Landracing Forum
Bonneville Motorcycle Speed Trials => Bville Motorcycle Speed Trials General Chat => Topic started by: Mr. Aris on April 19, 2006, 01:31:48 AM
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Hello Everyone,
I'm a complete newbie to LSR, and I was hoping to start this year. My background is in motorcycle drag racing. I would like to attend the BUB race this year. I need to know what I need to do to my bike to pass tech.
1. Has the 2006 rulebook been released yet?
2. If so, can someone point me in the direction where I can pick one up?
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Look here for Bub's rules.
http://www.speedtrialsbybub.com/2006_event/rules-06.html
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Mr. Aris, hunh? The Greek name for the god of war, hey? This is gonna be interesting.
Okay, back to land speed stuff. Welcome to the club. If you've been lurking and reading our stuff for a while you already know that we're straight-arrow serious, no goofing around is tolerated. We also like chasing records and building bikes (and car guys like building cars, but they're another breed).
Jonathon's already sent you information on Bub's, so that's covered. I'll suggest that you find a way to visit one or more of the lsr meets -- whether El Mirage, sooner, or at the Salt -- this August -- before you go to Bub's. You'll get a chance to shoot the breeze with some folks that have already succumbed to land speed racing.
If you're at SpeedWeek, plan plenty of time to stroll through the pits and visit with us and the others that are there. It's about the best way to learn how we deal with this afflication.
Welcome.
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Crap -- I forgot your question about the rulebook. You can order them on the USFRA website (www.saltflats.com) or the SCTA website (www.scta-bni.org). If you want a slightly different set of rules -- if for no other reason than to see what the other sanctioning organisation expects for bikes -- go to www.ecta-lsr.com and go about getting one of those rulebooks, too.
While you're at it, don't hesitate to join one or more of the groups (keeping in mind that membership is required if you're goinng to participate at one of their events). For the Bub's meet you'll need to join the American Motorcyclist Assassination. Learn more about Bub's at the basic address: www.speedtrialsbybub.com
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Mr. Aris
Jack Costello is a land speed racer from your area, he has been doing it since he was a 60s hippie from the bay area. You might contact him for any helt. BTW he is a car guy and messeds with bikes as well.
Welcome to the straight line racers.
:shock: :shock:
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Mr. Aris, hunh? The Greek name for the god of war, hey? This is gonna be interesting.
Just a quick reply to this. My name really is Aris. I travel to Japan a lot for business, and they always call me Mr. Aris over there. So, the nickname just stuck. :)
Thanks for the advice guys. I'll check into all of the sanctioning bodies.
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Mr. Aris
Jack Costello is a land speed racer from your area, he has been doing it since he was a 60s hippie from the bay area. You might contact him for any helt. BTW he is a car guy and messeds with bikes as well.
Welcome to the straight line racers.
:shock: :shock:
Thanks for the lead. I'll see if I can get a hold of him. I think that we may already have a mutual acquaintance. It's a really small world here in Silicon Valley. :D
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Hey! You didn't say what you are going to run. Fill us in so we can help.
(Not to mention we gossipy types just can't stand a mystery.)
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My bad. I forgot to mention it. My bike is a 2001 Kawasaki ZX-12. I don't think I'll be competitive in the 1350 class, but that appears to be the only one I can play in. I just want to go out and see what I can do. If the bug hits in the process, then so be it.
More questions:
1. Considering the fact that my bike is so fast, will I need to get a license before running the 'run what ya brung' event?
2. Do you get a time/speed slip after running the 'run what ya brung' event?
3. Someone told me that I need a crew member to pick me up at the other end of the course, and I'm not allowed to ride a race vehicle (my bike) back to my pit area. Is this true? Do I need to drag someone to the salt with me?
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At the BUB event in the past couple of years we have been allowed to ride our bikes back after making a speed-run......for SCTA/BNI you CAN NOT ride your bike back....so you need someone with a truck and/or trailer. (why I do not know....only the OFFICIALS in their wisdom know why) Check the BUB-site and/or contact Delvene
Manning for more information
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sweet! It makes it a lot easier for me if I don't have to find a crew person to drive 14 hours each way with me. I'll go shoot an e-mail to the BUB people just to make sure.
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The BUB Run Watcha Brung rules say:
Riding in the pit area or return roads is prohibited and subject to disqualification.
So if they enforce the rule, you have three choices:
1. Drag a buddy along.
2. Draft a buddy from the pits. (The offer of a free beer after the races helps.) Getting somebody to drive down to the other end isn't that hard to do.
3. Take a pit bike. Drive down to the other end with the pit bike in the back and drop off the pit bike. Drive back to start. Park truck, make speed run. Park race bike, hop on pit bike, cruise back to truck, pop pit bike in back, drive to other end and pick up race bike. Return to pits.
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At the BUB event in the past couple of years we have been allowed to ride our bikes back after making a speed-run......for SCTA/BNI you CAN NOT ride your bike back....so you need someone with a truck and/or trailer. (why I do not know....only the OFFICIALS in their wisdom know why) Check the BUB-site and/or contact Delvene
Manning for more information
The volume of traffic dictates the policy and the Insurance frowns on the mix of racers with others.
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Well,Jon,gonna get you twice. Jonathon sent him the rules?? Did not see his name here and Ares is the Greek god or war,not Aris, Mars was the Romans version. :twisted:
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And there were a few bikes at WOS allowed to ride back.IIRC they were all still in street trim,if that made a difference?? Not 130 Club either.
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3. Take a pit bike. Drive down to the other end with the pit bike in the back and drop off the pit bike. Drive back to start. Park truck, make speed run. Park race bike, hop on pit bike, cruise back to truck, pop pit bike in back, drive to other end and pick up race bike. Return to pits.
Interesting idea. I would feel confident doing this at the dragracing track, but I don't know about out in the middle of nowhere on the salt. Is everyone cool at the event? Do I have to worry about someone snaking my pit bike out there?
Would I have to chain a rabid dog to the bike to keep it from getting snaked during my run?
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Firemanjim:
My source for the Aris/Ares controversy was from a Google search. I came up with this website for a Greek soccer team:
http://www.arisfc.gr/page.aspx?item=3
Read the story and you'll see they imply it's a Greek god of war, spelled with the "i' rather than the "e".
Whatever, the poor guy about whom we're talking says it's his given name, not his chosen one, so maybe we should allow him to spell it any dang way he wants to, hey?
Back to you, Mr. Aris: I wouldn't have compunctions about leaving a pit bike or chase truck or whatver at the far end of the course (after making sure the officials don't have a problem with the parking location or whatever, of course). Maybe a note left on it, explaining why it's there...
As for finding someone in the pits that's willing to help move you around the course -- you'll almost certainly find someone willing to help.
As for an '01 12R -- Hey, great! My bike's an '00 ZX12R. The more the merrier -- too many 'Busas out there (compared to the 12Rs)(boy, this is gonna bring tons of crap down on me, I can just feel it coming). Another Kawi is always welcome. I don't know for sure if Bub's has licensing rules -- SCTA/USFRA/ECTA do have 'em, but there's value, too -- think of them as a form of driver training. You make a pass of up to 125, then up to 150, then 175, then up to 200, then up to 250, then up to 300, each one (assuming the powers that be are satisfied you're handling the increasing speeds with aplomb and dignity) garnering you a license of the next higher grade. Bub's "Wrung what you Brung" allows flat-out the first pass, I think -- but a practice run or two isn't all that bad an idea, even if the RWYB event only allows a limited number of passes.
That's enough points for one post. Drop a PM if you wanna compare Kawasaki lies.
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Hey Slim.....did you see that the BUB event has a $1000.00 for the
fastest lady rider......is your wife up to it??? 'Show me the money"
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Yeah, I saw that. Yes, Nancy's up for it -- in fact, she and I requested such a category/prize when we attended the first Bub's event a couple of years ago. But --
I'm not (and never have been) a fan of the American Motorcyclist Association and prefer not to join. Our participation at Bub's - after that first event - is unlikely. We plan on being at the Salt for SpeedWeek, and for World of Speed -- and even if Nancy were to take the money (at Bub's), it'd do no more than pay for the trip expenses, and I'd still have to put up with the AMA for a full year. Joining just for Bub's isn't worth it to me.
I'd attend Bub's for a run at the FIM record, maybe, but if I can run on that record elsewhere I'd choose the different venue over having to join AMA.
I'll look forward to having Nancy go fast on my bike elsewhere. If we/she change(s) her mind maybe we'll see you out there.
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Just for everyone's info, here's the reply that I received from Delvene. It looks like I'm good to go.
We do allow you to ride back to the pit area- the BNI/SCTA events do
not, there may be some confusions from those that have run at SCTA for
many years and have not yet made it to our meet.
We do not have a problem wit it. We expect all riders to use common
sense and keep their speeds low on their return run, but we do want to
encourage those new to the sport to come out, and it is not always
possible to bring others with you!
If you have any more questions please feel free to ask!
Kind regards
Delvene Manning
Event Manager
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As for an '01 12R -- Hey, great! My bike's an '00 ZX12R. The more the merrier -- too many 'Busas out there (compared to the 12Rs)(boy, this is gonna bring tons of crap down on me, I can just feel it coming). Another Kawi is always welcome. I don't know for sure if Bub's has licensing rules -- SCTA/USFRA/ECTA do have 'em, but there's value, too -- think of them as a form of driver training. You make a pass of up to 125, then up to 150, then 175, then up to 200, then up to 250, then up to 300, each one (assuming the powers that be are satisfied you're handling the increasing speeds with aplomb and dignity) garnering you a license of the next higher grade. Bub's "Wrung what you Brung" allows flat-out the first pass, I think -- but a practice run or two isn't all that bad an idea, even if the RWYB event only allows a limited number of passes.
That's enough points for one post. Drop a PM if you wanna compare Kawasaki lies.
Thanks for all the advice, Slim. It's nice to know that I have someone with the same bike that I can bug for specific info.
By the way, have you seen this:
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewthread.php?FID=1&TID=21050&set_time=
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And there were a few bikes at WOS allowed to ride back.IIRC they were all still in street trim,if that made a difference?? Not 130 Club either.
WOS is a different group (USFRA) and probably have a different insurance carrier
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One of the reasons to trailer or tow a vehicle back is that at Bonneville it is a long way back from wherever the rider or driver ends up at on the return road. Some may not carry enoiugh fuel to ride it back up to 7 miles. The other is it's easy to get lost and wander over toward the course. Yes it happens. The advantage of having a push truck is you have a crew to help with a CB radio to relay information back to the timing trailer if you lost a chain or any other part off your vehicle. This applies to bikes and cars. The same rule applies at the Dry Lake.
You wouldn't want to hit any part at speed on the course regardless of it's size. We deal with this every year and the rule is for that reason.
There is also additional wear and tear on a vehicle that is returned to the pit area under power. The rule is inforced and the patrols will stop you if seen doing it. It also helps keep the speeds down on the return road.
Hope everyone understands this ruling. As most know we have around 400 entries each year and control in all areas and necessary.
Glen
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The volume of traffic will determine the rules.
USFRA is a smaller meet if only because the time of year is more risky but the access to the Bonneville records is the same.
The basis for the event is with the SCTA and they have been doing it at a Club level for many years.
AMA/FIM are reinventing themselves with the expected growing pains and will be doing their 3rd event this year.
They have not built the reputation yet to cause the bikers to flock to them.
Slim is fairly new to the sport but he bears watching because he is learning too and he offers another pair of new eyes that might see more and a little differently.
That fresh perspective will guarantee the future as long as the meet is accessible enough to encourage him.
The weather has been a big factor over the past few years with shortened, canceled, and events run in under less than ideal conditions.
You will always do best to schedule yourself to attend the first available date because once you miss it the date is gone forever.
It is easier to fall back from a cancel than it is to make up a miss.
If you like the first one enough you will immediately start planning for the next one even if it is only 3 weeks away.
But even if it is a year, the experiences are cumulative and you won't get any other way.
As far as security , the people are very different and whole rigs are stolen at the Drags all the time.
The big thing is the wind.
If it comes up enough it will blow your stuff away but nobody is going to take it.
The exception might be that guy that was holding my tarp.
The last time we saw him headed for Idaho we were not sure if he was hanging on to steal it or afraid to let go.
The Keith report on the 12 was exactly correct.
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To quote Dan's quote . . .
"Certainly, there is great wisdom behind the rulebook's recommendation..."
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I'd attend Bub's for a run at the FIM record, maybe, but if I can run on that record elsewhere I'd choose the different venue over having to join AMA.
Well I guess your out of luck trying to set ANY FIM record... You must be a member of the AMA to attempt an FIM record. Doesnt matter where, even if you goto Australia for an FIM attempt you still have to be a AMA member... AMA America, or AMA Australia doesnt matter you have to be a member.
Jon
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To quote Dan's quote . . .
"Certainly, there is great wisdom behind the rulebook's recommendation..."
Well most things anyway.
Read the rules again. The AMA is only the North American affiliate of FIM. Australia, Mexico, and every other member country and organization have the same access requirements for an FIM record. :wink:
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Oh, well, I guess I'm out of luck for setting an FIM record. AMA's loss, not mine. I didn't know that FIM requires AMA. I do know that I don't care to join that group again.
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Hey Slim......if you want to set a
National and/or World Records and not club records.....you have to go
AMA/FIM.....AMA has its faults....
FIM has its problems.....plus the lines at the BUB meet are a lot shorter.
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I've said enough about Bub's for now.
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Hey Slim......if you want to set a
National and/or World Records and not club records.....you have to go
AMA/FIM.....AMA has its faults....
FIM has its problems.....plus the lines at the BUB meet are a lot shorter.
What about Vesco, Campos,and Corbin ?
To name just a few of the more predominate ones.
The FIM blessing of the BMW mark was a real service to the sport until they met the first competition against a loaner bike in Australia.
The problems were built into the start and the incentive is the same.
The lines are shorter with fewer runs. With an average of 5 min. per run and a 10 hour day of running time, that is 120 runs. The rest of the math is easier. The 5 min. average was a bit generous, but you get the point.