Amateur Sport

[John Beckett]

Amateur: One who engages in a pursuit, study, science, or sport as a pastime rather than as a profession.
 
 The definition doesn't say anything about money...which actually surprised me.
 
 Based on that definition the BUB events shouldn't have any effect on LSR being or continuing to be an AMATEUR sport.
 
 JB

[maxmph]

John, I agree. When I was stock car racing, I won one race in 75 tries. I won $100 for my victory! But I don't feel that made me a professional stock car driver.
 
  <small>[ March 01, 2005, 11:47 AM: Message edited by: extreme extreme ]</small>

[JackD]

The first time anyone was paid wages to be there was the end of the "AMATUER" status.
 At least the "PROFIT" is still in the hands of the fastest racer, and not the fastest budget.
 How you profit, determines how much fun you will realize.
 What is preventing GM, or FORD, or HONDA, or MAZDA, or a Magazine project, or a made for TV special, all with a panel of experts from going to Goliad or Maxton or Bonn now ?
 I have faith in the final results at the end of the day.
 Your day is not over until you quit.

[John Beckett]

Maybe Jesse James will take his Lakester to Bonneville and see if he can get a Red Hat.
 
 JB

[JackD]

All it takes is time or money.
 "That Crager 5 second club is looking pretty good.
 How much is that ?"

[LittleLiner]

Some disjointed thoughts concerning prize money and the costs of racing. . .
 
 Maybe in a society that pays big bucks for Bass Fishing I guess it is natural to expect some sort of payout for any sport.  
 
 And let?s face it, racing eats into the old wallet like a hungry dog on a bone.
 
 My previous wife defined racing as the "Science of converting money into noise."  Then she would point at the race car and say "That thing is too loud!"  Of course what I eventually found out was that Divorce was the science of spending money to get some quiet, but that is a totally different story . . .
 
 People do some really amazing things with their money to support their racing "hobby".
 
 I watched a guy mount over 300 dollars of new tires on a micro sprint just before the feature.  The rubber he replaced was still pretty good (better than I was running).  He did this to have a better shot at winning the $150 purse. (?)  He didn't win.
 
 Most of the guys I raced against at the dirt tracks complained about the low payouts.  They said it was too expensive to race for such a small purse.  Mind you they were saying this as they stood in front of a 35 foot RV pulling a triple axle enclosed trailer.  All that to haul a 500 pound micro sprint.  I towed mine on a 5 x 8 open trailer behind the family car.  Instead of a generator I had a flashlight.  Instead of a compressor I had an air tank and when that ran low I had a bicycle pump.  Go figure.  
 
 When my brother ran his junior fuel dragster back in the mid sixties he used to say the best way to end the season with $50,000 is to start the season with $200,000.  To run top Fuel now-a-days you probably have to add a few zeros to those figures.  
 
 Frankly I think getting prize money into LSR is a bad idea.  From what I've seen of the various amateur "econo" deals in racing (Karts, Legends, Econo-dragsters, Quarter Midgets, etc) is that the increase in spending always manages to exceed the increases in prize money.  Besides with so many classes in LSR (a good thing in my opinion) how do you fairly spread the wealth?
 
 I see LSR as something akin to mountain climbing.  It is a challenge.  Not everybody can do it.  It requires a lot of personal sacrifice.  No body will ever get rich doing it.  They just do it ?because it is there.?

[ddahlgren]

Years ago when i was fooling around with Nascar modified cars on the east coast we always noticed that the entry fee was in proportion to the purse. We used to refer to it as the elephant buying his own peanuts at the circus.
 Dave

[KeithTurk]

I just love the discussions about Money or the lack of it...
 
 In my business if you handed me a Million dollars the biggest problem would be the same as it is in racing... where could I actually spend it to make more then what I spent back in a reasonable amount of time...
 
 The point is that money won't fix things you don't know are broken... no matter how much money you have there is still a requirement to have the skill to employ it...   The obvious answer to folks like GM is that they simply hire folks that know what to spend it on... and can actually pre-engineer the outcome of X with a degree of certainty and that is the difference...
 
 But here like someone else said.. we can put a team together with X skills from several different disiplines and create our own results... our ability to predict the outcome might not be as good... but honestly when you consider that the folks GM might employ are our friends there is a very strong chance we have the ablity to get the job done...
 
 GM and the like build passenger cars not stuff that exceeds 200mph on a regular basis...that's what we do...  Interesting thought isn't it?

[Tom Bryant]

Keith,
 
 A good observation!
 
 Over the years I have watched people take money and chase the dream, and not make it happen. One interesting fact is that money will not replace the dogged determination it takes to succeed. If you are determined, you will find a way to get the necessary funds to reach your goal. Money, without the undying determination, does not guarantee results.
 
 The problem with the corporate endeavors is that their goal is basically advertising. Ours is EGO,  a BIG difference in motivation.

[jimmy six]

First, Jesse's red had would take 337 MPH with what he "built", not likely.
 
 Second, making it a paying operation (also not likely) would certainly change the "volunteer" status of the workers. In the last few years a per diem is given to those who spend countless hours, which is a nice touch, but most would probably do it without compensation as we did for countless years. For ME personally a change for "pay " would eliminate my volunteering.
 
 As many of the members do, I constantly answer questions, handle additional tags, write & mail certs, inspect, and many other things. If this "run for pay" were to start my new word would be "ADIOS". I may be easy but I'm not cheap.
 
 I, like may of you do, run LSR because we love it. I do not care if GM, Toyota or anyone else wants to come with all their money they still follow the same SCTA book. They can and have in the past, rented the SALT just like we do and run with some elses clocks and advertise to their hearts content. They use the organizations for credibility. We- ECTA,SCTA,BNI,USFRA- have it and they need it; (maybe) because who really cares, only 2 people I know---the person who has the record and the person wants it.
 
 Rant's over---Go Fast & have fun

[JackD]

When you say "WORLD RECORD,thousands of classes, only available in 1 spot,changes in procedures as the wind blows, restrictions on performance for unlimited classes, requirements that are not safety related, and credibility in the same mouthful, that says a lot.
 
  <small>[ March 03, 2005, 04:21 PM: Message edited by: JackD ]</small>

[Richard Thomason]

When my son Alex was ski racing, the more sponsorship and freebies he got, the more expensive the pursuit became.

[JackD]

He was skiing for him and working for them.
 How many jobs do you want to maintain ?
 The fun goes away as the jobs go up.

[JackD]

The subject of OEM participation in Speedweek came up during a conversation today.
 If one of them were to select a catagory, or class,or brand to put money in front of or behind, what would SCTA/BNI do ?
 If they had a suitable agreement with an entrant for advertizing before or after, what should be done ?
 Is it fair they get all the press.
 I guess it depends on your definition of fair.
 Without a suitable agreement like NHRA, NASCAR,AMA, USAC, and many others, you leave it wide open.
 If your desire to protect the amatuer status, I think it needs some work.

[Tom Bryant]

The subject of OEM participation in Speedweek came up during a conversation today.
 If one of them were to select a catagory, or class,or brand to put money in front of or behind, what would SCTA/BNI do ?
 
 I am troubled by the inference made in your post. I don't know how the association can be responsible for what deal an individual makes. However, as for as the association's stance on amature status...I can't answer for the SCTA/BNI Officials today, but, in the past there have been plenty of opportunities to receive money from corporate groups to gain press advantage and they were turned down cold. This is an amature sport and plenty of those in charge intend for it to remain such. The closest thing I remember to purses at Speedweek was when Mickey Thompson gave a set of tires to all record setters. Another instant was Andy Granitelli, as president of STP, gave a case of STP and t-shirts to all entries.
 
 In both of these cases, All those in each category received the same merchandise. No class was singled out and the association did not benefit financially from these acts.