Chevy Monza A/BGCC

[saltfever]

As already mentioned, the Classic Category is for vehicles 1928 -1981. The Monza fits in that category but there is no Comp Coupe class in Classic. You will have to run the Monza in the Modified Category that uses any year vehicle. This means your 1975-80 body will have to compete with very aerodynamic shapes created since 1981 to-date. The Monza has a Cd of 0.40 and 17.5 Area. It is not very hard to beat those numbers today. I think Allen told me the speed limit is about 247. After that there isn’t enough room to add enough ballast. 

I think this what you are thinking about. These guys ran in ’07 and are from New York. Nice bunch of guys and had a great time but I don’t have any more information. Their number would be on the run sheet. The top was chopped the legal amount. These pics have been shrunk to fit here. If you want hi res (1MP) email me.

[Stan Back]

Steve Batchelor's Monza ran high 240's with stock body heighth, stock wheelbase, stock rear spoiler and no real ballast, but a water tank in the back.  I believe it weighed 2800-3000.  Didn't have a hugh front air dam, either.  Must be some other way to run a coupe besides doubling its weight.

Stan

[bvillercr]

Steve Batchelor's Monza ran high 240's with stock body heighth, stock wheelbase, stock rear spoiler and no real ballast, but a water tank in the back.  I believe it weighed 2800-3000.  Didn't have a hugh front air dam, either.  Must be some other way to run a coupe besides doubling its weight.

Stan

There is...

[saltfever]

While the stock Cd is 0.40. That is not to say it wouldn't improve significantly when the front end is modifided. However, a lot of the Cd is determined by the rear end treatment and it is unknow how it contributes to the Monza Cd. With an area of 17.5 ft², it is already very competative with many late model cars. I wouldn't give up on your dream . . .

[fastman614]

Our Chevy Vega, which is the same chassis as a Monza, has gone out the back door at Bonneville at over 258 MPH.... fastest one way on the 254 record attempt was 255 plus. Steve Batchelor and I have, several times, discussed whether the Monza had better aerodynamics than the Vega and whether or not that was offset by the Vega being slightly smaller in the frontal area.... We figure the Vega, with its present engine combo at around 1000hp (at sea level) has several miles an hour in it yet. The Vega weighs 5000lbs (that IS correct!) full of fuel, water and driver.... the weight is down very low in the car and evenly distributed front to rear... our premise is that, at the drags, you just run bigger and stickier slicks to hook up... at Bonneville, you need the weight.... as we have discovered over the years, that, in some ways(living in Canada, where the lakes freeze cold enough to drive on them does have an upside, I guess), the salt is like racing on ice... skinnier tires and lots of weight seem to make the car hook up better. So, if we figure we can get the Vega to hit 260 with its present combo, what could it do with a supercharged engine putting out several hundred additional horsepower?.... I am pretty sure it would go faster but.... with 98" wheelbase, somehow, I do not think we will be the ones to find out the answer... and that is also why we started on Lakesters ....

Now, about the body choice itself, for a new classic coupe, I have my private choices ..... and I am NOT sharing them with anyone... but, if I was to build a new competition coupe, I would be combing the auto recyclers for the intact body (from the firewall back) of one of the NEW ultra high fuel economy cars... from Toyota, Honda, Ford or whoever... as these are not just ultra highly fuel efficent from engine technology... there is A LOT of aerodynamics involved as well.... these cars are SMALL in the frontal area and the back ends also look like the "hole in the air behind the car will also close quietly" .... the way people are driving cars these days, there ought to be a lot of bodies available.

And to all who do not know, we DID run the 254.153 mph B/Classic Altered record in the fuel class on gasoline....

I hope to see you in inspection with your car, whatever it is ..... good luck!

[fastman614]

I hust went looking on the 'net... and I found a body.... I did a bit of cutting and pasting and filling in the colors... and... it has possibilities... a 2006 Honda Civic 2 door... I could not find a pic with the door closed ... sorry.... and you will be on your own chopping the top...

[maguromic]

Nice concept.  I wonder if Honda has a body in white program like the big three.  It would be cheaper than converting a street car.  Tony

[jl222]

While the stock Cd is 0.40. That is not to say it wouldn't improve significantly when the front end is modifided. However, a lot of the Cd is determined by the rear end treatment and it is unknow how it contributes to the Monza Cd. With an area of 17.5 ft², it is already very competative with many late model cars. I wouldn't give up on your dream . . .

  With a frontal area of 17.5 it seems the Monza would have a better cd. than .40

                 JL222

[saltfever]

 Even though drag is CdA it is composed of two unrelated attributes. Area is frontal area and has nothing to do with Cd (which is the shape). You can have a brick with an area of 2" x 4" or you can have a large egg 2" x 4". Both have the same area but a totally different Cd. In the case of semi-aerodynamic vehicles the Cd is sometimes mostly influenced by the rear configuration of the vehicle.

[jimmy six]

Fastman...That Civic looks more like a stretched Mercedes than a Honda...(I own 2 Civics) But I could be wrong and often am....JD

[Kiwi Paul]

Hmmmm...How about thoughts on Vintage Comp Coupe bodies? Anyone? I have a vested interest in this one....although initially it won`t be going fast enough to experience Aero of any kind...

[maguromic]

I would use a Bantom or Fiat coupe body and maybe a swing axle suspension.  Just my 2 cents, Tony

[Jonny Hotnuts]

1. Find the smallest frontal area. Remember that you can have a somewhat radical chop. Chopping the top improves Fa. Chopping the top can also make a cars exiting aeros improve (*or hurt if not done correctly). I suggest choosing a car with the mindset of chopping the top as much as possible and how that will affect aeros and vehicle exits.

Starting with the smallest Fa possible is a huge factor. Air exiting the vehicle is also as important.

Many people look at a car from aeros in the first half of the vehicle, in a class where you can streamline ahead of and including the cowl makes many aero ugly 1st half cars look really nice once stretched and streamlined.




Take Rex Svobodas' Saab, clearly not considered to me a top ten choice in high speed race vehicles but it has a deceptively small Fa and so-so front end in OEM form but with some aero massaging on the front the vehicle has taken on an entirely new profile and high speed potential.
(*on this note I have seen many Euro cars that would be great potential LSR project platforms).


2. OEM engine choices should not dictate (entirely) your discussion unless its required by class. However I do recommend many foreign cars for small engine displacement classes, if you are choosing small engines (clearly Rexs' Saab motor is almost as big as the entire car!). The Honda shown is a VERY good option in my opinion. Also the consider the Insight (rear wheel covers OEM!) and the Toyota Prius (if these cars are legal in CC). There are also a host of very interesting European cars that people as a rule dont consider and may prove to be very fast.

3. The Monza is not a bad choice.

4. Dont let the fact that LK or anyone is building a vehicle to run the same class prevent you from also building a vehicle for the class. Proper choices and HP will best any record. True some records are harder then others but we are all running the same salt and who does this BECAUSE its easy?


Good luck with your project....


~JH

[saltfever]

Nice post, Jonny. And spot on.  Love that last statement . . . how true!  True some records are harder then others but we are all running the same salt and who does this BECAUSE its easy?

[jacksoni]

Nice post, Jonny. And spot on.  Love that last statement . . . how true!  True some records are harder then others but we are all running the same salt and who does this BECAUSE its easy?

Having had the opportunity to participate at the salt and another famous venue, this reminds me of another similar quote attributed to Matthew Webb. Who's that, you say?  He was the first person to swim the English Channel (in 1875).  Lots more folks up Everest and some more in orbit (I've heard) than manage a channel crossing. Going over 200 for a record sounds easy to some but those who know understand how hard it can be.

"Nothing great is easy."