Motorcycle displacement issues...

[Nortonist 592]

Jack D has a fantastic idea for a handicap system.  If we can get him to put it in writing all our problems wil be solved.  I have'nt the details to hand but if you are 95 years old and have a 1906 Harley you can become the worlds fastest.

[panic]

[Nortonist 592]

I am not advocating a one make one model class by any means.  What I am trying to say is that if the KR is the bike to beat in that class then the racers will use that model.  There always will be the one person who will beat his head against a wall and make something else competitive.  That someone wants to race an obviously uncompetitive bike should not mean that everyone else has to slow down.  Or be handicapped in order to make a slower bike competitive.  If you look at the SCTA rules compared to the FIM rules we are catered for much better.  If you look at the car guys you will find an awful lot of Chevys lurking under those Ford hoods.  Why?  Beats me.  I always thought a V8 was a V8 etc.   Obviously those that run Chevys know something.  I do think that flatheads having the 1/3 displacement "advantage" is fair.  If records were set with a bigger "advantage" well, it will take a bit of tuning to overcome that.  But racers being what they are will figure a way to do it.

[panic]

[JackD]

I too have an idea for a contest.

Let's have Jack D propose his ideas for a revised M/C rules package.

The prize would be a very happy and respected portion of the LSR community.

DW

Yeah, but thats not as easy as shooting flaming arrows and using the rolling eyes smiley! ...  

The 'FLAMING ARROWS" are not fired at random but with a purpose.
I understand they work both ways and I don't see any return fire.

[JohnR]

I too have an idea for a contest.

Let's have Jack D propose his ideas for a revised M/C rules package.

The prize would be a very happy and respected portion of the LSR community.

DW

Yeah, but thats not as easy as shooting flaming arrows and using the rolling eyes smiley! ...  

The 'FLAMING ARROWS" are not fired at random but with a purpose.
I understand they work both ways and I don't see any return fire.

Well the purpose still eludes me. Or maybe, I'm just looking for the usefull purpose.

[JohnR]

.... It is interesting to note that Modified is now Modified Production.  But there is no mention of that class in the 2006 rule book.  Is this an oversight?  Will we get another 1000 classes for Modified Production?  Am I being sarcastic?  No, I'm asking a question...

Pg 101, 2006 SCTA Rulebook.

7.F MODIFIED PRODUCTION

[JackD]

If you are going to make yourself a target, better lighting can really help those
 that are intent on recognizing your position.
In this case the target really hates the light and seem to attract a lot of arrows.
 That inicates something is wrong.
Being on target is not easy and you have to be prepared for some return fire.
Unless you stand your ground, it is not so much a battle as it is a chase.

[JackD]

.... It is interesting to note that Modified is now Modified Production.  But there is no mention of that class in the 2006 rule book.  Is this an oversight?  Will we get another 1000 classes for Modified Production?  Am I being sarcastic?  No, I'm asking a question...

Pg 101, 2006 SCTA Rulebook.

7.F MODIFIED PRODUCTION

The intended target of the rule change is a production bike by every standard in the world including the numbers required by SCTA. The change not only misses the mark but has the unintended effect of forgetting the thousands of HD clone road bikes that are in production now. As such the fall down laugh work arounds to the ill considered rule are for the most part published here. All of this without benefit of the wisdom that might be available from the participants if they were asked.

[JohnR]

If you are going to make yourself a target, better lighting can really help those
 that are intent on recognizing your position.
In this case the target really hates the light and seem to attract a lot of arrows.
 That inicates something is wrong.
Being on target is not easy and you have to be prepared for some return fire.
Unless you stand your ground, it is not so much a battle as it is a chase.

Jack, It appears that your definition of "the light" is this website. If they do not come here, they must be hiding. I am not a bike guy but I do attend the board meetings and have heard all the explanations & reasoning behind the rule changes, so I can't agree that the "target really hates the light".

[JohnR]

.... It is interesting to note that Modified is now Modified Production.  But there is no mention of that class in the 2006 rule book.  Is this an oversight?  Will we get another 1000 classes for Modified Production?  Am I being sarcastic?  No, I'm asking a question...

Pg 101, 2006 SCTA Rulebook.

7.F MODIFIED PRODUCTION

The intended target of the rule change is a production bike by every standard in the world including the numbers required by SCTA. The change not only misses the mark but has the unintended effect of forgetting the thousands of HD clone road bikes that are in production now. As such the fall down laugh work arounds to the ill considered rule are for the most part published here. All of this without benefit of the wisdom that might be available from the participants if they were asked.

I was told that you were asked to help form the new rules but you declined to participate. Is that true?

[JackD]

The secret society is very distasteful to me.
The declined invitation did not come from them but rather a car guy that understands the nature of the organization.
The last time the principal was represented is was to perpetuate a bald faced lie that was easily disproved. He hasn't been back in public since and resides behind the scenes that in large part contribute to the failures.
This is the most prominent public forum and deserves the attention from all sides including top to bottom.

[JohnR]

The secret society is very distastful to me.
And the declined invatation did not come from them but rather a car guy that understands the nature of the organization.

Any society that you refuse to take part in will always remain a secret from you...

You can't always blame "them" for your lack of involvment and then your resultant dissatisfacation with the outcome.

Anyway, that's all I'm going to say on the subject. I have already entered too much into this conversation.

[RichFox]

Panic wrote
 
Let me clarify my position on handicap.
I think that the choice of engine should not be so important that a tired stock model of the right choice always defeats anything a zealous innovator can do to the next best engine                                                --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------When I first went to Bonneville to run in XX/GAlt there were four cars in the class. A 12 port 270 GMC, my turbocharged stock head 270, a blown flathead and an Ardun. It was a fun deal. Then the flathead Ford guys started complaining that GMCs had an advantage. 12 port guys said blown motors had an advantage. Blower guys said turbos had an advantage. So now those four cars have four classes and don't have to run each other. The record I set in 1980 still stands because no one cares anymore. The fun went out of the class. 25 years with no entry's would seem to indicate the class is no longer needed.

[jimmy six]

There may have entries but no the exsisting records were not beat:). I have held a record for 21 years and it's been run on almost every year. I believe Phil Freudiger had one for almost 40 years before it was broken. It took someone in his own family to do it.

Records invite competitors. Let them stay.......