ago we were on the salt to lay out and drag our usual 4 courses. DIDN"T Happen.... Short courses 3 & 4 we could only get 2 miles of decent salt. We moved the starting line of course 2 slightly toward the dike so that we could get course one to higher ground. Course 2 was a little rough and only 2 3/4 miles of salt and it turned into dirt all the way to the 7 mile which was under about one inch of water. That as it stands is not good enough for a short course. Course one was even a bigger challenge and we were not able to drag it at all.
 
On Friday night the SCTA board revealed the results of the short course only survey and due to the interest of the racers (including us) voted to try and find at least one or two short courses to put on a meet. BNI Chairman Roy Creel and SCTA President Bill Lattin are enroute to and will be on the salt Monday to assess the situation and decide a course of action. The good or bad news will be posted on the SCTA web site on July 22nd. Keep your fingers crossed.
 
 
Jim

[Milwaukee Midget]

Has anyone researched how much money the racers and spectators bring IN to the local economy every year (food, lodging, fuel, etc.)?

It's my understanding that New Years Eve (one night, albeit one many would consider "special") brings in more money to West Wendover.  Speedweek is 2nd.

Personally, I'd rather have a barium enema than spend New Years Eve in a tacky casino on a frontage road in Nevada.

[Frankie7799]

Granted I've never seen an aerial map of the area, but why can't they mine the salt in the Death Valley area instead of Bonneville?

[salt]

I agree with Terry, Bob, Thomas, Louise and so many others:

 No more Mr. Nice Guy!

The diplomacy of the past 25 years has not achieved the desired outcome. The outlook is grim. Now is the time to start fighting for this PROTECTED geological marvel steeped in history, our beloved Bonneville Salt Flats.
I'm ready to be all in with some serious seed money to hire "Mr. Spence."

Willi

Kraut Bros.

P.S. In spite of everything, we should still work with the BLM, whenever possible. There are people that have it in their power to possibly halt (man-made) mineral depletion.

[F104A]

Maybe it's time for a class action lawsuit to get a court date and 1200 Bonneville enthusiasts and racers testify. That might get the attention of
the judge!

[vwpsycho]

Today we spent a few hours driving around out at Bonneville. I've posted photos at
https://www.facebook.com/PotterBrosRacing

[gas pumper]

hotrod:  Thank you for sharing all the interesting research you have been doing. The technical end of this mystery is very interesting. 
I believe the return of the brine to north is helping Intrepid to dissolve more of the salt/potash layers in the upper part of the salt crust (the top 3-6 feet).
Another mystery to me is where is the massive amounts of water coming from that they use in this process? I know it was mentioned about an aquifier deep under the salt beds. It would then seem to me that artificially wetting the flats or pumping this water into the salt zone would be detrimental to drying the lake bed too.

Frank

[SPARKY]

I wonder what they will do with pre-entries that need 5 and choose not to run otherwise? 

We will wait and see just like everyone else--look forward to the Official post on Tu.

[DaveB]

"Salt is currently mass-produced by evaporation of seawater or brine from brine wells and salt lakes." This is a quote from Wikipedia. I did some more reading and this is certainly true. The brine wells and salt lakes it is talking about here is our racing surface. Apparently the stuff Intrepid is selling is in part THE RACING SURFACE!

As to which "salt" type it is, I suspect the top hard surface is a combination of salt types that are bonded together. As others have pointed out, the top hard surface is the stuff we are concerned about because that is probably the most important part of the racing surface. Intrepid's collection process does not differentiate between the top layer and lower stuff. In fact their collection ditches probably preferentially capture the salt from the top surface. The runoff that goes to the ditches took into solution the top surface. It needs to stay where it is so the sun evaporates the water back out and the salt stays on top.

When minerals are mined you always have stuff left over that you can not sell because it is the wrong material, the wrong concentration, the wrong crystal structure etc. These leftovers are called "tailings" and getting rid of tons and tons of the wrong stuff is a problem for all mineral miners and processors (I work in the industry). The best way to get rid of it is find somebody that wants it. You give it to them so it is no longer your responsibility. I suspect this is exactly what their brine they are pumping back to the flats is, leftovers. Then they can claim "LOOK AT US WE ARE GIVING YOU BACK WHAT YOU WANT!" The stuff they are giving us back is probably some of their tailings.

I'll say it again. I believe Intrepid is selling the salt racing surface! This is why did they set up here in the first place.

[Bob Drury]

  Midget, I am about to undergo my ninth Surgery, have had one sygmoidoscopy (never again), four colonoscopies, and hopefully the ONLY BARIUM ENEMA THAT I WILL EVER HAVE IN MY LIFE!
  I could write a Book on the experience with the most likely Title of "Your going to put a plug up my A*s with a air valve in it? Let Me the f**k out of here right now".
  By the way, every Bar I have related this "experience" in over the years has needed to repair damage done by patrons diving under the tables, cowering in fear as I take them along the step by step journey that makes "Water-Boarding" by Dick Cheney pale in comparison... and I ain't sh*ttin you.
                                                                              One Run Bob,  much older and wiser than most*

*experience is the best teacher, more or less...................