Production Diesel Pickup Class

[SPARKY]

I have been mooting around in the rule book---and I have some general observations and curiosity's to ponder!!!

Classic Cars Classes
                                                Altered             /   Gas Coupe     /                Production
                                             /CBFALT  /CFALT     XXXXXXXXX                    XXXXXXXX
                                            /CBGALT / CGALT    /CBGC  /CGC                   /CPRO  /CPS
                                            [ -------------------- AA, A, B, C, D, E, F----------------] {C D E}



Car catagories:
                      Comp Coupe/  Altered Coupe/ GasCoupe /  Production /Production Supercharged

Trucks are now such a big total of the vechicels sold this is my thoughts for Truck classes:
no limitations on 4 wheel drive as long as year and eng compatibality in factory production

Gas /  ClassicDiesel /  Diesel

Production Classes would allow 4WD
Production  Gas virtually the same as now
Production Classic Diesel could run stock style injector pumps only
Production Diesel could run EFI

Production Pickup & Production Supercharged     
/PP /PPS /PPCD /PPSCD /PPD  /PPSD
 Blowers would have same rules as PS cars--blowers to be of same type


Modified Truck rules to follow gas coupe rules except can run any type four wheel drive if wanted

Gas and Diesel--no seperate class for classic diesel

mini Trucks would have similiar

DT becomes Comp Truck
I suggest more alliging the  DT rules to more similiar to Comp Coupe Class

The Big Truck classes  I havent looked at

Come on Truck Guys this should be a discussion starter,  I welcome all thoughts and comments
Sparky

[Stan Back]

Get a Ranchero and you can play there, too.

[kiwi belly tank]

I've got to admit that I was surprised last year at SW when I found out that a common 4WD turbo diesel p/u couldn't run 4WD.
  Sid.

[dw230]

Sparky,

You should get together with Pat McSwain. He had a set of rules on here a couple of years ago.

I am not one to discourage the creation of new classes but, re-read the responses that Jeff got just last week for his sectioned comp coupe class and the thread about my recent inquiry into a new hot rod class.
And all that is just from the racers, before you have to present to the board.

Good news is; you have until late 2012 to work out the fine points. Thar is when the next proposals for new classes will be enertained. And don't forget the guys with the early diesels who claim they cannot compete with the late Duramax and more modern engines. They want classes too.

DW

[SPARKY]

Dan thanks, sorry I forgot about Pat----i will go through the achives.  The early diesels were the main promt for my suggesting Classic Diesel ---the ones without electronic injectors

[38flattie]

Sparky, what are you trying to tell us?

...a lakester AND a diesel pickup?!?

[SPARKY]

No we are working on a Lakester only at this time---if and when we go back to the truck it will be a AA/BMP.  I just think that as many diesel Pickups are being raced elsewhere if we had a PPD class we might get more on board.

[McRat]

Anyone miss me?   

Diesel Pickup racing is a large and growing grassroots motorsports.  Marlboro, Budweiser, and Extenze aren't fighting over sponsorship opportunies, but there are thousands of racers who compete at hundreds of events nationally.

As a group, diesel pickup racers have a very good safety record in drag racing.  One of the reasons we have a good safety record is we mostly run in 4wd.  The minor accidents that have occurred have been 2wd trucks.  A normal diesel pickup tips the scales at ~7000lb off the showroom floor, and a race-ready prep is about 6000lb.  But over 65% of that weight is on the nose. For us, we fixed this problem by adding 1200lb ballast to the bed.  But I'd feel a lot safer at 6000lb in 4x4 than 7200lb in 4x2.

As far as Production Class goes, that's how most these existing racers are running, and IMO it's what makes the diesel pickup racing relevant. To be honest, a full-sized pickup is not good racecar, and a diesel powerplant is not competitive with similar gas engines when given the same displacement limits.  While diesel makes 20% more power, it doesn't like 8000 rpm.  What IS amazing is how fast they can go in nearly stock trim.  Diesel Pickups can often double their engine output safely with nothing but a good tuning.  I'd love to see a Production class for diesels.

Sidebar - Our truck is "resting" as I collect together another warchest to run it some more.  There are a few significant issues I have with engine life (or death it seems) that I'm working on, but have no answers yet.  I haven't retired, but I can't afford to lose a couple engines a year either.

[Seldom Seen Slim]

Yes, Pat -- I've wondered where you went.  Thanks for showing up and explaining your absence.  Welcome to the Forum.

[Peter Jack]

Good to hear from you Pat. Your input has always been helpful and constructive. Don't disappear on us again.

Pete

[Glen]

I talked to Pat a couple of weeks ago and he said they were catching up and business has been a little slow like it is for everyone.
 

[McRat]

Thanks folk.   

We are going to try and run the truck again this year Elmo, but might not be until late summer.

Our "A" displacement engine probably isn't going to be run again.  At Bonneville '09, the ring lands collapsed.  Then at Elmo it had excessive blow-by, which is a precursor to the ring land failure. 

My factory aluminum pistons have a steel insert cast in to support to the top ring, but in order to build a "A" displacement engine, I had to go with forged all-aluminum pistons.  I don't think it's going to work, and it's very expensive to experiment with.  So for now, I will have to run less displacement and factory pistons.

I have a "B" engine in the truck right now, and have driven it on the street, and it runs good.  But no track time with it lately.

[Steve Cole]

So how would one go about tech'ing a production pickup truck class? As it is now No one has run a true production pickup truck with a diesel. They ALL have had aero modifications made to them and since no one knows any better they get away with it. DT as it is today allows for most stock looking trucks that came equipped from the factory with a diesel to enter but 4wd is not allowed. From a safety standpoint that is probably best. What goes on in a 1/8 or 1/4 mile drag race is nothing close to running on dirt or salt for up to 5 miles of WOT. Safety on the drag strip has not been an issue for either the 2wd or 4wd trucks but there has been wrecks in both types. The current record holders are 2wd's, but the spread is not very far apart. I think the production 4wd units trying to run at 200 mph is going to be a real crap shoot at best.

If you wanted to try and split the class up into groups I think you would have a hard time getting very many in any one class. As it is today I can understand the wanting to have different classes but I think much more time and effort would be needed to getting a good set of rules and a way to check them.

[mtkawboy]

Looking forward to seeing the DirtyMax on the salt again

[SPARKY]

Steve,  I agree about the rules----since there is not a class  it would have to be "petitioned"----I am just trying to gather ideas, thoughts and wishes to see if it would even make any sense to "petition"..