Landracing Forum
El Mirage => El Mirage General Chat => Topic started by: velocity on June 23, 2009, 01:32:23 AM
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TV's Jesse James fraudulently claims besting BMW's FIA ratified hydrogen-powered World Record Speed Record
Cable TV personality Jesse James claims he set the world record for hydrogen-powered vehicles on June 16th on the southern California El Mirage dry lake.
The claim is without merit since the activities were conducted without benefit of any motorsports sanctioning authority. The vehicle was neither inspected, nor certified and all the timing personnel were on the James TV payroll.
World speed records require two runs over a one-mile course within one hour. James was 5,148 feet short -- being timed one-way for a total of 132 feet; he made only three or four passes over an eight to ten-hour period. Any world record holder will tell you it’s quite a technical feat to hold speed for a full mile.
The baseless speed stunt was reportedly for "the season-ending episode of James's TV show, Jesse James is a Dead Man." The episode is set to air in early August.
James claims to have bested the FIA ratified BMW HR2 record of 185 mph. The BMW HR2 race car set 9 international and FIA-ratified land-speed records for hydrogen cars at the Miramas Proving Grounds in France. The BMW HR2 is one of the few hydrogen cars developed with internal combustion engine (ICE) technology instead of fuel cell technology.
Mr. James efforts count for absolutely nothing on the world motorsports stage and amount to little more than a self-promoting “TV racer” PR stunt since he chose to ignore the sport's sanctioning rules that have applied to all records certified for the past 80 years.
When contacted to explain the fraudulent claim, James responded with a short crude retort that reminded this writer that vulgarity is indeed the refuge of a destitute mind.
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Who are you?..what do you race? Where are you from? Why are you hatin on Sandra's hubby..?
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Who are you?..what do you race? Where are you from? Why are you hatin on Sandra's hubby..?
:cheers:
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Land Speed Louise
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Badmouthing another racer never comes off well, especially in a motorsport with a high incident of casualities.
FIA records, you pay for the timing as well, IIRC.
But going 199 at Elmo is pretty fast no matter how you look at it, and is REALLY fast using hydrogen as fuel.
Informal records get a lot of folk pretty aggitated, but they have weight sometimes, at least for the ones who aim for them.
World's fastest man isn't actually a record, since there were no timing lights available, but 25,000+ mph was pretty fast for the Apollo crews.
While I'm not famous, I specifically targeted an informal record when I started out racing our truck, which was ~163mph; "World's fastest production diesel truck". And yup, I catch flak for making that claim. Not from the guy who held it, who congratulated me, but mostly from non-racers.
Best course of action is perhaps to just to either say Congrats, or bite your tongue, unless you also claim that same informal record.
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James responded with a short crude retort that reminded this writer that vulgarity is indeed the refuge of a destitute mind.
That speaker who first resorts to personal attack or vulgarity does so because the failure of his principal argument is apparent, and is thereby effectively defeated.
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you pay for the timing as well
And I'll pay for my record with the proceeds of my TV deal.
We all have one, don't we?
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I'll admit it seems unfair that folk who spend decades aiming at their goal often never get "press" when they finally achieve them, yet a public personality can do pretty much anything and get national acclaim instantly. But who is audience for each? The hardcore LSR folk get the respect of their peers. The TV show personality gets respect in People Magazine.
No, I'm not a member of the JJ fan club, I really don't know him, and in his TV stuff he comes off as an ahole, IMO. I'm told he is far different in person, dunno.
But throw out the personalities, these are hotrod cars and racers driving them. Going 199 at Elmo no matter how you do it is pretty dang fast. It's a fast car, and the driver did it without mishap.
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It is interesting what you can get praised on TV. I have seen people or teams that get wonderful press when they fail to reach their goal. We were covered a couple of years ago by a TV team only to fail miserably, breaking parts and such. We were attempting to get the car running well enough to put Mary in the car, but didn't. I am happy that they didn't produce the failure, but maybe it would be good to reveal to the TV audience how difficult it can be to set a record. As far as the J.J. is concerned, I can't understand why Hydrogen is such a poor fuel. Our car is about half the cubic inches, normally aspirated and to me it is miserable to go less than 200 mph on the lake bed.
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I'm certainly no chemist, but here's how I understand it. While lb for lb, hydrogen releases more energy than other fuels, you aren't putting it in the engine by weight, but by volume. Going by that, even propane is 8 times more punch than hydrogen. This is why diesel on paper makes less power, but in reality makes more power, than gasoline.
Nitromethane is actually pretty weak lb for lb, but it makes some really good power.
Thinking of hydrogen as a "clean" fuel is a bit scetchy. Commercial hydrogen comes from refining petroleum IIRC. Sure it burns clean, but what happened to the all the carbon that used to be attached to it? It still gets burned, so the net outcome isn't much different than just burning the gasoline to begin with, it just moves the tailpipe.
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McRat
I have agreed with most verything you have said in the past. But I bet if after you set an official record and then along comes someone making a claim that they have bettered you without the same constraints you will not be quiet.
Historical accuracy is what this is all about.
Respectfully,
Gary
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McRat
I have agreed with most verything you have said in the past. But I bet if after you set an official record and then along comes someone making a claim that they have bettered you without the same constraints you will not be quiet.
Historical accuracy is what this is all about.
Respectfully,
Gary
Nothing that JJ and his team says will pull that FIA cert off the wall at BMW(?). While they did go faster, BMW has the hardware.
To a minor extent, we have something going on the diesel hotrod community in the same vein. Two trucks claim to be the fastest diesel pickup. Banks holds FIA, SPAL holds SCTA-BNI. Who is right? Depends on who you ask: Both, One, or neither. Neither were diesel pickups when sold, and each one holds a different record which says they are the fastest. But both were solid efforts by true hotrdders.
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Darn I can't think of the guy [a professor from Colorado I believe] who used to run a hydrogen car at Bville and MAKE HIS OWN FROM THE SALT WHILE THERE!
Was it Ben Jordon? I talked to him on the phone years ago and I believe he said they had to set the spark timing about top dead center because it ignited so fast.
JL222
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Hydrogen can be made from water by just passing a bunch of electricity through it. If you start with hydro-electric power or nuclear power, and used water to make it, it would truly be a green fuel, but as I understand it, that's not the way it's made commercially. Too inefficient.
Sidebar -
Everytime fuel prices skyrocket, a hundred snake-oil salesmen pop up with Hydrogen Generator systems to plug into your car/truck and increase your mileage up to 50%. They take battery electricity, and make a miniscule amount of hydrogen and feed it into the intake. Uh... how did they generate the electricity? By burning fuel. It's a net loss, not gain. But thousands fall for it everytime.
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Thinking of hydrogen as a "clean" fuel is a bit scetchy. Commercial hydrogen comes from refining petroleum IIRC. Sure it burns clean, but what happened to the all the carbon that used to be attached to it? It still gets burned, so the net outcome isn't much different than just burning the gasoline to begin with, it just moves the tailpipe.
Most hydrogen is made from natural gas.
Why there is so much hype about hydrogen as a fuel and not natural gas is beyond, me but I guess you don't get grants to research a fuel that is already used for vehicles.
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Thinking of hydrogen as a "clean" fuel is a bit scetchy. Commercial hydrogen comes from refining petroleum IIRC. Sure it burns clean, but what happened to the all the carbon that used to be attached to it? It still gets burned, so the net outcome isn't much different than just burning the gasoline to begin with, it just moves the tailpipe.
Most hydrogen is made from natural gas.
Why there is so much hype about hydrogen as a fuel and not natural gas is beyond, me but I guess you don't get grants to research a fuel that is already used for vehicles.
I stand corrected. But yes, they would be better off just burning the natural gas as far as "clean fuels" goes. You can make diesel from natural gas too, I have a 55g drum of it sitting here that I need to test sometime. Rumor has it that it makes a little more power than pump diesel.
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Some good info here... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen
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McRat.
You are right as usual. It is up the powers that be in the sanctioning bodies to share/recognize the rules/standards of others. And that will never happen.
Gary
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Back in the late 1960's....early 1970's I worked for Pacific Lighting Corp. while there was involved in
Dual Fuel Inc. in R&D work in making vehicles run on compressed natural gas.......we did a lot of work
on making busses (diesel) run on CNG.....in fact many cities at this time still use CNG for their local transportation needs. If set up properly CNG will give great power in both diesel and petrol engines.......and it is very clean burning.
In regards to Mr. JJ, I have met him several times in past years, and he has alway worked very hard being the "All American Bad Boy"....I know he is in "show business" so the persona he presents is part of the "business" I fully understand that.....However, in working the Custom Chrome Show in Germany, Mr. JJ was to be the big attraction and when interviewed on the podium by the promotor of the show
he made a complete a##&s out of himself to the point that the many Europeans attending the dealer show just walked out of the interview hall......any respect I had for the man and what he has done....or will do in the future... is gone.
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Ben Jordan did run a hydrogen vehicle at the salt. I am sure that Stainless can recount the experience, (and the general panic...LOL), that resulted.
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BAK189,
if you are interested in CNG, check out my website www.lessmanracing.com. i ran a 311 with a peak speed of 324 last September with at least one dead cylinder. think we have the problem fixed, engine is due back at my shop in a couple of weeks and we will be getting ready for the WOS in September.
Roger L
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hydrogen car at Bville and MAKE HIS OWN FROM THE SALT WHILE THERE
Sodium chloride > hydrogen requires nuclear fission.
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Ben Jordan did run a hydrogen vehicle at the salt. I am sure that Stainless can recount the experience, (and the general panic...LOL), that resulted.
The car was driven by a USAF Tsgt. in 1981 :cheers:
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How does that famous song go, oh yea
Hooray for Hollywood !!!!
Tom G.
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hydrogen car at Bville and MAKE HIS OWN FROM THE SALT WHILE THERE
Sodium chloride > hydrogen requires nuclear fission.
I take it you mean that to cheaply produce large quantity's of hydrogen from water cheaply you would need nuclear fission. And not actually what you said? I just watched some guy make hydrogen and oxygen from water and salt and a battery on the science channel. Demonstrating how to make rocket fuel on Ganymede.
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How does that famous song go, oh yea
Hooray for Hollywood !!!!
Tom G.
I've raced at a few diesel events where they had TV coverage, but it seems everytime it doubles the length of the event. And should you get interviewed, there is only a slim chance you'll be on the air, and it stops you from working on your stuff. They'll film 8 hours of stuff for a 22 minute show. But it certainly helps on a race resume if you can list media coverage, so I still get my hopes up.
If anyone saw "Dateline"? a couple days ago about Ari Squire crushing that kid under a truck to pull an insurance scam, they wanted to interview me since I did the tuning for his sledpulling truck and talked with him quite a bit before the killing. I declined to be interviewed, because his murder of that innocent kid had nothing to do with motorsports.
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i guess there is a little pissing maych going on over this deal.... i got this email a couple of days ago...
----- Original Message -----
From: LandSpeed Louise
To: News Alert
Cc: tom.kowaleski@bmwna.com
Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 10:54 PM
Subject: TV's Jesse James fraudulently claims besting BMW's FIA ratified hydrogen-powered World Record Speed Record
TV's Jesse James fraudulently claims besting BMW's FIA ratified hydrogen-powered World Record Speed Record
Cable TV personality Jesse James claims he set the world record for hydrogen-powered vehicles on June 16th on the southern California El Mirage dry lake.
The claim is without merit since the activities were conducted without benefit of any motorsports sanctioning authority. The vehicle was neither inspected, nor certified and all the timing personnel were on the James TV payroll.
World speed records require two runs over a one-mile course within one hour. James was 5,148 feet short -- being timed one-way for a total of 132 feet; he made only three or four passes over an eight to ten-hour period. Any world record holder will tell you it’s quite a technical feat to hold speed for a full mile.
The baseless speed stunt was reportedly for "the season-ending episode of James's TV show, Jesse James is a Dead Man." The episode is set to air in early August.
James claims to have bested the FIA ratified BMW HR2 record of 185 mph. The BMW HR2 race car set 9 international and FIA-ratified land-speed records for hydrogen cars at the Miramas Proving Grounds in France .. The BMW HR2 is one of the few hydrogen cars developed with internal combustion engine (ICE) technology instead of fuel cell technology.
Mr. James efforts count for absolutely nothing on the world motorsports stage and amount to little more than a self-promoting “TV racer” PR stunt since he chose to ignore the sport's sanctioning rules that have applied to all records certified for the past 80 years.
When contacted to explain the fraudulent claim, James responded with a short crude retort that reminded this writer that vulgarity is indeed the refuge of a destitute mind.
Speedy Regards,
"LandSpeed" Louise Ann Noeth
Studio: 314.692.0247 C.S. T.
Mobile: 805.312.0893 C.S. T.
Member: Society of Professional Journalists, American Auto Racing Writers & Broadcasters, Motor Press Guild, Society of Automotive Historians, Western Automotive Journalists, Society of Land Speed Racing Historians
www.landspeedproductions.biz
"Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body; but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out and loudly proclaiming "Wow! What a Ride!"
P Please consider the environment before printing this email.
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Ben Jordan did run a hydrogen vehicle at the salt. I am sure that Stainless can recount the experience, (and the general panic...LOL), that resulted.
Look to the left Ben's little Abarth that ran Hydrogen. Mechanical injection, turbo and timing to TDC 8-) I sure miss Ben. He was a real interesting person. One of a kind.
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hydrogen car at Bville and MAKE HIS OWN FROM THE SALT WHILE THERE
Sodium chloride > hydrogen requires nuclear fission.
I take it you mean that to cheaply produce large quantity's of hydrogen from water cheaply you would need nuclear fission. And not actually what you said? I just watched some guy make hydrogen and oxygen from water and salt and a battery on the science channel. Demonstrating how to make rocket fuel on Ganymede.
If you want to get hydrogen from sodium chloride you would need to break down each element into it's sub-atomic particles, i.e. electrons, protons, etc. They could then rearrange and some hydrogen would result. Nuclear fission would be one way.
Producing hydrogen from water merely requires passing an electric current through water. Sodium chloride dissolved in the water enhances the effectiveness. But it is still a very energy inefficient method and you would still need a way to pressurize the gas in order to carry it onboard.
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The point of this thread was to inform the LSR community of a liar and a cheat. To claim and vigorously publicize a World Record, any record, without benefit of independent sanction and observation, is to insult the efforts of all those who were willing to be judged by their abilities on an even playing field.
Having watched some people go to their deaths attempting to set a record, the idea of staying quiet while some TV personality hijacks the sport's integrity is not possible for me.
Let's be clear, I have no axe to grind with the man, the machine or the fuel choice. I have long been an advocate of hydrogen, writing a national award-winning article in 1986 about its virtues if the cost factor could be overcome. Had James claimed he had exceeded the current FIA World record with a one-way pass then this discussion would not be taking place and we might instead be wondering if he could set a record. Instead, he chose to disrespect every speed record holder -- World, National and BNI International -- by claiming "membership" in a place where he hasn't even visited.
Case in point: Ohio State University's (OSU) Buckeye Bullet exceeded Pat Rummerfield's White Lightening electric World Record but OSU never claimed a world record. Instead, they went back and ran under world record rules and prevailed. Rummerfield, in the meantime, was so impressed with the team's integrity and show of speed that he publicly announced that the Buckye Bullet Team was indeed the fastest even if they hadn't yet set the FIA World Record.
That, ladies and gentlemen, is how fair play works, with integrity and honesty, not grabbing what you want and shouting it to the world because you have well-financed PR machine to do whatever you please at the expense of others.
LandSpeed Louise Ann Noeth
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If I remember my school days physics rightly Hydrogen is the most common gas in the universe!
Why is Alcohol more popular/fun and served in most bars around the world jeez you can even make it yourself with almost anything.Hmm thats maybe why my eyesight is failing.
If Hydrogen gas is so common where and why have they hidden it.
On the matter of JJ whether or not the record is legitimate if it gets people interested in the sport as the Worlds Fastest Indian did with me, it can be nothing other than a good thing.
Alcohol is the answer......What was the question.
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From Hemmings Motor news
The outlaw Jesse James stirs up controversy in land-speed racing
So did Jesse James set a record or not?
That’s the question buzzing around the landspeed racing community this week after the motorcycle builder and television star drove a hydrogen-powered streamliner to 199.7 MPH at El Mirage on June 16.
Of course, the press release issued by Spike — the network airing James’s show, for which the run was filmed — claims that he did break the record for hydrogen-powered, piston-engined, wheel-driven vehicles, topping an earlier speed of 184 MPH set by BMW.
And nobody seems to doubt that James did indeed reach that speed in the 1960s-era Dees Milodon Engineering – Davis B 777 streamliner, which James (under the guidance of land-speed racer Mike Cook) bought, lengthened, updated and fitted with a twin-turbo 780hp 572-cu.in. big-block Chevrolet V-8, converted to suck down 5,000 PSI of hydrogen.
But the controversy, spearheaded by landspeed racing historian Louise Noeth, centers on which sanctioning body supervised the run and how exactly the run could be stamped with a record. Noeth has stated that because no sanctioning body oversaw the run, it does not qualify for a record. The Southern California Timing Association, the sanctioning body that typically runs events at El Mirage, has distanced themselves from the run and stated that James never set any record.
Mike Cook, who not only helped James build the streamliner, but also handled course layout and timing for the run through his company, Cook’s Land Speed Events, said that, indeed, the run was not part of a sanctioned event. “We didn’t feel there was any reason for sanctioning this event,” Cook said. “Because there is no class to sanction the car in.” While the BMW’s record was FIA sanctioned, Cook said FIA provides no class for non-production-based vehicles such as James’s. However, Cook said he did use FIA-certified timing equipment and set up the course for James’s run exactly as courses are set up for typical racing at El Mirage.
“Jesse only wanted to go 200 MPH on hydrogen,” Cook said. “And he is going to try again to meet that goal.”
- By Daniel Strohl
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I'd say that once again we're caught in a battle of terminology. JJ exceeded the world record speed (assuming that the timing equipment is correct, and I have absolutely no reason to doubt it with Mike Cook and his gang involved). So he did break the record speed.
Did he set a record? Well, no -- since the record-setting machinery requires very precise conditions be met -- such as the return run, the length of the timed stretch, and on and on. Did he go faster than the standing world record? Yes, he did.
So I'm saying that if his publicity had stated that he exceeded the world record speed -- we wouldn't be having this discussion (well, maybe not). But by claiming to have "set" a record -- there's the problem.
Will he/can he run under FIA sanctioning to get a real, honest-to-goodness record that we'll all be able to accept? Stay tuned. But I betcha we'll have to stay tuned for a looooooong time. It's on to other things, I figure.
PS Thanks, for checking in here, Louise. It's been a while since we've heard from you.
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"If Hydrogen gas is so common where and why have they hidden it."
Most of it is in stars being converted to heavier elements. Free hydrogen is extremely rare on earth. It seems to have an affinity for oxygen.
"Alcohol is the answer......What was the question."
The question was, "What's for dinner?"
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There's nothing "green" about nuclear power. Having worked on nuclear programs of several types in my career, I got to know a little bit about it. While the high-level waste from the fuel rods gets all the attention, the real impact is the hundreds of thousands of tons of low-level activated steel and concrete that get to sit for a mere century or two on what was some valuable real estate.
As far as JJ goes, maybe instead of slamming people who don't understand the history and sanctioning, we could advise them before hand so that they could use the word "un-sanctioned". Or better yet, get them to go through the hassle of a sanctioned record and settle the issue. Why didn't JJ's adviser advise him to at least do the former?
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I agree with SSS. Seems it's all about linguistics (the science of pasta).
Does "broke the record" = "set the record"?
Broke indicates making something non-functional, so you'd think it would point towards setting a new record. But some say breaking a record is just exceeding it, but not necessary setting it, ie - "I broke the record, but DNF'd the backup run, so no hardware for me!"
Either way, it sure sounded mean, no matter who's dictionary is in force. :cheers:
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Jessie knew he would get no more then a certificate of speed that they provided. He also knew that it would not be an official record. Several years ago SCTA provided a special course of a jet car at El Mirage for some Englishman to run and become the fastest Brit. He did not get any kind of record only a certificate of the speed he ran. I was the timer at that time and it was a hassel to go through the prep etc. for two runs. I think at that time SCTA said no more special car deals. It cost them a lot of money to make it happen. Equipment, workers emergency equipment, permits etc., etc. The driver in the rent a jet complained all day about the heat, dust and was a little scared after the runs. It takes as much effort to run one car as it does a meet.
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I was thinking about the JJ drama and was wondering what the run up distance was before the lights? I have run 240 mph at El Mirage last year unfaired on a good course and this year ran 223 on the same bike unfaired on a crappy course.
I was wondering what was the actual run up distance was before the racer was at the clocks..?
Let's agree that the driver went faster than the FIA "World" record however the racer only went one way, what is the fastest the FIA record holder went one way?
J
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I was told the other day that the press will print whatever they think makes a good headline or story regardless of what a LSR team may tell them. I am so glad that it is an American argument.
Glen - regarding the Englishman I would be interested in further details of this 'rent a jet' activity to "become the fastest Brit". If it was after 1983 a speed of over 623 mph would have been needed to be the absolute fastest. Whose jet car? (Send me a personal mail please.)
John- the FIA only publish the average speeds for two way runs. So, to find out the highest speed the Hydrogen BMW went would need the timesheets from the officials for the attempt or information from BMW. No peak speeds would have been recorded officially, but a manufacturer would have some instrumentation to tell them.
I know its not fair, but the International (FIA) standing start mile average speed (two runs in 60 minutes) of a 250cc Kart set here in the UK was better than the World record average speed set by the hydrogen BMW! (but as it was not by over 1% the record remains with BMW).
Malcolm UK.
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Malcom, was this a hydrogen powered kart.....
also i noticed in Louise' post that it mentions
"Society of Land Speed Racing Historians"...........
does anyone know when this society was founded, by whom, and how many members...?...
im doing a research project..
Joe :)
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Malcom, was this a hydrogen powered kart.....
also i noticed in Louise' post that it mentions
"Society of Land Speed Racing Historians"...........
does anyone know when this society was founded, by whom, and how many members...?...
im doing a research project..
Joe :)
www.landspeedracing.com/
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also i noticed in Louise' post that it mentions
"Society of Land Speed Racing Historians"...........
does anyone know when this society was founded, by whom, and how many members...?...
im doing a research project..
Joe :)
Joe, do a google search. Jim Miller and many others have been working on this project for around 5 years? Lots of video, pictures, & text.
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I found the official press release (see below). I find it odd that they state "Jessie's time was documented by the Southern California Timing Association". But it must be true it's on the internet. Anyway I don't understand why some people are so wound up about this, It's a television show and it effects me not at all. The only people I can figure should have their panties in a wad are the BMW folks.
Jesse James Shatters a Land Speed Record for a Hydrogen Powered Vehicle
Jesse James Successfully Reaches 199.7mph While Filming His Hit Show "Jesse James Is A Dead Man" on Spike TV
EL MIRAGE DRY LAKE BED, Calif., June 17 /PRNewswire/ -- Jesse James successfully shattered the land speed record for a hydrogen powered vehicle yesterday in the Mojave Desert. James attempted the challenge while filming his hit television show "Jesse James Is A Dead Man" which premiered May 30, 2009. The show was filmed yesterday and will air as the season one finale of "Jesse James Is A Dead Man" premiering on Sunday, August 9 (10:00 PM, ET/PT) on Spike TV.
Jesse's time was documented by the Southern California Timing Association and beat the previous record holder, the BMW H2R, which previously held the land-speed record for an H2 car of 185mph in Germany. The vehicle used by Jesse was an emission free vehicle with a "Breathable Exhaust."
Jesse went to El Mirage Dry Lake Bed with an extreme purpose: to break the land speed record of 185 MPH for a hydrogen-fueled vehicle. It's a record that has long been on his mind and it has not been an easy road getting here. Jesse has consulted the help of legendary land speed racer Mike Cook. Mike gave Jesse invaluable advice on the design of the car. He also helped Jesse pick up the nuance of driving the car and was with him in the testing phase. Engine wizard Kurt Urban came from Detroit and auto row to help him develop a superior hydrogen engine: an internal combustion throwback to the days of overpowering American steel. Together they created an emission free vehicle that will dispel any notions of the power of alternative fuels. Jesse prepared for a worst case scenario situation by escaping from a burning fuselage, narrowly avoiding injury and testing his mettle to the limit.
"Jesse James Is A Dead Man" is being produced for Spike TV by executive producers Jesse James and Hildie Katibah through his production company, Payupsucker Productions, in conjunction with executive producers John Brenkus and Mickey Stern of BASE Productions ("Sport Science," "Crime 360"). Kevin Lee also serves as executive producer. Sharon Levy and Tim Duffy are executives in charge of production for Spike TV.
Jesse James is a custom bike and car builder, producer, publisher, television host and restaurateur. In 2000, James started his TV career with Discovery Channel's "Motorcycle Mania," and in 2002 produced and starred in the international television hit, "Monster Garage." Before his TV gigs, James started West Coast Choppers by doing what he loved, building motorcycles in his mom's garage. As an expert welder, James produces only 12-14 bikes a year, making a very long wait list for his coveted custom machines.
More recently, James established his own production company, Payupsucker Productions, and in 2004, he became publisher of Garage Magazine and launched Payupsucker Publications. In 2006 he opened an eco-friendly burger joint, Cisco Burger, in Long Beach, CA.
SOURCE Spike TV[/color][/b]
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Open this link and read about Gas Up 2009.
The historians have come out of this annual induction group.
http://www.oilstick.com/09gasupinfo/invitation.htm
FREUD
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I'm away from home and don't have access to my files but part of the people that are in the historian group are:
Bret Kepner
Rcihard Parks
Jim Miller
John Thawley
Greg Sharp
J.D.Tone
Eric Rickman
Jack Underwood
Glenn Freudenberger
Mark Brazeau for 2009
Add Pork Pie to the list.
A few years of memories in that group.
The foto is of the class of 2008.
FREUD
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Wow. :-o
That "press release" was way out of line.
I think they owe the BMW driver and crew a big fat apology and a retraction.
Anything nice I said about JJ (other than the car sounded good, which it did) I retract and apologize for.
That states the SCTA ran it, and the Team BMW record is no longer a record. Neither of which are true, and are actually a slam of another racing team.
:x
LSL was absolutely correct in her trashing of JJ.
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As stated, I am a member for the research work I have done for many people concerning the speeds reached by members of their families in the past. I enjoy what I do and feel it is important for those wanting inform ation to get the facts, at least the ones I can, correct.
With all it's rights, priviledges, and $$'s I purchased breakfast this morning for $6.15 and a tip of $1.00...The societys part of the bill was $0.00 which they covered gracefully my part $7.15. I'm sure Freud uses his monthy payment as I do. Isn't violunteerism grand...........JD
Frued forgot our most infamous member...and so will I
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Freud, Jimmy...looks like you guys are in good company with Louise....Im
proud of you guys....
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JoeA - the kart did not run on hydrogen. The "World Records" under FIA are regardless of category and class. Just making the point that this BMW was not a vehicle for acceleration.
The fastest average speed listed for the BMW Hydrogen car was for the kilometre distance from a flying start.
Malcolm UK
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Below was posted on another forum I frequent..the authors name is in the first line.
JESSEJAMES
BAMF with 28 legs.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: LBC
Posts: 370
I guess since SCTA is being Dicks this means My top speed just went up to the actual speed I ran.
201.59mph
Thanks SCTA!
__________________
VANILLA GORILLA
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jj cant set a scta record or join the dirty 2 (200 mph club ) unless he is a member of one of the 12 clubs ---guest can not set a record at el mirage willie buchta
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jj cant set a scta record or join the dirty 2 (200 mph club ) unless he is a member of one of the 12 clubs ---guest can not set a record at el mirage willie buchta
Willie,
I believe he is a member of a club...not mine however..
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strange why didnt he come to the last race and really set a record --- i would have cheered for him ---not mine either --------------------------- willie buchta
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Below was posted on another forum I frequent..the authors name is in the first line.
JESSEJAMES
BAMF with 28 legs.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: LBC
Posts: 370
I guess since SCTA is being Dicks this means My top speed just went up to the actual speed I ran.
201.59mph
Thanks SCTA!
__________________
VANILLA GORILLA
It appears the Vanilla Gorilla doesn't know or doesn't care who was Timing him. The SCTA didn't diss him, just said it didn't have anything to do with his "production". and where did he get that number? Everyone who races with the SCTA knows the speed go to 3 places behind the decimal point, and the ECTA goes to 5. So, is his "Official" Speed 199.700? and his exit is 201.590? or am i just getting anal again?
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Sounds like he's perhaps using GPS info for the 201?
We call that G-Tech Racing in drag racing:
"Wow! I ran a 11.95 last weekend, the first 2010 Camaro into the 11's!"
"Congrats. Post up a timeslip."
"I did that on Farm Road 205W with my G-Tech."
:roll: "Anything you say, slick. Get us a timeslip, or STFU."
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http://www.wired.com/autopia/2009/06/jesse-james/
check out this edited article
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found it on west coast choppers site
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I don't know which club he's in, but if he was in mine, I'd think about getting him out.
Stan Back
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the gear grinders require a 100% yes vote for a new member ---i was worried when i took sheri to get voted in that someone would vote NO ---she would always swear it was me ---every thing went O.K. willie buchta
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What all does it take to get FIA certified?
I just looked at BMW's records with their hydrogen car, and one is proclaiming they are the fastest hydrogen dragster (0-1/4mi standing start) with a blistering 60mph trap speed. That's solidly in Motorhome territory, or 1963 VW Beetle.
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He is a member of the LSR and I think its pertty cool. :cheers: Come on you guys need to move on give the man a break..
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"ozone friendly"? Ummmmm, did anyone measure the oxides of nitrogen? While it may have been carbon free, it is the NOx emissions from lean burn and high temperature that deplete the ozone layer.
"couple million dollars"? I could build an ALSR for that...
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"ozone friendly"? Ummmmm, did anyone measure the oxides of nitrogen? While it may have been carbon free, it is the NOx emissions from lean burn and high temperature that deplete the ozone layer.
"couple million dollars"? I could build an ALSR for that...
NOx seems to be the #1 concern of the EPA, especially with diesels. Our trucks are getting urea aftertreatment next year, and two watercooled EGR logs.
Big boost makes big amounts of NOx.
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This is Jesse's responce to SCTA President Roy Creels letter stating the SCTA had nothing to do with his "Record" from over on the HAMB site.
"The SCTA (Southern Calif. Timing Association) was neither involved in, nor did we confirm Mr Jame's "record". In fact, Mr James did not set any record.
What he did accomplish was to exceed an existing record speed previously set by BMW.
His private timing event was timed by the same folks that time SCTA events and the course was set up by the same folks who set SCTA courses." Roy Creel, President, SCTA"
Nice!
The way I see it I played by SCTA's rules on everything. I had Mike Cook oversee everything we did on the car. I had "official" timing equipment set up, and got an SCTA official speed of 199.7mph. The car actually went 201.59mph on my GPS past the speed traps.
Since SCTA is now being Dicks since this was not "sanctioned" event?
I'm going to consider 201.59mph my top speed
First Hydrogen I.C.E. car to Break 200mph
Thanks SCTA!!
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would hydrogen just put you in the fuel class ---or is there actually a hydrogen class--- i would think
if it did that record is over 400 mph ---what sanctioning body is the record with---i know if i were to break a record at bonneville i cant claim it at el mirage------- l would guess that JJ best brag would be " i have the fastest hydrogen car at el mirage ---that and 2 dollars will get you a cup of coffee --just some thoughts--------------------------------------------------- willie buchta
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Bill Cosby claimed 200 mph in 1968.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/200_M.P.H. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/200_M.P.H.)
I'd sooner believe him than the 'Vanilla Gorilla'.
Mike
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What is it that everyone don't understand. He got a certificate of speed at 199.700 mph. It was a 132 foot timing trap, there is no exit speed trap and I don't know where the 201 mph speed came from unless it was a GPS on the car. The car if run under a SCTA/BNI meet would run as a AA/BFS. The record at Bonneville is Burklands 417 mph and at the lakes Leggitt's 305 mph record. I am sure we would all like to see it run under a sanction meet.
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i think Cosby's story is a lot funnier than this one.... Hey Jesse, ever here the Cosby 200mph story...pm me if ya want a copy...
Kent
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This is Jesse's responce to SCTA President Roy Creels letter stating the SCTA had nothing to do with his "Record" from over on the HAMB site.
"The SCTA (Southern Calif. Timing Association) was neither involved in, nor did we confirm Mr Jame's "record". In fact, Mr James did not set any record.
What he did accomplish was to exceed an existing record speed previously set by BMW.
His private timing event was timed by the same folks that time SCTA events and the course was set up by the same folks who set SCTA courses." Roy Creel, President, SCTA"
Nice!
The way I see it I played by SCTA's rules on everything. I had Mike Cook oversee everything we did on the car. I had "official" timing equipment set up, and got an SCTA official speed of 199.7mph. The car actually went 201.59mph on my GPS past the speed traps.
Since SCTA is now being Dicks since this was not "sanctioned" event?
I'm going to consider 201.59mph my top speed
First Hydrogen I.C.E. car to Break 200mph
Thanks SCTA!!
Looks like he respects the SCTA. Why should anyone give him a break, he sounds a little spoiled to me. Once he shows up to an event then he will get some respect. He has done two LSR type builds both timed without showing up to any event. Show up, race on our track with the same conditions and he will get my respect. :cheers:
Troy Langlo
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another comparison off the top of my head would be.....
for those who have been at or competed in powerlifting.....
someone trains to break the "world record" bench press....
they find someone who is a powerlifting official from a sanctioning
body....they utilize the same certified plates/equipment.....
the person shows up, takes the weight straight off the rack....to about
4 inches from the chest...and presses it back up.......with a weight that
exceeds the current record........then has a press release that says they
shattered the world record, taking it from previous holder etc....
this is hard to swallow for the world record holder and all those who, have
to follow the sanctioing bodies rules which keep it consistent for decades...
ie.....once off the rack....you hold it until given the "press" signal from officials....then once its down to chest....held for a count of one...until
the official gives the "press" signal.....then pressed......
that is ALOT different.........but its still impressive that the dude took
off a weight exceeding the world record, and pressed it over a MUCH
more limited distance..........
Joe Amo :)
PS..............JJ.........we would LOVE to see you DO the deed......do
it right......WE WILL HELP AND SUPPORT you and such an effort......
it would be VERY VERY cool for you to come out to Bonneville....and
get it done.....time consuming..YES.....challenging...YES.....would
love nothing more for you to get it done, and see you say "bitc--s
you were right....you have my respect....and I hope to have earned some of
yours..."...AT THE BONNEVILLE 200 MPH CLUB BANQUET....!!!!!!!!!
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Kinda reminds me of the current homerun record in MLB. Impressive, but tarnished.
At least JJ can make his legit. The question is, will he?
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This is Jesse's responce to SCTA President Roy Creels letter stating the SCTA had nothing to do with his "Record" from over on the HAMB site.
"The SCTA (Southern Calif. Timing Association) was neither involved in, nor did we confirm Mr Jame's "record". In fact, Mr James did not set any record.
What he did accomplish was to exceed an existing record speed previously set by BMW.
His private timing event was timed by the same folks that time SCTA events and the course was set up by the same folks who set SCTA courses." Roy Creel, President, SCTA"
Nice!
The way I see it I played by SCTA's rules on everything. I had Mike Cook oversee everything we did on the car. I had "official" timing equipment set up, and got an SCTA official speed of 199.7mph. The car actually went 201.59mph on my GPS past the speed traps.
Since SCTA is now being Dicks since this was not "sanctioned" event?
I'm going to consider 201.59mph my top speed
First Hydrogen I.C.E. car to Break 200mph
Thanks SCTA!!
Sounds like missed comunications about official SCTA timing
JL222
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actually hydrogen is on the scta approved fuel list--- 09 rule book page 17 section 2.B---hydrogen would put anything in the fuel class ----------------willie buchta
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I spent fifteen years in Hollywood as an actor, writer and producer. You wouldn't believe what people would say to get their names in print, to get laid or to make a dollar. One of the best lines used in movies is "based on an original event". Mr. James wants to get his show renewed and BMW needs all the PR they can get. Why this stand alone "vehicle" would help BMW sales I do not know but actors and their managers go by the saying... "any publicity, whether good or bad... is good publicity". As long as he doesn't call it any type of World record, I don't care--
For you historians, has anyone ever been officially "banned from the salts"? I'm curious--
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same as the 08 rule book
2.B FUELS.
FUEL CLASSES.
In fuel classes, any approved liquid fuel may be used. Examples of approved fuels are: All alcohols and ethers, hydrogen, nitro methane blends, nitrous oxide, and unapproved gasoline.
willie buchta
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Re - Reply 61. The FIA speed for any of the standing start records is the average speed for the run, staring from zero. The 60 mph is not a trap speed as recorded on a 1320 or 1000 ft drag strip. Indeed the average of two run times is taken for the speed offered as the record. If my maths works this morning the 1/4 mile time is about 15 seconds. Not shabby for a manufacturers car, but that was why the Kart could beat it in the SS mile.
Now we are moving into GPS recording of speeds, does JJ want all of the timekeepers and timing distances to be replaced? The SCTA and its members clubs could then become an off shoot of the "World Records Academy"! ........................... (That was a joke).
Malcolm UK
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Re - Reply 61. The FIA speed for any of the standing start records is the average speed for the run, staring from zero. The 60 mph is not a trap speed as recorded on a 1320 or 1000 ft drag strip. Indeed the average of two run times is taken for the speed offered as the record. If my maths works this morning the 1/4 mile time is about 15 seconds. Not shabby for a manufacturers car, but that was why the Kart could beat it in the SS mile.
Now we are moving into GPS recording of speeds, does JJ want all of the timekeepers and timing distances to be replaced? The SCTA and its members clubs could then become an off shoot of the "World Records Academy"! ........................... (That was a joke).
Malcolm UK
DOH!!! Thanks for the correction. :cheers:
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I'm really starting to like my idea on another thread -- Get Jesse to run Mike Charlton's jet bike. Mike is having problems finding a venue that will take him, and he can afford from what I've read before. And now Jesse's got the connections and the bucks to pull it off for him. He hires the timing, the surveyors, has the insurance (I guess) and knows how to set records, if only in his own mind. It would probably help if Mike joined LSR, but they got the vanilla gorilla so Mike would be a big step up for them (although he seems to be way too straight-forward). I know Mike would rather do it himself, but at least this way it could get done. Thoughts?
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landspeed louise,
i enjoy your columns in the 'goodguys gazzette'.
more posts in this forum might be a nice addition.
franey
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louise has alot to offer as far as land speed and land speed history goes..... maybe she only writes for the monthly mags cuz it takes her a month to write a story.... come on louise you can start posting here... we like ya...
kent
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I'm really starting to like my idea on another thread -- Get Jesse to run Mike Charlton's jet bike. Mike is having problems finding a venue that will take him, and he can afford from what I've read before. And now Jesse's got the connections and the bucks to pull it off for him. He hires the timing, the surveyors, has the insurance (I guess) and knows how to set records, if only in his own mind. It would probably help if Mike joined LSR, but they got the vanilla gorilla so Mike would be a big step up for them (although he seems to be way too straight-forward). I know Mike would rather do it himself, but at least this way it could get done. Thoughts?
I would be worried he might put dent in the lake
G
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Moved to clubs section :-D
JL222
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Update
Today, in response to my inquiries and actions, Quantum Technologies, the supplier of fuel delivery parts used in the James car during the El Mirage runs, removed form its corporate website the fake record claim press release, directed PR Newswire to remove the original press release from its server and answered to full satisfaction all ethics questions raised by the SEC. I commend the company for its quick, responsible corrective action when it realized it was disseminating false information.
I am still chasing the story around the globe and asking for further removals, corrections and retractions. More than three dozen have been contacted and all but one has responded by removing the article altogether, or correcting/updating the facts of the false record claim.
This cost Quantum in the neighborhood of $15,000 in attorney fees and it is regrettable. My financial loss will certainly exceed that amount for all the hours I expended, and will continue to put in, trying to “unring the bell.” A trivial pursuit? To some it may appear so, but not to me. The bedrock foundation of land speed racing is the record, the prize earned through a sacrosanct act of honest effort seeking honest reward. Jesse James acted without honor and respect.
Dozens and dozens of land speed racers - national, international and world record holders included -- have contacted me with words of appreciation. It inspires me onward to protect their good name and deeds.
As for Mr. James running with the big dogs based on the 132-foot recorded speed. Please. Every one of you on this forum who have run at a sanctioned event know all too well your vehicle can storm into the mile with great promise only to see the peak power curve evaporate like water on cotton candy. When Mr. James can hold speed for a mile of more then we'll have something to cheer him about. Until then, its little more than a drag racing trap to me, a good indicator of potential but a long way from claiming fraternity with record holders.
Let's hope the old Dees/Milodon Engineering/Davis B Streamliner gets a chance to prove its worth in real time, in a sanctioned event and not force-fed through some fancy made-for-TV editing job. I believe James has the potential, but I seriously doubt he gives a damn what any of us think, especially me. Further, it is my opinion that he is quite happy puffing himself up with fake speed record claims.
I end with this direct quote from the James Family Trust:
The celebrity Jesse James has built a record for himself of snubbing authorities, in his vainglorious effort to personify himself as some imaginary kind of outlaw. Spike TV’s promotion for “Jesse James is a Dead Man” announces that Jesse James is a direct descendant of the outlaw Jesse James. This in fact is a falsehood and misrepresentation. Mr. James has been invited to prove his claim to the James family, to which he professes to belong. He never has done so. Instead, he continues to falsely misrepresent himself. Now Mr. James claims to have broken a land speed record. Once more, Jesse James rebukes authentication by reputable authorities to support his claim. The only record Mr. James can produce is a record of misrepresentation and falsehood, for which he is becoming well noted.
So now it seems we have a fake record holder and a fake outlaw.
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It seems all of this controversy could have been avoided with a simple request to the SCTA for a sanction and a bloody backup run. Jesse, next time run under the sanctioned rules.
No matter how far it went, it still can't claim a red hat. :mrgreen: For more than the Fossett LSR cost, it should at least do that.
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Slopoke --
I don't see where the SCTA has "blessed" the claim. I see just the opposite inRoy Creel's statements. Please help me understand your statement.
Thanx,
Stan Back
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The press release indicated his "record" was clocked by the SCTA. Or the "Dicks" as he called them when Roy issued the statement about no SCTA clocking.
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The press release indicated his "record" was clocked by the SCTA. Or the "Dicks" as he called them when Roy issued the statement about no SCTA clocking.
And were still waiting on ''the rest of the story'' :-)
JL222
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I've read all of it and more -- some provided by the people involved. I don't see how you can hold SCTA at fault here -- unless I'm misunderstanding you.
Stan Back
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First off, when has this group ever believed what a writer, TV show, or movie has ever gotten the facts straight (IE Bonneville Speed Capital of the world) so how do we know that anything written thus far is accurate or not in excerpt.
Here's what I know for fact! not from a webmaster, producer or a writer.
The SCTA had nothing to do with the timing or set up of the course, The track was laid out in similar fashion as the El Mirage dry lake races are. The timing equipment used was FIA/FIM certified timing equipment. FIA or SCTA does not certify Hydrogen fuel except in production passenger cars only.
Question? So how could there be any record in the first place for Hydrogen fuel engines.
Additional
I don't hear anyone complaining that Bill Elliot now claims a record in a E85 Mustang.
Just my 2 cents worth to this topic
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It is critical to understand the Mr. James NEVER hired the SCTA "timers" because there are none to hire. Timing duties at SCTA sanctioned events are performed Chronologic Timing [http://www.chronologictiming.com/] owned by James and Alan Rice. Mr. James engaged their services to conduct the timing duties. The brothers are independent businessmen who also count the SCTA and various other independent racers as clients. They are a trusted resource for all land speed racers, but they will tell you themselves that they are not in the business of sanctioning official speed records.
On another point, but equally important, some people seem to think my comments and actions are personal. They are dead wrong. I have no personal grudge, or affection for Mr. James, his TV program, fabrication skills or his lifestyle. The only point of contention is that he lied about setting a world record and then shouted the falsehood to the world. I would like nothing better than to conclude this entire affair with James getting his butt to the starting line at sanctioned SCTA/BNI, USFRA, or FIA event, make the runs required at the speeds required and pass the required technical inspections to earn a record that he and his team can be proud of -- not this goofy sham surrounded by vulgar name calling.
This sport deserves better.
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Amen! Crow
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NOTE TO JESSE and his PR people:
Below, in red, is how Brent Hajek and Danny Thompson handled the PR for their failed record attempt on the salt last year. It highlights the team's great accomplishment and potential yet makes very clear no record was set. The LSR community can easily get behind this group and cheer them on for another record attempt. We could have done the same for you.
E85 Powered FR500C Mustang Attempts 250 MPH at Bonneville Salt Flats Speedway
Brent Hajek and a crew of thrill seekers stormed the Bonneville Salt Flats Speedway to break a land speed record. Brent, Danny Thompson and crew attempted the record in a 2008 E85 powered FR500C Ford Mustang. The FR500C was equipped with a 5.4L Ford GT block, heads and various performance parts from Ford Racing.
Brent was the mastermind and financier of the project. Ford Motor Company supported the effort with parts, test facilities and engineering.
The Ford Mustang was able to hit a top speed of 252.78 MPH once, but was unable to repeat that speed during this run. The crew is scheduled to return to the salt later this year!
I could find no record for Elliot claiming to break a LSR record, except a NASCAR record attempt at Talladega that ended with a blown tire and wall kissing. Having spoken to him at length, Brent Hajek understands and respects the tenets of LSR record breaking. I am ignorant about stock records and will therefore never comment about them in detail.
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There is also the avenue of "informal" records. For our diesel racing, we claim to have the "fastest production diesel truck". There is no sanction by any organization for that class. We hit a higher clocked speed than the Dodge Cummins production truck that was run under ECTA clocking for an ECTA AA/DT record, but I would never say I broke their record. Different track, different rules. Their record stands unless I pack up the kids and head to Maxton. When the Dodge guys run faster than me, I will no longer claim the informal title. In a similiar light, Bill Heath claims to have the "fastest 6.5 GM diesel truck" which again, there is no formal record for, and such records are just for fun, and mark the racer's accomplishments. Due to the limitations of the 6.5 engine design, it would be difficult compete in a class that is an engine-swap class. But for the thousands of 6.5 owners out there, 155mph is a stunning top speed for one of their trucks, and is a serious accomplishment.
Personally, that is the path I'd take if I were running a car that did not have a class. "Jesse James and his team ran their hydrogen piston engine car to a recorded top speed 199.xxx mph at El Mirage Dry Lake making it the fastest piston engine car running hydrogen as a fuel that we know of."
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McRat:
You've used the magic phrase: "...that we know of..." A bit of humility accompanied by an open challenge to those who might want to surpass your speed -- or tell you that you're not the fastest.
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Just curious.
Reading Autoweek's story on the Jesse James run, (which was a fairly unopinionated report of the event) the speed was given as 199.712 mph.
If indeed the timing trap was 132 feet how many digits behind the decimal point does the Rice equipment record in parts of minutes?
'Cause if it's only four, there's no such speed , and if it's five they rounded out the speed to the next highest digit.
Anybody know?
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Seven dec. points. SCTA/BNI uses 3 dec. points. We never round up.
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Thanx Glen -my cheep calculater don't go that high.
considering an eye blink is about two - tenths (.02), three didgits oughta be enough.
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bystander..........0.02 is 2/100
But I like your math for figuring Income Tax.
FREUD
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Yeah, . . .ZERO POINT TWO like I . . .woops.
(in a whisper -thanks, Freud)
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It used to be that a record was a record.
If you did not break it by the rules you did not have it nor would you say that you did. You either have the record or you do not.
There is no "informal" "almost" "best GPS Speed" blab blab blab about it!
Sure miss those days.
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jj cant set a scta record or join the dirty 2 (200 mph club ) unless he is a member of one of the 12 clubs ---guest can not set a record at el mirage willie buchta
Willie,
I believe he is a member of a club...not mine however..
Dang you guy's are Harshe :-P!
I hate to see happens when I go FAST :wink:?
265 WF! The KID'S GOT YOU BEAT :cheers:!!!
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"I hate to see happens when I go FAST ?"
Better hurry up -- I'm getting along in years.
Stan
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"I hate to see happens when I go FAST ?"
Better hurry up -- I'm getting along in years.
Stan
you and me BOTH :cheers:!
I should of bought a busa :wink:!
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I've been watching this story unfold on several sites since the day it hit. No question there's no record.
What I have yet to see mentioned, is how far over the line Mike Cook went in selling his services to JJ and the production company. It looks to me that Cook went way past the line of his companies ability to certify any potential "record" that JJ might set on that day.
I'd love to have been the fly on the wall when JJ realized what Cook had sold him, in the way of certification, was just a bunch of hot air and snake oil.
Hat's off to Roy Creel for taking the high road and keeping the SCTA pure on this deal.
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SwampRat33. Don?
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I've been watching this story unfold on several sites since the day it hit. No question there's no record.
What I have yet to see mentioned, is how far over the line Mike Cook went in selling his services to JJ and the production company. It looks to me that Cook went way past the line of his companies ability to certify any potential "record" that JJ might set on that day.
I'd love to have been the fly on the wall when JJ realized what Cook had sold him, in the way of certification, was just a bunch of hot air and snake oil.
Hat's off to Roy Creel for taking the high road and keeping the SCTA pure on this deal.
Watched the show last night. I wouldn't lay blame on Mike Cook. I heard him say "record" two or three times but never said "world record".It's all in editing,he could have been relating it to a personal record. Also it looked like DW handed him an yellow B license card not a record certificate.
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He was probably p*issed cause his GPS said he'd get an A.
Stan
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By the way Thundersalt -- you must of had the lap record on the long course -- at least for the first couple days. Every time I looked up you were going by.
Stan
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I was on mission to achieve 10 consecutive passes over 200 mph in a row between last year and this year. I did and Celia also got her C and B licence.
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Keep running like that and they may try you out on the circle course next year -- look out Ab!
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i don't think Cook sold him anything except his services...... i believe it is all the publicist and TV production company blowing it up and then caught by those in the know..... i think JJ is is caught in the TV sensationalism "ride"..... the reality is were the only people who care.!.....
Kent
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Well said Kent oh by the way we ran 210 with dads car so hahahahahahaha
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As many here have probably seen this morning on the FR generated emails, I see JJ is taking his car to the salt. I wonder which venue. I would guess the private meet.
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As many here have probably seen this morning on the FR generated emails, I see JJ is taking his car to the salt. I wonder which venue. I would guess the private meet.
I hope he goes faster than ever [he should on a longer course] and sets an official record faster than BMW.
JL222
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J.J. - N.I.M.S.C.T.A.
No way, no how, no thanks.
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WOW what a thread……
I’m new to LSR and, if and, when I make my first run I’ll be considered a “ROOKIE”.
I’ve been involved in LSR for a little over sixty days. I’ve joined a club, started building my vehicle and have had to ask many questions about vehicle and procedure rules. Even after asking numerous questions I’m still confused about what I read in the rule book verses some of the answers I see in the forum.
My point is this…Seems to me that Jesse and his production team didn’t know the “rules” of the game, after all Jesse was a Rookie when he made this run. I know that ignorance is no excuse but whether or not you agree with what was said after the run Jesse did get in the car and run very fast with very little or no LSR experience.
There are strong emotions involved in LSR (life and death situations) and no one can fault people for thinking that claiming an undeserved record is right up there with the worst of moral crimes. That being said a Rookie and his team made a mistake and became defensive when they were challenged so harshly for something they thought was a great accomplishment.
This sport seems to be made up of a wide range of personalities, which is good, and a bunch of very smart and talented individuals which is also good. So why was the first response to the Jesse James announced record a knife to the heart instead of an offer of help to provide information and assistance to him and his team. My thought is that had Jesse not been a TV personality but a regular rookie from Podunk Idaho the initial reaction would have been quite different……
Time will tell whether or not Jesse will try to make another record attempt. If he does and if he actually breaks the record what will be said, not much I bet…..
Buzz
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JJ has made a few passes at Vanenburg AF Base a few years back under the watchfull eye of SCTA members. Eventho this also was not a sanctioned event of any kind it is still seat time. JJ's runs were not that fast at the begining and could easily be viewed as "rookie" runs.
I believe experience is used to determine allowable speeds. There are many who run at non-SCTA sanctioned events or private timed events which are given higher SCTA licenses when they do run under SCTA sanctioning. I don't remeber Don Gartlits starting at 125 in the streamliner he drove in the 80's. Remember it's a TV show and LSR is not a very good "watch" They need to make it interesting and did.
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....JJ as Jimmy said....is NOT new to this.......in that he
spent a week with SCTA folks......some of the best in the
business........for his tv show.....monster garage...building a
belly tank lakester for the show and top speed runs....
he wanted to get in the "bonn 200 mph club".......it was explained
at the time about what that entails......and so he wanted
to break 200 mph period.......and came up short.......
as he did here......
hopefully he has the desire and fortitude to pursue the work
needed to accomplish this goal.......
some folks arent used to not getting their way......some whine
some do something about it.........
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Thanks for the additional info on this topic.
I don't know Jesse personally nor have I ever met him. But like you said Joea, hopefully he has the desire and fortitude to pursue the work needed to accomplish this goal.......
I'd like to see him do it!
Buzz
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JD, Don did several slow passes with the liner... maybe not intentionally but he listened to a lot of folks before he went 200. First pass he turned out before the lites, thought he'd gone far enough... :-o
It may be unfortunate that TV requires PR guys and a TV persona... I thought Jesse was a nice kid and he really does want to be a landspeed racer.
He went faster than the BMW record... everyone remember a couple of years ago when Rocky took the record from Dave, then lost it to Chris.... and then Sam went 5 faster :-D Who had the fasted scooter in the world? not Denis... he was just the record holder...
Just a thought, give it a rest and let's see if we get JJ at a sanctioned event... hopefully without the PR, camera and TV guys