Landracing Forum
Loring Timing Association (Maine) => Loring (AFB) land speed venue => Topic started by: MiltonP on June 20, 2009, 01:07:33 PM
-
1 - Since all the records will be open, will you be teching cars for classes based on the Maxton record speeds? Seems to be the easiest way to go about this aside from the fact that we are running an additional 1/2 mile. Hopefully, those who anticipate breaking the next 'threshold' will tech for it or hold back.
2 - Will we have a gasoline vendor on site with the 100 octane and whatever else folks are purchasing on site?
I am still undecided between bringing the bike or the Miata though if I bring the later I may have to flip a coin with my G/GSS comrade in the VW to see who runs which class though i think her has been running a bit faster than I was last time out! :wink: Maybe I could look at the sports classes versus SS.
-
Milton,
We tech cars/bikes first for Safety, then allow speeds according to the vehicle and drivers' equipment.
If you have the required rollcage and similar necessities, you can attempt speeds over the 135 street cars limitations. It's all spelled out in the Rulebook.
Records set at Loring are original and only apply to Loring. In having an additional 1/2 mile to accelerate, it would not be fair to compare ECTA records to Loring records.
On a comparative basis only, speed records set at Loring that exceed longer distance records could be considered LSR records, someday by somebody, at least.
Arguments have gone on a long time about the recognizing of records between FIA/FIM, SCTA, ECTA, USFRA, DLRA, and it would be nice if someday we all just got along.
I think our first event will include personal bests, track records ( obviously) , and a few numbers better than at other longer venues. I leave the discussions to the Monday morning types, and as time goes by and LTA is gradually accepted, we'll get our credibility.
Fuel;
Our on site Fuel vendor is VP, and they assured us a wide variety of fuels will be available.
Vehicle: up to you, we have plenty of bikes, everything is open, record wise. I've received a lot of mail suggesting people will run in multiple classes. Set records as baselines and support the LTA, Thank You !!!
Bob Wanner
-
Having a mile and a half smooth paved course at 800 feet elevation has the potential to eclipse a lot previous records. Everyone coming to the event should plan on gearing correctly.
-
Bob, Thanks for the quick response but there are cases in the rulebook that state where the current record in a class exceeds... then you must have... and such. I think what you said may be what is enforced though via running time only with a safety approval for a set max speed. I would expect the ECTA records would be used to pick a speed that a new vehicle will have to pass safety tech at and that the driver would be asked to run progressively faster runs with it even if they have the appropriate license. Milt
-
For starters, the Safety policy is to run incrementally faster at 25 mph per run.
This applies especially at a new venue, on an unfamiliar surface, and officiated by newbie staff .
Obviously, our stated policy also allows "running up" in class , so the opportunity exists to set a lot of records at lower speeds that won't require Safety equipment compared to existing ECTA or SCTA records speeds. You get a record(s), and we get a much needed cash infusion from each class change to defer our startup costs.
Once we are in business a few years, we'll also have the option of pure in-class runs, but right now we must play a little mercenary.
Bob W, Capitalist Tool
-
Milt, I think what Bob is saying is that your tech will be set based upon the vehicles speed or potential speed.. (limits will be placed based upon MPH for the type of equipment each car/bike has) NOT the record in a class from another venue...
Example,,,,My first run at Maxton, I was teched to 135 (knowing the car was faster).. I ran and had fun, it was more pressure not to exceed my tech limit than to go wide open...
My next meet and this year I am teched for 150 and have went 149.6xxx.. (how is that for dialing in on an index ? )
I think the LTA is going to be a great venue, we are Thrashing to get the Stude done for the event...
Forget about "existing" class records, as LTA is new and each run in each class has the potential to be a track record and will be benchmarks for future Track Records..Just tech your bike or car for as fast as you feel it will go (or as fast as the inspectors feel the driver and vehicle safety equipment will allow) and have fun...
See you this weekend at Maxton ?
Charles
-
MiltonP Good questions. I think I understand what Bob is saying but just in case let me para phrase it to see if I really do have it right.
Don't concern yourself with the class record speeds from any other venue. Look at the ECTA Rules (used by LTA). If you have a car that does not have the appropriate safety equipment to run over 135 at Maxton then you should plan on limiting your speed to 135 or under at Loring.
Do I have it right?
Also it looks like everybody will be limited to a 125 license pass on the first run (right?). That should give you a chance to dial in your tach to judge your speed more acturately on your second run. Remember to bring a calculator . .
My best at Maxton was 126 and change. Given another half mile I expect I could go a bit faster. How much? Who knows? Maybe I am already maxed out HP vs drag and another half mile won't help. Or maybe I have another 5 or 10 mph. If the stars align and I can somehow arrange to take the car to Loring I guess I'll find out. Art
-
The question wasn't for my benefit as i don't have anything that will run over 135 up there anyways...I think... :roll:
It was to help any newbies who may show up with something with a big engine that while it may not get within 50 mph of the Maxton record it would theoretically have to meet tech for the record speed at Maxton if they want to run in that class at Maxton and if you go by the book. I think the situation for Loring is clear based on Bill's responses.
-
Also it looks like everybody will be limited to a 125 license pass on the first run (right?). That should give you a chance to dial in your tach to judge your speed more acturately on your second run. Remember to bring a calculator . .
Bonneville is 175 if you have your A license, what exactly is the ruling, a 25mph increment from 135 is a lot of passes to get to 200mph in a car.
-
Bonneville A license is 200- 250. Four runs minimum to get A license.
-
Our Policy is Safety. We reserve the right to only allow 25mph increments for the vast majority of racers. Observing an individuals control and performance on a new venue allows us the option of possibly skipping an increment, but don't bet on it. It will not be based on favoritism or club-think, but that annoying attention to Safety.
We doubt highly that our Inaugural event will have vehicle attendance numbers such that every one does not get a lot of runs. I also personally doubt that on Saturday or Sunday there'll be a horde of over 200 mph vehicles.
We'll address all this at that point, everybody will be reasonably happy.
BOB W
-
I think their will be more then just a handlful of vehicle over 200mph. Look at it this way any vehicle that runs 180mph or higher at maxton or texas stands more then just a slight chance of hitting the 200 mark. I think you are going to be suprised.
-
I think their will be more then just a handlful of vehicle over 200mph. Look at it this way any vehicle that runs 180mph or higher at maxton or texas stands more then just a slight chance of hitting the 200 mark. I think you are going to be suprised.
But I really don't know about that .... I've done the math and there isn't all that much time to accelerate that last 1/2 mile. e.g. My Ford Taurus has done 171+ (ideal conditions) at Maxton. That's about 250 feet per second. Even at constent speed, it only covers that last 1/2 mile in 10.5 sec. My 'Busa would have ~9 seconds.
-
I'd guess it'd be a gearing thing. Our car goes 200 in two miles, and 210 in five miles at Bonneville. And hits its power peak in the five. Probably geared as right as we're able.
Some competitors may think they might go 50% quicker in running from one mile to a mile and a half and gear up accordingly and go a hella of a lot slower. We went 203 at BV one time years ago and thought a gear change would make us even faster. Went up 3% and couldn't break 200 at the World Finals -- couldn't pull the gear.
Stan Back
-
I figure I'll just go to the driver's meeting and then follow whatever guidelines Bob and his staff give. If I'm told 25mph increments, then I'm happy with 25mph increments. If they limit me to a maximum speed lower than I think I should have, I'll be happy to run the speed they give me without complaint.
DickJ
In East Texas
-
Dick, what speed are hopeing for?
-
Fred,
I'm hoping for 213 to 218.
Dick
-
Good luck Dick. Having spent some quality time with your car :-D I know how nice it is. I'm pullin for you.
Fred
-
There is a huge difference in traction between bville and any asphalt track. 9 extra seconds of acceleration is worth a few miles per hour if you have the gear and the aero. Most expierienced lsr competitors should be able to show up with the correct gear ratio to optimize the top speed.
Im not saying that everone should be able to go out and run as fast as they can the first time out. But if you are an experienced land speed racer with the A lisence, I think 175mph is a resonable starting point. Given the conditons of the facility are much better the most other places.
just my .02
-
There is a huge difference in traction between bville and any asphalt track. 9 extra seconds of acceleration is worth a few miles per hour if you have the gear and the aero. Most expierienced lsr competitors should be able to show up with the correct gear ratio to optimize the top speed.
Im not saying that everone should be able to go out and run as fast as they can the first time out. But if you are an experienced land speed racer with the A lisence, I think 175mph is a resonable starting point. Given the conditons of the facility are much better the most other places.
just my .02
For what it is worth (kinda agree) ... I attended the World of Speed last year for my first time ever on the salt. I showed them my Class A license from ECTA. They asked "If I didn't mind, to keep the first pass under 150 mph and then I could go all out." Now personally, I wouldn't have run faster than 150 on the first pass no matter what they had told me. I'd rather be on the safe side and while car I drove was stable on the salt, I never had drove it.
Now, I also understand that the LTA is new and the volunteers need the "step up" speeds as well as drivers. Also, while the track maybe in better condition, I personally need to "feel" the weather conditions before attempting 200+ on my 'Busa. Starting runs at 150 or 175 for experience racers, don't hurt my feelings at all.
-
I think their will be more then just a handlful of vehicle over 200mph. Look at it this way any vehicle that runs 180mph or higher at maxton or texas stands more then just a slight chance of hitting the 200 mark. I think you are going to be suprised.
But I really don't know about that .... I've done the math and there isn't all that much time to accelerate that last 1/2 mile. e.g. My Ford Taurus has done 171+ (ideal conditions) at Maxton. That's about 250 feet per second. Even at constent speed, it only covers that last 1/2 mile in 10.5 sec. My 'Busa would have ~9 seconds.
The only thing limiting your acceleration is HP, Aero, and gearing. Ten seconds is a long time and plenty of HP helps. :cheers:
-
If you can get to where the HP is and you're hooked up -- but you knew that part of the equasion, right?
-
If you can get to where the HP is and you're hooked up -- but you knew that part of the equasion, right?
Yes, but they are talking about asphalt. Much better traction than dirt... :roll: