Landracing Forum
Misc Forums => NON LSR Posting => Topic started by: McRat on June 01, 2009, 11:28:53 AM
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It seems hard to believe.
I believe GM builds just about the finest mass-produced cars in the world, and their prices are in line with other mfr's.
Selling a superior product for a fair price isn't the key to success anymore I suppose.
I will continue to support my fellow Americans who build cars for a living. What is left of them.
Even if GM recovers, it will be government owned. I just can't see our Congress being very good at engineering.
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My Dad is probably tuning over in his grave. He was always a GM person, he would be surprised at GM stock selling for .27 this AM. Glad I bought some more Ford at $1.99 a few weeks ago, it's trading at $6.12 this AM.
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Another sign of the times:
By KEVIN KINGSBURY WSJ
General Motors Corp. and Citigroup Inc. will be replaced in the Dow Jones Industrial Average by Cisco Systems Inc. and Travelers Co., respectively.
GM filed for bankruptcy Monday as part of a government-aided restructuring effort. Bankruptcy is an automatic disqualifier for membership in the benchmark stock index.
Tonerjockey
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I haven't heard a peep about Corvette-- what's going to happen to them?
Regards, Neil Tucson, AZ
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GM wanted to go chapter 11 but Obama would not let them. He had to bail out the UAW and make them in power first to pay them back for the 74 Million the UAW spent to get him elected. GM now stands for Government Motors.
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GM did go chapter 11.
My concern is that the US government is following the British government's model of auto biz support that worked so well in Great Britain in the 1960's - '70's. :roll:
We all know what great cars the Riley Elf and the Austin American were, and we have the British government to thank for that.
And this bit of sarcasm comes from an MG fan.
Hmmm . . .
GM spelled backwards?
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....IMHO.....(i didnt start the thread)...if american car companies were "Selling a superior product for a fair price"........
........they wouldnt be filing bankruptcy........
how many people buying new cars can afford them......
how many people now that cant afford cars ...are supposed
to go out and buy these great cars at these great prices....
makes no sense to me........
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Obama said that the Government will not run GM "EXCEPT FOR THE MOST FUNDAMENTAL DECISIONS" - which means every aspect of the new GM. Henceforth, GM will make only "environmentally correct" cars, or only cars nobody wants or needs. Look for flimsy high mileage stuff. The labor unions and the government will be calling the shots just like they did in England. Remember Norton, AJS, Ariel, BSA,the original Triumph and other motorcycles in addition to Brit cars? I went to German cars years ago and have been happy about it ever since. Good luck to us all.
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Yea, saw the union workers on TV this morning wondering how this could happen... this seemed to affect their full pay and benefits when they were not working.....
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I'm watching my mailbox. Since I am now one of the owners of GM I'm positive that my voucher to go out to the dealership and get my new car will be in the mail shortly.
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In reality, the government has been running the US auto industry for a generation now, bit by bit.
But it does worry me that Congress will have a bigger hand in it:
- They spend 30 million applying for a job that pays $150k a year.
They vote themselves pay raises.
They get a pension after 4 years working.
They only have to have 67% of their employees there to conduct business.
You don't get fired for not showing up.
Most of them are lawyers.
You don't have to take accounting, engineering, or even math or science to get hired.
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"OK, today on the House Floor we are working on Build # 110516277844. Everybody put in your demands for this build. The customer is looking for a white minivan."
Can't be white. Rainbow paint option $2,500.
Minivans endorse excessive population. Needs to be a 3 seater.
It must run on electricity, but Pennsylania demands the electricity be generated with coal.
Having four tires just overloads our existing landfills. EPA puts a cap of 2 tires on it.
Stereo must have a G-Chip in it, so socially-unacceptable broadcasts are filtered out. G-Chips are on backorder, so just snip the speaker wires.
A/C makes the occupants unaware of global warming, so it only has a heater. You cannot turn it off.
Due to the Majority of the House, the right turn signal is deleted for this model year.
It must have a trailer attached that is filled with 10 bushels of corn, or the build will not pass.
Then the President vetos the build, because it doesn't have enough foreign content.
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it really tore me up to see Citigroup removed from the Dow...... about peed my pants with joy.... money grubbin bastards..... Karma....
kent
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Have you ever considered that with GPS-equipped cars the Government can track everyone. They can also monitor your speed and issue speeding tickets galore. Trucks are frequently done this way and have been for years. I just read that speed will be automatically limited, but being real old I forgot where it will be done - maybe London. Speeds will NOT be limited once they figure out that speeding tickets (and income) will disappear. I suppose speeds will be reduced in order to lessen the number of deaths the new Obamamobiles will cause. Am I paranoid enough?
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GM wanted to go chapter 11 but Obama would not let them. He had to bail out the UAW and make them in power first to pay them back for the 74 Million the UAW spent to get him elected. GM now stands for Government Motors.
One analyst on the radio today in So. Cal. said UAW wages were not cut, and he felt the debt would be too great to repay when the economy hiccups again. He feels GM will be back in bankruptcy in a few years. He was not to encouraging.
Tom G.
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I watched a Chevy Equinox wheel come off of our production line today. It is the last wheel that our plant will produce.
Superior Industries is the world's largest manufacturer of oem aluminum wheels. Three years ago the 7 plants made 19 million wheels. The Van Nuys, California facility made 75,000 wheels a week at the peak.
The Pittsburg, Kansas plant closed last December putting 650 out of work. The Van Nuys facility employed a little over a thousand. Now down to about 50. I've got until the end of the month.
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Really funny that Obama is channeling Orwell so accurately: the official name is not based on what it is, but what it is not (e.g.: Ministry of Truth produces lies) to effect a peremptory strike against discussion.
That's not bankruptcy, in that it does not follow any current rules, or resemble any previous filing. Obama has wiped his ass with yet another set of laws.
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Dean, I'm sorry to hear that.
The sad truth is that GM is currently building some of the finest cars I've ever driven, and has made huge strides in the last 15 years.
What the media doesn't seem to understand is that when gas goes to $4.00 a gallon in the period of six months, a company simply can't start making new vehicles the next day. If I were GM three years ago, you're darned right I'd be pushing out every Suburban and Tahoe I could at a 30% profit margin. If I were GM five years ago, you're darned right I'd be sinking development dollars into Cadillac and dumping Oldsmobile. If I were GM fifteen years ago, you're darned right I'd be developing the Saturn line, and looking to buy Saab.
GM actually made some pretty smart moves, and I think the Chapter 11 filing will prove to be another smart move. You simply can't turn a ship this big around overnight.
But what does concern me is that we are all now "reluctant share holders", and our President "doesn't want to be in the car business". If 60% of a company is owned by reluctant shareholders, and shareholder leadership wants to take a hands-off approach, what does that spell for General Motors' future?
I think we should have not got involved, and quite honestly, forced GM's hand last year.
The Brits have been down this road.
In retrospect - British Leyland was nationalized in 1975 during the financial crisis in Great Britain of the 1970's. This action did not avert the crisis, which continued into the early 1980's.
Today, the marques that made up British Leyland are scattered. Jaguar is now owned by a company in India, MG is owned by a Chinese concern that will probably never build a car bearing the marque, Mini went to BMW, and Triumph is lost, probably forever. Rover is dead, and Range Rover is up in the air.
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"What the media doesn't seem to understand is that when gas goes to $4.00 a gallon in the period of six months, a company simply can't start making new vehicles the next day."........
uh.......in 1989....the geo got 53 mpg city..57 highway.....many other
cars got well over 40.....
today they make hybrids that in most cases dont match the gas
cars from decades ago.....for over $30,000........
i guess i dont get it....
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Personally I feel that GM produced one of the most Cheap feeling cars and trucks around... When researching and almost b. uying a new truck over the winter I researched and test drove 08 Chevy 1500, 08 F150 and a 08 Tundra... Chevy was most expensive of all of them, had the lowest HP rating, worst gas milage and felt and drove cheap. F150 came in second and the Tundra was by far the best of them all.
Most of the options that cost considerable more then the base model price were all included STANDARD on the Tundra at no extra cost and vehicle was a couple thousand less the two comparable models of chevy and F150... not only that the Tundra had more HP, more Torque, better gas milage and more towing capacity then other two..... So in my opinion if you are looking for a cheap piece of crap by a chevy or ford truck... you want quality, power, towing capacity and bunches of features go with Toyota.
I see all brands of vehicles everyday, I fix all brands everyday... Just seems like there are more problems with GM and FORD products.. You give me a vehicle year and make and I can tell you common problems with that vehicle off the top of my head that are common problems... Just dont see that "Common anything" with Toyota's and Honda's.
Ill same German cars for another topic.
Now I do own a 03 Ford Ranger. I love this vehicle. I leased a 2001 and when lease was up I purchased this 03. I had never owned a truck in my life before the 2001 ranger. I love this vehicle. I was searching out a new pickup late last year looking for a good deal.... End result I kept my ranger and did not purchase. My car before that was a 1998 Ford Mustang GT, and a 1997 Mustang base. I have good results with all those vehicle so I am not a Ford hater at all.
I also own a 2007 Chrysler 300 AWD with all the bells and whistles. Love this car and would not trade it for anything. Before that we had a Chrysler LHS which was also a great vehicle.
Am I heart broken GM filed.. Nope.. do I feel for the people who might lose jobs, sure I do.
But I would debate the fact that GM is quality built because of the rate of problems these vehicles have compared to Foreign vehicles.
I would also debate anybody on the fact that Hybrid's are better for enviroment, cost freindly, and have better gas milage, and cost less to produce... The answers are all wrong with exception of a Toyota Prius... Which is again Foreign...
Just because GM and Ford build a vehicle with a electric motor that barely functions as an electric vehicle does not make it good. It's a marketing ploy and read the fine print...
JonAmo
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Yup, them new full-sized Toyotas make American stuff look like junk:
http://jalopnik.com/5261006/toyota-hybrid-breaks-down-towed-off-track-before-nascar-event
Notice it's a GMC Duramax towing it... :-D
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AS a retired GM guy---I will not ever own a car or truck that is produced after 5-31-09 as long as our Socialist Democrat pinko commie govt has any thing to do with them!!!!!!!!!!!!
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"I prefer the Camaro. It looks so much better hanging from a hook."
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"I prefer the Camaro. It looks so much better hanging from a hook."
I used to have great fun at the local AutoX events with a bone stock 2000 Camaro. It's priceless to watch the looks on the Import guys faces when a "dinosaur" with "foul handling" would beat them at their own game. Guess you can't believe commercials or Motor Trend I suppose.
I had some real fun going up to Bandimere (Denver) awhile back. A Tundra tried to pass me in my 2004 GMC 3500 Sierra as we were getting up near Vail. I decided to see what he had. It was close, but he just couldn't hang with me past 80mph uphill. I was towing 7,000lb at the time with 4 people on board.
The locals around here in their Titans, Tundras, and Hemis use to play with us. Pretty much they all retired. Getting whupped by something the size of a school bus apparently weakens their macho gland. Usually it's wifey who does the "schooling".
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McRat,
We could debate this topic for pages of pages, on who beat who and when... not all vehicles are the same... We all get that... I can only tell you real world data of what I see on a daily basis that come into my bay to be repaired.. I have plenty of work no matter what type of vehicle... I just see more GM and FORDS on a consistent basis with the same problems over and over and I have a game plan of what i am going to specifically look at when they come into my bay + the original complaint... And it's not all GM cars and trucks. Specific models have their problems. For instance I hardly see a GM Diesel Truck with any problems, but when you talk about GM as a whole..... When I get a foreign vehicle I don't know what I am going to get. Thats all i am saying...
And it's all my opinion, however since I deal with them on a daily basis I have a real good idea. And I personally would not own a GM vehicle no matter the style of car, and its based on they just feel cheap to me.... No offense to people who own them.
JonAmo
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GM (Government Motors) proudly introduces the 2010 Obama
(http://webmail.aol.com/42952/aol/en-us/mail/get-attachment.aspx?uid=1.25612709&folder=OldMail&partId=4)
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Yea, saw the union workers on TV this morning wondering how this could happen... this seemed to affect their full pay and benefits when they were not working.....
And there is 50% of the problem. Odd as this may seem, There are no gov`t/union benefit pks. for us old retired liquor store owners. We have to get by on what we squirreled away after working 80-90 hr. weeks for 20 years. :cheers:
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Morris predicts that there is no intention of "restoring GM to profitability", it was entirely fictional. The deal was to get the UAW on his side (such as building all small cars here to justify jobs, despite the fact that the higher costs make them uncompetitive).
They will build only the cars that Gore/Pelosi/Reid/Schumer want, that don't work (Volt) and no one will buy, and certainly not for more money than Toyota.
The UAW workers cannot be laid off, and will be subsidized with tax money for the next 20 years.
Easily another $100 billion gone.
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Jon A---what you say maybe true---but the comerical value, cost value, of a vech needs to be determined by the TOTAL cost of ownership over the period you own it---GM vech. usually stack up pretty good ---there are some exceptions---just ask the FORMER owners of mid to late 90's Toyota v-6s
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McRat,
We could debate this topic for pages of pages, on who beat who and when... not all vehicles are the same... We all get that... I can only tell you real world data of what I see on a daily basis that come into my bay to be repaired.. I have plenty of work no matter what type of vehicle... I just see more GM and FORDS on a consistent basis with the same problems over and over and I have a game plan of what i am going to specifically look at when they come into my bay + the original complaint... And it's not all GM cars and trucks. Specific models have their problems. For instance I hardly see a GM Diesel Truck with any problems, but when you talk about GM as a whole..... When I get a foreign vehicle I don't know what I am going to get. Thats all i am saying...
And it's all my opinion, however since I deal with them on a daily basis I have a real good idea. And I personally would not own a GM vehicle no matter the style of car, and its based on they just feel cheap to me.... No offense to people who own them.
JonAmo
No offense taken. :cheers:
There is nothing Toyota makes that I could find a need for either.
The reason you see more GM and Ford trucks in repair bays than Toyotas, is, uh, well, they outnumber Toyotas several times over. And when used as trucks, they currently have a higher mortality rate than domestic trucks. Ditto for their large SUV's. Apparently it isn't as easy to make a 6,000lb vehicle with 300+ HP as it is to make a 2000lb'r with 150.
After spending time on trucks boards, the Toyota and Nissan guys all say the same thing. "It was cheaper", "The plastic interior in our truck is less plasticy than the plastic interior in your truck", "The commercials say mine is better." But unlike the Camry, apparently the commercials aren't as effective with the trucks.
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Unfortunately, our new masters, the People's Republic, are watching this very closely.
The Dear Leader sent the Keebler Elf to answer their questions recently, and they asked "are Chinese investments safe?" - expecting an actual answer.
He, of course, served Kool-Aid and said "yes, fine, no problem".
The entire room laughed.
Why is this important?
Because we have until about 11/1/09 to raise $1.9T. Here are the choices:
1. convince the Chinese (who now think we throw money away) to lend it to us at a far higher rate (double taxes, anyone?), or
2. print it
For those to whom economics consists of listening to the "experts" (those whose incompetence caused this), there is a big difference between depression (which we already have) and inflation (which Obama will now cause to delay the problem until all his friends are happy).
"Depression" means what you already have is even more valuable, but only those with money will make any more.
"Inflation" means everything you have (savings, pension, investment) is worthless. There's an old saying about this, which dates from other and somewhat larger catastrophes (Black Plague, 30 Years War): "What I spent, I had. What I saved, I lost".
Which would you prefer (although I don't think the question is on the table)?
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ME thinks me need to try to find a cave on some native american reservation and try to convince them to let me stay, ----at least in AZ I presently have some options!!!!
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I haven't heard a peep about Corvette-- what's going to happen to them?
Regards, Neil Tucson, AZ
Hey, Neil,
Last week they looked safe
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=149190
I wouldn't expect to see much R&D on 'em for a while, though.
Holden is looking okay for now.
http://online.wsj.com/article/BT-CO-20090601-715703.html
Regards,
Chris
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Thanks, Chris. I hope they do survive.
Regards, Neil Tucson, AZ
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As it obvious that the bankruptcy was inevitable for GM why did the government advance 50 billion to avoid bankruptcy 3 months ago?
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pay offs to the Socialist Democrats voting unions
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Key to this will be getting GM on its feet quickly. They're going to be able to write off most of their former obligations, and I suspect they will want to dissolve their financial arrangement with the US Government ASAP.
Two examples from the past - Chrysler paying off their government backed loans early to get out from under government oversite, and Harley-Davidson asking that the tariffs on foreign bikes be lifted once they righted their ship - lead me to believe that this will be the historical model GM will follow.
Fritz Henderson doesn't come across as the kind of guy who wants to be the Commissar of a nationalized collective industrial/government amalgamation, and it's in the best interest of GM management, the Federal Government, the UAW, and all the rest of us to be done with this bailout quickly.
Chris
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Toyota or Nissan 1/2 to pu may be fine to haul a new lawn mower home but when I head out for BV with 18,000# my Ford F350 is more than up for the task. The Toyota or Nissan just aren't going to cut it. I drive a 95 1/2 ton chevy every day, 100,000 miles on it, my wifes 97 Rav4 toyota with 78000 miles had a water pump fail last year with no warning and it is driven by the timing belt. It took out the timing belt. The wrecker took it to toyota and $1000 later it was back on the road for 2 months before the belt failed again, not toyotas fault, but a tech problem, good news no charge to us this time outside the tow bill. The chevy 1/2 tons repairs to date have been, wiper module, (common as per Jon) heater hoses and I did water pump at that time (90000mi) , throtle position sensor, 4wd engage solenoid in front end (another common problem) no tow bills and everything else fixed at my convienance. The 97 f350. 78000 mi and no repairs. Typical results? Maybe not but don't try to tell me that the big 3 are not building a fine product. Vince
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A Chinese company is to buy Hummer, the General Motors brand known for its military-inspired off-road vehicles and seen as a symbol of gas-guzzling, road-hogging American excess.
Hummer’s sale to Sichuan Tengzhong Heavy Industrial Machinery Company will close this year, marking one of the biggest overseas acquisitions in carmaking by a Chinese group.
GM on Tuesday confirmed the sale to Tengzhong, a privately-owned producer of road, construction and energy industry equipment.
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One of our local dealers has GM, Toyota, and a few other makes. In 2008 I looked at the new trucks. The paint is peeling off of a lot of the GM vehicles in our neighborhood, especially the white ones. Some are almost new. I was afraid to buy a GM product because I did not want to repaint it, but I wanted to buy American.
There were stickers on the trucks listing the percentage of American content. A little Toyota Tacoma had an American content percentage that was higher than some of the GM trucks and it was assembled in Fremont, California. The tires were Firestones. Eventually I bought it and have had no troubles with it.
Don't give up on American made stuff. It is out there for sale, it is good quality, but it might have a foreign name on it.
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GM (Government Motors) proudly introduces the 2010 Obama
(http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg151/A2WindTunnel/2010Obama.jpg)
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It even has telapromters
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Somehow, the analysis does not show the cost per GM job saved: it's well over $1 million each.
Since they will continue to lose money, why not cut the losses and ask the workers (since the stockholders and bondholders are already SOL) whether they wouldn't prefer to take $1 million each (no unemployment, no pension, no benefits - just $1M) and burn it down?
Because the answer would be yes, and the UAW would be finished as a criminal enterprise.
Obama doesn't want to "fix" the problem, and he wouldn't know how in any event - he's never had a job, never ran a business, and (based on his appointments: Holder, Napolitano, Geithner, Sibelius) would avoid hiring anyone who could.
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"write off most of their former obligations": make my children pay for them.
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"write off most of their former obligations": make my children pay for them.
Actually, it looks as though it's GM's pre-filing debt-holders, suppliers, stockholders, dealers and the UAW that are going to take the beat-down.
GM will want to wash their hands of this unholy taxpayer/shareholder/government/UAW/Canadian alliance post haste, and their clearest path will be to pay us back as soon as possible. They can do that by building good vehicles with decent margins and lowered labor costs - something filing Chapter 11 will let them do.
Chrysler paid their government loans back early in the 1980's, in part to get out from under the feds. I see no reason why a right-sized GM won't follow suit.
I really don't think there is a Chevy Trabant in our future, and I doubt that our kids will get stiffed over this.
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With UAW having seats on the board of directors it still sound to me like the judge giving a murderer part of the victims life insurance pay out .
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UAW doesn't even need a seat on the board... as long as there's a Dem majority GM will be run for the UAW 1st.
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With UAW having seats on the board of directors it still sound to me like the judge giving a murderer part of the victims life insurance pay out .
The UAW does not have a seat on the BoD ... 1 person from the VEBA plan will have a non voting position.
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I'm very surprised that the positions and interests of current union members, retired union members, and future (union? remains to be seen) employees are even spoken of as if there were some commonality.
In point of fact, unity of representation among these three disparate groups is an extra-legal fiction dating from Roosevelt in which a union's ability to bargain (viz. yield to coercion, and accept bribes) and thereby resolve a crisis was correctly evaluated as badly compromised and delayed if retired members (and the equivalent of a guardian ad litem for future employees) were permitted separate standing.
The interests of retired employees is adverse to that of current employees, and only in "special cases" (politically sensitive issues, where favors and power trump the letter of the law and existing precedent) can they be remotely considered as united in interest.
Unions invariably throw retirees and future hires under the bus before relinquishing $1 of current pay and work rules, since retirees (in large part) do not vote, and future hires are not represented at all. This latter practice is called "f*cking the unborn", in which the starting salary and raises by seniority (increments) of new hires are far below existing. 30 years of "hired in 2010" will not equal 20 years of "hired in 2000", etc. No one cares - as long as there's no strike, and the union subsidizes Democratic candidates.
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GM is selling Saturn to Penske
kr
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GM is selling Saturn to Penske
kr
Heard that today, too. He's probably the one man in America with the cash, backing and expertise to take a whole division of GM and make it viable as a stand-alone entity. If it really happens, I think it could be good for everyone.
I'm curious if Malcolm Bricklin might be interested in Saab . . . :roll:
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my understanding is rogers group is just buying the dealers, distribution and will contract GM to build a couple of models and is planning on having another company build cars for him
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Penske wants the Saturn dealer network to market - you guessed it - Chinese cars.
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I'm seeing Renault Samsung
http://www.edmunds.com/insideline/do/News/articleId=148948
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It seems that the decisive factor in the outcome of most major wars, including the Civil War, has been the victor's ability to manufacture advanced arms and muster soldiers. The failure of our largest automakers is a concern to both major political parties. We all benefit if the automakers somehow survive. They also make a lot of our military hardware.
Triumph sank and was reinvented. The bikes have never been this good and they sold more this year then the old Meriden factory ever did. One scary thing about Triumph was that it had to almost completely die before it could be rebuilt. Another worry is that we do not have Britain's safety net to help displaced workers.
This is a thorny part of the problem. Government intervention and national security concerns prevent the complete collapse that allows the industry to be rebuilt in a new way. The Walrus has no answers here. He is as puzzled and worried as everyone else.
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GM is selling Saturn to Penske
kr
Heard that today, too. He's probably the one man in America with the cash, backing and expertise to take a whole division of GM and make it viable as a stand-alone entity. If it really happens, I think it could be good for everyone.
He already has Detroit Diesel (GMC diesel) Maybe he is buying the company on piece at a time.
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Not bad going from racing F1 to:
* Penske Racing - Marlboro Team Penske (IRL), Penske South (NASCAR), Penske Motorsports (ALMS)
* Penske Automotive Group - (PAG:NYSE - a 40+% stake) 151 United States Car Dealerships and 101 International Car Dealerships. It is the second largest dealership group in the world.
* Penske Motor Group - Owns and operates automobile dealerships in California.
* Penske Truck Leasing - Joint venture with GE Equipment Management
* Penske Logistics - Transportation Logistics
* VM Motori S.p.A. - Owns 51% stake and 49% DaimlerChrysler Group, Truck-Lite, and Davco (transportation component manufacturing).
* Truck-Lite - Lighting Manufacturer for Heavy trucks (18 Wheelers)
* QEK Global Solutions - QEK Global Solutions is a provider of a wide range of integrated support services to vehicle manufacturers, their tier-one suppliers, and other businesses outside the automotive sector.
* Davco - Manufacturer of Class 8 Heavy Duty Diesel powered truck fuel/heater water separators and filter systems.
* Ilmor - Engine builder
* Deer Valley Ski Resort - Part owner
* Internet Brands - Early investor in CarsDirect. Director since May 2000.
* Universal Technical Institute - Board of Directors. Nationwide provider of technical education training for students seeking careers as professional automotive, diesel, collision repair, motorcycle and marine technicians. NASCAR Technical Institute is located in Mooresville, North Carolina.
* FER Fahrzeugelektrik GmbH - Lighting Manufacturer
* Saturn Corporation - On June 5, 2009 the Detroit News reported[1] General Motors will sell its Saturn division to Penske.
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GM will be building the Saturn brand cars for Penske for 2-3 years and then Penske is planning on having them built out side of the states according to the reports I read yesterday. Its rumored that Penske has already purchased and owns the SSPO ( Saturn Supply Parts Outlet ) on our site in Spring Hill TN. This will be verified when a friend of mine who is a Foreman in that building gets his first paycheck.
In regards to the UAW giving up pay .... I talked to my foreman at work about that and mentioned that I would gladly had given up some pay to help protect the retiree's, his response was that the UAW did offer to do that exactly and the Government said " Its fine if you want to give up some wages, but that money will go to GM ... the retiree's are going to get what they get " ... I then had that confirmed by our Shop Chairman.
I have always wondered why the UAW has never sent out a questionere asking the rank and file members what they are willing to give up or what is really important to them to keep, just to at least get an idea on what to bargain with. There are a few " Benefits " we get that the majority of our members would gladly give up to either save GM money or protect their jobs, the retiree's etc. I'm certain if some of these things Plymouth me off or have me confused ... it would really make the general public even angrier.
Duane
GM employee for 27 yrs. +
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"We all benefit if the automakers somehow survive."
Wobbly didnt you just say you bought a JAP truck, you must not feel very strong about that.
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I heard GM sold Hummer to China. Would this include our military versions or just the civilian versions of the vehicle?
Tom G.
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GM said the military Humvee is not part of the deal
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GM was not affiliated with the HMMV: http://www.amgeneral.com/ (http://www.amgeneral.com/)
Mike
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I heard GM sold Hummer to China. Would this include our military versions or just the civilian versions of the vehicle?
Tom G.
I dont know if or when things changed, but it does seem that they did. Orginally GM only owned " Marketing Rights " to the Hummer. GM has never had any ownership or rights to the HUMVEE.
As of last night it was being reporting that China stopped the sale and wasnt going to allow it to happen. That same news has continued today. So who really knows for sure. The Shrevport La. plant where the Hummer is produced is still on the " Good " list and isnt slated for any changes as of this time.