Landracing Forum
Bonneville Motorcycle Speed Trials => Bville Motorcycle Speed Trials Rules Questions => Topic started by: Koncretekid on November 21, 2011, 11:15:02 AM
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I heard a rumor that for 2012 the seat/tailpiece partial streamlining rules will be changed to that similar to the SCTA and ECTA/LTA rules. Basically, SCTA and others allow full tailpiece to extend 10" beyond the rear tire whereas BUB/AMA has required the tailpiece to be cut out from the rear axle back, and from the top of the rear tire down. Can anyone verify this? Important, since I'm building partial streamlining now and don't want to have to change it for BUB.
Tom
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You are correct but you are also wrong. :-P
Yes they are going to allow full fairing and extended tails like you said but it is going to be a seperate "unlimited" class different from partial streamlined.
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Tom --- Really like the tailpiece.
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You are correct but you are also wrong. :-P
Yes they are going to allow full fairing and extended tails like you said but it is going to be a seperate "unlimited" class different from partial streamlined.
Good God, Dan, does that mean a whole new plethora of classes - from 50cc to unlimited? Like A-UPS, or maybe even M-UPS, or both? Sounds like some kind of new courier service. Soon won't be enough room for all the letters and numbers on the bike. Not to mention, longer lines because there will be more classes.
Tom
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Will the SCTA legal long tail be FIM legal?
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Tom, why not build it so either a short or long end cap can just be fastened on with Dzus fasteners? I think it could be a pretty simple design.
Pete
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Tom,
The way I understand it is yes they will be all new classes. The reason for this is all the old records that were set by the old rules would probabaly be obliterated which would really not be fair to the current record holders.
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Pete,
I've considered that, but thought that perchance BUB might try to co-ordinate with SCTA and ECTA rules to make it easier to conform to all. As it is, I'm trying to figure out how to split the fairing to make it easy to remove without too many joints.
Dan,
SCTA and ECTA did not, apparently, worry about previous record holders, but I certainly see the point. As Pete suggests, I could make it work both ways, and go for a record in both classes! Gets complicated.
Tom
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Dan,
SCTA and ECTA did not, apparently, worry about previous record holders, but I certainly see the point. As Pete suggests, I could make it work both ways, and go for a record in both classes! Gets complicated.
Tom
ECTA did worry about previous record holders which is why they waited until now to make the transition to the SCTA changed fairing rule. Remember that ECTA has closed the Maxton Record book so it will be some type of clean slate at Ohio Mile. So it is a perfect time to adopt any new rules that could affect speeds. ECTA fairing rules I believe were the same as SCTA until SCTA chose to change them a few years ago. I fully agree with you Koncretekid that it would be wonderful if all the venues had the same fairing rules so those of us that custom make them would have only one type to design. So once again a big thank you goes out to ECTA for at least making two places the same again.
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The method mentioned by Peter Jack is what I use. The basic streamlining is eligible for FIM, AMA, and DLRA with minor and easy to make changes.
That tail section looks great. How did you make the mold so quickly?
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Soon won't be enough room for all the letters and numbers on the bike. Not to mention, longer lines because there will be more classes.
As good a reason as any to make longer tailpieces legal :-D
G
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One of the questions I am dealing with does not seem to be addressed in the new SCTA/ECTA/LTA rule on partially streamlined seat/tailpiece. It now states that no part of the seat/tailpiece may be closer than 4 inches from the ground. Since most bellypans are closer than 4", there has to be a transition up to 4" at some point. The BUB rule currently reads as follows: "No streamlining behind the rear axel is permitted to be lower than the top rim of the rear wheel." I would suggest to all organizations that this wording, or the contemplated wording as is the case for BUB, be amended to read as follows: "No streamlining behind the rear axel is permitted to be lower than 4" from the ground." That would at least define where the 4" rule would apply. I have to make a decision on this before I can resume work on my fairing.
Wobbly,
See my posting in my build diary as to the method we are using to make the new fairing.
Tom
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Kid.........I think your mixing the BUB / AMA rules for Modified with those of Partial Streamlined............take a look at Tom Mellor's bike and note the differences (removable section behind the axle) when he changes from MPS to M..........I am listening and looking for all details regarding the 4" rule and the transition from bellypan to tail section when in PS class as I am planning to add PS to my Cub.
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Dennis,
What I'm comparing are the special construction (A Class) partially streamlined AMA/BUB rules (2011) with those of SCTA . BUB is rumored (confirmed by Dan from NRHS ) to be changing to something similar to the SCTA rules in 2012. They are very different, and allow you to run the tail section beyond the rear tire 10" and 4" from the ground; in other words, fully enclosing the rear tire. The Forestall Racing bike that Bill Warner rode at Loring is an example, which I will post here for your information. M class is different and I don't know the rules as well.
Tom
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I'm glad your trying to get this sorted..................
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SCTA rule change suggestion cutoff is Sept. 1st.
DW
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Please note that everything is just a proposal at this point. Nothing is actually set in stone yet as they have to meet and decide just what they will and will not allow if anything. Also I have nothing to do with these decisions only heard rumors like everyone else. If I gave the impression that I was part of the decision making or knew something more than is already out there I apologize as that was not my intent.
DO NOT make any changes to your bikes based on anything I said is what I am trying to say. Wait for the rules to be posted or build your bike to SCTA specs and hope that the AMA adopts similar rules. That way if it does not pan out you can still run at SCTA events with what you got.
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Today I received unofficial news that AMA will not be adopting new tailsection rules like SCTA, ECTA, and LTA. They will be running it as a demonstration class only to test the waters. Since I will be competing at Loring first, I will be completing my build to the new LTA, etc. rules. I will wait for the official announcement, and whether I run or not depends upon how much, if any, they intend to charge for this "demonstration" class. I already have the record in my class and it is a large expense just to go.
Tom
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That is a shame Tom. I was looking forward to running with a new tail at BUB this year. It seems odd that they will not conform to SCTA and other rules. That just means that AMA class records will be slower than the equivalent classes at other LSR venues. I can't think of any reason to not equalize the field. The AMA rules started out as a copy of the SCTA rules so why not keep up?
What is the "Demonstration Class" Is that a non record holding class?
Thanks for the notification. I will be waiting for the official rules to see what it actually says.
Don
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Tom, no more record chasing for me. Now and just race for the thrill of going faster with FIM streamlining. Do you know if that will work in the new demo class?
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What is the "Demonstration Class" Is that a non record holding class?
Don
Don't know yet, Don. Maybe that's an invitation to "Demonstrate." Maybe we should start an "Occupy Bonneville Salt Flats" movement.
Tom, no more record chasing for me. Now and just race for the thrill of going faster with FIM streamlining. Do you know if that will work in the new demo class?
"Faster Horses, Younger...", never mind. Yes, the thrill of going faster is what drives us, but it's always nice when there is an acknowledgement at the end of the day.
Tom
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Damn thats a pity
Was discussing this with Charlie H at the Cook shootout as we cut into Richard Assens tailpiece
Maybe FIM will still adopt the scta type regs ???
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Yes.......and it would also be great if SCTA/BNI adopted AMA/FIM rules on sidecars.................OH, well.....Happy Racing in 2012