Landracing Forum

El Mirage => El Mirage Rules Questions => Topic started by: willieworld on November 12, 2007, 05:26:56 PM

Title: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 12, 2007, 05:26:56 PM: At the last meet at El Mirage on Friday morning my friend, who was there as a guest, decided that after having some serious handling problems at Bonneville(we thought that we had found and fixed the problem),that he would test ride the bike on the lake north of the pits. After riding a considerable way away from the pits, he ran the bike up to about 80. Someone ran over to me and told me that he couldn't do that and he would be ejected from the lake and wouldn't be allowed to race. I told him that I had read the El Mirage procedures and that it says that your bike is not officially a race bike until you go through tech and pay. He said that he could show me where it said that in the procedures. I went and motioned for my friend to shut off his bike and we pushed it back into the pits and then I went back and asked the person that had told me that, to show me where it says that in the procedures. And he said that "It doesn't actually say that because a couple of years ago the printers left that part out and its never been put back in".When I got home and read my El Mirage procedures again and sure enough I was right. And the guy that told me that is full of it because on the front of my El Mirage procedures it says - revised: March 2007. So what gives??

Willie Buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: JackD on November 12, 2007, 05:51:44 PM: The area is controlled and policed by the BLM and subject to all the appropriate rules.
Running outside those limitations can bring a lot of rain to your parade.
I have done a number of magazine tests there and always with the appropriate permit , insurance, and other required safeguards.
El Mirage has the highest injury and death rate of any BLM controlled space and if you were to get hurt, it would reflect poorly on the permitted users.
A closed course competition vehicle is just that and you are covered with respect to liability insurance when you are running within the permitted boundaries and the appropriate rules.
If you hurt yourself or anybody else outside those restrictions and it compromised the ability of SCTA to get a permit, I might really give you some more problems as would a number of others.
I am really a pretty nice guy but with some really sharp edges.
GOT IT ?
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 12, 2007, 06:31:32 PM: #1 My friend had a HD roadking street bike - full dresser with fairing, saddlebags, registration, license and insurance and has nothing to do with the SCTA. El Mirage is a off-road vehicle park and you can ride anywhere you want, anytime you like.
#2 My friend is not a member of the SCTA or any club he was only a guest. It was Friday morning and tech hadn't even opened yet.
#3 Why don't they put it in the procedures then if that's the way they want it?
#4 Every time I go to El Mirage to race I go there on Thursday to test.
#5 I also am a nice guy, and as you, have some very sharp edges...
#6 If there is a rule I will abide by it gladly.
#7 Don't piss on my boot and tell me it's raining.

Willie Buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: isiahstites on November 12, 2007, 06:45:34 PM: I have heard it said many times at El Mirage that if it has numbers or placards with numbers it is not to be moved under its own power unless on the race course. They even mention it at rookie o which I assume all guests have to attend.

Scott
Title: Re: testing
Post by: bvillercr on November 12, 2007, 06:51:59 PM: This procedure was brought to my attention in the 90's, after we did some first and second gear squirts. I guess going over 150 wasn't such a good thing on a friday when there was no safety crew there or permission to do so?
Title: Re: testing
Post by: isiahstites on November 12, 2007, 06:54:58 PM: This is the last statment on the bottom of the ELMO procedures.

The BLM allows us to race at El Mirage because we are responsible people who respect the lakebed. It is imperative that each and every one of us polices our campsites and the surrounding areas if we are to continue with our chosen endeavor.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: ol38y on November 12, 2007, 06:55:42 PM: I'm sure there is more to the story but I thought testing was done on off weekends or days. :?

We also have to consider ourselves lucky, I think, SCTA is still allowed to have races at Elmo considering all the other racing venues that have been shut down in the desert. Like it or not some activities have to be minimized for the good of the sport.

Larry
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Stan Back on November 12, 2007, 06:56:48 PM: Willie --

I'm seeing a lot to all sides of this question.

If, as a "guest" you mean guest entrant, then it's not good to be speed testing because in case of an incident, it would reflect on you and me and the rest of the SCTA.

If he was just a street rider visiting our event, then we could all cop a plea that he was not one of us.

It doesn't have to be in the rule book or procedures to protect our group.

Nice meeting you Saturday and I sure like the looks of your bike.

Regards, Stan Back
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 12, 2007, 07:06:56 PM: nice meeting you to stan and agree with you and i would never do anything to cause problems at el mirage --if there is a rule i will abide by it gladly i have all this year --lets get in the rules this year then-- thanks willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: JackD on November 12, 2007, 07:12:59 PM: The BLM controls the area and the rules have been established by them from the beginning.
When the BLM Ranger writes you up, tell him you didn't know.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 12, 2007, 07:20:23 PM: Scott
This was on Friday morning and tech hadn't even opened yet and the rookie orientation was Friday at 4:00pm. it's something that should be well defined by a rule as on numerous occasions I went to El Mirage to test when it wasn't a raceday and I assumed when there wasn't an OFFICIAL MEET that El Mirage is an off-road vehicle park. Am I wrong??

Willie Buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: isiahstites on November 12, 2007, 07:26:11 PM: Quote from: willieworld on November 12, 2007, 07:20:23 PM
Scott
This was on Friday morning and tech hadn't even opened yet and the rookie orientation was Friday at 4:00pm. it's something that should be well defined by a rule as on numerous occasions I went to El Mirage to test when it wasn't a raceday and I assumed when there wasn't an OFFICIAL MEET that El Mirage is an off-road vehicle park. Am I wrong??

Willie Buchta

Willie I see your point and completely understand your side. I try to look at it from the other side as well. What would the BLM say if they saw your friend with you and your race bike and they assumed he was going to race. Knowing it was a race weekend they may try and make a strong case that he had involvement with the racers and the SCTA.

Are you wrong? I would say probably not, however you know how people mis-construe things.

Scott
Title: Re: testing
Post by: bvillercr on November 12, 2007, 07:35:59 PM: The SCTA used to set up cones so you could make a low speed warm up run at the north side of the pits. I believe it was 45 mph limit.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Dean Los Angeles on November 12, 2007, 07:42:17 PM: From El Mirage Procedures:
Quote
D. Warm Up Area
Due to insurance considerations, a warm-up area will no longer be available.

Head out to El Mirage tomorrow and the entire lake bed is open to you. I don't think there ever has been a speed limit on the lake bed.

On race days you will see motorcycles and ATV's doing 80 mph on the lake bed. That same lake bed isn't available to you. SCTA has all of it, not just the area inside the cones.

When the SCTA has a race, there is a speed limit, there is no warm up area, and you are going to be tossed out permanently if you don't think so. For November SCTA had the lake bed for three days, and that's midnight Thursday to midnight Sunday.

It's not fuzzy at all.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: bak189 on November 12, 2007, 08:29:50 PM: It all depends who you talk to...........I live approx. 20
miles from El Mirage (up in the mountains) and use ElMo for test runs...............Unloaded the trailer a couple months back
and here comes the "green truck" ....."what are you doing".........".taking some pictures of our racers".........".O.K., but remember there is a 55mph speed-limit on the lake"................PU left down the lake........I made my
"outlaw" run........................So who is right?????????

I am so BAD.........and will never do that again!!!!
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 12, 2007, 09:15:10 PM: I started this because I wanted to know because I didn't want to violate a rule. Somebody told me that my friend had and he was my guest and my responsibility. I had him shut off his bike and we pushed it back to my pit. And then I asked the person who told me this to show me in the El Mirage procedures. He said quote "The printer left that part out when it was printed two or three years ago". Obviously that was a lie because the last printing of the El Mirage procedures was in March 2007.Now somebody says there is a 55 mph speed limit and someone else says that the SCTA rents the whole entire lake bed from Thursday midnight to Sunday midnight for a two day event. Once I asked an official why they don't use caution tape down the return road like they do at Bonneville and I was told that although the SCTA leases a portion of the lake from the BLM,even so, they don't have exclusive rights and they can't put up any barriers other than orange cones. I seem to be getting alot of feedback from my question but I am not sure if any of it is true. Come on guys who has the true answer here? I would really like to know.
Willie Buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: isiahstites on November 12, 2007, 09:20:15 PM: Unfortunatley there seems to be some grey area............and the grey area won't go away until something is vilolated and then it will need to be written. Funny how rules books get larger with each passing year.

Scott
Title: Re: testing
Post by: desotoman on November 12, 2007, 09:47:16 PM: Quote from: bvillercr on November 12, 2007, 07:35:59 PM
The SCTA used to set up cones so you could make a low speed warm up run at the north side of the pits. I believe it was 45 mph limit.

No more. Many Racers abused that area. Some even went to the hospital on some controlled warm up runs.

Tom G.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Dean Los Angeles on November 12, 2007, 09:57:32 PM: The true answer? That's easy. What you need to understand is that SCTA is made up of some really wonderful guys that turn into vicious dogs when safety or rules violations come in front of them.

Ask Noonan. He explored a tiny little gray area and got hammered.

SCTA has been around for a loooong time because these guys are hard nosed.

If you want to try a warm up on race day, don't be surprised when a lifetime ban comes your way. Is it worth it?

Any old timers want to dispute this?
Title: Re: testing
Post by: ol38y on November 12, 2007, 10:40:39 PM: Willie, what is it you don't understand? You say you don't want to violate a rule. But, you were told Fri. you did. As i read it, every post here has told you ,very diplomaticly, you can't do this anymore. Accept it.... This is not the wild west anymore. You cannot go out and do whatever you want regardless of the consequesces to yourself or others. We are very lucky to be able to race at this venue still. There are very stringent regulations that have to be abided by. The regulations change regularly I'm sure. Get over it. You got busted for something you were not aware of. No big deal. You were told not to do it again. So now you know. Don't do it again. What's the problem???????? Oh, I know, you want to see it in print.
Larry
Title: Re: testing
Post by: jl222 on November 12, 2007, 11:05:35 PM: What if you have a off road vehicle sticker and the day before race day? We do.
JL222
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 12, 2007, 11:56:13 PM: dean for the third time it wasnt on race day it was on early friday morning willie
Title: Re: testing
Post by: bak189 on November 13, 2007, 12:44:30 AM: There are a lot of rules and regulations enforced
by SCTA/BNI that are not in print............................
however, if you want to race their program, be it
ElMo or Bonneville, you best do as they say..........
if not take up bowling............SCTA/BNI have been at this LSR sport a long time, and on the whole they do a outstanding job............in my 28 years as a BNI member, I have been told "don't do that again" many, many times........yes, I have protested
and questioned many of their rules and decisions
.................but in the end you pay your money and you do as they say......the same with BUB.NHRA,
just ask NASCAR's #20 Tony Steward........................
Title: Re: testing
Post by: desotoman on November 13, 2007, 01:13:33 AM: Quote from: willieworld on November 12, 2007, 11:56:13 PM
dean for the third time it wasnt on race day it was on early friday morning willie

If you are at El Mirage on the Friday before a two day meet, running flat out testing your vehicle you are guilty. If everyone is gathering for a race the next day, putting trailers out, cones out, etc. I don't care what time it is on Friday, you should not be racing around period. If I were a BLM Ranger, and saw your friend doing speed trials by himself on Friday morning I would associate it with the organization putting on the race the next day. Especially if he was in close proximity to where the races are held. It does not matter if you have a green sticker or a licenced vehicle. Use some common sense, and don't attract attention by doing something stupid. If you want to test on the lake bed do it on a day when SCTA is not around and very visible. Just because it is not in writing in the El Mirage proceedures, doesn't make it OK to do. If people keep up this kind of abuse when the SCTA is present we will be lucky to have a place to race in the future. The days of doing what ever one wants on the lake bed when SCTA is present are over. Think about the consequences of your actions before you act, if people did, we would still have a warm up area.

Tom G.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Nortonist 592 on November 13, 2007, 01:32:56 AM: You didn't break any written rule or law. You just did something that isn't done for a number of reasons. Getting tarred with the one brush is one reason. Its kind of like if you're at a fancy restaurant you don't rip off a big belch at the table. Theres no written law to say you can't. You just don't. No big deal.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 13, 2007, 02:45:39 AM: desotoman for the third time i wasnt riding the bike in queston a friend of mine was he came there to race as a guest all i wanted to know is if there was a written rule against what he did and i dont think that there is - i do understand that i am lucky to have a place to go as fast as i can-next year my bike number will be 9 i worked very hard for that and dont want to loose my chance to run at el mirage and will follow any written rule to the letter -but wouldnt belong to any club or orgianization or live in any country that had secret unwritten rules that were arbitrarily enforced and i dont think that anyone in there right mind would either -i think they call that a dictatorship-- i have tested at el mirage but never on race or on tech day if there is a written rule against it i cant find it that is why i asked about it to start with --written rules are fair for everyone unwritten rules that are arbitrarily enforced are unfair to everyone --thanks willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Stainless1 on November 13, 2007, 09:01:32 AM: Quote from: willieworld on November 13, 2007, 02:45:39 AM
desotoman for the third time i wasnt riding the bike in queston a friend of mine was he came there to race as a guest all i wanted to know is if there was a written rule against what he did and i dont think that there is - i do understand that i am lucky to have a place to go as fast as i can-next year my bike number will be 9 i worked very hard for that and dont want to loose my chance to run at el mirage and will follow any written rule to the letter -but wouldnt belong to any club or orgianization or live in any country that had secret unwritten rules that were arbitrarily enforced and i dont think that anyone in there right mind would either -i think they call that a dictatorship-- i have tested at el mirage but never on race or on tech day if there is a written rule against it i cant find it that is why i asked about it to start with --written rules are fair for everyone unwritten rules that are arbitrarily enforced are unfair to everyone --thanks willie buchta

Willie, the SCTA is a dictatorship, not a representative government. If you want to play with their ball, they get to make the rules. Yes they have rules that you are supposed to know if you have been in the organization for 30 years, and if you are new, you may learn them the hard way. Oh, if you run in the right circles, the rules may not apply. Always been that way so now you know you are already a member of one of those organizations, just have fun and learn the unwritten rules as you go.
Congratulations on the new number, see you next year and keep posting that build.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Dean Los Angeles on November 13, 2007, 09:58:09 AM: The fact that you are still arguing shows a lack of common sense. I already quoted the rule that says there is no warm up area. No, it's not race day, but it's still a racing venue on Friday. All day.

Making fuzzy distinctions about it not being race day, your buddy isn't associated, etc, isn't going to cut it. Accidents over the years got us to this point.

If you want to argue gray points about vehicle rules, knock yourself out.

If you want to argue safety rules, don't plan on a long career.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: bak189 on November 13, 2007, 11:17:04 AM: Willie.....we are all sorry to hear you won't be racing your #9 in 2008..............You indicated you would not belong to a club run by dictators.......
so that means you will not renew your SCTA/BNI
membership for next year........................................

As I noted before......you pay your money.......and
do as they say.........or take up bowling...................
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Dynoroom on November 13, 2007, 11:52:52 AM: Quote from: bak189 on November 13, 2007, 11:17:04 AM
As I noted before......you pay your money.......and
do as they say.........or take up bowling...................

Just like every other racing organization I've been involved with. NHRA, NASCAR, SCCA, IMSA, APBA....
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Old Gringo on November 13, 2007, 02:04:21 PM: Quote from: bak189 on November 12, 2007, 08:29:50 PM
It all depends who you talk to...........I live approx. 20
miles from El Mirage (up in the mountains) and use ElMo for test runs...............Unloaded the trailer a couple months back
and here comes the "green truck" ....."what are you doing".........".taking some pictures of our racers".........".O.K., but remember there is a 55mph speed-limit on the lake"................PU left down the lake........I made my
"outlaw" run........................So who is right?????????

I am so BAD.........and will never do that again!!!!

Here is a page from the B L M site. Hope this helps.
El Mirage Lakebed
The lakebed is a flat playa formed in an undrained basin. Silt and clay are deposited into this basin during periods of heavy rain. When the "lake" dries, a hard pan dry lakebed is left.

This hard, smooth surface is ideal for the unique activities conducted at El Mirage. These include ultra-light aircraft and gyrocopter flying, model rocketry, remote control airplane flying, landsailing and straight track racing. Many private pilots land on the lakebed to spend the day. The surface character has attracted the interest of many filming companies. Several major movies have scenes filmed here.

There is no speed limit on the open lakebed, but vehicle operators are responsible for their own safety, OHV rules and regulations, and knowing what is going on around them. The maximum speed limit is 15 miles per hour within 50 feet of camps and staging areas.

During permitted events, special speed limits and traffic restrictions are posted. Please watch for these events. To maintain a smooth surface, the lakebed is closed when wet or muddy. The California Highway Patrol, San Bernardino County Sheriff, and BLM Rangers patrol the area to encourage safe use by visitors.

Camping is permitted on the lakebed, but no more than 100 feet from the edge. This keeps the smooth center section of the lakebed clear for night riders.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: promachine on November 13, 2007, 02:39:00 PM: Lots of people test at Elmo during the week. Been going on for years. Most
people know about this. I try to run about the crack of dawn, bring plenty
of freinds with radio`s, and set a cone out about half mile. Even at 6 am there
will be people out there so we drive around and tell them to keep their eyes
open. Tested Fri. morning once before a two day race but got done and had the
car back in the box before anybody showed up. I allways assumed this was ok to do. Willie`s buddy just did not pick the right time to shake it down, to many
people around. I allways thought testing before a race was a good idea.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: dwarner on November 13, 2007, 02:48:44 PM: We stopped pre-event test runs when the lakebed became crowded. Didn't want to run the risk of hitting some one while running the race car.

DW
Title: Re: testing
Post by: John@JE Pistons on November 13, 2007, 02:57:03 PM: A few times I showed up at the lakebed with one of my street bikes and took it for a ride and a day later they had some time trials (fancy that) so I entered and ended up with a Red brass tag with my name and speed..cute little thing I tell ya. :mrgreen:

J
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Super Kaz on November 14, 2007, 12:14:26 AM: Quote from: John@JE Pistons on November 13, 2007, 02:57:03 PM
A few times I showed up at the lakebed with one of my street bikes and took it for a ride and a day later they had some time trials (fancy that) so I entered and ended up with a Red brass tag with my name and speed..cute little thing I tell ya. :mrgreen:

J

Your Modesty Kills Worlds Fastest :evil:! How can I get me one of those Red BrassTags with my name and speed :??
Title: Re: testing
Post by: racin jason on November 14, 2007, 01:12:46 AM: Your Modesty Kills Worlds Fastest :evil:! How can I get me one of those Red BrassTags with my name and speed :??
[/quote]

You have a better chance of a red tag if you get out and race Kaz!! :-D
Hitch hike, beg, borrow , steal, sell an organ just get out here Kaz. We miss you!
Title: Re: testing
Post by: John Noonan on November 14, 2007, 01:31:13 AM: Quote from: racin jason on November 14, 2007, 01:12:46 AM

Your Modesty Kills Worlds Fastest :evil:! How can I get me one of those Red BrassTags with my name and speed :??

You have a better chance of a red tag if you get out and race Kaz!! :-D
Hitch hike, beg, borrow , steal, sell an organ just get out here Kaz. We miss you!
[/quote]

Jason,

Better sell him one of yours to ride... :mrgreen:
Title: Re: testing
Post by: 1212FBGS on November 14, 2007, 03:21:20 AM: i think there was someone who totaled a busa last year doing some private testing... heard they broke some bones and spent a few days in the hospital....recently there was some drift cars doing there verson of testing out there..... some of you probably noticed the tore up areas... i was told by an old timer that the damage will take 5 years to repair.... its a general concenses that as the lakebead becomes more popular, and funding for BLM patrols dwindle, our days of use are numbered....
kent
Title: Re: testing
Post by: JackD on November 14, 2007, 08:43:43 AM: TIME TO VOTE

Can we see a show of hands ? :roll:
Title: Re: testing
Post by: 1212FBGS on November 14, 2007, 12:48:48 PM: vote for what? where ya been the last couple of days old man....
kent
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 14, 2007, 02:29:17 PM: thanks old gringo looks like someone finally posted that knew the answer --i will continue to ride my bike at el mirage --i hope all that is past us --now about this dictator thing -i was voted into the gear grinders-we just voted for new officers -i went to a rules committe meeting at el mirage where there was an open discussion and voting --anyone can submit a rule change form-- doesnt sound like a dictorship to me --yes there are some things i dont like and i will work to change this next year-- over all though i am very proud to belong to a great group of people i dont care what club you are in --i think we are all in the GO AS FAST AS YOU CAN CLUB ---------- thanks everyone for a great first year willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Dynoroom on November 14, 2007, 03:45:15 PM: Yuck.... Gear Grinders.... :-P

Kidding.... :-D
Title: Re: testing
Post by: JackD on November 14, 2007, 04:42:52 PM: If you are suggesting the first person did not know the answer, I suggest you didn't want to hear it. :roll:

OBTW: I saw somebody with a BLACK timing tag once.
What are they for ? :wink:
Title: Re: testing
Post by: John@JE Pistons on November 14, 2007, 04:47:13 PM: Quote from: JackD on November 14, 2007, 04:42:52 PM
If you are suggesting the first person did not know the answer, I suggest you didn't want to hear it. :roll:

OBTW: I saw somebody with a BLACK timing tag once.
What are they for ? :wink:

Melting down for the scrap value I would assume... :-D
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 14, 2007, 06:08:14 PM: im not suggesting anything
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 14, 2007, 06:22:44 PM: when i discovered this forum i thought what a great place-- a place where i can ask a question and draw from all of the hundreds of years of experience that you all have --imagine all the wisdom of all land speed racing right here on my computer--to bad willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Stan Back on November 14, 2007, 06:37:48 PM: What are the blue ones?
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Nortonist 592 on November 14, 2007, 06:42:57 PM: Willie, Do you think that if we were really wise we'd be hauling up tp El Mirage in the middle of July, frying our butts, suckin' dust, breaking parts and saying "Man this is great!"? We ain't wise and it is great!!
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Dean Los Angeles on November 14, 2007, 09:13:27 PM: Willie! I'm all for ya, but you are just diggin a hole.

Quote
If you are suggesting the first person did not know the answer, I suggest you didn't want to hear it.
And then you posted:
Quote
im not suggesting anything

If that's the case, you posted:

Quote
thanks old gringo looks like someone finally posted that knew the answer

Funny, old gringo posted about BLM rules, and your buddy violated SCTA rules. In particular, and for the second time.
"D. Warm Up Area
Due to insurance considerations, a warm-up area will no longer be available."

I know, you're going to argue that Friday doesn't count, or Friday early doesn't count even though SCTA has been on the lake bed since at least Thursday. Or that you haven't been inspected and aren't a race vehicle. All of this counts for nothing. It isn't safe, it won't be allowed, and since there has been a warning, the next time is asking for real trouble.

How do I know this? I was there when the club voted on Noonan's misadventure, which old naïve newby me thought was no big deal. I thought maybe dump his points for that race, make him skip a race, then BOOM I get a taste for the school of hard knocks. Ask him.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 14, 2007, 10:31:03 PM: dean i dont think you get it so i will keep it simple
1 i wasnt rideing my race bike on friday
2 my friend isnt a member of anything he can ride his bike anywhere at anytime at el mirage --the same as i do my pit bike
3 he didnt know any better he only raced 1 time before at bub this year and you do not have to tow your bike there--he knows now
4 i will continue to test there although not on friday saturday or sunday
5 enough is enough lets move onto something important
6 we have 5 months here lets learn from each other and all run faster next year -- o yes 1 more thing if i call you a name i will do it to your face not on the computer thank you for all of your imput positive and negetive willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 14, 2007, 11:34:47 PM: dean even though john isnt in my club i like him a lot i just wish he would spell my name right--dean while i have you on the line i am intrested in buying the front steering off of the long low bike(sorry i dont remember) thanks let me know willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: jimmy six on November 15, 2007, 01:01:26 PM: Blue for Bonneville, no record....
Title: Re: testing
Post by: jimmy six on November 15, 2007, 01:19:06 PM: As much as Willie is trying to find out, it will just take time until the word "lawyer" is used and we will not race again. 10 years ago we did not even have ELMO procedures and so many new folks came into this "sport" and something needed to be done. At that time I had over 20 years and didn't know the secret hand shake. (still don't), but the old guys seemed to know who the hippy was with the illegal roadster. Try to hide testing it.

I'm sure more will be added to the ELMO procedure list but most new members don't seem to get copies of it before they join a club. Too me all clubs should pass these out during the time prospective members are coming to meetings. Wait a minute one club only one meeting a year; well that didn't work.

Any of you may have watched last weeks 60 minutes all of todays generation are "special" and no one has ever told them NO. They will be the guys I'll be training to replace me in my job but they will leave before they know how to be safe. But they will move on to the next job and say how smart they are with highvoltage and probably go on to kill someone.

As a passing note. If we invite a "guest" up to run we should be responsible enough to let them know everything possible. I watched 2 guys on what appeared to be stock older BMW 2-wheelers ride by in the "rookie" line underpower (albeit slow) yes they had number placards obviously they did not have the word. Probably rode back after their runs too. JD
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Super Kaz on November 15, 2007, 01:25:27 PM: Quote from: John Noonan on November 14, 2007, 01:31:13 AM
Quote from: racin jason on November 14, 2007, 01:12:46 AM

Your Modesty Kills Worlds Fastest :evil:! How can I get me one of those Red BrassTags with my name and speed :??

You have a better chance of a red tag if you get out and race Kaz!! :-D
Hitch hike, beg, borrow , steal, sell an organ just get out here Kaz. We miss you!

Jason,

Better sell him one of yours to ride... :mrgreen:
[/quote]

Thats Sweet :-o?
Got any SPARES :oops:?
Heck I don't care what it is as long as it Fast :wink!
I miss You guy's too :lol:
Title: Re: testing
Post by: MattS on November 15, 2007, 01:53:04 PM: Quote from: jimmy six on November 15, 2007, 01:19:06 PM
As a passing note. If we invite a "guest" up to run we should be responsible enough to let them know everything possible. I watched 2 guys on what appeared to be stock older BMW 2-wheelers ride by in the "rookie" line underpower (albeit slow) yes they had number placards obviously they did not have the word. Probably rode back after their runs too. JD

Those bikes, actually their support equipment, didn't pass tech. My friend saw that & almost flipped, but then realized they were just watching their friend run. But they shouldn't bring their bikes into the staging line. That is another problem, people riding through the staging area. I know it is spectator friendly, but it's a zoo in there.

Matt
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 15, 2007, 02:24:13 PM: if they showed you the secret handshake it wouldnt be a secret any more --if they wrote down the unwritten rules they wouldnt be unwritten any more willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: JackD on November 15, 2007, 02:57:58 PM: Liability and the conditions of insurance allow SCTA to set up at EM only on the 1 day prior and do not cover them for any other activities.
If the SCTA published absolute rules about activity outside that area they would burden themselves with an uninsurable liability that day.
They can strongly suggest standards of conduct outside that area for their people, but are limited to that.
Violate the unpublished rules and you risk the unpublished sanctions that you are cruising for.
Not everybody knows all that but common sense has taught most of them to act appropriately.
The BLM on the other hand has published regulations for every activity and will often warn you just like any other policing agency.
When push comes to shove, ignorance is no excuse under the law.

" If you spend the whole time looking down and kicking the dirt, don't be surprised when it rains." (me)
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Dean Los Angeles on November 15, 2007, 04:16:47 PM: Quote
Not everybody knows all that but common sense has taught most of them to act appropriately.

Common

Sense

Two words that so many people lack, don't understand, ignore . . .

Quote
From Widipedia:
Common sense, based on a strict construction of the term, is what people in common would agree: that which they "sense" in common as their common natural understanding. Some use the phrase to refer to beliefs or propositions that in their opinion they consider would in most people's experience be prudent and of sound judgment, without dependence upon esoteric knowledge or study or research, but based upon what is believed to be knowledge held by people "in common", so: the knowledge and experience most people have, or are believed to have by the person using the term.

Yeah, hey, I get it.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 15, 2007, 05:16:48 PM: hey i get it to guys you have my word -now i need to make my bike go faster any any ideas or should i post somewere else (this site is for rules) thanks willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: JackD on November 15, 2007, 05:52:44 PM: Well I am glad we all got past that and as far as speed and performance in LSR is concerned, you are in the right spot. :wink:
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Dean Los Angeles on November 15, 2007, 06:02:51 PM: Hey Willie! Sorry! We tend to drift off to general rants instead of specific things. The common sense rant covers bazillions of people. You need kind of a thick skin here. Jack already owns several pounds of my hide. :-D
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on November 15, 2007, 06:39:26 PM: not a problem--now about that front suspension what do you want for it thanks willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: Super Kaz on December 06, 2007, 09:32:15 AM: Quote from: willieworld on November 15, 2007, 06:39:26 PM
not a problem--now about that front suspension what do you want for it thanks willie buchta
Add More Power :evil:!Hey at Least you got to race few times this year"Ya My Stuff's Broke :oops:"!Talk about WITHDRAWLS :cry:.....
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on December 06, 2007, 12:24:41 PM: Quote from: Dean Los Angeles on November 15, 2007, 06:02:51 PM
Hey Willie! Sorry! We tend to drift off to general rants instead of specific things. The common sense rant covers bazillions of people. You need kind of a thick skin here. Jack already owns several pounds of my hide. :-D

no kidding --5 pages about testing then i ask does any one know how i can make more horsepower ---then nothing ---hmmmmmmm---guess i didnt know the password---- willie buchta

p s i know how to make horsepower just trying to start some intresting conversation willie buchta
Title: Re: testing - and making horsepower
Post by: V8Pinto on December 06, 2007, 02:33:17 PM: Most endearing thing I saw at Speedweek 2007 (among all the endearing things). Back from a run, tired and hungry and Sheri asks me "you and Krystal want something to eat honey?". As she goes into the ice chest next to Willie's bike and digs around pulling out ham, mayo and other goodies - then a familiar looking blue bottle with an orange label floats to the top.

hahahaha now I know how Willie makes that horsepower....he hides the nitrous in his sandwiches!
Title: Re: testing
Post by: John@JE Pistons on December 06, 2007, 03:05:53 PM: Dang,

I did not know Willie was there for speedweek. 8-)

Oh well.

Willie did great this year!

J
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on December 06, 2007, 04:29:48 PM: thanks guys -- it was a little hot for me at speedweek i tried to do all my runs early in the morning and be back in town in the cool by 10-- world finals was perfect weather for me --in between runs i tried to visit as many people as possible-- sheri and i wouldnt have missed it --told everyone if they had a emergency and needed my help they would have to wait until after speedweek -- will be there next year with my old bike and sheris new bike 500cc sc-pg in the build diarys under not just another wheel on a stick --yes it is a b-last willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: panic on December 06, 2007, 07:47:29 PM: "Common sense"

What it is: that virtue possessed and displayed by people you like when they agree with you, regardless of any law, rule, logic or precedent.

What it is not: absence of same, as displayed by people you do not like when they attempt to assert their position through use of law, rule, logic or precedent that clearly favors their argument.

This can all be easily condensed. The "officials" subscribe to the following belief (popular among law enforcement and other value-deficient groups) as to inter-personal relationships and authority:

Me parent, you child. Do it because I said so.
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on December 06, 2007, 08:00:38 PM: im not that good at writing thoughts down but if i were i would have written what panic just did
right on panic willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on December 06, 2007, 08:05:21 PM: shane nos sandwitches and nitro coffee makes me forget about the dust and heat willie buchta
Title: Re: testing
Post by: panic on December 06, 2007, 11:30:42 PM: As an aside to any transactional analysis fans out there - yes, I meant "parent" rather than "adult".
Title: Re: testing
Post by: willieworld on December 06, 2007, 11:40:33 PM: yes dust shane and i race together at el mirage willie buchta