Landracing Forum
Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => SCTA Rule Questions => Topic started by: 1194 on March 14, 2009, 08:02:58 PM
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It is great to see that SCTA/BNI is going full circle regarding the sidecar rules.
We started out in the late 1970's racing with a passenger...........1987 passengers outlawed,
no ballast and/or platform required...(we always used ballast for safety reasons)....enter 2000,
platform required 12"x36"........around 2006,
one has to show the platform can hold a passenger......2009, ballast is now required.........
Who knows, is there a option of using a passenger in the future?............................................
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It is great to see that SCTA/BNI is going full circle regarding the sidecar rules.
We started out in the late 1970's racing with a passenger...........1987 passengers outlawed,
no ballast and/or platform required...(we always used ballast for safety reasons)....enter 2000,
platform required 12"x36"........around 2006,
one has to show the platform can hold a passenger......2009, ballast is now required.........
Who knows, is there a option of using a passenger in the future?............................................
Bob...won't happen......
John
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:-D Only if the passenger is a real "Dummy", has a signed psychological release from the mental ward, is physically fit and passes the medical requirements, convinces the SCTA/BNI that he can assume all responsibility for his own life and that Dr. Kevorkian is not waiting someware along side the course to administer first aid after he falls off. :wink:
Terry :cheers:
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Not nice,Terry...........I understand you are fairly new to sidecar racing, and I also understand in your very short career of racing sidecars in LSR
you never used a passenger, so you are not at all aware what a knowledgeable passenger can do to make for a fast safe run. Calling a "co-rider"
on a sidecar a "Dummy" certainly shows your absolute lack of knowledge as to what sidecar racing is all about.
PS. We also take great exception in calling my wife Linda (who raced as my passenger for many years in roadracing) and our outstanding LSR
passenger, Warren Ryan (at 72 years young) "mental cases"
As you can tell by my post, I have a very limited
sense of humor when it comes to "knocking" sidecar passengers
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Ok, explain to me how a passenger is anything but a liability in LSR?
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:wink: Nevermind! :-D
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Dean, if I have to explain it to you, you won't understand it anyway.............................................
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Dean, I know this is an LSR sight but the point that 1194 is making is that a passenger is an interagal part of Sidecar racing. Sidecars in any other racing disciplin (roadracing, moto x, trials, ice racing, etc, is about a rider and a passanger. And as a sidecar racer for fourty years I believe regardless of the disciplin a sidecar should have a passanger, it's just what sidecars are about.
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Yep, yep, yep. I get that. But since the passenger has zero function and huge liability . . .
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It's called racing
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I admit to being ignorant of sidecar racing. I do understand the purpose of a "Monkey" (that's what they were called when I started ridin) on a Road Race, Ice Race etc. side car. What exactly would one do on a LSR rig?
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Be a passanger on a racing sidecar
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i would like to know what the scta is afraid of by letting the sidecars race with
a passenger. thats what sidecars are all about driver and passenger.
not a wheel on a stick,not a platform with weight on it,but two humans thats
what sidecar racing is all about. the scta needs to pull its head out of its ass and get a grip.
sidecar lsr is two people to a rig.
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Does the word insurance ring a bell? :-)
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Does the rider have to pay a entry fee.How about the monkey?
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...What exactly would one do on a LSR rig?
Someone needs to answer the cell phone since the driver is busy, I heard this has cause problems in the past.
:-D
Old story, true IIRC - Big desert race in SoCal, one of the racers always had his dog ride along on the tank. He had a piece of carpet on the tank for the dog to grip on.
A lady TV reporter sees this, and admonishes:
"How terrible! What if the poor little doggy falls off!"
"Uh, lady? What if POOR LITTLE ME FALLS OFF! :roll:"
Some (most) dragstrips allow passengers up to 13.99, and the tracks are insured. 13.99 is about 100mph. Without a passenger, it's not a sidecar, it's a tricycle.
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"Insurance" is just a excuse......"insurance" has nothing to do with it.......back in 1987 when our dear friends Elmo and the boys outlawed passengers at SCTA/BNI it was all about the car people asking "Hey, if those guys on the sidecars can take a passenger, why can't I take my wife Maggie down the course in my roadster"
That's what it is all about.......A couple of former board members have told me so on several
occasions. SCTA/BNI is a car racing org................
If insurance is the reason.......WHY does the BUB
give sidecar racers the option of using a passenger.
SCTA/BNI is all about land racing CARS........and you M/C racers have to understand this......in fact
for 2009 car Tech will be inspecting your M/C
streamliners......is this the beginning of a major change. There is another option for you M/C racers...........it is called the BUB ALL MOTORCYCLE
SPEED TRIALS.................end of sermon.....................
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"Insurance" is just a excuse......"insurance" has nothing to do with it.......back in 1987 when our dear friends Elmo and the boys outlawed passengers at SCTA/BNI it was all about the car people asking "Hey, if those guys on the sidecars can take a passenger, why can't I take my wife Maggie down the course in my roadster"
That's what it is all about.......A couple of former board members have told me so on several
occasions. SCTA/BNI is a car racing org................
If insurance is the reason.......WHY does the BUB
give sidecar racers the option of using a passenger.
SCTA/BNI is all about land racing CARS........and you M/C racers have to understand this......in fact
for 2009 car Tech will be inspecting your M/C
streamliners......is this the beginning of a major change. There is another option for you M/C racers...........it is called the BUB ALL MOTORCYCLE
SPEED TRIALS.................end of sermon.....................
Thank you.
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If there would be any doubt as to the status of M/C racers with SCTA/BNI.......................................
All one has to do is go to the SCTA/BNI Website
it states "sponsors of the world's fastest
AUTOMOTIVE speed trials"........................................
Any questions?????????........................Amen.............
PS. "insurance will not allow it"................................
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At least the motorcycles can now integrate into the lines.
When I first went they were off to the side by themselves.
I think there was a time when they had to be invited to run.
Someone will correct me if I am incorrect.
FREUD
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You are right on, Freud......I first raced a M/C
at Bonneville in 1954.......and thing were different
in those days.....certainly M/C's get better treatment these days.......and don't get me wrong
SCTA/BNI does a outstanding job with great
volunteers......and until 2003 they were the only
game in town to go LSR for a M/C racer.......this year will be my 30+ plus years as a member of BNI
and I will continue my membership in the future.
But some of the "new" LSR M/C racers, who complain at times regarding the M/C Rules....need to understand that the M/C Rules Committee does the best they can..........but in the end, it is the "car people" calling the shots.......
So if you want "M/C people" calling the shots,
(like we do regarding sidecar passengers) there is now another org. to race with.
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i bought a used harley with a sidecar funny it didnt come with a monkey a dummy or a passenger --we get your sidecar passenger thing---this isnt roadracing or motocross its LAND SPEED RACING willie buchta
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Hey Willie, did your used Harley sidecar outfit come with a driver??? I know you stated it did not come with a passenger.......I would think your used Harley had a sidecar attached to carry a passenger............or maybe the kickstand was broken so they mounted a sidecar to keep it from falling over...........................................................
All we ask is that we are given the option to carry a passenger............some will like to run a
"wheel on a stick tricycle" and some will want to run a real sidecar.... w/passenger......give us the OPTION..... that is all we ask for..........very simple
to understand I would think....................................
PS. Insurance has nothing to do with it!!!!!
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Hey Willie, did your used Harley sidecar outfit come with a driver??? I know you stated it did not come with a passenger.......I would think your used Harley had a sidecar attached to carry a passenger............or maybe the kickstand was broken so they mounted a sidecar to keep it from falling over...........................................................
All we ask is that we are given the option to carry a passenger............some will like to run a
"wheel on a stick tricycle" and some will want to run a real sidecar.... w/passenger......give us the OPTION..... that is all we ask for..........very simple
to understand I would think....................................
PS. Insurance has nothing to do with it!!!!!
Bob,
I take exception with your blasphemous comments regarding the other racing bikes that are not passenger carrying while racing on the dirt or salt, calling my bike a "wheel on a stick tricycle" is demeaning and show's what you really know..it's called a "wheel on a stick sidecar" and us other 15 sidecar/wheel on a stick pilots would appreciate if you could get it right. :-D
See you in May? :wink:
J
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What is ant roadracing like? Seems to me they stay in line a lot. Could be like the Long Beach Grand Prix?
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if you want to carry a passenger on your sidecar go to the BUB meet----i remember a while back noonan invited anyone who wanted to be a passenger to come on out---there wasnt a long line -actually there wasnt a line at all --- willie buchta
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So sorry John N ......you are right I will not call them tricycles anymore......just "Wheel on a stick"
You are also right, Willie , that is why we race the BUB.............................................................................
but we would also like to race SCTA/BNI like we did prior to 1987 w/passenger.................................
PS. Insurance has nothing to do with it!!!!
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And i would like to hit the lottery----but hey it is what it is---willie buchta
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A wheel on a stick is what is accepted by SCTA as a sidecar and is a great way to get more points. I will re-visit a point that I made earlier on this thread; every other RACING disipline that accepts and races sidecars has a passenger involved. You are right Willie, it is what it is with the SCTA, unlike any other sidecar RACING class anywhere. As noted by the esteemed 1194 we are very greatful for national and international sactioning bodies like the AMA and FIM (BUB) who RACE sidecars that allow the true meaning of the discipline.
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My opinion on passengers Is, I think, known on this forum.
F.I.M. "sidecar" a.k.a. wheel on a stick.
(http://)(http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/7964/burnsandwright55.jpg)
By weslake (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/weslake) at 2009-04-17
SCTA sidecar (read room for a passenger)
(http://)(http://img206.imageshack.us/img206/1295/img0786.jpg)
By weslake (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/weslake), shot with Canon PowerShot A430 (http://profile.imageshack.us/camerabuy.php?model=Canon+PowerShot+A430&make=Canon) at 2009-04-10
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please post more pics of 7919 thanks willie buchta
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Larry,
Respectfully speaking, If Bob and I had your sidecar for a month and could change a few things( 90% turbo/engine stuff ) we would be running 200+ on it...with a passenger..if we took our "Little Red Machine" to Bonneville it would run 235+ :-o
Bob ran 193.711 as an average mile speed on a 1397cc engine with a little Nitrous one way several years ago..
Wheel on a "Steeeeeek" :wink:
John
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Hey John N......does the word "sandbagging" have any meaning to you???
One only has to run fast enough to beat the current record (club points are not our concern)
As far back as 1991 (I suspect before you knew about LSR) we ran 187+mph w/passenger with a old Kawa. KZ sidecar....................................................
For the past 30+ years I have promoted LSR for sidecars and not blowing a record out the window hopefully will bring others into the sport.
In fact for the last couple of years I have put
dollars out of my own pocket up for the sidecar class at the BUB hoping to again bring sidecar into landspeed racing. I have no doubt that with one of your motors my outstanding chassis
would run 200+mph.........but we will never know... will we......like Willie noted "it is what it is"
Respectfully speaking.............B.B....................
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Nortonist, your "sidecar" looks great.....you sure you want to have the sidecar wheel that far back?
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Interesting, Stan Back, you should mention the Long Beach Gran Prix..............our roadracing sidecars raced that event in conjunction with the open wheel cars.............in fact our own Larry C.
won that race going away......that event did wonders for our sport due to the media coverage it got...............................................................
PS. Sidecar passengers were used in that race and the event had insurance coverage..............
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Sand bagging at 218mph Pfttt :roll:
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"Sandbagging at 218mph" that is good John.........
However, knowing that you are great competitor
and have always been up to a challenge................
and due to the outstanding speeds and records you have run in past years at the BUB Trials
winning close to $20,000 of BUB's money..............
My challenge to you is to equal or even exceed
the dollar amount I have been donating for the sidecar class in past years. This would be a great gesture on your part in giving something back to the sport that has certainly been good to you.
PS. regarding the $20,000 ....correct me if I am
wrong..........................................................................
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Nortonist, your "sidecar" looks great.....you sure you want to have the sidecar wheel that far back?
The sidecar wheel is 10" ahead of the rear axle.
Willie, Did you get an e-mail I sent yesterday?
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Sorry Nortonist, 10 inches lead should be fine...
the picture showed it to be far less......................
I look forward to seeing it run.........Good luck.........
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nortonist i didnt get your e-mail willieworld@hotmail.com willie buchta
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Bob,
Yes you are wrong... :wink:
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John:
My PS. said "CORRECT me if I am wrong"...................
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On second thought.....................never mind.............
Have a fast and safe 2009............................................
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On second thought.....................never mind.............
Have a fast and safe 2009............................................
You too Bob.. :cheers:
J