Landracing Forum
Bonneville Motorcycle Speed Trials => Bville Motorcycle Speed Trials General Chat => Topic started by: xseal on January 03, 2009, 10:24:00 PM
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I'm a relatively experience road racer, have gone 158 or so at Daytona. Mostly race air cooled 2v Ducs in the thunderbike classes. For some reason, I'm keen on going 200, but am totally new to speed racing. Some questions for the experienced:
1) Cheap/safe way to go 200 (used Hayabusa with turbo?)?
2) recommendations for builders/knowledge re: bike set up/geometry/suspension?
3) places/forums to find a bike to buy that might be already built (possible to lease/rent for a speedweek, understanding if you bin it you own it ...?)?
4) should I go as a spectator (or on a road racing bike) this year and race in 2010?
5) what questions am I not smart enough to ask (and what is the answer/where do I get the info)?
6) when does registration start ... and when does it typically fill up?
Many thanks in advance.
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Xseal (do you have a real name?) -
I will answer a few of the questions, and I am sure others will also post their observations.
1. There is no "cheap" way to go over 200 mph. Even if you were to get a cheap 'Busa', KX14, etc, it will still need to be modified with turbo or NOX, gearing, and a dozen other mods that all cost a lot of money. I can't see a way to start from scratch and go over 200 for under $20k. To go along with that, you need entry fees, lodging, transportation, crew, etc.
But you do have several venues, such as Speedweek, World of Speed, El Mirage, Texas Mile, etc.
2. Once you get a platform you want to race, just post questions here. There are dozens of experts of all types, and no shortage of opinions.
3. I don't know of anyone who will rent you a bike. Too much risk.
4. You could come to Speedweek or BUB with a "normal" bike and race it just to get a feel for what is needed, and you will learn a lot in a week.
5. For registrations at the various venues, just keep watching here. Speedweek does not start till spring.
Good Luck
Don
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Welcome to LSR, your wallet will never be the same...
Check the for sale section, I think Jason had a 260 MPH bike there ready to race....
As Don said, there is no cheap way to go 200 on a bike. While every Busa rider will tell ya he has been 200 lots of times, the fact is it takes mods to get it there. Now a new ZX 14 will do 188 out of the box, the next 12 MPH will cost about the same as the first 188.
Where are you located
I would recommend going as a spectator to speedweek or with someone that is racing to learn the ropes.
Or go to the Bub on any bike, run and have fun....
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Thanks for the initial info guys. Much appreciated. I'm close to DC.
I found a used 04 Busa with low miles and a 1397 KWS engine. It appears to be otherwise stock. What other mods would be useful besides the steering damper? Stiffer springs/valving? Longer swing arm? other?
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Run it at Maxton first, then bring it to the Bub. It might have the HP for 200. Many have run them stock length. Look at the rules and go race. If you don't hit the goal the first time then you can make additional improvements.
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Best option is to run at Maxton a couple of times. You will learn a lot about the bike and give yourself a base line to start from. 200 is a lot tougher then most think. Another advantage to going to Maxton is that you can get a lot ideas on mods to a Busa plus the people are helpful.
Joe
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So far everything you've been offered here -- is right. Our 2008 ZX14R went 188 at SpeedWeek. To get it over 200 we'll be bringing some more CCs to the tracks. The fastest bike at Maxton was a stock-length swing arm 'Busa (ran 261 in the standing mile). Go to SpeedWeek as a spectator, then attend either Bub's or World of Speed with a race bike. Go to Maxton and learn and make some runs.
Maxton's first meet (late March/early April) is the Hot Rod magazine-sponsored event, and there'll be lots of entries -- so you should expect to get in only a few runs. Go to watch -- and in May take a bike and have at it.
A 1397 KWS engine should be able to make the 225 or so hp it'll take to go 200. More would be good -- but it'll take some dollars to get more hp out of the engine if there are no other mods than the increased displacement. Well, of course -- your gearing will need to be adjusted to get you enough top speed -- but take a handful of sprockets to the track and work your way up.
Registration doesn't "fill up" at any of the events, save Texas. Registering early doesn't give you an advantage - except that it'll cost you more to register at the track than in advance.
Enough? Ask more questions -- we're all here to help get you on the race course right behind us.
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Watch out Xseal, this stuff is addictive. You may think 200 is your only goal but once you begin and then reach 200 joining a 200 club will become the target. These two objectives require different bikes unless you only run at Texas. I would research the records at the venue you wish to try and then build an engine to meet that goal. Stick with one location as Salt bikes are considerably different from milers. Please ask questions, most of us have been there done that. And yes a stock Busa/14 chassis will be fine for your intended speeds.
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Whatsa KWS?
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KWS is the name of Kevin Hunt's business, he builds great proven road race and drag racing engines for GSXR's and Hayabusa's..843-552-7177
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Go and do it. Running on the salt is not like running at Daytona. Experience helps even if you just do a few run what ya brung runs at the Bub event this year.
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Welcome to LSR, your wallet will never be the same...
As Don said, there is no cheap way to go 200 on a bike. While every Busa rider will tell ya he has been 200 lots of times, the fact is it takes mods to get it there. Now a new ZX 14 will do 188 out of the box, the next 12 MPH will cost about the same as the first 188.
Stainless you hit it right on the head. My 06 ZX-14 p/p stock went 189.6 mph in 2006 and then did 199.678 in 2008. I haven't added up all the costs but to go an additional 10.078 mph has cost me approximately 9 grand. I could have broken the 200 mph barrier if Mr. Noonan hadn't lost his cell phone on the course--
By the way xseal welcome to the site and I recommend Maxton or the Texas mile to break that 200 barrier as those runs are at seal level and your engine will produce more power, not to mention better traction.
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Welcome to LSR, your wallet will never be the same...
As Don said, there is no cheap way to go 200 on a bike. While every Busa rider will tell ya he has been 200 lots of times, the fact is it takes mods to get it there. Now a new ZX 14 will do 188 out of the box, the next 12 MPH will cost about the same as the first 188.
Stainless you hit it right on the head. My 06 ZX-14 p/p stock went 189.6 mph in 2006 and then did 199.678 in 2008. I haven't added up all the costs but to go an additional 10.078 mph has cost me approximately 8 grand. I could have broken the 200 mph barrier if Mr. Noonan hadn't lost his cell phone on the course--
By the way xseal welcome to the site and I recommend Maxton or the Texas mile to break that 200 barrier as those runs are at seal level and your engine will produce more power, not to mention better traction.
Bill,
Good luck with that 200 run, better let Deb ride it... :evil:
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Just a quick update on John's reference to KWS Motorsports. They do indeed build great, powerful, and reliable stuff. However, the big news for 2009 is that KWS has been named the factory Aprilia team in the AMA Daytona Sportbike road race series. Look for their two RSV Mille's in the Daytona 200 at the beginning of March and all season! This is a great opportunity for Kevin and his guys!
Jack Broomall
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Somone might do it for 20K or under.. I am thinking.
A local guy from here in B.C. on a ZX10 with stock engine ran 176 on the RWB in 07
Ran in 08 with nitrous and got a 191 or 192 I think
So it may be possible.. I think he was into it for under 10K..
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You can go 200mph for less than $5,000. Buy a used 98-2000 Yamaha r1 install a Nitrous kit with 60 hp jets.
Mine ran 206mph in 2001 with stock piston, cams etc.
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Scott,
I dont think it is always expensive but it takes a lot more then most people think to go 200 regarding setup and engineering. Someone new to LSR couldn't have done it without a lot of help from experienced people.
Joe