Landracing Forum
Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => SCTA Rule Questions => Topic started by: Clay Pitkin on October 11, 2007, 08:13:31 PM
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Hi there,
I know, I need to read the rule book, actually I need to purchase it for this year, however questions about 5 point harness and helmets
In 2008, we will be running again after a set back. I have heard that the helmets now have to be snell 2005 certified, is this true?
Also, as far as 5 point harness/ seatbelts, are we required to update these, meaning is their dates on these seatbelts?
We passed tech in 2006 with no problems at all.
TIA
Clay
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Helmets yes
Seat belts... what year are they and probably yes.
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New leathers this year. A new helmet next year, mine is only 3 years old but has a 2000 cert. What's next? BUB is starting to sound better and better. :x
Hopefully by the time I go to partial streamlining they will have the rules figured out.
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Helmets age, and that alone is a good reason to replace one that's been around. However, the SCTA rules that stipulate Snell sticker date have generally allowed up to ten years life for a helmet. That is -- a helmet with M2000 inside will probably be acceptable 'til the M2010 stickers are out, and since that'll be in another three years -- you don't NEED to buy a new one just yet.
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I thought it stated in the rule book that you needed a 2005 approoved rating, that is why we bought new helmets.
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Nope. Page 22, rule 3.A.2 says SA 2000 or M2000 or later -- that's the car rule. For bikes it's on p. 102, rule 7.C.2, M2000 or later. The page references are to the current ('07) rulebook.
But boyoboy, watch me open a can of worms here: The car rule says the sticker must be visible. As far as I know, the sticker that we insist on seeing is inside the helmet, under the liner. Visible, but only after some digging, and certainly not when the helmet is being worn on the racer's head.
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My helmet was older than I thought.... OOOppss.
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Helmets age, and that alone is a good reason to replace one that's been around. However, the SCTA rules that stipulate Snell sticker date have generally allowed up to ten years life for a helmet. That is -- a helmet with M2000 inside will probably be acceptable 'til the M2010 stickers are out, and since that'll be in another three years -- you don't NEED to buy a new one just yet.
No kiddin, I realize helmets age. As I said mine is only 3 years old. One year before the 2005 cert. came out and it's always been garaged when not in use... :-D From what I've heard 10 years is a common age limit with other sanctioning bodies. But, while I was in Tech at Speed Week I did hear a comment that this was the last year 2000 certs would be accepted... So, I guess we'll have to wait till the 2008 rulebooks come out cuz we won't have any input on this ruling either.
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the life span of a helmet might be ten years...don't know.
but remember that the MXXXX represents a change/improvement in the performance test the helmet must pass to get the sticker.
i guess you could technically have a two or three year old helmet that is an excellent example of nearly 10 year old technology.
just a thought........
Mark
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"...that this was the last year 2000 certs would be accepted." If you heard it -- you didn't hear it from someone that knows what he's talking about, I betcha. I hope so -- both of our helmets are M2000. Yes, I know that helmets are cheaper than head injuries, but with the fancy paint job on Nancy's helmet -- I'm not ready to go to a new noggin protector if I don't have to.
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Slim --
Our 2000 Snell-approved helmet has its sticker buried under a bunch of stuff and every year I'm worried that when they inspect it, it will fall off. Not yet. But they do yearly put an approved sticker on the outside of the helmet that it's been inspected, so you only have to expose it once a meet.
Stan
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R U saying, Stan, that all of us- at least yer friends, not those who broke yer BNI records, should start a GET STAN A NEW HELMET crusade?
It's all I can do on my retiremnt income to send Landracing a twenty every now and then!.
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I helped Bill Taylor at the starting line during WF. Make sure the helmet fits. We want the helmet and belts tight! I don't want to be able to hook my finger under the helmet chin strap. With the strap that tight I don't want to be able to wiggle the helmet on your head. Watch out for the "D" rings; some are very thin. Be cautious of the motocross, parrot beak style design. When you put the collar on with this style helmet it often raises your head up to the point that you can't see down the course. This is not good! And speaking of belts- adjust them before you present the car to run. Have the same person help you every run. The lap belt wants to be straight across with the crotch straps and shoulder straps tight. This is not your girl friend tight; this is the tight that the starters put on when they are helping you have a safe run. It is ok to leave the shoulder belts a little loose and let the starters do the final safety pull down.
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The rule book has been the same for years and years. Belts, five and Helmets, ten. It is unfortunate if you bought on a short year on your helmet but the rules have always been the same since I started in 1975. I buy on the year to make 10. Snell usually comes in helmets one year after the new sticker. ie: the 2001 helmet will have the 2000 sticker and the 2006 helmets will have the 2005. The 2010 will probably be on the 2011's. Yes they are hard to find on some brands.
Always check with the seller on the date before purchasing. These are the reasons "new" helmets are sold cheaper. the Snell date maybe 4 years old even tho the helmet is new. I have sold lots of helmets and belts at swap meets all all of them looked new.
As an inspector I have seen 2 year old belts that were never cleaned. Salt has rusted metal and I write in they need new belts. I don't care what the year is. Some people do not take care of their safety gear. One "seller of rides" car was a piece of "s--t" that looked like it was never touched from August to October. I just get the Chief inspector and look to others to do.
Steve is right on with his discription of getteing ready...Have the same person each time. Good Luck
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Well, I don't plan to use my helmet for 10 years. In fact, Snell recomends replacing your helmet every 5 years. I do replace my helmets in the 5 year range. To that point, they do not inspect or regulate design or technolegy. They basically only drop things on them to see how they respond, good or bad. Notice I said basically, I know there is more involved. As with you Slim, I don't look forward to replacing my helmet at this time either. If it ever hits the salt or the dirt I will, but not at this time. As to who I heard the comment from, he has been the reason for another very heated PS topic here as well.
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We do NHRA and AHRA racing and we will be ready. The LSR people seem to be more relaxed on saftey.
SteveD
in Houston TX
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We do NHRA and AHRA racing and we will be ready. The LSR people seem to be more relaxed on saftey.
SteveD
in Houston TX
What makes you say that??
Sum
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I used to race NHRA, after they teched the car, they could care less is you had your seat belts on and tightened. They were more concerned that you had your windows up. The starters at the salt, are a lot more concerned about your safety than the boys at the NHRA events, even a national event.
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Your take on "relaxed" seems a little confused, and is not a good place to start.
Each organization has it's own requirements that are dictated by the conditions.
AHRA is really relaxed because they have been dead for years. :wink:
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We do NHRA and AHRA racing and we will be ready. The LSR people seem to be more relaxed on saftey.
SteveD
in Houston TX
I have to question if you have ever been to a LSR event. I have some drag racing back ground and have never seen the attention to safty that SCTA has. All you have to do is look at the window nets on TF Funnycar or Pro Stock to see that they probably don't do alot. Also you never see a drag racing official checking to see if you are straped in the car correctly.
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Quick question fer ya. I got a Snell M2005 helmet at the beginning of this year and at the first Maxton meet the tech guy was making a big deal that it was an 'M' helmet and not an 'A' helmet. Seems most people I talk to have 'M' helmets and the racing gear companies push them and even design them for the car guys. So, what gives? Do you think the 'A' helmets are that much better?
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It is my understanding that the SA, Special Application, helmets are made to different standards than the M, Motorcycle, helmet. These differences include Nomex lining and crush standards among other specifics.
Jack?
DW
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Dan you are right about them being different for those reasons and others. Also some of the newer car helmets have a air pouch built in to lift the helmet off gently with a air pump when you are unconscious without damaging anything in the neck or spine. It was mandated by some of the professional series.
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The testing from Snell is very much the same for both SA and M .
The MC lid has an additional test it must pass that simulates a puncture from sharp object like you might hit on contact with a guard rail or metal edge on yours or another vehicle.
The tight fitting fire skirt got manufacturers in trouble when after a crash, the driver would upchuck and the fluid could not escape and went into the lungs.
The flat back that was so aero revolutionary for awhile, was found to contribute to neck trauma when it caused the head motion to accelerate as it turned in some crashes.
It was designed and patented by an SCTA racer.
Snell is not the only good standard and all of them learn as they go as does SCTA. :wink:
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I was told at speedweek that a M helmet was acceptable in cars, but the A helmet was not acceptable for bikes. Of course it seems a lot easier to find the M, lots of bike shops everywhere...
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SCTA has it appropriately covered in their rules but clarification from Snell and consistency in inspection will improve the result.
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I believe that the SA helmet as used in cars does not the same "roll off" standard as the M. That is the reason M helmets can go both ways.(California reference here)
DW
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With the SCTA required fire retardant head sock, the M is a good choice for most applications in part because the selection and pricing is more competitive with simular materials and standards.
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:-D