Landracing Forum

Bonneville Salt Flats Discussion => Build Diaries => Topic started by: SaltPeter on June 30, 2012, 07:55:12 PM

Title: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on June 30, 2012, 07:55:12 PM: I have been putting together a APS 250 using a Suzuki RGV chassis and a Aprilia RS250 90degree V twin 2 stroke engine (based on a RGV).

This is the original bike. Had planned to run in P/P 250 but a rule mix up changed my plans.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_RGV2.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=RGV2.jpg)

Team Two Short Men at the first meet at Lake Gairdner, ended up running it in M/G 250 in 2010 ran 119mph License Pass and had a miss fire on Record pass 99mph. (Me on the left with my brother Gary pit crew.)

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/The%20Big%20LakeG%202010/th_TSM1copy.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/The%20Big%20LakeG%202010/?action=view&current=TSM1copy.jpg)

Rain outs have left me with my plans a bit all over the place. But from there.

This was Mk2 at 2011 wash out. Hoping to push the record up a bit. Drank Jim Beam instead until the road re opened and we could head home.lol

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/LakeG%202011/th_P1010063.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/LakeG%202011/?action=view&current=P1010063.jpg)

2012 was always meant to be a move to APS bike. I'll have more soon.

Pete
DLRA#866
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Dr Goggles on June 30, 2012, 08:17:19 PM: Hey Pete,

good to see you here, get over to the "Introductions" thread and tell the family what your up to or the old man SSS will get huffy. Tell us where you're from in Aus, I seem to remember you're a crow-scoffer.

You started with the DLRA during a tough stretch, hang in there. :cheers: :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: grumm441 on June 30, 2012, 10:09:12 PM: Hi Pete

Welcome aboard
I was just looking at your photobucket pics
What did you use to hold the panels on the trailer with
G
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 01, 2012, 03:04:16 AM: Been to Intro page March 30 I'm a Brisvegas Boy :-D

The Trailer Panels held on with Sikaflex Body Adhesive and Riveted.

Had to make a few mods after the 2010 trip. Dust!!!

All good now with twice as many Rivets and a Vent in the roof.

Get new Trailer Pics soon.

Pete
DLRA#866
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: dr j on July 01, 2012, 09:26:23 AM: Pete,
Nice looking bike! Bet it sounds wicked too. I ran an APS 125/2 for 3 events of the ECTA Mile. It is a 1994 Honda RS125. Not many 2 strokes out there any more. Mine is now back to sitting in the corner of the shop while I work on my Morini 350.
One suggestion- while on the rear stand practice your tuck position and have someone take side view pictures. You may find that you can keep your head lower and still see forward if you place a high density 2" thick foam pad on your fuel tank. The spot you want it is not for your chin but for the bottom front of the helmet. You then have a target for your tuck position and when the helmet is resting on that you push down and it rotates the front of the helmet up. That gives you a higher vision opening without bending your neck any more. Helped me.
Good luck and always check those plugs after a run.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SPARKY on July 01, 2012, 09:34:47 AM: ahhh the all important "tuck" :lol:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: kiwi belly tank on July 03, 2012, 02:12:55 AM: Jeez Goggs, "crow-scoffer" jerked the memory bank up to speed! :cheers:

Welcome to crazyville Pete.
Sid.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 03, 2012, 02:14:26 AM: I have been doing the photo stuff from day 1 dr j.

The first thing i did with the APS build was work out where I sat on the bike and found I needed to extend the swing arm.

This the 125mm or 5 inch extension. I got this done as my ally welding is still a work in progress.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_AMS250RLSwg.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=AMS250RLSwg.jpg)

Then I worked out the seating position and made a subframe to mount the Seat.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_Frame1.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=Frame1.jpg)

An Ally tube frame gave me the shape for the Tail Fairing.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_AMS250d.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=AMS250d.jpg)

More stuff soon

Pete
DLRA#866
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: dr j on July 03, 2012, 07:48:11 AM: Excellent. Nice work on the tail. Looks well thought out and executed. Good luck.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Freud on July 03, 2012, 12:33:10 PM: Love that exhaust. It'll clear you sinuses as well as your ears.

Nobody will pit too close to you.

FREUD
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 03, 2012, 03:47:14 PM: I know Freud, got any ideas on how to I can get my Respirator and the Ear Muffs under the helmet?

Pete
Smokin#866
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Freud on July 03, 2012, 11:44:57 PM: If you are running Nitro just hold your breath and don't have the earwax removed at your next physical.

Sorta like those divers that don't wear masks and harvest pearls.

You can do it. The faster you go the less time you have to hold your breath.

FREUD
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on July 04, 2012, 12:34:42 AM: It is nice to see another partial streamliner. Will the shell be aluminum?
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 04, 2012, 05:17:37 AM: I have been building the bike over the last 18mths. So this is a catch up post.
I was not sure if I could put this thing together, but it has slowly worked out.

I have built it in Fibreglass.

I used 6mm Divinicell and heated, bent and hot glued sections to get the shape I wanted.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_Build8.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=Build8.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_Build10.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=Build10.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_Build13.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=Build13.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_Build12.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=Build12.jpg)

Then Glassed over it.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_Glass4.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=Glass4.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_Glass3.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=Glass3.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_Glass2.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=Glass2.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_Glass1.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=Glass1.jpg)

More soon

Pete
DLRA#866

Hey Doc it has been a bit rough, but I am in for the long haul :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: dr j on July 04, 2012, 10:01:28 AM: Are you going to leave the end of the tail open for the exhaust to get sucked out?

Quote from: Freud on July 03, 2012, 12:33:10 PM
Love that exhaust. It'll clear you sinuses as well as your ears.

Nobody will pit too close to you.

FREUD

I disagree with Freud, as everybody will say they are "too close to you". :-D
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Koncretekid on July 04, 2012, 11:06:40 AM: Nice build. I like photo #5 in your Photobucket album - - Is that your launching ramp?

Tom
APS-PG 500
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on July 04, 2012, 01:04:31 PM: Pete, what are the individual weights of the fairing with windshield included, and the tail with the seat included? It looks good.

Some of my friends race two strokes off road. There are noise limits on all racing here and some mufflers quiet them down without taking away the power. I can ask folks around here what works if you are interested.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 05, 2012, 12:17:45 AM: Have not weighed the Body Work.

I have not got the silencers fitted because there is no room for them it's that simple.

The back of the bike is open so any air inside can get out, I also hope it will reduce some of the drag at the rear of the Bike.

Ahh my secret test ramp is exposed. I use it to test downforce, if the the Bike keeps flying then the Bellypan is still producing uplift.

Seriously we have been looking at options to get on and off Lake Gairdner when the edge of the Lake is a bit soft.

Pete
Smokin#866
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 05, 2012, 05:30:01 PM: The next step was to Flow Coat it,

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_FlowCoat1.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=FlowCoat1.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_FlowCoat2.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=FlowCoat2.jpg)

Then mounting it up,

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/th_ApsPre2.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/?action=view&current=ApsPre2.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/th_APSPre4.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/?action=view&current=APSPre4.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/th_APSfrontClear.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/?action=view&current=APSfrontClear.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/th_APSPre1.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/?action=view&current=APSPre1.jpg)

Finally I got to have a go at the paint job,

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/th_Fairing1.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/?action=view&current=Fairing1.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/th_Fairing2.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/?action=view&current=Fairing2.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/th_Tail.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20Paint%20Time/?action=view&current=Tail.jpg)

The Finished Job

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/th_Finfront.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/?action=view&current=Finfront.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/th_Finrear.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/?action=view&current=Finrear.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/th_FinSide.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/?action=view&current=FinSide.jpg)

Pete
Smokin#866

That is why i run a 2stroke so I got plenty of room in the Pits :evil:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Grandpa Jones on July 05, 2012, 06:50:27 PM: Hi Pete,

Nice job on the bodywork! :cheers:

How was working with the Divinycell? Can it be formed using a heat gun?

Thanks,

Dave
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 05, 2012, 11:01:48 PM: Yeah Dave

It can be bent with the heat gun.

I could not get it to do a compound shape, it was a cut and paste job using the hot glue gun to get the front shape.

The idea came from one of our blokes over here.

http://www.dlra.org.au/forum/viewtopic.php?f=18&t=1320

I would not have tried it without these instructions (onya Ross).

Pete
Smokin#866
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 08, 2012, 03:54:59 AM: This is what it looks like naked

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_APSDown.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=APSDown.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_APSFront.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=APSFront.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_APSRear.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=APSRear.jpg)

The engine is from a 1999 Aprilia RS250 road bike (an Aprilia badged Suzuki RGV engine)
I have done mods to strengthen the engine.
It has a welded up crank, Forged Wossner Single ring Pistons, Tuning Works (UK) Billet insert Heads (better cooling)

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_Wossner1.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=Wossner1.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_APSEng.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=APSEng.jpg)

For performance I have removed the Airbox and made a cool air feed, fitted Jolly Moto Race Spec Expansion Chambers, Re Jetted and a Zeeltronic ECu (allows control of the Ignition Curve and the opening sequence of exhaust Power Valves, still tweeking the settings).

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_AMS250JM.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=AMS250JM.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/th_AMS250JM2.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/?action=view&current=AMS250JM2.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/th_FinZeel.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/?action=view&current=FinZeel.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/th_FinIntake.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/?action=view&current=FinIntake.jpg)(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/th_Zeel.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/?action=view&current=Zeel.jpg)

To monitor the Engine I am using Koso Water Temp (top) and EGTs gauges on each cylinder and the shift light is on the right of the Tach

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/th_FinInstruments.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/?action=view&current=FinInstruments.jpg)

Pete
DLRA#866
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 24, 2012, 08:30:15 PM: Quote from: wobblywalrus on July 04, 2012, 01:04:31 PM
Pete, what are the individual weights of the fairing with windshield included, and the tail with the seat included? It looks good.

Some of my friends race two strokes off road. There are noise limits on all racing here and some mufflers quiet them down without taking away the power. I can ask folks around here what works if you are interested.

I finally got around to weighing the individual pieces

Front Fairing is 8.1kgs
Rear Fairing/Tail is 8.3kgs
Belly Pan is 5kgs

The Bike naked and wet is 128kgs
Suzuki claimed Stock Fully Dressed Dry Weight is 139kg

So I am up around 6kgs wet.
I tried to get 60F/40R weight % distribution, I got 58F/42R.

Thanks
Pete
DLRA#866
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on October 31, 2012, 04:05:42 AM: I have made a few changes engine/trans wise. There has been a Billet Ally Clutch developed in the UK and I've helped out with some testing so I fitted it and it is feels great.
It is a lot lighter so it reduces the load on the Crank Bearings at the prolonged Max RPMs we run.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/th_ProtoClutch1.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/?action=view&current=ProtoClutch1.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/th_ProtoClutch2.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/?action=view&current=ProtoClutch2.jpg)

Been taking 3 steps forward and 2 back for a few months with the Tune up.
I had Higher Compression Head inserts fitted and I have found that I also need Race Ported Barrels to get them work. The engine would not rev past 10000rpm and make 57hp should go to 11500-12000.
So I fitted the Lower Compression inserts and You Little Beauty it worked.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/th_VinceHeads1.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/?action=view&current=VinceHeads1.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/th_VinceHeadshemi01.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/?action=view&current=VinceHeadshemi01.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/th_VinceHeadsComplete.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/?action=view&current=VinceHeadsComplete.jpg)

and this lead to this

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/th_DynoRun39.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/?action=view&current=DynoRun39.jpg)

I am still Jetted safe with 1090F EGTs

Pete
One very happy Aussie
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Koncretekid on October 31, 2012, 07:40:11 PM: Unbelievable! 77hp on 15 cubic inches, 5 hp per cubic inch. I think you've outdone the formula 1 boys, and at less than 11,000 rpm. If you could just extend that torque curve for another 5,000 rpms or so, or add a couple more cylinders (500 Gamma?) And I struggle to get 45 hp with 30 cubes. Your bike may have a bit more frontal area than mine, but I predict you'll go way over 150 mph. Now you just have to hold it together. Maybe I'll have to go 2-stroke.
Tom
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on October 31, 2012, 10:51:23 PM: Hi Tom :cheers:

The big advantage tuning wise in our sport, Land Speed Racing, is I can use leaded fuel and Sunoco Supreme fuel is fast burning and is stable enough to advance the timing way further than I can with Unleaded. We got a Torque reading of about 36 ft/lbs around 10000 rpm. The numbers are all relative to the Dyno you use, but it is a 14hp increase over my Stock set up. I am really happy with the way the Curve goes is really smooth and straight above 8000rpm.

I use a Zeeltronic Ignition system that gives me the capacity to program in a 3D Ignition map, and control the opening of the Power Vales in the Exhaust ports. This sort of technology was once only available for Factory and later over the counter Road Race bikes like RS Hondas or TZ Yamahas,and was pretty expensive. Now it is both available and affordable.

I also have a set of Expansion Chambers designed for high RPM and not mid range Street Spec type pipes. I think I just did the research and eventually got all the Ducks lined up :-D

The disadvantage with 2 strokes is you need to tune to avoid seizing. Being able to get Carbs with Power Jet circuits in them makes a big difference. The Main Jet Circuit is helped by an extra Jet that adds fuel in the high RPM WOT range, so Jetting is less compromised. Still is a juggle.

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on November 01, 2012, 12:15:49 AM: Thanks for posting those weights, Pete. I compares well with my tin work and is much lighter than my attempts at homemade fiberglass. It is a method I am considering. It is much smoother aerodynamically than the riveted panels I am using.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 02, 2012, 05:04:58 AM: Still got to get weight distribution with me on the Bike.

Pete
DLRA#866
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: grumm441 on November 02, 2012, 08:04:59 AM: Quote from: wobblywalrus on November 01, 2012, 12:15:49 AM
Thanks for posting those weights, Pete. I compares well with my tin work and is much lighter than my attempts at homemade fiberglass. It is a method I am considering. It is much smoother aerodynamically than the riveted panels I am using.

yep
but the riveted panels look really cool
G
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 02, 2012, 08:29:11 PM: Multiple Vortex Generators hard to do that in Glass :mrgreen:

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Frank06 on November 03, 2012, 09:13:20 AM: Great build - I love 2-strokes!
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 22, 2012, 03:12:02 PM: Went back to the Dyno to get final Readings and it was way down on Power

One cylinder had low EGT, and found that one of the Exhaust "Power Valves" (PV) was not opening consistently, I swore a lot. then I took it home.

Found the problem, the PV shaft had a Bush missing?? so it was running on the seal as the pivot.

You can't see if the Bush is fitted unless the seal is removed, whoever put these Cylinders together left it out.:shock:

All good now, other Cylinder OK, PVs readjusted, opening and closing as Mr Suzuki intended.

Oh well better to find it now.

So I went up for a few Test runs at the Drags last night with no fairing/tail section fitted.

I ran the same gearing as the last time I ran the Bike up there, when I had the stock Fairing fitted, still had difficulty getting it off the line, it's no Drag Bike.

It ran great once moving.

When the Bike was stock with Fairings on I got in one relatively clean start (2.3sec 60ft) and got down as low as possible to get one 14.4 - 100mph run.

I went 14.5 - 100 mph sitting up, no fairing off a 2.6 60ft last night.

EGTs 1168F both sides, so I am going one size richer on the Power Jet, (they loved a bit of the old Power this and Power that in the early 90's)

New Clutch worked much better than the Rider did. :oops:

Big relief, :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 30, 2012, 07:54:42 PM: The Final Tuck. I do have clearance at the rear of the Bike off the stand.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/TuckLg.jpg)

:cheers:
Pete
DLRA#866
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on November 30, 2012, 09:00:55 PM: Pete, leaded race gas together with lambda sensors is not working very well for me. I am looking for another way to see if the Triumph has the correct mixture. Monitoring EGT might work for that. Is that what you are using your EGT readings for?
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 30, 2012, 10:55:51 PM: Yeah that's it.

I understand that EGT's can be used to monitor the Tune once you have a Baseline Jetting/AFR. Not really suitable to do the baseline Tuning/Jetting.

I was having a problem getting a AFR reading with my own Innovate LM1 system and at the Dyno.

What really helped me out, was that Suzuki make a Race Kit and a manual to follow as a baseline. Not exactly right, but it at least got me in the Ballpark. I used recommended Jetting + 2 Jet sizes bigger as a start and then had to rely on Plug Chops. I ended up going down 3 sizes to get good power and plug colour and had 1168F both cylinders at the Drags strip testing I did recently.

I have since found that you need to use a brand new O2 sensor or one with very little use, to get a reading on my Engine.

The last time I was on the Dyno they had a brand new sensor and I got steady readings. It was consistent 13-13.2 AFR with my EGT's showing the 1168F and the engine made
the maximum power on the Dyno, but I believe is on the "lean" side for sustained WOT runs aiming for 1100F EGTs.

I will now increase the Power Jet by one size to stay on the safe side at Full throttle, find out at, hopefully, my final Dyno run on Thursday.

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 01, 2012, 12:48:37 AM: A pic of testing the little beast at the Drags, they are Kevlar Jeans.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/TestNTune21stNov065ZF-4882-95432-1-001.jpg)

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: JustaRacer on December 01, 2012, 01:18:54 AM: Nice.

100mph traps in the quarter is smoking for a 250.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Koncretekid on December 01, 2012, 07:01:15 AM: Is that a cool air induction tube I see at the right front, and is it factory or one you made? The reason I ask, is that I made an airbox for my BSA that was at least 3 times the cubic inches of my motor and on the dyno, it wouldn't flow enough air. It had two 2" diameter inlets, and reduced my hp by 10% even without the duct work.
Tom
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 01, 2012, 10:29:59 PM: It a simple system I made to direct air into the top of the open air box. It's not a sealed Ram Air box.

Suzuki's Race Kit specs recommends taking the lid off the Std air box and removing the divider inside the box, then fitting a flex hose air feed into the back of the open box.

Because I have lowered the seat, I have removed the lid and cut down the height of the Std air box, and left the Divider in. The flex hose directs air into the top of this set up.

Seems to work given the curve from the Dyno is nice and straight once the Engine is "on the pipe". Often this is not the case with these engines.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/FinAir.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/FinIntake.jpg)

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on December 01, 2012, 10:56:20 PM: Thanks for posting that stuff on the EGT. A variation of that method should work good for me.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 02, 2012, 10:41:30 PM: No worries that was how I was shown how to use EGTs.

Here is my Air Box and the Air is directed over the top of this. On a stock RGV the Air Box lid had 2 x 35mm or 1 1/4 inch Tubes at the back of the box and sits under the Fuel tank, that is all that feeds the air in. It the goes through the Foam Filter and into what you see here. The new intake tubes are 2 x 50mm or 2 inch.

I tried running without the Air Box and I ended up with inconsistent fueling. Apparently the Carbs vibrate and have an effect on the Floats/Needle and seat in the Bowls. The Flexible Bell Mouths hold the end of the Carbs and eliminate the problem.

I left the divider in for no other reason than to help to stop the box flexing. Usually the box is bolted to the seat frame, I can't do this so the Box is held in by the Bell Mouths onto the Carbs and the Air Feed plate up top. It seems to work really well.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/AMed.jpg)

:cheers:
Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 06, 2012, 03:37:51 PM: I finally got back to the Dyno.

My first Chart was not right, I knew it was too high :-), there was a Hardware Problem, but it looked impressive.

This is a bit closer to reality.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/th_DynoFinalLg2.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/?action=view&current=DynoFinalLg2.jpg)

A nice Linear Power delivery :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: JustaRacer on December 06, 2012, 04:51:43 PM: What shut the engine down? Looks like it hadn't peaked before the throttle was cut.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 06, 2012, 08:15:04 PM: No that is what happens with these engines.

They "hit the wall" where the Power Band that comes from the Expansion Chamber Porting etc has peaked and then it drops off.

To stop any risk of Detonation in this over rev area the Ignition Timing is quickly retarded from 19 Degrees at 11000rpm to 8 Degrees at 12000 rpm.

The power characteristics of a small twin cylinder 2 Stroke is nothing like any Four Stroke.

It happens in a relatively narrow window with very little power developed either side of this window and everything else is designed around this fact.

You have to get the gear ratio spread and the shift points spot on to maintain acceleration. If you fall out of the Power Band then there is no Torque to get you going again. It's change down a Gear and have another stab at it. If you hold it in Gear too long you can feel the Power Drop off and more wasted time.

Probably sounds weird unless you have ridden one, but they are great fun.

:cheers:
Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 11, 2012, 10:27:47 PM: The Final piece of the APS Jigsaw.

This is the first stage of the Plug for the Front Mudguard Mould.

It's 1 Part RGV, .5 RM 80, 2 Parts 1mm Ally and a few rivets and Sikaflex.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/MudPlugMed.jpg)

It is getting filled in and finished by a Panel Beater mate for Beer. :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 14, 2012, 03:24:16 AM: Yes this is the same Mudguard.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/PlugFin1.jpg)

And for my next trick I'll just have to wait around for a Cure.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/Mold2.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/Mold1.jpg)

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 17, 2012, 08:09:55 PM: So far so good

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/Mold1-1.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/MoldFin1-Copy.jpg)

That is not a crack in the front of the Guard but Gel Coat build up as there slight imperfections in the Plug.
But I am more than happy with this, now I can have a shot at having a reasonably decent Mudguard.
On to the next step. Wax on Wax off :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 21, 2012, 03:28:28 AM: To Everyone across the Big Pond

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/XmasRGVsmall.jpg)

From Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 26, 2012, 04:00:09 AM: Well I laid it up on Monday and have just Released it from it's confines, it came straight out 8-) 8-) 8-)

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/Final4.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/Final3.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/Final2.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/Final1.jpg)

It's plenty good enough for what I am doing. It weighs 1.2kg and the Plug was 1.5kg. I reinforced the area where the larger front joins the Fork indents.

It is mounted on the front and the rear of the Forks. So it is evenly supported.

Find out if it mounts up without too much flex tomorrow.

So far so good. :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on December 26, 2012, 02:03:37 PM: Flex was a problem for me with a similar setup. Eventually I made some little metal struts to brace the fender. They connect the outside edges of the bottom of the fender to the ends of the front axle.

A lot of heavy and wet NaCl can collect inside those fenders if the salt is in a mood for it. This is something to consider when figuring out the strength of the attachments.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 27, 2012, 06:52:32 AM: Had a few clearance problems that where not there with the plug, the Glass sides just rubbed on the USD Forks. The Plug had Ally on the sides and had clearance but it was tight. I trimmed it up and will do a little tidy up, but it will do as a test unit. If it works, I'll make a small mod to the mold at a later date.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/MudFit3.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/MudFit2.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/MudFit4.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/MudFit5.jpg)

Once it was mounted it has virtually no flex :D :D

Well a quick paint and that's it, the Bike is ready, so on to the Tech Day then!!!!!!!

Everything is crossed for Feb

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Peter Jack on December 27, 2012, 07:25:59 AM: Very nice job Pete!

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on January 03, 2013, 11:48:57 PM: Nice work Pete. Nothing like a 2 stroke. I love them. I wish you all the best. :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on January 04, 2013, 12:23:08 AM: The bike looks great and you are ready to go ahead of the last minute. I wish I could do that.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on January 04, 2013, 09:09:55 AM: Oh this is the Paint job, the Bike might be ready but still got to tidy up the trailer and fit out the Tow Car so I can fit all the gear in it to do the 2800 mile round trip and part of it is the Dirt Road.

It's no drama I love the Trip to Lake G, you just got to make sure everything is secured and Dustproof, the first year I went I had more dust inside the Trailer than on the outside :-o :-o

I learn't that you have to Pressurise the Trailer with a vent. Next year in, clean as a whistle, inside :cheers:

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%20finished/FrontGuard.jpg)

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on February 02, 2013, 04:52:21 AM: This is the 300cc engine I have put together with the 38mm Lectrons fitted. Still a few things to do before it's ready to run.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/Engine%20Mods%202013/300kit1_zps23c56fe4.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/Engine%20Mods%202013/300kit2_zpsda003783.jpg) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/Engine%20Mods%202013/300kit3_zpsd3e061bc.jpg)

I now have a 250 and 350 Class engines, but I will run the 250 only this year.

Counting Down to the 18th. :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on February 02, 2013, 08:40:24 AM: Nice one Pete. Go you good thing!!!!!
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Old Scrambler on February 04, 2013, 08:30:19 PM: Very Nice.........your Aprilia motors look and are a lot faster than my Aprilia 650 Pegasso........but it sure is a lot of fun.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on February 06, 2013, 06:35:42 AM: Quote from: Old Scrambler on February 04, 2013, 08:30:19 PM
Very Nice.........your Aprilia motors look and are a lot faster than my Aprilia 650 Pegasso........but it sure is a lot of fun.

Thanks

Mr Suzuki is the real culprit here :-)

The Aprilia 250 motor is basically the same as motor as a 1991 - 96 Suzuki RGV 250.

I got 2 motors, one from my original 1993 Suzuki RGV (this motor pictured) and one 1999 Aprilia RS250 version (that's in the bike and I will run it at DLRA Speedweek in Feb).

This motor has a 300cc "big bore" kit, and I've made new intakes so I could fit the Lectrons.

I have put the Aprilia outer cases on, as you can see the front sprocket is easy to get to and makes any gearing changes that little bit easier. (the Suzuki cases completely cover the sprocket and I did not want to modify them)

I bolt on an Ally plate to cover the sprocket. This motor is part of the future plan I hope. :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Freud on May 03, 2013, 01:26:46 PM: Have you done any work except cleaning since the meet?

I envy your project.

FREUD
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on May 08, 2013, 01:50:34 AM: Hi Freud

It's been a bit quiet as I will be doing a big interstate move in about 6 weeks.

I have been doing a bit of limited "Porting" work on the "Modified Cylinders" for the next stage 250cc engine so I can run the Lectrons on this engine as well as the 350 Class engine.

The RGV engine is a Production Road Engine and is limited in how much power it can make, ( that's compared to Late Model Honda RS or Yamaha TZ 250 cc Road Race engines ).

But these mods will hopefully get everything working in a way that it was intended. Exhaust Pipes, Higher Comp Heads, Carbs and the Sunoco Gasoline.

I just finished these cylinders today and now have,

.9mm skimmed off the top so they are like Suzuki "Race Kit" barrels and I can use Suzuki Race Kit 1.4mm gaskets that raise the port timing and still use all the Heads/Inserts that I have.

Exhaust Ports widened 4mm on the Ears. This is one area in these engines that can benefit from a little opening up

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/ExhaustVersion2_zpsd1669bbc.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/EngineMods/ExhaustVersion2_zpsd1669bbc.jpg.html)

Entry to the Transfer Ports altered to eliminate the sharp entry, it has been found that you can gain power by having more rounded entries on the base of the cylinder instead of the previous Knife Edge dividers.

Before

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/BaseTransferBefore_zps60521c99.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/EngineMods/BaseTransferBefore_zps60521c99.jpg.html)

Modified

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/EngineMods/BaseTransferAfter_zpsc0b05c3a.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/EngineMods/BaseTransferAfter_zpsc0b05c3a.jpg.html)

1 mm wider and deeper on the entry to the Aux Transfer Port.

I have now done a bit more tidying up today and the Cylinders will now need re-plating.

3 possible things will happen: Nothing at all or I will gain HP or they’ll be stuffed. I rang the local Betting Store to see what odds I can get on the second outcome and it came in at 100:1 :-D

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on May 08, 2013, 04:58:59 AM: Put a hundred on it. You could come out smiling :-D
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on May 08, 2013, 08:09:44 AM: Quote from: tauruck on May 08, 2013, 04:58:59 AM
Put a hundred on it. You could come out smiling :-D

Got to be in to win it :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on May 30, 2013, 01:22:03 AM: (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/DLRA%20Speedweek%202013/LSRAPS1small_zps0e409e1c.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/DLRA%20Speedweek%202013/LSRAPS1small_zps0e409e1c.jpg.html)

A belated post but this was how it looked it looked down there in Feb.

I was hoping the Red would have given me a few more mph but it was not to be.
I am looking forward to the next run.:cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on May 30, 2013, 01:48:24 AM: Pete, will you be bringing and running both engines, the 250 and the 350?
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on May 30, 2013, 03:45:03 AM: Quote from: wobblywalrus on May 30, 2013, 01:48:24 AM
Pete, will you be bringing and running both engines, the 250 and the 350?

I am still undecided at this stage. I only have a few small things to do so that is an easy swap. Having the 2 years rained out upset the long term planning a bit, but I did manage to accumulate most of my parts over that time so now it's mix and match over a few Classes.

I do have another 250 V twin 2 Stroke, I picked up really cheap last year. It's a pretty Ratty looking early Honda NSR 250 (Road Bike), and to my surprise the engine looks ok. It is being tidied up and prepped for M-G 250 duty with the stock standard engine set up, I have unfinished business in that Class.

The Honda NSR's are harder to get parts for than the RGV. The research I have done suggests that I can probably get more power from the Honda as they have a different bore and stroke to the RGV, but at a price. A work in progress.

One way or another I am looking at running two Classes in 2014. The easiest option is to have a crack at APS-G-250 on the RGV/Aprilia and M-G-250 on the Honda, both of these Records need attention, I made sure I built the Trailer for two and I will be living a lot closer to Lake Gairdner next year :-D

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Freud on May 31, 2013, 01:56:35 PM: I thank you for your reply. I just hadn't opened this thread for a while but I am

impressed with your effort in a class than many people overlook.

I'll stay in touch.

FREUD
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 11, 2013, 06:08:15 AM: A carry over from the 250 records post.

This is an Aprilia RSW250 Road Race Engine, it has two cranks geared together. A very High Maintenance Race Engine

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/Engine%20Mods%202013/ApriliaRSW250640x425_zpsf1b68231.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/Engine%20Mods%202013/ApriliaRSW250640x425_zpsf1b68231.jpg.html)

This is my Aprilia RS250 Road Bike engine (ignore the Lectrons :-)) and is basically a Suzuki RGV VJ22 with different cases, and is what I ran at Speedweek this year. Two very different engines in so many ways, but mine is just a plain old fashioned High Maintainance 2 Stroke Road engine :-D :-D.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/Engine%20Mods%202013/300kit2_zpsda003783.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/Engine%20Mods%202013/300kit2_zpsda003783.jpg.html)

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Freud on July 11, 2013, 11:44:41 AM: I hope that this upcoming move doesn't kill the year.

Best to you, Pal.

FREUD
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 11, 2013, 05:16:15 PM: Quote from: Freud on July 11, 2013, 11:44:41 AM
I hope that this upcoming move doesn't kill the year.

Best to you, Pal.

FREUD

No Freud, everything is on track.

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on July 11, 2013, 08:10:05 PM: Do you guys remember when a 250 was a big bike? That was a long time ago when we buzzed around on 50's and 90's.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 12, 2013, 05:09:59 AM: Quote from: wobblywalrus on July 11, 2013, 08:10:05 PM
Do you guys remember when a 250 was a big bike? That was a long time ago when we buzzed around on 50's and 90's.

Yep I remember

I had one of these

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/A%20bit%20of%20Fun/7SuzukiT2501971_zpsf9863678.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/A%20bit%20of%20Fun/7SuzukiT2501971_zpsf9863678.jpg.html)

And then another one

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/8SuzukiT2501972_zps17715fe3.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/8SuzukiT2501972_zps17715fe3.jpg.html)

Then this 8-)

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/6Kawasaki-H1B_zps01e51784.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/6Kawasaki-H1B_zps01e51784.jpg.html)

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Graham in Aus on July 12, 2013, 06:46:41 AM: 1978, my RD and G/F!

(http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y10/grahaminaus/SDOC0012_zpsb35621ba.jpg)

Memories ! :-P
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: generatorshovel on July 12, 2013, 08:52:13 AM: My young days started a little "different"

(http://i156.photobucket.com/albums/t24/generatorshovel/42_walla_zps0a31da40.jpg) (http://s156.photobucket.com/user/generatorshovel/media/42_walla_zps0a31da40.jpg.html)

I was stoked when I was pulled over by the boys in blue for doing 71 mph in a 35 zone, SO happy in fact, the cop refused to put the speed in writing (ticket)

No one ever believed that speed :cheers:

Tiny
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wfojohn on July 12, 2013, 12:10:43 PM: Pete

The pic of your red bike and leathers a few posts above, is that from B'ville or a place in Australia? The salt on the tires etc looks like Bonneville but you said the picture is from February. If its Australia I did not know there is a salt lake there.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Stan Back on July 12, 2013, 05:13:44 PM: I had the best (?) of both worlds . . .
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on July 12, 2013, 05:41:28 PM: Yeah here's a few more

My Brits, these are my actual Bikes, I could not get enough Thunder in my life back then :-D

My first of three Thunderbirds

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/A%20bit%20of%20Fun/PeteMcFonda_zps7d7e5f10.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/A%20bit%20of%20Fun/PeteMcFonda_zps7d7e5f10.jpg.html)

My BSA Thunderbolt

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/A%20bit%20of%20Fun/TheBeeza_zpsaa9c11aa.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/A%20bit%20of%20Fun/TheBeeza_zpsaa9c11aa.jpg.html)

And my pride and joy

The Mighty Triton

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/A%20bit%20of%20Fun/TheMightyTriton_zps8bd9840a.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/A%20bit%20of%20Fun/TheMightyTriton_zps8bd9840a.jpg.html)

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on July 13, 2013, 03:09:28 AM: sorta miss the old days. This tom cat loved to ride around Bakersfield on the Harley. i carried him in my pocket when he was a little kitten and he liked it. I tucked him in the front of my jacket when he got bigger. It was a bit of a chore when he got real big, but he loved it.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 01, 2013, 02:07:18 AM: Finally able to get back into it.

I am not going to make any major changes given I did not get a "Full Power" pass this year.

I needed to tidy up the Wiring.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%202014/Wire_zps80bb0003.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/APS%202014/Wire_zps80bb0003.jpg.html)

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%202014/WireClose_zpsd91b1c80.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/APS%202014/WireClose_zpsd91b1c80.jpg.html)

Having the Right Tool made it a piece of cake.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%202014/Crimp_zpse463ecef.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/APS%202014/Crimp_zpse463ecef.jpg.html)

Next is some sort of Air Filter set up. Got the bits just have to make it so that restriction is minimised. More soon.

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on November 01, 2013, 09:03:00 PM: Pete, this is something I learned over the years. A lot of people, including some professional tuners, make the mistake of choosing their filter media based on it having the lowest restriction. Actually, it works best to pick the media that filters the best for the application and giving it the needed size to not cause restriction. Another thing I learned is to keep the filter as far away as possible from the carb intakes in a plenum. The pulsing flow near an intake can wiggle the dirt through the filter. Moving the element further back allows the intake flow to be more of a steady pull and this works better.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 02, 2013, 01:09:49 AM: Sage advice Bo. :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 02, 2013, 01:33:49 AM: Quote from: wobblywalrus on November 01, 2013, 09:03:00 PM
Pete, this is something I learned over the years. A lot of people, including some professional tuners, make the mistake of choosing their filter media based on it having the lowest restriction. Actually, it works best to pick the media that filters the best for the application and giving it the needed size to not cause restriction. Another thing I learned is to keep the filter as far away as possible from the carb intakes in a plenum. The pulsing flow near an intake can wiggle the dirt through the filter. Moving the element further back allows the intake flow to be more of a steady pull and this works better.

Good info Bo, and is right along the lines I was thinking.

2 strokes in general and the RGV's in particular, are really sensitive to Airbox/Airfilter changes. My RGV does not work very well without an Airbox, the Carbs are prone to vibrations and float/bowl issues.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/Engine%20Mods%202013/Airbox2_zps20a622d1.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/Engine%20Mods%202013/Airbox2_zps20a622d1.jpg.html)

This my cut down Standard Box and I will be doing exactly what you talking about, basically make a big Sock that fits over the existing setup with lot's of area and clearance.

Pete :-D
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 02, 2013, 10:47:43 PM: This is my new BSAFS ( Big Sock Air Filtration System ) :roll:

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%202014/Air2_zpse0d72526.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/APS%202014/Air2_zpse0d72526.jpg.html)

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Freud on November 02, 2013, 11:49:37 PM: I stand corrected but no one will pit very close to you.

FREUD
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Dr Goggles on November 03, 2013, 12:36:06 AM: Quote from: SaltPeter on November 01, 2013, 02:07:18 AM
Finally able to get back into it.

I am not going to make any major changes given I did not get a "Full Power" pass this year.

I needed to tidy up the Wiring.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%202014/Wire_zps80bb0003.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/APS%202014/Wire_zps80bb0003.jpg.html)

[img width=533

Having the Right Tool made it a piece of cake.

[URL=http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/APS%202014/Crimp_zpse463ecef.jpg.html]http://(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%202014/Crimp_zpse463ecef.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/APS%202014/WireClose_zpsd91b1c80.jpg.html)

Next is some sort of Air Filter set up. Got the bits just have to make it so that restriction is minimised. More soon.

Pete :cheers:
height=400]http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%202014/WireClose_zpsd91b1c80.jpg[/img][/URL]

ahh,you bike guys have all the answers, thing is I can barely understand the question..tell me, how did having a nutcracker help with serving spaghetti?
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 03, 2013, 02:44:36 AM: Cause I'm cleva Doc I just made Spaghetti Cake :-D

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 03, 2013, 06:13:14 AM: A "pasta patissiered chef" on salt!. :-D :-D

2 stroke guys Doc. There's a difference. :wink:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 03, 2013, 06:47:27 AM: Quote from: tauruck on November 03, 2013, 06:13:14 AM
A "pasta patissiered chef" on salt!. :-D :-D

2 stroke guys Doc. There's a difference. :wink:

No argument on that one Tauruck 8-) :-D 8-)

Pete comin to you from my own Parallel Universe :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on November 03, 2013, 05:47:29 PM: There will be some nice sounding howlin' coming out of that air box when the bike hits its stride.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 03, 2013, 09:31:31 PM: It certainly was a Howler this year Bo, :-o

Add the open Expansion Chambers echoing in that Tail Section, and Ear Plugs were a necessity :evil:

I know most everyone hates the Sound of a Smoker, but in my Universe it is indeed a sweet Crackle 8-)

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on November 04, 2013, 01:23:00 AM: A lot of us like the smell and sound of those two strokes. They are something we do not get to hear very often any more.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 04, 2013, 02:53:13 AM: There is no better sound IMO. BTW, I have two kart motors here that we used to run in 100CC Supers Class. It was the class world championships were decided on. These puppies used to scream to 20,000RPM. :-D :-D :-D That's a nice sound.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 04, 2013, 02:40:02 PM: Bo and taruck

Good to hear,

taruck I used to be briefly involved in Karting and I remember that sound,

My first involvement with Smokers came from Trail Riding and moved to racing mainly Dirt Track and a little MX in the 70's.

I started racing a "Race Kitted" Suzuki TS125 and then the only Brand New Vehicle I have ever owned a 1975 Honda CR125M Elsinore, amazing Bike in it's day.

Good Times and more still to come 8-)

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 04, 2013, 03:52:46 PM: Pete, It was a 250 Elsinore that got me hooked. One ride and it was all over. I've never owned a Honda and I still remember when in the late 70s the Red Rockets arrived at the track. The rumour was that all us guys on the RM125s were dead men.

I did do some porting on RDs in the 80s but it got out of hand. I did two sets for friends and everyone else thought it was FREE!!!.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: bak189 on November 04, 2013, 06:20:02 PM: Two strokes....never did well racing them....I can get a four stroke to run....two stroke not so good......so I got Rotax to put a outstanding engine together, 125c.c. rotary valve, made one fast run at` 143mph....stuck the piston, so no record .....rebuild the unit....have complete bike for sale.....................
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 04, 2013, 08:06:24 PM: Tauruck, a mate of mine has still got four 1972 -73 Elsinores - 2 x 125s and 2 x 250s One of the 250s is fully restored to Original it is indeed a beautiful thing. I really wanted a 250 but lacked the $, nothing has changed :-D

Quote from: bak189 on November 04, 2013, 06:20:02 PM
Two strokes....never did well racing them....I can get a four stroke to run....two stroke not so good......so I got Rotax to put a outstanding engine together, 125c.c. rotary valve, made one fast run at` 143mph....stuck the piston, so no record .....rebuild the unit....have complete bike for sale.....................

bak, I am on a pretty steep Learning/re Learning curve with mine. I have a fundamental understanding but the in depth stuff is a bit over my head.

The old stuck piston is way 99% go bang.

Because of this I set it up with a rich baseline jetting and try and maintain 1100 - 1150 F on my EGT if I need to make a change,

and still use the Suzuki Oil Injection System, this puts the oil directly onto the bearings and the front of the Piston.

But I always ride with my hand on the Clutch Lever :-o

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on November 04, 2013, 11:24:57 PM: The four stroke dirt bikes have evolved to have extremely oversquare engines with very short pistons. It takes a lot of expensive maintenance and periodic parts replacement to run them competitively. Plus, they have peaky power and are difficult to ride. A lot of racers in Oregon buying two strokes now. They are simpler, more reliable, cost much less to run, and are easier to ride.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 05, 2013, 12:16:26 AM: Bo, are there all the go fast goodies for those four strokes?. There must be a pile of stuff to make them less reliable. I've never ridden one but it must be sweet coming off a tight turn and getting an immediate handful of power.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 05, 2013, 12:43:14 AM: It sounds like the Dirt Bikes have gone full circle, oh no.

I thought you got a Four Stroke because they were more reliable, lol.

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on November 05, 2013, 01:41:05 AM: Mike, yes, they make all sorts of stuff to make them even more unreliable.

The short and very wide pistons wear and rock in the bores. Then, they crack and break. The guys that buy these bikes expect them to wear out and lose compression and not to explode. Burning oil and bad performance are what tells them a rebuild is needed. They do not always get this indication with these new bikes. They run great then Bam, it is all over.

A well designed two stroke with good materials like a KTM can give a long life. They are in a different league, reliability wise, than the typical oriental two stroke.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 05, 2013, 05:59:34 AM: Peter, you're on a good thing there. Stick with the oil burner. :-D
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 05, 2013, 11:59:55 PM: I'll be sticking with the Smoker cause it started after a few kicks, no push button here.

It idles and free revs as well what a bonus :-D

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 06, 2013, 12:06:50 AM: Pete, that sounds like Shane Warne!. :cheers: :-D
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 06, 2013, 07:30:01 PM: Shane who??? lol

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: grumm441 on November 06, 2013, 09:27:12 PM: Quote from: SaltPeter on November 06, 2013, 07:30:01 PM
Shane who??? lol

Pete :cheers:

Oh dear!

G
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: 4-barrel Mike on November 06, 2013, 10:07:29 PM: Yeah! I mean, come on! Everyone knows he holds the record for most Test runs without a century.

Mike
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 07, 2013, 02:20:07 AM: What's a Century in Test, is that like a 100mph License Pass???

Oh I know, you mean that Bloke on the Hair Transplant Commercial with the Fake Tan. :cheers:

Pete
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 07, 2013, 04:00:54 AM: I couldn't help myself, :evil:

I grew up going to the Speedway to watch a Test Match.

Solo Speedway Bikes

Australia vs Great Britain

Jack White, Steve Reinke, John Titman (Aust) against Nigel Boocock, Chris Pusey Peter Collins (GB)

My Aussie Heroes were people like Jim Airey, Billy Sanders, Phil Crump. Then later Jason Crump and Chris Holder.

Later I found other forms of Motorsport and Wayne Gardner, Mick Doohan, Casey Stoner.

As far as Cars I never miss Bathurst following Peter Brock and Colin Bond when I was young. I still watch it even though I was not a big fan of V8 Supercars. This year is a good one.

I watch F1, Moto GP and Nascar, I follow Drag Racing when I can.

It's good to be back having a go myself again and thanks to the internet I can follow Land Speed Events in the US as well.

So I suppose Cricket is not really on my Radar.

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 07, 2013, 06:38:47 AM: I'm a Greg Hancock fan, win lose or draw. It must be the best racing to watch. :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 07, 2013, 02:42:58 PM: Mike, there was so many great Speedway riders and Greg was one of them

Re painting a few bits.

I was a Postman and rode a Postie Bike (Honda CT110) for for 15 years so I set up this a similar type of Gearshift so I can keep my foot inside my Fairing.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/APS%202014/Gearshift_zps98d39971.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/APS%202014/Gearshift_zps98d39971.jpg.html)

It is set up as a Race Pattern Push Down to change up through the Gears. It worked great this year.

Pete :D
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 08, 2013, 12:06:40 PM: Shot Pete. Nice one. :-D

The shifter looks good. What else do you have in the pipeline?
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 08, 2013, 05:21:46 PM: Seeing I've reinstalled the original mechanical Coolant Pump, I have to do a little re plumbing on the Cooling and re install the Thermostat and it's Housing to even out the Coolant flow to each cylinder. Don't you just love V Twins 2 Strokes :-D

I can't put it back in the original position so a bit of improvisation is called for.

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 11, 2013, 01:28:54 AM: Well it did start ok and I have figured out a way to reconnect the original Plumbing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eld7d7xWuSQ

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 11, 2013, 02:45:34 AM: Now you got my blood flowing!!!!. That vidoe just killed my panic attack, seriously. :-D

Pete, it sounds great. No matter what I do or say or what I drive/ride now I'm a 2 stroke lover.

If you ever need a 5'7'', 150Lb stand in, :cheers: :cheers: :cheers: just call.
Title: Re: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Frank06 on November 11, 2013, 09:33:09 AM: Sounds great! I love riding two-strokes!
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: wobblywalrus on November 11, 2013, 11:09:09 PM: Just like my house. The mower is parked, the lawn is dead, the bikes are running great. Good job. It is alive!
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 12, 2013, 03:57:52 PM: Quote from: wobblywalrus on November 11, 2013, 11:09:09 PM
Just like my house. The mower is parked, the lawn is dead, the bikes are running great. Good job. It is alive!

Priorities in life are everything :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: fredvance on November 12, 2013, 04:09:14 PM: My mower is dead, I need a bailer for the grass!! :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Dr Goggles on November 12, 2013, 04:10:34 PM: Sounds great Pete, have you removed the catalytic converter?? :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Koncretekid on November 12, 2013, 04:45:07 PM: I thought it appropriate at this time to post this link the the video that, no doubt, inspired Pete to get into two strokes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqJVlS37J74
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Old Scrambler on November 12, 2013, 05:17:40 PM: Inspiring for some..................Tom, it must be the OFF-season........as in bug spray :-D
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: Koncretekid on November 12, 2013, 08:40:20 PM: Dennis,
I hope we never grow too old to laugh!
Tom
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 12, 2013, 09:43:35 PM: Quote from: Koncretekid on November 12, 2013, 04:45:07 PM
I thought it appropriate at this time to post this link the the video that, no doubt, inspired Pete to get into two strokes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MqJVlS37J74

I wasn't inspired by it I got paid to do it :evil:

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 30, 2013, 12:44:01 AM: I have these 38mm Lectrons that will be going on the Ported Engine,

On the current Engine I run the Stock 34mm Mikuni’s, and I needed to get the Lectrons to open fully. Well I did it without changing all and sundry with a little packing.

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/Sidecar%202015/LectronConversionC_zpsc1e65ee6.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/Sidecar%202015/LectronConversionC_zpsc1e65ee6.jpg.html) (http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/Sidecar%202015/LectronConversionD_zps69d1013d.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/Sidecar%202015/LectronConversionD_zps69d1013d.jpg.html)

And they fit nicely on the Bike,

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/Sidecar%202015/LectronTest2_zpsea20971a.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/Sidecar%202015/LectronTest2_zpsea20971a.jpg.html)

I did find a problem with the Intakes I made for them, had a leak between the Intakes and these Reed Valve Blocks

(http://i1023.photobucket.com/albums/af354/RGV866/Sidecar%202015/Reed1_zps9120e53d.jpg) (http://s1023.photobucket.com/user/RGV866/media/Sidecar%202015/Reed1_zps9120e53d.jpg.html)

and needed a bit of sealing.

Once I sorted that out, it did not take much to get it running evenly on both cylinders, the way Lectron set them up for me was pretty close,

Just 1/4 turn out (leaner) on the Metering Rod on the Left Hand Carb and the low to mid range is sweet.

I won't be running them in Feb, I just wanted to make sure they did work on my Bike and I am pretty impressed.

Once I sealed the Leaky Intakes, it took about 20 mins to get the Bike running with pretty even EGT's.

To do this on the Stock RGV OEM Mikuni's takes hours!!

So now off they come and I'll put everything back together and wait for Feb, not long now.

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: tauruck on November 30, 2013, 06:22:02 AM: Pete, nothing like a slide carb. Any two stroke nut's wet dream. I know the Tillotsen slides and they really take the guess work out of the equation.

I wanted to ask if you can get Carbon reeds for that block?. I know guys that changed over and it was better due to the reduced flutter.

Me? :-D, I'd take the Lectrons along with me in Feb.

It's looking good man.
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on November 30, 2013, 10:19:38 PM: Thanks Mike

It seems that Suzuki really did their home work with the RGV Reed System.

No one that have been developing these engines over the years found any gain to be had using after market Reed Petals.

I think the earlier design Reed Valve 2 strokes that were virtually Piston Port induction with a Reed Valve located in the Intake Port
located on the Cylinder really did benefit from upgraded Reeds.

The RGV is a Crankcase Induction Reed Valve Engine that had a Factory Upgrade Kit available for it.

If that "Kit" was fitted the RGV could rev to 12000 rpm and this used the Standard Reed set up.

That sort of Revs is about the limit for these Road Bike engines, unlike the purpose Built Racing TZ Yam's and RS Honda's that are designed to rev higher.

The thing is to have Reed Petals as one of those Replacement bits in the "Maintenance Schedule", you know those basic 2 stroke things like Pistons :-D

I have to do a bit more Lectron tuning yet, I hope to get a chance to do a back to back Dyno Test, but not this year.

Pete :cheers:
Title: Re: APS/G 250 2 Stroke in the Land of Oz
Post by: SaltPeter on December 04, 2013, 02:12:25 AM: Here is the Start up with the Lectrons fitted

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e8Cm75q2udA

Pete :cheers: