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Author Topic: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners  (Read 1005474 times)

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Offline Peter Jack

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #885 on: September 22, 2012, 12:54:04 PM »
If you're looking for reinforcement for your decision Wobbly, I think you're definitely on the right track with this one!  :-D :-D :-D

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #886 on: September 22, 2012, 03:36:14 PM »
Thanks Peter.  Right now I am building a motor for higher performance than I have ever done successfully before.  Posting what I do will hopefully bring out reinforcement for good ideas and comments about the birdbrain ones.  You were right about the windshield.  A piece of metal woulda worked just as good.

Offline Peter Jack

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #887 on: September 22, 2012, 04:15:20 PM »
The only reason we know these things is that we've usually been down a similar road in the past.  :evil: :evil: :-D

Pete

Offline Koncretekid

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #888 on: September 22, 2012, 05:59:34 PM »
Bo,
Had I known that Carrillo would have made a rod with an oil squirter hole, I would have gone that route, as well.  My oil squirter is actually aimed at the back of the piston because there was already a tapped hole in the front, which naturally directed the oil bacwards.  I think it would be better to squirt the front inside of the piston (exhaust side).  My solution was probably cheaper,  but a failure would be much more expensive than a new correct rod or two.

I'm still wondering why you don't buy a spare motor (around $1000 on ebay) to make a race motor and keep the current motor for the street.  You would just have to give up beer for a year, or so!

Tom
We get too soon oldt, and too late schmart!
Life's uncertain - eat dessert first!

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #889 on: September 23, 2012, 10:53:12 PM »
Tom, changing engines in these bikes is a major project.  It is just like a Vincent.  The swingarm bolts to the back of the motor so it and the rear wheel need to be taken off.  Then the engine-subframe assy is unbolted from the frame-forks-front wheel assy.  The latter is lighter than the former, by far.  It is lifted up and off of the motor-subframe.  The motor is as heavy as a battleship anchor.  Two people move it using the subframe as handles.  There are a zillion bolts and nuts.  The extremely heavy engines need to go up and down a flight of stairs.  Just thinking about it hurts.  It is far easier to switch the cylinder heads.

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #890 on: October 02, 2012, 12:31:27 AM »
The dirt bike club meets at a bike shop monthly. We figure out who will do what and how we will pay for it just like all other clubs.  It is in the evening and all of the scoots are rolled into the showroom.  It is an impenetrable mass of bikes.  I do not look at them.  I hung my cap on a Huskvarna's handlebars and forgot to bring it home.  Saturday I went back to get my cap.  My son, Werner, was with me.  The bikes were spread out and it was daylight.  We checked them out.  A used one stood out.  It was a 2007 Yamaha TT, blue like the cookie monster, and in like new condition.  A guy bought it for his wife, she rode it for 45 minutes, decided she did not like bike riding, and it was parked in a heated garage for five years.  This bike was a real good one.  Not often does one see a minter like this.

Werner signed up for the Marines and he goes in right after he gets out of high school in December or June.  I bought the bike so we could trail ride with his little sister for a few months before he leaves.  Rose and I brought the bike home today.  Werner asked me to coach him so he could learn the finer points of hauling butt in the land of pointy plants.  I never wanted to be in another desert race after the big crash.  I guess I will, now.  We are going to enter in the big race of the year, China Hat.  The build diary will be a bit slow this year.  The Triumph will be on the salt in 2013 with the 994cc motor, a fixed windshield, and that's about it.   

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #891 on: October 07, 2012, 11:31:04 PM »
Werner and me closed out the riding season today with a big blast through the woods.  It was the full experience.  Crashing, getting lost, breaking stuff, all great fun.  There is this Quack Attack trail I never was on before.  It was awful.  The worst I have seen in my life.  There were all sorts of strange things about this trail.  Trees alongside it were stripped of bark.  The trunks of the bigger trees were protected by metal pipes.  There was oil in places where folks broke open their oil pans.  All of the rocks in the rail were scraped up and there was broken headlight glass on the trail.

My figuring is "this is so bad it must be on the internet."  Type in "quack attack motorcycle trail"  There is a video "NEW Hoodoo trail - Page 5 - Pirate 4x4.Com"  We rode our bikes down this.  On You Tube there are several videos.  One is "quack attack 4x4 trail"  This explains what made the strange marks and damage I saw.  I never thought this was possible.  You car folks will love this.

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #892 on: October 11, 2012, 12:28:51 AM »
In the past I have used aluminum valve spring retainers and they have failed.  I was told that aluminum retainers do not have the long term fatigue resistance that is needed for street/race motors.  I was told to use steel retainers in street engines in order to resist fatigue damage.  Titanium valve spring retainers are available for the Triumph.  Does ti have long term fatigue resistance similar to steel?   

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #893 on: October 16, 2012, 09:53:30 PM »
Valve keepers are not subject to complete load reversal cycles or even load relaxation cycles.  They are always loaded in the same direction.  It is unlikely that fatigue killed my aluminum keeper.  It is most probable that the cotters pulled through because it did not have enough strength.  The ti keepers have a lot of strength so pulling through should not be a problem.  I will use them with no worry.

The fairing nose has always been a problem for me.  I cannot get the shape right.  Working conditions are partly to blame.  I do this in the winter, it is cold and I freeze my butt, it gets dark early, and its my workshop is down a flight of stairs from the bike.

The engine is out of the frame and I was able to get everything down where it is nice and warm.  Normally I do not like to brag, but this idea and setup is totally Einstein.  No excuses now.  It is time to shape this thing for speed.   

Offline grumm441

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #894 on: October 17, 2012, 05:26:44 AM »
Hey Bo
how far are you from Independance
G
Chief Motorcycle Steward Dry Lakes Racers Australia Inc
Wazavudu Bellytank  Spirit of Sunshine Bellytank

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #895 on: October 17, 2012, 11:43:22 PM »
Independence, Oregon, I assume you mean.  That little town is not far from here.  There is a nice Mexican restaurant there.   Sometimes Rosie and I ride out there on a summer Sunday on the Triumph.

The latest Motorcyclist magazine came in a plastic bag.  Normally they do not.  Inside was the new issue and a reprint of their February 1952 magazine.  They are celebrating a 110-year anniversary.  The 1952 magazine was a special commemorative for their 50th anniversary.  They interviewed Harry Martin, a fellow who raced in 1902.

Harry set an international land speed record on his Excelsior at the Canning Town cinder track.  Canning Town is part of London, I think, and this was one of the English Excelsiors.  According to Harry "At Canning Town, for instance, the track had four corners and measured three laps to the mile - 12 sharp bends per mile, and in the Open-to-the-World meeting there in July 1903, I broke the 5-mile world's record in 5 mins, 39 secs from a standing start, and did the flying mile in 1 min, 5 secs."

The racers controlled their speed with an ignition lever mounted on the side of the tank.  That must have taken real skill to set that land speed record on a cinder track with one hand on the bars and the other one on the tank.  Interestingly, they did not know about speed wobbles.  They discovered them when they started to race on the big concrete surfaced track at Brooklands.   

Offline Interested Observer

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #896 on: October 17, 2012, 11:46:09 PM »
Wobbly,
Fatigue damage will accumulate with any on-going variation of stress in a part that produces localized or general yielding of the material.  While full reversed cycles will cause damage more quickly than partial reversal or lower amplitude cycles, reversal is not required to produce “fatigue”.

In general, like steel, the “endurance limit” of titanium is about half of its tensile strength.  That is, stress amplitudes less than the endurance limit will likely not result in a fatigue failure and the part will have an indefinitely long life.  However, without close attention during design, most parts will contain stress concentrations that can easily multiply stress levels well above the nominal, or average, stress.

Unfortunately, aluminum does not have an endurance limit.  Lower stress amplitudes will give longer life, but eventually it will fail, hopefully not before its designed service life.

Offline grumm441

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #897 on: October 18, 2012, 04:42:36 AM »
Yep, Independence Oregon
I'm looking at a bike that's for sale there
G
Chief Motorcycle Steward Dry Lakes Racers Australia Inc
Wazavudu Bellytank  Spirit of Sunshine Bellytank

Offline Koncretekid

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #898 on: October 18, 2012, 09:32:25 AM »
The engine is out of the frame and I was able to get everything down where it is nice and warm.  Normally I do not like to brag, but this idea and setup is totally Einstein.  No excuses now.  It is time to shape this thing for speed.   

Einstein or Frankenstein?  Sorry, Bo, I couldn't help myself!  You have spent so much hard work on your project; you deserve better.

Following is a photo I took of your bike at BUB this year, and a photo of mine.  I gained 16 mph with my bodywork and no other significant changes.  I believe you didn't experience much improvement with yours. That doesn't qualify me as an expert, but comparisons can be made.  Your bike is a little higher than mine to begin with.  Is there anything you can do to get that front end and front fairing lower for less frontal area?  Secondly, that large hole behind your front wheel probably doesn't help.  One of the Harleys running full bodywork didn't have any provision for cooling air whatsoever, and the owner claimed he didn't need any.  I have only clearance for the forks, and a 3" diameter cooling duct.  Other than that, is there any gain to be made by smoothing out the rivet heads? A new windshield is indicated, as well.
Tom
We get too soon oldt, and too late schmart!
Life's uncertain - eat dessert first!

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Team Go Dog, Go! Modified Partial Streamliners
« Reply #899 on: October 18, 2012, 03:21:58 PM »
Graham, PM sent.  Tom, an eagle eye look at everything during the the engine tear down showed no signs of excess heat anywhere.  Based on that, I am closing up the opening in the front as much as I can.  The minimum room I need to accommodate the front wheel will pass enough air for cooling.

This year was inconclusive on how the streamlining works.  The 3-mile course is short and I was accelerating through the timed mile, I could not tuck down cause of the bad windshield, and the motor was really loose.  Next year I will run the longer FIM course so I can get meaningful data.

Complete agreement about dropping the windshield a few inches and reducing the frontal area.  It is on my to do list after the big motor gets sorted.