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Author Topic: Australian Belly Tank  (Read 1573893 times)
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Dr Goggles
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The Jarman-Stewart "Spirit of Sunshine" Bellytank


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« Reply #4920 on: January 17, 2016, 05:15:13 PM »

If we keep our total loss cooling system, of  60 litres (+engine cooling system cap.) is this the right formula to calculate whether we have enough volume?

Specific Heat Capacity (C_p) for water @ room temp is 4.1813 J/(g*K)
K is Kelvin

The equation is Q = m*C_p*delta_T, where Q=heat energy, m=mass of water in grams, C_p = 4.1813, and delta_T = change in temp in either K or degC.


for a safe margin of error lets say we are making 350Kw ( 470 hp) for 8mins. 60 litres, raising the temp by 65 degrees C.
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Few understand what I'm trying to do but they vastly outnumber those who understand why...................

http://thespiritofsunshine.blogspot.com/

Current Australian E/GL record holder at 215.041mph

THE LUCKIEST MAN IN SLOW BUSINESS.
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« Reply #4921 on: January 17, 2016, 06:23:31 PM »

Dr. G,
As a check I converted to English units and did the calculation and got delta T = 1207 F = 652C.  Which suggests there may be a factor of 10 missing somewhere.
Also, the full horsepower is  not dumped into the cooling system, and 8 minutes seems like quite a long time for a run.  If one assumes 30% of the power and 2 minutes duration, I get 90.5 F = 32.5 C which seems a reasonable result and pretty consistent with prior experience.
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Interested Observer
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« Reply #4922 on: January 17, 2016, 08:15:33 PM »

Attempt at engine photos:


* View0511.jpg (182.07 KB, 3072x2304 - viewed 179 times.)

* View0512.jpg (202.6 KB, 3072x2304 - viewed 172 times.)
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« Reply #4923 on: January 17, 2016, 08:18:04 PM »

More engine photos:


* View0513.jpg (187.42 KB, 3072x2304 - viewed 172 times.)

* View0514.jpg (200.4 KB, 3072x2304 - viewed 170 times.)
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« Reply #4924 on: January 17, 2016, 08:19:05 PM »

And the last---


* View0515.jpg (160.06 KB, 3072x2304 - viewed 160 times.)
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Dr Goggles
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« Reply #4925 on: January 17, 2016, 08:24:17 PM »

Dr. G,
As a check I converted to English units and did the calculation and got delta T = 1207 F = 652C.  Which suggests there may be a factor of 10 missing somewhere.
Also, the full horsepower is  not dumped into the cooling system, and 8 minutes seems like quite a long time for a run.  If one assumes 30% of the power and 2 minutes duration, I get 90.5 F = 32.5 C which seems a reasonable result and pretty consistent with prior experience.

Of course, likely a run is in the 3-4 min range, just looking for outside parameters... I asked because when I took the capo off it yesterday it was STILL pressurized two years after it last ran so if it has enough capacity it may well be convenient to use it as it is.....the least attractive option is a fan blasting air out of the top of the car......

My calculations gave me about 50% too, though by slightly different means. rolleyes
« Last Edit: January 17, 2016, 08:26:09 PM by Dr Goggles » Logged

Few understand what I'm trying to do but they vastly outnumber those who understand why...................

http://thespiritofsunshine.blogspot.com/

Current Australian E/GL record holder at 215.041mph

THE LUCKIEST MAN IN SLOW BUSINESS.
Polyhead
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« Reply #4926 on: January 17, 2016, 09:07:16 PM »

Why do fabricated valve covers always end up looking like the coolest thing in the world?  Just, nothing makes an engine look serious like fabricated valve covers.
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Ben 'Polyhead' Smith
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Dr Goggles
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The Jarman-Stewart "Spirit of Sunshine" Bellytank


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« Reply #4927 on: January 18, 2016, 12:30:40 AM »

Why do fabricated valve covers always end up looking like the coolest thing in the world?  Just, nothing makes an engine look serious like fabricated valve covers.

yep, unlike billet they hint at mongrel cheers

............ and 8 minutes seems like quite a long time for a run. 

You're right,it's somewhere between no-time at all and a lifetime.........at least that's what it seems like wink
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Few understand what I'm trying to do but they vastly outnumber those who understand why...................

http://thespiritofsunshine.blogspot.com/

Current Australian E/GL record holder at 215.041mph

THE LUCKIEST MAN IN SLOW BUSINESS.
maj
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« Reply #4928 on: January 18, 2016, 03:07:10 PM »

Our runs include driving back on the return road , which can be the cooling down period or the last straw
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Lynchy
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« Reply #4929 on: January 21, 2016, 07:05:35 AM »

Dr G

What model is the Electromotive ignition? Big Gaz and I have both had Electromotive ignitions back in the 80s. If it is one of these I'd ditch it. They were great back then but basic these days. It's probably something a lot more recent than that... Motec is awesome but ridiculously expensive. Just the camera system in the Jag was $5k. The best system is one that you understand and can work with and have ready access to an expert.

Regards
Lynchy
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Reverend Hedgash
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« Reply #4930 on: January 21, 2016, 07:49:54 AM »

Why do fabricated valve covers always end up looking like the coolest thing in the world?  Just, nothing makes an engine look serious like fabricated valve covers.

yep, unlike billet they hint at mongrel cheers

That's exactly what I thought. As soon as I saw them I thought that will look perfect in our tank. None of this branded mass produced bolt-on brightly coloured Speed Shop stuff! Made by hand, the weld line being the gesture of the artist that made it.

There is history in this car. From the first piece acquired being the bellytank, to the engine it is receiving today. Every piece of this car has pretty well been repurposed from other projects and lord knows how many thousands of hours went into those projects, how many sleepless nights, how many minds, how many fingers scarred (Dr. G holds the record) and it is great to see the memory of that effort and the people written into the material of its manufacture.

This car was made by many, all who share the Spirit of Sunshine.

Reverend Hedgash.
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kiwi belly tank
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« Reply #4931 on: January 21, 2016, 12:52:44 PM »

Electromotive were the pioneers in crank trigger ignition back in the 80's but didn't really pursue the V8 world but rather the Porsche stuff.
They still support all there systems right back to day one. NRE uses Electromotive on all there engines, I have two older Tech 3 units on my turbo'd Keith Black with Moran 500 injectors so I wouldn't be too keen to throw money away by going to something else for no good reason.
  Sid.
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Milwaukee Midget
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« Reply #4932 on: January 21, 2016, 01:58:53 PM »

In for a penny, in for a pound on the Electromotive - Just the ignition on the BMC, as we ran a carby, but will be upgrading on the Rover with EFI.

I really like the programmability and the dash board of the WINTEC software.

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"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  rolleyes

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

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Dr Goggles
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The Jarman-Stewart "Spirit of Sunshine" Bellytank


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« Reply #4933 on: January 21, 2016, 07:15:33 PM »

Electromotive were the pioneers in crank trigger ignition back in the 80's but didn't really pursue the V8 world but rather the Porsche stuff.
They still support all there systems right back to day one. NRE uses Electromotive on all there engines, I have two older Tech 3 units on my turbo'd Keith Black with Moran 500 injectors so I wouldn't be too keen to throw money away by going to something else for no good reason.
  Sid.

turboed Keith Black with Moran injectors...... the earth just shifted on it's axis.....
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Few understand what I'm trying to do but they vastly outnumber those who understand why...................

http://thespiritofsunshine.blogspot.com/

Current Australian E/GL record holder at 215.041mph

THE LUCKIEST MAN IN SLOW BUSINESS.
Lynchy
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« Reply #4934 on: January 21, 2016, 07:26:11 PM »

Sid

The Electromotive units we had back in the 80's were the HPV-1 and I had a HPV-3. By todays standards they are like using an abacus as a computer. A fitbit has more computing power these days. But they were great products. I seriously doubt that the one supplied with the engine is that old. I still think it would be more productive for the guys to use a computer that they already have backed up by help from one of their many friends who has that specific experience. The alternative is to use the Electromotive if it is mapped as per how the guys want to run the engine and they learn how to use it. If it has to be remapped, they can change it for one that they have better access to experience for.
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