Landracing Forum
Tech Information => Technical Discussion => Topic started by: Koncretekid on March 02, 2011, 08:05:06 AM
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Is there any prohibition on the use of plywood for seat base and chest rest on a motorcycle? I can find no mention of it in the rulebooks, but there's always the old "it's just common sense that you can't do that" rule, and sometimes we don't all have the same common sense.
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Just tell them that your seat base is a "all natural based cellulose cross grain composite" i.e. plywood. I am sure that if you secure the seat to the bike well and then give it some sort of covering, don't want splinters in your privates! there would not be a problem. Just my opinion, best to check with SCTA first.
Like your build.
Rex
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Back in '02 or so I ran my bike with no bodywork - and was told that I had to have some kind of seat (rather than me sitting on the frame rails up top). I made a seat out of plywood and had no issues, other than maybe a smile or two, getting it passed.
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Watch out for splinters
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Jon,
It's interesting what you said about not having any seat and being required to have one. The trouble with my lay-down riding position on my bike is that it is kind of like a cheap hotel, i.e., no ballroom! I considered just using some of that neopreme pipe insulation on the the tubes and calling that my seat. I guess they wouldn't have approved that either. I almost think an old bicycle seat would be more comfortable.
Tom
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I am not going to mention names (initials are KL) but I remember seeing a brown satchel and a phone book used as a seat.
~JH
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Is there any prohibition on the use of plywood for seat base and chest rest on a motorcycle?
I seriously doubt it.
The entire bodywork on Ed's fabulous bike is plywood:
(http://i453.photobucket.com/albums/qq252/octane98bonneville/CIMG5408.jpg)
(http://i453.photobucket.com/albums/qq252/octane98bonneville/CIMG5411.jpg)
He runs at BUB.
SCTA could be different ...dunno.
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Food for thought. . .
Whatever material you decide on for a seat, consider a narrow lower and upper section which you wear. You can put it on the front of your leathers and Velcro it around the back. I never saw a no-no about that in the rule book.
You wear your helmet, rather than bolt it to the bike, and slide up-into it, right?
"Innovation is encouraged." -- SCTA
Bill
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If anyone were to give you grief, you could make a strong case for its use as a structural material by telling them about plywood use in aircraft like the WWII mosquito built by the British, and WWII PT boats.
It is a high strength natural composite that compares very well with light weight metals.
It has high stiffness and light weight. A top coat of fiberglass or carbon fiber using it as the core material is a very effective structural material if properly bonded to mounting points to distribute those concentrated loads.
Larry
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I would claim 'carbon credits'
"Innovation is encouraged." -- SCTA, gotta finish the complete sentence:
"Innovation is encouraged, within the rules" -- SCTA, page 50, 2011 rulebook.
YMMV
DW
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Spruce Goose :-D
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I was head millwright toward the end of my 25 year stint as a maintenance technician in a plywood manufacturing plant.... the information that trickled down to us as to "unconventional" uses of plywood and laminated veneer products was, at times, amzing..... I really do not see plywood as an inferior substitute for the plastics that so many seats are now made of... and the several interesting items thaty I made over the years for hotrods and whatnot using sheets of veneer as the substrates and then fiberglass resin and cloth or mat as the "glue and filler".... I would say that you could have some fun with it
But like several people say...."watch out for slivers!" :-D
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He should go with oak, just for a touch of class :P
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He should go with oak, just for a touch of class :P
Oh yes, OAK!.... Definitely..... straight from "Live Oak Country"..... or oak looking Arborite.....
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I was head millwright toward the end of my 25 year stint as a maintenance technician in a plywood manufacturing plant.... the information that trickled down to us as to "unconventional" uses of plywood and laminated veneer products was, at times, amzing..... I really do not see plywood as an inferior substitute for the plastics that so many seats are now made of... and the several interesting items thaty I made over the years for hotrods and whatnot using sheets of veneer as the substrates and then fiberglass resin and cloth or mat as the "glue and filler".... I would say that you could have some fun with it
But like several people say...."watch out for slivers!" :-D
Have you seen the all wood Supercar being built? I will see if I got a link.
Here. http://www.joeharmondesign.com/
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No sense in stopping with the seat or body work. Morgan STILL makes cars with wooden frames.
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No sense in stopping with the seat or body work. Morgan STILL makes cars with wooden frames.
With over 400 years of experience that started with a thumbs up from the queen, they must know something.
Mark
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I was head millwright toward the end of my 25 year stint as a maintenance technician in a plywood manufacturing plant.... the information that trickled down to us as to "unconventional" uses of plywood and laminated veneer products was, at times, amzing..... I really do not see plywood as an inferior substitute for the plastics that so many seats are now made of... and the several interesting items thaty I made over the years for hotrods and whatnot using sheets of veneer as the substrates and then fiberglass resin and cloth or mat as the "glue and filler".... I would say that you could have some fun with it
But like several people say...."watch out for slivers!" :-D
Have you seen the all wood Supercar being built? I will see if I got a link.
Here. http://www.joeharmondesign.com/
Tman.... I had not seen any of that!..... My experience with veneer is spruce, pine and fir softwoods - generally used in construction plywood... and let me tell you..... dried veneer and slitting and shaping etc and then overlaying with fiberglass can make some pretty ingenious items.... my first attempt at using the stuff was when I made a conveyor trough section so that that using a metal detector- which was a full wrap around magnetic field- for the feed to the waste wood chipper would actually do what it was supposed to do- detect metal in the wood flow..... I, thankfully, had a carpenter onsite who was also a bit of a hotrodder and his expertise with resins and fiberglass helped A LOT!!!!!! anyway..... we built a conveyor trough section that was 8 feet long and had no metal in it..... that cost about 15% of what the supplier wanted for a similar item..... that was about 27 years ago.......I know for sure that, in 2008- when I still worked there, the conveyor section was still there .... and, as far as I know, it is still there to this day..... made out of wood!
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Well how about the Hughes flying boat, AKA the spruce goose. See it at the Evergreen Museum in Oregon.
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I'm thinking.......This could be dangerous. (me thinking,not the wood). I have some ideas now. This is interesting....Hmmm.
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Sounds like it was a cool project.
My question is.....................if a wood LSR car augers in at teh salt, how long does the cleanup crew take picking up splinters!?
I was head millwright toward the end of my 25 year stint as a maintenance technician in a plywood manufacturing plant.... the information that trickled down to us as to "unconventional" uses of plywood and laminated veneer products was, at times, amzing..... I really do not see plywood as an inferior substitute for the plastics that so many seats are now made of... and the several interesting items thaty I made over the years for hotrods and whatnot using sheets of veneer as the substrates and then fiberglass resin and cloth or mat as the "glue and filler".... I would say that you could have some fun with it
But like several people say...."watch out for slivers!" :-D
Have you seen the all wood Supercar being built? I will see if I got a link.
Here. http://www.joeharmondesign.com/
Tman.... I had not seen any of that!..... My experience with veneer is spruce, pine and fir softwoods - generally used in construction plywood... and let me tell you..... dried veneer and slitting and shaping etc and then overlaying with fiberglass can make some pretty ingenious items.... my first attempt at using the stuff was when I made a conveyor trough section so that that using a metal detector- which was a full wrap around magnetic field- for the feed to the waste wood chipper would actually do what it was supposed to do- detect metal in the wood flow..... I, thankfully, had a carpenter onsite who was also a bit of a hotrodder and his expertise with resins and fiberglass helped A LOT!!!!!! anyway..... we built a conveyor trough section that was 8 feet long and had no metal in it..... that cost about 15% of what the supplier wanted for a similar item..... that was about 27 years ago.......I know for sure that, in 2008- when I still worked there, the conveyor section was still there .... and, as far as I know, it is still there to this day..... made out of wood!
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There was a modified sports car on the salt one year that had a nose/spoiler that came apart on a run. The clean up time was over one hour. All of the ply wood, the bondo and wood screws were everywhere. You would be in shock if you had seen some of the crap we have picked up over the years. That's one reason the rules get tougher to prevent weird stuff being used.
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There was a modified sports car on the salt one year that had a nose/spoiler that came apart on a run. The clean up time was over one hour. All of the ply wood, the bondo and wood screws were everywhere. You would be in shock if you had seen some of the crap we have picked up over the years. That's one reason the rules get tougher to prevent weird stuff being used.
I WAS being a smartass Glen but I do not doubt you! The couple cleanups I saw on the salt were thourough and did take a little time for lesser incidents. Unlike the time my old construction foreman was pulling a job trailer down I29 and hit a HUGE bump causing a 50# box of roofing nails to catch air and blow through the rotten floor just in front of the trailer tires!~ He spent 4 hours on the road cleaning up nails while a trooper watched :-D
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Hey Koncretekid, wooden work.
Sid.
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Hey Koncretekid, wooden work.
Sid.
Wood so!
G
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G, you wana go mate??
Sid.
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My understanding is that's the way Kiwis and Aussies get along!!! :-D :-D :-D
Pete
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There's a camaraderie between Ozzy's N Kiwi's that's taken years to evolve. It's kinda like the brother you love but once in a while you need to get into a good scrap to sort out who's turn it is to buy the beer.
Sid.
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It seems to sort of be the way of it with a lot of the various nationalities of the "realm"......
I worked with several people - variously from England, Scotland, Wales and Ireland.... and these guys would be playing darts in the off hours- good players they were too... they taught me to play and i could actually beat one of them once in a while....
but these guys would be arguing over whether it was a treble twenty or or a treble one.... or a double twenty or out ..... and the profane things that they called each other ... word combinations I had never heard before and when it was settled- back to normal- like in another 10 to 30 seconds.... it was, at times, the high point of the entertainment, watching these guys carry on!....
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HEY watch it Canada! I resemble being called a nationality!
If we built all our crap out of wood, a crash could be cleaned up with a weed burner.
Sid.
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Sid!.... we in Canada are also "fellow loyal subject of the queen!...." and well.... as such we mostly understand the vagaries of our brothers, sisters, cousins etc throughout he "realm".... and if you come to my house.... it'll be - what took you so long to find your way "home"?
my 2 pence worth are.... it wood work!.... :-D
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G, you wana go mate??
Sid.
Woodeneye.
My understanding is that's the way Kiwis and Aussies get along!!! :-D :-D :-D
Pete
Now one of us should insert a sheep joke
There's a camaraderie between Ozzy's N Kiwi's that's taken years to evolve. It's kinda like the brother you love but once in a while you need to get into a good scrap to sort out who's turn it is to buy the beer.
Sid.
I make beer so it's always free
HEY watch it Canada! I resemble being called a nationality!
At least you don't have the line in your national anthem "our land is girt by sea" really, WTF
If we built all our crap out of wood, a crash could be cleaned up with a weed burner.
Sid.
Sid
You make a really good point
Now what was this thread about again?
G
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Dunno, G....Just trying to stay quiet in case Sid remembers that it`s my turn to get in the tinnies.......Our current Geography might make it difficult to make it back to your place in before the latest batch of Home Brew disappears..... :-D :cheers:
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Having been involved in various forms of racing for a long time I can assure one and all that it doesn't matter the country you come from, it's the people in all the forms of racing that make any and all of those sports great! :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Now back to plywood. :-D
Pete
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Yeah, I did it again. I hijacked another one, Gotta stop doing that. Thanks for the fun yall!
Sid.
ps, I hold no loyalty to any queens, it's kinda like "you can choose your friends not your family".
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I saw a Honda on E-bay once that had the spoiler, ground effects, rear window slats, and hood scoop all made out of plywood. It was actually quite well done, it must of had a million hours of labor put into it and still nobody bid on it.
That was a lead in to the Queen subject, I got escorted to the border in 1970 by the Royal Canadian Mounties for saying something derogatory about the Queen.
Steve
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Mate! :cheers:
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Ok, let me tell you a little story to maybe reserect the plywood theme.
Way back in my early racing days in NZ, I circuit raced a VW Beetle. The thing would normally spin 5300 in 4th. Mid race one time, the tach starts reading nearly 6 so I figure I'm loosing a clutch, but it's still pulling pretty good so I stay in it. When I get back to the pits I find the hood is open, the back one. So not being the dumbest kid on the block, I built a plywood deck out the back with electrical conduit supports to the body. This thing was half a sheet & shaped to fit the body. I figured start big & cut it down until the car slowed down. We went out & did some road testing & found we needed a taller gear or I was going to blow the eng away.
Two weeks later after some fresh gears & some skill saw tuning , we turn up at the track with a fresh coat of house paint on the deck. We really took some crap on this one, most people wanted to know if it was strong enough to hold a 9gal keg. (beer). Eventually it got dubbed " the barbecue plate". After the first race they stopped laughing. We didn't have a speedo in the track maggot, that had been tossed out with all the other useless junk but now we were blowing away all the Mini's & Alfa's & stuff.
Our plywood barbecue plate was a few years before Porsche came out with the whale tail 911's.
My dad wood have been proud of me, he was a carpenter.
Sid.
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The Lola 530 Can-Am cars had plywood sides from the back of the front wheel back. It was always interesting to see Keke and Danny Suullivan banging it up. :-o Tony
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kiwi sid..... the reference to "loyal subjects of the queen.... the realm etc"..... is a take-off from something a kiwi LSR legend named Bert Munro said to us as a group of Canadians the first time we met him in 1970.... and repeated variations of it for several years afterward - until we saw him no more....
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I'm pretty sure Burt took that quote with him.
Sid.
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Sid,
there were seven of us- kids from our extended family-ranging in age from 12yo to 18yo.... we had all talked our parents into bringing us to Bonneville for our summer vacation .... and as awe stricken and wide eyed as we were.... we noticed the legend himself.... Bert, that is.... and we got into the circle of people whom he seemed to attract .... and then one of us.... as if we were standing in the presence of God himself.... uttered in a hushed tone.... "Are you Mr Munro?"... he made a snappy comeback along the line that there are probably some who would call him that but he usually is called Bert.... and he asked,"Who might you boys be?"... well we answered him and, as he shook hands with each of us in turn, one of us, in answer to his question as to where we were from, we told him that we lived in Canada.... to which he answered, "Canada, you say.... well, its always nice to meet another group of fellow loyal subjects of the queen.".... for many years, we never really grasped the significance of the statement, as it was not until the later 1980s that I was told that people from Australia and New Zealand aren't exactly loyal subjects of anyone- let alone the queen.... I had the term POME explained to me as well... etc...
And I figure to this day..... it is an expression that I honestly believe Bert, from the great salt flats in the cosmos, will smile every time I use it as a tongue in cheek expression as he did....
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that summer vacation was in 1970.... and two of us have been coming back annually or more often, ever since....
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Great story fastman! :cheers:
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An article about Morgans. www.bbc.com/autos/story/20160225-how-is-a-morgan-made-building-britains-classic-car-by-hand (http://www.bbc.com/autos/story/20160225-how-is-a-morgan-made-building-britains-classic-car-by-hand)
Another article, this one about Toyotas. www.bbc.com/autos/story/20160406-can-a-car-be-a-family-heirloom (http://www.bbc.com/autos/story/20160406-can-a-car-be-a-family-heirloom)
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Carbon fiber "au natural"
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Plywood is pretty versatile; Our WW II PT boats were built of plywood, so was the Dehavilland Mosquito.
Regards, Neil Tucson, AZ