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Author Topic: Australian Belly Tank  (Read 1801787 times)

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Offline tauruck

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4605 on: August 23, 2014, 03:28:02 AM »
I don't care how it comes about but that car needs to be built. :cheers:

Awesome.

Offline Tman

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4606 on: August 23, 2014, 08:54:35 AM »
That car is as sexy and the Redhead! :cheers:

Offline SPARKY

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4607 on: August 23, 2014, 09:35:51 AM »
It is amazing how much easier the 2n car is.  You now have some pretty good ideas about packaging  and what works for  you and what doesn't. Having tried to make a new body fit an old very small car---you two have a great start.

Make the changes you want to the parts you might like to change---and go for it   oh by the way if turbos are in the plan  make it lots bigger.
Miss LIBERTY,  changing T.K.I.  to noise, dust and RUST!!!

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Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4608 on: August 23, 2014, 09:46:34 AM »
One last thought - yeah, as if I'm going to stop . . .

The renderings show the inspiration of the tank - I think that's the magic of the design.

But they don't necessitate the use of the tank.

Always quick to spend other people's money, I am . . .
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

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Offline Dr Goggles

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4609 on: August 23, 2014, 11:11:02 AM »
Been spending other people's money for a long time , I just wish the interest rate wasn't so punishing....

 :oops:
Few understand what I'm trying to do but they vastly outnumber those who understand why...................

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Offline grumm441

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4610 on: August 24, 2014, 03:32:07 AM »
I was about to write a long diatribe about thew advantages of a new chassis design when I had a look at the DLRA members list
to see what Dik's member number was. I think the DLRA admin is having a little joke
G

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Offline Stainless1

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4611 on: August 24, 2014, 08:08:40 AM »
356... that sounds about right
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, MSA Bockscar Lakester with a little N20 
MSA Bockscar Lakester #1000 my fastest mile 245 and change, 84 ci turbobusa motor... but Corey's 233 MPH H/BFL record is still 3MPH faster than mine.

Offline PorkPie

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4612 on: August 24, 2014, 09:50:04 AM »
there are several cars, they run or was concept

here the NSU streamliner concept from Wilhelm Herz, for four rotary engines...but the aerodynamic was very bad...the drag number 0,27....some lakester are better
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Offline PorkPie

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4613 on: August 24, 2014, 09:59:40 AM »
here the 1963 version from the Orpheus...a concept by Schmid, he was the chef designer for Porsche to this time....this a one of a kind 1/43 scale model I done some years ago
The project was stopped when the Brit's didn't allowed to sale the engine to Schmid

Also the Mercedes record car from the 1939 Dessau Speed days... this is a 1/43 scale model is from Omicron
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Offline Reverend Hedgash

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Streamliner
« Reply #4614 on: August 24, 2014, 10:48:21 AM »
Ha!

"...so Mr Spigot, you are here for the role of Tarzan... It's not that I have anything against your one leg, but neither have you." Peter Cook and Dudley Moore, one of my favorite sketches with Dud corpsing all the way through.

Thanks for all the suggestions so far. I would love to build another spec built car but regardless of our experience it will be still a long drawn out affair. Especially if we then try to make it as good as it possibly can be which is why we would do it. So it would end up being probably another ten year project.

The idea here is simply to do an experiment by making a new body that attaches to the chassis with absolutly minimal additions to the chassis which essentially would be the addition of mounting points, an extension to the exhaust, and the addition of a bolt on nose frame to pickup the reversed radius rods.

I certainly do not want to damage the physical car in any way so don't wish to make major changes. Upon removal of the body the car can be returned quickly to bellytank state, potentially at the same meet.

I believe I can build the body here in the uk and fly over Dr G and the colonel to assist in the attaching of it to the chassis (or vice versa) and test it at Elvington prior to shipping back to Bonneville and Oz.

I'm sure that this body will have plenty of issues and things to learn, (especially not having built in composites before) and so i would consider it an experiment of short duration. Also there will be heaps of aero issues to conquer which will mean there is already more than enough to think about. What we can learn from it we can then take into a fully fledged new car which we can develop into our retirement with me being back in oz.

I also doubt that the car would look like this if I were to start from scratch too so I don't buy the argument that a car that looks like this deserves it's own chassis as it would then not look like this anymore! It only looks like this in response to having the bellytank chassis.

In regards to getting too large to fit in, I am the skinniest I have been in years. The 5:2 diet is a cracker and I'd recommend it to anyone, including you Stew. If you want to continue driving the bellytank you need to continue fitting in regardless of the streamliner.

The arguments that I'd consider are that if the bellytank chassis is unsafe for purpose, or news rules required compromise it's use so that it becomes untenable (eg. The colonel has mentioned the addition of the Hans device has compromised its ease of use already) and perhaps the main one is the fact that at present the colonel himself cannot drive the car due to its configuration and I very much would like him to have the option to drive given all his work on the project thus far.

But as I say, I see this as an experiment and a short term one, can be up and running quickly and what we learn from it would be fantastic for the design and build of a completely new car.

When finished I guess we could pass the body on to someone who wants to build a chassis for it so it can continue racing.

Dik













Offline manta22

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4615 on: August 24, 2014, 12:35:27 PM »
Thanks, Pork Pie. I knew you would know which cars I was thinking of. How fast did the Mercedes go and with what horsepower?

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

Offline PorkPie

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4616 on: August 24, 2014, 04:20:39 PM »
Thanks, Pork Pie. I knew you would know which cars I was thinking of. How fast did the Mercedes go and with what horsepower?

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

Neil,

the engine was for the displacement 122 to 183 ci.....the real number and the hp is in one of my files....the speed was 248,1.... mph...top speed app. 252 mph....
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Offline manta22

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4617 on: August 24, 2014, 05:08:23 PM »
Thanks, that was a pretty good speed for 1939, especially for that engine displacement! I wonder if that speed was on the autobahn or at AVUS?

Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ
Regards, Neil  Tucson, AZ

Offline superleggera

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4618 on: August 24, 2014, 05:15:38 PM »
Instead of a full streamliner concept that fits over everything, the images above of adding wheel pants (ala Carbinite) or Orpheus-style housing would be interesting. (and fairly easy to integrate without damage and could be done remotely and shipped easier due to smaller sizes)  The addition of these panels would increase surface area itself -- but the frontal aspect would remain about the same and the airflow would be cleaner than the existing exposed wheels.

Given the baseline testing of the belly tank and known data about everything ala speed/gearing/displacement, it would make an interesting scientific project without breaking the budget.  Possibly three iterations or more of testing:  (and feedback in regard to directional stability)

1) Simple Carbinite NACA 6600 profile derived wheel covers over all four wheels (or rear two only). Or other shapes?
2) Orpheus configuration of integrated front/rear cover.
3/4) Variants of 1/2 with additional appendages to cleanup airflow over suspension / axles / etc.

- me: Mark - home: Dry Heat, AZ USA - build underway: J-BFS Streamliner

Offline Freud

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Re: Australian Belly Tank
« Reply #4619 on: August 24, 2014, 06:51:07 PM »
Superleggera.............Ya reached 100 posts. Yeah !!

FerD
Since '63