Author Topic: sizing turbo headers  (Read 10777 times)

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Offline RidgeRunner

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Re: sizing turbo headers
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2010, 09:50:12 PM »
Rick,

     Think I've got the difference between balancer and balance shafts straightened out better in my mind now.  Thanks for getting me to think deeper and learn more.

                        Ed

Offline 1 fast evo 2

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Re: sizing turbo headers
« Reply #16 on: February 18, 2010, 08:36:48 AM »
The 1.75 inch diameter will not be the worst problem you have in the making power department. That will be if you stay with the turbo and it is undersized, you can increase the efficiency and spool up all you want but a certain sized turbo will only move so much air.l This of course is only true if you where maxing out the turbo or close to it before if that's the case you will only see minimal gain.

I still haven't seen what size turbo you have, t3/t4 only gets us into a very large range of turbos it doesn't really tell us anything.
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My EVO 2 - 8.96@158 mph in the 1/4
221.4 mph at Maxton sept. 08
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Offline rebelce

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Re: sizing turbo headers
« Reply #17 on: February 18, 2010, 04:50:49 PM »
As soon as the car comes back from Boston, I'll get the turbo type and AR's,  a couple more pictures too.   The plan is to go to a larger turbo and new pipes if necessarily. The turbo support needs completeing and the coil pack remounted, always much to do.

Blue

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Re: sizing turbo headers
« Reply #18 on: February 19, 2010, 02:25:13 AM »
Sorry, I was counting backwards 153624 and 135642 are the same depending on the crank direction.

Yes, you are right that the lack of crank overlap and small main and journal diameters create torsional windup.  There is no good fix for this other than a new crank and deep billet block with larger diameters.  This doesn't help at all for what you are doing now, so let's look at what can help.

Here we are working with a standard block split at the main centerline.  A modern block with cross bolted mains is torsionally stiffer due to the deeper section, not the cross bolts.  There are two ways to use some of this architecture on your block.  The first is easy and reasonably effective, the second is a bitch and very effective: 

1. Go back to the main caps and add a girdle.  This is a milled part that is placed between the main caps and their nuts (longer studs are required).  The girdle is a web that connects the main caps torsionally to each other through sleeve dowels concentric to the studs.  It's a lot of work and it works best if you make your own main caps that are much taller than stock.  Good main caps should have the nut face ~1 main diameter above the parting line compared to the Chevy standard of ~.3.

2. Mill a billet pan and sleeve every bolt to the pan.  This makes the block deeper by a large margin and REALLY stiffens it up.  This cannot be done with simple bolts, the sleeves are needed to transfer the shear loads that are created by the torsion.

You are right about the 1.75" header.  For that piston displacement, we really need 2.25" to 2.5".  In a high-boost engine, the only thing that matters is blowdown: the time from EO to pressure equalization.  There is little scavenging above 20 lb and even less at 40+.  Lack of restriction during blowdown requires diameter, so that each header pipe becomes a plenum. 

I don't know what you can do given the owner's direction for this season, I hope this helps your long-term plans.

Offline rebelce

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Re: sizing turbo headers
« Reply #19 on: February 23, 2010, 02:58:36 PM »
Well, cars back and here's what I can find.  Turbo is a Master Power T61/"O" trim   A/R's  IN=.70,  EX=.68

Here's a couple of pictures of the header system and the bottom end.







Offline Jonny Hotnuts

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Re: sizing turbo headers
« Reply #20 on: February 23, 2010, 10:55:33 PM »
Quote
Turbo is a Master Power T61/"O" trim   A/R's  IN=.70,  EX=.68

Master Power is a GREAT bang for the buck turbo (made in Brazil and ISO certed, and I currently have a MP T70 waiting for a project)....however.....There are more advanced impeller designs that yield more HP with a comparatively smaller turbo (*more efficient). A more efficient turbo will make the same boost with less heat, and ultimately be safer for the motor (or allow higher boost pressures). It was this reason why I opted for another unit on our car last year.

We use Precision Turbos "Billet" 5857 (journal bearing). I cant say enough about the PT Billet turbos.
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"Sometimes it is impossible to deal with her, but most of the time she is very sweet, and if you caress her properly she will sing beautifully."
*Andres Segovia
(when Im not working on the car, I am ususally playing classical guitar)

Offline John Noonan

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Re: sizing turbo headers
« Reply #21 on: February 23, 2010, 11:59:27 PM »
JHN,

A Billet Turbo or a Billet intake wheel...?

Offline Jonny Hotnuts

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Re: sizing turbo headers
« Reply #22 on: February 24, 2010, 01:05:03 AM »
Quote
JHN,

A Billet Turbo or a Billet intake wheel...?
http://www.treadstoneperformance.com/product.phtml?p=689&cat_key=168&prodname=Precision+Ordering+Guide%2C+a+must+read+before+ordering!

JN, they are billet compressor wheels. They say they spool up faster than standard wheels and make more overall HP for their size. Could be just smoke but seemed to do really well for me.
The PT tech said the 5857 that I have is very similar to the GT35r in performance (spool and HP) while being a journal bearing.  

Got mine for 750$ (ish)

~JH
jonny_hotnuts@hotmail.com

"Sometimes it is impossible to deal with her, but most of the time she is very sweet, and if you caress her properly she will sing beautifully."
*Andres Segovia
(when Im not working on the car, I am ususally playing classical guitar)