Landracing Forum
Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => Build Diaries => Topic started by: octane on April 08, 2009, 03:10:50 PM
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Hi ! Lars from Denmark Europe, here!
..haven't posted much since I signed up and introduced myself (here: CLICK and scroll down (http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,3693.msg64093.html#msg64093))
As I told back then; (I visited Bonneville / BUB last year as a member of the Dreamcatcher crew)
"....and wooops: right after I got home the voices in my head (couldn't help it)
told me to buy a frame and an Indian engine.
Unless something goes really wrong, you'll see me on that thing next year on the Salt.
Ye'Sir!
It's not like "..I want to go there next year.."
nope: I have to!!!!!..."
...so I've waited a bit to introduce my project, till I actually had something
to show and convince you brilliant experienced lot, that I would 'walk the walk'.
So here it is; the result so far, after a billion hours of work,;
(..and a billion hours of more work to do)
The Salt Cracker INDIAN 741, 600cc Special Construction Class Vintage Supercharged Fuel (650 A-VBF)
that will run ( if the gods of speed show mercy on my bike and my poor soul,) at this years BUB in August.
This is it's current state of 'advanced mock-up' a few days ago;
(...no engine internals, but they are freshly rebuild and somewhat upgraded
and are all ready to be installed. In expect to do it right after Easter.)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/01a456c9.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a6140630.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/cc9f821e.jpg)
Of cause the blower belt / intake arrangement is partly mock-up
but the engine-blower-drive itself is ready. As is the most difficult part to dream up;
the intake/plenum;
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/17a0a866.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ab5f38dd.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9e6a5ee8.jpg)
Yeah: I know; looks weird and big'ish, but there's an explanation for that;
the weird shape is because one want a large plenum or boost storage tank,
ideally around 150-200% of cylinder-volume, on a supercharger V-twin,
to 'even out' the pumping action of the blower and the 'un-even' intake 'rythm',
according to all the clever old folk who did this back then.
This one is around 1200cc so pretty much spot on for this 600cc engine
The bikes configuration came about purely by 'accident':
Being and old romantic fart; I wanted to build an Indian.
Now big Indian engines are terribly expensive and I just happened
to stumble over this here (relativey) cheap small INDIAN 741 500cc engine (or more like: most of an engine)
and transmission. (They hardly ever come up for sale around here)
Here they are a few months ago:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b0b5daeb.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/fc9d6e2e.jpg)
Seamed to be in rather fair shape ....but ooops...look at the pistons:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5e586552.jpg)
...gotta be the worlds first 546,534 (or what ever) cubic-centimeters Indian engine ..ha ha.
At the same time a friend told about a frame for sale.
A "raw" ,never used, special frame made about 6 years ago, combining the beauty of the
gas-tank placed under the top-frame-rail and the possibility to install a 741 engine.
An INDIAN "101 lookalike", if you will.
Here it is a couple of weeks ago, when we made up the seat-'cowling'/rear-fender:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/93a1f46e.jpg)
Now running an anaemic 60-something years old 500cc engine,
seamed kind of lame so decided to bore it to 600cc (plenty of material on the cylinders to do that)
and I just happened to have a small supercharger
from a small 600cc Japanese mini-car...so on it went to make things a bit more exciting.
More torque, and a high gearing / low engine-RPM's sounded like a good idea.
Nothing like high RPM's to kill an old engine.
Now a tuned supercharged engine makes a lot of heat (dangerously so)
and the decision was made to run on 'fuel' , in this case methanol, to cool things down.
So there it was; (running the BUB / AMA rules) a 650 A-VBF bike.
That means I run for a 'soft' (not set before) record.
Some will find that wussy.
Well; be my guest, call me a wuss.
I think it is very much in the spirit of Bonneville and in the spirit
of dear old Mr. Burt Munro, to drag a nearly 70 years old INDIAN across the globe, from another continent,
solely to run it on the Salt.
I'll post the progress on the bike here as I get things done
and look back to contemplate some of the problems, the solutions, the not-totally-stupid ideas
and the downright idiocy that brought the bike to it's current state.
Here's the vital info:
...ca. 1940 Indian 741 engine
...bored to 600. New pistons
...totally rebuild with new or rebuild everything, from lifters
to bearings
...con-rods magna-flux tested for cracks and shot-peen'ed
...bigger exhaust valves
...small alterations of bearings
...slightly modified lubrication
...slightly modified crank-vent system
...blower drive running from crank (more on that later)
...seperate oil-tank fabbed inthich aluminum
...KingClutch
...modified transmission bushes for better lubrication
...transmission rebuild with new bearings and
closed off from side-cover for separate lubrication
...300cc AISIN supercharger rebuild with new bearings etc.
...1 3/4 Rivara Eliminator SU carburettor
...one-of frame. TIG welded construction, except for the cast steering head
and rear axle mounts (new reproduction 101 castings).
Seamless precision steel tubes, DIN 2391.
Cast reproduction fittings brazed as per original frames.
Engine plates are Duralumin
+ a million other small things. I can safely say that there's
not a single part n the bike that has not been worked over or replaced,
from the smallest washer in the engine, over rebuilding the blower... to new wheel spokes
Running gear:
...front end from a nineties Sportster . Lowered 2" and progessive springs installed
...front wheel; 21" costum off a Sportster as well (new Avon Spedmaster tire)
...rear wheel; 17" from a Suzuki 500T (rubber not decided yet)
Miss.:
...Tarozzi rear controls. Left side: foot-clutch. Right side: rear-brake
Gear-shifter; old-style hand shifter. Ignition advance in left-hand hand-control.
...ignition: 'total-loss' (no alternator) / Odyssey batteri / coil / 'electronic (contact-less) ignition
made by INDIAN PARTS EUROPE
...gas-tank is cast (!!!) aluminum. Made by a friend as
a reproduction of the original Indian, one-year-only, cast tank.
Comes like his:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/569bb5c1.jpg)
...then one has to polish/weld/finish and install filler-neck, fuel line etc. oneself.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/363b38c3.jpg)
Latest update:
we (that's me and my friend Kenneth who has devoted countless days and hours
to help me) made this rather funky, if I may say so, exhaust-pipes a couple of day ago:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/8ad9c375.jpg)
Hope I haven't bored you silly with this long winding post.
Forgive me if my English is somewhat inapt; English is not my mother tongue
so I'll probably come off as a 9 year old retard from time to time.
............................................................................
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d9e58bbb.jpg)
From the bottom of my heart, and with humble gratitude I'd like to
profoundly thank the following great individuals, without whom this project
would never ever have had a snowman's chance in hell to become a reality:
...”Rocky” of Dreamcatcher (http://www.virtualindian.org/lsrtxt.html) fame, and his brilliantly friendly
crew who accepted me as crew-member at last years BUB Bonneville event and sparked
my hidden inner Indian .-)
Thanks Rocky, thanks guys !
...”Moen” who runs Indian Parts Europe (http://www.indianpartseurope.com/), for immeasurable help,
encouragement and willingness to patiently share his encyclopedic knowledge of all
things mechanic in general, and Indian-related in particular.
Thanks Moen !
...,”Kenneth” (http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/34c3223e.jpg) the brilliant Jack of All Fabricating Trades,
who at an early stage offered to spend a great chunk (and then some) of
of his spare-time helping me out, doing all the stuff I'm just too plain dumb to do;
alu-welding, fabricating stuff on the lathe and on the mill.
If I was paying the guy for what he's work is worth; he would be a rich man by now.
Thanks Kenneth !
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cool
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Very cool. Great English, too!
Mike
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:-D Outstanding Build :cheers: I love the old stuff!
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Absolutely beautiful! :-D
It always amazes me that some of these bikes are works of art in addition to being fast, so here is to you going fast! :cheers:
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Awesome bike Lars..
Can't wait to see it on the salt. Good luck and ride safe.
Sheri Buchta
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I like the way you think.
Good job!
Sam
#6062
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Lars!! Now you have me looking at my old 57 rigid framed, 62 Pan bottom end, 66 Shovel top end street bike with a slightly different attitude! Beautiful machine...will see you at BuB meet! Crow
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There is plenty of room for you in this build diary.
You and your project are OUTSTANDING.
Don't be a stranger.
FREUD
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That's BEAUTIFUL Lars ! :-D
Tiny
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Fantastic, Very Nice
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....just gorgeous, good writing, beautiful pics, great attitude....COOL BIKE!!!!!!!!!
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Beautiful, just beautiful. :cheers:
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..
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I agree, that is a work of art and beautiful. Keep posting pics, even a car guy like me appreciates what you are doing.
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Oi !
Thank you ever so much guys for your kind words
and your encouragements.
Highly appreciated !!!
Thanks!
Very nice.
With your kind permission, a few questions & comments?
Absolutely!..Thanks for showing an interest in my little project.
I'm quite sure no-one knows more about supercharging old bikes than you Jeff.
Thanks for publishing your absolutely brilliant site: Supercharger Installation on Older Motorcycles (http://victorylibrary.com/supercharger/super-c.htm)
A fountain of info to be gathered there.
This is bored to the H-D 45 cylinder size, 70mm?
Yes
The SCTA class will be 500, not 650, since your actual displacement of 600cc is discounted by 1/3 for side-valve cylinders and heads. IIRC you must exceed 750cc to qualify for the 650 class (i.e., be illegal for 500).
Yep, but I'm running at the BUB Motorcycle Speed Trails, that does not go by the SCTA-rules
but goes by the A.M.A. rules (..and F.I.M. rules) that gives NO 'allowance' for side-valve engines.
(BTW AMA/FIM do NOT even consider the Indian engine to be a 'side-valve' at all (!!!)...
I checked that with the Tech. Inspector. Something to do with the very short lengths of Indian ...erh...non-pushrods.
I find that a little weird as the specific definition of "push-rod" in the rule-book reads:
"..with camshafts located below the cylinder head deck, push rods that open valves
with the use of individual lifters...". No mention of length.
I would assume that the push-rod-class was set up to distinguish these engines from overhead valve engines,
but Hey!..it's their party and if I wonna join it, I'll go by their rules.
An idea would be to clearify by using the definition from 'Utah Salt Flats Racing Association"
which reads:
"...Pushrod: “must have pushrod operated valves with camshaft located
at least one crankshaft (stroke) length below the OEM cylinder deck
or utilize OEM pushrod length at least twice the crankshaft stroke....”)
....so anyway; it has to run in the 'Vintage' class; that is; engine manufactured before prior to 1956,
must retain O.E.M. heads and cases.(Rule '12.J.').
Are you using the same drive ratio for the Aisin as used on the automobile engine? IIRC that's about 1.25:1 (25% overdrive).
IMHO this isn't fast enough, and won't develop boost until far up the RPM scale.
I'll start of with something around 1 : 1,5 and probably move up to somewhere close to 1 : 2.
I'm in contact with a guy in Australia that has just finished his blown Triumph 650
using the same blower as mine. He runs close to 1:2 and develops around 6psi. at around 10000 RPM's blower speed.
Works just fine.
Now, I've looked into several sources of calculation pressure, drive ratio etc. etc.
both using the calculations on your site and from the old book
by Maurice Brierly "Supercharging Cars and Motor Cycles" and other places.
I bumped into a few problems; I needed to know the comp.ratio and the valve-overlap.:
...apparently no-one had ever measured the compression ratio on the 741 engine
so I did a low-tech measurement; glued a transparent plastic to the 'under'side of
one of the heads (with a head-gasket attached).
Stuck in a syringe and measured the quantity of water I could pump in:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5256b575.jpg)
...then calculated the comp. ration (in case of being bored to 600cc) to 1 : 6.
Now that's low-comp.
Same thing with the valve overlap. No where could I find any info,
so did a real low-tech test. Sat up the cam'wheels' (cams are behind the wheels)
and held down the (non)-push-rods with rubber bands.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9def782c.jpg)
...turned the wheels and by holding each of two fingers
on top of the in- and out-let (non)-push-rods, respectively,
tried to feel the period where there was an actual overlap (both rods moved by cams)
Surprise: there was none...or it was negligible, to the point where my "test" couldn't detect it.
In all the literature on blowing (old) engines I've plowed through,
I'm told that 'low comp. ratio' and 'small overlap' is a good thing on a blown engine.
So this has got'a be good
.-)
I'd expect some fuel drop-out
in the plenum because of the large cross-sectional area.
Yep. I'm aware of this potential problem, but in order to get a proper
volume of the intake/plenum that's what I ended up with. There
is no practical provision for making it narrower (and therefore longer).
We'll see how it works out.
BTW: a 1940 military engine is 740, since the last 2 digits are the year.
Naaaa! I could be wrong, but I'm quite sure
all these engine are designated 741 (http://www.indianmotorbikes.com/features/741B/741.htm) irrespectively of the year of manufacture. Never seen an engine designated, let's say: 740 0r 742.
Did Rivera equip the carburetor for methanol as to needle & seat size?
Nope. The carb was a gift from a friend. Unknown former application.
I'll set it up myself. The rule of thumb seams to be to enlarge the jet to around
double size (double area of cross-section, so to speak) compared to running gas,
when running methanol.
I have a couple of books on SU carbs and some calculations relating to the subject
including haw to size down needle-profile etc. I'll give it a go.
One other problem when using the Rivera SU (compared to the car-application SU carbs)
is this thing here
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d5af05f3.jpg)
a bi-metal mechanism that moves the jet 'down' when cold (to make the mixture richer on cold-start)
...here you can see it inside the float-bowl:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/537020ba.jpg)
I'll have to '"kill" that thingy so it doesn't interfere with the mixture, what with running
alcohol that will make things cool down there.
That's a huge carburetor, which means that spring tension and needle
profile will be critical to get good atomization.
Yeah, I know, but that's the carburettor I had available,
and looking at it very un-scientifically, it kind'a looked "right" ;
almost the same cross-section on carb-outlet andblower intake
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b36e4756.jpg)
...and it being a CV-carb it will hopefully "self-adjust"(*) to the requirements
of the engine.
(*)..sort of
.-)
The carb/blower intake on the photos above (cut-off blower intake and cut-off carb. manifold...welded together)
will be replaced by this adaptor we made up a couple of days ago,
to go between carb and blower:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/0de62352.jpg)
Is the cam timing doped out yet?
No. I do not plan to do anything in that department (..but I could be wrong is not doing so).
Remember; this is a low-tech attempt to spice up things...not to go for the ultimate power-gain
at the cost of loosing reliability.
On a side-note: I've installed a blower on my Honda GL1000
(60 cubic inch Magnacharger and double barrel Weber carb,)
with no other modification, including valve timing, and it goes like flipping stink.
Again; thank you guys
and thanks 'panic' for taking an interests and offering advise.
Please keep 'em coming.
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Octane,
Your project is so cool! Very "grass roots" and I love the looks of your bike. I really hope it goes well and if nothing else you will have fun.
Regarding the SU carb, my son had SUs on his Datsun and he would take them apart and look at some parts and wonder what they did so he would remove them from the carb and every time he took something off it would run better!!! A throttle slide, a needle jet, main jet and a venturi and it will probably work. My bet is that most of the other stuff can be thrown in the "bin".
Your motor should really love that little supercharger, nothing makes a flathead come alive like a blower.
Love your project keep the post coming.
Rex
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..
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GREAT bike, look forward to seeing it at the 2009 BUB........if you have problems with the SU carb. you might want to try a S&S carb.......I have always had good luck with them.....they make a
"Fuel Carb." complete with a large bowl............
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Thank you Rex , thank you 1194 for your kind comments and advise !
Thanks Jeff too, for your advise.
One thing though that I don't quite get:
I'd go even larger than 2:1 for flow area if you can, but I'm not sure there's room in the top...
"...room at the top.." . Sorry; I don't understand that; What top would that be?
About the carb; mmmm: I tend to favour the SU
1. I have one
2. they are supposed to adapt quite well to supercharging.
See them all the time on the old blown cars and motorcycles,
at least this side of the pond.
Addressing the floatbowl-issue, I've attained a float-bowl-spacer-expansion-thingy:
dunno if it's enough though ?! Time will tell.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/8461a645.jpg)
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Tonight I'm doing all kinds of small jobs in preparation
for putting the engine together next week (OOOOOOOOOOhhhh...can't wait to do that !!!)
Genneraly cleaning up the top ends and getting rid of sharp edges etc. to avoid potential hot-spots
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ac925b6f.jpg)
...this is what they looked like before:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4ee139ee.jpg)
...and you don't want to run with a spark thread like this do you:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1755b96d.jpg)
...so new plug inserts has been inserted and the area where the top bolts
press down has been cut back a bit to make even surfaces
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/afaddb02.jpg)
Then little things like making sure the sidecover is absolutely 'flat'.
Write with a maker
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/208e5b52.jpg)
..take it to the 'flat' (a sheet of thick glass with abrasive paper)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/42d88d02.jpg)
...and repeat and repeat till you won't find any 'raised' area like this
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5c9384a7.jpg)
...and then a quick shower in my glass bead blasting cabinet,
and they are as good as new.
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I know this will get some replies.......but I put SU carbs. in the same class as Lucas components....
Have one on my 1953 Tri. bird....................................
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but I put SU carbs. in the same class as Lucas components....
What class is that Bob? The non electrical class? :-D
Lars, The Indian is looking fantastic. Saw a couple f photos of it at a show over there. You sure you want to run something so nice on the salt?
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Lars,
Quite an eyeful of tenacious going on over there, can't wait until August.
Rocky
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Cool I just love to see Blowers on bikes. Especially an Indian Fantastic.
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Lars, The Indian is looking fantastic. Saw a couple f photos of it at a show over there. You sure you want to run something so nice on the salt?
Yes! Positively sure. Thanks
Lars,
Quite an eyeful of tenacious going on over there, can't wait until August.
Rocky
Ditto ! See ya' then.
Cool I just love to see Blowers on bikes. Especially an Indian Fantastic.
Thanks Oz. I checked your build.
What can I say, except it's fantastic. Makes my 'build' look like I'm doing a darn bicycle
.-)
Yeah: blowers. Wonderful contraptions. Wonder why more people aren't using them on bikes.
It ain't that complicated, as proven by the fact that I am doing it.
I have another blown bike; a 1976 Honda GL1000 (...that's a pre-Winnibago-sized-fairing Goldwing)
that I build a couple of years ago:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Randall2.jpg)
60" Magnacharger root-type blower. Double barrel Weber carb.
It's a LOT of fun.
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Signed up and paid my entry to BUB Motorcycle Speed Trails today.
It's official: I'm in !
Kind of ...erh...grand, feeling. Ahhhhhh !
Guess all I have to do now is put the thing together,
and test is, and hopefully (ok call me an optimist) all goes well.
That leaves the small problem of finding some freight company
that won't charge me a billion dollars to fly it cross the big pond (and back again)...we'll see.
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..
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Thanks fella but I think mine is going to be a bit under powered until the Nitrous goes in but it is a fifteen year old engine.
If you are containering your Indian out why dont you ship the wing out too its a fine looking bike low centre of gravity should be good on the salt.
We strapped a shorocks onto a 1200 wing motor fifteen or so years ago that went very well..... For a while anyway, reckon we were pushing in a bit too much boost,Unfortunatley we lost alot our pictures a few years ago in a fire
You have got me thinking though I have a 1979 1100 without all the rubbish on it but has a blown head gasket I reckon when I fix that I may have to fix the fact it dosnt have a Blower
I Have had some crazy quotes for shipping some are coming in at around 3000 GBP and others are as high as 5400 GBP but that is Air freight out and sea freight back and you have a little further to go than myself,It is also getting more expensive to go with the exchange rates not being so good at the moment.
Anyway good luck I reckon you will be ready in plenty time and its a fantastic build way cool.
Oz
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you should market that "flippin' stink" (as in "goes like flippin stink" here in amerika. I know I could use some . . .
Ok, I could use a lot.
Here's to flippin' stink and your project!
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the bike looks like it will be a nice piece.
hope to see you at bub.
franey
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I'd try to get more than 2:1 area (methanol vs. gas is about 2.6:1) in the needle & seat, but IIRC the SU top isn't the original part but a Rivera product and I don't know whether there's enough metal to add stuff. Carl's Speed Shop also made their own top, it's not complicated but it's one more thing to do.
Thanks for all this info Jeff!
I've just started looking into maybe installing a larger
float bowl valve, which BTW isn't a needle & seat , but is a grose valve:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2c6be48d.jpg)
Haven't tested it yet for flow-capacity. I understand (?..or do I) from what you're saying that
I'm gonna need 2.6 times the quantity of fuel compared to running on gas.
Now of cause the problem is that I have no idea what the quantity is,
that I multiply by 2.6, what with this being a 600cc Indian with blower,
...a hitherto unknown set-up.
So I guess I'll have to start with a guesstimate of 'way-too-much', and take it from there.
It may be easier to run a low-press pump instead.
I'm considering making up an SU for a friend's racer with a Facet pump but without a float at all - the usual standpipe in the bowl regulates the fuel level, and the overflow gravities back to the tank.
I don't remember the interchange of 741 vs. Scout rocker arms (i.e., how many types there are), but you can change the intake to exhaust bias and the LSA simultaneously by exchanging rockers.
To compare: all Scout rockers are about 1.093" from the pivot shaft center to the lifter contact pad. If this matches yours, you can probably use a Scout rocker. All the roller lengths are different depending on the ratio, in. or ex., and model but between 1.30" and 1.50" shaft center to roller axle (yes, all the rocker ratios are "negative" - less than 1:1).
Ahh!...I see the possiblities, but a I wrote earlier; I'm not getting into valve-timing re-arranging this time around.
Thanks!
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Thanks fella but I think mine is going to be a bit under powered until the Nitrous goes in but it is a fifteen year old engine.
If you are containering your Indian out why dont you ship the wing out too its a fine looking bike low centre of gravity should be good on the salt.
LOL, yeah that would be great. I'm afraid it would be a bit too much for my though; financially and otherwise.
BTW, one problem with the Wing is that it would be waaay too complicated to
get a decent engine RPM/to rear-wheel ratio, it being a shaft-drive.
I Have had some crazy quotes for shipping some are coming in at around 3000 GBP and others are as high as 5400 GBP but that is Air freight out and sea freight back and you have a little further to go than myself,It is also getting more expensive to go with the exchange rates not being so good at the moment.
Those figures sounds just crazy. I really hope for some lower figures.
A friend of mine send a Nimbus bike (much heavier than mine) from here to Tokyo for around 1000.-US$
I've just aked for a quote from the company who did it for him. We'll see.
One thing which is a little better for me is the strenght of my local currency (like the UK, we don't do Euro's here)
compared to the US$.
Anyway good luck I reckon you will be ready in plenty time and its a fantastic build way cool.
Oz
Thanks a lot Oz...and the same to you!
you should market that "flippin' stink" (as in "goes like flippin stink" here in amerika. I know I could use some . . .
Ok, I could use a lot.
Here's to flippin' stink and your project!
Thanks David. Flippin' stink rules !
.-)
the bike looks like it will be a nice piece.
hope to see you at bub.
franey
Thanks Franey. Hope to see you too.
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Started putting the engine together with nice new, rebuild and modified bits:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/dd996f82.jpg)
...now will ya' look at those con-rods. I do believe I've had mopeds with
rods looking substantially larger...ha ha
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/72e2b367.jpg)
...anyway; as I said; they've been Magnaflux tested for cracks and shot-peened
and everyone who know about them tells me not to worry. They are in fact quite strong.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/72d78b5d.jpg)
One of several improvements. A modified oil-return system, including this
(non-original) oil-scraper
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2e6fcbd6.jpg)
The original (but rebuild) rollers
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/0699ac87.jpg)
Checking for end-float:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/bdd6d41d.jpg)
Installing pinion-gear with special Indian-tool
(yeah: I know; I had forgot to clean the edges. Did it later.)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ebbe8d07.jpg)
-
Camshaft wheels gear (whatever) installed...LOTs of lube (the thick stuff you use when putting together
engines...forgot the English term):
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9623a91c.jpg)
Outer cover (on which later goes the oil-pump) installed:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/fc678e7a.jpg)
Now the transmission is one hell of a challenge:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c2c61dbc.jpg)
There is no 'cover' ...no way of taking it apart. It's a closed 'box'.
All the thingies you see next to it has to go in through that hole in the box
...and be fitted together while in there. I seriously wished I had Veeeeery thin
fingers with a couple of extra joints..ha ha.
I did do a test, putting everything in there to see if thing were all right.
It really wasn't that difficult......but a fine test of patience and keeping the mind calm...real calm.
A few of the improvements to the tranny:
Closed it of with these home-made plugs to seperate the oil in the box
from the contaminated oil in the clutch/sidecover
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/781ad94d.jpg)
by way of making threads in the existing holes
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/0cc8961a.jpg)
..and plugging them in:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d85e0ee8.jpg)
New custom-made bushings with improved lubrication capability
( replacing the originals that had straight groves )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/6d7171b8.jpg)
...and running in the opposite direction/rotation, at the other end
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3bfa4e4e.jpg)
-
Doing up low-tech plans for the gear-lever.
We don't do CAD drawings here.
We do DPB drawings here....................................DirtyPizzaBox drawings that is
.-)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ed714048.jpg)
-
octane,
i see two exhaust systems in the pix.
you may need to add another or modify a set.
check bub rule 2.b .
i like the 2nd set , but tech may not.
if it has already been brought up, that's good; i haven't seen it.
franey
-
Thanks Franey for pointing my attention to this.
Tech. did have initial reservations but I
send a couple of additional pictures and explanation
and the system was deemed OK.
Drew Gatewood who heads tech. inspection at BUB
has been brilliantly helpful sorting out
and helping me answering my silly questions.
Thanks Drew!
Rule 2.B "Exhaust Direction"
"directed away from racing surface"....
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1694891b.jpg)
...."[away from] rider and rear tire" :
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5f247264.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/8ad9c375.jpg)
-
Beauuuutiful.
We now do cad but its only recent,It does help from time to time but its usually ofp (old fag packet that is cigarettes to you across the pond not those who bat for the other side ) sketches with us over here.
Oz
-
from the new shots the exhaust looks fine; the angle in
your first post was deceptive.
drew is good at what he does and very timely.
franey
-
Octane 98, It appears you are using the long spacer on the drive side bearings. I recommend you to use the short inner spacer, same thrust lock an use the seal behind the nut. I am doing that this weekend as we speak. Drew likes to see clean engines as well.
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Hi Rocky
..I'm not sure if I understand you correctly but;
the drive-side 'neck' is modified to accept modern oil-seal.
You can see the seal here (sorry don't have a better photo right now)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3773959c.jpg)
I like clean and oil-tight engines as well !
.-)
-
Octane,
Yes you are understanding exactly what I was saying except your seal looks different? Is that seal made by Indian Parts Europe?
Rocky
-
your seal looks different? Is that seal made by Indian Parts Europe?
Yep, that's a special "outer nut with lipped seal", from Indian Parts Europe.
-
Rocky; here's a better pic;
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/caab0a5e.jpg)
..in fact it keeps the hot engine-oil from seeping out
into the side-cover.
..or more precisely: the small 'chamber' in the side-cover closest to the crank,
now closed off, as I don't run a generator;
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/98cf2577.jpg)
At the clutch/transission end, I use a sealed bearing,
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/983a7aec.jpg)
with the sealing towards the transmission, removed.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9dafbdfa.jpg)
That together with the plugs showed earlier will
.. keep clutch-debris-contaminated oil from entering the transmission.
.. in the event of a leaking sidecover no oil will be lost in the transmission
.. I can choose to run different types of oil for the transmission and for the clutch/chain
One more thing to keep it this way is that the clutch
has been machined in the center, to accept a modern oil-seal,
sealing the shaft :
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/04d0d08c.jpg)
Yesterday we assembled the drive-side to see if things lined up
(notice the extended front-sprocket from which the blower-drive will run.
Naaaa: not the long socket-extension thingy. The thick-wall'ed tube ):
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4c1f78fd.jpg)
They didn't......
.....so we all started crying and then went home to bed.
-
NOT !
..but LOT'a head-scratching / pulling apart / re-re-assembling, till I found out what was wrong.
I'm too embarrassed to tell.
No use dwelling on the past.
.-)
SO; moving on (fastlike);
There's nothing quite like a table laid with fresh new
and reconditioned parts !
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/afaf5a85.jpg)
Yummy!
Tonight I'll install the valves.
It may sound silly; but I'm quite exited
as it's the first time I do a side-valve.
Also be checking the piston-ring end-gap on the new pistons.
Here's another small improvement on this almost-seventy-year old engine.
Originally the notorious 'sealing'-rings between the cylinders and the in-take
is made of brass, which inevitably will turn brittle and leak.
Don't really want that, particularly on a blown engine.
Indian Parts Europe has managed to have these
space-age-unobtainium thingies made:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ac5181e9.jpg)
..from some sort of nylon-like material that will not change properties
subjected to intense heat (and cooling and etc.).
You get them oversized and they are then machined down
to your specific (in this case ; home-made) intake,
for perfect fit.
-
:-D :-D :-D I thought I heard it all,,,,,,,, But "un-obtaineiums?????? Yeh! Crow
-
Click this: Unobtanium explained on Un-cyclopedia (http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Unobtainium)
-
and then,,, click this.......Crow!
-
Octane,
Real nice intake seals, boy I need to spend more time looking at Indian Parts Europe website cause they have some super parts for old Indian motorcycles.
Ironwigwam
-
and then,,, click this.......Crow!
Erh...click.
Assembled one valve/spring in the cylinder.
...measured the length when mounted/compressed
Then sat it up to measure the spring-load when pressing it down the above length.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7b5b199d.jpg)
...did the same thing but adding the measurement for maximum cam-lift.
Why ?
1) to check if all springs had equal load (and for future reference. I do keep a log book)
2) the second measurement for future reference if I want to mess with the cams.
...and in they went:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/001bbc17.jpg)
Marking the rings before taking them out to measure ring end-gap
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/11121f7e.jpg)
Rocky: yes IPE has some great stuff to upgrade ones Indian,
and as I said in the intro here; he's help to me is beyond immeasurable
and he does let me use all his special Indian-tools.
He has them all, plus some really ...erhh......peculiar named ones, like this: :?
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d259988a.jpg)
.
-
Currently d r o w n i n g in work, so haven't done much here.
Kenneth made a couple of bushings for the gear-shifter, to hold the new shifter 'rod'.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/92677735.jpg)
..that goes into a tube under the tank,
to get it as close as possible, up to the left side handlebar. (without interfering).
At the rear an adjustable rod will connect down to the tranny.
Originally the shift is positioned at the rear/right side of the tank.
Just a mock-up, mind you: not the right shape yet.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/09b0dace.jpg)
Yep: running hand-shift / foot-clutch / manual ignition-advance in left-side hand-control.
-
that is a beautiful looking bike-and i very much like the large amount of handmade parts and all the improvements great stuff!.i just got my indian -a 47 chief,my life,s dream-so to see all the improvements and performance work you are doing is very enjoyable-
i will be over for beer and pictures at bonneville.so see you there.i come over with OZ
BLOWN REDSKIN GO GO GO!!
SKAL!!
p.j.
-
Yup sure is looking good, I may have to get some tips of you for supercharging the CBR when we get back from this trip!
Hey PJ you know I have two Indian Chiefs dont you maybe we should get the metal detector out and a JCB and go treasure hunting eh!
I will be over for a cuppa soon
TTFN OZ
-
Octane,
Glad to see you are moving along. I admire the progress you are making, I wish I was making more.
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
that is a beautiful looking bike-and i very much like the large amount of handmade parts and all the improvements great stuff!
Well thanks BBKelly !
.i just got my indian -a 47 chief,my life,s dream-so to see all the improvements and performance work you are doing is very enjoyable-
Glad you enjoy it !
Congratulations on your Chief!
For parts / improvements / performance-parts / advise for your Indian:
look no further than (click this link) : Indian Parts Europe (http://www.indianpartseurope.com/)
i will be over for beer and pictures at bonneville.so see you there.i come over with OZ
BLOWN REDSKIN GO GO GO!!
Yep!
I'll buy you a beer
BTW ; are you going to Speed Week or BUB?
SKAL!!
SKÅL to you!
Yup sure is looking good, ....
Thanks Oz!
Octane,
Glad to see you are moving along. I admire the progress you are making, I wish I was making more.
Thanks Rocky !
But you are making progress, right !?
-
Yours truly looking for evidence...
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1.jpg)
....that there's any sanity in rebuilding
and modifying a 70 year old contraption...
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2.jpg)
...and drag it thousands of miles across
the globe, just to run it a few miles on a pile of salt
Nope; couldn't find any
-
Lars,
Yes I am making progress on engine and updates to chassis for tech inspection
Nice breather, I just made one close to that with a special timing plug I had made. I should know this week if I have to tear engine down.
Rocky
1957 S/VG
-
Glad to hear you're making progress Rocky!
Things slowed down here as I've been working silly hours,
but I'm free now so thing are flowing again.
Using this wide collection of shims and thrust-collars
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/682259b2.jpg)
...I finally managed to put together the transmission properly
and also achieve the right end-float
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/68f9067f.jpg)
It was all a LOT of fun;
As I mentioned earlier; everything has to go through the hole in the side of the transmission-case,
so basically one throws in a bunch of parts and THEN put them into position/interaction
WHILE in there.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/799a8f5f.jpg)
YesSir; had to do it a few times.
All piston-ring end-gap's has been set,
and tops have been tidied up,
so they're ready with new gaskets (James Gaskets) and bolts
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/345240e8.jpg)
So; all in all; it's beginning to look like an engine:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/492197eb.jpg)
Few odd jobs on the frame left;
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b194d9bd.jpg)
.....the last few brackets will be welded to the frame this weekend
and next week it's off to be powder-coated.
So hopefully it won't be that long
till it goes on the dyno to set up carb etc.
.
-
Fabulous project; are those the tires you're going to run?
-
Thanks for your kind words.
Tires:
The front tire is there by choice, so; yes. ( 3 x 21" AVON SPEEDMASTER Mark II)
The rear is just what happened to come with the wheel (off a Suzuki T500).
Haven't decided yet what to run there.
Suggestions are welcomed.
-
What size is your current rear tire & wheel?
-
The rear-tire is a 17". 120/90
-
Methink it's a sexy little beast:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9f1809c7.jpg)
-
It's magic!
1957 S/VG
-
I like Avon, tires that is. It doesn't look like they make a 17" Speedmaster.
Avon Motorsport Motorcycle Tires: (or is that tyres?)
http://www.avonracing.com/motorcycle_page.aspx
Avon Motorcycle Tires:
http://www.avon-tyres.co.uk/motorcycle/
I've been throwing around the idea of using Goodyear Top Fuel Dragster Front Runners:
http://www.racegoodyear.com/tires/pdf/drag_front_runner.pdf
They use 17" X 2.5" rims.
-
Methink it's a sexy little beast:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9f1809c7.jpg)
I agree :cheers: it's absolutely beautiful :-D
-
Rchop, that is one bitchen look engine, nice work. :cheers:
-
:-D Now that makes a protrubance in an old scooter tramps britches! I'll see you on the Salt! Go fast, but safe. Crow
-
It's magic!
Thanks Rocky !
..it's a lot of work and a bit of magic
I like Avon, tires that is. It doesn't look like they make a 17" Speedmaster.
Nope. Thanks for the links Calkins !
I think I'll go for the Continental TKV 12, 130/90 V17
(http://www.conti-online.com/generator/www/de/de/continental/motorrad/themen/motorradreifen/sport_classic/img/tkv11_12_uv.jpg)
I agree :cheers: it's absolutely beautiful :-D
Rchop, that is one bitchen look engine, nice work. :cheers:
Thanks Rchop and Glen !
:-D Now that makes a protrubance in an old scooter tramps britches!
I have no idea what that means, but thanks
.-)
I'll see you on the Salt! Go fast, but safe. Crow
See you there ! Will do.
-
a bump in the front of his trousers below his belt :? :-o
-
I've been throwing around the idea of using Goodyear Top Fuel Dragster Front Runners:
http://www.racegoodyear.com/tires/pdf/drag_front_runner.pdf
They use 17" X 2.5" rims.
Pretty sure this is what Willie is running. Not sure what front wheel that is, but pics here.
http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,5700.0.html
I still can't get over how beautiful this Indian is. :cheers:
-
In this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Df8XVdKbiLA
John Buddenbaum says that he uses the Front Runners on his Buddfab streamliner. He went 150mph with it.
-
I'm sure they are fine tires ...for going reallyreallyreallyreally fast.
I only plan on going reallyfast..-like.
I could very well be wrong but,
I think I'll be better of with a tire with a tad more bite/traction,
at the expense of (in my case unnecessary) ultra high speed-rating
or....?
a bump in the front of his trousers below his belt :? :-o
Ohh gawd!...hernia
.-)
Pretty sure this is what Willie is running. Not sure what front wheel that is, but pics here.
http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,5700.0.html
I still can't get over how beautiful this Indian is. :cheers:
Thanks SockJohn
-
That looks positively bitchin! That frame is gorgeous.
-
Well thanks Pinto!
Test assembled the (not finished) engine
into the (not finished) frame to test a few things,
so took the opportunity to take a couple of shots:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/e280b4e2.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/54ea75d5.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/15ea6446.jpg)
I was pleasantly surprised to learn that these modern gaskets (JAMES GASKETS)
are available for this here 70 year old girl:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7830548f.jpg)
There's a few gaskets I have to make myself; for the intake, blower-drive oil-seal housing etc.
They are not quite so sophisticated
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/02f1e5de.jpg)
-
That's a beautiful bike Lars :cheers: I hope you have fast and safe times with it on the salt.
-
A great looking bike................BUT you might want to rethink the location of the foot-pegs (foot-rests)
-
Octane 98,
That's a nice carpenter's hammer you got there. And it does double duty as a ball peen hammer?
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
That's a beautiful bike Lars :cheers: I hope you have fast and safe times with it on the salt.
A great looking bike................
Thanks guys !
BUT you might want to rethink the location of the foot-pegs (foot-rests)
Naaaaaaaaa; if you're referring to the rules,
I'm running AMA-rules and this being a "A"-class frame
(Special Construction Class, as the frame is a one-of special )
the rule-book says:
"..7.E.: Foot Pegs
Mandatory equipment, location of foot pegs is discretionary.."
...where as the other classes have rules for minimum distance to rear axle.
Octane 98,
That's a nice carpenter's hammer you got there. And it does double duty as a ball peen hammer?
Rocky
1957S/VG
Nope; it does service as a perforating-punch hammer.
-
No, not referring to the rules regarding the foot-pegs.........only referring to the rideability of the bike......
Couple of years ago at the BUB, we had a Harley running with the foot-pegs in the same location............
barely worked on the course........but was no... on the turn-off and return roads........Hey, but it is your ride............Just a thought...."we have been there done that"...........................................................
-
OK, got'ya! Thanks Bak for sharing your experience !
You may very well be right about my set-up.
The position when sitting on my bike does put some strain
on my...erh....reproduktive organs.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/cf0ae80f.jpg)
I do plan on making a 'pillow' on the top-rail to rest my manly chest on.
We'll see when I get to test-ride it.
.
-
How hot are they on road tests over there?
Bet you cant wait to give it a blast down the road.Very Nice!
-
How hot are they on road tests over there?
Hot.
I do intend to test it on the motorway
like on a very early sunday morning.
Better be careful though; if they catch you
running 30% over the limit you get a 'mark'
in your drivers licence. Three 'mark's and you loose it
and have to take the test again.
I have 2 'mark's.
Bet you cant wait to give it a blast down the road...
I'm like a child just before Christmas.
Been doing small stuff, like this cover
covering an ugly hole left by the absence of any generator-drive
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d355da29.jpg)
..and making more gaskets.
Here's the hi-tech method for making a 'template
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ab8c1c4c.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/13aec325.jpg)
A friendly email exchange with Mr. tech-inspection Drew
let me understand that I couldn't run the late-Chief type of vents
on the primary and gearbox ( for the sake of not risking oil-mist to run down on the salt)
( RED arrows: )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d1249ce0.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/847225ce.jpg)
..so bought a couple of fuel-filters with a VERY tight-knit brass-'mesh'
that will catch the oil-mist a let it flow back to where it belongs
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9bc660e0.jpg)
..and altered them slightly and put them on the old vent-mount/bolt
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4ca02716.jpg)
Yes: small small stuff.......but goodness there's so much small stuff to do
Ohhh yeahhhhh: got a batch of , if I may say so, rather cooooool
Salt Cracker Team t-shirts:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3fcfedf4.jpg)
.
-
If you want your times announced I wear an XL :-D
-
And if you want to get on the salt, I wear a large!!! :evil:
Lynda
-
:-D And if ya just want some p.r., I'm a gadabout spectator! size Lge.) Crow
-
Octane, are you running at Speed Week or Bub? I was thinking you said Bub.
-
Octane 98,
Nice choice for breathers, What style fire sleeve are you running on your gas lines in your BUB class?
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Glen and Lynda........so you are comming to the BUB event.....???????
Hope to see you there.!!!...
-
Well, shingles and shotguns :cry: guess I don't get a shirt. I don't do security for BUB.... sucks to be me!
Was a great thought while it lasted!
Lynda
-
Lynda, no worries. You would be spectacular w/o a shirt.
Poll results to be announced soon.
FREUD
-
I'll be a judge... :-o
-
LOL...seams I could make good money selling t-shirts at Speed Week.
Wish I could go there.
Octane 98,
Nice choice for breathers, What style fire sleeve are you running on your gas lines in your BUB class?
Rocky
1957S/VG
Rocky;thanks for pointing out there might be a problem
with the original breathers. You were right.
As for fuel-line sleeving, I'm using this stuff:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7c7f4246.jpg)
"..TEMPROTECT SLEEVING
Braided high bulk glass-fibre sleeve, silicone coated. Coated with iron oxide silicone rubber
which will even shed molten steel , aluminium and glass offering outstanding protection
to hoses, tubes and cables in a variety of hostile environments.
Continuous operating temp. 500ºF (250ºC)
Max. short term exposure 3000ºF (1650ºC)
Flame resistance - Very good
Abrasion resistance - Very good
Flexibility - Outstanding..."
Water & Oil resistance - Outstanding.
-
Octane,
It looks like a good choice to me. I am using a similar product from 3M over here but I am applying a kevlar sleeve over it as well, to prevent any exploding engine fragments to cut thru?.
Your'e welcome for the breather lookover, beleive me if I see spomething I am going to let you know so when you get here, so our others will have an easier time of getting you down the course and in the pits.
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Lars,
I was looking at your intake manifold/plenum and was wondering how it seal into the inlet ports. I re-read your posts and it looks like the 'spigots" on the sides of the manifold are inserted into the barrel inlet ports when you assemble the engine. How does this seal? Is there some level of "give" to allow for heat expansion and vibrations?
I am not a big bike "guy" but there are so many really neat bikes being built for the BUB, and ours is one of the neatest!, that I am going to plan a "business trip" to Salt Lake City the week of the BUB and probaby just happen to stop by. See you then.
Rex
-
Lars,
I was looking at your intake manifold/plenum and was wondering how it seal into the inlet ports. I re-read your posts and it looks like the 'spigots" on the sides of the manifold are inserted into the barrel inlet ports when you assemble the engine. How does this seal? Is there some level of "give" to allow for heat expansion and vibrations?
I hope so
.-)
Yes; the 'spigots' are inserted into the intake ports/'necks'.
The seal I mentioned earlier ( page 4 I think) :
..............................
Here's another small improvement on this almost-seventy-year old engine.
Originally the notorious 'sealing'-rings between the cylinders and the in-take
is made of brass, which inevitably will turn brittle and leak.
Don't really want that, particularly on a blown engine.
Indian Parts Europe has managed to have these
space-age-unobtainium thingies made:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ac5181e9.jpg)
..from some sort of nylon-like material that will not change properties
subjected to intense heat (and cooling and etc.).
You get them oversized and they are then machined down
to your specific (in this case ; home-made) intake,
for perfect fit.
...............
As you can see it's tapered ( is that the correct term?)
and there's an 'opposite' 'taper' inside the bolt-thingies
that screws onto the outside thread on the intake-'neck'
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/intake2.jpg)
Other people's experience with these intake-seal is that they really do
keep tight, even on my friends souped-up Chief.
This bike running alcohol should experience
less heat expansion etc., so I'm optimistic.
The part of the intake with the 'spigots'
will vibrate along with the engine,
and then there's a rubber-tube connection to
the second part of the intake which is mounted to the blower (bolted directly to the frame)
If the seals don't seal, this being blown and all, I'll take it from there.
I'd rather not, but may be forced to, use some silicone material
I am not a big bike "guy" but there are so many really neat bikes being built for the BUB, and ours is one of the neatest!, that I am going to plan a "business trip" to Salt Lake City the week of the BUB and probaby just happen to stop by. See you then.
Thank you for your kind words.
Yes; please stop by and say hello!
See you.
-
i have ran the same style manifolds on harleys and never had any trouble with them --i use a wrench that i made with a long handle --love your bike hope to see you and the bike at bonneville willie buchta
-
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/intake2.jpg)
Seams like it would work like a big compression fitting.
Do you think the alky will mess with your inserts?
-
i have ran the same style manifolds on harleys and never had any trouble with them --i use a wrench that i made with a long handle --love your bike hope to see you and the bike at bonneville willie buchta
Thanks Willie !
Do you think the alky will mess with your inserts?
We'll see; Testing seal, submerged in methanol
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9b5499a8.jpg)
BTW: the sealing-"cones" are made of (click:) PEEK / Polyaryletheretherketone (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PEEK)
.
-
No sealing cones were harmed in this experiment.
PHEW!
Been kind'a busy today:
Finally picked up the tooth-belt / wheels:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4a3e9b1e.jpg)
Ratio is ..erh...semi-educated guesswork: 48:26
5000 engine rpm --> 9230 rpm at blower. (10000 is apparently the max. for the blower)
Filed down some of the head and cylinder-'fins'
to make it possible to remove / reinstall the silly-shaped intake
without having to actually remove one cylinder
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/16403efa.jpg)
It's now doable (just) moving it to the right and then up and away.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9a6247d4.jpg)
We made the intake 'inserts'
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/f148138f.jpg)
..that goes inside the two intake-halves.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9873a466.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/09951799.jpg)
...to be connected with a silicone/rubber hose.
Trail-fit of wheels/belt:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/406a4000.jpg)
Ha ha ...that machine look wiiiiild !
Goodness, I love it!
-
As I said before, nice work. :cheers:
-
Octane, Nice experiment with methanol and rings of peek
-
Ahhhh, that's dead-sexy...
-
Thanks guys !
Yeah Rocky; I test all things that I plan on using (or maybe will use)
to see how it stands up to methanol by submerging them for a couple of days:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/67c37a0e.jpg)
ARALDIT two-pack epoxy glue it turns to a soft-ice like substance.
Two-pack metal-filler disintegrates slowly.
Silicone like PERMATEX and CASCO seams to be totally unaffected
The 'raw' tooth-belt wheels/discs Kenneth milled to suit the drive (and blower)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c2bccd66.jpg)
..so we made a "final" test-assembly
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b00a7c1d.jpg)
...to check if things lined up.
Then pulled the whole thing apart to do the last welding on the frame
and today I'll take it to the sandblaster.
Funny; folks ask me how's going with the bike
and I tell'em we're pretty close;
then they look at the present state (as of yesterday. Kenneth showing the frame):
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3193e714.jpg)
...and they think I'm nuts.
Mmm; maybe so.
-
We're all nutz! :lol:
-
Long as nobody gets sane everything will be just wonderfull, world will keep on turning like it always has.
Ed
-
I've had a few PM-comments about the intake / plenum
but I'll take it to this thread, as I'd be glad if someone more knowledgeable
than me (shouldn't be hard to find) could offer competent comments:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7d9c528c.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/20de2ddd.jpg)
We're talking about the need for a certain size plenum
to create a "pressure-reservoir", to 'bridge the gap' between
the constant/even-pressure delivery from the blower.
and the intermittent demand because of the 'un-even' (V-twin) firing order.
(On a single-cylinder the problem would be worse. On a multi it would be much less)
My calculations for the plenum-size is based on
Maurice Brierley's ( sixties supercharged Vincent drag-race hero)
book "Supercharging Cars and Motorcycles",
and an exchange with Jeff/"Panic", of Victory Library fame (http://victorylibrary.com/main_menu.htm)
( I tried to linkto the supercharger-part of his site,but they seams to have vanished (???) )
and a few other sources.
Their seams to be an agreement, partly different depending on blower-type,
that the size of the plenum should be from 150 to max. 200% of the engine-displacement,
on a V-twin.
My engine is 600cc and my plenum is approx. 1190cc so that's pretty darn close to max.
(I just re-checked it, by filling it with water).
Theoretical there's a bit difference depending on the 'firing pulse'
which in my case is 42 degrees, so the phase/wave formation
is slightly different than, say, a 50 degree V-twin.
This is mostly theoretical but:
...despite the plenum/(boost-storage-tank), the two cylinders
because of the 'un'even' firing, will receive slightly un-even quantities of "supercharge".
Because of this, some folks, like Brierley, will run slightly (half a ratio) different compression-ratios
on the two respective cylinders, to ad up things.
Apart from all this; my plenum is not perfect by any means,
as I'm not able to make it perfectly 'stream-lined' inside
to avoid what Brierley refer to as "aerodynamic fungus"
...but I did my best, considering the means I have available.
-
..
-
A couple of years ago I was waiting for the owner of a one-man shop to look in his junk parts stash for a tailight. He was busy running a Harley on a dyno with a non-standard single-carb manifold setup. It was a naturally aspirated engine. He had taps in the intake tracts close to the heads and he was checking the intake tract vacuum in each cylinder while he ran the engine.
Being a curious guy, I asked him what he was doing, after he shut down the engine. He said this manifold setup needed to be checked to make sure it was balanced. He said he would weld and grind on the manifold as needed to make sure one cylinder was not getting more air than the other. He had mercury filled vertical tube gauges that could measure both pressure and vacuum. A horizontal line across the gauge tubes indicated static air pressure conditions. Vacuum pulled the mercury higher than the line, and pressure pushed it below the line. Or vice versa.
This really impressed me. At low revs I could see the mercury jump due the the Harley's intake cycles. At higher revolutions I could see the manifold setup feeding more air to one cylinder than the other. One thing I also noticed was that the uneven firing order of a Harley meant there was more dead time between intake pulses every other cycle. Sort of "chuff-chuff-pause-chuff-chuff."
Maybe this type of testing could help you fine tune your setup.
-
..
-
..
-
This also means, in practical terms, that if the plenum volume is large enough, there will be a delay of "X" number of lobe rotations before full discharge pressure is present in the cylinder at IVC. Until the entire plenum volume is pressurized cylinder pressure < inter-lobe pressure.
Until that time, the cylinder will respond (i.e., develop torque) first as naturally aspirated, then develop more power as the plenum pressure rises (probably asymptotic) to discharge pressure.
Is that about the time it takes to twist the throttle :evil:
JL222 :-D
-
..
-
Supposedly, no.
The Corvair turbo engine was notorious for reduced response just from using a plenum to the 4 carb (140 hp) heads, rather than the original 2 openings.
How bad? Depends on volume vs. blower capacity vs. boost level vs. cylinder displacement.
This is a ROOTS blower instant boost
Even our centrifugal has instant boost, at a blip of the throttle boost registers on guage. If you new anything about supercharged engines you would know this.
My tubocharged buick had instant boost also.
JL222
The 222 car has over 10 ft of 4 inch tubeing and an intercooler 24 x 14 before the air sees the engine [ still instant boost ]
-
Octane,
In responce to your plenum, quote
We're talking about the need for a certain size plenum
to create a "pressure-reservoir", to 'bridge the gap' between
the constant/even-pressure delivery from the blower.
and the intermittent demand because of the 'un-even' (V-twin) firing order.
(On a single-cylinder the problem would be worse. On a multi it would be much less)
My calculations for the plenum-size is based on
Maurice Brierley's ,
end quote.
It looks fine the way you designed the sweep in the center , just bring it over for BUB and build on that.
Rocky
Ironwigwam
1957S/VG
-
I'm kinda thinking that Panic knows what he's talking about, even if I don't fully understand his second response. And I guess "instant" is open to interpretation.
Stan
-
I'm kinda thinking that Panic knows what he's talking about, even if I don't fully understand his second response. And I guess "instant" is open to interpretation.
Stan
Instant ''immediate'' concentrated precooked food or beverage. such as premixed greyhounds but not as fast as you can drink them :-D
JL222 :cheers:
-
My post about the dyno was to tell about using it as a tuning tool. I don't know a lot about superchargers. Octane has been teaching me a lot during his build.
The dyno gives us an opportunity to be close to the engine while it is under load. I spray soapy water on joints to check for leaks, both pressure and vacuum. I listen for weird noises. Then I turn off the lights and we look for wayward sparks. We get traces for horespower, torque, and fuel mixture. We rejet as needed. All data goes into a notebook. We figured out how to set jetting for B'ville while on a dyno near sea level in Oregon, by using our notes.
A good dyno operator is the most important thing. Especially one who is familiar with engine type being tested. Dyno tuning costs a lot, but it has really helped us. It is a lot easier to fix stuff in the shop than out on the salt.
, and We use a dyno sparingly because it costs a lot, but we get a horsepower, torque, and mixture trace and mi
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Thank you all, for your input !
Panic, I do believe I understand what you're saying.
Very informative.
Walrus; about the mercury-gauge etc. thing;
I do indeed have such a thing as the mercury vacuum gauge, right here.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/e682b0b1.jpg)
I use it for synchronizing the carbs on my four-cylinder / four carb Honda GL1000
and my six cylinder / six carb CBX1000. ( as it's only a four gauge thing, I use one carb
as reference and adjust the others according to that one)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/0fb83827.jpg)
(Beautiful engine, don't you think)
It mercury-thing measures the intake vacuum, so I can of cause not use it on the blown engine.
There is no vacuum in the intake/plenum....there's pressure.
The bike will indeed go on a dyno as soon as it up and running (...very soon hopefully)
Supposedly, no.
The Corvair turbo engine was notorious for reduced response just from using a plenum to the 4 carb (140 hp) heads, rather than the original 2 openings.
How bad? Depends on volume vs. blower capacity vs. boost level vs. cylinder displacement.
Dunno much about Corvairs, but they were horizontally opposed engined,
so just for fun; have a look at my 1977 Honda Goldwing GL1000 , supercharger set-up,
that being a horizontally opposed engine as well.
Magnuson Magnacharger. 60 cubic inches. / 983cc. Runs slightly 'over-cranked'.(24 to 23)
Weber 26-34 two barrel carb
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2a9e458a.jpg)
...also to compare blower/plenum sizes.
For your infotainment;
watch how fast that old blown Goldwing is
(Please disregard the clunky clutch. I wacked it within the first few miles after installing the blower.
Is now replaced by a Barnett clutch and stronger springs.)
Click the image and watch the video. Turn UP sound !
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/th_wroooooooom.jpg) (http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/?action=view¤t=wroooooooom.flv)
...and check how it picks up revs here:
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/th_CIMG3747.jpg) (http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/?action=view¤t=CIMG3747.flv)
(No silly: I'm not four feet tall. The bike is on a lift...ha ha)
BLOWERS RULE !!!!!!
-
:-o THATS impressive
JL222 :cheers:
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Octane,
One of the things that you probbly don't need to be really concerned about is quick throttle response, you are running at Bonneville not on a drag strip. That being said, I would think that the larger the volume of your plenum the less the pulsations of the blower and the engine inlet track will affect the steady state pressure in the plenum. I would think that going 5 of even 10 times the engine volume would have a greater affect on dampening the blower and engine plusations. If you want to see what is happening you will need an electronic pressure transducer and the ability to look at the transducer output at a rate probably at least once every milisecond (1000 time per second) this will really tell you what is happening. At this sample rate you will be able to see all of the events that you are concernd with, i.e. blower pulsations and inlet pulsations. Trying to use some sort of water or fluid column to visually look at the plenum pressure is only an indication of the average pressure in the plenum and not the instantaneous pressure.
You have a situation where the blower is injecting chunks of air at a rate of 2 chunks every revolution of the blower and the engine is inhaling 2 chunks of air every revolution of the engine, but not at the same rate or frequency as the blower so there is no doubt that there is a very big possibility of some sort of dynamic resonance that could occure between the blower output and the engine intake all of which you probably do not want to happen. The larger the plenum volume the less this will happen. So my vote is that if you see some sort of problem related to this blower/engine pulsation interaction go to a larger plenum.
In reality you will probably just go with what you have, it will run like a "stripped a$$ ape" and you will have tons of fun!!
See you at the salt!!
Rex
-
Rex and others have the good answers to your questions, especially about the gauge. My mention of dyno experiences are just to give an idea about a useful tool and method.
We are definitely looking forward to seeing the Indian and hearing it run. Its a beauty.
-
Rex do you know of any data recorders that test at that speed?
JL222
-
Jl222,
I have a small 2 channel recorder that will go to 10,000 times a second cost a couple of hundred bucks. PM me at rexschimmer@gmail.com and I will try to dig up the info. I think that I have a couple of pressure transducers also, which are actually more expensive than the data recorder!
Rex
-
Its Just Soooo Pretty I reckon thats the best looking Indian I have ever seen.
-
Thank you OZ , and thanks all, for your input
and for your kind words.
Mmmmmmm; this whole plenum volume thing;
I really don't know.
Rex I understand what you're saying, but 10 times the cylinder volume.?!
That's one mighty plenum ; 6 liters or close to 1½ gallon !!!
I don't know these things but I'd be inclined to take into account
Panic's warning that if the plenum is too big, ".... gas speed will decay ..... causing fuel drop-out"
I've see all sorts of set-ups from some rather long intakes/plenums,
like Max's blown double-Vincent, and these magnificent old drag bikes
(http://www.theaccelerationarchive.co.uk/roger/phillips_03/BW16-15.jpg)
(http://www.theaccelerationarchive.co.uk/roger/phillips_03/C69.jpg)
...to no plenum at all;
(BTW this is a 650cc Triumph, with the exact same blower as mine)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/46a14c09.jpg)
...and interestingly the bolt-on blower kit from MAGNACHARGER (http://www.magnacharger.us/) for H.D.'s
doesn't have much, if any, plenum to speak of.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/dd2577d1.jpg)
So for now I can't really do anything, but go by what I've read,
which is up to 200% of cylinder-volume and see how it works out.
We'll see.
.
-
SO:
..back to work !
Last welding, mods, etc. on the frame done, so it's been sandblasted:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/50a77dd6.jpg)
Will paint it tonight or tomorrow.
Engine disassembled for the xxx'th time
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7f21fdcb.jpg)
...doing the final little things like replacing all the cylinder-studs
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ed3c5641.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/bffe5726.jpg)
..before final ( as IF) engine assembly.
Blower drive is just about ready:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/f83e46e1.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4ce2d9bc.jpg)
...just need the thingy that 'locks' the belt-wheel and the extended sprocket-thingy together.
-
..
-
octane,
1st of AWESOME JOB :cheers:!
#1 Fuel Tank size :?? Riding to the Line,then running a Pass{Long or Short Course?} Then the Long ride back to the Pit's or Hopefully Impound area? 8-) Is a Long Way :oops:! I know the hard way. You also better wear a CUP/JOCK Support if you ever want to use it again :-o! Rigid and Rear set's@ Bub = PAIN IN THE NADS!:mrgreen:
Good Luck and Go FASTER!
SEE YA ON THE SALT,
Kaz................
P.S
Whats your Day Job ?
As you could be a Custom Bike Builder Easily :wink:!
-
Thanks Panic
....but I'm afraid I don't get the "..300 f/s this gives a diameter of 1.6".." part ?
octane,
1st of AWESOME JOB :cheers:!
#1 Fuel Tank size :??
Thanks Kaz!
..and thanks for asking about the tank.
I had completely forgotten to check the size (embarrassing)
Did it right away now.
Now half a tank is 5 liters ( yep; the tank hasn't been welded yet, as you can see)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1c0b0e9c.jpg)
..so if my time back at school wasn't totally wasted; the tank holds 10 liters = 2.64172052 US gallons
Riding to the Line,then running a Pass{Long or Short Course?} Then the Long ride back to the Pit's or Hopefully Impound area? 8-) Is a Long Way :oops:! I know the hard way.
Short course, so let me figger that out: approx. 5,5 miles to the course, 5 mile course, 5,5 returning = 11 miles. / 17,7 km.
2.64 : 11 = 0.24 gallon to run one mile
Being European that doesn't mean a thing to me so:
10 liters : 17,7 km = 0.56 liter to run one km.
You also better wear a CUP/JOCK Support if you ever want to use it again :-o! Rigid and Rear set's@ Bub = PAIN IN THE NADS!:mrgreen:
Yeah; I'm aware of that, but because the bike is as short as it is, it's not quite as bad as it looks.
That's probably bad enough..ha ha...so I've been experimenting with a different shaped seat that improves the situation somewhat.
Good Luck and Go FASTER!
SEE YA ON THE SALT,
Kaz..............
Whats your Day Job ?
As you could be a Custom Bike Builder Easily :wink:!
Thanks!
I work free lance, and right now I don't 'work'
so technically my 'day job' is building this bike
.-)
.
-
I agree with Panic regarding fuel drop out from high volume but my thinking was more along the line of increasing volume by say adding a -8 or -10 fitting to the end of your plenum and then connecting any additional volume to this fitting. The idea is getting the volume to provide capacitance to the system, which will modify the resonance of the inlet tract, not increase the size of the inlet tract to a point that the inlet charge velocity drops so low that the fuel falls out of suspension. I have a mid 80s Yamaha two stroke dirt bike and they added inlet tract volume this way to dampen the intake track resonant frequency and also broaden the resonant curve.
Rex
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I agree with Panic regarding fuel drop out from high volume but my thinking was more along the line of increasing volume by say adding a -8 or -10 fitting to the end of your plenum and then connecting any additional volume to this fitting. The idea is getting the volume to provide capacitance to the system, which will modify the resonance of the inlet tract, not increase the size of the inlet tract to a point that the inlet charge velocity drops so low that the fuel falls out of suspension. I have a mid 80s Yamaha two stroke dirt bike and they added inlet tract volume this way to dampen the intake track resonant frequency and also broaden the resonant curve.
Rex
Yea Rex I was wondering if that would help I added one of those ''boost bottles'' to my 465 yamaha back in the early 80s also and it made a big difference in response
JL222
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Mmmmm; not for a supercharged four-stroke engine, I believe.
At least not according to
Maurice Brierley, who in his book, "Supercharging Cars and Motorcycles"
says that such a thing serves a useful function on a standard car
but in case of using it in the pressure manifold of supercharged engines
he calls it "quite comprehensible".
"...the inlet pipe is subject to regular pulsations caused by
the intermittent 'gulp' of each cylinder on it's induction stroke.
The frequency of these pulsations depends on the number
of cylinders, and on the RPM of the engine.
The latter is variable.
In case of the production car the closed ended
buffer chamber serves to produce 'aerodynamic fungus'.
This prevents the disposition of of liquid fuel on the walls of the bend...
...it is necessary to avoid this deposition in the interest of equable
distribution of the mixture to various cylinders...
...One of the reasons why one choke per cylinder is used
on high-performance un-supercharged engines is that the necessity
for this is avoided and equable distribution is assured without having to
make a compromise with the volumetric effeciency and hence the specific
power output...
... the inclusion of a buffer end
which is in effect a resonance chamber is to be avoided
in the case of a supercharged engine, where there is in any
case no excuse for it's use.
In case of a supercharged twin cylinder engine with one inlet stroke
per revolution there are 6000 pulses per minute inflicted on the pressure manifold
at 6000 RPM (which is 100 pulses per second), at 3000 RPM
it will be 50 pulses per second, and so on.
It can therefore be seen that a wave formation (similar to sound waves)
is forced on the pressure inlet pipe with frequency depending on the
number of cylinders and RPM.
In any given engine since the frequency varies with the RPM it is most
important that the pipe work does not include anything in the nature
of a possible resonance chamber design....
....it may often be easy and convenient but can sometimes
result in unwanted harmonics in the system..."
-
..
-
modify the resonance
I've been looking for a definitive answer to the question "does all buffer an storage volume have to be in the flow path?" for about 30 years, with no satisfactory answer so far...
So I guess I won't find it either within the next couple of months
.-)
.
So today we made a pop-up / blow-up / whatever...valve:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2c731404.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3618de47.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d4f535c8.jpg)
Of cause I have no clue if the spring pressure-range is right
but I'll test when the thing is up and running.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/59d8d1cd.jpg)
We don't have a mill, but just down the street there's a workshop with one.
They kind'a grew tired of us asking if we can use their mill,
so they just told us where they hide the key and let us use it as we please.
Good people !
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/91aeca58.jpg)
-
...and last night I painted the frame.
Nothing fancy: just a humble rattle-can job in the backroom.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/f9ab9be2.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/50f7959f.jpg)
..today I'll do as little sign-writing and ad some red stripes.
Then clear-coat tonight.
Busy, busy, busy: have an apointment with the dyno-guy next Wednesday (!)
.
-
modify the resonance
I've been looking for a definitive answer to the question "does all buffer an storage volume have to be in the flow path?" for about 30 years, with no satisfactory answer so far.
If the entry and exit tubes are both re-entrant, and in close proximity (separation distance < ID?), the surrounding plenum volume can be very large and irregularly shaped but hardly affect gas speed, and still damp pressure waves.
How to use a small line (as Rex suggests) and not get evil return waves?
This will take much R&D, but the obvious thought is a "trombone" in the small line leading to/from the boost bottle.
Panic your wearing out my dictionary, but keeping us on our toes and learning new words :-D
Adding a boost bottle would be a fairly simple thing to do and test and adding the ''trombone'' would be a way of varying the test.
My Yamaha was a 1981 and it was a simple change of the intake manifold which now had about a 1/2 in short tube leading to a small [ 1 1/2 by about 4 in ?] boost bottle] but the results were amazing.
JL222
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octane,
#1 Fuel Tank size :?? Riding to the Line,then running a Pass{Long or Short Course?} Then the Long ride back to the Pit's or Hopefully Impound area? 8-) Is a Long Way :oops:! I know the hard way. Good Luck and Go FASTER!
SEE YA ON THE SALT,
Kaz................
Octane, the above is true only at Bub?? as you can not ride your bike at an SCTA event anywhere but the race track.
-
Octane,
Looking at your pop off valve do you have some sort of O ring seal on the bottom of the pop off to make a seal? Or are you depending on strictly metal to metal seal? Either way you probably need to relieve the area that mates to the part with the two kidney shaped ports. The reason being is that if you are sealing by the large metal to metal surface of the pop off part over the section that has the kidney ports the opening pressure will be pretty much based upon the area of the kidney ports but the re-seating pressure will be based upon the area of the complete pop off, this could cause some instability with the pop off valve. If you relieve the botto of the pop off out to its edge then the opening and closing pressure will be pretty close.
Rex
-
Thanks Rex.
It does indeed have a sealing by means of a rubber-seal in between the parts
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/04886c55.jpg)
I've never done such a thing before so I just sort'a modelled it after what I have on my Honda
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2455be3d.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/874e230f.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/57ac7103.jpg)
...and by looking at a few pics I found, like this
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/78028889.jpg)
I do not quite understand what you're saying about 're-sealing'.
The pop-up isn't really a 'function'-part , but a safety-devise that
only comes into play if (heaven forbid) some really nasty thing happens,
like stuck valves or a backfire...that will stop the bike fastlike.
I'm not sure why I should be concerned about 're-sealing' / 'instability'.
..or maybe I'm getting you wrong, which I am sure is not because of your explanation,
but because of my far from perfect understanding of the English language.
-
Octane,
Looking at the more detailed pictures of your valve the rubber seal around the outer diameter of the poppet means that any surge in manifold pressure will push against the complete area of the poppet less the area of the seal diameter. This is good as it will make the valve responsive to any manifold "event" that could cause a problem. I understand what you mean about it being really a safety device and a one time only function.
Looking at the valve you did for your Honda, did it ever have occasion to function? An additional thing that you want to look at is the length of the hole that the center shaft goes thru vs. the diameter. On the valve for the Indian it looks like the length is probably 2-3 times the diameter of the bolt, which is good, whereas on the Honda valve the ratio is probably less than 1:1. This can cause the poppet to lock onto the shaft (bolt) and be sticky. Every try to slide a tight fitting washer over a smooth shaft? you have to keep the washer exactly square with the shaft or it will stick. Kind of like the old Volkswagen jacks. (really dating myself there!)
Any how I am just "Kibittizing" as usual. Again, looking forward to seeing you at the BUB.
Rex
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Octane...
Name's Lars
.-)
Any how I am just "Kibittizing" as usual.
No, Rex; your comments and advise are highly appreciated !
New cylinder studs are in:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/74471cba.jpg)
'Flattened' the heads back
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1abf3524.jpg)
Pistons are in. Cylinders are on. No pictures; lowering the cylinders down over 4 rings, all by yourself,
is a...erh...challenge in itself, and doesn't leave a free hand to take photos.
( Aaaaand I forgot about it, when after spending half an hour with one particularly
un-coorperative cylinder/rings...I noticed I had forgot to put on the cylinder-base-gasket first....GRRR!)
Checked if there were space for the valves (upwards movement. It's a sidevalver, remember) by putting this gum on the valves,
assembling the top and turn the engine:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/508e1c56.jpg)
...and checked for clearance around the new bigger exhaust valves:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/58380ce7.jpg)
...which, as you can see, there was,
except on the other cylinder/head there wasn't,
so this here idjiout squashed the head, turning the engine.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ab602fb0.jpg)
...but it really didn't matter much, as I had to re-work the head anyway,
and BTW these heads are made of marshmellowuminum.
Just before oil-pump goes on:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ea6572a6.jpg)
Just what an INDIAN named The Salt Cracker need for a gear-nob.
A friend dropped by with this magnificent gift
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9726adb9.jpg)
...made of pure Bonneville salt.
OK; the last part wasn't entirely true.
The nob is made in one of them 3-D 'printing' wonder-machines,
and is made of ABS-plastic.
-
This is really a great effort, and you have a LOT of people worldwide rooting for you...
Nice work!
-
This is really a great effort, and you have a LOT of people worldwide rooting for you...
Nice work!
Thank you very much Ralt !
-
Frame painted.
Engine installed. Need to install clutch and a few other things
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/df539fb0.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c0bf0cf0.jpg)
A couple of months back I rebuild the blower with new bearings, oil-seals etc.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7b118656.jpg)
Problem:
The two bearing at the pulley-side are in NO bearing catalogue whatsoever. Period. Tried all known sources.
Everywhere I was told: "No such thing".
Don't recall the measurement but they were truly wacky.
Even more wacky: one of the original bearings didn't really fit the blower.
Stuck out of its housing (!)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4bb4a324.jpg)
Here's what I had to do;
insert a 'ring' to make the housing
accept a new bearing of (smaller outside diameter) standard size.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9eb81fad.jpg)
Had to be an 'angular contact' bearing;
(because of the bevel-cut gearwheels at the other end)
with rubber seals;
(to prevent the pressure from the blower escaping through
the bearing. BTW: they are double-row as you simply can't get single-rows with rubber sealing))
Had the same problem with the second bearing on that end
(left side on the photo above)
but the other way around: the hole was too small,
so the diameter was machined bigger to accept the
bearing mentioned above.
I'm sure this blower was NOT build to be disassembled and put back together
Putting it together I had to mount the bevel-cut gearwheels which are press fit unto the shafts.
Now pressing them on ; one has to make absofåginglutely sure the two shafts/'rotor's
are positioned precisely in a 90deg. angel to each other.
If not; they will collide once rotated. So what you see below is a jig, made to hold the two shafts/'rotor's in such a position.
Holes for the shafts.
Aluminum-"Tits"screwed to the plate goes into the holes in the 'rotor's:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4daba39f.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/f70e735d.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/6f206151.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/22b0684f.jpg)
Finally got around to do the last finishing touches and
put the tiny huffer back together properly today:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c2439d6b.jpg)
Gooooodness; there' SO many small things to do !!!!!!!!!!
-
WOW!!!!!!! now that's building a "bike"
-
nice motor plate.
what is cubic inches of blower?
how many people coming over with you?
whatever your port of entry, i imagine you'll be crossing ohio
on interstate 80 or 90. we are at interstate 77 ,midway to both (actually 5 mins. from 77 and interstate 480) and may be able to put you up. many tools and access to great (&quick) machinists and welder, if needed.
diane and i are leaving for the bub sat. 8/22 at the crack.
will be headed southwest, though not direct to salt.
franey
-
...but it really didn't matter much, as I had to re-work the head anyway,
and BTW these heads are made of marshmellowuminum.
That's funny, i thought that Indian heads were made of Cheesium
http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Cheesium
G
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Lars,
Your project is a pleasure to follow. The photography is outstanding and your work is artfull. I'm going to miss this thread when you are done.
I'd like to make some comments on your supercharger. First is the translation of the type of gears that drive the rotors. The mechanics here call them helical. Bevel cut gears allow the direction of the shafts to angle in a different direction (most commonally 90 degrees).
It looks like one of the gears is keyed on the rotor. The other one must be a interference fit on the shaft? I have only worked on the Roots type blowers that were used on Detroit Diesels. Both rotors were keyed to the rotors and were adjusted (timed) by moving the gear in or out on the shaft which turns the shaft (lobes) in relation to the the other shaft (lobes). The movement of the gear is positioned by shims ( I think I saw shims in your picture of blower parts). I believe the shims were placed between the bearing and the blower case. This is the accurate way to adjust the lobe clearance easily. The clearances were checked by long feeler gauges through the discharge port. You probably don't have any specifications on the clearances but the clearances should be checked both ways with a slight drag on the driven rotor. If you could find a repair manual on a Detroit diesel 3 cylinder/ 51 series engine it may give you some information that would help. It would seem if the clearances were tighter at the discharge area it would pump more pressure. If you would like, I can look for some information here.
Harvey
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Octane,
Although our economic downturn at my day job has forced me to not to run the streamliner this year, I may still fly out to be with "Rock Salt" and the "Dream Catcher" Bonneville crew for the film. I do have some special cams that my father made for their supercharged scout that I will toss in my bag.
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Hi Franey
nice motor plate.
what is cubic inches of blower?
It's 300cc = 18.3 cubic inches.
I run 1 :1.8 ratio crank/blower pulley drive
how many people coming over with you?
One guy is going with me and then I'll meet up with
5 or 6 guys from the US, and one guy's coming over from U.K.
whatever your port of entry, i imagine you'll be crossing ohio
on interstate 80 or 90. we are at interstate 77 ,midway to both (actually 5 mins. from 77 and interstate 480) and may be able to put you up. many tools and access to great (&quick) machinists and welder, if needed.
Thanks you very much for your kind offer. That's very generous of you !!!
...but the plan is to fly in to Salt Lake City and also air-cargo the bike to that city.
Thanks
Lars
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Lars,
Your project is a pleasure to follow. The photography is outstanding and your work is artfull. I'm going to miss this thread when you are done.
Thanks Harvey !!!
I'd like to make some comments on your supercharger. First is the translation of the type of gears that drive the rotors. The mechanics here call them helical. Bevel cut gears allow the direction of the shafts to angle in a different direction (most commonally 90 degrees).
Sorry. You're you're right. Thanks for pointing it out.
As you may know: English is not my mother tongue
and some times I mix up all these technical terms.
It looks like one of the gears is keyed on the rotor. The other one must be a interference fit on the shaft? I have only worked on the Roots type blowers that were used on Detroit Diesels. Both rotors were keyed to the rotors and were adjusted (timed) by moving the gear in or out on the shaft which turns the shaft (lobes) in relation to the the other shaft (lobes). The movement of the gear is positioned by shims ( I think I saw shims in your picture of blower parts). I believe the shims were placed between the bearing and the blower case. This is the accurate way to adjust the lobe clearance easily.
I understand well what you're saying about shimming (in effect moving the one gear(-->shaft-->lobe) is relation to the other
but I'm afraid it doesn't apply to this here blower.
It's actually very crudely put together and apparently consist of parts that must have been
originally made for some other application, and then used for this thing, probably to save
production costs:
..one of the helical gears do have a provision (key-slot(?)) for a woodruff key
but the shaft does not.(!)
..both shafts have a thread ("outside" the gears) but only one (!) of them has a nut to go on the thread
So there is no way to 'adjust' by shimming , the lobe clearance.
One just have to get it right when assembling.
It's little difficult to explain but, I can try:
the 'shims' you see on the photo (at the pulley-end) are used at the other end of the blower
to hold the bearings at the right position in relation to the 'neck' on the shaft
and the body of the blower.
The clearances were checked by long feeler gauges through the discharge port. You probably don't have any specifications on the clearances but the clearances should be checked both ways with a slight drag on the driven rotor. If you could find a repair manual on a Detroit diesel 3 cylinder/ 51 series engine it may give you some information that would help. It would seem if the clearances were tighter at the discharge area it would pump more pressure. If you would like, I can look for some information here.
Harvey
... no I don't have any spec's, just checked for even clearance with a feeler gauge
and I have been in contact with another guy who's been rebuilding one of them here thingies
and listened to his experiences.
Thanks !
Lars
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Octane,
Although our economic downturn at my day job has forced me to not to run the streamliner this year, I may still fly out to be with "Rock Salt" and the "Dream Catcher" Bonneville crew for the film.
That would be great Rocky ! Hope to see you there.
I do have some special cams that my father made for their supercharged scout that I will toss in my bag.
Fantastic. In what sense are they different from the originals ?
-
hope to see you at bonneville.
franey
-
Love the Indian Lars,
Just read the build from end to end and loved it. A friend rebuilt a similar (although larger) blower here and had the same bearing issues you did. he too made a ring and machined the case to suit common bearings. Don't sweat your English, it works just fine for me.
Good luck at Bub, the help and comeraderie you receive here is nothing compared to when out on the white stuff.
-
Octane, The cams have a longer duration and a special off ramp that my father ground for their supercharged attempt in 53.
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Octane,
I just noticed that you have no drain on your plenum?Might be an idea to fit a drain in case fuel puddles on bottom of plenum while idling? would be easy to clear a richness instead of trying to let engine clear itself? Just a thought? I imagine you are working overtime doing final assembly?
Best of luck!
Rocky
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Octane,
I just noticed that you have no drain on your plenum?Might be an idea to fit a drain in case fuel puddles on bottom of plenum while idling? would be easy to clear a richness instead of trying to let engine clear itself? Just a thought? I imagine you are working overtime doing final assembly?
Best of luck!
Rocky
sounds like a good idea.
now you just about have to put a drain in.
murphy says if you don't ; you'll wish you had.
franey
-
..
-
Thanks guys for reminding me !
.-)
...but I do indeed have a drain.
More on that a little later.
Got the clutch installed. Took for ever;
had to file each friction-plate to make them
fit the 'studs'. Remember this is a seventy year old engine
that isn't exactly made with precision machinery.
Rebuild the ignition:
On the right: crappy old stuff
On the left: fine new stuff
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0012-1.jpg)
..installed new distributor-shaft bushings
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0013.jpg)
..and the Electronic igition (http://www.indianpartseurope.com/ignition.html)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0018.jpg)
Fabbing the bower-drive set-up:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0014.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0017.jpg)
...and the gear-shift and a bunch of other things
So time to take the beast out:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0026.jpg)
If you look closely you'll see the drain , a small brass thingy
at the lowest point of the intake/plenum
Kodak-moments:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0065.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0064.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0037.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0038.jpg)
....and then back to do the billion smalstuff still to be done.
-
Love the Indian Lars,
Just read the build from end to end and loved it. A friend rebuilt a similar (although larger) blower here and had the same bearing issues you did. he too made a ring and machined the case to suit common bearings. Don't sweat your English, it works just fine for me.
Good luck at Bub, the help and comeraderie you receive here is nothing compared to when out on the white stuff.
Thank you for your kind words Rob !
-
Octane! Ya wouldn't want to take my wife in trade for your bike , would ya? Just had to ask! That is one of the three most impressive bikes I've seen in a long time! Good luck in your endevors with it! Go fast, and ride safe!! Crow
-
Thank you kindly Crow ! ! !
On the trading matter:
I've posted pics of the bike; now you post pics of your wife and then we'll talk business.
.-)
.
-
Lars, as always more great workmenship. I want to see it with the salt in the back ground, what a combination of beauty. Again thanks for sharing.
:cheers:
-
Lar's just wondering what your plans are for the front fender. As you will get a lot of salt spray even when the salt is very dry. Clean up is another chapter that has been discussed on the site before, it's in the archives. The cleanup of the bike, trailer and support vehicles are critical and can't wait till you get it back to Denmark. You will get a lot of help from others on the site but plan on it in advance.
-
Lars --
There's also a concern about overheating with salt packed into the fins of the cylinder and cylinder head, especially with the direction they run.
I had a Model A pit car for year that never overheated until the radiator filled with salt at BV one year. Just something to think about.
Stan
-
Lar's, awsome build. Very impressive. I do have one thing bothering me though. I don't have a rule book handy but, are those exposed blower drive sprockets gonna pass tech? Since an exposed counter shaft sprocket would not pass, I'm wondering about the blower drives.
Look forward to seeing your bike on the salt
Larry
-
Lar's just wondering what your plans are for the front fender. As you will get a lot of salt spray even when the salt is very dry. ......
Lars --
There's also a concern about overheating with salt packed into the fins of the cylinder and cylinder head, especially with the direction they run.
I had a Model A pit car for year that never overheated until the radiator filled with salt at BV one year. Just something to think about.
Stan
Thanks Glen and Stan for pointing this out.
Initially I hadn't planed on putting one on.
I'd say that maybe on third, to one half, of the bike I saw at last years BUB
didn't have a front-fender....so ?!
Anyway I guess you're right, so I found this fender that used to sit on my BSA cafe-racer
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4f991e8b.jpg)
..so I'll adapt that to my front forks.
Lar's, awsome build. Very impressive.
Thanks kindly Larry !...but it really isn't.
Compared to a lot of the stuff I see in this forum,
this is ever so insignificant.
I do have one thing bothering me though. I don't have a rule book handy but, are those exposed blower drive sprockets gonna pass tech? Since an exposed counter shaft sprocket would not pass, I'm wondering about the blower drives.
Me too
.-)
Thanks for pointing this out Larry !
I can not seam to find anything in the AMA rule book on the subject.
The Special Construction Class (that I run) -section doesn't mention anything about
belts, chains or chain-guards in general or blower belts in particular.
The closest I can find is the this, in the Modified Frame Class section:
5.C. Chain/Belt Guard
Minimum length of the belt guard is 1½ times the total span
and a minimum of 1/4" wider than the belt.
Primary cover is mandatory.
Belt/chain cover must extend from center of the primary to the
outer most edge of the rear sprocket.
Even though this is not for a blower belt/guard
I've used that as a guide-line, in that the guard
is (more than) ' 1/4" wider than the belt '.
(...and BTW; I'm doing a chain guard as well.)
Guess now would be a good time to consult Tech. Inspection
to make sure I'm doing this right.
A bit of progress here:
Doing the wiring
and doing the oil-lines by modifying the original lines to my bike
by cutting and soldering and bending etc.,
and experimenting with a different seat
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/0bc9b522.jpg)
Thanks all for your interest and for helping me out !!!
Lars
-
I would most certainly run a front fender to keep the salt spray down for you and the bike........................Check with Drew regarding belt/chain/pulley covers ......it's a long way to come, to get turned down in Tech. for a no run.
-
I would most certainly run a front fender to keep the salt spray down for you and the bike.
OK. I'm listening !
Check with Drew regarding belt/chain/pulley covers ......it's a long way to come, to get turned down in Tech. for a no run.
It certainly is.
Checked with the ever helpful Drew;
my set-up is just fine.
One great thing about doing stuff one has never done before
is that one gets to buy tools one has never had before,
like tube-bending tools
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/0b1f73f8.jpg)
Note that 'trumpet'-shaped spring thingy.(Hard to see on the pic, but it's a wound spring)
I'm sure this is old news to you but I've never seen such a thing before.
Goes around the tube and you can hand-bend it without 'kinking it.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/519ede9b.jpg)
It actually works surprising well.
I bought the tools for making the oil-lines.
This is the initial set-up.
The clear hose (with a bit of heat-protection on) is so that I can check the flow
for the test running.
Will change that later
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3a916e90.jpg)
Did the clutch (yep: foot operated) -release arm
Not the most elegant solution, but it works
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/6af90046.jpg)
I'm behind schedule but catching up.
Expected start up early coming week.
Then 10 days to work out bugs and finish a dozen small things.
Then dyno-test.
Then two weeks tuning the engine and dyno-testing again.
Once in a while I sit on it and go
BROOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/8ebb704c.jpg)
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Hey Lars
It's really a great build
I was just at a friends place, he works for a gut called Jim Parker, in Australia who does Indian resto's.
I hope with all your new bending gear you are not planning to use copper lines as they can split with vibration.
Cheers
Gray
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LARS----you, the bike, the keds, the BUILD---to perfect!!!!!!!!!!!! :cheers:
-
Even your vacuum cleaner is color coordinated! That took some planing! Love the whole everything about your build and bike. Go fast, but safe! Crow
-
The bike looks great, Lars.....I look forward to seeing it on the salt at the BUB....................................
Remember.....regarding, number plates and numbers ....."number plates... 7 inches high and 8 inches wide"
"Numbers... 3 inches high and 1 inch wide......................................................................................
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Fabulous machine. I'm in envy of your skills!
Just a couple of things I can't help notice about the exhaust that might save some grief once on the salt. The rules for BUB, in section 2.B exhaust, state that "Exhaust must be directed away from the racing surface, rider, and rear tire". It looks like your pipes point generally down toward the ground in the pictures. If they really are it will probably be a "fix it before you can run" gig in tech. Which might be a real problem once you are there. :|
Also, just a personal thing with me but something you might want to think about is the sever slash cut at the end of the pipes. It looks cool, but if you were to go down and tangle with one of them it could turn into a big hypodermic needle and easily punch through some part of your body that you really would prefer to keep unmodified. :-o
-
"Numbers... 3 inches high and 1 inch wide......................................................................................
[/quote]
i believe class lettering has same parameters for '09.
franey
-
1" High on class numbering if its the same as SCTA regs
I often go Brooooom Too!
-
Class letters/numbers need to be readable by the starter, mostly, while vehicle numbers need to be visible to the folks in the timing tower. Think of it that way. Bigger is fine, and for sure -- make them of a color that contrasts well with the bodywork of the car, and also think about not having them the same color as the background (the Salt) for even easier reading at a distance/at speed.
-
THE timing trailer at the salt is 800 to 1000 ft from the courses and we can't read any numbers. The starters tell us whats running on each course. I don't know what the distance for USFRA or Bub have but it's a safety issue if yoy are close enough to read the numbers.
-
Go, Lars, Go!
1957S/VG
-
Lars - Great Build !!! Haven't been on line for some time so I missed this build diary. I will have to skip 2009 due to the economy but I am now building the Gen2 Timecycles Flyer for 2010. I have moved up a few years to a 46 Triumph. Go very fast and take that "soft" record with style!
Cheers - Timecycles
-
Octane 98,
What's up? Its been pretty quiet. Have you been back to work? Gremlin in the oil pump?
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Lars! What's up with the bike?
-
Lars, hopefully you are on your way to B'ville. We look forward to seeing you and the Indian.
-
Lars isn't on his way to Bonneville unfortunately. Had word from a friend in Denmark to say Lars broke a bearing on the blower and he is also extremely busy workwise. That added to the fact that Rocky isn't going to make it he going to give it a miss. But he will be there next year.
-
Lars, I'm sure your disappointment is very deep and we'll miss seeing you this year. Hang in there, don't give up, and we'll see you next year!!
By the way, I wore your T-shirt the first day of racing at Speedweek, so, now that your shirt has been on the salt, guess you're just going to have to show up yourself!! :-D The shirt looks very nice on all that white!! It's one of my very favorites and I'm taking good care of it! :cheers:
See you on the salt!
Lynda
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LARS----MAJOR BUMER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :cry:
-
LARS, when LYNDA wears your shirt, you are well represented.
We will be watching you until next year, ONLY if you keep posting.
Don't forget us and we certainly won't forget you.
Chin UP, Fellow.
FREUD
-
I first met Lars at BUB 2008 when he showed up at Bonneville , all the way from Finland to help me finish my Indian streamliner and try to get a record at BUB. He immediately caught Salt Fever and in the past year has raised the bar for accomplisments and workmanship that has added a sharpness to everyone's foot step on my Bonneville crew and then he began a build of his own Indian as everyone has followed during the year.
Unfortunately, economic downturns have forced most of our team to wait until next year to man another try with our streamliner and various other indians and teams for some friendly competition amongst Indian tribes at BUB 2010. As it stands now, I am three years from retiring and have lost my day job of 28 years, sure I have plenty of time now to finish, but alas, funding is tight at best.
Lars has spoken to me some what about superchargers and oil pump gremlins and I feel confident, he will be back here soon amd we will be at BUB 2010.
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Ironic isn't it, how the smallest part can stop you.
I had my ticket in my hand to Bonneville in 2006 and my MuZ660 Skorpion ready to go when a van pulled out in front of me in the rain when I was testing the new chain. Took me two years to find a new frame for it.
Beautiful bike you're building! I am re-inspired!
-
Thank you, thank you, thank you
all for your kind words and encouragement !!!!!!
Highly appreciated !
Terribly sorry for not keeping you up-dated !
A special tanks to Lynda for honouring me by wearing my t-shirt. Thanks!
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well no, things did indeed not go according to plans.
A rather unpleasant mixture of technical problems, private personal problems
and work-money-blahblah-related "stuff" brought the whole thing to a screeching halt....auch!
Now I won't bore you with wining about my personal ...erh...stuff,
just mention an observation: trouble never seams to come 'alone',
they tend to come in droves, don't they !?
Aaaaaaaaaaaanyway; I'm back in the workshop today
for the first time in many a week, and I'm looking forward
to getting started again, and enjoy working on getting
the bike ready for 2010.
(DARN; reminds me; just prior to the melt-down I had ordered a bunch of
t-shirts with the caption: The Salt Cracker Indian....etc.....2009.
Ha ha; guess I can sell them as "vintage" )
Yes I did run into trouble with the oil-pump.
The supposedly freshly rebuild thing just didn't function quite right.
There was this un-even resistance/grinding.
Turned out to be rather complicated but
here the 'shot' story, leaving out details that would
take me longer to explain that to actually rectify
.-)
Measuring on the cogwheels (is that the word?) showed that they were kind of woobling
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3.jpg)
Measured out the shafts and wheels:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4.jpg)
and realised that the cogwheels were out of true , thickness-wise
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-1.jpg)
and were grinding against the 'body' in an un-even manner
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-1.jpg)
Took for AGES to get the 'body'-surface even AND the wheel-surfaces even
AND to get the right tolerance between cogwheels and body.
-
That done, I then did a perfect job of ruining the blower, beyond any hope
of making it work properly.
Just wanted to 'adjust' the darn thing, but naaaaa.
Again; explaining how, will take me longer than to actually do it,
but let's just say that the bloody thing was NOT build to be disassembled
and assembled back again.
Drove me nugging futs.
Now where could I find a new one.
Remember this thing was made for a special edition
mid-nineties 'Japanese-market-only' mini-car !!!
The Supercharged Subaru Vivio.
Searched the World Wide inter-Web for days.
Japan was not an easy place to searh. My Japanese is kind of rusty.
As a few ones had been exported to (English-speaking) Singapore
I searched there. Tried contacting the Singapore Vivio Club etc.
Knowing a few ones had 'escaped' out of Japan,
I tried Australian / New Zealand Ebay, car dismantlers,
car-part trader web-sites, car-clubs etc etc.
spread the search to USA, Canada and Europe
....and FINALLY obtained a phone-number to a
guy that maybe, just maybe, had something.
..."Hi there. Any chance you have a AMR300 Aisin supercharger
from a mid-nineties Subaru Vivio ?"
..."Sure. How many do you you want ?"
..."Huh ???"
..."Yeah, I have a shelve full of them"
..."All righty...Give me a couple then"
The guys place turned out to be right here in Denmark,
two hours drive from my workshop!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The gods of speed moves in mysterious way.
The blowers looked like sh*t
but turned out to be in absolutely brilliant condition
and really just needed a 'flush', to remove to old grease and
new grease in the bearings was pressed in
by carefully opening the sealing
and (on the one where the sealing could not be removed)
using a syringe to force in my trusty
air-plane-spec grease
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4303.jpg)
till it came out around the sealing
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4304.jpg)
..and a thorough cleaning and paint-job did the rest.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0421.jpg)
Who says it shouldn't look good !
Not me.
.-)
All settled then, right?
Nope!
I my happy frenzy I hadn't noticed that
the good folks at Aisin had, in their infinite wisdom,
decided to make a few modifications
during the production-run.
My two new and splendid looking blowers
turned out to be build as an upside-down mirror-image (does that make sense?)
of my original blower.
Great!...now the intake/plenum didn't fit
and nor did my carb-to-blower manifold.
Uargh!
This where I am now.
Better get working. and I also have
like 1200 forum-posts from this years BUB to read.
I sincerely hope you all had a GREAT time on the salt
and that you'll show up next year so I'll get a chance to meet you !!!
-
octane what would it cost to get one of those little blowers sent to the U S calif. thanks willie buchta
-
Hi Willie.
(If I got the weight right) the price of sending is approx. 66 $US.
The price for the blower is approx. 190 $US .
You've got plans ?
-
checked w/ bub reg. trailer 2x during the meet.
sorry you didn't make it.
franey
-
Its nice to read that you are doing OK and working on your bike. There were some new Indian riders at the BUB meet and they were having a good time. The tribe was well represented. Hope to see you next year.
-
hey lars-sad to hear you never made the meeting-but kind of glad you were able to erase some problems in the workshop instead of having trouble on the salt-
your thread is still a source of major inspiration-keep at 'em.
for my birthday this year we went to the international indian rally in scotland,we took a couple of harleys and i had my 47 chief- :cheers:
as always ,on the international rallies,we met some great folk,and especially the fins,who had ridden their aged iron over 2700 miles!!-you vikings are crazy!- :evil:
we met some great people and had some great times at bonneville too-
best wishes for the new year-p.j.
-
Lars can you give the list an update on the bike. Have you had it running yet?
Best Regards
Joe
Melbourne, Australia
-
Lars,
So great to hear your words on a screen instead of thru a haze in the sweat lodge.
I moved the streamliner to Minnesota so the contigent up there can work in a secret CNC machine shop to make the liner tech ready, while I keep the engine and redo the cam profile to prepare for trials this summer up there.
My thoughts have been answered.
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Apologies for my resent absence !
checked w/ bub reg. trailer 2x during the meet.
sorry you didn't make it.
franey
Thanks Franey !
Its nice to read that you are doing OK and working on your bike. There were some new Indian riders at the BUB meet and they were having a good time. The tribe was well represented. Hope to see you next year.
Likewise ! Thanks!
Glad to know the tribe was well represented.
hey lars-sad to hear you never made the meeting-but kind of glad you were able to erase some problems in the workshop instead of having trouble on the salt-
your thread is still a source of major inspiration-keep at 'em.
for my birthday this year we went to the international indian rally in scotland,we took a couple of harleys and i had my 47 chief- :cheers:
as always ,on the international rallies,we met some great folk,and especially the fins,who had ridden their aged iron over 2700 miles!!-you vikings are crazy!- :evil:
we met some great people and had some great times at bonneville too-
best wishes for the new year-p.j.
Thanks ! ..and best wishes to you !
Lars can you give the list an update on the bike. Have you had it running yet?
Best Regards
Joe
Melbourne, Australia
Sadly; no...sort of...and yes....not really
I had it all ready, fuel, ignition (what more do one need?!)....it did say PHOURRFFF and then the oil poured out
of those f&%¤g silly oil-line joints , so I've just re-worked every part of them.
Before that, because of the new blower being slightly different, I had to rework/modify
both parts of the intake "plenum", the blower-body, the blower mount, the blower to carb manifold
and the belt cover.
Getting ready to get it fired in a short while ( goodness; I've said that before...several times..urgh)
Lars,
So great to hear your words on a screen instead of thru a haze in the sweat lodge.
I moved the streamliner to Minnesota so the contigent up there can work in a secret CNC machine shop to make the liner tech ready, while I keep the engine and redo the cam profile to prepare for trials this summer up there.
My thoughts have been answered.
Rocky
1957S/VG
Thanks, my man.
Good to know the liner is making progress.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/SIDE-1.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/LS.jpg)
Proper update to follow soon........promise!
-
Lars, its great to see that you are back to working on your bike. It looks good.
-
Good to have you back Lars! Try not to stay gone so long this time!
Lynda
-
Lars, you and your scooter just reinforce International bonding.
Good job !
FREUD
-
Is this the newest blower and repaired oil pump? Or still the first version?
I think Wobbly Walrus is going to attend the Indian Uprising BUB 2010 this year.
Rocky
1957 S/VG
-
The walrus imagines midnight drumming at the bend in the road...a circle of scantily clad guys from Scandanavia, New Zealand, and everywhere else...dancing around a big smoky fire...fueled by a burning triumph. The insurrection. I will hide my bike.
In seriousness, maybe you'all can talk Delvene and Co. into putting the Indian stories into the BUB meet program. They have a different theme each year and the insurrection would be a good one.
-
It’s all progress, good to see! As my build partner says “…we haven’t built it unless we build it twice.”
Here’s some bike porn to ease the nerves :lol:
An Indian riding photographer friend travels to the salt with us each year. He got a web site up and running a few months ago. Some great tribal pics in these galleries…
http://frankkletschkus.moonfruit.com/#/speed/4533837790
-
Hi Lars,
I just read your build thread from the start. It's soooo typical of most builds of racing bikes and cars. Everything looks and feels just right, but when you fire it up and run it down the road for the first time, all those nasty demons show themselves.
As always, I am impressed by your craftsmanship and sense of style.
I really hope you can make it to Bonneville this year.
Keep smiling, --EP
-
Thank you for the up-date Lars... she's looking good mate! Please keep us informed when you start testing.
All the best.....
Joe
Melbourne, Australia
-
Lars, its great to see that you are back to working on your bike. It looks good.
Thank you WW !
Good to have you back Lars! Try not to stay gone so long this time!
Lynda
Lynda !...promise !
Lars, you and your scooter just reinforce International bonding.
Good job !
FREUD
Thanks freud !
Is this the newest blower and repaired oil pump? Or still the first version?
I think Wobbly Walrus is going to attend the Indian Uprising BUB 2010 this year.
Rocky
1957 S/VG
This is the new blower and repaired oil-pump.
Would be delighted to meet WW!
The walrus imagines midnight drumming at the bend in the road...a circle of scantily clad guys from Scandanavia, New Zealand, and everywhere else...dancing around a big smoky fire...fueled by a burning triumph. The insurrection. I will hide my bike.
LOL
In seriousness, maybe you'all can talk Delvene and Co. into putting the Indian stories into the BUB meet program. They have a different theme each year and the insurrection would be a good one.
You listening Rocky !?
It’s all progress, good to see! As my build partner says “…we haven’t built it unless we build it twice.”
..or tree times, or......
Here’s some bike porn to ease the nerves :lol: ;An
Indian riding photographer friend travels to the salt with us each year. He got a web site up and running a few months ago. Some great tribal pics in these galleries…
http://frankkletschkus.moonfruit.com/#/speed/4533837790
Great stuff. Thanks!
Hi Lars,
I just read your build thread from the start. It'ssooooo typical of most builds of racing bikes and cars. Everything looks and feels just right, but when you fire it up and run it down the road for the first time, all those nasty demons show themselves.
As always, I am impressed by your craftsmanship and sense of style.
I really hope you can make it to Bonneville this year.
Keep smiling, --EP
Will do!
..and thanks a lot for your kind words Piloto !
Thank you for the up-date Lars... she's looking good mate! Please keep us informed when you start testing.
All the best.....
Joe
Melbourne, Australia
Thanks !
Yep; you'll be the first to know.
No big update yet.
Have been too busy working, which is bad as I don't have time for this stuff,
and good 'cause I'll make some money so I can do this stuff
.-)
I'm off from work starting Tuesday, so hopefully the beast will be ready
for start-up shortly.
Have spend a few nights trying to learn a new skill;
TIG alu-welding: CLICK (http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,7606.0.html)
as Kenneth, who put in a LOT of work actually doing the alu-welding
has left the project.....so guess I'll just have to learn it myself, won't I !?
.
-
Lars,
I'm listening,
Rocky
-
Time for an update:
nothing spectacular , been doing smaaaaal stuff ... a LOT of small stuff ...so here comes some of it.
If you read this, and you hear the dreaded sound of "forehead-hitting-PC-keyboard" ,
it's because I've bored you to sleep.
Of cause I can't use standard cables, so I've been doing cables for the throttle
and the manually adjusted ignition-timing ( in left-hand handle ).
This is most probably trivial stuff for you guys but here's how I do it:
..drag the cable through the nipple ( is that the term ?)
and spread it out
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a-1.jpg)
..solder it from the 'back' first ( to keep the solder from running down the cable rendering it un-bendable)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b-1.jpg)
...then the other side
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c.jpg)
...and file it down into shape
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/e.jpg)
..all the while making sure I get the correct lenghts
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/f.jpg)
..and incorporating adjusters
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/g.jpg)
Made a bracket for the engine-off switch ( must be able to use it without hand leaving handlebar)
and the ignition shut off switch activated by lanyard required for the fuel class
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/x6.jpg)
What the hell is this:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/x1.jpg)
...well that's just me trying to get the right shape for a bracket that attaches
behind the engine side-cover. Couldn't really measure anything up in there
so it was trail and error, cutting and adding cardboard till I got the right shape
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/x2.jpg)
...it'll hold the oil catch tank:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/x3.jpg)
...picking up the oil-mist from the air-vent in the crank house and the oil-pump
that I have added.
Both have one-way valves.
The oil-tank also vents to this tank
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/x4.jpg)
Cut an instrument panel
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-3.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-3.jpg)
..and polished it up:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-2.jpg)
..untill I realized that maybe it wasn't such a bright (pun intended) idea
to ride this bike staring into a mirror reflecting the Utah sun ..!
so I glass-bead blasted it and mounted the rev-counter and boot-gauge
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4-2.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5.jpg)
...they show the voltage until given a proper input.
Nifty, as I run no generator but rely on the charge of the battery.
Bored a hole in a bolt
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a-2.jpg)
..heli-coiled a thread in the intake
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b-2.jpg)
..inserted the bold from the inside
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c-1.jpg)
..and thereby had a place to mount the tube for the boost measuring devise
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/e-2.jpg)
Now suddenly I had a bunch of wires to fix up
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1el.jpg)
...and realized that I probably wouldn't remember a thing about them in a few weeks,
so I made a diagram to bring with me
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2el.jpg)
Made a new sear-pan
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1sde.jpg)
...that I'll bring Monday to this old upholstery guy who did my BSA seat
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2sde.jpg)
Kind'a funny story about him; when I called, him back then to have my BSA seat done
he asked me where my workshop was located and I told him the address.
10 minutes later his car came to a screeching halt outside the workshop door
and this guy came in all exited: turns out that when he got his first job doing upholstery
back in the late fifties it was in MY workshop. He worked right here for seven years
doing car upholstery.
No one around anymore to do the TIG alu welding so I had to learn to do it myself.
I had priceless help from some great guys on this forum ( in the How-To section )
THANKS guys !!!
Practiced by laying like a hundred feet of weld on scrap alu
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/b3.jpg)
..then practiced welding tubes to a flat surface
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/b1.jpg)
...till I finally got to a point where I could do a semi-decent weld
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/b2.jpg)
All for the sake of being able to do a combined intake (that will later have a bigger filter)
and thingy to keep my knee from interfering with the throttle mechanism
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/a16.jpg)
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/a18.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-3.jpg)
There's a story to that INDIAN RACING "air-horn" thingy:
During my first and only visit to Bonneville in 2008 as member of the Dreamcatcher crew
I was given that thingy by crew-member Lyle Landstrom of Landström Foundry (http://landstromsfoundry.com/).
First time I ever owned an INDAN part.
It was at that moment the voices in my head demanded me to go home,
build an INDIAN LSR bike and bring it to the Salt
.-)
..so I really needed to incorporate it on to the bike somewhere.
Besides all this, the bike looks it's old self:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-5.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-4.jpg)
Engine start-up expected in a few days ( knock on wood ) .
I'm ALL exited.
You'll be the first to know.
-
Another great update Lars.
Its the final details that take the longest.
As I read along, I keep thinking that your build diary would make a great book.
Cheers,
Scott
-
That is one sweet looking bike you're building. I would LOVE to have one just like that to ride on the street!
You wrote, "It was at that moment the voices in my head demanded me to go home,
build an INDIAN LSR bike and bring it to the Salt"
Good idea. Can't fight the voices, it only causes haedaches. :lol:
-
Yes, I agree -- a great update on a fine build. The bike looks dandy, but more impressive is the quantity of tiny details you're making look easy. Well done!
-
Lars,
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
I have nothing but the upmost RESPECT for builders like you! Your patience, style and talent are eveident in the GREAT looking (and running, I'm sure) bike you're building.
Keep the updates coming and hope to see on the salt this year.
Buzz
-
bike is looking great, lars.
do you have a better pic of handlebars?
looks like you're using a
morse cable for the brake pedal.
i am going to try one for shifter on new build.
franey
-
Lars,
Every detail that you add makes this project closer and closer to an art project!! Love the detail and the functionallty. The best part, as I am sure you will agree will be that blast down the salt. Looking forward to seeing you there.
Rex
-
Lars, Rex is right, your bike is a work of art. I don't remember, have you decided which meets you'll be able to make this year?
Larry
-
Thanks for posting the tip on cable soldering. It solves a problem I have been having. The bike looks good.
-
Lar's sent me a really neat tee shirt last year(Crew Shirt) also a couple of neat pictures of the bike. I was really disappointed when he was unable to cross the pond and run on the salt. He has a lot of fans on this side and everyone of us is pulling for his build to go fast.
:cheers:
-
For custom cables the best source here in the U.S. is Barnett Tool & Eng. known for their top notch motorcycle clutch components they also are the premier aftermarket motorcycle cable manufacturer in the country. Your local MC dealer can special order what ever you need, length, fitment etc. for your project. Check their website also at www.barnettclutches.com
-
Lar's sent me a really neat tee shirt last year(Crew Shirt). I was really disappointed when he was unable to cross the pond and run on the salt. He has a lot of fans on this side and everyone of us is pulling for his build to go fast.
:cheers:
Me too (t-shirt). If you won't be here for SpeedWeek again this year Lars, then once again I'll wear your t-shirt on Saturday to kick off the beginning of Speedweek 2010!
You'd better show up pretty soon!!
Lynda
-
Beautiful build , wonderful attention to detail!
-
…ditto all of the above compliments. And I really like your workshop, very neat and cosy. In the last pic, the BSA seems to levitate off the ground… magic workshop.
-
Thank you VERY much all of you for your all too kind words !
It's very encouraging that you take an interest in my little project
and I owe so many of you for that, and for all the good advise I've been handled here.
Thanks !
A special thanks to Glen and Lynda !...you may not be the ones that bring home the trophies
but with out people like you, doing the work you do, there would be no LSR
and no one would would bring home any trophies or run the Salt at all.
Now for the sake of variety I'll now go from small stuff to
....er......smalLER stuff. Uaaargh:
Just when I'd finished my intake thingy it dawned to me that I had
completely forgotten ( in my self-congratulating joy of having done my first ever alu-welded part )
that there are two holes in the carburettor that act as air-intake
for the idle-circuit: ( EDIT: had to (re) read up on the SU carb system:
In fact one hole vents the float-chamber. The other vents the space underside of the vacuum piston (as it lifts up))
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z2.jpg)
...that by now I had blocked with the flange of the new intake.
Doooh, Mister SmartA** welder !
If I was to make a new thingy I would lose the joy of taking my first ever alu-thingy
to Bonneville AND probably destroy the INDIAN-Sport air-horn in the process of ripping it off the intake.
What to do ?
Contact the INDIAN spirits for advise, of cause!
I obviously got the wrong number, cause me cry for help was answered by
a guy who introduced himself a Mr. MacGyver ..huh?!
Here's what he said:
"...Don't do anything stupid, like starting all over again.
Don't go buy anything. Look around. See what you've got.
Don't use any fancy machines. If there's ANY chance you can get to use a hacksaw:
use a hacksaw !!!.."
I looked around for un-fancy machinery. A battery-drill was what I found.
Ahhh: found a bit of left-over tubes from when I cut up the original oil-lines.
I could hacksaw' them, couldn't I.
Bored two holes in the flange, that would line up with the idle-air intake on the carb.
Stuck in said tube.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z4.jpg)
...sawed back the tube
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z5.jpg)
...worked them a bit, ( with the hacksaw, of cause ) to make them fit
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z6.jpg)
...fits quite nicely
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z7.jpg)
...'glued' them in, using Grey Permatex ( couldn't use any two-pack stuff like epoxy
as methanol dissolves every two-pack stuff I've tested )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z8.jpg)
...works for me
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z9.jpg)
-
Lar's sent me a really neat tee shirt last year(Crew Shirt) also a couple of neat pictures of the bike. I was really disappointed when he was unable to cross the pond and run on the salt. He has a lot of fans on this side and everyone of us is pulling for his build to go fast.
:cheers:
Me too (t-shirt). If you won't be here for SpeedWeek again this year Lars, then once again I'll wear your t-shirt on Saturday to kick off the beginning of Speedweek 2010!
You'd better show up pretty soon!!
Lynda
You have no idea how much it means to me,
reading such words , when it comes from you two.
BTW: the t-shirts.
I must have been influenced by that MacGyver guy when I decided what to do
with those 2009 t-shirts I had lying around:
I got a friend to make me these little things that I can iron on to the t-shirts
covering the "2009"
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/tshirtsMcG.jpg)
...ha ha !
-
bike is looking great, lars.
do you have a better pic of handlebars?
I'm afraid I do
.-)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z10.jpg)
It's the result of being tired debating with myself how to do it,
so I made beyond-MacGyver-primitive set-up.
Flat piece of steel with 8 holes, 4 Home Depot-type U-thingies holding it to the fork-legs.
Handlebar-raiser-clamp-set sawed down holding handlebar to flat steel.
Was supposed to be temporary, but.... hey !
PS: the handlebar will be set lower for actual running
looks like you're using a
morse cable for the brake pedal.
Yes Sir.
. I don't remember, have you decided which meets you'll be able to make this year
I was planning on going to BUB event and hopefully meet up with the Dreamcatcher crew
with whom I spend a great time in 2008
BUT
IF this thing will be ready in time ...and IF it works OK ....and IF it doesn't self-implode
...and IF I have the time (likely) ....and IF I have the money (less likely)
I will go to Speed Week, drive around for a week and come back to the BUB event
And I really like your workshop, very neat and cosy.
Thanks. I like to work in an orderly place
and also because I certainly spend more time here then at home.
During Easter I didn't bother going home at night, but slept on a madras on the floor.
In the last pic, the BSA seems to levitate off the ground… magic workshop.
The real magic will be the moment the Indian runs properly.
At that moment I will be the one levitating !!!
-
Re: the reason for using Ultra Grey Permatex for 'glue'-ing in the tubes.
Some of you might find this infotaining:
A couple of years ago I did this highy scientific test:
6 different brands of liquid gasket / silicone RTV
(including some other stuff from Honda, Hylomar, Permatex and Loctite I've used before)
Put it on some rather slippery plastic to see how well it 'glue's on to that
and on an old outer cover and laid washers on it
to see which one 'glue's the best, when I ripped off the washers after 24 hours:
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/gasket2.jpg)
( I do understand that they have different qualities;
some are supposed to 'cure' like silicone,
others will remain 'sticky'. )
Here's the result:
Test one: press a finger firmly down on the gasket and move finger to the right
(to test adhesion when used between two surfaces that flex/move/expand)
Surface is VERY smooth/slippery plastic
Upper row:
Honda Liquid Gasket 1216 (not Hondabond)---> wouldn't break loose (but using fingernails it came off quite easily)
Blue Hylomar ---> sticks on, no matter what I did (but being a non-curing type it did of cause change 'shape')
Permatex Ultra Blue ---> broke loose
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/test1.jpg)
Lower row:
Loctite 5926 Blue (silicone-based) ---> sticks VERY well. Didn't brake loose (but disintegrated within it own 'body' when using blunt force)
Permatex Ultra Grey ---> broke loose
Non-brand 'blue universal'---> acted the same as Blue Hylomar
Test 2.: grab the washer and pull. To test adhesion metal to metal.
Upper row:
Honda Liquid Gasket 1216 --->took some force to break loose. Never let go of metal but 'broke' within it's own 'body'
Blue Hylomar ---> just 'squashed' loose . Gasket-material however still present ON the metal.
Permatex Ultra Blue ---> couldn't get it off using my fingers. VERY strong adhesion
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/test2.jpg)
Lower row:
Loctite 5926 Blue (silicone-based) ---> broke off easily. Did NOT glue on to the surface. Just snapped off.
Permatex Ultra Grey ---> couldn't get it off using my fingers. VERY strong adhesion
Non-brand 'blue universal'---> acted the same as Blue Hylomar
OK: I'm a geek
-
thanks for taking the time willie buchta
-
Willie, you beat me to it by a minute or so. I was going to say the same thing -- thanks for doing what might, at first, sound silly -- but testing the gluing abilities and the curing/flexing ways of the various compounds -- is something that many of us oughta do but never other with. Thanks to you we all have a better idea of which one to use for any specific job.
So -- speaking of driving around 'tween Speedweek and Bub's -- I believe we've already all told you where you should go during your time, but in case you haven't yet filled your itinerary -- ask so we can inundate you with good ideas. And - don't forget to plan on attending Salt Talks Sunday of Speedweek. You'll get to meet many of the folks with whom you chat here on the Forum, including Glen and (maybe) Lynda - if she can get loose from her Land's End duties.
-
That's a real fine looking dash up front with the Indian script.
Are you making these modifications to the carb and bleeds as found in the first attempt to run?
Or is this your plan?
Finish your reading, yet?
Still have a big lump in chest.
Rocky
-
Lars,
Geez, I am embarassed as I appear to have answered before I read ALL the stuff you just added.
Maybe I need to hang one of your foil hats in the sweat lodge for inspiration?
R
-
Lars..... thank you for your up-date to present. Hey all those little things that you might think are boring actually help others. I have my own business and make my living through welding. I think what you have done displays a determined man on a mission. You have come a long way on a true life journey...... learnt new skills and overcome difficulties on the way. You are an insiration to allot of people who might think their dreams are far from grasp.....
All the best to you......
Joe
melbourne, Australia
-
Thank you very much for your kind words Joe!
Thanks all !
and Slim: I'd love to attend the Salt Talks and meet the all good folks from this forum.
We'll, see how it works out.
Rocky: always have a tin-foil hat within reach.
You never know when they come to beam you up !
.-)
I've decided to try and do all the small stuff before turning
my attention to the engine, which by now is ready to be fired up.
I'm quite sure a bunch of problems ...erhh...'challenges' will turn up as I turn to the engine
and it would be nice to focus all attention on that, not having to care about the small stuff.
Handed the seat-pan to the upholstery guy Monday noon.
Picked up the finished seat Tuesday noon.
THAT's my kind of guy !
He's done a fine job. It's not like you just wrap a piece of vinyl around a piece of foam..is it!?
...felt glued to the edge of pan, so it won't cut into the vinyl
...hard foam
...soft foam
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4684.jpg)
..cover made by sewing vinyl and material together with foam in between
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4683.jpg)
...to get that "sausages-in-a-row" look
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4686.jpg)
All for the pricey sum of around 65$.
The world is still a good place.
While it was away I played around with different types of foam myself
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4673.jpg)
..to make a 'pillow' on which to rest my manly chest.
Hard foam / and soft rubber-like foam on top. I'll take it to the upholstery guy today.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4678.jpg)
Now anyone who have tried shaping foam know that it's a royal pain
to try doing it with any sort of normal knife, be it a box-cutter type or kitchen knife of some sort.
The foam simply changes shape as you cut it and you have no control over the cutting.
This is probably old news to you, but for those who don't know the trick
you'll be happy I told you this:
.-)
Use one of them electrical knifes that have two blades rubbing against each other.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4675.jpg)
Cutting foam now becomes as easy as cutting soft butter with a hot knife.
Here's a short video to show how it works.
Mind you; the reason it works a bit slow on the video
is because I'm cutting some very 'heavy' rubber-like foam.
( Click on the image )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/th_M2U00038.jpg) (http://s207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/?action=view¤t=M2U00038.flv)
Sanded and polished the tank to a mat finish
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4687.jpg)
Masked off
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4689.jpg)
Did a quick rattle-can spray job in the workshop back room
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4692.jpg)
Masked off using a self-adhesive 'negative' made by a friend
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4695.jpg)
A bit of rattling the rattle can again
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4696.jpg)
...and : hey
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4698.jpg)
...and the same thing with the "MOTORCYCLE" letters
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4701.jpg)
Will add white "shadows" by hand, later.
-
bike is looking great, lars.
do you have a better pic of handlebars?
I'm afraid I do
.-)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z10.jpg)
It's the result of being tired debating with myself how to do it,
so I made beyond-MacGyver-primitive set-up.
Flat piece of steel with 8 holes, 4 Home Depot-type U-thingies holding it to the fork-legs.
Handlebar-raiser-clamp-set sawed down holding handlebar to flat steel.
Was supposed to be temporary, but.... hey !
PS: the handlebar will be set lower for actual running
looks like it will work fine
franey
-
Eric,
It just keeps getting better!! Love the seat and the paint job!! Beautiful!
Rex
-
I hereby nominate this Indian for the Salt Talks tee-shirt.
Do I hear a second?
Don
-
Second
-
Third!! But only because you hit post before I did!!
Lynda
-
I move to amend the motion by asking for a unanimous acclimation declaration by the enlightened website potentate Senior SSS!!!!!!!!
-
Gee, unh, mmm, I wonder if I'm being railroaded here. . . I have NOT made final decisions on the Salt Talks t-shirts yet -- have just begun gathering some potential vehicle photos. I will be happy to consider this bike. Here's what I need: First of all, as I've said, I try to use vehicles that've been built in diaries here on the Forum. This one qualifies, right? Second -- I need pretty good photos of the completed vehicle - if at all possible. The artist on the other end wants good, high-resolution photos. Showing all of the details - including lettering and class and sponsors or whatever -- is good. Good lighting. Good positioning -- no tail-end shots, and even angle shots aren't as good as broadside pictures, although a pic taken from front or rear quarter can yield more stuff for the artist to use. Also -- the shirt art is usually showing vehicles grouped or clustered -- so they might not end up being broadside shots. I would be tickled if I could get the art arranged so that it looks like the vehicles are all "parked" around the center of attraction (such as, in the old days, a drive-in restaurant) -- but in this case the center would be some Salt Talks logo and information.
But back to this bike -- yup, it's turning out quite tasty, and I'd like to see some good photos so I can give it a fair chance to beat out the other bike or two that I've already got on the drawing board.
There -- did I call that bluff or what?
-
HOLY MAKEREL !
Guys and gal......what can I say !?
Thank you! thank you for your nomination !
I am overwhelmingly flattered and honoured
to the point of total embarrassment,
as you'd probably be more than slightly disappointed when hopefully
I get to the other side of the pond, and you get see it in real life.
This settles it;
I will go to SpeedWeek, as well as BUB, unless something
really really bad happens to keep me from going.
Better get the darn thing rolling:
Finished the tank-lettering
and added an extra line
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-5.jpg)
...hell: how many in this country can actually justify putting that on their bike besides this one.
None
.-)
The chest-rest 'pad' came back from the upholstery guy
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/6.jpg)
I wouldn't go as far as calling the riding position 'comfortable',
but it's not bad...not bad at all,
except for one minor detail; my whole lower-body weight
rests on my...er....howcanIputit......reproductive organs, which is unreasonably painful.
So to alleviate the pain I tore the whole thing apart again,
cut a hole in the seat-pan
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-7.jpg)
...and glued it all back together again bit by bit
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-4.jpg)
...never tried this stuff before, so the result wasn't too pretty
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3A.jpg)
...but who cares, when the up-side looks kind'a OK
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3B.jpg)
...and now the position is acceptable for the short'ish 10 miles ride.
( Remember: at BUB you ride to, and back from, the 5 mile course )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5-1.jpg)
Went to buy a BIG KN air-filter
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4-4.jpg)
...and while I was there I picked up a set of SPARCO Nomex underwear/socks/hood.
It's not mandatory for riding 'fuel' at BUB, but strongly recommended.
I'm not sure about the SCTA rules but I do believe I read somewhere that it IS mandatory in my class.
I wont inconvenience you with a picture of me in underwear
so here's just a pic of the burqa.
BUH !!!
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/burka.jpg)
I never reeeeally liked the front forks, which are off a nineties HD Sportster.
I'm afraid I bought them cause they were easy to install
and dirt-cheap.
Maybe not the best criteria for buying stuff for a LSR bike.
The forks waaaay too long. You can't see that from the latest pictures
as the springs have been removed.
At a friends workshop I stumbled across a nice old set of
Ceriani GP forks.
Much better. Much shorter.
I have a hard time persuading him to part with them, but he let me borrow them
to test them out, and even to eventually use them, if I can't find a set myself
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4733.jpg)
So I'm in the market for a set of 35mm / length 675mm ( 26.5" ) Ceriani front forks.
A set of just the leg-assemblies will do nicely
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/art1005.jpg)
..as I can get the 'bridges' (upper and lower triple-tree) here.
Mmmmmmm: I guess this is what happens when one does not have a decent plan to begin with.
Same thing with the front wheel ( also from a Sportster ): I rebuild it,
I put in new bearings, I mounted new spokes and a new tire....then decided it was too big.
For now I intend to use the mid-seventies Honda Goldwing wheel presently on the bike.
You live
you learn
you pay
.-)
.
-
octane if you are going to run at an scta event your number plate will have to be ahead of the rear axle willie buchta
-
Hello,
I have some bare N.O.S. 35mm Ceriani lower legs.
They are not the RR style though.
If interested, please send me an email to gears55@verizon.net
and I will email some photos.
-
This settles it;
I will go to SpeedWeek,
We will see you at Salt Talks. :cheers:
-
Octane, do you have a steering damper on your new front end?
-
We will see you at Salt Talks. :cheers:
I certaintly hope so !
octane if you are going to run at an scta event your number plate will have to be ahead of the rear axle willie buchta
Yeah I saw that when I checked the SCTA site to see if I could download the SCTA-rules on-line
like I can for the BUB event.
All I could find was some rule-changes, including something about the number plates for motorcycles and I also found
the Motorcycle Tech Inspection Form.
I ran through it; I seam to be within those things mentioned except this one:
".. functional front-brake ...[snip] ..required, unless class allows rear brake only.."
which I don't know.
I'm aware that I now will have to look into a whooooole new set of rules.
Am I right in assuming that the only way to get the SCTA motorcycle rules
is to buy a (paper-) rulebook ?
If so; time to join SCTA ( by applying for membership in one of the affiliated clubs..right ? )
and order a rule-book.
Maybe someone here, who is familiar with both set of rules, would be so kind as to
point out for me if my bike for some reason will not fit into the SCTA rules or class-system ?!
At BUB it will run the 650 A-VBF class
Max. 650cc ( the bike is 600cc) / Special construction frame (it's a one-off) / Vintage / Blown / Fuel
I have no idea if SCTA divide their classes the same way.
.
-
Hello,
I have some bare N.O.S. 35mm Ceriani lower legs.
They are not the RR style though.
If interested, please send me an email to gears55@verizon.net
and I will email some photos.
Drew; thank you very much for your offer.
I'll have to check out a few details first and then get back to you.
Octane, do you have a steering damper on your new front end?
Nope, but I do have one that will fit right on
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Steeringdamper.jpg)
Thanks.
-
Lars, you don't have to belong to a SCTA club to run at Bonneville. You do have to join BNI to run the event. Rule book and everything is included in the entry. To run at the DRY lakes it can be run as a guest but you can't get records or points without being a SCTA club member.
-
We could send you a Indian factory narrowed 741 fork as fitted to all mile track machines competing in Class C competition? Not sure how it would compare to modern forks.
-
Thanks Glen.
Joined the BNI. Rulebook etc. is on it's way cross the Atlantic.
Thanks Rocky
for you kind offer !!!, but I'll stick to the Ceriani.
Been kind'a busy here.
The list of to-do things is actually getting shorter day by day.
Now THAT'S something new.
Got this great feeling that perhaps I WILL finish this silly contraption in the near future.
Here's a few of the things I've been messing with:
Finished the gear-shift which until now had been more like a mock-up
It goes like this:
fork-thingy attached to gear-box-shifter-arm
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4754.jpg)
and the top attaches to this cut-down ex-scooter brake lever
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-10.jpg)
attached to rod running in two brass bushes inside tube that sits under the tank
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-11.jpg)
and ..presto....gear-lever-knob close to left hand/handlebar
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-6.jpg)
After messing around with several cardboard dummies
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4763.jpg)
and measuring, and trail testing, and generally fooling around,
I made a chain guard
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4785.jpg)
the welding didn't turn out TOO bad considering this is the second part
EVER in my life, that I've alu-welded
The finished result wasn't TOO pretty, but it'll work just fine
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4784.jpg)
At some point I took a long hard look at the white exhausts
and just realized that they looks sort'a silly,
so I repainted them
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-8.jpg)
and stuck them in the oven to cure the paint
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-8.jpg)
Now that's much better ..ei??!
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-10.jpg)
Also I've mounted a set of Tomeselli double-jointed clip-on so I can
adjust the position of the handlebars in any way I bloody please.
( On the pic they are mounted with a single-joint)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a1-2.jpg)
I haven't a clue why I haven't done it till now.
The front wheel as of now it 'stolen' from my BSA build,
cause during test-riding it's probably a good idea to be able to brake the darn thing
and I might need front brakes to run SCTA. ( I'll find out when the rule-book arrives.)
I recently rebuild it with new bearings and re-spoke'ed / re-laced it (?), etc.
and the tire is brand new.
It's a helluva good looking front wheel/brake don't you think ?!
Dual action double-sided Grimeca. Yummy!
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5bf82ff8.jpg)
Other small but equally important stuff:
the remote fuel-valve arrived from the UK
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a-3.jpg)
and I'm trying to figure where to mount it.
Need to have a couple of adaptors for the front-fork bearings made,
fab a battery box,
make a rear-wheel 'inner' fender
and an assortment of small stuff
and then get around to the big moment of getting the engine running
and probably say
HELLOOOO
to an avalanche of new and interesting problems.....challenges.
I've been e-mailing with a guy in Washington state who is also in the process
of building a blown bike for LSR, and we agreed that sometimes when you
tend to loose confidence that you'll e v e r finish the bike, as you feel like you're getting nowhere,
is a brilliant idea to get out the BEFORE-pictures from a few months back
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Beforewaybefore.jpg)
and compare them to the present state of the bike
and realize that in fact quite a few things have been accomplished
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-9.jpg)
-
Lars said
"that sometimes when you
tend to loose confidence that you'll e v e r finish the bike, as you feel like you're getting nowhere,
is a brilliant idea to get out the BEFORE-pictures from a few months back"
Thanks for opening my eyes and letting me see pass the trees.
Rocky
1957 S/VG
-
Octane you will not need a front brake--but you will have to move your number plate in front of the rear axle you will run in A- VBF or A- VBG 650 cc in the 2010 rule book there are no records in either class willie buchta
-
AND....Remember Lars......the leathers that are legal for BUB (and every other M/C sanctioning org. in the world) will NOT be legal for BNI.........
-
AND....Remember Lars........depending how Tom Evans is feeling that day......that rear-fender might be a little to short........Safety you know........
Great looking bike.....outstanding worksmanship.....good luck
-
And.....Remember Lars........that outstanding cover you made for the charger drive, at the top end it may need to be inclosed due to your leg/knee being very close to the drive/pulley......Safety you know.........
Hey, I am just trying to help........you are comming a long way to race.....not to spectate...........
-
And.......Remember Lars.....put some safety wire around the rubber hand-grips on the throttle....in the Bonneville heat they may get loose on you, so when you get ready for your big run the grips only are turning........(been there done that)
-
Looking better and better with every update Lars.
It's definitely two wheeled, functional art at it's best!
Cheers,
Rob
-
AND.....Remember Lars.....you need a pit-crew, you need a truck/car/trailer to pick you up after your fast run on the course........there is NO riding your bike in the pits......or on the return road......the only place you can ride the bike is on the course.......also if you can kickstart or have a remote starter or a set of rollers you are OK........there is no push and/or bump starting your bike in the pits......."insurance you know".............. Welcome to BNI Speedweek..............................................................................
PS. Unless, the "Rules" have changed in the last 7 years.................................................................
-
Octane you will not need a front brake--but you will have to move your number plate in front of the rear axle
OK thanks,
and BTW there's something about the size of the numbers/letters, as well, I think.
Still waiting for the rule-book.
you will run in A- VBF or A- VBG 650 cc in the 2010 rule book there are no records in either class willie buchta
Well, well: about time someone come set that record ....mmmmm....now who would want to do that
AND....Remember Lars......the leathers that are legal for BUB (and every other M/C sanctioning org. in the world) will NOT be legal for BNI.........
AND....Remember Lars........depending how Tom Evans is feeling that day......that rear-fender might be a little to short........Safety you know........
Great looking bike.....outstanding worksmanship.....good luck
And.....Remember Lars........that outstanding cover you made for the charger drive, at the top end it may need to be inclosed due to your leg/knee being very close to the drive/pulley......Safety you know.........
Hey, I am just trying to help........you are comming a long way to race.....not to spectate...........
AND.....Remember Lars.....you need a pit-crew, you need a truck/car/trailer to pick you up after your fast run on the course........there is NO riding your bike in the pits......or on the return road......the only place you can ride the bike is on the course.......also if you can kickstart or have a remote starter or a set of rollers you are OK........there is no push and/or bump starting your bike in the pits......."insurance you know".............. Welcome to BNI Speedweek..............................................................................
PS. Unless, the "Rules" have changed in the last 7 years.................................................................
The plan is to rent a van for the period, so that should take care of the need to transport the bike to the course
and provide me with a place to sleep during Speed Week.
As for the 'crew' to run the van etc. I'll try and hook up with someone. I've got plans.
Thanks a lot for your kind words, and thanks a lot for all the info Bak !
And.......Remember Lars.....put some safety wire around the rubber hand-grips on the throttle....in the Bonneville heat they may get loose on you, so when you get ready for your big run the grips only are turning........(been there done that)
Auch, that sound like one hell of an unpleasant experience.
Must say I usually glue my rubber using hair-spray.
Lubes and makes it easy to attach them...then it dries and turns to a rather effective glue.
Looking better and better with every update Lars.
It's definitely two wheeled, functional art at it's best!
Cheers,
Rob
Thank you Rob !!!
-
Lars you won't be stuck for a crew. I'm planning on being there and I can chase you. I ,hopefully, will for the first time have an "actual" crew there so we will take care of you. Tick that off you list.
Bill
-
Happy to see things are moving along well for you, and your nicely designed Indian. :-)
After a few days at the BUB speed trials you will hopefully be seeing me. :-D
I'll say a prayer for productive days from now until race time.
Drew Gatewood
-
Lars, you might want to send Tom Evans an email and ask some of these questions with pics. that have been brought up now. I mentioned the charger belt guard earlier and someone said it was fine but it'd be easier to find out now. You also have to have your steering limited to 15 degrees each way. A total of 30 deg. steering lock. You can't use the steering dampner to accomplish this either. I'm not sure what Bob see's that he doesn't like on the rear fender but the number plates are a definate no no. See ya on the salt...
Larry :cheers:
-
On the rear fender........I have no problem with it......However, I am not the Tech. person doing the inspection........I had a short fender (behind the seat) like that on one of my Tri.'s back in the 1980's
and Tom suggested for me to change it and make it longer.......Yes, the same Tom Evans back then......
Tom has been in Tech. for a very, very, very ,very long time......and he does a outstanding job and not much in the area's of safety slips by him.....................................................................................
PS. To this day Tom cusses me out for bringing sidecars into LSR.....(Just kidding) Tom has been very helpfull in making todays LSR sidecars safe for both SCTA/BNI and the BUB........................................
As you can tell Tom is one of my "Heroes".........you should have seen the Supercharged Harley he raced back in the 1970's........ it was very fast.........
-
Lars you won't be stuck for a crew. I'm planning on being there and I can chase you. I ,hopefully, will for the first time have an "actual" crew there so we will take care of you. Tick that off you list.
Bill
THANK YOU SO MUCH BILL!!!
I'm very grateful for your kind offer !
I'll do my best not to stand in the way
This is great news !
Ticked that off my list.
I've also been invited to share camp at the Bend in The Road
with another guy who I'm in contact with
so I'm kind of settled now.
THANKS !!!!
The world is still a good place
with good people
-
Happy to see things are moving along well for you, and your nicely designed Indian. :-)
After a few days at the BUB speed trials you will hopefully be seeing me. :-D
Yes I'll be seeing you the minute I get there
I'll say a prayer for productive days from now until race time.
Drew Gatewood
Thanks you Drew !
If some of you don't know:
Drew runs the tech. inspection at BUB and has been VERY helpful
answering all my silly questions regarding the rule and how to make my bike
comply with them
Lars, you might want to send Tom Evans an email and ask some of these questions with pics. that have been brought up now. I mentioned the charger belt guard earlier and someone said it was fine but it'd be easier to find out now. You also have to have your steering limited to 15 degrees each way. A total of 30 deg. steering lock. You can't use the steering dampner to accomplish this either. I'm not sure what Bob see's that he doesn't like on the rear fender but the number plates are a definate no no. See ya on the salt...
Larry :cheers:
Thanks Larry.
I was just about to ask if there is one person to whom one can direct
questions regarding the S.C.T.A. rules.
How do I contact Tom Evans ?
Regarding the belt cover: it has been OK'ed by Drew for the BUB event
but then again S.C.T.A. could be different of cause.
If needed, I have these thingies ready
from which I can make some sort of 'grill' on the belt-cover
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4836.jpg)
I do know about the 15/15 degree steering rule , the damper thing, and the number plates, but I'll
do my homework properly the minute the rule-book turns up.
On the rear fender........I have no problem with it......However, I am not the Tech. person doing the inspection........I had a short fender (behind the seat) like that on one of my Tri.'s back in the 1980's
and Tom suggested for me to change it and make it longer.......Yes, the same Tom Evans back then......
Tom has been in Tech. for a very, very, very ,very long time......and he does a outstanding job and not much in the area's of safety slips by him.....................................................................................
PS. To this day Tom cusses me out for bringing sidecars into LSR.....(Just kidding) Tom has been very helpfull in making todays LSR sidecars safe for both SCTA/BNI and the BUB........................................
As you can tell Tom is one of my "Heroes".........you should have seen the Supercharged Harley he raced back in the 1970's........ it was very fast.........
The thing is that running BUB in my class means that the rear fender
can NOT extend back any longer.
For Special Construction Class ( A ) the rules stipulates:
"...fenders...may not extend beyond the center-line of...rear axle..."
but if the S.C.T.A. are different I guess I'll just make a removable extension.
-
Been working on the forks:
disassembled the forks off my BSA
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-13.jpg)
and finally got to use this funny looking tool to rip out the seals
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-12.jpg)
Took the parts out to my friends place where Jakob
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4826.jpg)
...cut down the tubes and made new threads inside them
so they are now ready for assembly
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4835.jpg)
SUZUKI parts for the rear wheel finally arrived from Holland
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-14.jpg)
new sprocket bolts / locks and the missing 3 rubber-dampers
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-13.jpg)
The brake/lining is brand new , so that's good
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-9.jpg)
I was thinking, as the bike has no stand, that it would be nice to have a
( don't know the proper English term ) light-weight quick-stand made in aluminum
that I can bring with me.
Mmmmmmmmmmmmm....if only I could fabricate and weld aluminum.
But HEEEEY ...I forgot....!...I can !
So I did
.-)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/stand2.jpg)
This is my third and so far most "complicated" part I've ever alu-welded.
Works quite well:
FLIP---> LIFTS---> LOCKS
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/stand3.jpg)
Yep; the bike is FINALLY off the work-bench .
I've got around the weigh is and it weights in at 156 kg --> 343 pounds.
That's not bad.
Having the bike on the bench for such a LONG time I had forgotten how
low it actually is:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/low.jpg)
Light and low is GOOD !
Dragged the bike outside the other day to take a few pics.
Unfortunately the the sky was heavily grey-black so the bike looks
kind'a dull, but hell; it's starting to like a BIKE, isn't it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/6-2.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4-7.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7-2.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/8.jpg)
Getting there...it'll be ready soon
...knock on wood !
-
Lars,
Your skills speak for themselves, but it's your passion for the sport and your positive attitude that has everyone cheering for you.
You won't having any trouble finding good help.
-
Chief Motorcycle Inspector Tom Evans MrRodan@budweiser.com (818) 352-9109
See ya on the salt...
-
Your bike is looking beautiful, Lars!!! You've done a fine job and should feel very proud of your accomplishment! Hope to see you on the salt this year!
Lynda
-
Lars,
You have done super job building the Indian. Congratulations.
I can't wait to see it and you on the salt.
Good Luck,
Gary
-
Beautiful, look forward to seeing it on the salt
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
-
Beautiful bike and your craftmanship is really first class. SCTA rule on the rear fender in special construction is minimum to the vertical centerline of the rear axle, maximum to the rear edge of the rear tire.
Fred
-
and remember the number plate has to be ahead of the rear axle willie buchta
-
Just looked at AMA/ Bub fender rules. There are two parts, the first is what you quoted, The second, next page, is what I said, SCTA rules. So you can take your rear fender to the rear edge of the rear tire for Bub and SCTA,
Fred
-
Thank you
B.R. , Larry, Lynda, Gary, Gary C. and Willie
for your kind words and info provided !
Just looked at AMA/ Bub fender rules. There are two parts, the first is what you quoted, The second, next page, is what I said, SCTA rules. So you can take your rear fender to the rear edge of the rear tire for Bub and SCTA,
Fred
Fred, you're right !
I'm dumb;
I do have the BUB 2010 rule-book here in the workshop,
but by mistake the rule-book I've been looking in, on this subject,
is the 2008edition (gotta throw that away)
The 2008 book says:
"...generic replacement type fenders may be substituted and may not extend beyond the
centerline of...rear axle
Elongated seat may act as rear fender and is subject to scrutineering..."
( and my far from perfect command of the finer points of the English language
didn't stretch to comprehending the "generic replacement"-thing.
The 2010 book , as you correctly point out, clarifies and elaborates on this point:
"...an elongated seat may act as rear fender. Rear fender/seat section
shall not extend beyond the rear edge of the rear tire, and shall not
be lower than the top rim of the rear wheel..."
SO; if I get it right this time.
Generic fender can not extend the center-line of the axle.
An "elongated seat" / "rear fender/seat section" can stretch to, but not extend, rear edge of rear tire.
...and I could therefore extend my seat"cowl" like this
IF, and only IF, my my set-up would be considered a "elongated seat" / "rear fender/seat section"
( If so; I would be looking into an alternative use of material for the extension.
Cardboard is incredible hard to weld .-)
-
On the S.C.T.A number plate rule,
I was afraid there wouldn't be enough space for it
if it is to be totally visible seen from the side.
But there IS...just.
Mocked-up S.C.T.A sized plate:
-
Your bike looks great. :cheers:
-
Sorry Lars, I did not mean to open a can of worms regarding your rear fender......but it is a long ways for you to come and have to build a new rear fender.........Your card board extension looks good................
-
Thanks bvillercr !
Sorry Lars, I did not mean to open a can of worms regarding your rear fender..
Absolutely nothing to be sorry about.
I really appriciate that you pointed it out for me !!!!
....but it is a long ways for you to come and have to build a new rear fender....
It certainly is
.....Your card board extension looks good.........
.-)
.
-
Lars you won't be stuck for a crew. I'm planning on being there and I can chase you. I ,hopefully, will for the first time have an "actual" crew there so we will take care of you. Tick that off you list.
Bill
Wow, I've only been here for a while, and I nearly wrote I'm amazed at how helpful everyone is, but I'm not, as this happens throughout the world of petrolheads, it's brilliant! Lars, your bike is beautiful, when can we get together and do a feature on it? And being cheeky, can I borrow your old 1998 rule book to give me some guidelines, as I'm about to start work on my chassis. I'll send it back. I'm taking my Indian over in 2012.
-
Thanks Desperate Chris !
Check your PM in-box.
-
Been absent for a while as I've been working like a mad-man.
( Gotta make money for this silly endeavour, don't I !? ),
but a bit of progress has been made , so just to let you know that I haven't gone AWOL
here's a short update:
Took my forks out to my friend again
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d-1.jpg)
..as I realized that we had ...mumble mumble...made one of the fork tubes...mumble..hark hark..
shorter than the other.... oooups
...and the triple-tree stem (?) on the Ceriani forks was modified to be adapted to the frame
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c-2.jpg)
.. from left: a thick 'washer' was made
.. a adaptor-'bushing' was made , then heated and mounted on the stem
.. stem cut in two, shortened , hole made in each of two pieces, rod inserted,
TIG welded
.. yet another 'bushing' made, heated, mounted and TIG welded on
.. the assembly put in the lathe and the (slightly outer diameter over-sized ) bushings taken down to size to fit new bearings
( doing it at this point securing that the bushings would be perfectly in line )
Stem cooled down, ( lower bearing in the oven )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c1-1.jpg)
previously I had fixed the upper triple tree,
painting it with wrinkle-finish pain.
Weird stuff: here it is right after applying it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a-4.jpg)
..but one never know what the finished result will look like
as the wrinkles develops over several hours.
First try didn't look too good so I removed the paint and re-did it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b-3.jpg)
..now that's more like it. After air-drying it for 24 hours I baked it in the oven
Donno why, but it's a finish I really do like.
As I had to modify the instrument panel for the new fork assembly,
I did the same thing with that.
SO: front ready for assembly:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c2.jpg)
...and now that the spray can was out, I did the top of the frame
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a1-3.jpg)
...and as I was at this point intoxicated silly by the fumes,
I went a bit nuts, and sprayed the blower mounting-thingy as well
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/f-1.jpg)
We also made a new and considerably thicker axle for the rear wheel as I was somehow uncomfortable
with the very thin Indian-reproduction axle that came with the wheel.
Looked too weak for my likening.
Maybe I'm being hysterical BUT my priorities goes like this
..safety !!!
..reliability
..speed
and of cause having one hell of a good time !
That of cause meant new spacers and new inner 'adaptors' for the rear wheel assembly.
Photos tomorrow when my friend Jakob drops by,
as he has made them at home.
Can you guess what these alu-thingies , found on the scrap-yard,
will be used for ?
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a-5.jpg)
First right answer will recieve an INDIAN SALT CRACKER BONNEVILLE RACE CREW T-shirt.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2010.jpg)(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2010redblack.jpg)
Have a brilliant week-end ya'all !!!
-
foot pegs willie buchta
-
:-D Maybee,,,rear,,foot pegs? lol lol lol
-
Sheri, you beat me to it. I've seen similar ones on BMX bikes. Plenty of grip.
-
Nerf bars?
-
you've already got a nice set of footpegs that
are set up for the levers.
i can see them being bolted to the extra
hardtail brackets for-- rear tie downs and/or
pegs for a triangular "kickstand" plate.
franey
-
How about knee rests?
Lars, while looking at the pics of your amazing build again, I'm wondering if your countershaft should be covered. I don't see anything in the rule book but I know I've been told in tech that the countershaft sprocket has to be completely covered. Just trying to save you a trip back to the shop after you get to the salt!! :wink:
-
Hand grips?
-
Lars, take some pix of that bike when you get it all together and post them, including the finished # plates on the bike. The tech inspectors have the final opinion, of course, but we can spot anything that is obviously goofy. It is a lot easier to make everything right in a shop than on the salt.
-
How about knee rests?
Lars, while looking at the pics of your amazing build again, I'm wondering if your countershaft should be covered. I don't see anything in the rule book but I know I've been told in tech that the countershaft sprocket has to be completely covered. Just trying to save you a trip back to the shop after you get to the salt!! :wink:
Right, thanks.
The set-up was OK'ed for BUB , but that of cause doesn't mean it's OK for SCTA.
I'll check with tech. inspection.
Lars, take some pix of that bike when you get it all together and post them, including the finished # plates on the bike. The tech inspectors have the final opinion, of course, but we can spot anything that is obviously goofy. It is a lot easier to make everything right in a shop than on the salt.
Certaintly is !
I'll post pictures of the "finished" bike ( never was such a beast..was there ?! ha ha )
As a matter of fact, I'll have to do a little booklet of the entire bike build and present to tech inspection very soon:
The rulebook states
"..7.A.4 New race Vehicles:
It is strongly recommended that all new Special
Construction class ( A, APS, Streamliner, SC, or SCS )
vehicles.....[snip]....be submitted for pre-event inspection by the Technical Committee.
If not practical because of distance, photographs and drawings may be
submitted to the Technical Committee Chairman..."
Good thing that I have like 2 million pics of the build
including things like photos of all weldings on frame, gas tank etc.,
taken before painting etc.
-
Sorry ! My mistake !
I should have pointed out that the alu thingies doesn't necessarily go ON the bike,
but of cause they will be used for something relevant to this whole endeavour.
So here we go again:
Can you guess what these alu-thingies , found on the scrap-yard,
will be used for ?
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a-5.jpg)
First person to come up with the
right answer will recieve an INDIAN SALT CRACKER BONNEVILLE RACE CREW T-shirt.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2010.jpg)(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2010redblack.jpg)
Have a brilliant week-end ya'all !!!
-
Lars,
Will they be used for a warm-up stand?
-
Will they be used on your bike to push start a streamliner?
-
Rollers for an external wheel based starter?
-
:cheers: Something to throw at that dam-ed dog that keeps coming in the shop and eating all the sandwiches!????????? lol Crow.
-
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a-5.jpg)
you're building a shredder, in case the missus finds your receipts?
-
Pieces for the remote starter.
Tom G.
-
Regarding you didn't misplace your tin foil helmet, it has to be laddersteps on the next project intercontinal spaceship delivery rocket, Denmark-Bonneville! :mrgreen:
-
you're building a shredder, in case the missus finds your receipts?
LOL !!!
No missus at the moment.
Been there , done that.
I've turned into a sorry, lonely, old fart
with a severe allergy caused by the sheer notion that some other person
should have any saying whatsoever on what I do, how I do it, how much time I spend on it, and how much money I spend on it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/logo_m4m7-Kopi.jpg)
Regarding you didn't misplace your tin foil helmet, it has to be laddersteps on the next project intercontinal spaceship delivery rocket, Denmark-Bonneville! :mrgreen:
LOL !
Yeah: I'm working on a old-fart propelled rocket to get me to Bonneville:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Rocketman-1.jpg)
Rollers for an external wheel based starter?
Pieces for the remote starter.
Tom G.
Bbarn and Tom, you're both right and I'm a generous guy
.-)
so both of you; please PM me, stating your size, color preference and a mail address
and I'll send them right away ( may not have the right size, but we'll sort that )
More on the starter later.
-
Working yesterday but took a brake to receive the parts made by my friend Jakob
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4-8.jpg)
New spacers , "bearing-adaptors" etc. for the rear wheel.
Old axle in the background , new considerably stronger one up front.
Wouldn't really know what kind of steel to use for such an application,
but my friend Jonny came to my rescue as he donated an axle off
some rather obese big heavy Harley Davidson
(I'm not a HD-guy so I forgot which...but it's BIG ).
That has got to be strong enough for my 340 pound bike.
We shaved it a little on the lathe to make it fit here.
Just need to make a thread for the nut on the axle.
BTW , quite irrelevant for this thread,
but hell, we all like interesting cars...don't we;
he delivered the parts in his brilliant old Austin Healey
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/6-3.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7-3.jpg)
Love it !
Nicely rebuild, but not "chrome'ly" overdone.
The lower 5 inches of the car was rusted away when he got it
and he painstakenly rebuild it without buying any new body parts.
Yeah: took him a couple of years.
Gotta go back to work ( real work...make money-work... now.
-
Cool aerodynamics it may catch on!!
Desperate would wear it thats for sure.
-
I see! That belgian Tintin version 2:1. This was you and your friends testing edition 1:2 here? I got a pic. of version 1:0, but you wouldn't like to share that! However I show a picture of another test crew. Now git back in order!
-
Thats the purple helmets display team in the top picture if I am not mistaken.
may need more back pressure on the silencer!!
I aint seen that lot in years real funny displays all done on old Honda C50s C70s C90s Cool
http://www.sheepskullenduroriders.com/
mad dudes
TTFN
-
Sorry: double-post.
-
I'm still working like a mad-man ( real make-money-work ) weekends and all,
so haven't been able to do much on the bike.
A few later night hours is all.
But here's a short update to let you know that I haven't sunken into the ground.
Took the carb apart as it dawned to me that I probably forgot to drain
it after a start-up attempt looooooong ago.
Methanol is supposed to be quite aggressive so I was a bit worried:
...bad news: yep, I forgot to do it
...good news: no damage apart from a bit of corrosion in the bottom of the float bowl
Weird: when putting it back together the rubber-seal between the float-chamber and the bottom-piece
was too small...must be the methanol that made it scrink ???
The trick is to immense it in WD-40.
Hence the yellow container with the seal emmenced.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b2-1.jpg)
Yep: WD-40 will make it swell up.
I know from a test I did once when a discussion came up
about using WD-40 to loosen up a brake-piston if stuck in the caliber.
NOT a good idea as the test shows:
The WD-40 will make it a LOT harder to get the stuck piston loose:
Honda GL1000 front brake seal :
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-15.jpg)
...after a few hours in WD-40:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-14.jpg)
...and after a couple of days:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-10.jpg)
Got the carb together all right.
Made an "inner fender" / splash guard.
Should have a double-curvature at the rear.
Whacked it in the blindingly naive hope that I could actually do that
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4963.jpg)
BAM...BAM....BAM...BAM.....I don't need no stinking english-wheel...WHACK....WHACK....yes I do!!!!
Whack-job.
Maybe I should invest in some proper tools instead of delude myself
that it can be done with a plastic-tip hammer and a tiny anvil.
Never mind for now. It'll work:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4969.jpg)
...will go in here:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG4971.jpg)
Got the parts ready for the roller-starter:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b2-2.jpg)
...One piece of scrap aluminum
...Two pieces of POM Delrin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delrin)
bought cheaply from the local plastic whole sale dealers cut-off-pieces heap.
It's an amazing material.
The rollers will be shaved 'smooth' at each end,
and stuck directly into corrosponding holes in the Delrin , which can easily
act as 'bearings' for the rollers on each side.
...One Mitsubishi starter from the auto junk yard
Took the starter to pieces to remove the 'arm' from the solenoid to the cog-wheel
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-17.jpg)
..as the starter will be connected directly: cog-wheel--axle-->roller,
and as the bike starts, the cog-wheel will run for a short while freely ( not dragging the starter-motor)
by means of the over-running clutch ( blue arrow ) on which the cogwheel is attached.
More on all that later.
-
Octane, the "Shaping Aluminum with Hand Tools" DVD at www.covell.biz will show you how to beat that fender. One thing I learned is to pound the fender out of an oversize piece and to trim it to its final size after the shape is OK. Have fun.
-
It will be interesting to follow your build of the roller starter. I'm exactly where you are at the pictures in my build, aquired a pile of almost all parts but is having problem to figure how to connect the starter clutch to a chain sprocket in a reliable way. It seems easier to use a bike starter motors as there is several that already is using chain drives but I'm afraid the starters are expensive and too weak, and car starters are so much easier and cheaper to get. It would be equally interesting to see what starters you other followers have cobbled up.
-
Lars,
Why not drive the starter on the engine drive shaft as I do on the streamliner? It just takes a nut welded to a plate and bolted to your belt pulley? The sprag on the starter on the transmission is an expensive and weak link on the electric starter chiefs. Moen may have one down the street from you?
Rocky
-
The new workshop I am working in just purchased a thing called an easystarter
It looks like your usual roller race bike starter, but is powered by a 2400 watt angle grinder
Plugs into the power point
Used it twice yesterday, once on a CRF250 and next on 750 Bonneville
Worked a treat
When we were at Lake Gairdiner this year, John Trease from Harley Motorcycle Engineering in Melbourne had something similar, but powered by two 2400 watt angle grinders. Something to do with the hi comp Vincent Comet that was with him on the lake.
He had a honda generator in his pickup. Plugin, press button and woo hoo
G
-
Octane, the "Shaping Aluminum with Hand Tools" DVD at www.covell.biz will show you how to beat that fender. One thing I learned is to pound the fender out of an oversize piece and to trim it to its final size after the shape is OK. Have fun.
I will ! Thank you!
It will be interesting to follow your build of the roller starter. I'm exactly where you are at the pictures in my build, aquired a pile of almost all parts but is having problem to figure how to connect the starter clutch to a chain sprocket in a reliable way. It seems easier to use a bike starter motors as there is several that already is using chain drives but I'm afraid the starters are expensive and too weak, and car starters are so much easier and cheaper to get. It would be equally interesting to see what starters you other followers have cobbled up.
Mine won't use a chain sprocket, but please see below where I post
pictures of those I found in my hunt for starter-ideas ( that I never folloewed..ha ha)
Lars,
Why not drive the starter on the engine drive shaft as I do on the streamliner? It just takes a nut welded to a plate and bolted to your belt pulley?
Mostly because that would require some sort of transmission/reduction-gear between the starter and the drive,
to get enough torque / lower RPM from the cheapo car-starter.
Too complicated for a simple guy like me.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/tommy_1.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/tommy_2.jpg)
The new workshop I am working in just purchased a thing called an easystarter
It looks like your usual roller race bike starter, but is powered by a 2400 watt angle grinder
Plugs into the power point
Used it twice yesterday, once on a CRF250 and next on 750 Bonneville
Worked a treat
Something like this ?:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Picture007-1.jpg)
When we were at Lake Gairdiner this year, John Trease from Harley Motorcycle Engineering in Melbourne had something similar, but powered by two 2400 watt angle grinders. Something to do with the hi comp Vincent Comet that was with him on the lake.
He had a honda generator in his pickup. Plugin, press button and woo hoo
G
Yep that would work,
but I would prefer to have a 12 V running on a battery.
Here's a few other variations. Some are apparently home-made,
others are some you can buy. The really nice ones are terribly expensive...up to 3.000$US.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/starter1.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/starter01_web.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Produc2.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Produc1n.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Bm3.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/avviatore.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/starter01_web.jpg)
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Just for an idea, a good friend of mine has a H2 powered kart, and he made a rig that holds the chassis off of the ground a couple of inches, and uses and old horizontal shaft Honda go kart motor to spin another kart wheel mounted in a bearing to spin backwards against the tire on the kart, using belt drive and a tensioner assembly off of the bottom of the deck of a lawnmower, just pull the handle when the Honda motor running, the wheel on the starter starts turning, wait until the wheels on the kart get going, and drop the clutch in 2nd gear. Fires up the motor with no problems. I will try to get a few pictures of his "Kart Starter" the next time that I am over there and post them on here if anyone is interested.
Jeff
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i use a dodge starter motor. powered
by 2 -12 volt batts.(24 volt)
if you go that route, put two handles on it.
maybe my pm didn't go through.
let me know if anything besides $ is needed for bub.
franey
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i use a dodge starter motor. powered
by 2 -12 volt batts.(24 volt)
if you go that route, put two handles on it.
maybe my pm didn't go through.
let me know if anything besides $ is needed for bub.
franey
Instead of 2 handles, use 1 handle and a large Stud that locates with a hole on the engine. This with control the torque.
-
F I N A L L Y !!!!! ....I am off from work.
.-)
Jeff, Franey, Gearhead...thanks a lot for you input !!!
I'm afraid I disregarded it ( I may very well regret that later ) and went on with my plan:
how to make a roller-starter with the fewest (and cheapest) parts possible:
..so I spend a late night at my friend Jacobs place.
Jacob is quite brilliant working a lathe and a mill.
It all goes down in his basement, with an old cassette-tape player playing fifties jazz music in the background
and once in a while his wife comes down and offers refreshments.......bloody nice!
The rollers were rounded in the ends , incorporating a small 'neck'
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d-2.jpg)
..holes were cut in the delrin using a thingy in the mill
that I have no clue what is called in English.
Sort of a head with an adjustable cutting tip for extremely accurate hole-cutting
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/e-4.jpg)
Then I cut off the snout of the starter , and cut down the starter-axle
and another guy made me an axle
with a hole bored in it that fitted exactly on to the starters axle ( as to keep them 'in line' )
and the 'new' axle was welded to the starter-axle / cog-wheel
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/AAksellavetSvejsetp.jpg)
...a corresponding hole was bored in one of the rollers to accept the motor-axle.
Cut down the delrin, and cut off the top of the aluminum bar.
Insert rollers
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/BSkretnedRullerforkortetsdeliggerba.jpg)
Bushings for the starter motor
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CSvupindmedbandittenBsninger.jpg)
Test the set-up and mark where to make threads for the bolts that will hold things together
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/g-2.jpg)
The delrin is absolutely wonderful to work on.
You can use a pair of scissors as a smoothing plane to make a real nice surface-finish
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/i.jpg)
..and at the same time you can cut a thread that really is surprisingly strong
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/l.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/h.jpg)
Do a bit of cutting, and set up for welding a ramp
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/k.jpg)
Cut a hose left-over from the blower intake,
that happened to have the exact right diameter,
to keep the dirt and salt from entering the starter moter
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/j.jpg)
...bore through the roller/axle and insert locking-pin
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5063.jpg)
...and ( fanfare ) you have the LEGO of roller starters
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/f-2.jpg)
Mission accomplished; it works !!!....................erh........so far.
For battery I am contemplating maybe using one of these tiny nifty things:
MOTYDESIGN lightweight batteries (http://motydesign.com/Battery.html)
That done, it's time to start up the darn bike.
Wish me luck !!
Have a splendid weekend ya'all!
-
Wish you luck!
Thanks for update!
I can see the trees in forest now.
Rocky
1957 S/VG
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Simplicity, beauty and style. I hate when people do this to me! Weld a tube to the sprocket, lock with a pin. Bushings that double as rails and a simple frame with a ramp.
Why didn't I think of that. :cheers:
Mind you, without effort I can put all kind of layers of complicity to a problem, and make it work but the ingenious is to reduce a problem to its bare bones. Thank you. I'd test it however in an oven to ensure the rollers don't drag in the hot bonneville sun.
-
I'll keep my fingers crossed for the start-up Lars, but I bet it fires up first go.
-
Lars, there is a post on the Team Go Dog, Go build site about some basic things to check before start up. Some might help you. Good luck with the initial run. This is always an anxious time.
-
I've been looking and listen around high and low for a long time what is used, what's available and where to get build sheets and/or build diarys and only got run around answers like "It's easy, just use excel" or "buy this and that and you're set!" Most had incomplete information or are restricted to a narrow goal. Mostly Lotso$$$ and/or useless for motorbikes, I didn't find what I wanted. It's difficult to know how to set up and know what kind of data you need, when you haven't done it before. When you look at Wobblywalrus pen and paper buildsheet it looks simple but requires a lot of thought and experience to get that clear and sorted. Nowhere but on Team Go dog, Go have I seen an explanation or description that clear and systematic on how to sort and put up the data that is needed and required. I saved all pages on my harddrive and hope he continues!
-
Thanks Rocky, WW and Charlie.
I'll keep my fingers crossed for the start-up Lars, but I bet it fires up first go.
Thanks............ but nope!
.-(
BUMMER BUMMER BUMMER !
Talk about a bad start; the big moment arrived and a bunch of guys came over to give a helping hand
..first my nifty ( or so I thought ) roller starter had...er...technical problems
so I borrowed a chunky chain-saw driven roller starter
..got the bike on it and ran it;
aourgh; methanol all over the floor pouring from the carb.
Long story, but fixed it
..ran the bike again.....bike didn't as much as fart.
Lot's of checking and found this: two halves of the rotor tumbling about inside the ignition distributor
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-Kopi.jpg)
WTF; that's a new one to me: the rotor in the distributor had disintegrated.
Explanation:
Turns out the POS rotor was really badly made;
the metal-thingy on the left sat , ever so slightly, too far away from center,
(compared to the upper one we pulled from my friend Allan's Indian.)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-17.jpg)
Not only that, but it didn't sit tight in the recess (recess to wide) so it could therefore move about, ("turn")
become askew ( is that the word ?)
...hit the brass-thingy hi-tension take-ups in the cover (evidenced by the presence of brass-dust in the distributor)
and thereby brake the rotor.
...ran the bike again.....nothing happened except it backfired and shot... WHAM!... out the
safety pop-up valve on the intake plenum.
At least the pop-up valve has now proved it's value.
Then I gave up. Gotta re-re-re-check everything.
Somethings seriously wrong here. I am ( was ) sure I checked it,
but something tells me I timed the ignition not on the compression stroke
as I'm supposed to.
Here's a short video of the disaster;
You can't hear it over the noise from the chain-saw engine
but at the end you see the camera(man) jump (and yours truly too, I'm afraid,)
as it explodes out the pop-up valve. ( ...and I remark; "That's what a pop-up valve is for ")
The video is filed under "Comedy"
( Click the image to see video)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/th_start.jpg) (http://s207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/?action=view¤t=start.mp4)
No one told me this was gonna be easy.
-
Hang in there, remember your first trip there and what was endured?
-
Fuel? Spark? Compression? You are sooo close. Good luck!
-
You can always run that fine looking BSA you have there.....fine looking bike it is......and maybe even faster then the Redskin....you think........................don't give up...you will get it sorted out..............
-
What ever you run at the BUB.......if and when you need welding equipment come to our trailer and you are welcome to use it..........we are all one big happy family.......................
-
What ever you run at the BUB.......if and when you need welding equipment come to our trailer and you are welcome to use it..........we are all one big happy family.......................
that is great to know. had to run into town for a
broken alum. chainguard bracket at '09 bub.
franey
-
Suggestion - Make sure you didn't accidently set your timing 180 degrees off
-
Thanks guys for your advise
and thanks Franey for your kind offer.
May come in handy.
As I suspected and as Drew pointed out ;
the ignition timing was all wrong.
Don't know how that happened. Must have been done on a late night
or maybe I'm just dumb.
I should have checked all this before attempting a start-up,
but it's just that I had just got the roller-starter and there was a bunch of guy offering their help
and I just thought; why not have a go at it.
Dumb.
Pulled the distributor to get to the cam follow'er covers
so I could open them up and check the position of the valves
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a-7.jpg)
...which in retrospect was dumb, because by fooling around , turning the engine with the distributor removed,
I 'lost' the present ignition timing, ( and hence not being able to check it )
but I tried to "re-construct" the position and I'm quite sure
I had it wrong, as in: not set on the compression stroke.
Anyhow; I got all confused as things simply wouldn't add up.
Lots of head-scratching until I checked the installation of the little "electronic/magnet"
'trigger-gizmo' .
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b-4.jpg)
...there's a little punch-mark there. It's supposed to be positioned with this mark
right over the biggest slope/cam on the distributor-shaft. ( Triggering the front cylinder spark )
Mr. Dumb here had positioned it over the other cam.
Goodness; I better give all my work a proper check :
did I really put the front-wheel at the front and the rear-wheel at the rear ?
Did I put gas in the gas-tank and oil in the oil-tank ?
Jezz !
-
Wow, That Indian Parts Europe really produces a nice electronic ignition kit! So do we have sound?
-
Wow, That Indian Parts Europe really produces a nice electronic ignition kit!
...yes indeed. It's the very type that sat on one of "Burt Munro's" bikes in the "Worlds Fastest Indian" movie.
One nifty feature is a tiny LED lamp on the trigger take-up ( the small square aluminum box)
that lights up at the point of ignition. Makes adjusting the timing so much easier.
So do we have sound?
Yep; the sound of me going "AAAAAUUURGH",
after I found a tiny crack in the oil-tank.
Will weld it up tonight and later seal the tank with a two-pack sealer, just to be safe.
Rocky: how's going with the liner ???
Is the engine ready ?
-
Lars,
I got the new moly rings for engine, still need to sort out some extra Bonneville valve springs for the valves, the heads are being machined , I need to check with Ed, the machinist as his wife is in hospital at the same time. The Lakeview fellows are geared up to reproduce the factory Daytona heads I have with a smaller valve chamber as a billet head if I can create the drawing in 3-D CAD solid works.. Engine is apart and ready to check cam timing of 4 lobes as I suspect I have the front cam jumped one tooth advanced. I will be out of town working this week, but should be ready to start assembling when I return over the weekend. The liner engine will be ready, if something comes up I have a back up plan that will involne an engine size change for BUB.
Rocky
-
Rocky
you're not using moly rings with a blower are you
G
-
Rocky
you're not using moly rings with a blower are you
G
No I am not but Why not?
-
Hi !...I'm still here.
Busy fighting the demons that keep popping out of the machine.
It's like a crazy dance where you take one step forward and two steps back and one one step forward and two steps back .....etc.etc.etc.
Rocky ! Glad to hear you're making progress !
-
Demons ? from the oil pump? Remember its a gravity feed and pressure return to the tank
-
Demons ? from the oil pump?
..nope ( not that I know of, anyway ).
Just a load of things that are acting up:
a starter that won't work, a carb that gives me grief, some other stuff...blahblah......the clock is ticking !
I'm working on it.
-
I,m glad the clock is ticking cause that means I am still on the right side of the green grass and I am in control.
Ever notice how some guys work better under a little pressure?
Rocky
-
Rocky
you're not using moly rings with a blower are you
G
No I am not but Why not?
If you get any detonation the moly falls off
G
-
Lars, did you seal your tanks yet? Over the years I've tried several brands, but I recommend this one 200%, it's superb and sets like rock overnight, as do any leftovers in the can :-(
I always do both my fuel tank and oil tank on eveything I make. Mask off any threads! It's called POR15 and is single pack, you can get it from Frost Products http://www.frost.co.uk/item_detail.asp?productID=8232&frostProductName=Fuel+Tank+Sealer+(US+Quart%2C+946ml)++&frostCat=&frostSubCat=&CatID=28&SubCatID=
-
Thanks Chris for the tip !
I already bought a somewhat similar single-pack product for the fuel-tank , but haven't 'done' it yet.
Methanol will eat most things two-pack , but for the oil-tank I'm going for
a two-pack product , mostly because several friends has used it successfully ( forgot the brand name )
I,m glad the clock is ticking cause that means I am still on the right side of the green grass and I am in control.
Ha ha , I guess you're right !!!
Now back to work....the clock is spinning
-
Lars, will your oil have some methanol contamination in it and it will eat away an oil tank liner that is not methanol resistant? I just thought about this after reading your last post and I do not know if it is a problem. Maybe an expert will know.
-
Awesome bike, Lars. I hope your still bringing it out in 2011 when i get a chance to bring my project(s)
-
Wobbly !... I'm listening ! Have reconsidered the choice of sealer.
CK: thank you for your kind words.
Short update, as I'm busybusybusy. I can feel the dark clouds of time's-running-out decending on me.
The nifty little designer-starter I made ?...no good. Big mistake.
I have something up my sleeve in that department . More later.
The beautiful old SU carb: big mistake. Keeps giving me grief of all sorts and parts hard to come by.
Opted for a Keihin CV carb that is off a Harley.
HD used them extensively on several models, but folks tended to replace them with
big shiny bling-bling SS carbs and others, so there's plenty on the marked for very little money.
Got this one dirt cheap at the local HD repair/parts shop.
Looks brand new in- and outside
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/aa.jpg)
Great carb. It's a CV...good for blown application.
Easy to tune. Has a acceleration pump. Parts are readily available.
Just to be safe I got a rebuild kit and to tune it for my application
I installed a Dyno-Jet tune up kit. Comes with a variety of jets , a different vacuum piston spring and
other useful stuff.
LOADS of INDIAN riders use this carb and this modification, so all I had to do was
jet it "up" to 50/50 % gas/methanol
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/bb.jpg)
Fabbed a new intake manifold using my new-found alu welding semi-skills
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/cc.jpg)
...and fabbed a new carb-to-air-filter manifold.
Because I needed the space for the mounting bolts....
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ee.jpg)
...I had to weld INside the tube,
which for this here still-wet-behind-his-ears "weldor" was quite challenging
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/dd.jpg)
...and had to cut a piece off a thin-walled pipe
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ff.jpg)
...bore holes through the intake and attach the pipe-bit
to make provision for the air passing through the flange--into---carb---up to vent the area
over the vacuum piston.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/gg.jpg)
NOT pretty, but it works
and taking into account that this is the 4th. real functional part I have ever fabbed in aluminum
I'm not too ashamed about it.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/hh.jpg)
Later added a flange that attaches to the seat-"cowling", so keep thing from falling off.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ii.jpg)
This engine is looking ...erh....weird
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/jj.jpg)
-
It's not weird at all Lars, looks like it has a purpose. I am a fan of this kind of engineering, keep up the good work :cheers:
-
This engine is looking ...erh....weird
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/jj.jpg)
nope - the engine is looking GREAT
-
Lars,
Bike looks really good!
Consider placing a shield between the tire and the air filter. You may hit a wet spot and soak the half of the filter next to the tire.
Geo
-
It's not weird at all Lars, looks like it has a purpose. I am a fan of this kind of engineering, keep up the good work :cheers:
Thanks !...but one can hardly call it "engineering",
more like The Oops-what-did-I-do-now-sh*t-I-have-to-do-that-System
nope - the engine is looking GREAT
Thank you Sumo
Lars,
Bike looks really good!
Thanks Geo
Consider placing a shield between the tire and the air filter. You may hit a wet spot and soak the half of the filter next to the tire.
Naaa: that is a carefully engineered, well thought out, sophisticated hi-tech, PRMWST system.
You know : Passive Random Mechanical Water Injection Tuning
If THAT fails ( depending on the weather situation ), I will be ready with the incredible SAHI optional equipment:
( Space Age Hand-held Injection )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/water.jpg)
Seriously: thanks Geo, I hadn't thought of that.
-
Hey Lars, the bike's looking great and the welding skills are improving rapidly as well! Good work!!! :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Pete
-
Got it
-
Lars, my Triumph has a pair of those Keihin CV's. They can be tricky to jet, but when they are set up, they work very well in a wide variety of conditions. I am very happy with mine and yours should give you good service.
-
I've got one of those carbs on my Indian, on a superb Indian Parts Europe manifold. Not tried it yet. Hey Lars, that's a nice bit of welding.
-
Wish i could afford SAHI injection. :cheers:
-
Thanks all' for your input !!!
Wish i could afford SAHI injection. :cheers:
But you CAN:
PayPal 1000$ to H2O@I'lltakethemoneyandrun.com
and I'll ship it to you right away.
WooooooHaaaaaaaaa, wazz'that :
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1a.jpg)
Yep: a bolt-on electric starter kit, for owners of INDIAN CHIEFs with weak knees,
made by a guy in Germany.
Just happens to fit right on my bike as well, as it shares gear-box and kick-starter set-up
with the CHIEF
If it can start the beastly CHIEF ( 1300 cc / 80 cu. in.) it can certainly start my tiny low-compression 600cc.
The starter motor is the same one that runs some big Sportster HD.
Expensive ? Not really; it was cheaper than the cheapest basic roller-starter
I could find ( !!! )
Another (of many ) "This-is-what-I-should-have-done-from-the-start" moments.
Auuurgh!
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1b.jpg)
Remove kick-starter and mount the bracket ( yellow circle )
on the kick starter 'rod' attached to the frame ,
then the back-plate , and the cogwheels etc
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-18.jpg)
and cover ( loose test set-up on pic )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-12.jpg)
and mount starter motor from behind
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5-5.jpg)
Now I "just" need to make a few adjustments, move the oil-catch tank and find a new place for the battery
and then hopefully final mounting and test-run today.
Here's the heart of the matter; the sprag clutch ( or "one-way bearing" , one might call it ).
Never seen one of them before
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4extraspraqueclutch.jpg)
....now back to work. I'm seriously running out of time here.
-
Blimey, Lars, I bet that wasn't cheap! Will you be running it from your standard battery, or using a slave unit? I'm struggling to find room for a small wheelchair battery on mine.
-
OK Got it
-
Blimey, Lars, I bet that wasn't cheap!
Mmmm: 'cheap' is a relative term , ain't it ?
It was cheaper than the most basic 'roller-starter' that I could find on the market
and
had I opted for something a bit more fancy, ( but still not the most expensive )
like the good looking sturdy roller-starter from Italy; I would have had to pay twice (!)
as much as I paid for the above set-up.
So; in a way; ....yes; cheap.
..Will you be running it from your standard battery, or using a slave unit?...
I don't have a 'standard battery' per se, as I don't have no alternator ,
so I was still trying to make up my mind about a battery for this 'total-loss' battery/ignition system.
May want to go for this: MOTY DESIGN batteries (http://www.motydesign.com/index.php)
Dunno.
Now back to work................been delayed as I had to fix my daily ride.
-
Of course you could always keep the battery in a cart and just attach leads at the starting line, I think the fellows with the indian streamliner could loan you one?
-
Plus -- look at the added traction you're gonna gain!
-
Those new batteries are light and small. Some of the chopper guys around here use two sets of the smaller batteries wired together but hidden away at two different locations on their bikes.
-
But that starter motor in the back has to add a pound or two.
-
Now, this is just my thinking and about 2 cents worth. I'm a bit stumped. This fragile starter is the first non essential item on the bike I can think of. Even given to me I'd think twice about fitting it. Every layer of complexity can (and will) turn around and bite a**. In addition to that -its a contraption that is hard to repair or borrow out there on the big white, in contrast to a busted roller starter. Heck, I'd even leave a kick starter pedal at the starting line. On the other hand the starter could be nifty for a swift getaway in a test session on the danish blacktop. Ooh yess, I bet I hit the nail there! :mrgreen:
-
You build a bike that cool and while Bonneville is the big picture, there's no avoiding taking it around town once or twice. The starter makes the bike as a whole that much more practical. IF it were mine, i'd show it off.
-Chad-
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IT'S ALIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIVE !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It starts like a pussycat
NO unpleasant machanical noise from the engine whatsoever
Took a bit of fixing intake leaks , ignition timing blah blah
but it starts ...it runs ....it sounds positively glorious !
( Can't hear that on the crappy video )
It goes like stink !
On the video ( one of the first starts ) it wasn't set up properly yet, so it backfires...farts....spits....the exhaust was
loose so it spit out flames, and there's still a LOT of dailing in to do...carb etc.
but now here tonight it goes kind'a'real well !
Click image
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/th_CIMG5203.jpg) (http://s207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/?action=view¤t=CIMG5203.mp4)
Been looking at this beast for a year and a half and .....F I N A L Y !!!!
I'm happy happy happy happy
happy happy happy happy
happy happy happy happy
happy happy happy happy
happy happy happy happy
happy happy happy happy
happy happy happy happy
happy happy happy happy
happy happy happy happy
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Congratulations!! What a beautiful machine, I can't wait to see it in person.
-
Congratulations Lars. It was all worth it!!! :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Pete
-
WoooHooooo Lars!!!!! When it first fires up all the late nights, broken parts, missing parts, nicks and cuts all vanish into the darkness. Congrats. Really looking forward to seeing it zoom along the salt.
-
Way to Go Lars!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1 :cheers: We're all very proud of you and the way you have stuck to your dream!!!!! Can't wait to be given the opportunity to protect your dream on the salt!!!!
Lynda
-
Congratulations
Fantastic
G :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
-
Cool!!!!!!
See ya on the salt.
-
Got it Salt Cracker
-
I think u need a way to attach your Salt Talks badge on that Bad Boy...........
Your project epitomizes the "home built" dream.
CONGRATULATIONS ! ! ! ! !
Protect the tank with a Salt Talks T-shirt.
FREUD
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I will wear my salt cracker tee shirt tha lars sent to me.
:cheers:
-
Good job Lars. That bike, and the starter motor, sound great.
-
That's a cool bike. Fine quality craftamanship. I hope you can make many return trips and hope to see it run.
-Chad-
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I will wear my salt cracker tee shirt tha lars sent to me.
:cheers:
Me too, but then I all ready promised to wear mine Saturday mornin!!!
Lynda
-
Thank you, thank you, thank you , all of you!!!!!!
You have no idea what it means to me to be to part of this group of good people
with all your kindness, your offers of advise, your offers of support and all your encouraging comments !
Thank you !
-
Congratulation Lars! On the other hand you don't have a clue what it means to me to be able to wach a project like this get together! I feel so fortunate that you let me in to your garage and share your tryings and tribulations as well as your succsess. Together with your excellent photography and witty humor it sure is fun and I only can raise a skal for you to this landmark of achievements. I got several of these skals in store to celebrate your forthcoming victories in your strive for a note in the books of Bonneville Land Speed Records. Well done Lars! :cheers:
P.s. Better give misfortunate JimL on 1350cc Pushrod bike a thought.
-
Beautifull dude!!! now its time for paperwork and transport headaches I have sent you some forms and stuff for you to look at so if you are reading this dont!! you have to get your ass into gear this paperwork and shipping takes time and governments and officials wont rush as they dont appreciate your hard work as much as we do, you cant miss it now for the sake of a few bits of paper or a missed detail.
But it is a work of art!!
Congrats Oz
-
are you sorted yet lars?
-
Like Charlie said (although I've not been on this forum that long) I've enjoyed the pleasure of watching you get it together, I've suffered your frustrations, and I, like many people on here, have sat with our fingers crossed, as if it our own bike, waiting for it to fire up. Well done Lars, you've made a lot of us happy too.
-
Lars your efforts inspired us we congratulate you :cheers:
-
I guess it's okay to tell everyone now: Lars' bike is on the 2010 Salt Talks t-shirt. I choose vehicles that have been the subject of build diaries here - especially because so many of them show massive amounts of personal work. Being on the shirt is my way of giving the builders the recognition they so well deserve. I don't have a final draft of the shirt art yet (even though it's done and the shirts are in production) - so because I don't have the final I don't think it's proper to show it. Don't worry -- you'll get your chance to look at the shirts when you buy some at Salt Talks.
-
WOW!!! :-o What an honor!!!! Guess I know where some of my moneys is going to go!!! :-D
Congratulations, Lars! Well deserved!
Lynda
-
I guess it's okay to tell everyone now: Lars' bike is on the 2010 Salt Talks t-shirt. I choose vehicles that have been the subject of build diaries here - especially because so many of them show massive amounts of personal work. Being on the shirt is my way of giving the builders the recognition they so well deserve. I don't have a final draft of the shirt art yet (even though it's done and the shirts are in production) - so because I don't have the final I don't think it's proper to show it. Don't worry -- you'll get your chance to look at the shirts when you buy some at Salt Talks.
Jon,
You made a good choice and it is nice to know that "railroading" is still an effective means of getting where you want to go. :-D
Lars,
If you have any shirts left and room to bring them, please do.
Don
-
Big honor Lars!! The major problem now as I see it is with your bikes picture on ALL those T shirts everyone will know who you are and you WILL have to go REALLY fast. No if ands or buts.
-
Congratulation! Another skal raised to your honor! :cheers: If there's anything you need and that somebody can help you with to get to the great white, you have to let us know...Now, where's your PayPal donation button??? and how do I buy a Saltcracker t-shirt?? 8-)
-
Thank you all !!! You make me blush
WOW!!! :-o What an honor!!!!.....
It certainly is !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I'm humbled.
VERY short update, as my stress-hormone level is at a point where
gushes of cortisol is pumping out my ears :
Thanks to the invaluable help from Oz ( you're a star Oz. I owe you big-time man ! )
who walked me through the procedures over the phone, I went through the trails an tribulations
of composing several pages paperwork to the US Department of Transportation that made it
possible to get through the even more complicated paperwork of submitting an application to the
US Environmental Protection Agency who in turn have now granted me at
"Racing Exemption" to the EPA rules, that allows me to enter the bike into the US,
as a racing bike and therefore exempted from the Importation of Motor Vehicle Subject to Federal Air Pollution Regulations
when attached to EPA Form 3520-1 as a "Code L", and the "Carnet" issued by the Danish Chamber of Commerce,
to whom I've paid a deposit , and they in turn have issued a Carnet that will guarantee
to the US Chamber of Commerce that the bike will be returned to Denmark
and therefore no customs or fees will have to be paid to the US Customs
and I also upon arrival fill out DOT Form HS-7 (along with the EPA Form 3520)
as a "Code 8", which is a declaration that I can enter the bike and be exempted from the
Federal Motor Vehicle Safety , Bumper and Theft Prevention Standards
There was a bit more to it, like going to the US Embassy to have none other
than the US Vice Consul to Denmark notarize my signature on the application/permit
and return said signed and notarized paper to EPA in order to make the Racing Exemption valid.
................PHEW , godallmighty!
Now THAT done, it turns out that the American partners to the Danish shipping agent
has somewhat f*cked up royalty and there seams to be a problem with the
whole shipping thing.
I'll get an answer to whether it will work out or not within the next couple of hours.
At the same time I'm working like a madman to get the last few bits on the bike ready.
More later. I'll answer your posts and comments then.
Wish me luck.
Thanks
-
What a huge pain in the A@#, best of luck.
-
Ah, one final challenge and then......YOU ARE ON YOUR WAY!!!!! How fantastic is that?!!!!!!! What an accomplishment!!
Lynda
-
Got it
-
that's great lars.
franey
-
Ah, one final challenge and then......YOU ARE ON YOUR WAY!!!!! How fantastic is that?!!!!!!! What an accomplishment!!
Lynda
Thank you Lynda!
Ultra short update:
BLIMY ! It looks like I might actually be going to Speed Week with the bike.
The shipping folks idiots, called Wednesday and told me they couldn't fix the problem at the American end, so
" Sorry Lars, we can't ship your bike. Bye bye"
( after fooling around with this matter for two weeks )
Found another shipper who acted fast and with LOTS of psycho-frantic complications it now looks like they can do it.
Knock on wood.
All I need to do now is finish xxx number of little, and not so little, things on the bike,
semi-dismantle it to get the size of the shipment down,
build the crate, crate the bike, get it to the shipper by Monday noon.....aurrrgh.
Ohh yes, then the small matters of getting the permission for me to enter the USA,
buying an airline ticket, sort out a rental van etc. etc.
More later .....I'm busy busy busy busy !
-
Hurray!!! I'll be watching for you at Land's End!!!!!! :cheers: :cheers:
Lynda
-
Fantastic, Here's to a successful time at the great white dyno, also really hope you are going to be able to attend the Salt Talks. Iam sure there will be a legion of fans just waiting their chance to bend your ear.
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
-
Bring your own qvark!
-
Lars,
When and where are you arriving?
Don
-
last year it was slc and sounds last minute.
lars, you can update later; get butt in gear.
franey
-
Bring your own qvark!
Qvark!
Me be a prohibited import
G
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Willie and I will have to look you up Lars. I love your build and would like to get some pics of you two. If you are in the pits look for the white mailbox. Looking forward to meeting you.
Willie and Sheri Buchta
-
Fantastic, Here's to a successful time at the great white dyno,
Thanks !
also really hope you are going to be able to attend the Salt Talks. Iam sure there will be a legion of fans just waiting their chance to bend your ear.
"fans" ? LOL .
I'm afraid you all will be disappointed by the bike.
My bike is a 'looks-great-from-a-ten-yards-distance' whack-job type of bike.
OK: listen up y'all: don't come any closer than ten yards to the bike.
It's radiating Danish Bacon Beams....VERY dangerous ! Stay away ! It's for your own safety !
The same goes for me BTW ( the looks-great-from-a-ten-yards-distance thing, that is ...ha ha )
Hurray!!! I'll be watching for you at Land's End!!!!!! :cheers: :cheers:
Lynda
Thanks !
...and I'll be watching for you Lynda
.-)
Don:
I'm flying in to SLC Thursday night...cheapo hotel in SLC...pick up van early Friday morning
...HOPEFULLY drag the bike out through customs during Friday....drive to the Salt....
...meet up with The Tri-Mac Speedsters Team from Washington state, coming with their blown two-stroke bike and
with whom I'll share camp at The Bend in the Road and pit
THEN
a week "off" and on to BUB where I'll share pit with
a Danish guy who lives in Reno who'll run his Vincent !
Hey what a trip!!!
I can't tell you how exited I am.
Not can't I tell you how empty my bank account is
Willie and I will have to look you up Lars. I love your build and would like to get some pics of you two. If you are in the pits look for the white mailbox. Looking forward to meeting you.
Willie and Sheri Buchta
Thanks !
I'll definitely look you up
Thanks all !!!
Looking forward to meet you !
Now back to work....need to do like a hundred
no, make that a thousand thing before delivering the bike to the shippers
tomorrow afternoon.
-
What a great build, I can't wait to see it in person.
Safe travels, see you on the salt
Dave :cheers:
-
Got it, I am leaving the sweat lodge on Thursday or Friday and should arrive at BUB on Saturday? Hopefully with the liner
-
Good luck, Lars. You are probably traveling now. We will see you at BUB.
-
Come on over and have some fun.
Watched your build for quite some time, you have my undivided attention.
Looking forward to meeting you and your sweetheart.
ray c wheeler
-
I have read this whole thread this afternoon.
That is a kewl bike and I wish you luck on the salt Lars. :cheers:
I signed up just so I could reply to this thread. :D
I will attend speed week one of these years. And maybe someday build a car to get me over 200mph, I know I would not be in "the" 200MPH club, but would still personally know I went 200MPH.
-
Thanks all for your kind words !
I'm afraid there's a few posts I haven't responded to.
Don't want to be rude , so please accept my apology
for not getting back to you, as I'm VERY short on time
making preparations here.
With invaluable help from a bunch of friends who, the last few days,
generously donated time and effort, the bike was send off yesterday.
If you read this: 1000 tak drenge for jeres fantastiske hjælp.
Tak Moen, Mads, Jakob Ole, Kasper, Allan, Abel, Jakob Bonfils, Peter !!!
...and a BIG thanks to this brilliant forum:
Jon who makes it all possible and all the members here how have
helped, encouraged , provided info and generally been great !
Without you this would never have happened !
...
Even the crating became a 'project' in itself.
Needed to be within certain measurement , needed to be as light as possible
and needed to be forklift maneuverable from both sides.
The local Harley Davidson dealership donated a gigantic motorcycle transport-pallet
that we cut down to size and the partly dismantled bike mounted on it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c-3.jpg)
and an aluminum box was build on top of it.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d-3.jpg)
-
Nice job Lars. Take lots of pictures so you can pack it again that way for the trip home!!! :-D :-D :evil:
Pete
-
Lars
I've kept tabs on your build--awsome job
I know the packing problem
Vincent sidecar I'm helping my mate with for BUB
(http://)(http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg102/bonesracing/IMGP3831.jpg)
I'll keep an eye out for a verry kool Indian
cheers Bones
-
Thanks guys !
Bones : is that a thing made of wood
that the bike is on ?
I was told that you can not enter USA with wood as part of the packaging
unless it's heat-treated to some VERY strict specifications ( seriously ).
Click this International Standards For Phytosanitary Measures No. 15 (ISPM 15) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISPM_15)
Don't see the USA on the list and it seams that plywood is OK
but that's not what the shipping company's USA folks said so........
I'll keep an eye out for a very cool Vincent
-
Merely reading your final posts has got my adrenaline flowing Lars. All the best mate.
-
I used one of the same Harley crates to ship my bike to Australia,thanks to my local dealer.
See ya soon,Bones!
-
Thanks Chris.
....................................
This is ridiculous:
Ab so lu te last minute problem:
Anyone happens to have a set of leathers / boots / gloves / helmet
for a guy like me ....5' 11" / 175 pound ?....that I can use a couple of times on the Salt ?
Cause I don't.....( long story )
.
-
Thanks Chris.
....................................
This is ridiculous:
Ab so lu te last minute problem:
Anyone happens to have a set of leathers / boots / gloves / helmet
for a guy like me ....5' 11" / 175 pound ?....that I can use a couple of times on the Salt ?
Cause I don't.....( long story )
.
I believe Willie did at one time... I'm sure he'll check in any time...
-
Lars come on, come on we will get you some leathers---ours are a little larger but you are welcome---Sparky 602-762-2211
-
My leathers are for the 175 pounds -- but about 6'4" tall. Nonetheless -- we're not racing this week, so if you haven't found another set -- find me and we'll see how they fit you. Size 14 boots -- large/extra large gloves. Our trailer is right near the end of the pits close by registration. Look for the Seldom Seen Slim logos on it.
-
Hello,
I have a set of leathers that fit me when I was 165 lbs and 5'10". They are a one piece suit in race shape. I would give them to your cause if they are something you desire.
Jim :cheers:
-
Lars,
What size boot in U.S. measurement?
Don
-
Thank you for your kind offers !
Just arrived in SLC. Knackered ! Hopefully pick up bike tomorrow Friday.
Head for the salt.
Lars come on, come on we will get you some leathers---ours are a little larger but you are welcome---Sparky 602-762-2211
Thank you Sparky ! I'll get back to you when I get there
My leathers are for the 175 pounds -- but about 6'4" tall. Nonetheless -- we're not racing this week, so if you haven't found another set -- find me and we'll see how they fit you. Size 14 boots -- large/extra large gloves. Our trailer is right near the end of the pits close by registration. Look for the Seldom Seen Slim logos on it.
Thanks Jon. I'll look you up
Hello,
I have a set of leathers that fit me when I was 165 lbs and 5'10". They are a one piece suit in race shape. I would give them to your cause if they are something you desire.
Jim :cheers:
That's awfully kind of you. How do I contact you
Lars,
What size boot in U.S. measurement?
Don
That would be size 9 ( + the Nomex socks, I guess )
Thanks and
see you !
Need sleep...badly.
-
Lars
The box is a steel Harley crateand we cover it with ply wood. It has been sent 2x before
We've been told -manufactured wood- is ok
Australia has verry strict quarenteen laws.
Did you take the at the end of the road
LOTS OF LUCK Bones
-
Sleep? You don't have time for that.
You have a bike to assemble.
I'll see you in tech
Graham
-
Hi Lars and everyone else,
The rest of us back in Copenhagen are very curious to get an update! How are things going, Lars?
Maybe someone on this forum could could could give an update on what's going on if Lars is having trouble getting online, and you happen to bump into him - and maybe even post a few pics?!? :-)
Have fun - we all hope to join next year!
Kasper and the rest of the crew.
-
There is a PIC of Lars Indian in the Pits being reassembled on Landstrom's Foundry.com at the BBS section. Its anout 8 or 9 from the top.
-
Lars at wendover,
Hope you don't mind lars, I'll miss it
Rocky
1957 S/VG
[img width= height=]http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-11/1109362/lars%20om%20salt.jpg[/img]
-
Well. The bike is thru tech. We just need to see lars's safety
Gear and it's all
G
-
I'm following the thread "Speedweek 2010" on Bonneville general chat here on this forum and I can only find 2 notes about Lars, reply #604 where mentioned he is putting the bike together, and reply #651 that he's desperate looking for Mikuni jets. Must be great conditions this year, records is slaughtered big time over there, every day! Love to be there but for Lars I figure there's a lot of mental stress beeing such a rushed and somewhat hyped build, with shortage of test time and all things new, getting rookie license and all that. I'm shure he's coping with all that pressure and is having a blast and I'm hoping the bike is holding together for at least one good run! Whatabout the other Indians over there? What start numbers do they have and as I'm a flathead fan anyone know of other flathead engined participans?
-
Here is Lars going thru tech
-
Hi Lars and everyone else,
The rest of us back in Copenhagen are very curious to get an update! How are things going, Lars?
Maybe someone on this forum could could could give an update on what's going on if Lars is having trouble getting online, and you happen to bump into him - and maybe even post a few pics?!? :-)
Have fun - we all hope to join next year!
Kasper and the rest of the crew.
Kasper !!!!....håber du fik min email ?!! Har ikke kunne komme online før nu.
Short update ( more later when I get my pics organized and uploaded)
Everything has gone well and I've had a flipping FANTASTIC time !!!!!!!
Picked up the bike in SLC and rode straight to Bonneville
and unpacked the beast:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-19.jpg)
Those two guys helping me is the brothers George and Jim of the Tri-Mac Speedsters Team
who graciously invited me to share camp at the bend in the road,
and pit with them.
Man; I'm telling you; you couldn't ask for better company than those two guys.
Thank you, thank you, thank you George and Jim for your hospitality, for your help
and your just brilliant funny and witty company !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
....and then you find yourself 5400 miles from home in a desert of salt, with a lump of metal,
going : "...what the hell have I got myself into.."
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-19.jpg)
...but my 'new workshop' is just beauuuuuutiful:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-13.jpg)
...thaks to Sparky's friend Joey I got myself equipped with leathers and all
( PHEW it was HOT !!!)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4-9.jpg)
...so I could do my rookie-run on Georges splendid little 100cc supercharged inter-cooled two-stroke.
This is George telling me: "..No funny stuff..you hear me ?!!...just give it all it's got..."
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/6-4.jpg)
...and loo and behold: off I went down the salt YEEEEEHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
and can now call myself a Bonneville Salt Flats Landspeed Racer ( or sum'thing like that)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7-4.jpg)
What a feeling !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Got the bike together after a series of expected unexpected problems, modifications
and general fooling around and got it into Tech Inspection
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/8-1.jpg)
...who swamped around it, this being a class A Special Build that I do believe requires
extra scrueteny
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9-1.jpg)
...paperwork
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/10-1.jpg)
I'll see you in tech
Graham
...indeed ! The approval was handed over by none other than Graham a.k.a. 'grumm'.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/11.jpg)
...except; to get it into the logbook it was required that I show up with the leathers etc.
but the rightful owner was using them at this time and because of unforeseen circumstances
he had to leave early this morning , and the deal about borrowing them this morning fell through.
Also I was supposed to show up with Georges support vehicle and CB and fire extinguisher equipment
but they also had to leave today.
I HAD an idea about running it today, but I was having trouble of getting the jets
and the timing right , so running will be at BUB in ten days.
Never mind; I had expected this outcome, I've had the time of my life here,
met a bunch of great great guys who helped me, seen some spectacular cars
in spectacular action
................................. and I ran on the salt .
FLIPPING BRILLIANTLY FANTASTIC !!!!!!
I'm going on a little tour and then back to the Salt...back to BUB.
Doesn't get any better than this.
More pic and stuff later.
Hope you don't mind lars
Not at all, my man.
I'm shure he's coping with all that pressure and is having a blast
...indeed. Indeed I am !
-
Lars,
Glad to hear you are having a good time. :cheers:
Tom G.
-
Lars, It's great to see pics of you and your bike on the salt finally... :cheers:
Look forward to seeing at Bubs.
Larry
-
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9-1.jpg)
...And then I said to my wife -If I can get those flower pattern cushions at a 15% reduction, then I just have to buy the blouse....whatdoyouthink Lars? Pink or off white???
-
Lars, it looks like we are sort of the same size. We will be at BUB and you can use my leathers etc. when I am not running. We will be there on Tues.
-
It's amazing to see the saltcracker out of the workshop and placed into it's natural habitat on the salt-flats. It is obvious that this is it's true home, and I'm thinking you're gonna have trouble lassoing it back in the crate and getting it back to Copenhagen ;-)
-
Lars, If you need leathers.....we have a extra set in the trailer.......also tools and gas welding equipment
(sorry no tig) cold water....cold beer....look for the Barnett truck.....trailer Bakker Motorsports.....sidecar
#1194.....at the front of the pits.....see you at the BUB........
-
Lars, a PS. to the last post......our team will be at the BUB event starting Friday as we will be setting up the pit areas for BUB........if you need anything or help.......... contact me at the hotel (Montego) or Lands end..
Bob Bakker
-
Lars,
Glad to hear you are having a good time. :cheers:
Tom G.
Thanks Tom !
Lars, It's great to see pics of you and your bike on the salt finally... :cheers:
Look forward to seeing at Bubs.
Larry
Likewise !
See ya' !
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9-1.jpg)
...And then I said to my wife -If I can get those flower pattern cushions at a 15% reduction, then I just have to buy the blouse....whatdoyouthink Lars? Pink or off white???
Sorry but you are mis-informed;
What he said was:
"..now I got this fancy orange thing on my head, I really need an orange suit to go with it.."
Lars, it looks like we are sort of the same size. We will be at BUB and you can use my leathers etc. when I am not running. We will be there on Tues.
Thanks a lot for your kind offer WW!
I'll find you there.
It's amazing to see the saltcracker out of the workshop and placed into it's natural habitat on the salt-flats. It is obvious that this is it's true home, and I'm thinking you're gonna have trouble lassoing it back in the crate and getting it back to Copenhagen ;-)
Guess you're right Kasper.
A BIG thank you goes out to you, and the other guys, who helped me get ready
for going over here.
I owe you ...bigtime !
Lars, If you need leathers.....we have a extra set in the trailer.......also tools and gas welding equipment
(sorry no tig) cold water....cold beer....look for the Barnett truck.....trailer Bakker Motorsports.....sidecar
#1194.....at the front of the pits.....see you at the BUB........
Lars, a PS. to the last post......our team will be at the BUB event starting Friday as we will be setting up the pit areas for BUB........if you need anything or help.......... contact me at the hotel (Montego) or Lands end..
Bob Bakker
Thank Bob !
I'd be happy to give a hand Friday to help the BUB folks setting up what-ever
out there.
What do I do ?....just show up early Friday morning or..?
-
What I was saying was
"if you want go get this through tech you'll need to
Come back with some decent beer 'cos I've had enough
Of this Coors light that every one around here drinks!!!"
G
-
Thanks for the offer to help, Lars........but we got it covered and have plenty of help....See you on the salt next Sat. ........B.B......
-
Lars, did you manage to find any jets? If not, ask around to see if anyone has a set of "Sizing Drills" (that's what they're called in the UK). Basically, they come as a boxed set of drills with a brass holder on each, and range from the size of a hair up to about 1.5mm, and are used to drill out jets by hand. I used to use them to re-jet chops (CB 750 etc) after changing pipes and filters.
-
Lars,
I will be landing in SLC at 10:30am Friday with #46, 48, 50, 52, 54, 56 pilot jets for your CV Carb.,
plus picking up refilled Nitrous bottles for some other riders.
Should be in Wendover by Mid afternoon.
I will be at the Quality Inn, Room #128
Cell Phone 219-926-5647
:cheers:
Drew Gatewood
-
Now Lars, as you obviously got nothing to do with the bike, nothing important going on at Bonneville and I think you're not heavy on the bottle there must be only one reason why there's no update, it must be wimen! Well overdue for a ban of woman in Wendover I think!!! :mrgreen:
I found some updates and pictures on the IPE website:
http://www.indianpartseurope.com/
I knew that! He's fooling around with rubbers!!
Hey Lars, I always let my girl do the blowtest!
-
Hey Lars;
We are all cheering for you up here in Canada! Wish we could be there to see your dream come true! WFO Brother.
Colin
-
Lars, sure wish I was there to cheer you on, si I will do it from home. Best to you.
Glen :cheers:
-
Thanks Drew for the jets ( that man is gold )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/10DREWkomforbimeddissejuhuuu.jpg)
Thanks Chris/desperate for the advise. We must be on the same wavelength, cause I did just that
when I was in SLC shopping last Saturday
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/dsds.jpg)
Thanks Charlie...I always use rubber
Thanks Colin !...long time no see. Sorry you couldn't make it. I really hope to meet you next year
Thanks Glen. I'm sorry we didn't meet. I would have been honored to shake your hand. Next year ..OK ?!!!
And now that I'm at it : THANKS to all the folks at Speed Week that I met, for giving me such a good time.
It was just great meeting the fine members of this forum Lynda, Jon and his wife, Sparky, Rex, Don, Ray,
Pork Pie, Graham, Willie, Sheri, Nortonist/Bill and a bunch more who's name slips my mind right now...
sorry.... but my meeting-good-people-memory is on overload right now, but will come back to me.
It's quite an incredible crowd of good people there !!!!!!!!!!!!
Spend the last week in Wild Wild Wendover, passing my time practicing my contortionist act
working on the bike strapped inside the van, doing all kinds of stuff; re-checking valves, etc.etc.etc.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5371-1.jpg)
..and doing a leak-test: bicycle inner-tube attached to intake flange + pump from the supermarket
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5387-1.jpg)
that exposed a couple of ...mumble mumble mumble....
...and working on the carb inside the motel-room that look more and more like
a self storage room, than a motel-room, what with the shipping box, pallets, spare-parts, tools etc. in there.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5389.jpg)
Met up with Bob ( "MC1314" ) who paid me a visit the last few days up to BUB, keeping me company.
WHAT a great guy !
Bob is a VERY youthful 73 years not-old guy, and he came all the way from South Carolina , ( that's a 2300
miles drive each way (!)) just to volunteer at the pre-stage, and get a chance to ride his 100 cc bike.
Maaaaan: the good people one meet here !
BUB finally arrived and boy'oh'boy ; the bikes one get to see !
Sorry new-bikes-guys... I'm not dissing you, but my personal preference are the home-brewed slightly insane crazy bikes
like these flipping amazing creations:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0179.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0174.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0176.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0185.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0206.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0207.jpg)
and of cause the classics like these
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0217.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0213.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0209.jpg)
...and this brilliant Vincent Black Lightning, that happens to belong to my pit-host
Kurt from Reno:
Will ya' look at that beautiful bike!
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0198.jpg)
Now here's a bit of advise: you wanna set a record ?
OK all you have to do is invite me to share pit with you.
At Speed Week my pit-host George immediately set a record, and here at BUB
Kurt immediately set a record.
So there you go; Invite me into your pit!....it's gonna cost you of cause...ha ha !
Have met yet a new bunch of guys from the forum; WizzBang, Bruin, Woobly Walrus/Bo,;Bak
, Larry and a bunch more ( again: sorry I can't remember the names right now...again: good guys name over-dose )
Got through Tech. Inspection without any issues.
Did a test run away from the pits ( unlike Speed Week, one can do that at BUB )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a1-4.jpg)
A couple of the guys I spend time with at BUB back in 2008 as member of theDreamcatcherr crew,
Neil and Magoo, came down from Minnesota for a couple of days, just to say hello.
THAT was nice. Great guys !
Well my bike is F I N A L L Y ready ( I think...believe...erh....hope )
after I realized what the problem with the engine was in fact:
Erhhhh; I had mumble mumble, mumble, for which of cause I have a legitimate excuse..................not.
Anyway: it now runs and sounds quite flipping nice.
SO the great moment arrived: got in the leathers, helmet, gloves, boots ( THANKS Woobly Walrus/Bo).
Fired up the little beast to do a final ( yeah...right ) test run
...large'ish bunch of people gathered to see where all the noise was coming from.......expectations were high....all eyes at me...
Reeeeeeved up the beast to show off ....and yanked the gear-lever into first....KLONK.....
one silly Dane sat there with a broken off gear-lever in his hand.
All dressed up and nowhere to go......ha ha ha ha...talk about feeling dumb.
BIG thank to Bob Bakkker / "bak" for ( yet again; he also lent me leathers for first test-ride) coming to my rescue
brazing (spelling) the bloody thing back together.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/brazing.jpg)
Thanks man !
Gotta get my act together. I've got two and a half days left.
Wish me luck.
Advise I: don't ever take an un-tested, un-finished bike to the Salt.
It's a waste of time.
Advise II: disregard the above advise, 'cause the Salt is the best place
on earth to waste your time
PS:
regardless: I'm having a BLAST here !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
and if everything else fails , at least I captured the perfect Kodak-moment:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0195.jpg)
It's all good !
Good night you all. Gotta get up at 5.00.
-
Lars,
It was a pleasure meeting you at Speed Week.
I sure wish I was at Bubs to hear that little Indian run.
Hope to see you again next year and thank you for the shirts.
Don and Gus
-
Lars, One of the highlights of SpeedWeek was meeting you and having a chat (far too brief). A truckload of good luck tomorrow. Eagerly awaiting a very rapid report.
-
Well, well, well; the run today will be tomorrow.
Just when I thought everything was honky dory the tank started to break loose
because of the threads going up into the tank from underneath being notsogood.
With the aid from this great guy David, who lurks here on the forum
we got it fixed.
By some miracle the local auto parts store happened to have a heli-coil set
in the next size metric bolt; M10 and the right drill for it. Wonder of wonder.
Then when I thought everything was honky dory ( am I repeating myself here ???)
I started up to do a test ride the just-fixed gear lever broke off again...huh?
Must bee some voodoo in that thing. The metal looks kind'a strange...like charcoal or something.
OK so then David goes: maaaaaaybe we could....naaa....it won't work...or ?!
YES indeed it works:
Gear-lever Series II:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0233.jpg)
David has been a great help here at BUB.
Thanks David !!!
Finally got to do a series of test runs, and it runs just great and strong.
Time was running out so the bike is now on stand-by, ready for running first thing in the morning
.
Lars, One of the highlights of SpeedWeek was meeting you and having a chat (far too brief). A truckload of good luck tomorrow. Eagerly awaiting a very rapid report.
You're too kind.
Thank you Bill.
Looking forward to see you next year.
Lars,
It was a pleasure meeting you at Speed Week....
...Hope to see you again next year and thank you for the shirts.
Don and Gus
Likewise Don !
Hope to see you next year !!!
...I sure wish I was at Bubs to hear that little Indian run....
Well; here's what it sounds like. Not the sound of your average Indian 741
( Turn up sound and CLICK the image)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/th_CIMG5407.jpg) (http://s207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/?action=view¤t=CIMG5407.mp4)
The "hands above the head" thing is the typical
"I've-spend-days-on-the-Salt-messing-with-my-bike-and-now-it-finally-runs-good" - gesture.
.
-
It sounds mean, go get'em lars! :evil:
-
I like the sound of that Lars! Added your updates through Indian Parts Europe to our website. Ride that thing like you stole it!
Colin
-
Go Lars Go--- sorry we could not stay Joey had to get back to work...
-
Vroom Vrooom Just plain and simple Mozart to my ears, Go get em tommorrow!!!!!
:cheers: :cheers:
-
waiting for news. Hope he did good.
-
Watched Lars roll off mile 3 long course this morning ... Bike sounded strong ... didnt hear speed ...
-
Thanks folks !!!
Short update. More later.
First pass on the course:
blew the front head gasket JUST as I was
entering the 'timing mile'.
Replaced gasket.
Second run ; blew the rear head gasket JUST before I was leaving the 'timing mile',
but at least this time I got a timing slip.
88.198 mph.
Not bad really with a blown head gasket.
Only, this time the blown gasket meant that the flames had eaten a chunk of the head.
The leak had probably been there for a little while.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1auch2.jpg)
I have failed miserably in "racing" terms.
But HELL: it has been one flipping trip of a fantastic ride and I fåcking did it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1Ifggingdidit.jpg)
...I build, and rode my own little INDIAN on The Bonneville Salt Flats
with the immeasurable help from the greatest bunch of people on this planet
-
Time for solid copper gaskets Lars and if that's an aluminum head, and it appears to be, it'll be a piece of cake to weld it up. Good luck in the future and well done for this time!
Pete
-
Looks and sounds like winner to me!!! Congratulations on the "race down the salt" and the timing slip for 88.198 mph!!! Worthy effort Lars, you are a true Land Speed Racer!! :cheers: :cheers:
It is an honor to know you. You've done yourself, your country, and your fellow racers proud!!!
Lynda
-
Well done Lars, your dream came true !
Iv'e been following your build and can relate to the hurdles that got in your way , and admire the way you overcame difficulties that may have stopped a lesser man,,,,,
Let the addiction continue,,,,,,,,,,
Tiny (in OZ)
-
More updates on IPE site! 88+ with a blown headgasket. What's the remedy for a groove in the gasket surface on a flathead guys? I'm sure he's all over it and got lot of hours to grind it away until tomorrow but would be interesting to hear others roadside solution. I bet tons of people have been experience this back in the days. JB weld and clamp it on with a milk carton gasket? Mexican mill with a concrete slab?
Oops, looks like I'm a bit slow... noth'n new.
Copper gaskets can break too.(http://)
-
Lars, CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The speed is irrelevant. That you did it is what counts. So many sit on their butts and dream. You built a bike that was almost too pretty to take on the salt and then haul it 7300 miles and run it. I said earlier it was a pleasure to talk with you. Let me add that to it is an honor to know you. A big tip of the hat to you!
-
Lars,
I am so happy for you. You did great. We all were waiting for reports on your efforts, and even though you ran into some gremlins you did great. My hat is off to you, and I know you had a blast.
Regards,
Tom G.
-
It's amazing how once again, a little Indian and her dreamer have captured our hearts!!!
Lynda
-
Congratulations, Lars! :cheers: When I wear your shirt and people ask about it I will be proud to tell them your story.
-
That first run this morning sounded reall strong when you left mile 3 ... beautiful machine and well done ... Joe
-
Great job Lars! Only wish I could have stuck around to see you run. Oh, well, maybe next year. You know George is really pushing my dad and I to build some thing for next year.
-
Lars that is bloody fantastic.... your Scout sounds allot faster than 88.198 MPH. Yup copper head gaskets, copper coat the head bolt threads and multiple head torque and re-torque again. You have come a long way and not just Geographically...... you got the bug?
Cheers Mate!
Joe
Melbourne, Australia
-
Lars - Congratulations my friend! There is no better accomplishment than a run on the salt with a machine that you built. The experience will enrichen your life as will the friends made along the trail. You have the respect of the Time Cycles Racing Team. Colin.
-
Excellent just running up the salt is enough!!!
A dream come true eh!!
oz
-
Time for solid copper gaskets Lars and if that's an aluminum head, and it appears to be, it'll be a piece of cake to weld it up. Good luck in the future and well done for this time!
Pete
Thanks Pete !
Looks and sounds like winner to me!!! Congratulations on the "race down the salt" and the timing slip for 88.198 mph!!! Worthy effort Lars, you are a true Land Speed Racer!! :cheers: :cheers:
It is an honor to know you. You've done yourself, your country, and your fellow racers proud!!!
Lynda
Lynda...my favorite Speed Week Person !!!...THANKS !!!
Well done Lars, your dream came true !
Iv'e been following your build and can relate to the hurdles that got in your way , and admire the way you overcame difficulties that may have stopped a lesser man,,,,,
Let the addiction continue,,,,,,,,,,
Tiny (in OZ)
Thanks Tiny....ohh yes this is well on it's way to turn into an ( rather expensive ) addiction
More updates on IPE site! 88+ with a blown headgasket. What's the remedy for a groove in the gasket surface on a flathead guys? I'm sure he's all over it and got lot of hours to grind it away until tomorrow but would be interesting to hear others roadside solution. I bet tons of people have been experience this back in the days. JB weld and clamp it on with a milk carton gasket? Mexican mill with a concrete slab?
Oops, looks like I'm a bit slow... noth'n new.
Copper gaskets can break too.(http://)
Yes.
.-)
I'll come up with something.
ONE thing ( out of MANY ) I've learned is: be better prepared
Lars, CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The speed is irrelevant. That you did it is what counts. So many sit on their butts and dream. You built a bike that was almost too pretty to take on the salt and then haul it 7300 miles and run it. I said earlier it was a pleasure to talk with you. Let me add that to it is an honor to know you. A big tip of the hat to you!
THANKS !...and a tip of the hat back to you Bill !
Lars,
I am so happy for you. You did great. We all were waiting for reports on your efforts, and even though you ran into some gremlins you did great. My hat is off to you, and I know you had a blast.
Regards,
Tom G.
Yes indeed, I had an unbelievable bast !
Thanks Tom !
Congratulations, Lars! :cheers: When I wear your shirt and people ask about it I will be proud to tell them your story.
Thanks George , you're too kind.
That first run this morning sounded real strong when you left mile 3 ... beautiful machine and well done ... Joe
Thanks Joe.
Yep: I do believe is goes real strong. Time to do a proper job on the engine
Great job Lars! Only wish I could have stuck around to see you run. Oh, well, maybe next year. You know George is really pushing my dad and I to build some thing for next year.
Thanks . I was great meeting you and your dad....now get started building that thing !!!!
Lars that is bloody fantastic.... your Scout sounds allot faster than 88.198 MPH. Yup copper head gaskets, copper coat the head bolt threads and multiple head torque and re-torque again. You have come a long way and not just Geographically...... you got the bug?
Cheers Mate!
Joe
Melbourne, Australia
Yep: got the bug ...big time.
Thanks Joe !
Lars - Congratulations my friend! There is no better accomplishment than a run on the salt with a machine that you built. The experience will enrichen your life as will the friends made along the trail. You have the respect of the Time Cycles Racing Team. Colin.
Thanks Colin....now promise me we'll get to meet again next year !
yes; you're right about "the friends made along the trail".
It's quite a fantastic and humbling experience how 'unknown people' turns into friends during this thing.
Excellent just running up the salt is enough!!!
A dream come true eh!!
oz
Yes Oz...and you were a great help. Without your help I would never have figured out all the friggin' paperwork
involved in shipping the bike.
Thanks Oz !
-
Lars, like I said on the Salt. "Your here, that's the biggest part of the battle". It was a pleasure meeting you and seeing you on the salt. Your story here can be an inspiration to many.
Larry :cheers:
You didn't happen to spill some of that rum into the tank and cause the blown head gasget did you...
-
Lars, like I said on the Salt. "Your here, that's the biggest part of the battle". It was a pleasure meeting you and seeing you on the salt.
Thanks. Likewise !
You didn't happen to spill some of that rum into the tank and cause the blown head gasget did you...
Errhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh:
After numerous conversations , phone calls and email correspondences with experts
from all over the world, there is general agreement what caused the top end gasket blows:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5420.jpg)
In a vain attempt to emulate the distinguished Mr. Munro
adding a 'secret' ingredient to the fuel,
I added a few drops of Danish Aquavit 'snaps' to the tank
Bad vibe.
1)..you don't f*** with Burt Munro's legacy
2)..it is common knowledge that 'snaps' will blow the top end gasket
in any person who drinks it, and my Saltcracker being quite a personality it obviously goes for her too
Now THAT explains everything.
Here's a few pictures of what has got to be the most exiting moments of my life
Waiting the be send of for the first run
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5418.jpg)
Nervous ?...moi ?...naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1turnright.jpg)
"Don't go right. Don't go left. Don't do donuts. Go STRAIGHT....fastlike !"
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1b-1.jpg)
What the *ell am I doing here...must be nuts
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5444.jpg)
Go, go, go ....honestly I can't remember the start of the run.
I remember shortly after , feeling like I was in a vacuum hearing my breath
inside the helmet and thinking: "hold on, hold on ......faster faster"..
and realizing that the handle was cranked all the way.
One good thing about my bike:
I really had no idea how it would 'feel' out there.
It felt safe. A bit scary, but in a good way
.-)
W H A T T H E * E E L I S T H E M A T T E R W I T H T H I S
L A N D S P E E D C O M M U N I T Y ???
They just can't help themselves, can they ?
They just can't stop being good people:
Got out to the Salt Thursday morning to pack up.
My Danish friends and the pit, that I had shared, was gone.
The little INDIAN sits there all by itself with a tarp cover looking quite forlorn.
It's all over for now
and the whole thing is just a little bit sad.
Then I lift the cover and see this:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5453.jpg)
Some unknown person had left a bottle of bubble water,
as a congratulation I take it.
Big boys don't cry.
-
Lars
It was a pleasure meeting you before the racing began, watching you work on the Indian was really refreshing. Guys like you make racing what it is, congratulations on your run, next year I think you will go a lot faster (remember my prediction?).
The real reason the head disintegrated was the Akavit was only 40%!!!! Bring the good stuff next year.
Have a great year!
Best Wishes
Bob #1314
Don't forget the movie!!!
-
Thanks for coming over and sharing the salt addiction with us.
It was a pleasure meeting you.
ray wheeler racing usa
-
Lars, it was the high point of the week for me to finally meet you and shake your hand. I feel that I'm a better man for having met you. You took the trials and tribulations with a smile and enjoyed the whole experience, and that says a lot. Like I told you several times through the week, usually when things went bad, Welcome to Bonneville.
Your bike is absolutely more beautiful in person than in pictures, great workmanship and design all around. I'm sure that with a little refinement and tuning it's destined to put down some great runs. I can't wait to see what you'll make it do.
(http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m68/Whizzbang02/Bonneville%202010/100_4553.jpg)
-
..
-
Brilliant Lars, you did it!
Panic, I like your idea of adding more bolts, I'm seriously thinking of making a pair of heads for my own Indian (I was about to contact Moen at IPU to scrounge a scrap head to use as a pattern). The heads on my motor are the only part I'm not happy with, but mostly because loads of fins are bent or broken.
-
Lars, it was great meeting you at the BUB, our team was very happy to help you out......here is hoping you can again make it back to the salt in 2011...........................................................................
PS. Now it is time to start working on that great looking BSA.........................................................
-
Lars
It is super to see you make it here and participate.
Not a motorbike guy, but have loved watching your build and finally running such a unique machine.
The design and materials of the cylinder head gasket that failed is NOT the most robust for any engine, particularly a boosted motor.
If you would like, send me a PM and I can offer opinions/suggestions.
Rick@RBMotorsports.com
Again Congratulations for your successful trip. You have a lot to be proud of.
-
..
-
Lars
It was a pleasure meeting you before the racing began, watching you work on the Indian was really refreshing.
Guys like you make racing what it is...
Guys like YOU ( the volunteers ) makes it all possible .
A big Thanks goes out to you and the other volunteers !
...and a BIG Thanks goes out to AMA , and one guy in particular:
The eminent Mr. Drew Gatewood who came to my rescue.
That guy simply radiates good karma
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Drew-Kopi.jpg)
Thanks Drew !!!
congratulations on your run, next year I think you will go a lot faster (remember my prediction?).
The real reason the head disintegrated was the Akavit was only 40%!!!! Bring the good stuff next year.
Have a great year!
Best Wishes
Bob #1314
Don't forget the movie!!!
I won't
.-)
You have a great year too, my man.
I'll bring the good stuff next year and go faster.
See you in 2011 !
Thanks for coming over and sharing the salt addiction with us.
It was a pleasure meeting you.
ray wheeler racing usa
Thanks. Likewise Ray !
Lars, it was the high point of the week for me to finally meet you and shake your hand. I feel that I'm a better man for having met you. You took the trials and tribulations with a smile and enjoyed the whole experience, and that says a lot. Like I told you several times through the week, usually when things went bad, Welcome to Bonneville.
Thanks for your kind words !
For those who don't know Ed/Whizzbang: I'm telling you; this guy is a class act,
who imbodies the true Bonneville spirit.
By now all my friends know who "Ed" from Bonneville is.
Please tell me you'll be back next year !
Your bike is absolutely more beautiful in person than in pictures, great workmanship and design all around. I'm sure that with a little refinement and tuning it's destined to put down some great runs. I can't wait to see what you'll make it do.
Nor can I
....only 335 days left
.-)
Lars, it was great meeting you at the BUB, our team was very happy to help you out......here is hoping you can again make it back to the salt in 2011...
Mr. Bakker ! : I owe you BIGtime.
Here's another man embodying the Bonneville spirit AND showing enormous generosity:
Not only did he come to my aid, fixing my broken gearlever and lending me a set of leathers,
but he GAVE it to me to take home !!!
Mr. Bakker: please take a bow !
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5426.jpg)
PS: do you think my bum looks big in them leathers ?
...ha ha
-
do you think my bum looks big in them leathers ?
...ha ha
Lars. Just fit a (really) wider rear tire and you'll be fine. : - )
Bob is a stand up guy. LSR is the better for him being involved.
-
Got the bike back into the box
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0254-1.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0255.jpg)
...spend time cleaning the gas-tank, oil-tank and carb as they went into my luggage
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0259.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0260.jpg)
..as it enabled me to avoid having to ship the bike as "dangerous goods"
which is much more expensive.
Spend a LOT of time cleaning the rental van inside out.
It took F O R E V E R !
Spend a couple of days after delivering the bike in SLC
going to the Miller Race track motorcycle 'Vintage GP'
and taking a trip to Park City in the mountains
then back to Copenhagen
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/showmapphp.jpg)
WHAT A FANTASTIC TRIP from dream
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Beforewaybefore-1.jpg)
..to reality
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/doing2.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Doing.jpg)
Let me take this opportunity to send the biggest heartfelt Thank You possible to Moen at
INDIAN PARTS EUROPE (http://www.indianpartseurope.com/)
without whose invaluable help none of this would have been possible !
.
-
A few thoughts on the head gasket problem?
Yes please. Thank you
It's at a very hot spot - the exhaust seat, and far away from the cooling influence of the intake tract.
Besides gasket integrity, there are 3 other possible contributors to the failure:
1. the cylinder's head-gasket surface is not flat at operating temperature due to local temp-induced warping.
2. the cylinder is not flat due to leverage from valve spring tension (the springs are far outboard of the bore center, and have mechanical advantage).
3. you may have borderline clamping force at the failure point.
1. I don't know of any fix except thermal barrier coat inside the port. Is the exterior fin surface bare? Painted? Coated? I have a feeling that the entire upper end could be held flat by a stiffening plate secured above the head on stand-offs using longer bolts. It doesn't have to be really thick if it has a "dorsal fin" extended across the center span (it's also another heat convection dump, and air scoop).
2. I'm trying to make a "rev kit" fixture for my SV to load some spring tension against the crankcase rather than the cylinders. It can be a substantial steel plate under the cylinder base, extending to the right with "eyeglass" holes to permit the valve covers to work around it (lucky me - I need stroker plates anyway). If it can't be stiff enough, it can be braced to an extended top motor mount (vertical post).
3. The bolt hole looks like it perforates the cylinder? If you spot-face the bottom, you can use a fine-thread bolt and a big flanged washer on the bottom and a nut on top for more compression. You can also add the next smaller size bolts (if 3/8-16 NC, use 5/16-18 NC or 8.0mm-1.25mm, etc.) in-between the existing adjacent to the failure point.
Brilliant Lars, you did it!
Thanks Chris.
Panic, I like your idea of adding more bolts, I'm seriously thinking of making a pair of heads for my own Indian (I was about to contact Moen at IPU to scrounge a scrap head to use as a pattern). The heads on my motor are the only part I'm not happy with, but mostly because loads of fins are bent or broken.
Lars
It is super to see you make it here and participate.
Not a motorbike guy, but have loved watching your build and finally running such a unique machine.
The design and materials of the cylinder head gasket that failed is NOT the most robust for any engine, particularly a boosted motor.
If you would like, send me a PM and I can offer opinions/suggestions.
Rick@RBMotorsports.com
Again Congratulations for your successful trip. You have a lot to be proud of.
Thanks for your offer and for your kind words Rick.
I will contact you
but also; please post any advise here
If you have room in the cylinder casting, you can just up-grade all the bolt sizes (not to mention most of the threads aren't too fresh...). To remove minimal metal, you want a pitch very close to the original: if 3/8-16 NC (a std. thread), it becomes 7/16-16 NS, which isn't std. but it's common - use H-D 45 or UL bolts. If already 7/16-14, the usual fix is 1/2-13 but 12mm × 1.75mm looks a bit better (removes less ID, and pitch is only .5 away).
I'd make the head thicker everywhere, taller fins, longer perch distance to the bolt surface. Leave a generous seating surface for 3/16" or more thick washers at the bolt holes. Extra mass slows down overheating slightly. Put the plug closer to the exhaust valve. I'd try to figure out how much pop-up I need before figuring casting thickness, you want at least .200" thick over the dome, plus the quench distance.
OK:
The gaskets.
All in all I'm quite happy with my bike considering my limited economical and mental resources.
In particular I'm very glad that it felt safe and "tight" to ride, and that the whole blower set up ( the big unknown )
seamed to work pretty fine.
Obviously there's a lot of things that I want to improve and modify,
the head gaskets being the first thing that comes to mind.
I'm surely not the first one to run into this problem
and this is not something I have dealt with before
so all advise is highly appreciated !
Here's what happened:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-21.jpg)
Close up front gasket
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-20.jpg)
and rear gasket
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-15.jpg)
Here's some of the suggestions folks have presented:
..no gasket. Period.
..no gasket. Paint a "gasket" with aluminum-paint
( let it sit in the can for a while. Use the thick stuff at the bottom of the can )
..form a thin strand of stainless steel wire and use as "gasket"
..make a groove in the top of the cylinder. Lay a thin 'rod' of copper,
(that stands proud a few thous of the grove) in the groove.
I don't think there's room for that on mine, as the distance between
the bolt-holes and the cylinder-bore is so small.
BTW: This seams to be a weak point , gasket-wise, on my engine judging from the above photos.
..use copper gaskets.
I'm not sure such a thing is available for my bike.
but it shouldn't be hard to fabricate.
I have some for my BSA ...
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4-11.jpg)
...and I take it that I should use
the 'solid' type, not the one with the white stuff in between two thin
pieces of copper
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5-6.jpg)
...which reminds me that someone mentioned that the type of gasket I was running
was problematic as they served as a heat-insulating layer between cylinder and top,
so the two pieces were moving ( expanding ) in different manners
and thereby "rubbing" the gasket, and weaken it.
Panic:
I'll come back to your informative detailed comments later today
but just for now: ( and this goes for Chris/desperate too):
I'm not sure how to read it, but the rules states that:
for Vintage Class one shall
"...retain the O.E.M. heads......originally installed at the time of factory production.."
I'll have to find out exactly how this should be understood
....if, and how much, one can 'modify' the heads.
One thing tell me that there's NOT a lot one can do as the rule also states
"...exact reproductions may be legal in vintage class if they offer no competive advantage..."
Anyone knows ?
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do you think my bum looks big in them leathers ?
...ha ha
Lars. Just fit a (really) wider rear tire and you'll be fine. : - )
LOL !!!
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I find it interesting that the gaskets are showing failure at the bolt holes only. It would seem that if the head was flexing the gaskets would still be intact at the holes.
When you pulled the heads did you happen to notice if the head bolts were lose in the area of the gasket damage? I ask because I've seen bolts or studs stretch, threads pull out when the engine was hot, and other failures like that.
If you haven't removed the front head yet, it may be a good idea to put a torque wrench on them and make sure that they're still the same torque that you set them to. If they are loosening then you need to figure out why. If that's the problem it may be as simple as needing new hardware, or repairing the threads in the the cylinders.
Another thought is that you may just have too much cylinder pressure for the engine to handle. Possibly finding a way to control your boost to limit cylinder pressure may be in order? This was suggested to me by another racer on the salt as the possible cause of your problems.
You do have to run stock heads in Vintage class, or exact reproductions. There is no rule saying that you couldn't install a "girdle" on top of the heads along with higher strength fasteners to help keep the heads down under high cylinder pressures. Just a thought.
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Lars,I would go copper.
(http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t24/generatorshovel/Slug.jpg)
The pic shows the copper head gasket I made for the little single, not that I had a choice, as NOTHING is available for a one off home made type of engine like this.
I even had trouble finding copper sheet suppliers and ended up buying a piece of a boiler storage tank from a scrap metal supplier, made a template,and a hole saw, clamped the copper between 2 pieces of plywood and went to work,,finished it with a file, annealed it, and applied copper base gasket paint.
No leakage problems, yet, after 2 years and several re-anneal / paint & re-fits.
Tiny
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I find it interesting that the gaskets are showing failure at the bolt holes only. It would seem that if the head was flexing the gaskets would still be intact at the holes.
When you pulled the heads did you happen to notice if the head bolts were lose in the area of the gasket damage? I ask because I've seen bolts or studs stretch, threads pull out when the engine was hot, and other failures like that.
Yep: the guy who removed the head the first time around ( one of the Vincent Vikings ) mentioned
that one ( as I recall it ) was loose'ish
If you haven't removed the front head yet, it may be a good idea to put a torque wrench on them and make sure that they're still the same torque that you set them to.
Will do.
Haven't removed the front head. Bike haven't arrived yet.
If they are loosening then you need to figure out why. If that's the problem it may be as simple as needing new hardware, or repairing the threads in the the cylinders.
Could be, but this is how it was set up, as we were concerned about the extra
challenge for the bolts when blowing this engine :
Threads checked and cleaned up
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4-13.jpg)
New bolts
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/6-5.jpg)
..and bolt-attachment 'surface' "faced" ( it that the English term ?)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5a.jpg)
and ( unrelated to this problem ) new cylinder base studs
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/studs1.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/studs4.jpg)
Another thought is that you may just have too much cylinder pressure for the engine to handle.
Yep, that may very well be the case
Possibly finding a way to control your boost to limit cylinder pressure may be in order?
Yep, could be that I'm simply running too much boost.
You do have to run stock heads in Vintage class, or exact reproductions. There is no rule saying that you couldn't install a "girdle" on top of the heads along with higher strength fasteners to help keep the heads down under high cylinder pressures. Just a thought.
...and a relevant one at that
DOOH:
it suddenly occurs to me that when I bought the engine
it DID have copper gaskets.
I've got them somewhere. I NEVER throw anything out.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-22.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-16.jpg)
Lars,I would go copper.
(http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t24/generatorshovel/Slug.jpg)
The pic shows the copper head gasket I made for the little single, not that I had a choice, as NOTHING is available for a one off home made type of engine like this.
I even had trouble finding copper sheet suppliers and ended up buying a piece of a boiler storage tank from a scrap metal supplier, made a template,and a hole saw, clamped the copper between 2 pieces of plywood and went to work,,finished it with a file, annealed it..
Darn nifty !
and applied copper base gasket paint.
Never heard of that. Had to look it up.
Is this it?:
Copper Spray (http://www.permatex.com/products/automotive/automotive_gasketing/gasket_sealants/auto_Permatex_Copper_Spray-A-Gasket_Hi-Temp_Adhesive_Sealant.htm)
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Quote
and applied copper base gasket paint.
Never heard of that. Had to look it up.
Is this it?:
Copper Spray
Yep, that's the one.
I even used it on a "never use again" original honda head gasket we used on a young lad's "roughie" this year, and it held up to 13.5 C/R WOT on methanol , and gave the 17 y/o his 2nd record (his 1st was MINE !)
Tiny
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Probably need to machine the heads and cylinders flat while bolted to a fixture plate and then spend time lapping the gaskets surfaces to a mirror finish to be flat with the most contact possible. I understand I have no room to talk as I have yet to establish a timing slip but I do remember my father preaching these words when I was younger.
I will shortly be in the sweat lodge for a month of project work,
Rocky
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Lars, you may just try it without any type of gasket......make sure everything is flat....no gasket has worked just great on the "old" roadracing bikes, like the Norton Manx...........................................
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..
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Lars,
Maybe I missed it, but how much boost are you running, and what is your static compression?
Tom G.
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..
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lars,
great meeting you at the bub.
hope that we can get to '11 bub.
franey
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Lars, it is nice to see that you are safe and sound and back home. Commercial roofers use sheet copper. I get my copper from a roofer supplier. Type "copper flashing" into an internet search engine to find suppliers. I always anneal any copper gasket before use. I heat it red or orange hot and drop it into the toilet.
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Panic,
You say "I'd try to get .035" to .040", no more no less." for piston to head clearance. Where does a piston hit the head at 7000 RPM? I understand there is rod stretch and of course the roller bearings allow some flex and clearance as well, plus aluminum expands as it gets hot? So is .020 too close of clearance? and pistons would strike head at 7000 RPM?
Just wondering what your thoughts are?
Rocky
1957 S/VG
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I always let copper head gaskets air cool to anneal ... quenching hardens hot metal ...
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Hi Lars,
The following is a just suggestion,
but there surely should be a similar type of company nearer to you.
Also, make sure you measure for proper thickness to achieve piston dome clearance. :wink:
See Ya
Drew
http://www.cut2sizemetals.com/copper/flat-sheet/ksh/?gclid=CNbC7sOTg6QCFQtN5wod2T5cGw
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You can order custom made gaskets from Cometic.
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..
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55chevr,
"quenching hardens hot metal ." Only ferrous metals not copper.
Rex
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Lars, I've always used solid copper head gaskets, both on my old BSA Super Rockets, and the Indian. I've had the Indian 20 years and only bought new gaskets when I had it overbored using +.020 Royal Enfield pistons 2.751" O/D. I got my solid copper gaskets from Robin Oakley at RTO Engineering 01303 893893 but maybe Moen has a supplier?
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CAD is a wonderfull thing send me a DXF file/drawing of the Gasket you require and I will Laser cut one or two for you.I have just done some parts for Gabriel and the Angelic Bulldog project,they came out good too.
Oz
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Thank you 'wolcottjl' , Drew and all for your advise and thank you Oz for your generous offer !!!
and apologies to you all for my later reply:
I've been workingworkingworkingworkingworkingCauseINeedmoneymoneymoneymoneyCauseIambrokebrokebrokebrokebroke.
Yep; copper gaskets it will be for now, when I get the time to assemble the bike
that arrived last Thursday
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5519.jpg)
Haven't had a single minute to work on it yet.
The plan is to assemble the bike 'as it was' + copper-gaskets and then put it on the dyno
to get a reference point, from witch to work and measure what-ever improvements can be made
.........
Copper Spray
Yep, that's the one.
I even used it on a "never use again" original honda head gasket we used on a young lad's "roughie" this year, and it held up to 13.5 C/R WOT on methanol , and gave the 17 y/o his 2nd record (his 1st was MINE !)
Tiny
OK , thanks; I'll get some of that stuff
Probably need to machine the heads and cylinders flat while bolted to a fixture plate and then spend time lapping the gaskets surfaces to a mirror finish to be flat with the most contact possible. I understand I have no room to talk as I have yet to establish a timing slip but I do remember my father preaching these words when I was younger.
I will shortly be in the sweat lodge for a month of project work,
Rocky
Of cause you have room to talk Rocky, my man!
Glad you are working on the liner. I expect to see you at BUB 2012 !!!
Lars, you may just try it without any type of gasket......make sure everything is flat....no gasket has worked just great on the "old" roadracing bikes, like the Norton Manx...........................................
Mmmmm: maybe I'll give it a go, but first I'll try the copper gaskets
I agree, if you're going to use a gasket copper is fine (used gaskets must be annealed to re-soften!).
H-D didn't use gaskets on race engines, just aluminum paint, but this requires a lapped surface (spend an evening at telly with the bits and some fine lapping compound + oil slurry).
The caveat: it reduces your quench clearance by the gasket thickness, so (easy) add a base shim in the same thickness, or (much worse) re-cut the dome down (re-balance?), or (worst) relieve the head for the dome intrusion. I'd try to get .035" to .040", no more no less.
On the vintage rule: the wording is (sorry, rant follows) poorly done. Assuming the last version I read is accurate and current: "Flat head and OHV heads, and two strokes must retain the O.E.M. heads and cases", the people who wrote it know nothing about either two strokes or flat heads.
Taken literally, it is silent concerning (and therefore permits) both later model and aftermarket cylinders on both two strokes and flat heads - exactly the opposite of what they were attempting to preclude.
The rule's true purpose is stock heads and cases on OHV, OHC (but replacement cylinders are OK), and the reverse on flatheads: stock cylinders and cases (but replacement heads are OK).
If I'm right, you can do anything you want to the heads as long as they don't have valves in them.
Yeah; you could be right...dunno....I'll check it with tech
Lars,
Maybe I missed it, but how much boost are you running, and what is your static compression?
Tom G.
Tom; I'm running 6:1 comp. ratio.
Way back that was one of the first things I checked, as the information
just wasn't available (!)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5256b575.jpg)
...and I've calculated the boost to 6 psi / 0.4 bar
but I have a feeling that I've totally miscalculated.
My boost-gauge wasn't much help, as it just flipped all over the place.
I need something better than that 20$ p.o.s. instrument.
I see washers below the head bolts, but they don't look very substantial.
They should cover the entire spot-faced area of the casting (the ones pictured are smaller), and more if you have the time, and be as thick as possible, 1/4" is not overkill.
I haven't O-ringed a flathead, but if you're very careful you can trace a shallow groove inboard of the bolt holes, But as you said it's pretty close. A simple copper O-ring tightly surrounding each bolt may help, but has to be inletted into the gasket and should be relieved a bit in the cylinder and/or head.
Found this from James Gasket: "76095JC Head gasket. High quality solid copper gasket. Fits stock 741 engine. May require trimming for big-bore, big-valve 741 engines. Set of 2." http://indianpartseurope.com/james.html
Thanks Jeff ! I'll check the washers, the bolt size / pitch
and the other things you mentioned earlier.
Don't think I'll even attempt the groove-thing.
lars,
great meeting you at the bub.
hope that we can get to '11 bub.
franey
Great meeting you Franey !!!
Lars, it is nice to see that you are safe and sound and back home. Commercial roofers use sheet copper. I get my copper from a roofer supplier. Type "copper flashing" into an internet search engine to find suppliers. I always anneal any copper gasket before use. I heat it red or orange hot and drop it into the toilet.
You don't flush... do you ?
.-)
Bo !...did I mention what an absolute pleasure it was meeting you and your adorable daughter Gretchen !?
"Woobly" / Bo was one of them good people who just seamed to pop up every time
help was needed !!!
....lending out tools, getting tools from other people and bring them over,
lending me his helmet, gloves, boots etc.
I'm telling you; you'll have a hard time finding person with a better 'vibe' than Bo.
THANKS !...I hope to meet you next year, and maybe have a little more time to talk with you !
One other person who I think I haven't given enough thanks
is Kurt and his Vincent Vikings team, who generously invited me to use their camp at BUB.
Thank you Kurt !!!
Kurt set a record and, as you know, tech had to check the cc after his record:
NOT a simple matter on a Vincent
...one , more or less, have to disassemble the entire bike to
remove the heads:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0237-1.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0236-1.jpg)
Thanks to Kurt I had a chance to sit on a genuine Vincent Black Lightning (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vincent_Black_Lightning)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/IMG_3091-Kopi.jpg)
HEYYYY: how often does such a thing happen ?
I feel privileged !
Another guy who needs to be mentioned:
Tom from Denmark you just happened to be there as a 'tourist'
and who also happened to be one of them good people who just turned up when help was needed.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/20100901_27914.jpg)
Thanks Tom !
Lars, I've always used solid copper head gaskets, both on my old BSA Super Rockets, and the Indian. I've had the Indian 20 years and only bought new gaskets when I had it overbored using +.020 Royal Enfield pistons 2.751" O/D. I got my solid copper gaskets from Robin Oakley at RTO Engineering 01303 893893 but maybe Moen has a supplier?
OK Chris !
Yep: Moen at Indian Parts Europe have a supplier !
One thing I did have time to do right after I got home was to take a few close ups of
the gaskets.
I do find it weird that apparently the edges of the gaskets have melted (!),
in SEVERAL places, even though in some of those places the gasket isn't actually broken .
I don't know much about these things, but could it be that the edges of the gasket
has acted as pre-detonating 'hot spots' ???
It IS weird isn't it...or ???
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5514.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5513.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5515.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5509.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5511.jpg)
...
Afterthought / reflections on a fantastic journey:
I think there is some absolutely beautiful 'poetic justice' in the fact that I did not set a record.
Somewhere in the back of my mind,( I'm embarrassed to admit ),
there was this thought that it would be rather easy to set a record, as I was
going for a 'soft' record.
Ha, ha.....welcome to Bonneville.
"...the human creature is designed for striving; Buddha, Spinoza and Schopenhauer,
among many others, agree.
Striving implies effort applied over time, with obstacles, difficulty and the possibility, even likelihood
of failure.
If we could feel good without effort we would no longer feel good.
The difficulty is crucial. Everything worthwhile has to be earned..."
Michael Foley
in the book "The Age of Absurdity. Why modern life makes it hard to be happy".
Have a great weekend you all !
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Thank you Lars for a beautiful insight and catch up
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..
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there was this thought that it would be rather easy to set a record,
[/quote]
it's not as easy as it looks.
franey
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"easy to set a record" Lars, I didn't miss a meet at El Mirage between 1997 and 2007. I didn't get a record until Sept. 2007. I'm sure you will do it faster. Bonneville sometimes tends to be underestimated. Copper gaskets, 2011, and I'm sure you will go home with a record cert in your back pocket. I'll be rootin' for you.
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Lars, it is always a good idea to know your static and dynamic compression ratios. The static ratio is easy to figure. The dynamic ratio is not so obvious. This is the on-line calculator that I use to calculate dynamic compression ratio www.rbracing-rsr.com/comprAdvHD.htm The Indian community should have some experts who know the maximum static and dynamic compression ratios that you can use at sea level in a N/A engine without problems. As a rule of thumb, and only if no better advice is available, it would not be a good idea to exceed that dynamic ratio at B'ville. Note that there are several things that you can do to regulate the dynamic compression ratio besides controlling boost.
Keep in mind that I am no flathead or blower expert. This is simply advice that can keep you out of trouble until you find an experienced tuner to help you with your engine.
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"Panic" / Jeff:
Sorry but I'm not sure I understand your post.
Thank you Lars for a beautiful insight and catch up
Thank you Rocky
there was this thought that it would be rather easy to set a record,
it's not as easy as it looks.
franey
Nope: ....and if it was easy it wouldn't be real interesting, would it ?!
"easy to set a record" Lars, I didn't miss a meet at El Mirage between 1997 and 2007. I didn't get a record until Sept. 2007. I'm sure you will do it faster. Bonneville sometimes tends to be underestimated. Copper gaskets, 2011, and I'm sure you will go home with a record cert in your back pocket. I'll be rootin' for you.
Thank you Bill !
Lars, it is always a good idea to know your static and dynamic compression ratios. The static ratio is easy to figure. The dynamic ratio is not so obvious. This is the on-line calculator that I use to calculate dynamic compression ratio www.rbracing-rsr.com/comprAdvHD.htm ...
Thanks Bo.
I'll look into that.
One thing: on the page it is mentioned that:
"...Of the variables, the most important is cam timing which has a dramatic effect on your "dynamic" as opposed to your static compression ratio. The more "overlap" your cams have, the lower your "actual" as opposed to your static compression ratio will be..."
Now that's interesting as I waaaay back checked the overlap. No-one in the Indian community could tell me.
Quoting from earlier in this thread:
...
No where could I find any info,
so did a real low-tech test. Sat up the cam'wheels' (cams are behind the wheels)
and held down the (non)-push-rods with rubber bands.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9def782c.jpg)
...turned the wheels and by holding each of two fingers
on top of the in- and out-let (non)-push-rods, respectively,
tried to feel the period where there was an actual overlap (both rods moved by cams)
Surprise: there was none...or it was negligible, to the point where my "test" couldn't detect it.
In all the literature on blowing (old) engines I've plowed through,
I'm told that 'low comp. ratio' and 'small overlap' is a good thing on a blown engine.
...
...in other words, this tells me that the minimal overlap gives me a high dynamic compression.
...The Indian community should have some experts who know the maximum static and dynamic compression ratios that you can use at sea level in a N/A engine without problems.
I'm not sure, but I hope so. Not that many people race and tune the 741 engine
but there's quite a strong 741 racing tradition in New Zealand, mainly because the have
a relatively great number of these machines, as they were dropped there in great numbers during WW II.
As a rule of thumb, and only if no better advice is available, it would not be a good idea to exceed that dynamic ratio at B'ville. Note that there are several things that you can do to regulate the dynamic compression ratio besides controlling boost.
Keep in mind that I am no flathead or blower expert. This is simply advice that can keep you out of trouble until you find an experienced tuner to help you with your engine.
Thanks for your advise and info, Bo.
I did, and will again, seek advise, but the trouble is that my set-up has never been done before.
BTW:
I just received this video of my timed run from Lou Fischer (http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,8634.msg137168/topicseen.html#msg137168)
What a brilliant souvenir.
BUB run VIDEO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-qHmtbDo88)
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Lars,
Great to see/ hear you again.
On the indian cams, the overlap can be seen/felt while the cam moves thru BDC, there will be an overlap where the exhaust is still open while the intake begins to open. This is why I have go to 4 lobes so I can make corrections? or shoot myself in foot on a tune up.
By the way, look for me in 2011, I'll be the fellow with the red streamliner with an Indian on the side
Rocky
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Ironwigwam: the overlap can be seen/felt while the cam moves thru BDC
:-D I think you mean TDC... :-D
Patrick
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..
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.
My head is spinning !
.
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..
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Lars, the dynamic compression ratio stuff might be too confusing. The coverage we just had of Cook's shootout showed the blown out plenum chamber on the Speed Demon. It is the aluminum sheet metal box that is all bent up. A fellow in the forum said that chamber was a pressure release valve. It was not designed to be one, it just acted as one.
On the salt I watched the little Scout. It was really moving along. As I remember, it averaged just under 90 mph through the mile with a blown head gasket slowing it down near the exit. This is much, much faster than a standard Scout would go at that altitude and on that surface. Most of the bike's build is fairly conventional and it is running on gasoline. Lots of boost must be giving the bike the speed.
The Speed Demon problem got me to thinking about the Scout. Could the head gaskets be acting like pressure relief valves? Would fixing the gasket problem keep excessive combustion pressures in the engine and cause more expensive damage? The failures I see on the close up views of the gaskets make me very concerned about excessive combustion chamber pressures. These are not old gaskets that have been eroding after long use and many heat cycles, and they finally let go. They are new gaskets with very few miles on them. No heat erosion or fatigue issues here. Pressure may be the culprit.
It is getting late. Somewhere in this mess of an office I have some dynamic compression ratio data from the old days. I will dig it up.
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All I know is what I touched with my hands when doing this yesterday,
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wobblywalrus: Could the head gaskets be acting like pressure relief valves?
These fiber ones did... I think copper gasket would have more inherant strenght in them.
What I've noticed over the years of abuse I gave to my 900 H-D side valve KHK is that, no matter how well you mate the heads to the cyls by lapping (no head gasket on these), there's always traces of combustion leaks between the chamber and some of the head bolts.
I'm thinking of actually remachining part of my cyls and heads to press in some sort of individual "fire rings" around each of the head bolts... These would sit half way in the heads, half way in the cyls and make a better "labyrinthe" type of seal to avoid leaks.
More head bolts would help as well!!!
Patrick
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..
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Lars, the dynamic compression ratio stuff might be too confusing.
Oh yes, but I do believe I understand ( more or less....er....less ) what it's all about.
This one explains it quite well:
Dynamic compression ratio (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compression_ratio#Dynamic_Compression_Ratio)
BTW: that site has a link to this:
Cam Timing vs. Compression Analysis (http://victorylibrary.com/mopar/cam-tech-c.htm)
written by none other than 'panic' / Jeff
On the salt I watched the little Scout. It was really moving along. As I remember, it averaged just under 90 mph through the mile with a blown head gasket slowing it down near the exit. This is much, much faster than a standard Scout would go at that altitude and on that surface. Most of the bike's build is fairly conventional and it is running on gasoline. Lots of boost must be giving the bike the speed.
Yep...and maybe too much. I do think I am on the limit as to how much power I can squeeze out of the poor thing
without doing some serious damage to it.
Remember this used to be a little 500cc thingy that went maybe 45-50mph and now it goes
close to 90 mph ( with two farting head gaskets at a density altitude of 6290 feet ).
The failures I see on the close up views of the gaskets make me very concerned about excessive combustion chamber pressures. These are not old gaskets that have been eroding after long use and many heat cycles, and they finally let go. They are new gaskets with very few miles on them. No heat erosion or fatigue issues here. Pressure may be the culprit.
Yep; these are new gaskets and yesterday I finally had the time to take off the front cylinder-head to check
the gasket. That one had VERY few miles on it as it was installed prior to the last run I made.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5530.jpg)
....but even so, it was slightly leaking as seen here
( so I was in fact running two leaking gaskets on the timed run )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5531.jpg)
Yes pressure is the problem ....BUT I'm tempted to disagree with you on the "heat-erosion" issue.
Again one can see how the edge of the gasket has melted
so I do believe there's a "heat-erosion" problem that makes the gaskets unable to cope with the pressure
As you know one want to avoid any sharp edges in the combustion chamber
(and I did go through a lot of work on the head to polish them to erase all sharp edges)
as these will act as 'hot-spots' where pre-ignition can take place
My theory is that that's exactly what the edges of the gaskets are doing
....heating up the edges, and eventually melt them.
It's a LOT 'easier' to suffer pre-ignition on a supercharged engine than on a N/A.
BTW: I took a look at the spark plug, and to me it looks good.
I did read somewhere in the forum how you can't 'read' the plugs in the usual way
when running on racing-gas ( I was running the 108 octane racing gas )
as it will never give the blown(ish) color we're usually looking for.
This one should give an good indication as I 'killed' the engine right after leaving the timed mile
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5533.jpg)
If you have the room above the engine, a single piece of heavy steel plate above all bolts can be jacked into place by levering against a frame tube.
...mmmmm: that may be an idea.
We'll see after I tested how things go with the copper gaskets
I agree that based on the video the power is there, so the cams can't be too bad. Unless you have some alternate parts that can be simply swapped in (cams, rockers) I'd leave that stuff alone to avoid introducing a variable.
I will.
As I said ; I do believe too that the power is there and
the exact amount of valve overlap isn't that interesting to me.
All I know is that it's VERY small and everything I've read on supercharging tell
that small overlap is a good thing in a supercharged engine...which is quite logical come to think of it
How much spring are you running?
I take it you mean valve-spring pressure ?!
200 psi ( valves fully opened ) / 110 psi ( valves closed )
as 'simulated' here in this set up I did
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7b5b199d.jpg)
BTW ; I realized I had a couple of small video-files that Tom took out there
and I put them together to make a little video.
Now I wished I had more, as this will be a great souvenir for when I get
old and fart'y, and sit there and dwell on memories
.-)
Click image
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/th_Filmklipppetdissolve.jpg) (http://s207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/?action=view¤t=Filmklipppetdissolve.mp4)
OK. so I cheated on the narrative, as the last shot is from the first ( un-timed ) run
but heeey; that's called 'artistic freedom' ...ha ha.
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..
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Lars,
Here's a little read about plug reading. Everyones opinion will be different but it gives some good basics. There is also another one but I can't find it right now. When I do I'll attach it...
http://xlforum.net/vbportal/forums/showthread.php?t=920271
Larry
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Hi Lars, Did you check your valve springs for coil bind????? When you read your plugs, you should look all the way down looking at the porcelin and plug body, Do you have a plug reading light? Mike R.
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..
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Isn't it about time to delete your earlier posts?
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Actually, you're right.
Moderators: please remove all this debris, since it appears I'm talking to myself.
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..
..
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Actually, you're right.
Moderators: please remove all this debris, since it appears I'm talking to myself.
???????????????????????????????????????
Huh ? ....what's this all about ?....why erasing all your post ?
You weren't talking to yourself.
I, for one, was listening !!! ...and appreciated your posts !
.
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Lars,
Here's a little read about plug reading. Everyones opinion will be different but it gives some good basics. There is also another one but I can't find it right now. When I do I'll attach it...
http://xlforum.net/vbportal/forums/showthread.php?t=920271
Larry
Never knew that so much could be 'read' from the state of the plugs.
Great to learn something new !
Thanks Larry
I'll be back later with a better photo of the plug
and use the link to try'and figure out the state of affairs in the engine
Hi Lars, Did you check your valve springs for coil bind?????
...mmmmm: I'm afraid I don't even know what that means
When you read your plugs, you should look all the way down looking at the porcelin and plug body, Do you have a plug reading light? Mike R.
Yes ...sort of; I have a magnifying glass with a build-in light, but it's still hard to get the light all the way down there.
I guess you've just given me an excuse to buy a new tool
.-)
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Hi Lars, Did you check your valve springs for coil bind?????
...mmmmm: I'm afraid I don't even know what that means
Hi Lars,
"Coil Bind"
The simplest way to think of it is as follows;
When your valve is fully open, there should still be some distance between the coils of the valve spring, usually in the region of 0.3mm per coil plus an additional 0.3mm.
Therefore if your spring has 6 coils, then you need 7 times 0.3mm (2.1mm) of free movement at full valve lift.
HTH
Neil
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Hi Lars, Did you check your valve springs for coil bind?????
When your valve is fully open, there should still be some distance between the coils of the valve spring, usually in the region of 0.3mm per coil plus an additional 0.3mm.
Therefore if your spring has 6 coils, then you need 7 times 0.3mm (2.1mm) of free movement at full valve lift.
HTH
Neil
Ahh ! I understand now.
Thanks Neil !
I'll check.
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Isn't it about time to delete your earlier posts?
( This is directed at 'panic' I assume. )
I may misunderstand this
BUT
if it's some sort of personal beef or pi**ing contest, please take it somewhere else .... like posting a PM to the person
to witch it is directed.
With all due respect; I really do NOT care for that kind of stuff here....AT ALL !
In my view, a pi**ing contest produces nothing but ...pi**.
I don't care for that.
Please explain what's going on. I just don't get it. The best thing would probably be to PM me.
Thank you !
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/ITstress-1.gif)
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not a pi__ing contest, but look at all his other posts and he deletes them in a few days.
Actually I have no business being here as I know nothing about Indians. I rest my case in the hands of experts who have no idea how an Indian operates.
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not a pi__ing contest, but look at all his other posts and he deletes them in a few days.
Actually I have no business being here as I know nothing about Indians. I rest my case in the hands of experts who have no idea how an Indian operates.
PLEASE PM me, Rocky my man !!!
I have absolutely no effing clue what you're talking about !
Thank you.
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http://cranecams.com/?id=5&show=faq
Lars, heres a little write on valve springs by Crane Cams. Towards the bottom they reccomend .060 clearance from coil bind. It was reccomended to me to have .100 when I set up my motor. So as you can see, there are many schools of thought.
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Lars, I don't know Panic but I do know he is sensitive. If someone disagrees with him all his posts disappear. Don't worry about it. Its standard operating practice. 2011 SpeedWeek will be here before you know it so getting the head gaskets sorted is far more important! By the way, Ivan in Thisted wants to be your mechanic for next year!
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Lars
Looking at those gaskets, they don't have a steel fire ring
Are they available with one or can you only get that on a round gasket
G
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1auch2.jpg)
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Lars, I think Grumm found a big part of your problem.
Sometimes it is best to sneak up on a problem. On flatheads it is easy to raise and lower the compression ratio. I would stack three gaskets on each head, torque the heads down, run the bike, retorque the heads, and run it couple of more times. Then I would do the same thing with two gaskets. One of these combinations will lower the compression enough to give you decent gasket life and performance.
Sweden is close to Denmark and there are the land speed on ice races. A great place to troubleshoot the engine make sure the gaskets work OK.
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If someone disagrees with him all his posts disappear.
That's not the reason, but why bother.
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If someone disagrees with him all his posts disappear.
That's not the reason, but why bother.
I too am curious as to why you seem to do this a lot.
You've got to admit, without knowing what your reasoning is, it seems that Wobbly has made a fair assumption.
So please, enlighten us as to why you do this. I'm not trying to stir up anything here, I find your informative posts to be quite valuable and feel a loss when you delete them.
I read almost all the posts on these threads, trying to learn as much as I possibly can to help improve my meager efforts. I look forward to the discussions concerning different takes on technical matters. Everyone knows that there is more than one way to approach a problem and in many cases more than one "correct" solution to a given situation. Having access to a broad spectrum of opinions with information to back them is a valuable tool, and allows us to filter through them with some research and arrive at a solution that works for us.
Everyone here has seen you take a lot of time to post detailed information with quoted sources, making the effort to help others with your knowledge, and then go back and delete all that work a few days later. I'm sure that I'm no the only one that has been disappointed to go back to review some of your posts only to find them gone. The loss of this information is not a good thing.
I understand not wanting to get into a p**sing match with someone who may have a different opinion on the net, but if that's what the issue is why don't you just not reply to those folks. Leave the information that you've made so much effort to post available to those of us who may find it of use. Seems to me it's more effort to go back and delete stuff than it would be to just not reply to folks who want to argue. :cheers:
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"Disagree" suggests that text that I remove is my opinion. "Vanilla is better than chocolate" is an opinion. Generally, anything other than fact, historical data, actual dimensions, laws of physics will say very clearly IME, AFAIK, or attribute the statement to the original author.
My statements (widely made, and disagreed with half of the time) that high rod ratio cannot make the rod "dwell" (stop) at TDC, piston motion @ TDC and BDC are not symmetrical, piston motion B&A TDC are not symmetrical unless the pin is centered, and that 1/2 the stroke does not occur at 90° are not my opinion, and do not require validation.
When some rocket scientist "explains" "what is widely acknowledged", or "it stands to reason that", and repeats what he read off some magazine cover, I don't bother to discuss it with him.
People who post things like "increasing the compression ratio 10% increases power by 10%" are not susceptible to discussion, let alone correction.
In short, arguing with a head-strong amateur is wasting everyone's time: mine, because I don't care if he's right or not; his, because he's not going to listen; and yours, because you're waiting for the dust to settle. .
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Panic.... I just don't get your reaction to the rude commet made too you!You gave all this unsolicited help TOO LARS, which he certainly appreciated,then some guy from the "peanut gallery" makes a wisecrack about you so you punish LARS!! That my friend is not logical... Any one that ticks you off, hit that IGNORE button, problem solved... One thing on this website is CREDIBILTY especially when your dealing with many of the subjects discussed here...I think you are a credible person and who wants to help people when you can...Poor Lars is sitting over there in Denmark probably saying "what the F--k" just happened? There is a lot of people on this website who would like to see you continue to post, I for one vote yes, But if that is not in the cards, well good luck to you and remember that in life there is always a Ignore"button... Mike R.
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Panic, I hope I am not the peanut gallery guy that ticked you off. My apologies if I did.
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In short, arguing with a head-strong amateur is wasting everyone's time: mine, because I don't care if he's right or not; his, because he's not going to listen; and yours, because you're waiting for the dust to settle. .
So don't argue. We're pretty much all headstrong amateurs in this sport, that's part of the fun. We don't know everything and aren't smart enough to know what can't be done sometimes. That doesn't mean that we don't want to learn and know more, and your posts are the kind of information that a lot of us hang out here to find.
Just because someone has a slightly different understanding of how something works, or chooses different ways to express or visualize something, doesn't automatically make them stupid. Perhaps they are misinformed, or misunderstood it the first time it was presented to them. That doesn't mean that they are undeserving of access to the correct information.
Deleting your posts the way that you do is petty. It's like a teacher taking away the text books from the entire class just because one student is failing. I can't wrap my head around any good reason for you to do that other than disdain for anyone less well versed on the subject than yourself, but I can't see that because if we all knew everything there would be no reason for you to post it in the first place.
I also vote that you keep posting, I've learned a lot from your posts, and would have like to have had a chance to learn more by reviewing them later.
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I'd quote Ayn Rand, but I don't think it would do any good.
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I'd quote Ayn Rand, but I don't think it would do any good.
*
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"Disagree" suggests that text that I remove is my opinion. "Vanilla is better than chocolate" is an opinion. Generally, anything other than fact, historical data, actual dimensions, laws of physics will say very clearly IME, AFAIK, or attribute the statement to the original author.
My statements (widely made, and disagreed with half of the time) that high rod ratio cannot make the rod "dwell" (stop) at TDC, piston motion @ TDC and BDC are not symmetrical, piston motion B&A TDC are not symmetrical unless the pin is centered, and that 1/2 the stroke does not occur at 90° are not my opinion, and do not require validation.
When some rocket scientist "explains" "what is widely acknowledged", or "it stands to reason that", and repeats what he read off some magazine cover, I don't bother to discuss it with him.
People who post things like "increasing the compression ratio 10% increases power by 10%" are not susceptible to discussion, let alone correction.
In short, arguing with a head-strong amateur is wasting everyone's time: mine, because I don't care if he's right or not; his, because he's not going to listen; and yours, because you're waiting for the dust to settle. .
If you want to keep a post quote it :evil:
JL222
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Mmmmm; this is all getting a whiff weird.
Pookie / Mike:
Thanks for your comment:
you're making perfect sense !
Rocky ( "Ironwigwam" ) is my friend.
I was honoured to be on his team in 2008 and I look forward to
see your liner crunch the Salt next year !!!
I have no effing clue what happened with you and 'panic'
and it really doesn't matter.
Who gives a flying f....f...f...f...fork seal...ha ha
Please come back. You know Indians.
I value your input.
Whizzbang.K.C. / Ed
I spend time with on the Salt and
I consider him a friend, that I look forward to meet again
and Ed; I agree with you on this ...er....incident.., and I admire your bafflingly eloquent and 'to the point' comment' here.
WooblyWallros / Bo is filed in my dictionary under "kind helpfulness"
and also a friend that I very much look forward to meet again
'Nortonist592' / Bill is a effing great guy that I thoroughly enjoyed meeting on the Salt
after having only 'met' him several times 'on-line'
'Panic' / Jeff , I admire for his dedication and passion for knowledge and for being kind and helpful to me,
not only here but in PM's as well.
Jeff; it pi**es me off, like you wouldn't believe, that you delete your posts, but heyyyy; that's you privilege.
It's your posts.
[EDIT: I just found out that you have deleted every single of your posts in my thread
going all the way back to April 2009.
Maaaaan: I just don't get it......but as I said: that's your previlege]
SO; friends;
please let it go !
Some of us are a bit weird, and some of us are a little more that just a bit, weird.
It's all cool !
If anyone wants to comment on Panic's actions or if Panic want to comment on some of these posts
or someone want to comment on a comment to Panic or Panic wants to comment on a post commenting
someones comment on Panics action or someone wants to comment on my comment to the comments on Panic's
comment to someones comments to the comments on Panic's comment to the comments commenting
the comments to the comments to Panics action:
PLEASE USE THE PM system .
THANKS !
So after this ...er....interesting ...intermezzo:
Back to business; :
Here's a couple of pictures to witch I'd like to hear your comments.
ALL your input, be it guesswork, educated guesswork, exact knowledge , expertise, drug induced fantasies ...whatever...
is highly appreciated.
I feel nothing but gratitude for you guys who actually take an interest in my small endeavour
and take the time to post your comments
and I'm sure you do it with nothing but the intention of helping me.
I've said it before and I'll gladly say it again:
THANK YOU !
There's been a couple of slightly conflicting links posted here, on how to 'read' spark plugs
but what'ta'your'think:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5541.jpg)
To me it kind'a OK
...Color change , more or less in the middle of ground strap
( plug heat range OK )
...grey/brown'ish color at the point where inner-wall meets porcelain
( indicating jetting/mixture is OK )
...base ring and inner wall grey-black
( indicating mixture is OK )
UNclear indications of tiiiiny spots of aluminum on ground strap.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5540.jpg)
Tiny black spots on porcelain
Deteriorated porcelain .
...that can't be good . Sign of pre-ignition ?
THIS worries me:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5547.jpg)
Weird oil-stain on piston...???
( The polished part is because I wanted to check if there was any evidence of
pitting ( aluminum deterioration causes by pre-ignition ) ...but there was none )
Similar weird oil-stain on corresponding head:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG5548.jpg)
What IS that ???
I'd quote Ayn Rand, but I don't think it would do any good.
NO, probably not, but my guess is that you're referring to this quote :
"...There are two sides to every issue: one side is right and the other is wrong, but the middle is always evil...."
Ayn Rand
I'm afraid I totally and utterly disagree with Mrs. Rand.
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Howdy Lars, The ONLY way you can get a valid plug reading is to clutch and kill the engine simultaneously while it is at full speed.. Any other way is a exercise in futility.. Kinda like pissing into the wind.. That black stuff could be oil that worked its way past the rings, REMEMBER you did not beak in the engine and the engine tolerances were set up on the "loose' side. The black stuff could also be excessive fuel that was not burned completely, could be slightly gooey and tacky. Didn't you say in your build sheet you were thinking about running alcohol?? Did you? If you ran gas your plugs will look 1 way but if it is alcohol they will look differant than gas..1 thing else you are tuning a 50 year +or - old technology that means you have to use "back in the day" knowledge and experience. You know, Fred Flintstone stuff.. Did you get my last PM>? Take it easy, Mike R.
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In the lower left side of the piston picture it appears that the edge of the piston is damaged. Is this just an optical illusion in the picture or is it actual damage? It appears that the swirl stain originates at that point, so possibly you have damaged rings in that area allowing oil to bypass them into the combustion chamber.
Are this picture and the plug with the deteriorated porcelain from the cylinder that cut a groove in the head when the gasket failed? If so they may both be collateral damage from the gasket failure due to the groove allowing outside air to be sucked into the cylinder and leaning out the effective mixture, along with the corresponding loss of compression, and completely messing up the burn characteristics. If so I wouldn't worry about those too much, just focus on fixing the root cause of the failure.
Actually, I kind of agree with Panic. Arguing with idiots is kind of like wrestling with a pig in the mud, after a while you figure out that the pig is enjoying it! I just can't wrap my head around deleting good info and letting stuff that he's sure is erroneous stay up, seems to be counter productive to me. (The last statement from me on this topic, LOL.)
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Lars, Whizzbang KC is definitely correct about the piston.. The plug is showing gray and porcelain is showing pre or beginning detonation.. The lip of the piston looks to be eroded away. Is there any scoring on the cylinder wall where the top is eroded away? Good job, Whizzer, Mike
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Lars, you are struggling. It is best if I do not give technical recommendations. I am more of a brit bike kind of guy. This is how I work. First, I start with a standard engine as designed by the factory, more or less. I ride it and learn about how it works, how the parts color with carbon, etc., and what it feels and sounds like. The proper fuel, ignition timing, plugs etc. Then I change something. I ride it some more. It is easy to figure out what causes any problems. It is the last thing I changed. I get everything working good. Then I move on to the next step. Lots of notes, etc. You can see this in my build. I ran a bone stock engine in 2007. A bone standard engine with a ported head in 2008 and 2009. Two years with this setup? It took me a couple to get everything working. A mildly hopped up engine in 2010. More fine tuning on this same engine in 2011. The lower end is built for a blower and one might be installed in the future, if I find the money. It will not happen until I get the NA setup completely figured out and working.
Sometimes when I have problems I go back to the last known good setup and start over.
Pure race motors are something I rarely built. When I did, I put them in a street chassis and broke them in, troubleshooted all sorts of problems, set the mixture, and then I put them in the race chassis. All of the work on my Triumph gets figured out on the road as best as I can.
This is not telling anyone what to do or the best way. It simply is a different approach to doing things.
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Someone asked me a series of questions using the PM system,
but I'll repeat the answers here in case someone else find them
useful in order to better 'understand' the engine as it sums up the basics of the engine:
.. Have the heads been surface?
...yep. I cleaned up the heads
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-22.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-17.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4-12.jpg)
...and surfaced them in the manner I've always used.
Thick sheet of glass...working my way through finer and finer grades of abrasive paper
that I spray-glue to the glass, using first water then thin oil on the finer grades,
sanding in a circular motion
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0007.jpg)
Have the cylinders been checked for flatness or surfaced?
..yes. It was done by the machinist who bored the cylinders
Are the head studs of stock origin or are you using Hi performance like ARP brand?
..stock ( brand new manufactured repro )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/345240e8.jpg)
What type of torque wrench did you use to torque the head nuts?
..don't know the proper English term, but the adjustable 'click' type
Did you use lubricant on the threads..
..I'm afraid I don't recall if I did that when I first installed them. I do think I did.
Reminds me that I just checked this site:
HEAD BOLTS (http://www.enginebuildermag.com/Article/1126/perfect_engine_sealing_starts_with_proper_head_bolt_use.aspx)
....which was suggested reading by David. David is not a member here, but here's a pic of him.
Apparently he is vacuum cleaning the Salt. Good man !
.-)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/David.jpg)
Were the heads torqued to stock spec.?
...yes
How did you determine that you needed bigger exhaust valves..
..from what I read about supercharging:
Gas is FORCED in by the blower,
but the exhaust gasses doesn't get any 'help' getting out,
so installing bigger exhaust valves is a good idea , to help the engine 'breathe'
Did you put larger intake valves in?
..no
Did you cc the heads?
..I'm not sure what you're asking.
I DID measure the cc of the heads in order to calculate the compression ratio:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5256b575.jpg)
Are you indexing the spark plugs?
..no
Have the intake or exhaust ports been altered?
..no
is the camshaft stock and do you know the specs on the camshaft?
..stock.
Specs: CLICK (http://virtualindian.org/archcamtiming.htm)
See the specs for "INDIAN 741"
Did you degree the camshaft?
..no
Is the ignition a point type is it dual point with 1 or 2 coils?
..point type but with "electronic" / magnetic trigger. 1 coil.
I rebuild the distributor and replaced the points with this:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0012-1.jpg)
...the Electronic ignition (http://www.indianpartseurope.com/ignition.html)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0018.jpg)
What is the ID of the exhaust pipes and the total length?
...don't know, but I followed the advise of what I read about supercharged engines:
make exhaust pipes as short and big-ID'ed as possible ( and I had to make them so they
complied with the A.M.A. / S.C.T.A, rules )
When the piston is at TDC, is the pistonflush with the top of the cylinder or is it down or above the cylinder?
..flush
The pistons look like they cast not forged?I take it that you set the ring gaps at stock settings?
..yes.
Ring gap set to 'racing' specs according to the instructions that came with the pistons
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/t5.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/t4.jpg)
Do you have a leak down tester?
...no but will definitely make one now
.......................................................................................
I'll be back a little later to answer the above posts.
.
-
...and surfaced them in the manner I've always used.
Thick sheet of glass...working my way through finer and finer grades of abrasive paper
that I spray-glue to the glass, using first water then thin oil on the finer grades,
sanding in a circular motion
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0007.jpg)
Ahhhh. Lars, after you get the groove from the blown gasket welded up, take those heads to a good machinist and have them properly surfaced with a fly cutter.
I'll bet you a beer at the Black and White next year that surfacing them the way you did left them "not perfectly flat". The thin areas between the combustion chamber and the bolt holes would tend to be sanded down ever so slightly more than the thicker areas due to the way the paper and lose abrasive behave when doing it that way.
I used to use that method myself on H-D Shovelheads, then one day I checked one with a machinist's straight edge and saw that the "flat" gasket surfaces actually tapered off just a bit on the edges. Less than .002 inch, but still enough to not properly clamp the gasket. That was the last time I used that method.
You can check yours with a good straight edge across the chamber in an area that wasn't damaged by the failure. You shouldn't be able to see any light between the edge and the gasket surface, all the way to the chamber. Should be a nice sharp edge on the sealing face.
-
Det min gode ven. bedste succes med deres motorcykel Henledte
Drew :cheers:
p.s.
I hope that came out correctly
-
Lars, the machining leaves a slightly rough surface which helps retain the gasket especially when it's a fibre one. This will probably help as well with the existing gasket, although I'd rather still see a solid copper one.
Pete
-
In the lower left side of the piston picture it appears that the edge of the piston is damaged. ....
Lars, Whizzbang KC is definitely correct about the piston.. ( ..snip..).... The lip of the piston looks to be eroded away.
For once I am happy to announce: you're wrong
.-)
Guys !..you got me all nervous, so I rushed by the workshop...cleaned the piston top
and naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa: it's perfectly fine
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Piston.jpg)
Is there any scoring on the cylinder wall...
Checked that too.
No scoring whatsoever !
-
I'll bet you a beer at the Black and White next year that surfacing them the way you did left them "not perfectly flat". The thin areas between the combustion chamber and the bolt holes would tend to be sanded down ever so slightly more than the thicker areas due to the way the paper and lose abrasive behave when doing it that way.....
It could very well be that you are right !
BUT let me ad that the way I do it , to make certain that it IS in fact flat
and does not have any 'valleys' or high points, is this :
( I don't have pics from when I did the heads but it's the similar method used here )
I use a marker and draw on it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0782.jpg)
...and any high-points will show up like this: marker-marking (huh) sanded off
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_0783.jpg)
Then re-apply with marker....sand again...low-points will show up ( marking still present )....re-apply with marker etc. etc.
till I reach a point where ALL markings will disappear during one sanding.
Theoretically (!) this should guarantee that the surface is flat within
a tolerance of the 'thickness' of the marker-ink-layer.....er......kind of
-
Det min gode ven. bedste succes med deres motorcykel Henledte
Drew :cheers:
p.s.
I hope that came out correctly
LOL
Close enough.
Tak min ven !
.
-
Howdy Lars, The ONLY way you can get a valid plug reading is to clutch and kill the engine simultaneously while it is at full speed.. Any other way is a exercise in futility.. Kinda like pissing into the wind.. That black stuff could be oil that worked its way past the rings, REMEMBER you did not beak in the engine and the engine tolerances were set up on the "loose' side. The black stuff could also be excessive fuel that was not burned completely, could be slightly gooey and tacky.
You're making perfect sense on both counts
Didn't you say in your build sheet you were thinking about running alcohol?? Did you?
Nope.
Gave it a try at first with a 50/50 gas/alcohol mix, but realized I didn't have jets big enough,
so gave up that idea for the moment , but I will try again after I've had it on the dyno
and have established a 'starting point' from witch to work.
I'll do it first and foremost for the cooling effect...a blown flat-head gets flipping hot...at least this one does.
Here's an interesting picture
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5A-1.jpg)
HUH ...no fins ?!??
Yes, those are INDIAN heads;
"... a special set of aluminum scout heads for a 45 alcohol burning hill climber.
As developed by Clem Murdaugh on his way to a national AMA #1 champion hill climber in 1940...."
..obviously they had problems getting the engine hot enough !
The picture I borrowed from Rocky's / Ironwigwam
homepage: IronWigWam (http://www.ironwigwam.com/)
Check out his absolutely wonderful collections of old PICTURES (http://www.ironwigwam.com/html/pictures.php)
If you ran gas your plugs will look 1 way but if it is alcohol they will look differant than gas..
Yep.
Found something on the subject here: Blown Alcohol Motor Spark Plug Reading 101 (http://www.dragstuff.com/techarticles/reading-alcohol-spark-plugs.html)
1 thing else you are tuning a 50 year +or - old technology that means you have to use "back in the day" knowledge and experience. You know, Fred Flintstone stuff..
Yep; and in fact the engine is 70 years old.
...Are this picture and the plug with the deteriorated porcelain from the cylinder that cut a groove in the head when the gasket failed?
Nope, but this cylinder had a small gasket-leak as well, so the mixture etc. was messed up as well here, I guess
Lars, the machining leaves a slightly rough surface which helps retain the gasket especially when it's a fibre one. This will probably help as well with the existing gasket, although I'd rather still see a solid copper one.
Me too !
-
Lars, you are struggling. It is best if I do not give technical recommendations. I am more of a brit bike kind of guy. This is how I work. First, I start with a standard engine as designed by the factory, more or less. I ride it and learn about how it works, how the parts color with carbon, etc., and what it feels and sounds like. The proper fuel, ignition timing, plugs etc. Then I change something. I ride it some more. It is easy to figure out what causes any problems. It is the last thing I changed. I get everything working good. Then I move on to the next step. Lots of notes, etc. You can see this in my build. I ran a bone stock engine in 2007. A bone standard engine with a ported head in 2008 and 2009. Two years with this setup? It took me a couple to get everything working. A mildly hopped up engine in 2010. More fine tuning on this same engine in 2011. The lower end is built for a blower and one might be installed in the future, if I find the money. It will not happen until I get the NA setup completely figured out and working.
Sometimes when I have problems I go back to the last known good setup and start over.
Pure race motors are something I rarely built. When I did, I put them in a street chassis and broke them in, troubleshooted all sorts of problems, set the mixture, and then I put them in the race chassis. All of the work on my Triumph gets figured out on the road as best as I can.
This is not telling anyone what to do or the best way. It simply is a different approach to doing things.
Bo: I like your way of doing things.
In my case I just didn't have ( or take ) the time to do it this way
and I'm not sure I would have the patience.
.... I am more of a brit bike kind of guy....
Me too !
My first bike was a TriBsa; an A10 BSA frame with a Triumph Speed Twin engine.
Here it is back in 1978 from a road-trip with my girlfriend at the time
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Xbsa2JPEG.jpg)
I bought that bike 32 years ago and I still have it !
It's been through a few rebuilds and 'permutations' since then, and the last time I saw it
before putting it in store a couple of years ago, the sorry little thing looked like this
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/mellowyellow-3.jpg)
Then for a while I had a 650 pre-unit Triumph with a frame stretched 4", that I started working on
( actually the blower on the INDIAN was bought for this Triumph )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Trummmmph.jpg)
...then I started changing it into a LSR look-a-like ( blue thingy is a blower 'stand-in' )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a1-5.jpg)
Then I got the silly idea after visiting Bonneville in 2008 that it would be a hole lot more
fun to build an actual LSR bike and in the process
I got insane and decided to do it with an INDIAN engine as the base.
All the while my 650 pre-unit BSA, that I've had for 10 years is still waiting for me to
finish the second rebuild I've done on it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/engineparts.jpg)
I just can't wait to finish it: it's an absolute wonder to ride,
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-23.jpg)
...except I need new Ceriani front forks ,
as I ripped them of the Beeza...shortened them ...and put them on the INDIAN...oops !
-
For those of you who enjoy watching all kinds of vintage motorcycle racers,
check this out:
Vintage Grand Prix (http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,8737.msg140511.html#msg140511)
.
-
Lars, that picture of the stripped A10 brought back memories. I could get hold of those parts and put the lot together in a day, as my second love after Indians, was A10's. Here's a picture of one of mine built @1978, 1954 A7 plunger frame, A7 gearbox, A7 engine but with Super Rocket crank, rods, barrels & ally head. This was in the days before they invented silly names for bikes, like Bobber, or Lowrider. Forks were about 8" over, and the whole bike cost me £50 to build, which was a lot back then.
-
Lars,
Here is a PIC of my 4th generation of Indian titanium rockers with a Climax cam set. Note how the cam is balanced so it is harmonious with itself.
I have begun a 5 th generation of magnesium lifters with three rollers, as soon as they are finished, I can loan these to you if you like?
Thats all I know for now, let the shooting begin.
Rocky
1957 S/VG
1959 M/BG
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-11/1109362/indian%20lifters.jpg)
-
That is one hell of a cam profile!
-
AHG,
That is a Climax #3 designed by my father and Clem Murdaugh, probably first tried in 1950.
Rocky
-
Lars,
Here is a PIC of my 4th generation of Indian titanium rockers with a Climax cam set. Note how the cam is balanced so it is harmonious with itself.
I have begun a 5 th generation of magnesium lifters with three rollers, as soon as they are finished, I can loan these to you if you like?
Thank you very much for your kind offer Rocky. I'll get back to you on that.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-11/1109362/indian%20lifters.jpg)
WOW ! Those rock'ing rollers look fantastic compared to the original , rather crude looking ones, see below on my engine ( before rebuild ). Every time I see them they still appear real weird to me,
what with that high and steep cam-lobe profile and the single cam common for both in- and exhaust
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CamshaftsLiftersPush-rods.jpg)
I like the fact that they have rollers where they touch/lift the 'push-rods',unlike the originals that 'rubs' the push-rods''
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/indianlifters.jpg)(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CamshaftsLiftersPush-rods-Kopi-1.jpg)
-
Lars, that picture of the stripped A10 brought back memories. I could get hold of those parts and put the lot together in a day...
Chris, I'm sure you could do it in a matter of minutes ,after watching how fast you build your brilliant Indian LSR,
.. my second love after Indians, was A10's...
Yeah , it's one hell of a good looking frame
-
Brilliant machine work on those lifters. Actually those are hardened pads pinned to the lifters. With clever profiling theres no scrubbing at the push rods and actually can add some lift. Rollers here would put unneccesary weight on. A 3 parted offset roller sounds interesting, it would change some int. versus exh. cam timing I think.
-
Lars- I just made my first visit to Bonneville last week, found this forum, and stumbled across your build thread for your Indian. What an amazingly cool project.
I don't know much about Indians, but I do have some experience with a Hudson Hornet flathead 6 engine (308 cubic inches!) and they were known for having head gasket problems. I've read many tips about getting them to seal properly and some of these might help with your Indian. Several of the tips are consistent with suggestions you've already been given (use copper gaskets, applying "copper coat" gasket sealer, etc.) but here are a few others that might be of interest:
- Slightly chamfer all the bolt holes in the cylinders and cylinder head before installation. Supposedly if this isn't done, the metal around the bolts tends to be stretched first so that much of the bolts' clamping force is expended right around the bolt holes over-compressing the gasket in these areas and providing insufficient compression of the gasket between the bolt holes. This doesn't appear to be your problem as it looks like the gaskets failed AT the bolt holes rather than between them.
- Use studs rather than bolts to hold the heads. Studs are said to provide superior clamping force.
- Use hardened flat washers under the nuts on the head. These are available from auto performance shops. Apparently the idea is the washers won't distort, and they cause less friction on the underside of the nuts, resulting in more clamping force for a given torque.
- Make sure your heads haven't been milled excessively in the past, which can make the head too thin and prone to gasket failures. Again, this doesn't seem like your problem given that your compression check found 6:1 compression.
Good luck with your project. I'll be very interested to watch your progress.
Hugh
-
Cool to see more flathead fans here. Here's an interesting site with some meat on modifying heads, and alot more. I know, car engines isn't the same, but some ideas might be had. Nothing about head gaskets thou.
http://www.midstateantiquestockcarclub.com/flat_heads3.html
Flatfire seems to have a groove in the head only for a thin copper wire, the block seems to be flat.
http://www.flatfire.com/flatfire2.htm
I've been browsing Ebay and the net for more info on Jr. dragster flathead mods, but it's thin. What's up with the fire slot?
Great and really informative photos Lars, I guess the oil pattern is from when you rolled off the throttle, vaacuum got high in the comb.compartment and pistons got cooler, sucking up some oil. Fantastic to get a wiew of the swirl pattern on the piston top! I found a great article on copper head gaskets.
http://www.enginebuildermag.com/Article/1260/engine_sealing_high_performance_head_gaskets.aspx
Thanks Pookie, the info I'm searching is mainly for learning more and in the end apply on an Indian engine, I'm not into Jr drag in particular. Bobs 4cycle is a large site. Induction and head design tends to be a guarded secret in most cases.
-
Hey Charlie 101, on this website there are 2 members [that I am aware of] who have experience with jr. dragster engines, Ron Kato ie; Kato Engineering is his web name, and myself..If you want info I suggest contacting by Private email.. McGee Engineering also builds engines and has a website.. McGee also grinds cams and a whole bunch of other stuff.Check out NHRA who run the jr, dragster program, they also have a magazine every 2 months with info ,ads and race results..The fire slot is supposed to aide in flame travel to the squish area of the head.The squissh area is where the head and piston meet developing the power stroke, in a 4cycle engine. That type head would be used in a lowbuck beginners level engine. There is also an extensive amount of info at Bob's 4 Cycle web site, just start navigating the web site and go to the flathead section. Even tho it is for karting most of the info would help you and could be applied to the jr. dragster program.. Mike R.
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Folks !
...sorry: I realize I'm behind in answering to some posts here
as well as to some PM's and emails from some of you guys.
Please accept my apologies.
Don't mean to be rude !
...it's just that I'm frightfully preoccupied
with a few real-life issues that have totally overwhelmed my attention-capacity .
I'll be back as soon as the 'fog' clears.
-
Lars,
It is terrible when "real life" gets in front of the life we really want. Hope things get better.
Rex
-
Cant wait to see you 2011 wish i would have read this before i was out there this year. Just a thought with the head gaskets what about retarding the ignition some to keep the cylinder pressure down and temp some? I've always been told to keep the ignition retarded and advance into it slowly.
-
Hey Lars! Sorry to hear real life is getting in the way of really living. Hope it improves soon.
MERRY CHRISTMAS LARS AND A HAPPY NEW YEAR. SEE YA ON THE SALT!!!!
-
Hello ya'all !
Thank you metalracing and others for your input.
Much appriciated.
I will get bact to you later.
Lars,
It is terrible when "real life" gets in front of the life we really want. Hope things get better.
Rex
They did! Thanks Rex !
Hey Lars! Sorry to hear real life is getting in the way of really living. Hope it improves soon.
MERRY CHRISTMAS LARS AND A HAPPY NEW YEAR. SEE YA ON THE SALT!!!!
Thanks Bill !
Short update:
Off topic, but on topic...ha ha:
Went through a spot of ...er...trouble.
Well what can one do. One thing would be to turn a problem into a solution
.-)
Decided ( was forced to ) to downgrade my financial obligations
so I'm selling my house and will move into a workshop/living area combination.
What the he!! am I doing out there in the suburbs anyway.
THAT will enable me to ( back on topic ) make my annual pilgrimage to Bonneville
( now THAT's ON topic ) .
I'm sure you guys can relate to the obsession !
While I'm over there on the other side of the pond , why not take
a trip around that beautiful country of your.....every year.
Cut the cost by owning a motor-home instead of rental-car and motel and restaurants etc.
So I've bought the motor-home I've always been dreaming of owning one day
to just that.
A fantastic Airstream Argosy from 1978.
At some point refurbished for the use as tour-bus for a Chicago band.
Last year driven around USA by a German guy from who I bought it.
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/1-9.jpg)
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/10-2.jpg)
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/15-2.jpg)
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/8-2.jpg)
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/6-2.jpg)
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/4-4.jpg)
It's a dream come through !(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/avatar_2275.gif)
I'm in love with..... ( this is slightly pathetic ) a motor-home !!!!
I know;
for you American guys it's " Yeah what about it.....it's just yet another old motor-home"
but for me coming from a country the size of Rhode Island, with cars the size
of the average American shopping-cart....this is just flipping fantastic.
Ohhhh boy I can't wait to get behind the wheel of that carrier sized thing
and fire up the 7.4 liter V8 ...yeaaaah !
“If you don’t follow your dreams, you might as well be a vegetable”
Burt Munro
More on the cylinder heads coming up.
Glad to be back !!!
-
Lars,
Thanks for the update.
I'm glad you are doing OK and hope to see you at Bonneville in 2011.
Don and Gus
-
Welcome to the club of ancient motor-home owners!!! Mine is a $3000 '80 model and has made three trips to Bonneville without any problems. They made them good then. You'll have fun.
-
Nice looking rig. Where do you tie the aircraft carrier up at? Salt lake City., Chicago? Sweat Lodge?
-
And I thought your absence was due to you had to double take a ignition setting course at IPE :-D
Glad things got resolved and I wish you Glædelig jul og e Godt Nytår ! :cheers:
-
How fun - to see your happiness through the screen. Best wishes to you, the bike, the motor home, and so on. I hope your decision works out well -- and that you have a chance to mosey through Michigan's Upper Peninsula some day as you're traveling around the US. Feel free to call -- we've got plenty of room for you to park and visit.
-
That's great Lars. Ya gonna put a blower on the MH too? :cheers:
-
Hello Lars,
Though this is not at all directly regarding your bike; I thought you may still get a thrill about the following information.
I just received this from a friend in New Zealand. He is the Jawa Speedway Dealer, and avid fan of Burt Munro.
Hope you enjoy.
Happy Holidays
Drew Gatewood :-)
Hi Drew,
This is the latest project from the man who made your Indian trophies.
It is about half done and will weigh 650 KGs.
It is to be put into Queens Park in Invercargill on completion.
I was privaleged to be given a first hand look at it.
The maker is seated with it
Regards,
Ronder.
-
:cheers:Way to go Lars! Its alot fancier than my Grumman Olsen '78 Ford Holsum Bread truck that I am converting, but already alot of fun! If ya make to Arizona at any time, Mi Casa, es tu Casa! Enjoy life!!!!!
-
seems that there was another indian owner
who lived in a workshop/ living area combo.
don't know if he ever had a cool looking motor home like yours.
stop and park your wheels in cleveland some time.
franey
-
This is my 1st post on this site. I have read every word of the 39 pages here and am truly amazed at your skills and fortitude. I live about 25 miles from ElMirage ca. and go to the speed trials there at least a couple times a year.Never been to Bonniville yet but will be next year.Not to compete. Not yet. I would love to. I like the cars but have been on two wheels ever since i was a kid.50 yrs young now. Maybe I will see you there. Keep up your amazing dream. Gary.
-
Welcome Gary. Lars is some puppy alright. I wish I had his fortitude and persistence. Build a bike and come on out to El Mirage and race. The SCTA lets the red headed step children race.
-
Thats the plan Nortonist.I may try getting my feet wet in the production class 1st.
-
Thank you Hugh/"Hughlysses" and others for your advise.
I'll try to 'condense' it and decide how to proceed.
Lars,
Thanks for the update.
I'm glad you are doing OK and hope to see you at Bonneville in 2011.
Don and Gus
Thanks...you will. Looking forward to see you there !
Welcome to the club of ancient motor-home owners!!! Mine is a $3000 '80 model and has made three trips to Bonneville without any problems. They made them good then. You'll have fun.
I intend to
.-)
Mine was slightly more 'expensive' , but still as I see it, it was ridiculously cheap.
Nice looking rig. Where do you tie the aircraft carrier up at? Salt lake City., Chicago? Sweat Lodge?
Rocky ! Dunno yet . Probably at Neils place in Montana or perhaps in SLC
And I thought your absence was due to you had to double take a ignition setting course at IPE :-D
Glad things got resolved and I wish you Glædelig jul og e Godt Nytår ! :cheers:
LOL.
Godt nytår og glædelig jul til dig !
How fun - to see your happiness through the screen. Best wishes to you, the bike, the motor home, and so on. I hope your decision works out well -- and that you have a chance to mosey through Michigan's Upper Peninsula some day as you're traveling around the US. Feel free to call -- we've got plenty of room for you to park and visit.
Thank you very much Jon !!!
That's great Lars. Ya gonna put a blower on the MH too? :cheers:
Mmmmmmmmmm: now there's an idea.
Wonder what class to put it in to set a record
.-)
Hello Lars,
Though this is not at all directly regarding your bike; I thought you may still get a thrill about the following information.
I just received this from a friend in New Zealand. He is the Jawa Speedway Dealer, and avid fan of Burt Munro.
Hope you enjoy.
I certainly did !
Happy Holidays
Drew Gatewood :-)
Thanks and
Happy Holidays to you Drew
:cheers:Way to go Lars! Its alot fancier than my Grumman Olsen '78 Ford Holsum Bread truck that I am converting, but already alot of fun! If ya make to Arizona at any time, Mi Casa, es tu Casa! Enjoy life!!!!!
I'm doing my best....and thanks so much !!!
seems that there was another indian owner
who lived in a workshop/ living area combo.
don't know if he ever had a cool looking motor home like yours.
stop and park your wheels in cleveland some time.
franey
Thank you Franey !
The hospitality expressed by you guys never seize to amaze me !
You are the best!
This is my 1st post on this site. I have read every word of the 39 pages here and am truly amazed at your skills and fortitude. I live about 25 miles from ElMirage ca. and go to the speed trials there at least a couple times a year.Never been to Bonniville yet but will be next year.Not to compete. Not yet. I would love to. I like the cars but have been on two wheels ever since i was a kid.50 yrs young now. Maybe I will see you there. Keep up your amazing dream. Gary.
Thanks Gary for your kind words.
Dunno about "skills and fortitude"...more like 'nut-job with a lot of patience'.
Hope to see you at Bonneville next year.
Welcome Gary. Lars is some puppy alright.
Puppy ? Huh ?
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/big_headed_tiny_dog_chasing_tail_lg_nwm.gif)
I wish I had his fortitude and persistence.
You do. You do Bill, indeed !
-
......
Things has been done to the cylinder head.
A friend machined out a chunk around the damaged area
and welded it up.
I didn't dare doing it myself as it is extremely 'soft' and I was afraid I'd damage
it beyond repair.
He said it was 'like welding steel-wool'
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/w1.jpg)
..then took it to the local machinist who made a tool to hold it
so he could use the lathe ( yep; the lathe ) to make it absolutely evenly 'flat' again
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/w2.jpg)
..and then ran it over a flat surface with a rather coarse abrasive attached.
He always does this and then use a copper gasket + a sort of liquid gasket.
This is probably a somewhat 'controversial' way of doing this,
but I trust the guy.
He does all the machining on all my friends flat-heads and
absolutely no-one has ever complained about any thing he has done.
Now I need to go over on the top with my 'Dremel'-type tool to
shape the 'inside' of the welding and bore up the hole.
then: copper-gaskets....and dyno testing.
Now the motor-home: ( it's a small world )
..the MH just happens to be stored in New Mexico an hour drive from
my friend David, who I met this year at BUB and who was a great help there
..and in Santa Fe where David lives , he told me there just happens to
live a guy who just happens to know a LOT about old Indians,
and this guy just happens to be Jim Mosher who I just happened
to run into a BUB, where he kindly offered his help
and when I checked his web-side it turn out he just happens to owns
an old motor-home that just happens to be the same as mine
..and the only 'serious' problem with my new MH
is that the Onan generator doesn't function properly,
but my friend George in Washington St. who kindly 'hosted' me at SpeedWeek,
just happens to have a few Onans , Onan spare-parts and manuals in his workshop
Indeed ; a small world, all connected by great land-racing guys !
SO what better excuse for a trip across the pond to check the MH,
so I'm certain it will be in good shape for my trip next year, and to fix
insurance and registration.
Yes Sir !....flying over to New Mexico, for a few days, on Wednesday where David
kindly has offered his help to pick up the MH, get it registered etc.
BIG kudos and gratitude to David !!!
and to Neil, who I met at BUB in 2008
and who came down from Montana to visit me this year.
This whole idea was sort of coming together over a few beers with him
one night sitting outside the motel in Wendover.
Neil kindly offered any help I needed, like storing the MH at his place
and lending me any tools needed when going to Bonneville.
None of them are members here, but certainly they are part of the great land-racing community.
Thanks guys !
Neil on the left...Dave in the middle:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/NeilDaveogmig.jpg)
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/Landracing.jpg)
-
Lars, OK on Montana, although there is room at Forest lake, Minnesota as well next to the Dream Catcher. While you are at Neal's. maybe, Please maybe? Can you suggest to Neal how to install the turbo on the Rock salt Scout while you are there?
Rocky
-
Hello !
Been a while, but I'm still here
and so is da' Saltbiscuit, and she's in good company:
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/CIMG5781.jpg)
Working om the head and doing od small stuff to get it ready for the dyno-test.
Two observations:
..salt gets in E V E R Y W H E R E
..I'm impressed with the MOTY batteries (http://www.motydesign.com/)
I'm running.
Checked the voltage: it's right up there where it was many moons ago at Bonneville.
BTW:
Had a great trip to New Mexico just before Christmas.
WHAT a nice place, and what nice people.
And I got myself a cowboy hat, didn't I ..yeehaaaw
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/foto.jpg)
Lars, OK on Montana, although there is room at Forest lake, Minnesota as well next to the Dream Catcher. While you are at Neal's. maybe, Please maybe? Can you suggest to Neal how to install the turbo on the Rock salt Scout while you are there?
Rocky
Rocky: I'd be more than happy to help out Neil,
but I'm sure he knows how to do things.
-
Yep
-
I saw the Indian in a magazine article somewhere.Cant remember where though. It was in a different language.? It was your bike for certain though. :cheers:
-
Hey Lars...We're hoping the motorhome will make a visit to us in San Diego....perhaps you could come along as well! Think about a trip to San Diego, you're welcome anytime. If you make it around El Mirage dates we could even go racing!
We need to get started prepping/changing/modifying our bikes for May..you put us to shame!
Jill
-
Agreed Lars. If you're going to be tooling around the states for a while you better make a stop by El Mirage... :cheers:
-
I saw the Indian in a magazine article somewhere.Cant remember where though. It was in a different language.? It was your bike for certain though.
Could it be this one: MCM (http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,9153.0.html) ?
Hey Lars...We're hoping the motorhome will make a visit to us in San Diego....perhaps you could come along as well! Think about a trip to San Diego, you're welcome anytime. If you make it around El Mirage dates we could even go racing!
Thank you so much for your kind offer !
I am in fact planning to come over in that direction, as I'm going to visit and old Danish friend in L.A.
We need to get started prepping/changing/modifying our bikes for May..you put us to shame!
No way ! I've seen the pictures of your and Dave's brilliant bikes.
Compared to them, mine looks like a traffic accident
Agreed Lars. If you're going to be tooling around the states for a while you better make a stop by El Mirage... :cheers:
I will indeed check out the dates etc.
-
Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr !
This has turned out a bit more complicated than expected,
but HEY!...no one promised it would be uncomplicated.
Checked the blower.
First problem: oil-residue on the blower-lobes and inside the 'plenum' ( leading to the cylinders ).
Quite a lot, in fact:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-25.jpg)
There's only one place it can come from:
the oil in the cog-wheel housing.
I noticed that when I opened it, to drain the oil
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-18.jpg)
...there was a quiet sound like: "Psssssssssssssssssssssss".
Obviously pressurized air escaping.
OK, so the pressure from the blower-'chamber' will pass the oil-seals
which are mounted in this 'direction' (lip towards the cog-wheel housing)
(pic is from the first blower that I discharged)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Oilseal.jpg)
..and I guess the pressure in there will force some of the oil into the blower-'chamber'
when the blower-'chamber' is not under pressure ( not rotating )
Maybe I put too much oil in there.
Maybe it's because I used ATF which is VERY 'thin'.
Maybe both.
Donno.
Now there's another problem. A bad one:
at every 'half' rotation the 'lobes' lock up into each other
making a wholelotta' resistance (!!!)
Checking the surface of the lobes
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4-14.jpg)
..I found traces of what must have been some foreign object passing through
making a scratch/bump on the (PTFE/Teflon covered) surface ( + inside the housing )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5-8.jpg)
The raised surface would explain the 'lock-up'
BUT
after carefully removing the raised part there was no change in the lock-up.
Strange.
Checked to see if I could find the actual spot where the lobes touch each other ( which they should NOT )
by covering one 'side' at the time with a thin paint-like white agent.....rotated the lobes.....checked for
trace of color being transfered from lobe --> to 'opposite' lobe.
'Paint' on LOBE 2
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/8-2.jpg)
...transfered to LOBE 1
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9-2.jpg)
The transfer was found on a large area on the opposite lobe...not at/around the damaged area.
I can't come up with any explanation, except that the ATF has somehow
affected the surface/coating and made it swell up.
Some oil will do that to certain stuff. For example will WD40 make certain types of rubber swell.
All I know is that engine oil won't affect this surface.
I've have seen the inside of 4 different of these blowers.
All had a coating of oil. All worked just fine.
In the original set-up when the blower sat in the Subaru engine
the oil-mist from the crank-house vent was led into the blower via
a tube directing the mist into the intake just 'before' the blower.
Fortunately I cloned the blower when it was still in its original shape
and after a few days the in the blower-incubator the clone has now reached
the proper size:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/6-6.jpg)
..so I guess I'll just mount it, and then rip the other apart
to see if I can find an explanation.
Tonight I'm making the necessary modifications to the new one, so it will fit
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7-6.jpg)
Never a boring moment !
-
Maybe salt got in there??????.....If you have a blower a VERY good aircleaner is required......A Turbo is a little more forgiving if salt gets in the works...............................................................................
-
Was that a standard vinyl oil seal in the housing?
Rocky
-
Maybe salt got in there??????.....If you have a blower a VERY good aircleaner is required
Yes Sir, I do have a nice rather oversized KN filter.
Was that a standard vinyl oil seal in the housing?
Rocky
Have no idea what is the ( now mal-functional ) present blower.
Won't find out till I disassemble it.
The pic of the seal above , is from the first blower that I never used.
Test to compare the broken blower to the new one I'll install:
It's NOT a pretty sound coming from the broken one
VIDEO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jzdpcF0aLQ0)
.
-
Took the darn thing apart:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/11-1.jpg)
This blower is NOT in a good shape.
Found the thing that had ripped up the surface of the lobes:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/12.jpg)
...a piece of what appears to be aluminum,
kind of 'welded' into the surface (!)
Then this:
a 'crack-line' in the body
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/13.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/14.jpg)
Urgh!
Rotating the lobes it's obvious ( I think ) that their relative
position as altered ( anti-clockwise on the pic ), so that they interfere,
more or less at the area below what is highlighted by the white marker
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/15.jpg)
It's a bit of a mystery. My friend Georges has a theory that when some foreign
object got in there it was 'locked' between the lobes,
and as the gear-wheels are not "key'ed" to the shafts,
one gear-wheel slipped on the lobe-shaft ---> changing the relative position of the lobes.
It's the best explanation I've heard so far.
BTW the oil-leak from the gear-housing explains another worrying mystery;
the oil on the top of the pistons and on the cylinderhead
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/piston2.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/16.jpg)
-
Lars,
Maybe you could pin the rotors to the shafts. I recall that being done to the GMC 4-71/6-71 family of blowers to preclude what seemed to happen to your blower, i.e. the rotors slipping on the shaft & then binding.
HTH
roy
-
Hi Lars,
Split body, must have been quite an object to do the job... I have another supercharger off a twin cylinders Hanomag 2 stroke diesel engine, it's scratted and battered to death but no split, bits normally imbed themselves in the alloy, don't split it??
I had a better look inside my AMR500 today... I think I will get rid of the oil bath for the gears and lube them from a Tee and small jet off the oil return line to the oil tank and drain it back to the engine, don't fancy having about 50cc of oil sloshing in there!!!
And I now see what you meant by AMR's non standard ball bearings!!! Gawd, where did they get the idea???
Patrick
-
Wow! It took me a couple of days to get enough time to read the whole thread!
Amazing craftsmanship, and a wonderful story!
Kudos! :cheers:
-
OK so I was wrong:
Finally got the blower totally disassembled ( gears , bearings etc. ) today.
Lots of heat to get the gears lose
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a-8.jpg)
..well; loo and behold:
In spite of looking exactly like the first blower on the outside, this is quite different
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b-5.jpg)
..as the gears ARE keyed to the shafts !!! ( unlike the first one that had NO keys )
and
there are NO oil-seals behind the bearings
and
the bearings are completely different, being a double-row ball bearing type
with a metal seal/shield towards the blower-body
( and the size: diameter 15mm / outside diam. 35mm / width 23mm (!))
is NOT something I can find at my usual bearing-pusher SIMPLY BEARINGS (http://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/)
and
the bearing on the pulley side are different as well
being in size that is actually available ( unlike the ones on the first blower)
( The one on the pulley-shaft was shot, maybe from lack of lubrication (?) )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/c-4.jpg)
This means that the changed position between the rotors can only
be due to the rotor(s) having moved in relation to the shaft(s).
The rotors are made of aluminum ( covered with PTFE/"Teflon")
so I take it they are heat-shrink'ed ( is that the term ?) on to the shafts (?).
Mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm (http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/felix.gif)
Lars,
Maybe you could pin the rotors to the shafts. I recall that being done to the GMC 4-71/6-71 family of blowers to preclude what seemed to happen to your blower, i.e. the rotors slipping on the shaft & then binding.
HTH
roy
Thanks Roy.
Before I totally disassembled the darn thing I would have pointed out that
the problem was the gears were sliding on the shafts, but obviously I was wrong
so what you say here makes perfect sense.
Hi Lars,
Split body, must have been quite an object to do the job... I have another supercharger off a twin cylinders Hanomag 2 stroke diesel engine, it's scratted and battered to death but no split, bits normally imbed themselves in the alloy, don't split it??
Patrick. you've got a point, and I think you're right;
It probably wasn't a foreign object .....but ( I must shamefully admit )
the rather spectacular back-fires I experienced before the engine was set-up properly.
We're talking "fire-spitting-through-the-pop-up-valve" BIG-BANG back-fires.
I must ( even more shamefully ) admit that at one point I was suspecting that
the spring on the pop-up valve was too weak, so I added an extra one from
the auto-parts store in Wendover
The back fire theory would somehow explain the altered position of rotors, the splitting of the body and
probably the oil inside the intake as well.
Goodness; I wonder when this happened....maybe I've been riding all along with it
in this condition ?!??
I'm just not too smart.
You live, you make mistakes, you learn.
Gotta get the other blower attached and enjoy how it will now go a LOT faster.
Yeah, right.
Almost finished working on the heads, filing and sanding and polishing
around the repair.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/d-4.jpg)
Wow! It took me a couple of days to get enough time to read the whole thread!
Amazing craftsmanship, and a wonderful story!
Kudos! :cheers:
Well, THANKS a lot, Flattie !
-
( and the size: diameter 15mm / outside diam. 35mm / width 23mm (!))
is NOT something I can find at my usual bearing-pusher SIMPLY BEARINGS (http://simplybearings.co.uk/shop/)
and
Lars
why don't you use a pair of 6202 bearings (15 35 11) side by side
G
-
Great and informative pictures Lars! Much appreciated! Lots of thoughts for the mind. Are there any blower version identification numbers or other differences between the keyed and non keyed blower?
The rotors sideshift shows clearly there is tremendous forces in a backfire, I would like to avoid that problem. It seems to me that the blower could be saved if multiple blow-out valves was used or made as large as a barn door.
I'd bet a case of Carlsbergs those bearings are angular contact bearings in order to control side play, much like modern wheel bearings, so ordinary 6202 bearings are not an option, it might be possible to pair up 2 single ang.cont.brg. but problem is dual bearings needs to be preloaded and there is no positive lock for the outer race.
-
Are we going to lap the heads flat to the cylinders so they are brothers?
-
Brothers...It has to be little brother and big brother then??? 37cuin versus 45?cuin :-D Rocky, post some pictures and lets see what the big brother is doing to his motor...you sure got some tricky stuff too! and whats stewing in papa Moshers den??? Gee...this is going to be an exciting year 2011 when Fearsome Flathead Family is taking over the world (lets hope grandaddy Ron does approve!) 8-)
-
Lars, small diameter holes such as those for blow off valves typically do not provide effective relief for explosion induced pressure. Only a small amount of gas can flow through the hole with the speed needed to reduce the spike in pressure. In the past I have used "blow off" panels in the plenum chamber or air box with success. In all cases they had large openings.
-
Lars
why don't you use a pair of 6202 bearings (15 35 11) side by side
G
Graham: I'm afraid that not a solution.
See below:
I'd bet a case of Carlsbergs those bearings are angular contact bearings
Yep
in order to control side play, much like modern wheel bearings, so ordinary 6202 bearings are not an option,
Yep
it might be possible to pair up 2 single ang.cont.brg. but problem is dual bearings needs to be preloaded and there is no positive lock for the outer race.
Nope
Great and informative pictures Lars! Much appreciated! Lots of thoughts for the mind. Are there any blower version identification numbers or other differences between the keyed and non keyed blower?
Nope
The rotors sideshift shows clearly there is tremendous forces in a backfire, I would like to avoid that problem. It seems to me that the blower could be saved if multiple blow-out valves was used or made as large as a barn door.
Yep
Are we going to lap the heads flat to the cylinders so they are brothers?
I'm not sure what exactly that means.
I'll see to it that they are FLAT...that's it.
If they are all FLAT, they are 'brothers', I'd say.
Then I'll go for a copper gasket
Lars, small diameter holes such as those for blow off valves typically do not provide effective relief for explosion induced pressure. Only a small amount of gas can flow through the hole with the speed needed to reduce the spike in pressure. In the past I have used "blow off" panels in the plenum chamber or air box with success. In all cases they had large openings.
Bo; I'm listening
Just checking in here to say that I am still alive.
Not much progress on the Saltcracker.
Terribly terribly busy, fixing up my house to make it sale'able,
fixing up my workshop to make it live'able,
fixing up the Honda GL1000 that I've sold, but not delivered yet,
fixing up little things on the Honda CBX1000 that I'm putting up for sale
and working working working to make a living and to get together money for
the 2011 Bonneville trip.
Here's a little something with which I can polish my ego:
a while ago a guy on another forum told me that the editor of BikeExif,
the most visited on-line custom-motorcycle site in the world,
was looking for me.
I send him an email.....and loo and behold, the next day my bike
was featured:
CLICK (http://www.bikeexif.com/indian-741)
That's quite nice, I'd say.
Not because I want to brag about it, but mostly because the exposure
might help me find someone who'll maybe sponsor some of the expenses for the next trip.
I have no clue how to do that, but at least this time I can show that I actually
have achieved something and that it's out there
-
Lars, you are a very busy guy. So I will patiently wait for a PM. You have a mighty full plate, good luck! How goes the movie business?
-
Land Speed Larry, The term "brothers" refers to lapping the front head to the front cylinder using small 13mm circles using coarse, then fine and now to extra extra fine lapping compond. Now they are perfectly flat to each other , no need for head gasket , no worries about leakage and more compression ratio for the thin air. When the gasket surfaces have a matching matted gray hue, then they will be dedicated brothers joined at the neck for what lays in front of them.
Here is a starting point
(http://i378.photobucket.com/albums/oo221/ironwigwam/lapping.jpg)
-
Hi Lars,
When I was racing a turbo nitrous funny bike, we used to use a burst plate on the plenum chamber.
It consisted of 2 round rings with approx a 2" bore. The first ring was welded to the plenum, and drilled and tapped with 6 M4 screws threads
The second ring had clearance for the M4 screws.
The actual burst panel material started off as a coke can, but we found that the panting of the engine induced stress failures of the ally disc. We then changed over to plastic milk carton which never failed mechanically, but would burst at around 40 PSI.
If you would like, I could possibly dig out an old photo if this would help
Neil
-
Do the head gaskets always leak in the same place ?
Cometic will make custom head gaskets in Copper etc.
http://cometic.com/custom.aspx (http://cometic.com/custom.aspx)
IIRC, the rules don't require you to run stock cylinder heads.
Only the case and barrels need to start out stock.
So you might be able to make your own heads, to help improve sealing.
-
Lars, you are a very busy guy. So I will patiently wait for a PM. You have a mighty full plate, good luck!
I'm terribly sorry Bob!
A lot of...erh...stuff got in the way, so it slipped my mind.
I'll get back to you
Land Speed Larry, The term "brothers" refers to lapping the front head to the front cylinder using small 13mm circles using coarse, then fine and now to extra extra fine lapping compond. Now they are perfectly flat to each other , no need for head gasket , no worries about leakage
Thanks Rocky...I get it now.
My worry ( which might be unfounded ) would be if the head(s) , due to the heat
somehow would warp/twist ever-so-slightly, and there would be nothing to take up that.
Must say : for now it will be copper gaskets.
Hi Lars,
When I was racing a turbo nitrous funny bike, we used to use a burst plate on the plenum chamber.
It consisted of 2 round rings with approx a 2" bore. The first ring was welded to the plenum, and drilled and tapped with 6 M4 screws threads
The second ring had clearance for the M4 screws.
The actual burst panel material started off as a coke can, but we found that the panting of the engine induced stress failures of the ally disc. We then changed over to plastic milk carton which never failed mechanically, but would burst at around 40 PSI.
If you would like, I could possibly dig out an old photo if this would help
Neil
Hi Neil.
Now the problem is that I'm running at about 5-6 psi and I would have a hard time
'calibrating' a burst-panel to burst at , let's say, 9psi.
On the other hand, with a set-up similar to mine its a question of picking
the right coil-spring and adjusting the nut-tension on the spring
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSC_1097.jpg)
I do however see the advantage of having a big-area panel to burst open in an instant.
Mmmmmm: I'll give it some thought.
Thanks !
Do the head gaskets always leak in the same place ?
No.
Cometic will make custom head gaskets in Copper etc.
http://cometic.com/custom.aspx (http://cometic.com/custom.aspx)
IIRC, the rules don't require you to run stock cylinder heads.
Only the case and barrels need to start out stock.
So you might be able to make your own heads, to help improve sealing.
Thanks for the info !
...but I'm afraid that making my own heads are way outside of my
capabilities and AMA ( BUB ) rules says that running "Vintage" class
I must
"..retain the O.E.M heads..."
Strangely that doesn't appear to be the case for the S.C.T.A ( Speedweek ) rules.
-
Well: long time, no see
so time for an update:
Finally got around to disassemble the engine
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a-10.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b-7.jpg)
Basically it was all good news.
Nothing broken, no twisted con-rods, no scratches inside the cylinders etc.
Except for one thing:
ever since I ran it at Bonneville I've been completely mystified by something
strange going on:
When I twisted the throttle ----> the blower-drive-pulley ( and therefore the whole crank assembly)
moved to the left
When letting go of the throttle---> it moved to the right
One thing was certain ; the crank end-flow had risen from when we put the engine together
where it was shim'ed to the factory spec: 0.015" / 0.4mm.
When I measured it having the bike back in the work-shop it was a whooping 0.040" / 1.0mm
so obviously some strange 'sideways' force, that I couldn't phantom, was at play here.
No one I talked to could explain it.
-
To make a long story short(er):
fortunately I have friends in the USA who are waaaaaay smarter than I am.
David in Santa Fe dug into the problem and came up with , what I believe is,
the perfect explanation. There's even a term for it:
"Corkscrewing"
The easiest way to explain it is quote from the link to KIWI Indians (http://www.kiwiindian.com/)
that David provided:
"...Cork screwing is when the flywheels are fitted between
the case halves and are rotated, they pull to 1 side or the other....."
[ which mine does]
"... During service cork screwing causes side
loading (thrusting) which will cause damage to our lower end which is usually
evidenced by grooved or blued thrustwashers..."
...in other words; 'grinding' the thrush-washers/shims and the result
will be a larger end-play...as I have now
"...Possible causes are flywheel
misalignment, pinion and drive housings out of alignment (possibly caused by
improper installation), mismatched case halves or case halves have damaged
mating surfaces (causing cocking)..."
What I DO know is that my cases were 'matched' and line-honed,
so I took out the manual and went through the flywheel checking procedures:
First a visual check, for what the manual calls
"truing the flywheels"
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a1-6.jpg)
..by holding a scale to the face of both wheels
to check wheel-alignment
Whooha, mine didn't quite pass the test.
One side was like this ( note the distance between scale and 'lower' flywheel ):
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-27.jpg)
....and the opposite side ( 180 degrees around ) had just a tiny bit of distance
but the other way around ( at the 'upper' flywheel )
Then the manual calls for a way to "true up the rotation of the wheels"
by testing them in contraption like this
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a2-1.jpg)
and measure the "high spots" ( out of true ) on each wheel.
The height of these spots should be no bigger than 0.002" / 0.05mm
Borrowed this nifty thingy from a friend
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a4-1.jpg)
and measured both sides
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a5.jpg)
The high spots were 0.004" / 0.10 mm and 0.006" / 0.14 mm,
so that's twice and three times what it should be,
so obviously the two flywheels are out of true, in relation to each other,
making the assembly turn in a sort of 'tilted' whooply manner , causing the corkscrewing.
The KIWI link explains how to check for corkscrewing:
"...To check for cork screwing, rotate flywheel
assembly in 1 direction and see if it winds towards one side of the case. Now
rotate flywheel assembly in the opposite direction and see if it cork screws
towards the opposite side. Repeat this procedure several times ensuring that
"you" do not cause the side thrusting..."
....and YEP that's exactly what happened.
I rechecked ( to make sure it wasn't the contraption on which I rotated it, that
somehow made it move sideways )
by turning the crank assembly so left side rested on the right side of the contraption
and yep, the result was the same but of cause it moved sideways in the opposite direction
Bad news that it's out of whack, but then again: it's in fact GOOD news,
as the source of the problem is now found and it's relatively easy to correct
According to the manual, one simply take a big lead-hammer and whack them good
till they are true .
Seriously (!!!). That's what the book says.
I don't have the nerve for that, and anyway I'll take it to the machinist to
examine the rod bearings ( though I can't find any undue play ) and put
the thing together in a correct way.
What I did find ( very much in accordance whit what KIWI describes )
is some discoloration and marks on the shim on the left side
from the 'grinding' caused by the corkscrewing
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a6.jpg)
One other thing I checked was the flywheel balance.
This is a new one to me, but the book calls for:
..assemble one piston with all the rings and attach it to the 'male'
connecting rod.
..place them on two parallel bars or 'knife edges'
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a3.jpg)
Now , the piston and rod assembly should stay in any
position if perfectly balanced........should be capable of of balancing in
any rotated position.
I didn't have such a set of parallel bars, but put it back on the thingy
where the shafts rest on both sides on a pair of roller bearings.
I take it the result is the same.
First I removed the piston from the 'female' rod.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/a7.jpg)
...and NOPE.
It was not in perfect balance. One thing is that the result probably isn't
quite accurate due to the out-of-whack flywheels.
I'll do the test again when that thing is corrected.
If it's still out of balance the book says to drill 5/16" holes
through both flywheels on the 'heavy' side.
Never a boring moment...erh ?
BIG BIG thanks and kudos to David for solving the mystery
and to George of "Tri-Mac Speedsters" for patiently explaining the 'dynamics' involved.
-
Land Speed Larry,
The flywheels are never in true balance to each other. Usually around 62-68% of total mass.
I can send a balancing manual courtesy of ironwigwam.com if you PM me your address.
Rocky
-
...The flywheels are never in true balance to each other. Usually around 62-68% of total mass...
Sorry Rocky, I just don't know what that means
-
Lars, do not worry about the big lead hammer. It is standard operating procedure for a lot of us to use one to do the final truing, if needed. Always use a lead hammer. Nothing harder.
-
Hi Octane,
Balancing and trueing!!! real challange...
I do my own trueing... If you can manage to align the flywheels with a straight edge all round the periphery, you'll usually be within 2 to 4 thou from perfect, then careful use of the lead hammer to bring it dead true.
I also don't think balancing with one piston fitted as you show in that picture will be anywhere near since the rod without piston also comes in the picture. The balancing factor (I use 50% like most "old" H-D racers) applies to whole pistons, rings, wrist pins and upper part of the rods, all the bits that are concidered to be alternating weight, while the lower part of the rods, the crank pin and nuts, are concidered as a purely rotating weight. Balancing factor only applies to the reciprocating weight.
I usually calculate my balancing weight, but leave it to an expert to do the drilling/balancing for me from my calcs, they are a few shops that do it, day in day out, here in GB, costs about £50.00 or so if you only send them the flywheels. A lot more required if you send the complete crank since it will also include dismantling and reassembling/trueing...
Patrick
-
Larry,
PM sent
Rocky
-
...The flywheels are never in true balance to each other. Usually around 62-68% of total mass...
Sorry Rocky, I just don't know what that means
Ahhh. Get it.
I think you inadvertently mixed apples and oranges...the "to each other" part, that is.
That threw me off.
We're talking two different things here:
1...truing the flywheels ( the two in relation to each other )
2...balancing the ( complete assembly ) flywheels.
THAT's where the percentage of total mass comes in.
I only have rudimetarily knowledge on that subject.
I do remenber from back when I shared workshop with a guy who set
up his bike with new Wiseco pistons and Carillo rods , how they sat night after
night with digital scales and pocket calculators and large pieces of
paper with large numbers of ...er....numbers, trying to figure out
the closest to perfect balance for the flywheel.
I do understand ...somewhat...the dynamics of how the weight
( and therefore the 'balance' ) on the flywheels
shifts as the position of the weight of rods and pistons move about relative to the center
and how one can never get a 'perfect' balance
This link provided by David explains it rather well in laymans terms:
RB Racing on V-Twin Balance (http://www.rbracing-rsr.com/balance2.html)
Lars, do not worry about the big lead hammer. It is standard operating procedure for a lot of us to use one to do the final truing, if needed. Always use a lead hammer. Nothing harder.
OK , but frankly I just can't bring myself to do it.
I'll leave it to a local machinist who do just about nothing than rebuilding
HD flat head / knocklehead / panhead and Brit bike engines.
He's been doing it from the beginning of the world....well, almost
Hi Octane,
Balancing and trueing!!! real challange...
I do my own trueing... If you can manage to align the flywheels with a straight edge all round the periphery, you'll usually be within 2 to 4 thou from perfect, then careful use of the lead hammer to bring it dead true.
I also don't think balancing with one piston fitted as you show in that picture will be anywhere near since the rod without piston also comes in the picture.
Yep, I'm sure the Indian guys knew that,
BUT I think what the Indian manual it trying to say is
that with the method they propose ( only one piston ) you will get something
which in the end will get you to the same ( or nearly the same ) result as long complicated calculations etc.
In fact they , by using only one piston and the flywheel in perfect 360 degrees balance,
they 'build-in' the prefered "un-balance"...be it 62% or whatever.
The balancing factor (I use 50% like most "old" H-D racers) applies to whole pistons, rings, wrist pins and upper part of the rods, all the bits that are concidered to be alternating weight, while the lower part of the rods, the crank pin and nuts, are concidered as a purely rotating weight. Balancing factor only applies to the reciprocating weight.
I usually calculate my balancing weight, but leave it to an expert to do the drilling/balancing for me from my calcs, they are a few shops that do it, day in day out, here in GB, costs about £50.00 or so if you only send them the flywheels. A lot more required if you send the complete crank since it will also include dismantling and reassembling/trueing...
Thanks Patrick
-
Busybusybusy in the workshop.....timeisrunningfasttimeisrunningfasttimeisrunningoutshortly
Tested ( the un-harmed ) cylinder-head for flatness,
using the scribble-with-a-marker / run-it-over-a-flat-surface-with-abrasive-paper-glued-to-it method;
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top1.jpg)
Ooops: it was flat when I put it on the bike...well, not anymore.
Something tells me it is warping , more or less, along this line
which is obviously not 'supported' 'horizontally' as there are no
cooling-fins 'supporting' it in that direction
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top2.jpg)
..shown from a different angle here
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top3.jpg)
...and one of those 'low' spots is actually where the gasket failed
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top4.jpg)
...and then it gets worse:
tested the cylinders for flatness
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/cyl1.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/cyl2.jpg)
...same thing, but the 'other' way, which of cause just makes things worse,
but could explain the failed gaskets.......no ?
It was flat for sure when I put it on. The machinist had seen to that
when it was bored etc.
At first I thought "WTF", a cylinder can't do that !!!..forgetting that
this a flat-head , which ( still to me ) looks a bit weird
see from the side :
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/cyl3.jpg)
I could be wrong, but with that shape it could very well do just that
ever so slightly.....no ?
I guess the heat has a lot to do with this.
Hopefully running alcohol this year, will somewhat help the situation.
I've bought an extra carb that I will set up for alcohol
and keep the old one jetted for gas.
What to do ?
Dunno what to do about the cylinder, but a few ideas for the heads
has been floating around the workshop with help from the local
motorcycle-intelligentsia.
One idea would be to strength the heads by grinding of
the 'outer' part of the cooling-fins ( around 1/4" ) and then
weld on ( to the 'base' of the head ) an 'upright' piece of aluminum
( 1/4" by maybe 1" ) like this
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top5.jpg)
...maybe just in the 'direction' shown on the picture,
maybe on the entire circumference.
-
Some things you might consider:
Stronger, smaller diameter, (and longer?) head bolts (which would be stretchier) at higher torque (preload). To increase initial preload and then minimize its loss due to various (thermal?) distortions.
Re-torque after heat cycles.
Trim away the outside of the head gasket so that the gasket unit contact stress is higher and located more on the interior contour instead of spread across the relatively broad gasket land.
O-ring it.
-
Larry,
As you may not know, I have worked on the cylinder pressure sealing area as well.
1. Machined heads and cylinders flat on mill first,
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-11/1109362/head%20flat%201.jpg)
2. Added dowels so heads repeat their position on valves and also to slow head growth from heat.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-11/1109362/head%20flat2.jpg)
3. Flat within .002, not good enough as I am not using head gaskets to increase compression
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-11/1109362/head%20flat%203.jpg)
4. Now it is time to use lapping compond and a vibratory power unit to let eacjh surface ;ap it self to the other to be a perfect match.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-11/1109362/head%20flat4.jpg)
5. Now its closer than ever before.
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-11/1109362/head%20flat%205.jpg)
Not to hijack this thread but only to explain my misguided effort.
-
Is it possible to weld a knob onto the head. mill it flat, drill a hole in it? Then drill and tap a hole in the same location on the cyl, and add a stud?
-
I should have mentioneed before that I am converting to studs on this go-around rather than the stock fine thread bolts
-
Is there any material you could make the stud that is by the exhaust vlave area that would not grow so much? I bet it is growing more than the others. Or try cool the top and bottom of it with water or something.
-
Something tells me it is warping , more or less, along this line
which is obviously not 'supported' 'horizontally' as there are no
cooling-fins 'supporting' it in that direction
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top2.jpg)
..shown from a different angle here
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top3.jpg)
Why is there a slot, where the fins should meet ?
Is that a factory design ?
Is the head cast iron, same as the barrel ?
-
aparently you are loosing clamping force allowing the head to lift, blow the head gasket and warp.
I will still bet the stud is growing due to heat transfered from its base that is close to the exhaust port.
A halo from above the head or a giant clamp that is not dependent on that stud that is mounted right by the exhaust port.
-
I'm not sure about Octane and that stud by the exhaust port but it would be easy enough to add a water drip from the water tank in my case. Actually that stud is short to begin with as it can not breech the port
-
Hi all,
Somehow, I don't think the alloy head is the problem on an sv...
Side valves with cast iron heads distort the same!!!
Valves on the side, cast iron cyls, fresh cool intake on one end, hot exhaust on the opposite side, all this stuff hanging out in a bell tower away from piston, nobody can cure that, it's part and parcel of the design.
Best one can do is to try to get rid of as much heat as possible away from the combustion chamber or prevent the heat propagating too much, so, oldtimers' tricks: slot the cylinder's cooling fins on each side of the exhaust port, cooler fuels like methanol, enclosed valve stems/springs with oil circulation inside, run as little advance as you can get away with, do not use laminated/composite head gaskets, just plain ones, or better, delete them to get better control of the squish...
Patrick
-
I think French Owl is on it. Especially the part about getting rid of the composite gaskets, but we talked about that before. :-)
Just throwing out some ideas here, I'll start with the disclaimer that I have no actual knowledge of anything at all, so take or leave any of the following as you wish. These are just some random brain droppings. 8-)
One thing I'd be looking into if it were mine would be the head studs. It looks like you may have room to drill and tap for larger studs in the cylinders, at least the two on each cylinder on each side between the valves and cylinders. Offset the center line of the new larger holes so that you don't use up any more of the space between the studs and the combustion chamber. The larger studs would allow you to torque that area a little tighter to help control the deformation under pressure, and if you look at the design, it appears that the pressure against the head isn't evenly distributed on all the bolts, but rather is more concentrated on those two holes, causing the head to try to pull away from the cylinder in that spot. Also, like we discussed before, large thick washers to spread the clamping load out as much as possible, and machine the bearing face on top of the head to be flat to the washers. Possibly even build up some more with weld to spread it out even further.
It might even be beneficial to mill the gasket surface on the head so that there is a slightly proud lip (say .005 inch) all the way around the combustion chamber. That would allow it to press into a copper head gasket and really provide a good seal. It would be almost like having a true O-ringed head, which is not possible due to the limited space between the combustion chamber and the stud holes.
-
Stud girdles on bottom ends are made to "preload" main brg caps. What about a "Stud Girdle bridge" that lets you have some "pre load" bolts from the bridge down to the head :?
-
Some things you might consider:
Stronger, smaller diameter, (and longer?) head bolts (which would be stretchier) at higher torque (preload). To increase initial preload and then minimize its loss due to various (thermal?) distortions.
Re-torque after heat cycles.
Trim away the outside of the head gasket so that the gasket unit contact stress is higher and located more on the interior contour instead of spread across the relatively broad gasket land.
O-ring it.
Observer , you're giving good advise here.
Yep, other bolts are under consideration,
maybe some bolts ( some fancy SS-something material )
a friend showed me which has an expansion rate more similar
to aluminum , than the standard bolts
Yep, I will be a LOT more meticulous with the re-torque thing.
I'm afraid I did a sloppy job last time.
Others have surgested the O-ring thing. As I see it there just ain't 'room'
for it . The distance between the holes and the 'inside'/cumbustion chamber is just to small
Larry,
As you may not know, I have worked on the cylinder pressure sealing area as well.
1. Machined heads and cylinders flat on mill first,
2. Added dowels so heads repeat their position on valves and also to slow head growth from heat.
3. Flat within .002, not good enough as I am not using head gaskets to increase compression
4. Now it is time to use lapping compond and a vibratory power unit to let eacjh surface ;ap it self to the other to be a perfect match.
Not to hijack this thread but only to explain my misguided effort.
No hijacking at all Rocky.
I am listening, but I just do not see myself running without gaskets.
It's purely guesswork of cause, but looking at my warping heads and cylinders
I just can not imagine it will work and btw. I'm NOT looking for the added compression,
that comes with it,
in fact I'd rather be looking for some reduced compression in my case
Is it possible to weld a knob onto the head. mill it flat, drill a hole in it? Then drill and tap a hole in the same location on the cyl, and add a stud?
Yes, I guess it's possible, but I would be just a tiny bit afraid ( could very well be unfounded )
that adding more holes in the gasket , ( which would come with the added studs )
would create more "weak gasket area"s.
-
Why is there a slot, where the fins should meet ?
Is that a factory design ?
Yes it is.
Looking from above ( red arrow = direction of passing air )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top6.jpg)
...it's obvious that it's what INDIAN concidered to be the design that
gave the best air-flow .
"Closing" the V-formation would "trap" the air
Is the head cast iron, same as the barrel ?
No the heads are aluminum, the cylinders cast iron
-
aparently you are loosing clamping force allowing the head to lift, blow the head gasket and warp.
I will still bet the stud is growing due to heat transfered from its base that is close to the exhaust port.
A halo from above the head or a giant clamp that is not dependent on that stud that is mounted right by the exhaust port.
Stud girdles on bottom ends are made to "preload" main brg caps. What about a "Stud Girdle bridge" that lets you have some "pre load" bolts from the bridge down to the head :?
You're in line with Moen from Indian Spare Parts (http://www.indianpartseurope.com) there
if I understand you right.
Like a big fat 'ring' that I would sit on to the head, with holes
in the same position as the head-holes.
Clamp it down with longer head-bolts.
The 'ring' would have threaded holes with bolts that goes down on the head
in between the head-bolts.......right ?
He suggested the same thing.
Would probably work. The problem with it is time and money.
Would have to be precisely cut and milled.
Slightly complicated to fabricate as one would have to make it a funny shape
that 'raises' it in the area around the spark-plugs. Otherwise they won't come out or in.
-
Hi Lars, How about a stud girdle that goes across the head , 2 bars of aluminum and then tie them in to the bolts/studs that keep the cylinders to the case.. Just a thought.. Mike R.
-
Hi all,
Somehow, I don't think the alloy head is the problem on an sv...
Side valves with cast iron heads distort the same!!!
Valves on the side, cast iron cyls, fresh cool intake on one end, hot exhaust on the opposite side, all this stuff hanging out in a bell tower away from piston, nobody can cure that, it's part and parcel of the design.
I'm not alone !!!!
.-)
Thanks Patrick !
Best one can do is to try to get rid of as much heat as possible away from the combustion chamber or prevent the heat propagating too much, so, oldtimers' tricks: slot the cylinder's cooling fins on each side of the exhaust port
Sorry , my English is lacking: what exactly does that mean ?
Could I please ask you to explain ?
cooler fuels like methanol,
Check. Will do !
enclosed valve stems/springs with oil circulation inside
Woohaa , beyound my scope
run as little advance as you can get away with
Check. Will do. I REALLYREALLYREALLY need to get this silly contraption
ready in time to get it on a dyno.
The ignition timing I did last time was a joke to be honest.
do not use laminated/composite head gaskets, just plain ones
Check. Will do
or better, delete them to get better control of the squish...
Mmmmmm naaaaaa, see above
-
I think French Owl is on it. Especially the part about getting rid of the composite gaskets, but we talked about that before. :-)
Yep. Good to see ya' here Ed.
Are you coming this year ?
Just throwing out some ideas here, I'll start with the disclaimer that I have no actual knowledge of anything at all, so take or leave any of the following as you wish. These are just some random brain droppings. 8-)
I'll try'n catch them
One thing I'd be looking into if it were mine would be the head studs. It looks like you may have room to drill and tap for larger studs in the cylinders, at least the two on each cylinder on each side between the valves and cylinders. Offset the center line of the new larger holes so that you don't use up any more of the space between the studs and the combustion chamber. The larger studs would allow you to torque that area a little tighter to help control the deformation under pressure, and if you look at the design, it appears that the pressure against the head isn't evenly distributed on all the bolts, but rather is more concentrated on those two holes, causing the head to try to pull away from the cylinder in that spot.
Your random brain droppings are making perfect sense.
I'm listening
Also, like we discussed before, large thick washers to spread the clamping load out as much as possible, and machine the bearing face on top of the head to be flat to the washers. Possibly even build up some more with weld to spread it out even further.
The bearing faces are machined 'flat'
and in fact there is room for bigger washers. Not much but still:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top8.jpg)
It might even be beneficial to mill the gasket surface on the head so that there is a slightly proud lip (say .005 inch) all the way around the combustion chamber. That would allow it to press into a copper head gasket and really provide a good seal. It would be almost like having a true O-ringed head, which is not possible due to the limited space between the combustion chamber and the stud holes.
Sounds like a good idea. I'll have to think it over.
Hi Lars, How about a stud girdle that goes across the head , 2 bars of aluminum and then tie them in to the bolts/studs that keep the cylinders to the case.. Just a thought.. Mike R.
Mike, I'm afraid that again perhaps my English is lacking.
I think it's a good idea ( if I understand you right )
but that's the same thing that Sparky ( and Moen ) suggested ?....or ?
I apologize to those of you ( probably several ) that I misunderstand
or maybe just plain don't understand.
Some times I just don't get the finer points of the English language.
-
Thanks all !
I'm truly grateful for all your advise.
Please don't get me wrong if I do not follow all your advise.
Does in no way imply that it's not good advise,
just that time and money makes it impossible
or the simple fact that I can no follow them all as some
are somewhat contradicting.
Take it in a positive way:
when I blow this little devil to smithereens
it won't be because of your advise
.-)
In fact I've made a list of them and will contemplate all
and judge what can be done.
I do believe that some, if not most of the problems are due to excess heat:
bad ignition timing , maybe bad jetting and the simple fact that a
supercharged flat-head should be run on alcohol to cool things down.
There's a few thing that I most probably will do and not do:
The idea of supporting the heads by welding on an 'upright' piece
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top5.jpg)
...is out.
It will disturb the airflow. Don't wanna do that.
The newest idea is to weld on additional material at the points where
there is the least material to support the gasket
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top7.jpg)
...and of cause flat it down to be flush with the head-surface.
Seamed to be the area where the gaskets broke up.
...copper gaskets
...bigger washers
...new bolts
I'll look into the 'girdle'-idea but I'm afraid I just won't have the time to do it.
I'll bring a spare set of heads.
Moen found a set for me
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/top9.jpg)
...a few fins are broken and I need to have the washer 'bearing' surfaces machined etc.
but they'll work and having an extra set gives a certain peace of mind.
Is this then the end of the troubles ?
Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa !!!!!!
Checked the valves:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6186.jpg)
Goodness this little devil certainly is intend to self-destruct fastlike:
One exhaust valve was ever so slightly bend,
as in: the head was not in angle with the stem
and the other exhaust was worse
AND the stem was pitted
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Valve2.jpg)
Huh ?
I can find no explanation but violently excessive heat. ( ??? )
There was no trace of the valves interfering with the head.
So what could I do but call the local Indian Parts Delivery Service ?
Some call for pizza delivery.
No me.
Moen dropped by on his wonderful little Moto Morini
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/mm1.jpg)
...with a set of valves
and after a bit of lapping
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6187.jpg)
..in they want.
So was this the end of the troubles ?
Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa !!!!!!
The machinist working on my crank called.
Baaaaaad news:
when putting in and torquing up the nuts on the crank-shaft...
( I'm not sure about the right English term; I'm talking about the shaft that holds together the flywheels
on which the rods are attached)
...it flipping broke !
Huh ?
No sure explanation except this IS a weak point:
when INDIAN when from 'splash' "lubricating" the shaft/con-rod big-ends
to pressure lubrication , they basically used the old part except they bored
a hole straight into it at the timing-side end of this relatively small diameter thing
( and then holes out to the big-end bearings )
so thereby turning that end into a relatively thin-walled tube
instead of a proper shaft.
( the hole is plugged with a thingy ( dunno the term )
Who said this would be simple and easy ?!!!
Anyways, he is now mounting a shaft of his own making.
What can I say ?!!!
One could argue ( with great persuasion ) that this whole endeavor is plain idiotic:
an anaemic seventy-something old engine with a 'technology' firmly based on
what was available more like a hundred years ago:
as Moen said yesterday: take the con-rods,
with very little difference they are similar to nineteen-twenties INDIAN rods
which most probably weren't even state of the art at that time.
...and that's I try it to turn into a
salt-ripping "fast" racer...ha ha ha !
But h*ll: I like it, and besides I gotta work with what I've got
and work my way to improve it.
Better stop making dumb mistakes.
Again: thanks you all for helping me making a bit less foolish mistakes !
"..The road to wisdom ?
Well it's plain and simple to express:
Err and err again
but less and less and less.."
Piet Hein (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piet_Hein_%28Denmark%29)
-
What I have in mind is like Iron Wiggwams jig (see previous post) for the oversized head studs then drill holes in the plate and tapp for bolts to screw down to the head with a spreader much like a floating end of a C clamp.
Torque the heads down with the studs then preload the the bolts---someone smarter than me will have to advise you on how the torques on the various studs and bolts would need to be. some or all of the fins would have to be milled off where the "feet" reached down
-
Lars, you sure have had your share of challenges this year! Hang in there, you will do at least 130, still my prediction if you can keep it running.
Look me up in Pre Stage. Are you going to park at the bend in the road?
Bob
-
Octane, you are not alone with your leaking head gasket problem, Iv'e had more that just a little drama keeping my cylinder / head hold down studs from pulling out of my crankcase in the past,,during re-assembly !
Here is my solution (I hope)
(http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t24/generatorshovel/top.jpg)
If this does not work, at least I won't run over the head and barrel when it blows.
Tiny
-
Octane,
When you run out of new ways to hold that head down, why not try a thicker head gasket to lower the compression. After all, you've go a supercharger to bring the compression back up again. Better to walk before you run. You could always start with the lower compression, then switch to thinner head gaskets later.
Tom
-
The rules require you to use the stock cylinders, but not the stock heads.
You could make up some heads with more material in the right places,
and a different fin pattern.
(http://www.petpeoplesplace.com/petstore/pet-image-large/harley-flathead-wl-wr-45-cylinder-heads-6-high-comp_110673086530.jpg)
-
"Some times I just don't get the finer points of the English language."
If you watch and listen carefully most of us who use it as our native tongue sometimes have the same problem!!! :? :? :?
Pete
-
What I have in mind is like Iron Wiggwams jig (see previous post) for the oversized head studs then drill holes in the plate and tapp for bolts to screw down to the head with a spreader much like a floating end of a C clamp.
Torque the heads down with the studs then preload the the bolts---someone smarter than me will have to advise you on how the torques on the various studs and bolts would need to be. some or all of the fins would have to be milled off where the "feet" reached down
OK, I get it now
Basically that's the same thing that Moen suggested but different........erh.....I wish I could explain !
Lars, you sure have had your share of challenges this year! Hang in there, you will do at least 130, still my prediction if you can keep it running.
Look me up in Pre Stage. Are you going to park at the bend in the road?
Bob
Hi Bob ! Aaaaaaaaaa, I think you're a bit too optimistic
.-)
Yep, I'll be at the bend.
Looking forward to meet you again !
-
Octane, you are not alone with your leaking head gasket problem, Iv'e had more that just a little drama keeping my cylinder / head hold down studs from pulling out of my crankcase in the past,,during re-assembly !
Here is my solution (I hope)
(http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t24/generatorshovel/top.jpg)
If this does not work, at least I won't run over the head and barrel when it blows.
Tiny
That looks great Tiny.
A bit too sophisticated for me.
I'd probably end up with something like this BSA Gold Star:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/20.jpg)
Huh ?!
Yep!...I took that pic a couple of years ago at the Swedish racetrack Knutstorp
Octane,
When you run out of new ways to hold that head down, why not try a thicker head gasket to lower the compression. After all, you've go a supercharger to bring the compression back up again. Better to walk before you run. You could always start with the lower compression, then switch to thinner head gaskets later.
Tom
Yep, that might be worth a try !
Also; hopefully I'll have time to do an extra pulley for the blower to run it slightly slower.
The rules require you to use the stock cylinders, but not the stock heads.
I'm afraid that only goes for SCTA, but not for AMA / BUB where I plan to run as well.
Vintage classes:
"...flathead, OHV, and 2 stroke engines must retain the O.E.M. Heads, Cylinders
and Crankcase originally installed at the time of factory production..."
"Some times I just don't get the finer points of the English language."
If you watch and listen carefully most of us who use it as our native tongue sometimes have the same problem!!! :? :? :?
Pete
Ah ! ..so that's why I don't understand you guys
.-)
-
Been fooling around with carbs today.
Got myself an extra one as a back up in case I do something foolish
with the 'original' one.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6234.jpg)
On a normal set-up with this carb on a big HD it would run with a 180 main-jet ( = 1.8mm diameter hole)
I bored my main-jet up to 235 ( = 2,35mm diameter hole ...you get the point now...right )
in order to get it rich enough.
Nice.... except when reflecting on it and properly using what little brain I have left
there a slight problem:
The mail jet sits below a small tube that goes up into the venturi.
The hole in that tube is is big enough to flow the gas from the main-jet
except the needle is always "taking up room" in the hole , even at full throttle.
Calculated the 'effective area' (EA) of the hole
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6221.jpg)
and the restrictive area of the needle at a position as when at full throttle.
Oooops: what was 'left' was an area smaller than the area of the main jet hole area.
My ham-fisted 'solution' to this was to bore up the hole in the little tube thingy
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6222.jpg)
and raising the needle ( made possible by a DYNOJET aftermarket needle with grooves and a circlip )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6231.jpg)
Now to check the effective flow area, I put things back into carb
and again marked the position of the needle ( at full throttle )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6232.jpg)
Calculated again hole area and subtracted needle-at-that-position area.
...and hey !!! ...I now have an area bigger than the main jet even after boring it up to 3mm
to set it up for alcohol.
( The area of the former 2.35 main-jet hole was 4,2 sq. mm
the area of the now bored 3.00 main-jet hole is 7.06 sq. mm)
Now further down the system:
The bore of the float-bowl valve hole is 3.2mm so that's fine
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6224.jpg)
but will the valve
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6225.jpg)
restrict the flow ...as in will the valve be slightly 'in' the hole even when
fully open ( float bowl near-empty )
Dunno really, but I could measure the flow-rate, so I set up at test:
1 liter water in a bottle
Connect to carb
Hold up bottle while shaking about the carb ( as when running )
so float-valve would open/semi-open/close/open etc.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6235.jpg)
...and timed how long it took to flow 1 liter.
That took almost exactly 2 minutes, so:
At 160 km/hour ( 100 mph ) I would run 2.6 km pr. minute
or 5.2 km pr. two minutes
So I have 1 liter to run 5.2 km.
That probably doesn't mean a thing to you, but that's the equivalent of running
12.2 miles pr. gallon
That has got to be enough for a tiny 600cc engine even running on alcohol.
If not then I will just have to mix it with gas ( requiring less stuff to burn pr. mile )
This is hardly a rocket science exercise , but just my cross-eyed attempt try and set up the carb.
...............................
Now that the pocket calculater was hot in hand
I did a bit more calculating.
Wanted to know how many RPMs I ran at Bonneville.
I knew the speed ( just shy of 90mph ) the circuference of the rear wheel ( 2 meters )
the wheel and gearbox sprockets ( 40/22 ) and the primary sprockets ( 52/24 )
so it was a simple matter of going 'backwards'
and result was that I was running 4700 RPMs.
That's a good number and being slightly optimistic that this time around
I will run the same 4700 RMPs with a slightly stronger running engine
I've decided to mount a 25 sprocket on the gearbox
and if all goes according to plan ( ha ha ...as IF ) running the same 4700 RPMs
on the little devil Saltbicquit, it will reach the phenomenal speed of 100 mph.
A fine round number, I'd say.
................................
New fancy and rather expensive headbolts and bigger hardened washers
from ARP (http://arp-bolts.com/) have been ordered.
Have a great weekend ya'all !
I hope I haven't bored you silly.
-
Land Speed Larry,
Do you have a part number for this ARP product?
Roky
1957 S/VG
-
Hi Lars,
Roughly, you'll need twice as much methanol as required on a gasoline set up.
1.8mm diameter main jet = 2.54sqmm
X 2 = 5.08 sqmm/3.1416 = 1.62 = rxr = 1.27 radius = 2.54mm diameter
My S&S MGAL, 47mm, when on methanol on my OHV bike, needed a 3mm fixed main jet plus a Mikuni adj. main jet, 3mm diameter with an external needle adjustment, about 1 turn 1/2 open. It used to drink methanol like there's no tomorrow, at 1/4 mile sprints I could do about 6 passes plus warming up in the padock with 8 litres in the tank...
From old timers tales, mostly true, do not mix gasoline with methanol, it's quite hard to tune properly... You'll be better off with straight methanol.
At one stage, I tried to run the OHV with a 38mm methanol spanish square Amal from a grass track bike... it did not last long, about 100 yards and the float chamber was empty, not enough coming in.
Solved it by fitting a German made twin float conversion, used on long track speedway there. It had 2 feeds and 2 needles about the same size as yours in it. But it was an ugly carb for a vintage bike, so went the S&S route after that...
It's also quite hard to judge carburation with methanol, spark plugs don't get the colors you'll be used to and it doesn't tell you when you're too rich, which is a problem since unburned fuel will pass the rings and wash your cylinders, loosing you compression. On a flat run, the engine don't load enought to tell you. I found the best tuning was gained when doing hill climbs and enrichen the mix until it accelerates cleanly uphill...
My little Terrot also runs on methanol, old type AMAC without needle and a 45 degree cutaway on the slide. That's only a 22.2mm carb, main jet, tuned dead nice, is 2.2mm. It's the massive cut away that leans the mixture.
Then there's the oil... No oil on the market likes methanol... Best run straight castor oil...
Patrick
-
Do you have a part number for this ARP product?
No, I'm afraid not.
They were ordered as individual bolts and washers from Allen's Fasteners (http://www.allensfasteners.com/).
They have a section for ARP (http://www.allensfasteners.com/search_results.asp?txtsearchParamCat=61) products.
I ordered them in different lengths and specifications ( tensile strength , heat expansion rate , 'hardness' etc. )
with help from a friend who knows about these things ( which I don't )
-
Hi Lars,
Roughly, you'll need twice as much methanol as required on a gasoline set up.
Yep.
1.8mm diameter main jet = 2.54sqmm
X 2 = 5.08 sqmm/3.1416 = 1.62 = rxr = 1.27 radius = 2.54mm diameter
My S&S MGAL, 47mm, when on methanol on my OHV bike, needed a 3mm fixed main jet plus a Mikuni adj. main jet, 3mm diameter with an external needle adjustment, about 1 turn 1/2 open. It used to drink methanol like there's no tomorrow, at 1/4 mile sprints I could do about 6 passes plus warming up in the padock with 8 litres in the tank...
WoW ! That's 8 liters ( more than 2 US gallons ) running 1½ mile ( ??? ) ...are you sure ?
From old timers tales, mostly true, do not mix gasoline with methanol, it's quite hard to tune properly... You'll be better off with straight methanol.
OK but my thought was to adjust the mix with a bit of gasoline,
like if for instance I was running a bit too lean ( on methanol ) due to the restrictions in the carb
I would ad gas
At one stage, I tried to run the OHV with a 38mm methanol spanish square Amal from a grass track bike... it did not last long, about 100 yards and the float chamber was empty, not enough coming in.
Solved it by fitting a German made twin float conversion, used on long track speedway there. It had 2 feeds and 2 needles about the same size as yours in it. But it was an ugly carb for a vintage bike, so went the S&S route after that...
It's also quite hard to judge carburation with methanol, spark plugs don't get the colors you'll be used to and it doesn't tell you when you're too rich, which is a problem since unburned fuel will pass the rings and wash your cylinders, loosing you compression. On a flat run, the engine don't load enought to tell you. I found the best tuning was gained when doing hill climbs and enrichen the mix until it accelerates cleanly uphill...
My little Terrot also runs on methanol, old type AMAC without needle and a 45 degree cutaway on the slide. That's only a 22.2mm carb, main jet, tuned dead nice, is 2.2mm. It's the massive cut away that leans the mixture.
OK, but please check my calculations here.
Mind you: I could be way off as this is something I've never done before;
...before I was running a 2.35 main jet ...area = 4.2 sq.mm
but due to the restriction of the needle in the tube-thingy, in fact I only had a flow of 3.66 sq.mm
( hole 2.9 mm = 7.06 sq.mm . Needle area at full throttle ( 2mm diameter ) = 3.4 sq.mm......7.06 minus 3.4
---> effective area = 3.66 sq.mm )
...NOW the main jet is 3mm...area is 7.06 sq.mm
and this area IS effective as I've bored up the tube-thingy and raised the needle so the area around the needle is 13.8 sq.mm.
SO : what I should compare now are the numbers 3.66 and 7.06
meaning I have close to the double area now ( which is needed for running alcohol )
Might want to bore up the main a wee bit , though.
Does this make any sense ?
( I do realize these are just the musings of a semi-ignorant guy
punching a pocket calculator. Real life conditions may vary....a lot )
Then there's the oil... No oil on the market likes methanol... Best run straight castor oil...
Yes you're right.
I even made a test to see how alcohol would mix or not mix with ordinary oil
and it was discussed here Alcohol compatible oil / oil dilution (http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,6033.0.html)
As you can see: that's now they do it over at their side of the pond.
They just don't have the stuff.
-
As I think I've mentioned, I want to run alcohol mostly to cool things down.
If it fails then I guess I have to fall back on the earlier mentioned
PRMWIT system.
You know : Passive Random Mechanical Water Injection Tuning ( rain )
If THAT fails ( depending on the weather situation ), I will be ready with the incredible SAHIK optional equipment:
( Space Age Hand-held Injection Kit)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/water.jpg)
OR
the newest development; the PrePumpableProfessionalWaterInjectionKit
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Waterinj.jpg)
Heeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeey: it might work
OK , I'm nuts, but look at the carb,
it has a nifty redundant inlet here
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/inj1.jpg)
that was blocked on both my carbs. Guess it's for some enrichment (?)
as the 'hole' itself is part of the "choke" enrichment system that I've blocked off on my carb.
How about hooking up a tube and a valve
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/inj2.jpg)
and a small water-tank.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/inj3.jpg)
Of cause I wouldn't have the faintest whiff of an idea how much water one can 'inject'
but let's say it's set up only for wide open throttle and
activated by a fancy remote-controlled valve activated from the handlebar.
My guess is that the water will be thoroughly mixed into the gas
when tumbled in the blower
Am I insane ?
Probably.... but it's a lot of fun to let the mind wander.
Now back to work. I have a bike to 'finish'.
-
lars,
a good figure on alcohol volume is 2.2 x the amount of gasoline you
would be using.
much research has gone into that figure from those that know way more than me.
franey
-
You should get in contact with some speedway tuner folks, they work exclusivly with methanol. I can put you up with an address in Gothenburg. I think i saw that you have some so and so drivers there in that tiny Denmark....whats his name....Niklas Petterson, Nicki Pedersen? When I think on speedway I can only think of the shanting that echoed at the circuits
Tony-Tony-Tony-Tony-Tony-Tony Richardson- :evil:
I don't have experience with methanol, but as I understand it the mixture span is a lot larger before the engine is loosing power. If it is too lean the exhaust temperature rises and if it is too rich the flame goes out and the engine misses. So why not use extra methanol injection instead of the water you are thinking of and loose less power when injection cuts in but still have the cooling effect. A exh. temp gauge could determine when the valve should open.
-
Lars,
As I remember from my sprint car days running alcohol is pretty forgiving. Its sweet spot for maximum power is pretty wide which allows you to run rich with not a huge power loss penalty. We actually controlled the engine temp by how rich we ran the engine in the sprinter. Now these cars are grossly over powered so the loss of a few percent of power for engine cooling is not as big a deal as running an engine a the salt. Sprint cars do not spend their time a WFO throttle like salt vehicles. I think it was John Romero in his 1500 cc blown fuel Honda ( it made over 650 Hp as I remember) told me that he injected alcohol right in front of the turbo and the air temp dropped 70 deg F, he did not run an intercooler as I remember. I would definitely go with alcohol over water injection, although I like some of your injector concepts!!
Looking forward to seeing you at the salt.
Rex
-
If a person could keep the valve springs cooled like with a drop of oil or an injection system one could keep more spring pressure onseat and lessen the heat of springs,
Hhmh, maybe I could with water?
-
Hi,
The H-D Model K has forced lub to the springs and valve stems, works this way: a hole is drilled between the crankcase and the top of the tappet guides. It's at an angle, pointing up. When the pistons go down, there's more pressure in the crankcase than in the timing cover which is at athmospheric pressure. This forces an oil mist up these holes. Oil is drained from there by a longitudinal groove cut in the tappet guides. Spring telescopic covers are fitted with fiber washers top and bottom and an O ring in between them.
Patrick
-
lars,
a good figure on alcohol volume is 2.2 x the amount of gasoline you
would be using.
much research has gone into that figure from those that know way more than me.
franey
OK. Thanks Franey
You should get in contact with some speedway tuner folks, they work exclusivly with methanol. I can put you up with an address in Gothenburg. I think i saw that you have some so and so drivers there in that tiny Denmark....whats his name....Niklas Petterson, Nicki Pedersen? When I think on speedway I can only think of the shanting that echoed at the circuits
Tony-Tony-Tony-Tony-Tony-Tony Richardson- :evil:
I don't have experience with methanol, but as I understand it the mixture span is a lot larger before the engine is loosing power. If it is too lean the exhaust temperature rises and if it is too rich the flame goes out and the engine misses. So why not use extra methanol injection instead of the water you are thinking of and loose less power when injection cuts in but still have the cooling effect. A exh. temp gauge could determine when the valve should open.
Thanks Charlie.
Concerning the methanol:
I have some books, booklets and info from various sources
that I read back in 2009 when I started building the bike.
I have to read up on it again.
I think the speedway crowd of today would look at my 70 old , side-valve, supercharged engine,
shake their head and say: " ..what the **** is that ?.."
As for speedway champions I have two words for you: OLE OLSEN !!!
.-)
Lars,
As I remember from my sprint car days running alcohol is pretty forgiving. Its sweet spot for maximum power is pretty wide which allows you to run rich with not a huge power loss penalty. We actually controlled the engine temp by how rich we ran the engine in the sprinter. Now these cars are grossly over powered so the loss of a few percent of power for engine cooling is not as big a deal as running an engine a the salt. Sprint cars do not spend their time a WFO throttle like salt vehicles. I think it was John Romero in his 1500 cc blown fuel Honda ( it made over 650 Hp as I remember) told me that he injected alcohol right in front of the turbo and the air temp dropped 70 deg F, he did not run an intercooler as I remember. I would definitely go with alcohol over water injection, although I like some of your injector concepts!!
Looking forward to seeing you at the salt.
Rex
That's my understanding as well ( as I remember it )
that one can run quite rich with little penalty besides the risque
of 'washing' the cylinder walls.
My whole water-injection thing was of cause a joke,
but now I'm all intend on seriously looking into the possibility.
Maybe starting here: Mechanical water injection (http://www.landracing.com/forum/index.php/topic,8257.0.html)
Thanks Rex. Looking forward to seeing you too !
-
Crank is back:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6250.jpg)
..all ready to go.
Here's what happened when the machinist torqued the crank-shaft nut:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6254.jpg)
Seams a bit weird to me that the diameter is so much
smaller right behind the threads.
Fortunately this brilliant guy have a modified crankshaft of his own making
where the there is no such silly thing
and his also have a smaller hole at the end, so the
'wall's of the hollow shaft is thicket.
This is the original one:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6252.jpg)
Compared to his
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6251.jpg)
Probably hard to see from the photos
but there is a significant difference.
-
AaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaH !!!
Finally that glorious , long awaited moment when one can go CLICK
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6260.jpg)
Signifying that now parts are going back together again,
after messing with and fixing dozens and dozens of small damages, dodgy work,
and mistakes.
Carb's ready
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6264.jpg)
Frame touched up with a bit of rattle-can spewing
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6243.jpg)
A bunch of parts fixed, cleaned and ready to be installed
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6261.jpg)
A new set of tires
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6265.jpg)
And last but definitely not least:
engine ready to be assembled.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6263.jpg)
It's gonna be a nice weekend !
-
Spend a few hours at Moen's place ( Indian Parts Europe ) the other day
talking about ideas for future modifications to the bike.
One thing came up:
the possibility to beef up the engine by installing a crank/con-rod assembly
of somewhat stronger build.
From the left,
rods from: HD WLC , Indian 101 ( more or less like mine ) and HD Sportster.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6200.jpg)
That Sportster thing certainly looks the part.
It's not too difficult to cram into da' Indian case.
In fact it's a rather common thing to do and he has (click:)all the parts required (http://www.indianpartseurope.com/strokerscout.html).
The thing is that it will 'stroke' the engine which is not a bad thing
and if I wants to keep it in the cc-class , I can revert to original size 500cc cylinders.
Mmmmm: worth a thought.
Talked about carburation and some interesting things came down from the shelves:
A bunch of , to me, rather odd carbs, the GARDNERS:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6212.jpg)
Look how the slide moves downward , the needle is static
and the fuel move up through the slide ...huh !?
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6211.jpg)
Weird, but I've seen a Vincent streamliner from the UK with these on.
They do work really well.
Then this funky old S&S alcohol carb
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6213.jpg)
One type that fascinated was these
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6204.jpg)
The Wal Philips injectors.
A fuel-valve at the top and a butterfly inside.
Adjust the mixture by changing the relative position of the two.
That's it and that's that.
Absolutely brilliant.
He's got some seriously mouthwatering stuff out there.
Have a look:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6197.jpg)
Weslake, Jawa, JAP, Ariel and Triumph racing engines.
On the top-shelve you can see part of his collection of magnetos.
Apparently the best ever are the ones from some Vincent engined
'drone' airplanes the Brits used to practice shoot at or something.
Nice stuff indeed.
Have a great weekend ya'all !
-
Land Speed Larry,
I have crank pins with the indian taper that will let you use the Sportster rods in the indian flywheels so you do not increase the stroke.
So you have another option.
Am going to Forest Lake for final assembly on liner the 13th.
will see you in person soon.
Rocky
1957S/VG
(http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-11/1109362/xl%20pin.jpg)
-
those gardeners look similar to carbs you see around here in the early and mid seventy's.
there were-- posa " injectors"
lake " injectors"
franey
-
The Wal-Phillips were a great idea based on an earlier Lucas design. Like Lucas they leaked (fuel vs. electricity). But unlike Lucas they actually caught fire and fire is light. Lucas nearly used their early injector design as headlights.
-
The Wal-Phillips were a great idea based on an earlier Lucas design. Like Lucas they leaked (fuel vs. electricity). But unlike Lucas they actually caught fire and fire is light. Lucas nearly used their early injector design as headlights.
So they were Lucas's answer to acetylene headlights
Nice
G
-
More stuff on Wal Phillips on my page here:
http://victorylibrary.com/brit/WP.htm
-
Wal Phillips "injectors".....I used them on my roadracing sidecar in the 1970 with great success...the outfit
was powered by a pre-unit Triumph engine....the engine was mounted in our outfit in a lay-down position
like the Moto Guzzi singles....made for a lower profile sidecar outfit....The Wal Phillips units got fuel
from 2 Amal GP float bowls...using a electric fuel pump.......once you got them adjusted they worked great
and were not effected by the cornering forces that always effect carburation on a racing sidecar...........
-
The folks at Sudco in the US have the parts to convert Keihin carbs to alcohol, such as float valves, etc. www.sudco.com Write or call them. They have a lot more stuff than is shown on their website.
-
,
I have crank pins with the indian taper that will let you use the Sportster rods in the indian flywheels so you do not increase the stroke.
So you have another option.
Great .
Thanks Rocky !
those gardeners look similar to carbs you see around here in the early and mid seventy's.
there were-- posa " injectors"
lake " injectors"
franey
Yep, although I'd say that the Gardners are just a bit more "sophisticated".
My friend George use a POSA on his brilliant supercharged intercooled two-stroke 100cc
that I rode for my rookie-run at Speedweek:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/100_2013-Kopi.jpg)
The Wal-Phillips were a great idea based on an earlier Lucas design. Like Lucas they leaked (fuel vs. electricity). But unlike Lucas they actually caught fire and fire is light. Lucas nearly used their early injector design as headlights.
So they were Lucas's answer to acetylene headlights
Nice
G
LOL
More stuff on Wal Phillips on my page here:
http://victorylibrary.com/brit/WP.htm
Wal Phillips "injectors".....I used them on my roadracing sidecar in the 1970 with great success...the outfit
was powered by a pre-unit Triumph engine....the engine was mounted in our outfit in a lay-down position
like the Moto Guzzi singles....made for a lower profile sidecar outfit....The Wal Phillips units got fuel
from 2 Amal GP float bowls...using a electric fuel pump.......once you got them adjusted they worked great
and were not effected by the cornering forces that always effect carburation on a racing sidecar...........
Thanks for the info !
Wonder how they'd work on a blown engine
The folks at Sudco in the US have the parts to convert Keihin carbs to alcohol, such as float valves, etc. www.sudco.com Write or call them. They have a lot more stuff than is shown on their website.
Thanks Bo!
I'll check it out.
-
Yesterday was a good day.
Got a lot done.
The weather acted up and we had a thunderstorm
with the worst downpour of rain measured in 30 years.
6" in two hours (!) ,
so this was what Copenhagen looked like yesterday
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Rain.jpg)
...so I stayed in and burned the midnight oil.
Had the crank end-float shims laid out
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6266.jpg)
and a few INDIAN tools courtesy of Indian parts Europe
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6272.jpg)
and after initially screwing things up,
and assembling and disassembling a few times
I got a perfect end float
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6277.jpg)
It's a bit difficult to explain but the engine
comes together in a rather unorthodox manner
because of the way it goes into the frame
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6278.jpg)
...but finally around midnight ,
in it went:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6282.jpg)
All what's left is to throw the rest of the parts in the general direction
of the above......and WrrrrOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM !
.
-
Lars, are you positive that top photo isn't from Venice, Italy?
-
Lars, are you positive that top photo isn't from Venice, Italy?
Yep, though it's hard to recognize it as being Copenhagen
Yesterday was a good day.
Of cause it wasn't.
What I meant to say, was that it was a good day in the workshop.
..................................
Got the valve gear in
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6285.jpg)
..and measured the cam-shaft end-float
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6291.jpg)
..to compare it to the last time the engine was assembled
just to make sure nothing funny had occurred.
-
...assembled the nifty starter-mechanism
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6295.jpg)
allowing myself time to smarten up the cover
by polishing it, masking up some go-faster stripes
and sand-blasting it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6302.jpg)
New head-bolts and hardened washers from ARP arrived:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6309.jpg)
New on the left. Old on the right.
Unfortunately there was a f-up with the number of bolts they send me
so I'm waiting for the rest to arrive
The copper gaskets arrived
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6308.jpg)
They really look the part.
They're 1.7mm ( 0.066” ) thick. (!)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6310.jpg)
Of cause they had to be trimmed to size.
Used a dentist thingy with a bend sharp thingy ( lots of thingies here )
to mark the shape of the combustion chamber
scraping along the edge under the gasket
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6312.jpg)
(Yes; I have grown an extra hand. One needs that when working on an INDIAN.)
Filed it into shape
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6313.jpg)
and 'flattened' the edges
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6314.jpg)
Made an extra set , which of cause was easier now that I had a set of templates
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6317.jpg)
and punch-marked them F and R , for 'front' and 'rear'
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6316.jpg)
Did the BPG test ( Bostik Poster Gum )
Gum in the heads. Assemble heads to cylinders. Turn engine.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6319.jpg)
to make sure the valves didn't interfere with the tops.
Front head looked good.
Ooops: rear head, not so good
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6321.jpg)
so had to work on them a bit
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6324.jpg)
So back to filing the gaskets.
DOH: maybe I should have done this in the right order
Heated up the gaskets with a propane torch to soften them.
...and I heated and I heated and I heated and I heated
but they really wouldn't turn red,
but they did go soft.
I was wondering if the torch just didn't deliver enough heat
so I tried on my BSA gaskets. No problem. Turned nicely red.
??????
Made me think if the old gaskets would take such abuse.
NOT so:
after about 15 seconds the gasket burst into flames ( huh ??? )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-28.jpg)
and the surface totally disintegrated
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-26.jpg)
ever so slightly bending the gasket and taking a closer look
revealed that it had totally fallen apart and sort of evaporated
looking exactly like what happened to them last year when I ran with them on the Salt
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-19.jpg)
I have no clue why this would happen.
People use these kinds of gaskets every day.
My friend Allan use them on his souped up Indian Chiefs with no problems.
Maybe this particular batch had some sort of fabrication failure (???)
Anyway: makes me feel rather confident using the copper gaskets
-
Maybe the old gaskets were not designed for a performance application
Also, I don't see a metal fire ring on them
I was speaking to a friend of mine, who works Jim Parker Indian in Australia, and he told me he was getting thick chrome moly washers custom made for that application, and anything short of copper or copper-asbestos gaskets just didn't work
G
-
I'm using the hardened head bolt washers from my discarded SAAB V4 engine. I suspect they are the same on the german Ford V4 and V6 engine.
-
I was speaking to a friend of mine, who works Jim Parker Indian in Australia, and he told me he was getting thick chrome moly washers custom made for that application
My new washers are grade 8 hardened,
so they should do the trick.
Maybe the old gaskets were not designed for a performance application
Mmmmm, dunno: but the thing is that , as I mentioned, my friend use them on
his two highly tuned Indian Chiefs, which turns out waaaaay more power than my engine
It's weird.
The first person I told about this, had trouble believing I was telling the truth
( and frankly; so was I....ha ha ) so I re-did the test this morning
putting it on video ....can't argue with that, can ya ?
Here's the video. Watch how it bursts into flames at around 10 sec.
( Click the image ,wait a few seconds and the video starts )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/th_filmII.jpg) (http://s207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/?action=view¤t=filmII.mp4)
and here's the result of the above exercise:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6336-1.jpg)
Now I do understand that this is not a exact representation
of what goes on inside the cumbustion-chamber, but still ;
all that damage just from my measly little torch !
.
-
Lars, it is not hard to make a copper head gasket. Sheet copper is available from a commercial roofer and usually they have scraps. First the copper is clamped between two pieces of wood. The big piston hole is cut with a hole saw to a size a little bit smaller than the final size. Then it is taken out from between the wood pieces and the piston hole is enlarged to the final size and the other holes made. The last step is to anneal the gasket. It takes an evening to make one gasket for a single cylinder.
-
Lars, I expect you know (and did) this, but to properly anneal copper, you have to heat it and quench it. The opposite to annealing steel.
These days its fairly easy to get copper gaskets laser-cut.
-
Lars, I expect you know (and did) this, but to properly anneal copper, you have to heat it and quench it. The opposite to annealing steel.
These days its fairly easy to get copper gaskets laser-cut.
I think that the jury is still out on the quenching part, but I'd like to hear what other people think (or know, if we have an export on board.)
This is copied form Gasket Works USA website:
"After the gasket has been worked to proper size it is ready for use. It may be necessary to re-anneal the gasket if it has work hardened. Annealing is a heat treatment that softens copper. The gasket may work harden somewhat if you have worked with it but it still should be soft enough for use.
Since there is oxygen within the copper it can only be annealed (using flame heat) a few times before it becomes somewhat brittle. I don't rec. reannealing more than three times.
OXY/ACETYLENE TORCHES may give TOO MUCH HEAT. We do NOT REC. this method.
Heat the metal until it appears just dark red while in a dark location. More red or orange is not necessary. Ideally, a temperature of about 900d F is optimal. Let air cool. Once cool (in about five - ten minutes) brush with the"Scotch-Bright" pad on a flat hard surface to clean and flatten. A flaky post annealing residue is normal after annealing in air. Bright annealing in an inert gas oven is optimal and prevents this oxidation. "
I've heard of both methods.
Tom
-
I am not an engine guy, but I have been lucky to have watched some great engine guys work. When assembling the Yamaha road race motors Don Vesco used to heat the copper gaskets and then quench them to to the annealing. It surprised the heck out of me at the time as it is the opposite of heat treating various steels. They used to use the same gaskets a number of times.
It really is the details that count in engine assembly. You are doing a great job Lars, it really takes time to do it right! :cheers: Can't wait to see your bike in person this year!
Matt Guzzetta
-
Lars, it is not hard to make a copper head gasket...
Nope
It takes an evening to make one gasket for a single cylinder
..but I simply do not have the time.
I needed one set + one extra set
+ one set ( not filed to size ) for my extra set of heads.
So I bought 3 sets. They're not cheap but they're not expensive
Lars, I expect you know (and did) this, but to properly anneal copper, you have to heat it and quench it. The opposite to annealing steel.
These days its fairly easy to get copper gaskets laser-cut.
I think that the jury is still out on the quenching part
Thanks Briz
and thanks Tom for the info.
Obviously the jury is still out,
but I did do the quenching thing.
From what I've gathered it won't hurt.
It really is the details that count in engine assembly. You are doing a great job Lars, it really takes time to do it right! :cheers: Can't wait to see your bike in person this year!
Matt Guzzetta
Thank you for your kind words Matt.
A friend pointed me to a magazine in which was featured a bike
that's supercharged and runs one of them Wal Philips 'injectors':
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/wf.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/wf2.jpg)
The builder claims it works really well
but best so at WOT
Mmmmmmmmm.
Da' Saltbisquit is starting to look like a bike again:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b1-2.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b2-3.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/b3-2.jpg)
.
-
What a fantastic build, i can only give you one tip, for the head gasket - machine in a couple of matching grooves on the barrel top and cylinder head underneath to give a better seal on the copper gasket - the copper will press into those grooves and never blow the gasket.
Good luck at Bonneville,
regards Ellwood
-
Hi Lars. Somehow I missed the post showing the gaskets. They look good.
Most of the fellows that taught me how to work on engines grew up in the great depression. They were thrifty. One guy bought his copper head gasket new in the annealed state. He kept the gasket for the life of his engine and he did not reanneal it. He said the gasket squished to conform to the high and low spots in the mated surfaces. He always reinstalled it exactly the same way, up side always up, etc. He also torqued and untorqued the head bolts in incremental intervals and he followed the manufacturer's tightening pattern. This was important, he said. He had no head gasket problems that I recall.
It is difficult to get a head gasket evenly heated with a propane torch before quenching. Some spots are hotter than others. This can make some spots more annealed than the rest and cause problems. A gas stove burner can adequately heat a bike head gasket with sorta even heat. A foundry has a large enough flame to evenly heat a car gasket. When in doubt let a foundry do it. Usually the cost is minimal and several gaskets can be done at the same time to make it economical.
One of my side acts is old style architectural sheet copper work. The copper needs to be annealed so it can be bent and hammered around sharp corners. See the copper around the posts. This is a job I am doing this afternoon. The copper is quenched after heating if it can be done. Often it is not. Both processes make it softer but the quenching makes it softest and the annealing is the the most uniform with quenching.
Pre-unit Triumphs needed more bolts in the cylinder head between the cylinders. Head gasket leaks were a problem in this area. Some silver paint applied to both gasket faces at this spot made a big difference.
The bike is looking good. - Bo
-
Thanks Ellwood !
Thanks Bo. Your sheet copper work looks just beautiful.
I mentioned earlier that my friend running the two souped up
big Indian Chiefs, used the same head gaskets that I previously used.
Not so. I had misunderstood him.
In fact he uses this type
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6357.jpg)
..a triple layer of metal.
Don't know the exact kind of metal, but a magnet sticks to it.
Never seen that type before.
The right head-bolts from ARP arrived yesterday
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6358.jpg)
..so with a bit of luck I can start up the beast tomorrow.
-
Not sure if true with yours, but gaskets used to be made with asbestos etc. surrounding a steel wire mesh grid.
-
Helleva bike, beautiful.........
-
Helleva bike, beautiful.........
Thanks racer !
After two days of strugling with the *¤#æing starter system
while a certain Murphy declared martial law in the workshop
finally this afternoon it was ready and set to go.
Maybe it's just me, but it's with a certain anticipation
and fear of the worst, that one starts up an engine after a rebuild.
Started it up with a 50/50 gas/methanol mix
and it just burst into life like a flipping pussycat.
It sounded real good too. You can't hear that on the video
( where it sounds like a poorly assembled demented lawnmower )
as it was taken by my friend with his I-phone.
Just couldn't cope with the noise.
My ears are still ringing...seriously.....niiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiice !
Click image for video:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/th_Video1.jpg) (http://s207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/?action=view¤t=Video1.mp4)
Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeehaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaw !
One rather reassuring observation: it runs MUCH cooler.
The whole intake system was quite cool of cause, and I could put
my hands on the tops, no problem, after running it.
Something I definitely couldn't do before, when running on straight gas.
-
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Looking and sounding good! Can't wait to hear it run in person. Now all you've got to do is tear it down and ship it, right????
What are your travel plans in the states this year? I saw that you have procured an RV and are going to do some wandering.
-
Lars, if you do decide to wander about in the RV - I'm full of good places to see and visit. Nancy and I have toured extensively out west on our Gold Wing (motorcycle) and have found lots of places that'll give you scenery that you don't see in Europe, and roads that'll make a spin through the Alps a very simple ride. Substitute Denmark" for Europe if you please. Anyway - get in touch with me if you'd like to do some pre-trip planning. Oh yes -- I'll also give you my tip on which road atlas to buy to show you where you're going.
I look forward to hearing from you soon -- or, if not -- to seeing you at Salt Talks.
-
Sounds good from Forest Lake, Minnesota
I'll be departing Minnesota about the 24th for BUB with Lyle
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Started it up with a 50/50 gas/methanol mix
and it just burst into life like a flipping pussycat.
[/quote]
Will you race with 50/50, or straight Methanol ?
-
:cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Looking and sounding good!
Thanks Ed !
The sound on the video really does not do it justice.
One of the other guys did a video as well.
Still a wimpy sound, but slightly better: CLICK (http://youtu.be/ARiscoSHEFg)
Can't wait to hear it run in person. Now all you've got to do is tear it down and ship it, right????
Naaaaaaaa: today I'll take it to a friends workshop situated
on a former military airfield where I can run the engine and make a LOT of noise
and make short runs. Then hopefully get it on a dyno and
THEN tear it down and ship it.
What are your travel plans in the states this year? I saw that you have procured an RV and are going to do some wandering.
Ohhh yes; The Behemoth, The Barge , The Mothership... whatever.
It's in Santa Fe where it's being checked by a truck/RV garage.
So far so good: engine's good, good equal compression on all 8 cylinders,
needed a little work on the carb, transmission good, getting a full service etc.
I'll fly to Albuquerque, drive up to Santa Fe....spend a few days working on the barge....drive to Salt Lake City
to pick up the bike , then on to Bonneville....join George and his brilliant Tri-Macs team at Speed Week
...then BUB...
after that; dunno yet. Depends on money , job etc.
Lars, if you do decide to wander about in the RV - I'm full of good places to see and visit. Nancy and I have toured extensively out west on our Gold Wing (motorcycle) and have found lots of places that'll give you scenery that you don't see in Europe, and roads that'll make a spin through the Alps a very simple ride. Substitute Denmark" for Europe if you please. Anyway - get in touch with me if you'd like to do some pre-trip planning. Oh yes -- I'll also give you my tip on which road atlas to buy to show you where you're going.
I look forward to hearing from you soon -- or, if not -- to seeing you at Salt Talks.
Thanks a lot Jon. I'll get in touch.
Sounds good from Forest Lake, Minnesota
I'll be departing Minnesota about the 24th for BUB with Lyle
Rocky
1957S/VG
Looking forward to see you !
Will you race with 50/50, or straight Methanol ?
Don't know yet.
I'm to do a bit of backwards testing/reasoning, starting with the carb as it is
and use the relative quantity of the gas and the methanol, to get the right air/fuel mixture:
the carb jets etc. is bored to the max.
I'm pretty sure the jets etc. are not big enough to run straight methanol
so I'll start off with 50/50 and then add more and more methanol into the mix
till I'm getting close to a lean condition.....and then 'back off' some
so I'm on the safe side ( running slightly rich ).
-
Almost forgot, Neal will be with us as well.
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Almost forgot, Neal will be with us as well.
Great !!!
Today was a very good day.
Took the bike out of town to run the engine ( and make LOTS of noise )
and check all systems.
Dunno what it is. I must have done something right.
It just runs so really really really well.
The angriest little dragster-devil in town.
No big problems, just little things like the belt adjuster not being the
most clever devise ever dreamed up, so will change that.
But it starts on the dot and just revs like there's no tomorrow
not missing a beat:
Video and sound, and a happy camper with the goofy'ist grin (http://youtu.be/JP5Vz6JBY6g)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/avatar_2275.gif)
.
-
Nice way to violate the local noise ordinance. Sounds wonderful.
-
Hej Lars,
The Vincent Vikings will be there in 2011 along with John Renwick and his Vincent sidecar streamliner from the UK. Feel free to join our camp and let me know if you need anything in the meantime.
Vi ses
Mange hilsner Kurt
-
Lars, You are the Prince of Denmark with the stoutness of that tune-up.
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Nice way to violate the local noise ordinance. Sounds wonderful.
Thanks KH !
Hej Lars
Haløjsa Kurt! Det var længe siden
The Vincent Vikings will be there in 2011 along with John Renwick and his Vincent sidecar streamliner from the UK. Feel free to join our camp and let me know if you need anything in the meantime.
Tusind tak !!!
Thanks a lot !!!
I'll get back to ya'!
Vi ses
Ja, for pokker.
Bedste hilsner herfra med ønsket om at du kører endnu hurtigere i år !
Lars, You are the Prince of Denmark with the stoutness of that tune-up.
Rocky
1957S/VG
Thanks a lot Rocky !
See you !
-
Lars, You are the Prince of Denmark with the stoutness of that tune-up.
Rocky
1957S/VG
Let's just hope that the Prince of Denmark is not related to the Prince of Darkness (Lucas)! Hope to see you at BUB.
Tom
-
:cheers:
-
Lars, You are the Prince of Denmark with the stoutness of that tune-up.
Rocky
1957S/VG
Let's just hope that the Prince of Denmark is not related to the Prince of Darkness (Lucas)! Hope to see you at BUB.
Tom
He's a VERY distant cousin, so I don't worry about it
:cheers:
:cheers: to you Sparky !
See ya'
-
The start-up the other day was mostly to check all systems
before it goes on the dyno Monday morning.
The guy who runs it has the appropiate name "Speedy".
He knows his stuff. particularly old stuff; he runs a turbo-charged Norton.
One thing we checked was if the vacuum piston in the CV carb
actually did lift all the way up at WOT.
I would have been surprised if it didn't
what with the blower and all, but here's one nerdy video to show it: CLICK (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9pzjZTRNUpg&feature=related)
( probably won't win me a most-seen-YouTube-video prize...ha ha
Took the heads off to check things.
basically it all good:
absolutely no trace of damage to the fine new copper gaskets...PHEW !
No damage to the piston tops.
One little problem:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z1-2.jpg)
...slight valve/head interference.
Fortunately the heads are made of marsmallowium.
AURGH ! You might recall that I DID check for clearance before
engine assembly.
The problem is that the diameter of the bolt-holes in the heads a quite considerably larger
than the diameter of the bolts , so the head can move about.
I really should have made some dowels ( is that the term ?) going
through the head / gasket / cylinder, to keep them in position.
Any way, I removed enough material so it won't happen again
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z2-1.jpg)
There was a slight sign of bolt-lubrication 'sweating' around the bolt-holes
its way into between the gasket and the head/cylinder
so this time I painted the gaskets , both sides, with zinc paint
before assembly, as suggested by some good folks here.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/z3-1.jpg)
This also gave me an oppotunity to position the gaskets perfecrly on the head
while the paint was wet. I let it dry for a while and the gaskets were thereby 'glued' to the heads.
I could then turn them around and position the heads on the cylinders
WITH the gaskets under them in the proper position.
Getting ready for the dyno-test.
Wish me luck
and have a brilliant weekend ya' all !
-
Dyno test result
WoooooooooooooooooHaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/IMG_0013.jpg)
Now that was interesting:
did all kinds of set-up, gas , gas/alcohol, pure alcohol,
ran it lowered boost; simply put a too-weak spring on the pop-up valve
so part of the gasses/boost leaked out...NOT the proper way...but heeey: rock'roll !
First surprise: the boost is beyond the wildest expectations: 1 bar / 14.5 psi plus.
Must have been running with a malfunctioning blower at Bonneville.
I could watch the intake-hose expanding like a fat man breathing when cranking up.
Something I did not experience at Bonneville last year.
Finally after a lot of fooling around da' little devil delivered close to 40 bph at the rear-wheel
running pure alcohol.
That of course is nothing by the standards of what most of you guys run,
but for a little 70 year old stone-age-technology flat-head that left the factory with probably
considerable less than 20 bph , it is a result beyond my wildest expectations.
Some interesting figures:
accelerating from 100 km/h to 150 km/h is done travelling just 180 meters
or from 62 mph to 93 mph is done travelling just 590 feet.
It didn't get too hot. Nothing broke. Nothing fell off.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/avatar_2275.gif)
Here's a video from when it still ran on gas making some 32 bph.
No Indians were harmed during this video-recording.
CLICK (http://youtu.be/x3CRi1Z2e6o)
Removed heads today: no damage whatsoever to the head-gaskets,
no pitting ( is that the word(?)) on top of piston...PHEW !
I think my gasket problems is a thing of the past.
Going back there tomorrow morning to fine-tune ignition and jetting.
.
-
Nice videos, great work, looks like things are coming together for a fun time at B.ville this year!
I especially like this part: No Indians were harmed during this video-recording.
-
It raises the bar to keep on track. Thanks Cool Bean lars. Is that Moen in the background?
-
Lars
Were any Danes harmed?
I still say you will do 130..mph not kph.
See ya in Pre-stage.
Bob
-
That's great to hear Lars... :cheers: See ya in Sept. :-D
-
Nice topic Lars, and thanks for posting dyno results... Very interesting project you have, very interesting.
Fine-tuning probably yields few more horsepowers.
-
Forgot to ask, what were or are the RPM's in best power?
I saw only the speed... Do you know the exact RPM number or what is the estimation of these?
Absolutely fantastic idea that supercharged side valve Indian...
-
No indians were harmed---lol :cheers:
-
it sounds good lars.
it's a good thing your 4 way flashers are working.
see ya when I see ya.
franey
-
Hi Lars. This build shows a fellow with strong craftsmanship talent who is progressing to learn the tools and analytical skills of seasoned builders and racers. The future looks good.
-
It raises the bar to keep on track. Thanks Cool Bean lars. Is that Moen in the background?
Rocky: check your P.M.
Lars
Were any Danes harmed?
LOL.....nope
I still say you will do 130..mph not kph.
Naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa...no way
See ya in Pre-stage.
Bob
Looking forward to see you Bob!
In my book, you as a volunteer working to make it all happen, makes you one of the heroes of Bonneville
That's great to hear Lars... :cheers: See ya in Sept. :-D
See ya !
Forgot to ask, what were or are the RPM's in best power?
I saw only the speed... Do you know the exact RPM number or what is the estimation of these?
We got the RPM readings fixed yesterday and as I remember it, the best power is around 4500 RPM
No indians were harmed---lol :cheers:
Cheers Sparky !
-
it sounds good lars.
it's a good thing your 4 way flashers are working.
see ya when I see ya.
franey
See ya' Franey !
-
Hi Lars. This build shows a fellow with strong craftsmanship talent who is progressing to learn the tools and analytical skills of seasoned builders and racers. The future looks good.
You're very kind Bo, but I'm afraid that what I've been doing to this poor old machine is somewhat
of a miscalculation:
I've turned this 70 years old thing into a (relatively seen) over-inflated drag-racer.
Moen with is expansive INDIAN experience and knowledge
and 'Speedy' ( the dyno-guy) with his decades of tuning American twins experience
and the machinist who did the crank and stuff on my engine, with his vast experience
of building and re-building highly tuned Americana V-twins
ALL tell me that I will bring a new meaning to the term 'blown' INDIAN if I run with such
a high boost as I do at present, so today I've been frantically working to
find, and to arrange to fit new blower cam-wheels and belts to get the boost down
and find and fit new drive-chain sprockets to get the RPM's down.
My heartfelt gratitude and thanks go out to
my dear friend Jakob :
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/jbindian.jpg)
who will do the work on the pulleys.
To 'Speedy' of Basement Performance (http://www.speedys.dk/32052709)
for patiently dyno-testing my bike, give lots of good advise , doing it at a VERY favorable price
and generally being just a great guy
To the brilliant guys at Engelbrecht Construction who swiftly, this morning,
ordered all the parts I needed, and will do the work on the sprockets to make them fit my bike.
Thank you Anders, thank you Per and thank you Kim !
Last, but not least, thanks again to Moen at Indian Parts Europe] (http://www.indianpartseurope.com/)
for patient, invaluable help and assistance.
I owe you all...BIG time !!!
I hope to, one day, pay you back, in some way !
-
Lars,
While your packing stuff up, throw in one of those old blown head gaskets. I've got a little plan "cooking" up. :lol:
-
Lars,
While your packing stuff up, throw in one of those old blown head gaskets. I've got a little plan "cooking" up. :lol:
OK Ed.....mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm: what is he up to ?
-
Looking for Speed Week pre-entry.
It can be (snail)mailed to my friend in Santa Fe.
I can pay via PayPal or Westerne Union money transfer.
Thanks.
-
I have a lot respect for racers whether there in a fully cage dragster or in a cockpit of a red bull race plane, but you bikers are on a whole different level. I had an 01 RC51 a few years ago that I got up to 175 on I36 heading up to Boulder in CO, I had to pull the seat out of my @$$ when I came to a stop. Much respect for the speed that you guys set out to reach on two wheels.
-
Thanks Jorge !
I have a lot respect for racers whether there in a fully cage dragster or in a cockpit of a red bull race plane, but you bikers are on a whole different level. I had an 01 RC51 a few years ago that I got up to 175 on I36 heading up to Boulder in CO, I had to pull the seat out of my @$$ when I came to a stop. Much respect for the speed that you guys set out to reach on two wheels.
I'm waaaaaaaay behind in that line of fast and not-so-fast bikes.
Pre-entry secured thanks to a heads-up from 'Franey'
Thanks man !
.
-
glad that I could help, lars.
bf
just for gp,- did you get info from the pm or my email?
-
glad that I could help, lars.
bf
just for gp,- did you get info from the pm or my email?
Didn't get no email.
Got your PM ( and an 'alert' in my email, that I had recieved a PM )
.
-
Quick update:
I seam to remember I had a fully functional bike a couple of days ago.
Mmmm; not any more
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6406.jpg)
It's all good:
New pulley wheels are ready.
New chain sprockets being made.
During dyno testing I made this test-tube
from a second float chamber I had, to measure the fuel level
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6402.jpg)
..and check if it was running dry.
It was ...sort of...long story
So Jakob expanded the 'intake' into the carb float chamber from 3.4 to 3.9mm ( black hole in the center )
as he has clearly marked it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6407.jpg)
...and made extra holes along side the valve.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6408.jpg)
..so as to get more flow because not all fuel needs to pass between the valve and the sides of the
'hole' it sits in. Some can escape out the holes.
I think it was the dyno guy who told it was an old trick to get a bit of extra flow.
Not only that; he made a little instrument with a tip
angled as the float-valve-tip, that he used to 'knock' carefully
down the new expanded 3.9 mm hole, so the valve will seat properly
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6410.jpg)
...AND Jakob being the brilliant Jakob he is,
he made a plastic tip to protect it.
AND he modified the new pulley wheels to fit the bike.
Jakob, if you read this : I bow my head and duff my cap to you!
Back to work.....busybusybusy !!!
-
Lars, come on, come on! we can't wait to see you again on the salt!! :cheers: :cheers:
-
Thank you Sparky !
See ya !
Back to work.
-
Great work and good info...........Also good to see our SALT TEAM ADVANCED LANDSPEED is not the only one still building at this late date.........
-
Great work and good info...........Also good to see our SALT TEAM ADVANCED LANDSPEED is not the only one still building at this late date.........
Thanks Scrambler.
You're way ahead of me: still working on the bike today. Must deliver the bike to the shipping company tomorrow.
Dozens of little things to do.
Doing a blower belt cover-cover ( or something ) to comply to the S.C.T.A. rules
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6414.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6417.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6416.jpg)
Not purdy, but it will work
...fixing the reserve blower that I'll bring . Arrived yesterday
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6415.jpg)
...and a bunch of other stuff.
And here's a little thing to boost my ego.
Latest edition of the Danish BIKE Magazine
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6420.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6418.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6419.jpg)
Back to work
-
My head bolts arrived today from Allan's.
Thanks for the heads up.
Rocky
1957S/VG
-
Lars---that looks like some great coverage :cheers:
-
Rocky, you're welcome !
Sparky; it is.
Does that mean the big-buck sponsor dollar will flow in now...............naaaaa.
Getting there getting there getting there:
Picked up a reserve blower belt.
Bunch of paperwork for the shipping company.
Started packing:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/pak.jpg)
Nice bike...er ?
-
Rocky, you're welcome !
Sparky; it is.
Does that mean the big-buck sponsor dollar will flow in now...............naaaaa.
Getting there getting there getting there:
Picked up a reserve blower belt.
Bunch of paperwork for the shipping company.
Started packing:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/pak.jpg)
Nice bike...er ?
Lars , as ya can see i followed your suggestion, i'am hooked up with landracing.com. Keep us posted with your adventures on the flats.
Many happy trails at the flats, Cheers mate :cheers:
-
like some fella out west said a few years ago -
" there is nothing left to do but everything"
franey
-
Lars , as ya can see i followed your suggestion, i'am hooked up with landracing.com. Keep us posted with your adventures on the flats.
Many happy trails at the flats, Cheers mate :cheers:
Thanks Alexander !..and welcome to the forum !
like some fella out west said a few years ago -
" there is nothing left to do but everything"
LOL
-
One ( well. two , in fact ) notes before I leave early tomorrow to start
my jurney to the Land of the brave, home of the free:
A BIG thank you to Moen at Indian Part Europe (http://www.indianpartseurope.com/)
for all his hel and advise.
He dropped by the workshop last night with this magnificent box of spareparts
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/box.jpg)
with everything from valves to clutch springs,
and the lid had that nifty 'window' with description of every single part.
Thanks Moen ! Without you, my silly adventure wouldn't have ever happened.
Looking forward to seeing you all, and looking forward to visit your beautiful great country.
Please allow this here foreigner to make a humble and heartfelt comment on the current situation and political 'climate'
in the USA;
Shut the f*** up and appreciate what a truly fantastic, free and incredibly beautiful country you all live in
and just f****** get along, and work together on solving the relatively small problems you are dealing with.
You're not in f***** Somalia.
You're blessed !
[Jumping down from soap-box]:
See ya' all soon
-
Cool Ass Lars,
Thanks it has been a pleasure having you in the streamliner crew in 2008, hopefully the liner can make Moen as proud as well this year.
See you soon,
PM me with a phone number when you land and get settled.
Rocky
1957 S/VG
-
Thanks Rocky.
I'm going shopping for a helmet tomorrow
in Albuquerque.
Don't have the rule-book with me.
Could someone please tell me the 'rating' requirements.
Something about SNELL (?)....something
Thanks.
-
Lars
Snell Foundation M2005 or M2010 (black strap)
you can use the M2005 until 2015 and the M2010 should see you through until the end of 2020
G
-
Lars,
I will be running my bike and you are welcome to borrow my helmet, boots, gloves, leathers or what ever else you need.
Don
-
Hey Lars! We'll still be on the lookout for you in San Diego. :-D Safe travels, hope we meet up sometime. Jill
-
Lars --- how does the rate of exchange from Euro to dollar affect the trip?
-
...and will it be different when the Market opens on Monday...
-
Lars
Snell Foundation M2005 or M2010 (black strap)
you can use the M2005 until 2015 and the M2010 should see you through until the end of 2020
G
Thanks Graham !
Lars,
I will be running my bike and you are welcome to borrow my helmet, boots, gloves, leathers or what ever else you need.
Don
Thank you very much Don !
I do have the leathers from last year that Bob Bakker gave me ( Thanks Bob !!! )
I'll see if I can buy the rest of the stuff here i Albuquerque
where I am right now, is a semi-shitty motel, after a looooooong trip,
waiting for the shops to open
If I can't find the right stuff I might have to take up your generous offer.
Thanks !
Hey Lars! We'll still be on the lookout for you in San Diego. :-D Safe travels, hope we meet up sometime. Jill
Thanks Jill !
Hope I'll be seeing you
and your brilliant bike
sometime
Lars --- how does the rate of exchange from Euro to dollar affect the trip?
Haven't a clue really
but nothing dramatic.
Danish Kroner to the US Dollar:
(http://www.x-rates.com/d/DKK/USD/graph30.png)
We don't have Euros in Denmark. Still the good old 'Kroner' ( = Crowns )
though it's 'tied' to the Euro
...and will it be different when the Market opens on Monday...
Donno.
Forgot my crystal ball at home
.-)
.
-
Looking forward to seeing you all, and looking forward to visit your beautiful great country.
Please allow this here foreigner to make a humble and heartfelt comment on the current situation and political 'climate'
in the USA;
Shut the f*** up and appreciate what a truly fantastic, free and incredibly beautiful country you all live in
and just f****** get along, and work together on solving the relatively small problems you are dealing with.
You're not in f***** Somalia.
You're blessed !
[Jumping down from soap-box]:
See ya' all soon
Right on, Lars. I look forward to seein ya and hearin that awesome beast of yours fire up and run. We'll do our best to keep someone's (name withheld to facilitate blackmail) truck stuck in the mudflats. You Vikings need all yer energy for settin records. :)
-
Lars, check your pm.
-
Thanks Ray !
Thanks Vintage racer Jill !...I'll get back to you
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAauuuuuuurgh !!!!!!!!!!!!!
I am just about to loose my freaking cool !!!!!
This is NOT going according to plan....not at all:
to make a very long story very short:
was supposed to pick up the MH in Santa Fe Monday morning.
Not so; a last minute series of modifications because of the new Hedman headers
meant that I couldn't pick it up till this morning.
Took the darn thing to the MVD ( being an out of state vehicle , a VIN number inspection is required to register it).
Parked it, and lo and behold , it pi**ed coolant all over the freshly laid 'inspection lane'.
Now that wasn't the worst.
No;
The MVD just wouldn't accept the VIN number M28T7V5572
even though it is stated in both the ( Illinois ) title from the previous owner and
the ( Illinois ) title from the previous-previous owner
( I have a copy of that )
simply on the grounds that it should be a 'regular'
VIN ( with that long number of digits used today )
The rather impolite rude lady at the MVD required us to visit the State Police (!)
who wold have to make inquiries to Illinois and
run some checks.
We still don't know yet if we can make an appointment with them
within the next couple of days. They apparently are hard to reach.
This is all REALLY strange as we have been told that such an old
vehicle does NOT require a 'modern' VIN
and indeed checking the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration
( who implemented the rule ) website, CLICK (http://www.nhtsa.gov/Vehicle+Safety/Vehicle-Related+Theft/Vehicle+Identification+Numbers+%28VINs%29)
it is clearly stated that the 'modern' VIN wasn't required till 1981
and my ARGOSY is from 1977
The MH cooling thing is fixed.
Dunno when I'll make it to Bonneville.
Maybe, just maybe...if we get this thing fixed Friday, when maybe, just maybe we can
get an appointment with the State Police....I can make it to Bonneville arriving Sunday.
Bummerbummerbummerfuc*ingbummer.
.
-
maybe you'll get different results at another mvd office.
franey
-
maybe you'll get different results at another mvd office.
franey
I was going to say the same thing Lars. If you have another mvd not too far away I'd try that. Remember, you're dealing with Civil Servents. Not always the sharpest knives in the drawer. Good Luck
-
Lars,
Should I send someone down from Montana or minnesota to take you to Bonneville? There may be a New Mexico connection somewhere, did we try on Landstroms site yet?
-
Thanks guys !
I'm working on it.
I've found all the relevant ducumentation from
the guverment agencies on-line..printed them out...
clearly they made a mistake at the MVD.
I'll go to the MVD first thing in the morning
and talk to a VIN inspection supervisor.
If it all folds .... I have a plan B.
-
The DMV doesn't want to hurt you - they don't want to make any decision at all.
If you give them something to hang their hat on (like the NATB book that gives samples of all VINs) they'll let it go through. Been there, done that.
-
Guess it's a mixture of bad planning on my behalf
and some serious red tape bollocksnonsense.
Went to the MVD this morning to talk to the lovely lady there.
Good grief !!!!...She was rude beyound belief. I seriously don't think anyone, ever before, has been so rude to me.
Honestly; she talked to me as if I was a slightly demented 4 year old semi-retard and she was my school headmaster.
I demanded to talk to her superiour which didn't make her demeanor the slightest more charming.
Got a phonenumber to him. He was all pleasant, but what he said didn't make a whole lotta sense.
Anyway; gotta go to the NM State Police to get the VIN verified/checked ..or something.
They only do that here in Santa Fe twice a month.
That won't do, so tomorrow at 6 o'clock we're heading to the State Police in Espanola
and hopefully get this mess sorted out, so I can head up to Bonneville.
Wish me luck......well in fact, I don't need 'luck'...just that things make sense.
The MH has got a name by now:
"The Sponge"
Not only does it suck up money and gas like a sponge,
it has a spongy drivers seat, spongy steering, spongy suspension and spongy brakes.
Coupled with a big V8 mother- , it makes for some ....er...interesting driving.
-
Lars.
Rule 1, u don't know nuthin.. They feel you are challenging them if you know anything, if you don't many will try to help.
That rule holds true for most government agencies, including the Highway Patrol.
Best of luck with the spongmobile!
Bob
-
Lars ........don't let the b a s t a r d s wear you down.
If time starts getting close and one of us offers you help, ditch the Sponge and accept
American hospitality. Then solve the problem when there is no time line crowding you.
I know there are people that will come pick you up and take you wherever you need to go.
Let us help you thru this headache.
FREUD
-
Lars,
Try calling Neal Olsen, if you need his number PM me, I think he has an answer to the dilemna.
Should I move my departure from Pennsylvania forward to now? and finsh my liner after getting you to Speed Week?
-
THANK you guys!
The Spongemobile performed faultlessly going over the mountains
to get the VIN thing done in Epanola.
...robocop in Espanonola could do it but he couldn't do it
...robocops partner could do it but he couldn't do it
...Albuquerque State Police could do it but they couldn't do it
...Santa Fe County Police could do it but couldn't do it..
Blackout
Plan B:
Tried every single rental agency but NO cargo van to get
( transport of bike from SLC and accomodation for me )
Got myself down to Albuquerque. Got a pick-up truck.
I find the notion of sleeping under the sky on the bed of a pick up truck at Bonneville
quite romantic.
Walmart: sleeping bag and stuff........leaving Santa Fe this minute.
I bow my head and repeatedly bang my forehead
down into the dusty earth of New Mexico, and say :
Thank you David.....bang/AUCH...Thank you David.....bang/ouch.....etc
for his incredible assistance here in Santa Fe.
He'll try to get the VIN thing fixed next week.
I'll go down here and get da' Spongemobile......on to BUB
-
Lars
Another racing season of great adventure! What more could you ask for?
Glad to see you are on your way, don't forget a tarp in case of rain.
I'll be there on the 26th, with or without the bike.
Good luck, see ya there.
Bob
-
Go, go Lars,
Nobody is carrying Burt's torch of determinatin higher than you right now!
All the best for a favorable tide change. Looking forward to you seeing just rewards for all your hard work and determination.
Ed
-
This is just using up all your bad luck in advance - leaving nothing left but success!
-
Lars, I may can help private message for my cell
-
Cool Beans, Best of luck to you, see you as planned at BUB,
Rocky
-
Thank you for all your kind words.
I'll get back to you later.
Right now I'm totally knackered.
Just wanted to say that I have bumped into the fantastic world
of kindness and generosity of the landspeed crowd.
Not only have I had the pleasure of meeting some fantastic people like
George, Steve , Lee, the Texican (?) , Matt Guzzetta ,
Lynda, Jon , Nancy , Patrick ( the French Owl ), the distinguished Freud ,
Sparky , Ray , Graham , Tyler , Alp , Scott,
( and numerous other who's name has slipped my mind just now.
Forgive me please, ....my mind is marshmallowed )
but in time of need when I found myself without pit , pit-equipment like
chase-car, CB radio and all that jazz,
out of the blue these two fabulous characters materialized before my very eyes:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DonGus-1.jpg)
Don ( "Salt27" ) and his son Gus:
Ez Up, tarp, car, CB , helmet, gloves and boots , at hand
at my disposal.........................and they are sharp dressed too, don't you think ?!
THANKS a lot !!! you two !!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Gus; you can be proud of your father.
Don; you can be proud of your son !
They had to leave today, so BAMMALAM:
The eminent Bill Anderson ( "Nortonist 592" )
( who rides the brilliant lay-down Weslake sidecar outfit) , his wonderful wife Veronica
and their friend Joe offered to take me in, and "crew" me,
take me to the track and all that.
This truly is a great and giving community.
Did my first run this afternoon:
the bike just did wonderfully wonderful, didn't miss a beat, felt almost mellow.
I took it easy; I mean I haven't ridden it in a year and I certainly didn't want to push it,
what with all that trouble last year.
I was totally flabbergasted ( love that word ) when I got the timing-slip:
98 ( point something ) mph.
Bike is in impound
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6498.jpg)
.............and I'm in heaven.
-
Backup run tommorow
G
(http://i219.photobucket.com/albums/cc28/grumm441/4e24a2d4.jpg)
-
Thanks Graham !
-
Life is GOOD.
-
Great to hear you arrived good and well. Good luck and hope you get a lot of runs down the salt this year! Easy does it, you'll get in the 120's in time. I'm thrilled to bits for updates of your progress. I really really wish I was there! :-D:cheers:
-
I'm glad to see you overcome the hassles of the last week Lars, WELL DONE !
Now , of someone could just get a video of the Saltcracker singing in top gear tomorrow, I would be almost as happy as you :cheers:
Tiny
-
BRILLIANT!!!!
Now just do another one, just like the other one. :-D
See ya in about a week at BUB.
-
GO... Lars! !!!!!
Great news, and good luck with the return run :lol:
Just wanted to say that I have bumped into the fantastic world
of kindness and generosity of the landspeed crowd.
Not only have I had the pleasure of meeting some fantastic people like
George, Steve , Lee, the Texican (?) , Matt Guzzetta ,
Lynda, Jon , Nancy , Patrick ( the French Owl ), the distinguished Freud ,
Sparky , Ray , Graham , Tyler , Alp , Scott,
( and numerous other who's name has slipped my mind just now.
Forgive me please, ....my mind is marshmallowed )
You say you have met Patrick from the UK, is he running his bike? His friend Richard is staying with me in Aus at the moment, we would love to know how he's going? I've asked on his build thread too....
Best of luck for the am.....
Go Lars!! :cheers:
-
Way to go Lars Congratulations!!
-
Well done Lars, fingers crossed for you.
-
Thanks for all your encouraging words !!!
Impound early morning sure is a magical place.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6499.jpg)
The whole mood of the place is really intense....anticipation, excitement, nervous energy
...this is your shot at getting in the books.
Here's a pic of "my" crew. Again cool dressers, those guys.
Bob and Bill wearing the Saltcracker T-shirts
and on the right Graham ( "Grumm" ) has sneaked into the pic
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6501.jpg)
Goooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooodness: was that a super-extra exciting ride.
Whatta'you'know: first da'Saltbisquit starts falling 'out of gear' and into neutral...again and again
then when entering the measured mile the little devil craps out......like there's no fuel...
my mind goes: nononononononononononononononononononononon you silly thing....don't do this to me
....it revs up again.......falls out of gear....craps out....no fuel......and finally revs up properly.
In order to keep it from falling into neutral
at this point, I would of course never ever ever ever ...cough....think of blasting the rest of the way in the measured
mile with left hand on the gear-knob ( hand-shifter...remember ) and only one hand on the handlebar
...NO SIR !....that would be against the rules.
I'm telling you: that was one h*ll of an.....er....interesting ride.
Got a real crappy speed of course, but I can't think of a situation
where I have been SO relieved as I was when I passed the mile mark exiting the measured mile...PHEW !
Bike was checked in impound. It was all good.
So now it's official : I got the record and I just couldn't be more happy.
The speed is silly but I'll do my very best to better it at BUB in a short while.
-
CONGRATS..........to a great rider. Just think of what it will be like with 2 hands on the grips!
-
congratulations 8-) 8-) well done Lars :cheers:
-
Congratulations Lars!
Great thing. It's rewarding to read about your journey.
-
Success isnt a destination ... it is a journey ...
-
Congrats Lars. See ya next weekend... :cheers:
-
good for you, lars.
that's great.
bill franey
going back for more on friday?
after sw we need to know about the sponge.
-
Congratulations Lars!
If it were that easy many more would have done it long before. You took the challenge, over came more than your share of obstacles, got there, and did it. I'll bet Burt is smiling down with approval.
Ed
-
Way to go Lars...... Bonneville Record holder....
Sounds good that! :cheers:
-
Way to go Lars! We've all been waiting to see you with a record since you first started writing your build thread. Such a neat machine you created. It was great meeting you in Bill and Veronica's motorhome. Wish I could have stayed to help out with the rest of the gang. Maybe next year. Good luck at the BUB.
David
-
This is what Lars started with in the morning.
-
This his bike in the afternoon.
He would have got to run on the same day he put it together but the staging line was just a little too long.
If everyone had to over come the obstacles that Lars does, I think the lines would indeed be much shorter.
Congratulations to you Lars!
-
Good job Lars! Your record might not be the fastest of the meet but it is first rate for the suspense and excitement.
-
Bonneville record holder.....that's really something to put on your CV!!! Congratulations!
-
Congratulations Lars!!! Congratulations is a small word in comparison to the effort required. I prefer WOOHOOO!!!! and see you next year. The first Dane with a land speed record!!!!
(http://)(http://img851.imageshack.us/img851/2884/img2276m.jpg)
By weslake (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/weslake) at 2011-08-19
And the all important record cert.!!!!
(http://)(http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/4228/img2288t.jpg)
By weslake (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/weslake) at 2011-08-19
-
Lars,
Don't you consider Kurt a true Dane?
2010 AMA Record Vincent Vikings Kurt Carlson 1000-M-VF 132.004
-
Thanks all !!!!!!!!!
I'll get back to you later.
I'm leaving Cortex, Colorado in a minute
to go to Santa Fe
Lars,
Don't you consider Kurt a true Dane?
2010 AMA Record Vincent Vikings Kurt Carlson 1000-M-VF 132.004
Oh yes: Kurt is a true Dane though he lives is the USA.
I think that what Bill was maybe refering to
is the fact that I am the first Dane to drag a bike
build in Denmark, forth and back
over the big pond to set a record.
In fact I talked to Kurt on the phone yesterday
and I am very muck looking forward to see him at BUB.
-
With Speed Week being as large as it is I was fortunate to meet Lars at Salt Talks.
Lars, you are phenomenal.
FREUD
-
Great job Lars.....
followed the build for months....
Ray
-
Lars,
No bike this year for me. But, I will see you at Bub's.
Joe
-
Thank you so much
Charlie, General Shovel, Ed ( see you soon man ), Graham in Aus, Oz ( see you next year , oi ?! ),
Chris ( see you too next year ! ), OldScrambler, Strathbran Steve, Twinspeed, 55Chevr /Joe,
Larry, Franey, Ed, David, Don ( extra magnum thanks to you ! ) , Bo , Bill ( and an extra super-sized thanks to you ),
Freud ( I'm just SO glad I had the honour of shaking your hand ) and Ray.
You are the best !
I had a fantastic trip down to Santa Fe.
It reeeeeeally is a be...auuuu...tiful country you got ya'self here.
Someone: hand me a green-card please !
Southern Utah...into Colorado...down into new Mexico...a feat for the eyes
Success isnt a destination ... it is a journey ...
That's a keeper !!!
-
Highlights of the trip down here so far:
...getting pulled over by the Utah Highway Patrol for speeding.
I guess I've seen too many bad TV-series , but I got a bit...nervous..terrified...when he stepped out of the cruiser
and I noticed he unbuttoned the strap on his gun and as he walked up to me
he kept his hand hoovering just over the handle ( or whatever it's called ) of his gun.
I'm telling you; we don't get that in little peaceful Denmark.
Inside my head I was going: " NO 'funny' movements...NO sudden reaching for my licence and stuff...keep calm...sit still)
Standing at the open passenger-side window, I could detect that he still had his hand there,
so I told him "Officer, I need to reach down in my bag and get my licence".
Looking at my licence he asked me what part of Denmark I was from,
and it turned out he had lived for a while in Sweden and quite often visited Copenhagen, Denmark.
He was all friendly and polite...checked my licence and let me off with a
" You're set to go. Drive safely".
..PHEW !
There's an Indian Art Festival taking place in Santa Fe this week-end
and the motel prices has been cranked up to at least double level
so I went for cheap....real cheap:
....OK I could live with the fact that the motel-room was 10 feet from one of the main streets
with the four-wheeled BOOM-boxes cruising by
....and the fact that the Fire Brigade was just around the corner, passing my room going out on duty
....and the fact that it obviously was the main route for the police cruisers going into town with the sirens at full volume
on a rowdy Saturday night
....and the fact that the all-pink (!!!) room probably hadn't been cleaned since the mid-nineties
....and that there were left-over clothing and stuff from the previous guests
....and the guy outside yelling at himself
....and the p!ss-drunk old woman stumbling up to me and David sitting outside the room
asking for a beer.
What did it for me was when I, real exhausted and tired, wanted to go to bed,
pulled of the bed-cover and found the "fresh" looking blood-stains on the bed sheets and cover.
AURGH !....big-time AURGH !
Too tired to do anything about it, I ripped it all off, threw it in a corner,
and got my sleeping bag from the car to sleep in.
Got a nice new room today which has a nifty car-port to it.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/acarport.jpg)
Brilliant !
David and I unloaded the bike unto it, and now I have great 'workshop'.
I've started to make a don't-know-what-to-call-it
thingy with little notches to hold the gear-lever in position
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/anotchplateGear.jpg)
It will be bolted to the frame front down-tubes.
I'll finish it tomorrow and then on to checking the other thing on the bike.
Never a boring moment !
It's a great adventure.
.
-
I know you havent the same gearstick system but I thougt it is appropriate to attach the positive gear lock system that Burt used on his naked bike, a simple spring steel flat iron bent to suit the application, maybe there is still a thing or two to learn from that dirty old man?? :-D
-
Lars, a simple 2-wheel drive four cylinder truck with a canopy on the back and a light little trailer has done well for me. I sleep in the back of the truck or on an army cot next to it. This is all I have done for most of my life and it works just great.
-
I'm trying once again, this forum reply program is acting up, sorry if double posted, What I wanted to show is the gear lock system on Berts liner, the entire lever is springing behind an angle iron in third gear for a more absolute gear arrest.
-
Here's a pic of "my" crew. Again cool dressers, those guys.
Bob and Bill wearing the Saltcracker T-shirts
and on the right Graham ( "Grumm" ) has sneaked into the pic
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/CIMG6501.jpg)
I'm terribly sorry Joe.
I must have been tired or something when I posted this.
The caption should read:
Joe and Bill wearing the Saltcracker T-shirts.
Thanks Joe for your help !
Bo:
A four cylinder truck won't do for me.
That's how we do it at home.
I'm in the U.S. of BIG A.....nothing but a V8 will do
.-)
Charlie:
Thanks.
I get your point...including the point about 'absolute third gear arrest'.
What I'm doing is similar...but different.
There's only so much I can do with a few hand-tools in a carport.
We'll se how it works.
-
It's crude....very crude
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSCF2009.jpg)
...but I hope it works.
I does work 'bench-testing' it here. Of course real life seams to differ somewhat from that
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSCF2006.jpg)
Well, well...I'm doing my best
in my little 'workshop' with a bunch of cheapo tools
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSCF2008.jpg)
-
Youre doing excellent work with what you have! Neat and elegant as always. I hope nothing bad happened in the gearbox, A whole lotta' heavy metal and rock and roll is going on in there but it shouldn't jump out of gear. The third gear dogs can become a little rounded and loose their ability to grip properly, that's usual but something more sinister could have happened like main axle bent or the outgoing ball bearing have gotten more play than it should have. Hash gearchange, torque power or oval sprockets puts tremendous stress on the outer bearing. A check would be if the chain sprocket is wobbling or if there is excessive play in the axle. Bearing play and main axle internal play might only be possible to be felt with the chain off. Play can be felt at the starter gear that is fastened on the main axle (maybe difficult with the electric starter on) but a bent main axle might be felt if you push a finger on the chain when the engine is idling and gear in neutral.
-
Hi Lars, regarding gearchange, Moen's probably told you, but have you thought about winding in the threaded tube that holds the gear selector ball in place by spring pressure? You'll need a 1" spanner & it's a pain to get into as it's halfway up the box between the engine plates.
-
Youre doing excellent work with what you have! Neat and elegant...
Thanks Charlie, but 'elegant' isn't quite the first word
that comes to mind, looking at that thingy
.-)
....as always. I hope nothing bad happened in the gearbox, A whole lotta' heavy metal and rock and roll is going on in there but it shouldn't jump out of gear. The third gear dogs can become a little rounded and loose their ability to grip properly, that's usual but something more sinister could have happened like main axle bent or the outgoing ball bearing have gotten more play than it should have. Hash gearchange, torque power or oval sprockets puts tremendous stress on the outer bearing. A check would be if the chain sprocket is wobbling or if there is excessive play in the axle. Bearing play and main axle internal play might only be possible to be felt with the chain off. Play can be felt at the starter gear that is fastened on the main axle (maybe difficult with the electric starter on) but a bent main axle might be felt if you push a finger on the chain when the engine is idling and gear in neutral.
Thanks for all your advise.
I checked it....can't seam to find anything wrong.
BTW, I just don't think my riding this thing will screw the box.
As I understand it the box is more or less identical to the one on the big Chiefs
which has way more torque and power than my bike, so it should be OK.
Hi Lars, regarding gearchange, Moen's probably told you..
....yep and I told myself..ha ha.
I had that box assembled and disassembled about 8 time when I build the bike
so I am aware of the ball-mechanism.
The thing is, as you point out , that it's almost impossible to get to.
On my bike, maybe even harder than on the original, as I have
non-original engine/gear-box mount plates.
but have you thought about winding in the threaded tube that holds the gear selector ball in place by spring pressure? You'll need a 1" spanner & it's a pain to get into as it's halfway up the box between the engine plates.
Thanks Chris for your advise and the nifty pics !
I've be going through the bike from a to z
and one thing I did find was that .......aaaaaruuugh...not AGAIN:....
under the distributor cap I found bits of bakelite and fine brass-'dust'
...the ignition distributor rotor had been bumping into the little brass thingies
inside the cap and knocked a piece of itself off in the process
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSCF2010.jpg)
The reason:
those rotors are just crap !!!
They simply do NOT fit the shaft they go on...the 'hole' doesn't fit
and the notch inside the 'hole' doesn't fit,
so the poor thing is floating about sideways, up, down and tilting.
The result: it knocks into the brass thingies and in the process it disintegrates
and the rivet breaks loose
Here's the first one I ran last year
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-Kopi-1.jpg)
..here's the second or third or whatever...I guess I've been through 7 or eight of these horrible things
( disregard the blue lines etc. )
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-28.jpg)
Solution:
First file back the brass thingies ever so slightly
..massage in a lump of JB-Weld into the 'hole' in the rotor
..lube the shaft onto which it goes , with WD-40 ( acting as a 'casting lubrication' )
..force down the rotor over the shaft....let it sit for just a little while
..lift it up....now it has a shape 'inside' that actually fits the shaft
..let the JB-Weld harden
..glue ! the bloody thing to the shaft
The motor-home is still ( AAAAAAAARRRRGHHHH ! ) in red-tape hell.
Had to extend the pick-up truck rental.
Truck is loaded...ready to leave.
I'll leave Santa Fe, together with my friend down here David,
at 5 o'clock tomorrow morning -----------> Bonneville here we come !!!
Looking forward to see a bunch of you guys
and to set ( knock on wood ) a better record !
"Winning isn´t everything, but the will to win is everything"
Vince Lombardi
-
The best of luck Lars. A few runs like the first one last week and you'll be heading home with a suitcase stuffed with records!!!
-
Lars: Don't let the b a s t a r d s wear you down.
Turn to anyone that can help you.
Get every minute out of the hours you spend on the Salt.
It's normal to go home totally wasted but spend the energy getting those records.
Best always,
FREUD
-
What freud said.
Go get em Lars, we're pulling for you.
Don and Gus
-
LandspeedLarry,
Regarding your breaking caps and rotors, one must look at the bushings in the botom of the distributor drive. When they are worn a few thousands they let the shaft get "wobbly-cocked" and lean over and strike the cap. We aklways redo the busj=hes and hone the bushings to get the best we can with spark timing. Is that your dodge motorhome at the bend in the road yesterday at BUB?
Shot in the dark, formerly Rocky
-
Nope, that would be my motorhome....sorry! :-(
Lynda
-
A quick up-date from "Team Hapless Dane" ( formerly known as "The Saltcracker Team" )
here in disaster zone Bonneville.
Had an incredibly beautiful tour up from Santa Fe, taking the scenic route over the Colorado mountains.
Started from Santa Fe at 5 in the morning,
arrived at the Bend in The Road at close to midnight.
Fell out of the car and went fast asleep in my sleeping bag on the ground.
..paperwork, tech inspection and all that.
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out
Fiddling with the electrical system.
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out
Took every single electric part apart, including switches and all.
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out
Tested every single wire
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out
Replaced everything one by one, including the coil.
David went around Sunday to find one. Got one of a vehicle wreck
on the golf course.
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out
Checked for burned stuck valve(s)
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out
Replaced the ignition module
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out
Disassembled the fuel shut-off
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out
Disassembled the carb twice.
Replaced float, float-valve, diaphragm.
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out.........................etc. in ad infinitum for two days
.......you get the idea
Finally did a lot of stuff that I can't even remember what was, including removing some
funky stuff from the fuel-filter.
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....runs great.....................YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAH !
Got in line this afternoon,
just 10 minutes before the track closes.
Yehaaaw ! ...this it is.
Green flag...GO !
Turns on the ignition.....................NOthing
Noooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo...no no flipping no no !
Turns out the fuse had blown.
I probably inadvertently turned on the ignition at some point going to the track.
No one ever told me this would be easy ....ha ha ha....and I'm STILL having a blast !!!!!!!!!!!!
-
Oh Lars. I am really sorry to read your post. We have been chompin' at the bit for some news. And that wasn't the news I wanted to hear. I was hoping to hear you hadn't room for all the record certs!!!
Tomorrow is a new day and we will be rootin' for you and the Salt Cracker!!!! GOOOOOOOOOOOOO LARS!!!!!!!!!!!
-
Lars, with that much stress there's got to be a record in there somewhere. GO FOR IT!!!!!:cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Pete
-
Of course theres another record in there. Lars got one at SpeedWeek and a bird never flew on one wing.
-
Oh man! What a devil of a time. Wish we were closer to help figure it out...
Tomorrow is the day, I'm sure of it!
-
Hi Lars,
I'm back in the UK after a very hairy flight from Philly to Manchester in the Elaine storm on Saturday... The burn is healing OK, back to work in 2 hours, my internal clock is way out of tune...
I sincerely hope you'll make it OK today... GOOD LUCK!!!
Patrick
-
Hi Lars,
Your post would seem to represent the motto "Expect the unexpected!" That's apparently the Bonneville Experience as I learnt during my first and unlikely last trip there this year.
I was happy to have unexpectedly met you during Speed Week 2011 (you may recall I was assisting Beairsto Racing) and was looking forward to a chance to chat at length on supercharged Goldwings and of course study your Indian further. Alas, we got busy with our own dilemmas, you were busy and then had to leave. We'll just have to chat next year or via the Inter-aether.
I wish you good luck and "God speed" with your bike. Enjoy your trip.
Best regards from afar,
Jim
-
Lars in assembly mode during Speed Week 2011...
-
Bike runs just fine on the stand.
Test ride.....craps out
Fiddling with the electrical system.
Lars, perhaps stating the obvious and being certain you have already performed said check, the root of all (evil) electrical problems after ensuring signal / power points A & B are physically connected is poor grounding when using the frame or engine as a ground path. It is an often overlooked area because when you check it with nothing running, all can seem well and when the engine runs, large currents can and will flow and even small ground contact resistances can lead to large voltage drops which can then play all sorts of havoc on the electrical system, especially when dealing with ignition systems.
Once upon a time I worked for an tier 1 automotive supplier on gasoline engine management systems where I measured up to a steady (not including pulses) 2-1/2 Volts difference in ground potential between the engine and chassis someplace else in the vehicle with the engine running. If I hadn't have measured it myself, I might not have believed it. I can't count the number of times poor grounding has been the cause of electrical gremlins.
I don't suppose your stand electrically and unintentionally connects one side of the bike to the other?... the picture above would seem to indicate not (covered in tape with that stand)
Good luck with the gremlin extermination.
Jim
-
Hope today goes well Lars. Looking forward to seeing you pose with another record cert!!
(http://)(http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/4228/img2288t.jpg)
By weslake (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/weslake) at 2011-08-19
-
Yet another update from "Team Hapless Dane" :
First of all:
Thank you Bill, Pete, Gill, Patrick and Jim !!!
... The burn is healing OK..
GOOD ! That's all I wanted to hear.
I was happy to have unexpectedly met you during Speed Week 2011 (you may recall I was assisting Beairsto Racing)
I certainly do. We'll keep in touch and talk blown Goldwings and stuff
Lars, perhaps stating the obvious
No: your giving good advise !
Thanks !
and being certain you have already performed said check, the root of all (evil) electrical problems after ensuring signal / power points A & B are physically connected is poor grounding when using the frame or engine as a ground path.
Yep !...I wholeheartedly agree that it is the root of all evil,
which is why I didn't connect anything using the frame/ground.
I ran separate wires for all connections going to battery +,
but alas the gremlins had descended on the bike anyways....AURGH !
..............................................................................................
Here goes some of the ridiculously ridiculous petty-full details:
..after the aborted run the other day ( I'm too knackered to remember which day was which day )
we packed up the bike in the pit.
During the night there was a bit of a wind coming up.
No biggie....except my bike had fallen over and was lying in a pool of oil.
A sad sight...and NOT a good start of the day
..got ready to do a run as we were first in line ( because of being first in line the previous day when the race was closed )
Checked the bike in the pit.
Pushed the starter button.....Nothing !
Huh ???
Finally found a wire on the battery terminal-connection had worked it-self loose.
Weird ! Really shouldn't happen
..got in line
Start signal
Started bike
Bike died .....whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat the #/§k ?????!!!!!!!!!
Fuse burned
After lots of fooling around we found a wire that had worked itself into
a passage between the battery-box and the frame.
The minute I sat down my fat a** on the seat ( over the battery box ) it ripped the wire and short'ed it
to the frame..
OHHHHHHHH no: it ain't over: there is more misery coming up :
Fixed that.
Got in line
Go signal
Yehaaaaaaw: bike runs sweeeeeet....BRooooooooooooM ....happyness !
That is: until I got to the half-mile
Bike craps out and just dies.
AUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURGH !!!
( I'm good at those long loud heartfelt " aurgh "s , wouldn't you say ?! )
Time to replace everything potential that can be replaced:
new coil, new relay, new BIG automotive fuel-filter.
The Indian guys turned up with new REAL genuine high quality
ignition rotors and a cap, both of which actually fits on the bike.
More testing and testing and testing and test runs and test runs
and disassembly and reassembly and testing and testing and testing and test runs and test runs
and replacing ignition module and stuff.....
More same same same:
inconsistent results, no logical results
and lots of unclear mixed signals,
but always would it just fart and semi-die after a bit of test-running
We had the whole Indian intelligentsia over
and a bunch of other racers whos collective racing
experience probably represents a few centuries of wisdom,
to help out and give advise.
This morning we got out there at sun-rise and went through the whole thing again
and rechecked the electric system
and in fact found a couple of embarrassing fault that could have caused the problem
( like a real bad connection on the coil to distributor HT wire )
except they weren't consistent with the fact that it ran well
first day at Speed Week but not on the second day.
Anyway: at around 11 o'clock I did the first successful test-run.
YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Got in line.
The 'second-before-me' bike set off.
One more guy to go and it was time to ROCK'N'ROOOOOOL !
Then the wind came up and the course was closed down for today.
Now : that's one he** of a super-sized mega bummer story....ai ?
I couldn't have made it up myself.
I think it's darn funny ! Seriously !
First one has to kind of pretend it darn funny just to cope with it
but then it does in fact become real funny......because it is darn funny !
I'm afraid that when the course was closed and we rolled the bike back on the truck
I descended into a semi-hysterical laughing fit.
If what you expected to happen always did happen, it would be real boring wouldn't it.
Thank you thank you thank you thank you to David !!!!!!!!!!!!
and to Ron who showed up the other day out of the blue
to sign up for the "Team Hapless Dane".
I've never met him before, just 'talked' to him on another forum.
Here they are:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSCF2062.jpg)
-
Hope today goes well Lars. Looking forward to seeing you pose with another record cert!!
(http://)(http://img508.imageshack.us/img508/4228/img2288t.jpg)
By weslake (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/weslake) at 2011-08-19
Sorry Bill. You got it wrong.
That's a paper stating that I'm committed to the funny-farm.
They send me off when I couldn't stop laughing hysterically
while screaming and shouting and punching wildly into thin air
trying to knock down the demons that surrounded me.
I'm writing this in a room with the lock on the outside,
wearing a straight-jacket, using my nose to tap the keyboard.
..
Took me about two hours......stopping now....my nose is bleeding.....%Æ)¤....
-
Lars,
I absolutely ADORE you!!!! :cheers:
Being decended from Danish Stock myself, I Love the NO-QUIT-I"LL-FIGURE IT OUT-GAME ON in you!!
You are my Hero this year!!
Lynda
-
Lars,
Stand strong, you will prevail.
Don
-
Lars. Its difficult to believe all tha crap happened in such a short period of time. It reads more like a litany of lifetime woes than ONE race meet. But look on the bright side. You went 98.126 at SpeedWeek and all the crap that can happen has happened. Its blue skies and fast runs from now on. Come back to SpeedWeek next year and the gods will smile upon you. They've thrown their worst at you and you are still standing (and smiling). Next year will be THE year.
And do remember, you are going home with a record cert in you pocket. Maybe not as fast as you wanted but a cert none the less. A lot of riders went home empty handed.
P.S. Did the DVDs arrive?
-
I stopped by your pits to say hello. I saw the level of intense electrical trouble shooting .. reviewing coils ... resistance ,,, ohms ... I left you and your crew to continue uninterrupted ... tomorrow is the day ,..
-
Tomorrow Lars. Smoke the salt!!
(http://)(http://img692.imageshack.us/img692/9978/img2261kw.jpg)
By weslake (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/weslake) at 2011-08-21
-
New record holder :
A.M.A 650 A-VBF
"Team Happy Dane" / The Saltcracker
at 97,something mph.
.-)
( multiply the size of that smiley by a factor 1 million )
.
-
Lars, congrats and go for 100 mph both ways.
:cheers:
-
New record holder :
A.M.A 650 A-VBF
"Team Happy Dane" / The Saltcracker
at 97,something mph.
.-)
( multiply the size of that smiley by a factor 1 million )
.
That's great news Lars! :cheers:
What did you find was your elec. issue?
-
Fantastic news to start the day with. Go Lars!
-
GO LARS!!! :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Go for 100!!!!!!!!!!!!
Lynda
-
Waaaay to go Lars!!!!! I'm sure you heard the collective sigh of relief from all of us! Bump it to 100 before you leave.
-
You meet the nicest people in Impound ... After all Lars trials and tribulations it is so gratifying to see him in impound tearing down for record certification. Quite a broad smile ...
Joe
-
I'm surprised he was able to fit his smile into impound!
-
Good job, Lars.
At least you have had the experience.
Now you can make the changes that will satisfy you.
Go for it, pal.
FREUD
-
good for you, lars.
sw 262
-
Hey Lars. Joe sends his congratulations!! He says its SHOWTIME!!!!
Veronica sends her congratulations as well!
-
New record holder :
A.M.A 650 A-VBF
"Team Happy Dane" / The Saltcracker
at 97,something mph.
Congratulations Lars. That makes all the troubles fade for sure.
Are you intent on attending any additional speed meets this year this side of the pond with Saltcracker before you head home?
Jim
-
Good work Lars
Congratulations
G
-
Lars,
Just checking my favourite Blogs and lo and behold, you made "The Vintagent." I was hoping Mr. d'Orleans was going to be at Speed Week. I guess he opted for BUB instead.
http://thevintagent.blogspot.com/2011/09/song-of-salt.html (http://thevintagent.blogspot.com/2011/09/song-of-salt.html)
Have fun..as you always appear to do.
Cheering from afar.
Jim
-
I knew that hard head of yours would pull you through, congratulations again.
Don and Gus
-
Good news indeed!!!
-
:cheers:
-
Hey Lars - Joe here - I finally got signed on so I can post, although I was watching your efforts or struggles here.
Anyway, congratulations - glad you got the old gal going. We knew you could do it.
See Ya next year!!!!
-
Hi Lars,
Fantastic story from start to finish. As a half Dane, I'm very proud of what you have achieved.
Next year is my first attempt at a record, I'm in the UK building a bike for the A-PG and or A-PF 650cc class.
If I can't make both Speed Week and BUB, I'm interested to know which you would choose as someone who is in their second year of competing.
I wonder if I should try for a record with my Nimbus too ha ha.
Regards
Peter
---
I am here: http://maps.google.com/maps?ll=51.338943,-0.251409
-
If I can't make both Speed Week and BUB
my thoughts--wos on the salt flats. and / or lta in limestone , maine.
both would be very good meets 4 you.
franey
you also got the texas mile 3 x a year.
-
I have to ship my bike from the UK so a lot of those aren't realistic for me. Ideally come over for both Speed Week and BUB, but the 2weeks between the to events makes it very hard to get the time off to do both.
Peter
-
Hi Peter,
Basically, Speed Week has the history and plenty besides bikes while BUB is strictly bikes...
Take your pick and make your choice!!!
Patrick
-
Ok thanks Patrick
How's the hand???
-
I see I forgot to congratulate Lars on his successes, so, CONGRATS where it's due!!!
Peter, hand's OK and healing nicely!!!
Either Speed Week or BUB, if you come with a bike, between wrenching, soaking up water, waiting in the queue on the line for your turn, you won't have much time left to see the rest!!! Shame cause there're plenty of different ideas around... I saw some, but not as much as I thought I would... Still, 1600 photos in 3 weeks, I've got plenty to study later 8-)
Patrick
-
Peter. Read post no. 250 on "BUB 2011" on the BUB forum. It should tell you which meet you should run.
-
From the bottom of my heart:
thank you !!!...Lynda ( you're a sweetheart ! ), Don & Gus ( and a special thanks for letting me use your
helmet, boots and gloves ) , Bill & Veronica and Joe ( special thanks to you for saving me at Speed Week ! ),
Glen , Jill, Freud, Franey, Jim, Graham, SquidH8er, Sparky, Peter and Patrick !
You are the best !!!
Sorry about my late reply here.
Been on a mindblowingly beautiful two day 'scenic route' tour over the Rocky Mountains,
crossing the continental divide three times, going back here to Santa Fe.
No inter-net.
What a beau.....ti....ful tour.
Ohboyohboyohboy....after the trails and tribulations at BUB
....WHAT a flipping releiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiif it was to finally getting the little devil
to run sort'a properly and setting a record.
On the return run my mind separated into two different entities:
...one was screaming out loud.....GOGOGO through that measured mile
...the other just went blank....compLETEly blank
Both of them went: YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES !!!!!
when I finally hit the exit of the mile.
NOT so fast as I wanted to/hoped for/wished for/dreamed about/prayed for,
but HEEEEY , I was running only half boost and probably a little too lean,
so what can I say:
it's just a simple matter of coming back next year and do better ....ain't it ?!
A happy Dane with the goofy'est smile on the Salt: CLICK (http://youtu.be/7PVgIJAE48c)
More later.
-
:-D You define this little smiley! BIG BIG Congrats on the Bub record :-)
-
Lars,
Now you have to redesign your T-shirts for next year!! Gotta have those 2 records on there and an extra line for that 100mph record coming to the salt near...me! :-D ...in August next year!!
Looking forward to seeing the new fashion next year!!
Lynda
-
Lars,
It was our pleasure assisting you, sorry we could not stay longer.
Maybe next year at Speedweek You, Bill and I could pit together.
We also may be going to Bubs in 2012 so Gus can run.
I am assuming you will be back to defend your records. :cheers:
Don and Gus
-
we're still gonna wanna hear about the sponge.
when you have time.
franey
-
That would be a great idea Don. I'm planning to be back and try and put my records up where they should be. I'm sure Lars will be back for the ton record. 98.126 on his first run. Just a whisker away and tantalizing enough to make you come back. And Lars, like Don it was a great pleasure to be able to help you.
-
Bill,
Your ingenuity and outside the box thinking is inspiring.
Thanks for letting us crash your pit and helping Lars.
It just goes to show, that you meet the nicest people in impound. :-D
Don
-
Thanks Don. You were more than welcome. Like my wife says. Motorcycle guys are way friendlier than car guys. With you and Gus, Lars, Joe, David, Tyler, Kyle and Wes SpeedWeek was a great meet. Getting a couple of records and seeing Lars run a record didn't hurt any either. We will definitely be back and I sure hope yo and Gus can make it too.
-
Lars,
Congratulations on your new record.
Tom G.
-
Thanks!
Peter
Peter. Read post no. 250 on "BUB 2011" on the BUB forum. It should tell you which meet you should run.
-
The Taos Valley and the Sagre de Christos North of Santa FE and Southern Colorado are UNBELIVEABLE :cheers: :cheers:
Ps how did the motorhome Title thing finally work out?
-
Great News about making the record..........Dave was somewhat dissappointed he couldn't stay longer to get you some decent spark. Its interesting to note how many of us on this page ended up in Impound! If you are ever in the upper mid-west, look me up!
-
:-D You define this little smiley! BIG BIG Congrats on the Bub record :-)
Thanks !
Lars,
Now you have to redesign your T-shirts for next year!! Gotta have those 2 records on there and an extra line for that 100mph record coming to the salt near...me! :-D ...in August next year!!
Looking forward to seeing the new fashion next year!!
Lynda
Darling !..you'll be the first one to receive the new fashion line t-shirt !
Lars,
It was our pleasure assisting you, sorry we could not stay longer.
Maybe next year at Speedweek You, Bill and I could pit together.
We also may be going to Bubs in 2012 so Gus can run.
I am assuming you will be back to defend your records. :cheers:
Don and Gus
Ohh, yes !
we're still gonna wanna hear about the sponge.
when you have time.
franey
Thanks for asking.
Sponge still in red-tape hell.
David's working on it
Lars,
Congratulations on your new record.
Tom G.
Thank you Tom !
-
The Taos Valley and the Sagre de Christos North of Santa FE and Southern Colorado are UNBELIVEABLE :cheers: :cheers:
It was an absolutely magnificent trip.
Colorado Rockies:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSCF2070.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSCF2080.jpg)
Great News about making the record..........Dave was somewhat dissappointed he couldn't stay longer to get you some decent spark. Its interesting to note how many of us on this page ended up in Impound! If you are ever in the upper mid-west, look me up!
Thanks Dennis !
-
Hi Lars, been out for a while but followed your endurance sporadicly and have to say it was sure an achivement to get the records! Like Burt, All you need is one good run! Congratulation!
-
Lars,
considering all the things that happened and all the things that didn't happen ( :-D ), your 97mph are more than just impressive!
So, next year 100 is the number ?
Good luck!
Cheers,
Greg
-
Lars - Tech question. Did you reverse the rotation of the supercharger?
Joe
-
Charlie, Greg: Thank you !
Joe: no I didn't....what did you have in mind ?
Woke up yesterday morning, thinking about all the things that had gone wrong
and how nothing more could possibly go wrong.
That was untill I recieved a message from my friends company
i Denmark who was to recieve my returned bike.
They told me that they had indeed recieved a bike but
....erhhhhh........uuumm.....erhhhh....whazzthat
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/Forkertmotorcykelmodtaget.jpg)
I j u s t c' a n t f * * * i n g b e l i e v e t h i s
-
:-o Hmmmmmm! That doesn't look familiar! lolololol
-
Not funny and probably there's someone else thinking the same thing.
Pete
-
:-o Just a little levity to take the edge off!,,,,,sheeeeesh!
-
That one is going to take a loooong time to become a funny part of your Bonneville 2011 story. Some serious business when they ship the wrong bike. Are you still in the states? We're still looking for you and the sponge to show up in San Diego.
-
Golly! The shipping company just lost a one-of-a-kind, world-record-setting, $1,000,000.00 motorcycle!
:-(
Mike
-
Lars, you're kidding us, right ?
This is what you refer to as Danish humor or something like that ? :roll:
Cheers,
Greg
-
I was considering using an Eaton M62 supercharger for next year. It has clockwise rotation while a Sportster engine rotates counter clockwise off the alternator side. It is not practical to drive it off the cam side which has correct rotation. I have a tentative solution which is to use a jack shaft from alternator (left) side to transfer drive to cam (right) side. A somewhat ambitious challenge but considerably less challenging than supercharging an antique Indian ... Joe
-
Can you change the direction by swapping shafts in the rotors ??
I was considering using an Eaton M62 supercharger for next year. It has clockwise rotation while a Sportster engine rotates counter clockwise off the alternator side. It is not practical to drive it off the cam side which has correct rotation. I have a tentative solution which is to use a jack shaft from alternator (left) side to transfer drive to cam (right) side. A somewhat ambitious challenge but considerably less challenging than supercharging an antique Indian ... Joe
-
Lars, this is one instance when all of the useless paperwork a person fills out to ship something might be useful.
-
Lars, Tell me this is Danish humor!! Holy crap!!!
-
I was considering using an Eaton M62 supercharger for next year. It has clockwise rotation while a Sportster engine rotates counter clockwise off the alternator side. It is not practical to drive it off the cam side which has correct rotation. I have a tentative solution which is to use a jack shaft from alternator (left) side to transfer drive to cam (right) side. A somewhat ambitious challenge but considerably less challenging than supercharging an antique Indian ... Joe
There's some other chargers to consider that turns the right way or can be ordered as you like. The Rotrex C15 or the new C8 is an extreme compact hairdryer. Not pushing Danish products, us Swedes got the Lysholm but it's a bit big. Opcon 2036 in a compact screwcharger.
Lars, Ihope it turns out an easy solution, what a nightmare, it's like coming home from the mall and discover you have the wrong child in the cart.
-
This is going to be inconvenient. Hope it gets sorted out properly.
-
it's like coming home from the mall and discover you have the wrong child in the cart.
That happens every day and is a minor easily made mistake. This is serious!
-
Sounds like the address needs to be written in a few more languages....
Hope your bike shows up none the worse for it's wanderings without you. Can't trust those crazy Indians, they seem to wander around on their own. We'll be waiting for that positive outcome Lars, so try not to wait too long to let us know where it landed and who owns the one you got. They could end up being your new best friend! Stay positive My Friend!!
Lynda
-
Hope it'll get sorted fast, Lars...
Mine has just landed in Manchester G.B. this morning, fingers crossed... :|
Patrick
-
First, congratulations and I can't tell you how much I have enjoyed watching your build.
As for your bike, I bet it's safe and sound in it's crate in the warehouse. Imagine the forklift driver getting
a shipment ready, reading his work order. "Motorcycle going to Denmark" then he drives by that crate that is clearly
a motorcycle and grabs it. Your crate doesn't look like a bike at all. Good luck, I have a feeling it is going to work out in the end.
-
Octane, a small funny metal crate showed up at my house. Do i have a deal for you!!!
IT WILL SHOW UP SOON.
Bob
-
THANK YOU all, for your concern !
You are all very kind !
No, it wasn't a joke.
They send me a bloody Honda-something !
da' Indian was lost...but now it's found !
.-)
Maaaaan; that little Indian-devil is such a drama-queen, ain't she ?!
:-o Just a little levity to take the edge off!,,,,,sheeeeesh!
It's all cool !
I laughed myself.
I'm getting real good at "what-the-he**-else-can-I-do-but-laugh"
That one is going to take a loooong time to become a funny part of your Bonneville 2011 story. Some serious business when they ship the wrong bike. Are you still in the states? We're still looking for you and the sponge to show up in San Diego.
Jill; I'm still in the states.
I'm in a semi-crappy-run-down motel ( heeeey: what can one expect for $29.- a night ) in Santa Fe,
working every day on the Spongemobile.
More on that later.
I'm afraid my touring-the-USA won't be till next year.
I hope I can take advantage on your kind offer to visit
next year.
Thanks Jill !
it's like coming home from the mall and discover you have the wrong child in the cart.
That happens every day and is a minor easily made mistake. This is serious!
Bill !
I've said it before and I'll say it again: you're a VERY funny man !
First, congratulations and I can't tell you how much I have enjoyed watching your build.
Thank you Fulltrack !
As for your bike, I bet it's safe and sound in it's crate in the warehouse. Imagine the forklift driver getting
a shipment ready, reading his work order. "Motorcycle going to Denmark" then he drives by that crate that is clearly
a motorcycle and grabs it. Your crate doesn't look like a bike at all. Good luck, I have a feeling it is going to work out in the end.
You're probably right about the bike.
I have no clue what happened, but just relieved that the whole miserable story got sorted.
Octane, a small funny metal crate showed up at my house.
Bob !
That would be the do-it-you-self-assembly 'Perpetual motion bike' (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Perpetual_motion) you told me you ordered on-line.
Looking forward to see you run it next year.
.-)
.
-
Delighted to heat the drama queen has been found!! Whereabouts was she located?
-
Hi Octane!
Looks like a repeat of the finally successful runs on Bonneville! After all the gremlins had been exterminated, it finally worked!
Maaan, you've been tested for patience and passed.
How about the last days run on BUB and the gearbox, did the gear drop out or not? I think Curt said you went directly from 1st to 3rd gear?
Locks like you will be in MCM again. Send me an email!
-
Delighted to heat the drama queen has been found!! Whereabouts was she located?
Thanks Bill.
Donno the details yet about what happened
but as of now it's in my friends workshop !!!
Hi Octane!
Looks like a repeat of the finally successful runs on Bonneville! After all the gremlins had been exterminated, it finally worked!
Maaan, you've been tested for patience and passed.
How about the last days run on BUB and the gearbox, did the gear drop out or not? I think Curt said you went directly from 1st to 3rd gear?
Locks like you will be in MCM again. Send me an email!
Thanks Jan !
Will do.
Yep, on the second run I had a bit of a problem with the gear
so went straight to third.
Pulled like a freight-train never the less .....er ....a very small freight-train that is.
Da' Spongemobile;
that whole registration nightmare got even more bizarre ( more later )
Ohhhhh....I've beeen waiting a looooong time for this:
the prettiest sight I've seen for a while:
New Mexico registration plates
in my , and Davids, name !
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/DSCF2141.jpg)
.
-
Hurray!!! Sometimes you just have to go after that red tape with a black magic marker!!! Glad everything has worked out. I guess you're going to have to get a leash for that bike of yours, seems she's got the wanderlust in her eyes (eye?) now! That ole girl does seem to enjoy traveling!!
Lynda
-
good to hear the bike is with the rightful owner.
is your friends workshop in new mex or across the pond?
franey
-
Hurray!!!
Thanks Lynda !
Sometimes you just have to go after that red tape with a black magic marker!!!
Took a bit more than a black magic marker:
My friend David, here in Santa Fe, has been working his a** off
to get it done. It was like a black hole...a billion calls to various offices to
get information, to get someone to do that darn VIN inspection, to get someone to
tell who and where it could be done. Two different persons in the same office would
give two different answers, call were never returned, persons couldn't be reached.
Finally last Friday, by coincidence, he learned that we could get it done at the State Police
up in Española. Raced up there, waited for the guy in front of us....got the darn VIN inspection
with no problems and got up to the Motor Vehicle office, sat in line for two hours.
The nice lady said she'd do it right away...came to the window with the loooooong awaited
license plate.....I almost reached in through the hole in the window to grab them from her,
and maybe I should have cause.......PROBLEM !....officer Robocop had made a slight mistake
filling out the papers...so "Sorry, no registration"....AURGH !----and Robocop had left the building and
couldn't be reached......David left at note at his office explaining the situation
and then tried for two days to get hold of him....no cigar.
Then a few days ago David had had enough ...bless him, bless him, bless him.....he got up at 5 in the
morning and drove up to the State Police in Española and waited for him to show up for work.
Grabbed him by the balls ( umh...no really ) and got the paperwork (re)done.
Gawdallmighty !!!
Glad everything has worked out. I guess you're going to have to get a leash for that bike of yours, seems she's got the wanderlust in her eyes (eye?) now! That ole girl does seem to enjoy traveling!!
She'll be in chains from now ongood to hear the bike is with the rightful owner.
is your friends workshop in new mex or across the pond?
franey
Thanks Franey !
Across the pond that is.
-
Sorry to bring this up again but this annoys me a bit, and I have experience of Indian bureaucracy. Now, this quote is from the 10 of August. It have taken Lars time, money and worry in spite of papers in well order. I read thru the forum replys but I can't get the essence of the purpose. Would someone educate me so I know at the time I will buy a vehicle in the USA why this Acura inspection is required? Is it different dependent of what state you're in at the moment? The car is an out of state vehicle, so what? I buy a car from a guy and what? The VIN isn't altered! Is it required that the sale must take place in the state the car is registred in or else this Fording pack of Pontiacing Bedfords is after your tail. Why not recognise an original VIN on a nation built car that never been abroad? Or is it like this with all cars before a certain vintage? Whats with that VIN that doesn't jive?
Thanks Ray !
Thanks Vintage racer Jill !...I'll get back to you
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAauuuuuuurgh !!!!!!!!!!!!!
I am just about to loose my freaking cool !!!!!
This is NOT going according to plan....not at all:
to make a very long story very short:
was supposed to pick up the MH in Santa Fe Monday morning.
Not so; a last minute series of modifications because of the new Hedman headers
meant that I couldn't pick it up till this morning.
Took the darn thing to the MVD ( being an out of state vehicle , a VIN number inspection is required to register it).
Parked it, and lo and behold , it pi**ed coolant all over the freshly laid 'inspection lane'.
Now that wasn't the worst.
No;
The MVD just wouldn't accept the VIN number M28T7V5572
even though it is stated in both the ( Illinois ) title from the previous owner and
the ( Illinois ) title from the previous-previous owner
( I have a copy of that )
simply on the grounds that it should be a 'regular'
VIN ( with that long number of digits used today )
The rather impolite rude lady at the MVD required us to visit the State Police (!)
who wold have to make inquiries to Illinois and
run some checks.
We still don't know yet if we can make an appointment with them
within the next couple of days. They apparently are hard to reach.
This is all REALLY strange as we have been told that such an old
vehicle does NOT require a 'modern' VIN
and indeed checking the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration
( who implemented the rule ) website, CLICK (http://www.nhtsa.gov/Vehicle+Safety/Vehicle-Related+Theft/Vehicle+Identification+Numbers+%28VINs%29)
it is clearly stated that the 'modern' VIN wasn't required till 1981
and my ARGOSY is from 1977
The MH cooling thing is fixed.
Dunno when I'll make it to Bonneville.
Maybe, just maybe...if we get this thing fixed Friday, when maybe, just maybe we can
get an appointment with the State Police....I can make it to Bonneville arriving Sunday.
Bummerbummerbummerfuc*ingbummer.
.
-
VIN inspections were implemented primarily to help suppress car theft, and vin plate swapping on stolen/junk cars.
For example steal a car in good condition, find a junker of the same make model, and pull that vin plate off and swap it onto the stolen car, or manufacture a bogus vin plate that is a duplicate of a legitimate car in another state. This in effect "laundered" the stolen car, converting it back to a car with a clean record.
Larry
-
OK, that's the essence and purpose but we know that doesn't work, at least on more expensive cars where just larger chunks, panels or subframes or such is replaced with the VIN plate. The bad guys is held back what? 2 days? no, in fact it is just messing with ordinary folks as usual, but what about my other questions? This was a case where the MDV couldn't accept a original VIN!!? What's with that? At a vehicle purchase of certain vintage am I required to have that inspected of an authorized officer or can I demand that from the owner before i pay up? I am looking at a possible delay of several weeks if things go as it did for Lars.
-
what happened with lars is not the norm.
inspections are usually required when an out of state vehicle
is registered in a different state.
systems in some states are antiquated.
dmv officials are sometimes antiquated and anal.
some states require proof of insurance and local ( state ) identification.
I'm sure there is a website with state rules and regulations. dmv phone numbers also.
as in the world over--
some of those people have to be azz kissed from the get go.
franey
-
The system is different from state to state.
In New Mexico in order to register an out-of-state vehicle
you have to show the vehicle/Vin number at the MDV.
That's not what I refer to here as 'VIN-inspection'.
The VIN inspection I was required to go through
is a complete 'back-ground-run-everything-through-the-computer
-crawl-under-and-around-inside-the-vehicle' -inspection
that can only be performed by a VIN-inspection-certified officer from
the State Police, or in some cases the Country Sheriff's office.
This was a case where the MDV couldn't accept a original VIN!!? What's with that? At a vehicle purchase of certain vintage am I required to have that inspected of an authorized office
...no, but the lady from hell at the MDV insisted that we went through the VIN inspection
on the grounds that (as she wrote in the VIN inspection request to the State Police)
"the VIN number isn't correct for the manufacture year " ( or something to that effect.)
...that was total nonsense. The VIN number was correct for that year.
The present VIN number system wasn't mandatory till 1981.
Up till then the manufactures could use whatever VIN number system they so pleased.
I tried to explain that to her but she refused to talk to me
...the State Police recognized that the VIN was correct and said she
should never have requested an inspection
In this case there's a problem here in New Mexico as they are in the process
of changing the Vin inspection procedure and no one knows what the he**
is going on and who's doing what.
-
OK, that's the essence and purpose but we know that doesn't work, at least on more expensive cars where just larger chunks, panels or subframes or such is replaced with the VIN plate. The bad guys is held back what? 2 days? no, in fact it is just messing with ordinary folks as usual, but what about my other questions? This was a case where the MDV couldn't accept a original VIN!!? What's with that? At a vehicle purchase of certain vintage am I required to have that inspected of an authorized officer or can I demand that from the owner before i pay up? I am looking at a possible delay of several weeks if things go as it did for Lars.
Different States have different regulations implemented and enforced by different departments, often interpreted differently by different people at different times within within those same departments. At times those regulations can differ as a result of different reciprocating agreements between different States.
Here in Massachusetts it often appears collecting maximum sales taxes on vehicles trumps cutting down theft on them.... Back in the day dealers were allowed to, and often did, update the new year onto paperwork for unsold inventory of low production volume trucks and M/C's on Jan 1. "Proper" titles for older vehicles purchased before the sales tax law went into effect and with Vin numbers before the standard number systems came into effect can get very involved [read as a real PITA].
As with your personal medical or any other legal issues, nobody knows your case as well as you do. Do your homework and gather all the information and documentation you can for review before making any major decisions.
Good luck in having the best to deal with in keeping the paperwork straight in a timely fashion.
Ed
-
Lars, I sometimes use an "auto broker" to get the transactions done. The brokers are professionals at this and they charge a fee for their work. Typically the first visit the broker to explain what I want and the second visit is to sign all of the papers and to drive off in the vehicle.
-
Actually, the vin number on a Motor home has another twist---there are 2 VINS
One for the Ford, Dodge, GM or other OEM motorized chassis
One for the house part of the body that goes on the
the big problem is how this is treated from one state to another---very few back in the 70s did a very good job of "marrying the 2 vins" I am sure this contributed to the problem the vin 28T tells me that this is a twin bed 28' model but nothing about the motorized part that would have originally been part of the FEDERAL system that required of the motorized part
I was a GMC motor home dealer in the early 70's a sold lots of chassis to various house part manufactures---we refered the various states as 2 titles or single title states the 2 title states were the ones that married the two vins
-
In 2008 some knucklehead ran into the back of the Triumph when I slowed down to make a turn from the highway onto a side street. The frame loop that is attached to the passenger foot peg on one side was bent. This "totalled" the bike. No one wanted to try to straighten the frame due to liability concerns. I took the insurance money, fixed the bike, and obtained a salvage title. There was some omission in the paperwork on my part or a simple mistake by the Oregon DMV or my insurance company. The DMV suspended my driver's license and they did not tell me.
Off I go to Bonneville with the Triumph in tow and my oldest daughter and youngest boy in the truck. Happy and carefree I drive into Battle Mountain Nevada. A bit fast, unfortunately. An officer pulls me over for speeding and looks at my license. He does not bring it back. Soon all sorts of policemens arrive and they park all around me. It must have been a slow day. The ossifer comes back and says, "Son, your license is suspended. (I was easily 20 years older than the cop.) You are in trouble. We would arrest you but you have children with you. Follow me and I will take you to the city park. You can camp there until this is straightened out. If you make a run for it you will not get far. Then you will be in big trouble, boy. Big trouble." I knew how to handle this situation based on my living in the southern part of the US during my youth. I said "yes sir."
I camped at the park. The kids had no part of this. They wanted to sleep in beds in a motel. I did not want to leave Bonnie, my bike, unattended. A compromise was made. The kids slept across the highway and train tracks in the Owl Motel above the Owl Casino. I camped in the truck. This was Saturday and Labor Day was on Monday. It would be a long weekend.
Monday I sent all the bike papers I had to Rosie using my computer in an internet cafe. She worked all night before this and wanted to sleep. Instead of snoozing she went to the DMV and insurance company on Tuesday to try to figure out how I could get my license reinstated. All this time my kids were learning about gambling and prostitution. The Owl is a busy place during night and day. I would read and watch the trains roll by my campsite. Tuesday afternoon she got everything fixed. I went to the courthouse on Wednesday morning and talked to the judge. He saw a FAX that said I had my license and he let us go. We were on our way to the races.
Anyway, Lars, you are not alone. Problems with the DMV are an American ritual. It happens to all of us.
-
Problems with the DMV are an American ritual. It happens to all of us.
Not only American, they just don't call it DMV in other countries. :-D
@Lars: Any updates on the whereabouts of your little Indian ?
Cheers,
Greg
-
Not only American, they just don't call it DMV in other countries. :-D
isn't SNAFU the international translation ?
-
Lars, your record is in the list on the BUB website.
-
Walrus Bo: Thanks !
Lars: Any updates on the whereabouts of your little Indian ?
Yep, it's back home, safe and sound.
I'm still here in Santa Fe, safe and sound.
Been doing a couple of weeks work on the MoHo.
I'm now officially a 'shade tree mechanic':
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/22FrontmaletogfixetNiiiice.jpg)
You see;
shade , tree ....the mechanic you can't see ...he's behind the camera
.
-
Lars, For an "older" RV it looks very handsome. Will we see it on the salt next year? But beware. I had the sprinkler running under mine for almost two days after we got back from the salt. Then I got under it with the hose to make sure. Today when I went outside I saw a big chunk of salt under it! Sneaky stuff that salt.
-
Bill , my man ;
yeah it doesn't look too bad , does it ?!
I think it's a thing of great beauty !!! A seventies handmade aluminum-made-like-an-airplane
-grumbling-7.4-liter-V8-propelled-spaceshipsubmarinespacecraftmothership:
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/21Frdig-maletNUerdennicenicenice.jpg)
I've been working on it like a mad-man.
I'm sure it would bore most folks here silly, if I went through all the things I've done to it
and this is a landracing forum , not a Mo-Ho forum, right ?!
But just let me mention a couple of things to show what a dodgy lazy guy I am:
the dash-board really depressed me by the way it looked
so while the Mo-Ho was at the parking lot at the storage place I
masked it up at daytime
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/1fuske-malingafinstrumentpanel.jpg)
and after the attendant-guy left the place in the evening
I painted it, with a wrinkle-finish spray-can in one hand and a flashlight in the other.
Quite exciting to come back next morning and check what the he** I've done.
Made new 'bezels' using door-edge-'chrome'-plastic-mouldings from Pep Boys
and some chromy' stuff from Home Depot's plumbing department to
pimp it up
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/2fuskeinstrumentpynt.jpg)
Before
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/3fr.jpg)
After
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/4efter.jpg)
....and a BUNCH of other stuff, after I moved it up to my friend David's
place , up in the mountains outside Santa Fe
Hedman headers.... heat-wrapped the HT leads
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/7headersLedningervarmeisoleret.jpg)
Heat and sound isolated the 'dog-house'
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/6motor-rumisoleret.jpg)
A million thing to the interior.
Clad the dog-house inside with rubber etc.
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/5mnumedup-gradeinterieur.jpg)
...painted parts of the exterieur
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/12males.jpg)
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/13ogmales.jpg)
....worked over the rest of the interior
and a bunch of details
(http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x214/octane98/5s.jpg)
....and a thousand other things from fixing the windscreen washers to
get the electric steps working.
All with great help from David.
I love it love it love it !
NOPE, I won't bring it to the Salt as such,
but I'll park it at the bend in the road next year.
-
Dang Lars!!!! Dazzling!! Park it well away from my heap!! Can't say I blame you for not taking it on the salt.
-
Sweet! Good Job Lars..
-
Beautiful job Lars. Where did you find it? All I find are big bricks!
See ya at Bub in 12.
Bob
-
It'd look better if you can get the grafetti off the upper sides between the windows.
-
Ouuups. Sorry about that re-re-post.
Either the forum software, or my computer ( or my brain perhaps )
screwed up.
Thanks Bill !
Bob: I found it on EBay where it didn't sell for the minimum prize.
Contacted the seller , who turned out to be a German guy,
and worked out a prize.
It was made by Airstream in 1977, and basically it's constructed exactly
like an Airstream trailer but
sat on a GM, P-30 chassis, with a Chevy big-block engine.
For the first few years they manufactured motor-homes,
they called them ARGOSY. From 1979 ( I think it was ) they called them Airstream Motor-Homes.
I've always been completely fascinated by those things and the way they were made:
VIDEO (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gB4E_ALb3Ms&list=WL58C08589D2A9959E&index=1)
Not exactly like mine but a later ( and bigger ) model....note the 'fuselage' at time-line 2:03 (!)
It's hand-made and mostly assembled with screws and rivets
so what's made by hand can be fixed by hand ...right !?
Of course they cost a fortune back then. Mine cost close to $30.000 in 1977.
That was a LOT of money in 1977.
Saw one in Southern France with my own eyes some 25 years ago and been lusting
for one ever since.
Stan: yep !...the 'graffiti' is horrible. Will attend to it later on.
...
OK enough MoHo stuff. Sorry to interrupt the programmed schedule.
-
"assembled with screws and rivets" is better than the staple guns most use now-a-days.
-
the upholsteries looks pretty good.
nice headers.
bf
-
Thanks Sten...you're right.
Thanks Franey...yep it's kind'a OK
I'm in the process of putting thing back to the seventies style:
a symphony in mint-green, brown and orange.
I love it...everybody else will probably hate it.
Well, this MoHo is not for 'everybody'...it's for me, ain't it !?
.-)
Took the Spongemobile,on it's first real tour / test drive.
Up the mountains between Santa Fe and Albuquerque.
Beautiful !
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/DSCF2314.jpg)
Performed faultlessly, didn't miss a beat:
..oil-pressure way up
..voltage/charging way up
..radiator temperature way down ( 1/4 to somewhat under 1/2 up the scale)
..fuel-meter.....erh.....declining....fastlike...who cares
when this thing looks so cool and SOUNDS so good:
CLICK (http://youtu.be/ZlSFY7Y1-mU)
..and gas is down to 2.93 here.
Ouuups: wrong forum...this is about LandRacing.
Sorry 'bout that !
-
It looks good. You can put your BSA A-10 in it and use the bike for running errands and short trips. That will save gas.
-
It'd look better if you can get the grafetti off the upper sides between the windows.
Hey Lars, take a photo of the mural, get it framed and hang it in the crapper. Then spray over it...I never, ever got murals....could be worse, but not much.
Otherwise I love that rig.......Stainless's mate John-boy will be lusting after it....he showed me around his new bus at speedweek, "are you into busses?" he asked me.........
You know, I'd never really even thought about them that much, positively. Being made to stand at the front of our school bus at 12 with one of the seniors holding me in a hammerlock is a strong memory.....I had to do the howls in "Werewolves of London" ,then when the song finished the bus driver said " I've had enough of you you smartarse, sit down the back"......sitting down the back meant sitting with the girls, that wasn't a positive either....it meant Sue Ellen Rice my unhinged next door neighbour (who is probably in jail now) could hold me by the hair and if I even spoke the driver would threaten me with being thrown off, we were the only bus on our route....12 miles home.
-
Looks magnificent Lars!! If I can give you a hint for the gas gauge. Take a little blob of glue and glue the needle on full. Otherwise it tends to drop faster than my speed.
-
Lars, the November 2011 "Cycle Source" issue is on the newsstands. It is their Salt Flats Edition. Guess who has an entire article written about him?
-
Some folks from here have emailed me to ask how things going
and inquire about my absence
+ there's a few email I haven't answered.
Please accept my apologies.
Explanation:
my head has exploded.
Long story ( very ) short:
...got into an argument with my workshop landlord
via email while still in the US.
He claimed I hadn't paid my rent. Said he'd kick me out.
I send him screenshots from my web-bank with the money transfer.
..next thing I hear from my neighbors
that there's a bunch of guys loading all my stuff from the workshop on to a truck
..come home to Denmark a few days later.
Completely whacked from jet-lag and lack of sleep.
Drives up to my house.
All my stuff is dumped on the front-lawn.
Wet, in semi-water-dissolved cardboard boxes.
I freaked......seriously completely freaked.
..my BSA and the supercharged Honda ( and my TIG welder and some other stuff )
are missing
..the sh!tfacedlooneymotherf**kingbastard have stolen them and won't 'give' them back
till I pay him ( the equivalent of ) $20.000.- ( twenty-thousand )
for "damages" to the workshop .....WTF ????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
( that I completely renovated out of my own pocket ..new walls with insulation...new insulated floor..etc. )
The claim of cource is something he pulled out of that place where the sun don't shine.
...according to my lawyer and a source in the police
apparently the only way to "solve" this
is to be dragged through a court case to the tune of $400 pr. hour (!) to the lawyer
which will probably take a year or so.
This is absolutely freaking outragerous but
the cops will regard it as a 'private' financial dispute.
I have never ever ever been so mindblowingly frustrated, devastated, agitated and indescribably
raving angry.
Just writhing this makes my hands shake with anger....seriously.
-
Oh, Lars -- I'm so sorry to hear what's happened to you. Words cannot convey the frustration that you're suffering, and all I can do is offer the best thoughts and condolences possible from all of us racers. What has happened to you is likely the absolute worst that could befall any racers.
Soldier on, sir!
-
That really sucks.
-
Lars,
I am so sorry to hear of your misfortune. I wish you the best getting your property back.
Tom G.
-
Lars,
Your landlord is a P.O.S., I'd like to take him fishing :evil:.
I hope things get set right.
Keep us updated, we care.
Don
-
Dodge Lars, sorry to hear this. Best of luck getting it all sorted.
-
What a horrible end to a crazy expedition! Hope you can get this rectified soon.
Lynda
-
He broke the lease by evicting you, even though your rent was paid up.
I'd be looking for an opinion from another Lawyer.
Unless the lease specified no renovations, you should stand a chance.
-
WOW, this is serious sh*t. A middleman and a lawyer is the thing I would recommend. A middleman so you don't do anything foolish, and a lawyer so you don't do anything foolish. Sleep on it and talk about it to as many intelligent people as possible. Time will quench the rage and produce some productive thinking. There's some scenarios in this society that almost leaves one unprotected. Least civil law protected scenario for the complainant, and second worst to be robbed by banks and government, is to be robbed by next of kin or the landlord. An hour with a lawyer can get you a long way.
-
Holy smoke Lars, words can barely describe such utter madness... There are indeed some unscrupulous MF'ers in this world.
Firstly, secure what belongings you do have and catalog any damage with photos and witnesses.
Secondly, review your lease / rental agreements with a lawyer, "Mieterbund / Mieterverein" or Danish equivalent thereof. (I had a similar, though less destructive issue with a dodgy landlord that decided to keep my 3 month damage deposit...and did so to everyone as I found out later. The local German Mieterbund, with whom I had a membership, got me my deposit refunded in full. It took many months)
Thirdly, bikers don't let bikers get screwed. Do you have any full patch, two-wheeled, bad MF'ing friends? (I'm only half joking...probably a bad idea but they might be great "middlemen")
Fourthly, counter-sue the SOB for property theft and property damage and look for an out of court settlement of "you give me my property back and I'll drop the suit" (no, I'm not a lawyer, just an idea).
Lastly, start applying for a green card for the USA or permanent residence for Canada...
Jeez, what on earth got into your landlord's head whilst you were away?
Lars, I'm truly sorry to hear this devastating news. I wish you good luck with sorting it out. Man, I feel for you.
Best regards,
Jim
-
Lars, these previous posts are good advice. Interview people, photograph, and document everything. Contact a lawyer for counsel. Do not do anything dumb you will regret later.
-
Holy Jeebus, that sux big time. I am glad to hear that you are at least physically OK though, I really was starting to worry.
It always amazes me how much people with no morals can get away with. A normal person would think that he'd be facing grand theft charges for taking your property, instead you're the one that has to fork out money and time to prove your side of the case to recover your property.
I agree with the previous posts on documenting everything. Fortunately you do have photographic evidence of the condition of the bikes prior to his interference, posted on various web sites, so that should be helpful. If I'm not mistaken you also have pictures before and after of the shop when you took it over and the "damage" that you did to it in the way of upgrades. All that should help to make your case. None of it changes the fact that you shouldn't even be dealing with it to begin with.
Does Denmark law recognize emotional distress as something that you could be compensated for, along with the material and monetary losses? I also agree with the previous posts that you need to counter-sue for everything you can possibly think of, even if some of it is completely implausible, just to push him as hard as possible to a resolution. Maybe if it has to fully run it's course you can end up owning the shop when it's all found in your favor!
Don't fret too hard, things have a way of working out, and it will all get better in the long run. Just keep planning for next year's racing to put you in your happy place. Chin up as the Brits would say.
-
How far behind does he allege you were on your rent ?
Research local laws, there is generally a legal procedure for eviction.
Written notice, bla bla bla.
These Gestapo tactics don't sound legal.
-
sorry to hear about this bullshiz issue.
maybe its time to bust a move.
to the land of opportunity ; the land of enchantment.
if I can help, I will.
franey
-
LARS- wishing you the best from your friends in england-very sano advices from friends above-especially the documentation part of things-it,s your friends who will get you through this-it sounds like at least you will get your stuff back eventually.
visions of a greasy salt cracker tee shirt tied round this rats neck are to avoided.
chin up mucka!
p.j.
-
Any news Lars? Have you managed to get this unbelievable mess sorted?
-
Anyone heard about Lars? It has been too long with no news. :-( I got a chance to see Lars and his well done bike last year and was bummed to hear about his landlord difficulties, not a good thing.
Hope that things are going better for him.
Matt Guzzetta
-
Land Speed Larry is around and about in Denmark, old friend circle only sees him ln a glimpse which is nothing unususal for Lars. I am sure he's OK so far as the Indian guru's om Denmark are a covert breed to start with.
Ironwigwam
-
his friend , moen , from over there, says also that lars does drop out of sight here and there.
he has not heard from him for some time now.
franey
-
I just had an e-mail from Lars. He's alive and well. He's been working non stop on a Danish TV project which is the reason for his disappearance. He also got the workshop mess sorted and is (today) moving into a new workshop which he describes as a dream. I asked him to post here. Hope he does.
-
Be great to hear from him again.
-
N/592 - Glen ... Good deal ... glad is ok
Joe
-
Bill [nortonist592] and Lars at Speedweek.
I don't recall who the tall guy is, anybody?
-
The tall guy is Tyler Malinky of Lowbrow Customs. He ran a record in 750 V/G and 750 VPS/G last year. His brother Kyle ran a record in 650 V/G. A good week for them.
-
Hello you wonderful SaltNuts !
First of all:
THANK YOU Jon, Glen, Tom, Don, Larry, Lynda, Ian,
Charlie, Jim, Bo, Ed, Franey, P.J., Matt, Rocky, Joe
and Bill
for your concern , advise and uplifting comments !
Of course I knew this, but it still amazes me:
you are good people !
Thank you !
Please accept my apologies for my long absence.
Please accept my apologies for emails , or PM's not answered.
I will do it now.
Life has been weird. As Bill mentioned I have been working
non-stop ( and I mean NON-stop ) since shortly after I came back.
In fact I calculated that my average working hours has been
close to 100 (one hundred (!)) hours. I have been working every day including weekends
except Christmas day and one other day. Sleep work sleep work sleep work.
I have had NO spare-time or 'personal' life or social life of any kind whatsoever.
I have never ever ever been so utterly knackered in my life before
but it's all good. Yeah, and they money weren't too bad either.
The bike is still in the box.
My luggage from my return-travel is still on the bedroom floor un-unpacked.
I have enough dirty clothing to keep an average sized laundy busy for a few days...ha ha
The dust in the house has reached a level where it has morphed
into a new lifeform that barks at me when I open the front-door.
The GOOD news:
I got all my stuff and my bikes back.
The short version of the story;
my lawyer took sh!tfacefu*khead landlord to court.
He didn't show up.
The court ruled that the court people ( don't know the English term )
and the cops were to show up at the workshop and force him to hand over my stuff.
Before that actually happened I did get my stuff some other way.
We're now going after him for break and entering my workshop,
entering private property ( my front garden ), property damage,
and suing him for a large amount of money for damage to my stuff.
.....and , who knows; maybe some....erh...errrhm...'poetic justice' is coming his way.
the other GOOD news:
sort'of out of the blue I was offered a new workshop.
To me it's almost a dream come through.
LOT's of space, around 3400 square feet ( four times the old place )
and ( what can easily be turned into ) living quarters,
There's a toilet, a bath, central heating etc. and it is brilliantly
situated so that if I ride 7 minutes in one direction
I'm in the center of Wonderful Copenhagen and 4 minutes
in the opposite direction , I'm at a rather nice beach
AND it's gonna cost me only a couple of hundred dollars
more than my old place
and then some more GOOD news:
there is every possibility that something flipping good
is going to happen on the sponsor-front.
More later.
So much looking forward to be on this brilliant forum
among you good people again !!!
-
Lars, So glad to hear your doing good. :-D
It is great to have you back here and so much of a releif to hear that crooked landlord's get whats coming to them in the end. :cheers:
-
We always knew you'd be back! Time Heals all Wounds--- and Time Wounds all Heels!
Tom
-
That was nice to hear! Skal Lars! :cheers:
-
Good news is soooooooooooo welcome! Will we see you in 2012?
-
Good news is soooooooooooo welcome! Will we see you in 2012?
Time to change the title of this thread to 2012 Lars.
You've still got a pulse and the bike is packed so no excuses!!
-
I finally finished reading the build last night,glad it turned out better than ever. Does you friend sell the cast fuel tanks? My eyes sparkled when I saw that... :cheers:
-
Good to hear from you Lars! I had begun to fear the worst. I firmly believe what goes around, comes around. Glad your ex-landlord would appear to be getting his come-uppance. The Germans have a great and appropriate expression ..."Schadenfreude" or loosely translated "pleasure in the misery of others," which would seem wholly appropriate given the landlord being the recipient.
Good news on the workshop. I'm sure it will bear fruits and inspire you to ever faster machines. I look forward to hearing and seeing your coming landracing exploits. Until then...
Regards,
Jim
-
Hi Lars!
Good to see you up and banging again.
More good news, there is an article about you and the saltcracker in "Cycle Source" november 2011. We did the MCM article , but not this one. Do you have a copy of the magazine?
If not, I can scan it for you.
Jan &b Agneta
-
Good news fella !!
maybe see you on the salt soon eh?
-
Lars, I am overjoyed that you have survived this ordeal.
I'll watch for you at Salt Talks wearing your pristine badge.
FREUD
-
Wow, Lars. I thought you went berserk and were in jail. Life can be an adventure. Glad you are OK.
-
Let me add my heartfelt relief on hearing from you again! Obviously our concern for your well fair has been publicly shared. It's a relief to know that your absence as been because of work, but from now on, if you're too busy to let us know you're alive and kicking then designate someone to tell us!!! :x
We'll forgive you this time because of the good that has come your way with the new shop, return of your tools and belongings, and the opportunity of hearing about the dropkick-stomp-on-his-scrotum-Karma's-a-B*tch landlord. :evil:
Anyway, glad you're doing well and I'll see you at Land's End this year!!!
Stay Safe
Stay Upright
Go Fast and....
STAY IN TOUCH!!
Lynda
-
One more friend in the group that has missed updates on your (mis?) adventures! Glad to hear you are still upright. See you on the salt.
Jill
-
Wow, great to hear you are getting your stuff back and have a new shop! I had been following your build for a looong time and was glad to meet you and see your wonderful bike in 2011. Last year was a magic year for some autocross friends that goaded me into getting back to Bonneville for the first time in nearly 30 years. It was a bummer to hear of your landlord problems :x One thing, get your bike out of the box and make sure the lingering salt has not caused any problems. :-o
Hope you can make it back, it is a addicting place :-D
Welcome back, we missed you! :cheers:
Matt Guzzetta
-
Lars, So glad to hear your doing good. :-D
It is great to have you back here and so much of a releif to hear that crooked landlord's get whats coming to them in the end. :cheers:
Thank you !
We always knew you'd be back! Time Heals all Wounds--- and Time Wounds all Heels!
Tom
Thank you Tom !
That was nice to hear! Skal Lars! :cheers:
Skål Charlie !
Good news is soooooooooooo welcome! Will we see you in 2012?
That is indeed my plan.
Good news is soooooooooooo welcome! Will we see you in 2012?
Time to change the title of this thread to 2012 Lars.
You've still got a pulse and the bike is packed so no excuses!!
Just checked: yep, I've got a pulse.
Better start preparing da' Cracker
I finally finished reading the build last night,glad it turned out better than ever. Does you friend sell the cast fuel tanks? My eyes sparkled when I saw that... :cheers:
Hi Cerial ! Thanks a lot for taking an interest in my silly endeavour.
I'm not sure about the tank. I'll ask. Please remind me if I forget to
(Happens ALL the time)
Good to hear from you Lars! I had begun to fear the worst. I firmly believe what goes around, comes around. Glad your ex-landlord would appear to be getting his come-uppance. The Germans have a great and appropriate expression ..."Schadenfreude"
So do we here in Denmark. We call it 'skadefryd'
or loosely translated "pleasure in the misery of others," which would seem wholly appropriate given the landlord being the recipient.
Good news on the workshop. I'm sure it will bear fruits and inspire you to ever faster machines. I look forward to hearing and seeing your coming landracing exploits. Until then...
Regards,
Jim
Thanks a lot Jim !
Hi Lars!
Good to see you up and banging again.
More good news, there is an article about you and the saltcracker in "Cycle Source" november 2011. We did the MCM article , but not this one. Do you have a copy of the magazine?
If not, I can scan it for you.
Jan &b Agneta
Hi Jan and Agneta ! Good to 'see' you here.
Thanks for the offer but I do have a copy. My good friend David
send me one.
Good news fella !!
maybe see you on the salt soon eh?
Hi Oz! That's the plan
Lars, I am overjoyed that you have survived this ordeal.
I'll watch for you at Salt Talks wearing your pristine badge.
FREUD
Thank you for your kind words Freud !
Wow, Lars. I thought you went berserk and were in jail. Life can be an adventure. Glad you are OK.
Thanks Bo. No I did not go berserk, but only 'cause men wiser
than me held me back
Let me add my heartfelt relief on hearing from you again! Obviously our concern for your well fair has been publicly shared. It's a relief to know that your absence as been because of work, but from now on, if you're too busy to let us know you're alive and kicking then designate someone to tell us!!! :x
We'll forgive you this time because of the good that has come your way with the new shop, return of your tools and belongings, and the opportunity of hearing about the dropkick-stomp-on-his-scrotum-Karma's-a-B*tch landlord. :evil:
Anyway, glad you're doing well and I'll see you at Land's End this year!!!
Stay Safe
Stay Upright
Go Fast and....
STAY IN TOUCH!!
Lynda
Lynda !!! Thank you for you concern
and I do hope you have it in your heart to forgive me again ?!
One more friend in the group that has missed updates on your (mis?) adventures! Glad to hear you are still upright. See you on the salt.
Jill
Thank you Jill !
Wow, great to hear you are getting your stuff back and have a new shop! I had been following your build for a looong time and was glad to meet you and see your wonderful bike in 2011. Last year was a magic year for some autocross friends that goaded me into getting back to Bonneville for the first time in nearly 30 years. It was a bummer to hear of your landlord problems :x One thing, get your bike out of the box and make sure the lingering salt has not caused any problems. :-o
Hope you can make it back, it is a addicting place :-D
Welcome back, we missed you! :cheers:
Matt Guzzetta
Thank you Matt ! It was a pleasure meeting you !
Yep, da' Cracker is out of the box now.
…...
OK , so FINALLY I do have something relevant to write here , in what
is after all a BUILD thread:
I've interrupted the workshop build
and set up shop with a fraction of my tools and stuff
( most of it is still in storage ), 'cause I needed to get the Cracker
up and going for a bike-show next weekend.
...and I was going semi-insane from not being able to work
on bike for ...what is it....more than half a year.
That can make any normal person batsh*tcrazy.
The hard stares that bike send me every time I looked at it
didn't help either.
Tell you what, getting back to wrenching was better than ██ .
Will ya look at that:
The little darling Indian all in one piece and ready to fire up tomorrow
in the main-room in my wonderfullywonderfull new workshop
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1-29.jpg)
I've been working like a madman, literally non-stop, for weeks to get the new shop/crip
up to snuff. Spend the first couple week tearing down odd sh*t
and dragging tons of garbage-stuff and dead mice to the dumpster.
Maaaan this place was a mess. A landfill of crap and paint falling off the walls
and some seriously disturbed constructions.
Then building up the whole thing , new flooring, partitions,
sliding glass-doors , painting every square inch of ...er....everything.
Had a couple a guys help me for a little while so I could move in.
Been living here for 4-5 weeks now.
I have all a man really needs:
toilet, bath, a kitchen ( ha ha: a hotplate and a fridge )
basic tools, a few bikes, the trophy and certificates from Bonneville,
the ”girls-with-some-of-their-clothing-missing and bikes” pics,
a mattress on the floor , a table and 3 chairs.
How could I possibly want for more ?!
Here's a little video-tour if your TV is broken and you have
time to kill:
( Yep; I went a little nuts doing the shop-floor. Painted it
black and put on a thick layer of epoxy clear-coat mixed
with gold-flakes....drug will make you do that kind of thing...
...except I don't do drugs....must have been the fumes or something then )
The room behind the glass-partition will be the workshop proper
that I can heat in the wintertime. Insulated flooring and walls.
First floor will be the private quarters. Includes a sleep-place.
NOT shown...too bloody messy.
Video: CLICK (http://youtu.be/yIVqKkhm9uY)
Now back to business: the bike:
It was corroded BADLY, but nothing a dip in WD40 , liberal use
of a very large hammer and a crowbar couldn't fix.
Examination showed a couple of slightly worrying things.
Look at the chain; WTF ???
TWO places it was broken
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/4-15.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-20.jpg)
I've never seen anything like that. Could have been nasty!.
I've seen them stretched and 'loose', but nothing like this.
I wish I could remember where I bought it so I could come
back and slam it on the counter. I mean: this is a supposed to be a
sturdy 530 chain....POS.
And I found a small indention in the front cylinder-head where
the valve had hit. Mmmmmm: glad the head is made of marshmallowonium.
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/5-9.jpg)
Splashed out and bought a couple of new gauges that hopefully will
work a bit longer than the old ones
( just under one minute (!) Wasn't too inpressed by that).
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2-30.jpg)
…...
A seriously heartfelt THANK YOU goes out to Tyler Malinky
of LOWBROW fame, who set up The Redliners Racing International
”...Redliners Racing International. A group of six dashingly handsome, smart, and fast individuals
[ I like that ...ha ha ] who waste way too much time and money on the irrational pursuit of making old, slow machines go fast....”
CLICK (http://www.lowbrowcustoms.com/index.php?l=blogview&link=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.blogger.com%2Ffeeds%2F7406717291819005800%2Fposts%2Fdefault%2F4624528173208546036)
and setting up and selling a series of merchandise from which the proceedings will
go to the group.
Meet this exclusive group of gentlemen here. You'll recognize a couple
of them from this brilliant forum:
Redliners Racing International (http://www.redlinersracing.com/)
Thanks man ! Tyler is good people !
What else:
I have a new contender for 2013 in the pipeline.
Won't say what till I got something to show for it,
except the name of the beast is 'THORS HAMMER'.
For those of you un-educated in Norse mythology ,
here's what Thor is about
THOR (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thor)
Da' Viking is coming to conquer the Salt !
The case concerning my lovely landlord.
I'm filing the case myself as there's NO way I can afford a lawyer
for that. When I got the lawyer's bill from the first part of the case
I almost soiled myself. ( Sorry for inflicting that visual image on you )
I just don't have that kind of money.
And when all the 'legal' nonsense is over with I seriously will
go ███ the ████ ████.
I have a hard time waiting for that.
I apologize for not keeping the thread updated, but as I mentioned,
there hasn't, till now, been any 'build' to update.
At least; when I finally do update, I see to it that it's loooong, tedious
and babbling.
I hope you are all happy and in good health !
-
Lars, so glad to se you back, looks like things are going your way. Looking forward to the rebuild/updates and speed week. :cheers:
Nice looking shop.
-
Program your build timeline so you will have free time for Salt Talks.
That's the source of all "truths."
Anything you say or hear there is truth as solid as granite.
Old bikes become as fast and as vibrant as lightening bolts.
Do you need a new Salt Talks badge to represent your new scoot?
FREUD
-
What a beautiful space! Remember our invite to San Diego? Let me know well ahead of time if you'll make it, our shop would need a serious cleaning. Happy for you!
-
Anyone would have needed a time out after all that bashing you got last year. Seems you where challenged by some in the the Vanirs clan? Thor is a member of the clan AESIR. It seems you could do with a whole clan of power and war gods, why not call your little family AESIR? The little indian is Ullr, who is a son of Sif, and a step-son of Thor. He is so good an archer, and so fast on his skies, that no one can contend with him. He is fair of face, and possesses every quality of a warrior. Men should invoke him in single combat.. The blown gold wing is Hoder, hight one of the asas, who is blind, but exceedingly strong; and the gods would wish that this asa never needed to be named, for the work of his hand will long be kept in memory both by gods and men. And here comes Thor. Thor is the foremost of them. He is called Asa-Thor, or Oku-Thor. He is the strongest of all gods and men, and rules over the realm which is called Thrudvang (Bonneville). I can see a little track bike there, there is yet an asa, whose name is Tyr. He is very daring and stout-hearted. He sways victory in war, wherefore warriors should call on him. In the foreground calmly waiting is Bragi, the Norse word for poetry. He is famous for his wisdom, eloquence and flowing speech. What can be more flowing than the speech of yet another Honda flat 6? Or maybe his name is Heimdall? He is also called the white-asa. He is great and holy; born of nine maidens, all of whom were sisters. He is also called Hallinskide and Gullintanne, for his teeth were of gold.
-
Welcome back Lars .
I had an O ring chain with the same problem once.
I don't know why you bothered with getting a table, the floor looks more than adequate to eat off.
Do you plan on putting your "salt cracker" tee's on the market again ?
-
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/3-20.jpg)
I've never seen anything like that. Could have been nasty!.
I've seen them stretched and 'loose', but nothing like this.
I wish I could remember where I bought it so I could come
back and slam it on the counter. I mean: this is a supposed to be a
sturdy 530 chain....POS.
Chain slap? Only chain whip can produce force that's needed for that sort of havock. That's the only reason I can think of.
Lowbrow have a sprung chain tensioner that maybe could fix that.
-
Hey Lars, it's great to see you back. Glad you got it all sorted out with the landlord to at least get your stuff back. Don't forget to sue him for your lawyers fees. It looks like you have the perfect "Man Cave" now. It looks great. Look forward to seeing ya at Speedweek. Remember, entries must be postmarked by the 10th...
Larry :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
-
På gensyn!
-
Glad to see you back here, Lars. Look forward to seeing you at Speed Week..... :cheers: :cheers:
-
Lars,
I was getting suited up for a ride and was trying to get my boots on when I noticed that there was a sock stuffed down in one.
You probably looked all over for it.
Now you have to go to SpeedWeek just to get your laundry back. :-D
Don
-
YES!
welcome news lars-and what a workshop! great to see you bounce back ,indians make you hardier.crazy here with build for BSW-
SKAL!
-
Is that industrial grade chain or genuine motorcycle chain? Was it rusty and pitted when you last used it? Your shop and home looks great.
-
Wow, what an excellent workshop! I lived in my workshops for over 20 years. If I was looking at a new one, the first thing I'd check out was the office....could I live in it? Or if there was room somewhere to build living quarters? I never had to go far to work :-D
-
Welcome back Lars and now show 'em, why Loki is scared of Thor's Hammer. 8-)
-
I finally finished reading the build last night,glad it turned out better than ever. Does you friend sell the cast fuel tanks? My eyes sparkled when I saw that... :cheers:
I think (see the special offers page) the aluminium cast tanks can be bought favourly through Moen of Indian Parts Europe, one of Lars biggest sponsors! And Moen's site is surely worth reading if you're an Indian buff.
http://www.indianpartseurope.com/
-
Lars, so glad to se you back, looks like things are going your way. Looking forward to the rebuild/updates and speed week. :cheers:
Nice looking shop.
Thanks Glen !
Program your build timeline so you will have free time for Salt Talks.
That's the source of all "truths."
Anything you say or hear there is truth as solid as granite.
Old bikes become as fast and as vibrant as lightening bolts.
Do you need a new Salt Talks badge to represent your new scoot?
FREUD
Thanks Freud !
Thanks for the offer for the badge, but the new scoot won't be till next year...but thanks !
What a beautiful space! Remember our invite to San Diego? Let me know well ahead of time if you'll make it, our shop would need a serious cleaning. Happy for you!
Thank you Jill !
You're very kind
Anyone would have needed a time out after all that bashing you got last year. Seems you where challenged by some in the the Vanirs clan? Thor is a member of the clan AESIR. It seems you could do with a whole clan of power and war gods, why not call your little family AESIR? The little indian is Ullr, who is a son of Sif, and a step-son of Thor. He is so good an archer, and so fast on his skies, that no one can contend with him. He is fair of face, and possesses every quality of a warrior. Men should invoke him in single combat.. The blown gold wing is Hoder, hight one of the asas, who is blind, but exceedingly strong; and the gods would wish that this asa never needed to be named, for the work of his hand will long be kept in memory both by gods and men. And here comes Thor. Thor is the foremost of them. He is called Asa-Thor, or Oku-Thor. He is the strongest of all gods and men, and rules over the realm which is called Thrudvang (Bonneville). I can see a little track bike there, there is yet an asa, whose name is Tyr. He is very daring and stout-hearted. He sways victory in war, wherefore warriors should call on him. In the foreground calmly waiting is Bragi, the Norse word for poetry. He is famous for his wisdom, eloquence and flowing speech. What can be more flowing than the speech of yet another Honda flat 6? Or maybe his name is Heimdall? He is also called the white-asa. He is great and holy; born of nine maidens, all of whom were sisters. He is also called Hallinskide and Gullintanne, for his teeth were of gold.
Ho, ho !!! Fantastic ! I LIKE that story !
Welcome back Lars .
I had an O ring chain with the same problem once.
I don't know why you bothered with getting a table, the floor looks more than adequate to eat off.
Do you plan on putting your "salt cracker" tee's on the market again ?
Thanks General !
Yep, new t-shirts are in the making with a new 'design'
Chain slap? Only chain whip can produce force that's needed for that sort of havock. That's the only reason I can think of.
Lowbrow have a sprung chain tensioner that maybe could fix that.
Thanks Charlie. Never thought about 'chain slap' being the culprit.
I'll look into finding a chain tensioner.
Hey Lars, it's great to see you back. Glad you got it all sorted out with the landlord to at least get your stuff back. Don't forget to sue him for your lawyers fees. It looks like you have the perfect "Man Cave" now. It looks great. Look forward to seeing ya at Speedweek. Remember, entries must be postmarked by the 10th...
Larry :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Thanks a lot Larry
På gensyn!
På gensyn Monix ! [ See ya' ]
Glad to see you back here, Lars. Look forward to seeing you at Speed Week..... :cheers: :cheers:
Thanks Paul !
Lars,
I was getting suited up for a ride and was trying to get my boots on when I noticed that there was a sock stuffed down in one.
You probably looked all over for it.
Now you have to go to SpeedWeek just to get your laundry back. :-D
Don
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh; so that's were I put that sock with all my money.
Please send them ( ALL of the $10.000 ) back to me.
.-)
YES!
welcome news lars-and what a workshop! great to see you bounce back ,indians make you hardier.crazy here with build for BSW-
SKAL!
SKÅL BBKelly !........................."indians make you hardier"....naaaaa; Indians makes you nuts
Is that industrial grade chain or genuine motorcycle chain? Was it rusty and pitted when you last used it? Your shop and home looks great.
Hi Bo !
That was a genuine motorcycle chain from RK (http://www.rkexcelamerica.com/).
Yeah, it was rusty and somewhat pitted from when I used it back in 2010, but still......?!
Wow, what an excellent workshop! I lived in my workshops for over 20 years. If I was looking at a new one, the first thing I'd check out was the office....could I live in it? Or if there was room somewhere to build living quarters? I never had to go far to work :-D
Thanks Chris !
Welcome back Lars and now show 'em, why Loki is scared of Thor's Hammer. 8-)
Thank you Nanno ! I'll get back to Thor's Hammer later
I finally finished reading the build last night,glad it turned out better than ever. Does you friend sell the cast fuel tanks? My eyes sparkled when I saw that... :cheers:
I think (see the special offers page) the aluminium cast tanks can be bought favourly through Moen of Indian Parts Europe, one of Lars biggest sponsors! And Moen's site is surely worth reading if you're an Indian buff.
http://www.indianpartseurope.com/
Yep !
-
Well; my new project for the Salt won't be named Thor's Hammer after all.
Seams someone got that idea before I did, so first come....first serve.
The evil man in question is Kurt ( originally from Denmark ) who runs his
magnificent Vincent on the Salt.
I tried to persuade him that it would be an excellent idea if he would please
call his bloody bike 'Kurt's Hammer' instead.......but naaaa naaaaa, THAT wasn't
good enough for him.
OK then; I guess I have to punish him by showing this picture:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/kurt-1.jpg)
Smart fella'...ei ?
First he builds a really tall platform for his bike , only to realize he can't reach it
so he has to go to town to buy himself a ladder.....jeez
You will have to forgive him; his a Molbo (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molbo_story)
So what am I to do: calling my new project 'Thor's Screwdriver', just do not cut it.
Take this Kurt:
It'll be called 'Odin's Fury'
So who is this 'Odin':
"....Odin is associated with the concept of the Wild Hunt, a noisy, bellowing movement across the sky...
His name is related to ōðr, meaning "fury, excitation," besides "mind," or "poetry."
His role, like that of many of the Norse gods, is complex. Odin is a principal member of the Æsir
(the major group of the Norse pantheon) and is associated with war, battle, victory and death,
but also wisdom, magic, poetry, prophecy, and the hunt.
Odin has many sons, the most famous of whom is Thor...."
So Kurt: who's your daddy !?
.-)
OK, I'll lift the veil on it:
It's a Danish made four cylinder 750cc overhead-camshaft Type C NIMBUS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nimbus_%28motorcycle%29).
but as of now it's just a plan. I did have a good deal on one, but due to my own stupidity
the deal fell through, so now I'm searching for another.
I used to have one back some 32 years ( now I feel old ).
Here it is just after I bought it:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/n2.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/n1.jpg)
That's a 'Bender' side-car. It was a copy of the 'Steib' and it was made here in Copenhagen.
He it is after I rebuild it
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/RIMG0189-1.jpg)
That's me on behind the handlebars....it REALLY is !
Here are the first drafts:
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/1Sketchyfastdrafydraft.jpg)
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/2EvenfasterdraftydraftydraftBLOWERside.jpg)
The plan is to drive an AISIN AMR300 blower ( similar to the one on the Indian ) off a shaft
coupled ( is that the term ) to the overhead camshaft.
I've been all over a couple of Nimbus bikes lately and measured everything,
calculated the direction and RPM of the shaft/blower etc. and it should
work out just fine.
-
Now the Indian:
I've been all over it and it appears that everything is honky dory.
No undue funny noises, no 'cork-screwing' crank...nothing really.
I've re re re rechecked the carb. Checked the float-bowl 'needle' rubber tip
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/6-7.jpg)
to see if it was harmed by the methanol....nope.
Checked the electric fuel-shut-off thingy
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/9-3.jpg)
I've put a new chain on it, put on the big pulley
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/7-7.jpg)
( last year I only got to run with the small pulley )
and put on a smaller rear-sprocket
(http://i207.photobucket.com/albums/bb220/octane98extra/8-3.jpg)
so of course it will now go muuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuch faster.
Took it to a bike-show a while back and showed off by starting it up
to great applause
.-)
It does run real nicely, thank you.
Here's a video someone took there: ( I know: the guy with the Easy-Start spay is a bit over-enthusiastic )
CLICK (http://youtu.be/m9BKydYL1EU)
So all there needs to be done it making a new wiring harness.
I didn't really impress myself with the one it has now.
Then I'm ready !
Except:
Freakingfu%6+#motherofallbummers:
the sh!t has been flying fan-wards bigtime.
As my situation is right now, there's just NO way I can afford to go this year.
That horrible little fact has knocked my world off its axis.
Well, well; c'est la vie.........a freaking roller-coaster.
For now I'll just joyfully keep on working on the bike with a glimmer of hope that
something unexpected happens,
and then I'll just observe how the universe unfolds.
"..Hope is the feeling you have
that the feeling you have isn't permanent.."
Jean Kerr
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Why not name the new bike Mijolnir. Which is the name of Thor's Hammer. Kinda circumvents the other guy that way. Plus there seem to be a lot of ways to spell it if that particular way is taken. Too bad about your surprise circumstances. Hope something good turns your way.
-
Well; my new project for the Salt won't be named Thor's Hammer after all.
...
Take this Kurt:
It'll be called 'Odin's Fury'
...
So Kurt: who's your daddy !?
.-)
OK, I'll lift the veil on it:
It's a Danish made four cylinder 750cc overhead-camshaft Type C ...
"Odin's Fury," I like it and laughed my ass off at the "who's your daddy" comment. :-D
I have often been fascinated with the relatively unique Nimbus too in my searches for eclectic bikes. I seem to have locked in on shaft drives (not necessarily for Land Speed Racing) with a Sunbeam S7 and a "naked" early Goldwing. The shaft drive makes for less issues with chain but probably makes for more of a challenge in changing gear ratios. I look forward to seeing this come together.
The shop/living quarters is awesome. That has to be the silver lining of all time after your troubles last year.
As it turns out, I probably won't make the Salt this year either being in Europe on a long standing planned road-trip with my dad.
I lift my rhyton in salute to Odin's Fury. Skol! :cheers:
Jim
-
What about the tank sealing goo you used? Is that really necessary to use and was that a reason for the poor runs you had?
You got your work cut out making a bland, boring, gutless flat iron 3 speed Nimbus dust sucker to a rowing, stomp pulling fire breathing supercharged father of gods. It'll neeever woooork.... :mrgreen:
-
charlie101....I can't begin to tell you how wrong you are!!!! With all that Lars has gone through to race his Indian on the salt, get a record, find his lost Indian when he got home, battle with the #$%^$$##@#$%^ landlord, and still end up optimistic... Lars is an inspiration to us all and definitely should be to you too!
I'm very sad you won't be on the salt with us this year Lars, but I'll be watching for you next year!!! Love the new garage...it's twice the size of my apartment!! Take care and Stay Upright!!!
Lynda
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charlie101....I can't begin to tell you how wrong you are!!!! With all that Lars has gone through to race his Indian on the salt, get a record, find his lost Indian when he got home, battle with the #$%^$$##@#$%^ landlord, and still end up optimistic... Lars is an inspiration to us all and definitely should be to you too!
Lynda
Nimbus.....It'll neeever woooork.... :-D
:cheers:
-
hey lars! i agree with lynda-just a small portion of your adventures would make a great book or a tv programme that would be worth watching-a rarity!
from my years in iceland and norway i seem to remember the only name to suit the new bike would be SLEIPNIR- dunno if i spelt it right, but i think,[hazy days] sleipnir was odin,s eight legged war horse there is a big mountain in iceland with the shape of a horse shoe-left as odin left earth on his eight legged warhorse, bound for valhalla- before ragnarok?-
these are just my hazy memories,so if some smart , computer wise type wants to correct me by quoting some text he has trawled off garggle or wiki-dont bother.
LARS- you should just get a flight and come to BSW for the party-there are plenty of indian folk you aint met -and i need to hear the impression of your motorhome driving up a hill !!
P.J.
-
OK it looks like my dot.comfuser is working again.
Lynda, you left abit untold, don't forget the months of red tape and worry to get the bike in the country, weeks and weeks of trouble and added cost he had with the Motorhome and DMV, nonstop driving and late arrival to B'ville, and only after prolonged stay with added cost again and non stop relentless work on the bike the record was beat with a couple of halfrotten runs with a problem noone on the salt could solve. Any one with his fluids balanced would have abolished the project weeks earlier :-D Top that up with a motorhome camping landlord with his own ideas take a spin and have a fallout. And out of his hands, the Salt cracker gone missing without a trace. And that even before the welcome home was a garage landlord gone completely bonkers, rob him blind and sue him at that! Lars must have taken good care of his tin foil hat! That Lars caracter is certainly made of some double gnarly stuff. It'll take a tougher hide than a catskin to polish him up! I am in total awe, wish him all luck in the world and is happy and envy of the fantastic mancave he's made all by himself!
-
When there is not Lars, there's another knobhead revisiting Bonneville. A Swedish frostbitten rawhide Viking really geared up and armed to his teeth to thrash his own previous record. He has honed his racing skills with years and unnumerous laps on winter ice tracks with hundred of inch long pinsharp stubs in their tires. They lean the bikes more then 60 degrees in the curbs, sliding elbows on the ice inches from each other and a whole lot quicker around the bends than the speedway jockeys. G-forces compared or sometimes exceeding those in F1. A sport for people with some sincerely serious balls. I 'm convinced the riders must have some fibruos growth in places others don't have...:-D
His Blog is also written in English so you unwashed can read. 59 days and change remaining...the bike is sent and the dices are thrown....visit and give Anders your blessings!
http://edstugaanders.blogspot.se/
The air cargo prices he is stating are really interesting! $800 to Seattle for 120 Kg.
-
WOO HOO!!!!! Let's go racing and build more incredible memories to add to the collections we already have!!!!! It's going to be an AWESOME Speedweek!!!
Lynda
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Hi Lars,
Sunning meself on a Greek island for a few days... (had my 60th at Bonneville, but Susan wanted hers here!!!)
Nice new project with the Nimbus... Keep at it...
Patrick
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OK, I'll lift the veil on it:
It's a Danish made four cylinder 750cc overhead-camshaft Type C NIMBUS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nimbus_%28motorcycle%29).
but as of now it's just a plan. I did have a good deal on one, but due to my own stupidity
the deal fell through, so now I'm searching for another.
I am sure you know Tormod and Klaus of the "Dumb way round" ?
http://www.kccd.no/
If not, I am sure they can help out in one way or another, as they're very fond of stupid ideas like racing a Nimbus...
Cheers,
Greg