Elvington: 265.4 on a Busa today

[JackD]

Are the records in the short distances done with a 1 run deal and various other differences ?
Most are Club records and each has it's standards that are dictated by the space and time available.
Until they all run to the same standard the cussing and discussing will dominate.
Longer, better surfaces are as available as performance.

[JackD]

The experts would say is is foolish to guess because the amateurs will strive to fool you.
It was not long ago we had a lot of the same experts and 200 mph was a real mark.
Today you can go that fast if you just have good credit and no credentials.

[joea]

bbb..........world land speed records have had the
standard of...................average speed over 5280 ft,
or 1 kilo................for about a century.............

that is tough to find the venue to support maintaining
top speed for that distance..........that is what forced
most, to places like Gairdner or Bonneville...........that
forces one to deal with those venue's challenges............

so those that take on the challenges of setting a standard world land
speed record see the flying 132 (60ft..?) ft timing trap speed as very
interesting but along way off........

I am still wondering how all those bikes picked up 20+ mph this year
compared to runs over the last 5yrs+ of running there with similar set up bikes............?


Joe

[Lorcan]

I'll answer any questions as best I can, I wasn't at the event but I do know most of the fast runners. The meeting was a UK record meeting, the first to be run under the IOPD (Institute of Professional Drivers). It was not meant to be a world record meet or in any way comparable to Bonneville records.

The white bike pictured is the 257mph bike of Jarrod "Jack" Frost. This was it's first full outing. Jack is the existing 2-way ACU UK record holder.

The course is approx 2 miles overall with the 80' speed trap at around 1.5 miles and 0.5 miles to stop. The trap was NOT in the middle of the course as per ACU rules, so the same distance applies on the return run.

Did I miss anything?

[bbb]

no one here, not myself nor anywhere I have read thus far has said the 265.4 was a world record. nearly everyone wants to defend a indefensible position; this wasnt a world record, but the fastest a motorcycle has ever been timed. 10', 60', 120', 5,000' whatever.

my point was this; until everyone (US, UK, AU,) agrees to a specific distance (let alone metric vs standard) we can only look at what was produced and admire it for what it was.

Noonan has as an avatar his 261 on GPS but not his times for his highest mph record. this is just another example. admire it for what it is. no one is taking anything from anyone. especially not me. I have a 500+hp busa that has not made 200mph yet...so I am just looking in from the outside.

[joea]

thats just it bbb................the FIM (scta, LSA... etal) has
been the standard world wide for over a century............
flying mile and flying kilo............

kudo's to those running the flying 80ft and flying 132ft..........!!!!!!

awesome numbers...!!!!

credence is all relative...........FIM  with standard
distance.......two way.......opposite direction......with
measurement criteria........wind criteria.......etc.....ensure
the same for all...............

this does nothing to take away from those who did so well
in Elvington...........KUDOs..........CHEERS......!!!

the questions were asked about why Bonn. why salt...etc
and was answered here..........

[JackD]

The Flat Earth Society and the Brotherhood of Not Invented Here will be talking about that for a long time.
The 1 mile to a 132' trap is a repeatable and accurately measurable distance and time that can be duplicated around the Real World and be verified.
The distance of 1 mile, the 1% requirement, the turn around time the backup run over the same real estate,
 grade change, outside assist, the durability were all measures to level the field when the competition first started and reflect
 the frailties of the day.
Don't kid yourself, most LSR racers would kill to have the HP and durability of a NASCAR or F1.
You don't find them in LSR for lots reasons with some better than others.
You guys just have to get it together and then
 remember where you put it.

[Sumner]

bbb..........world land speed records have had the
standard of...................average speed over 5280 ft,
or 1 kilo................for about a century.............

that is tough to find the venue to support maintaining
top speed for that distance..........that is what forced
most, to places like Gairdner or Bonneville...........that
forces one to deal with those venue's challenges............
Joe

The way I see it at Bonneville and Gairdner 90+% of the vehicles have a long enough course to see what their true top speed is.

Cars/bikes running on 1 to 1 1/2 mile strips (including El Mirage) are still exploring the acceleration capabilities of their vehicles similar to those running the 1/4 mile only longer.  True some of the under 200 mph vehicles might reach their optimal top speed, but those over 200 are working every angle to accelerate as fast as possible to the traps.

Some of the really fast cars at b'ville that have out the "back door" speeds greater than their 5th mile speed are also trying to balance acceleration with top speed.

I haven't had the opportunity yet of trying to run 5 miles at WOT or near to it, but I have witnessed it is a feeling and or sight that no car/bike running at high speed for only a matter of seconds can duplicate.  I can't really imagine anyone running Maxton, El Mirage, Texas, England, etc. that doesn't have it in their mind that where they want to be one day is B'ville or Lake Gairdner and if you are a spectator I think the feelings or similar.

c ya, Sum

[JackD]

Their are more surfaces available in North Africa but the accessibility is a real challenge.
The tracks are so good I think they even fight wars over them and still don't get to race.
The 17,000' surfaces for the Space Shuttle are becoming more available.
The guy at Edwards suggested we could have the pits inside the climate controlled paint booth.
Time marches on, don't let it leave without you.

[bak189]

265 mph...outstanding....BUT if the same bike was run at Bonneville....
265 mph maybe!!!! The last years with the condition of the salt,
traction has been a BIG problem (right John)  Even back in the early 1990's when according to Bonneville experts the salt was "great" our sidecar ran 162+mph
I took the outfit one month later to France....ran the same gearing
but on pavement (tarmac to you Brits) at 187+mph.  Again the experts tell that us that this year
the salt is the best seen in many years.....so 270mph (right John)

[JackD]

Salt is even tougher to swallow in large amounts.

[John Noonan]

265 mph...outstanding....BUT if the same bike was run at Bonneville....
265 mph maybe!!!! The last years with the condition of the salt,
traction has been a BIG problem (right John)  Even back in the early 1990's when according to Bonneville experts the salt was "great" our sidecar ran 162+mph
I took the outfit one month later to France....ran the same gearing
but on pavement (tarmac to you Brits) at 187+mph.  Again the experts tell that us that this year
the salt is the best seen in many years.....so 270mph (right John)

Gary,

I agree fully however no 270 for me, I sold my stuff to another racer so he can race this year

J

[Malcolm UK]

Other than the IOPD (and what constitutes a professional driver or rider?) who will care about the speeds attained being UK speed records?  

As the track arrangement described could only be used by motorcycles with very good brakes, its just an event for bragging rights.  Why - so the sponsorship money can be attracted to get one or more of the bikes being used across the pond an onto the salt flats.  

If they had tried to follow Texas and Maxton with 1 mile and 132 feet timed they may have joined an established party, but 1.5 mile - for car safety you would need a 2.3 or 2.5 mile long runway and Britain has none of those available.

Its also a good way of p*****g me off, when the team I was with in '97 thro' to '99 atleast did a true ACU British record - flying start, 1/4 mile timed distance two way - with one run at 241 mph with change.  The quarter in the centre allowed only 0.8 mile run up.

It will be interesting to see if these "IOPD UK Speed Records" gain favour over the ACU/FIM British records.  Although the riders may never try for ACU or FIM speed records I wonder if taking part in a 'rival' UK speed record contest will affect them receiving their racing licences?  Governing bodies do get protective of their Record Books!

[tomsmith]

I read that "Salar de Uyuni ", the largest salt flat in the world, is in Bolivia on the Altiplano plateau, with salt depth over 750 ft in some places.  The only problem is that it is at 12,000 ft altitude.  It may be a little inconviently located, but the good news is that Bollivia has a revolution every 6 months or so.  A few gun fights with the army would add to the thrills and excitement of conducting a speed meet.  Just think of the possibilities.

[JackD]

I am going to enjoy watching the British fight each other on their home turfs.
You didn't hear it but MK spit before he said that and Tom had his tongue firmly planted in his cheek.
The British local variation on the "Rooster" is the "Brewster".

That can be fixed though.

GAME  ON