Author Topic: Observations at El Mirage  (Read 11624 times)

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Offline jl222

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #30 on: May 26, 2009, 05:10:00 PM »
There some holes missing in this story. Yaccouci had the letters XO in engine class under Vehicle Classification. He also had the matching XO engine code. On sat. when he went in for record cert. Dan told him he had the wrong info on the entry form and the record was disqualified. Being that Dan Warner, like most of us, dosen't know the El Mirage Procedures by heart, he told Rick to re-enter the car with the correct info and then go run it. There was then a protest filed and the protest was upheld because the El Mirage procedures were not followed. The main thing that many people in Landspeed racing forget is that majority of the rules that are in place are a reaction to a problem that happened. In this case it had to due with someone building an engine to small for the class which it was running it. When it went to record cert, it was fould to be to small so the entry form was changed. This stirred up talk in the association and this rule was implemented. There are Rule Change Request forms on the SCTA websight and to the best of my knowledge no one has filled one out yet on this topic. Nominations for SCTA officers will be comming up in Oct. So if you havn't gotten the message yet please get the facts before you open your mouth and step up and be part of the solution rather than part of the problem.
D3

 And all this time I thought the codes were for computer work :roll:
 
  JL222

 Hope your facts are right after opening your mouth :evil:
 
« Last Edit: May 26, 2009, 05:14:09 PM by jl222 »

Offline joea

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #31 on: May 26, 2009, 07:55:29 PM »
nice irony....GREAT reflection of OUR SOCIETY today.....

someone whined about a team setting a record
with an engine smaller than allowed.......boo freakin hoo....

and someone protested a team who made two record runs with a
legal vehicle.......and wanted their points disallowed d/t a clerical
error.........yea thats the racing spirit...

THOSE PROTESTERS SHOULD BE SO PROUD..............
(likely folks who believe in "redistribution of wealth"... etc)

no worries.....

ya cant keep the hard working , honest, fast people down for too long....


Offline willieworld

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #32 on: May 26, 2009, 08:35:38 PM »
racing at el mirage isnt the same as bonneville ---we have 2 rule books the scta-bni book and the el mirage procedures --if you have never raced there you might want to go to the el mirage procedures on the home page of www.scta-bni.org and pay attention to section 6 c and 7 k  but read the whole thing if you have time ---if you dont  fill out your paperwork properly and you leave the start line you cant change classes at el mirage --at bonneville you can at a cost of 300 dollars  just some thoughts  willie buchta
« Last Edit: May 26, 2009, 08:38:20 PM by willieworld »
willie-dpombatmir-buchta

Offline RichFox

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #33 on: May 26, 2009, 11:04:23 PM »
nice irony....GREAT reflection of OUR SOCIETY today.....

someone whined about a team setting a record
with an engine smaller than allowed.......boo freakin hoo....

and someone protested a team who made two record runs with a
legal vehicle.......and wanted their points disallowed d/t a clerical
error.........yea thats the racing spirit...

THOSE PROTESTERS SHOULD BE SO PROUD..............
(likely folks who believe in "redistribution of wealth"... etc)

no worries.....

ya cant keep the hard working , honest, fast people down for too long....


You know I'm friends with Jack and i like Rick. But maybe this is Karma from the "Tag Motor" deal. Anyway, Rick will just do it again with the right numbers.

Offline John Noonan

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #34 on: May 26, 2009, 11:25:15 PM »
nice irony....GREAT reflection of OUR SOCIETY today.....

someone whined about a team setting a record
with an engine smaller than allowed.......boo freakin hoo....

and someone protested a team who made two record runs with a
legal vehicle.......and wanted their points disallowed d/t a clerical
error.........yea thats the racing spirit...

THOSE PROTESTERS SHOULD BE SO PROUD..............
(likely folks who believe in "redistribution of wealth"... etc)

no worries.....

ya cant keep the hard working , honest, fast people down for too long....


You know I'm friends with Jack and i like Rick. But maybe this is Karma from the "Tag Motor" deal. Anyway, Rick will just do it again with the right numbers.

When running correctly and legal Jacks vehicles and Rick are great competitors..there is more to the story however it is like beating a dead horse...it is now old news.

Rick and his team will be running stout numbers and still could win the championship if other teams step on their Pissers again.. :oops:

landracing

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #35 on: May 27, 2009, 12:50:39 AM »
Why does this all seem like we are not "amateur racing" anymore....  Good thing I got Stainless around to fill out paperwork....

JonAmo

am⋅a⋅teur  /ˈæməˌtʃʊər, -tʃər, -tər, ˌæməˈtɜr/  Show Spelled Pronunciation [am-uh-choor, -cher, -ter, am-uh-tur]  Show IPA
–noun
 
1. a person who engages in a study, sport, or other activity for pleasure rather than for financial benefit or professional reasons. Compare professional.
******We all do this for fun right???*****

2. an athlete who has never competed for payment or for a monetary prize.
******Well Noonan is out*****


« Last Edit: May 27, 2009, 12:52:18 AM by landracing »

McRat

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #36 on: May 27, 2009, 01:14:23 AM »
Why does this all seem like we are not "amateur racing" anymore....  Good thing I got Stainless around to fill out paperwork....

JonAmo

am⋅a⋅teur  /ˈæməˌtʃʊər, -tʃər, -tər, ˌæməˈtɜr/  Show Spelled Pronunciation [am-uh-choor, -cher, -ter, am-uh-tur]  Show IPA
–noun
 
1. a person who engages in a study, sport, or other activity for pleasure rather than for financial benefit or professional reasons. Compare professional.
******We all do this for fun right???*****

2. an athlete who has never competed for payment or for a monetary prize.
******Well Noonan is out*****




I race because poverty is supposed to be good for the soul. 

Didn't work.  I'm still an ahole.  :evil:


Offline John Noonan

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #37 on: May 27, 2009, 02:13:55 AM »
Why does this all seem like we are not "amateur racing" anymore....  Good thing I got Stainless around to fill out paperwork....

JonAmo

am⋅a⋅teur  /ˈæməˌtʃʊər, -tʃər, -tər, ˌæməˈtɜr/  Show Spelled Pronunciation [am-uh-choor, -cher, -ter, am-uh-tur]  Show IPA
–noun
 
1. a person who engages in a study, sport, or other activity for pleasure rather than for financial benefit or professional reasons. Compare professional.
******We all do this for fun right???*****

2. an athlete who has never competed for payment or for a monetary prize.
******Well Noonan is out*****



Mighty big talk for such a  _-_-_-   awe never mind.. :cheers:

Where is my parts..?

Still need the fire suit?

Later.

J

PS, the sock drawer misses you.   8-)


J



LittleLiner

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #38 on: May 27, 2009, 01:45:27 PM »
The problem is not the el mirage rules . . . or the procedure to change the rules . . . or the computer skills of the average official . . . or whether or not the protesters were being chicken sh**s or not.   The problem is that there is a flawed system for interfacing the class structure into the computers.

I used ‘codes’ for programming when I learned to use a keypunch machine and program in COBOL back when Jimmy freaking Carter was president.  That same year I learned to program in BASIC and you didn't need no stinking codes to describe things that were already uniquely identified when using BASIC or anything that has been developed since.

Pick a class . . . any class. . .let's say E/CBFALT.  With a unique class description like that why does the El Mirage computer need one unique code for the engine class and one unique code for the body class??   Anybody??  Anybody???  Bueller???

The answer is - you don't need a code for either.  Just program the machine to recognize the actual class designation. 

By sticking with the code deal they have engineered in a possible way to get things wrong.  Stop that.  It's really not the way to run a system where you intentionally build in possible stumbling blocks . . . . .

Oh yeah, . . . I know . . here come the replies about me not ever running at El Mirage, why don't I see a club rep, etc, etc, etc.   

Just fix the program

It shouldn't require a rule change

Offline RichFox

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #39 on: May 27, 2009, 03:27:44 PM »
Exactly the point I tried to make with the guy who set the system up. No help.

Offline willieworld

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #40 on: May 27, 2009, 03:41:30 PM »
no replies like that----it just occurred to me though --maybe the number letter code thing is I.Q. test---yea i know i failed it one time myself LLOOLL           willie buchta
willie-dpombatmir-buchta

Offline 1212FBGS

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #41 on: May 27, 2009, 04:03:31 PM »
maybe the newest, best thing to race is a Hayabusa..... but this organization likes to race antique roadsters.... they do it there way.... if you don't like it race with the ECTA.... seem like the biggest bitches about this don't even race el-mo....

McRat

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #42 on: May 27, 2009, 04:06:23 PM »
I suppose it could be worse.  Like our Postal Zip Code system.  Our's has been changed 3 times but we never moved.  Now it's a 9-digit number.  That's 1,000,000,000 unique possible values.  Every address in the US can have 10 unique zipcodes.  One for the bathroom, one for the kitchen, etc.  But what if you live in a mansion?   You might have to share your bedroom zipcode with your closet, and possibly not get your mail.  Perhaps they needed 10 digits to play it safe.

Back on subject, yes, one text file and a few lines of code would eliminate the redundancy, yet keep the code if you need them.   This is 30 year old BASIC:

10 INPUT "What is the class?"; ENTRYCLASS$
20 OPEN "CLASSLIST.TXT" FOR INPUT AS #1
30 READ #1; CLASSNAME$, ENGINECODE, BODYCODE
40 IF CLASSNAME$ = "ENDOFLIST" THEN 100
50 IF CLASSNAME$ = ENTRYCLASS$ THEN 70
60 GOTO 30
70 PRINT "For ";ENTRYCLASS$; ", the body code is ";BODYCODE;".  The engine code is ";ENGINECODE
80 CLOSE #1
90 GOTO 120
100 PRINT "Not a valid class name.  Try again."
110 CLOSE #1
120 END

No comments on my rotten coding style, but it's not very much code, and can be done in less than 1 hour to existing code, regardless of the programming language.

But like everyone says, it is what it is, and just follow the procedures.



« Last Edit: May 27, 2009, 04:08:53 PM by McRat »

Offline desotoman

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #43 on: May 27, 2009, 04:13:12 PM »

There some holes missing in this story.


There are Rule Change Request forms on the SCTA websight and to the best of my knowledge no one has filled one out yet on this topic. Nominations for SCTA officers will be comming up in Oct. So if you havn't gotten the message yet please get the facts before you open your mouth and step up and be part of the solution rather than part of the problem.
D3

D3,

With all due respect, if you are referring to my post that started this thread here are my thoughts.

I got the story correct, there was a clerical error on the entry form, Rick entered a different class and corresponding code on his entry form, I was standing in impound when this mistake was found, and witnessed the whole thing. In fact I was the one that suggested to Dan (which he commented was a good idea) that Rick fill out a new entry form, instead of crossing out the class and code designations on the original entry. My thought was to eliminate any confusion on what happened, and to show there was no intent to hide anything.

I have always felt discussion is good, sometimes you get points of view you may never have thought of. After digesting others points of view, then and only then can you decide whether a change is necessary or not.

Rule change request forms are not for the El Mirage Procedures. It clearly states in the El Mirage Procedures when and how to propose a change, under section I.B. of the Procedures.

I feel by bring this subject up and making racers aware of a potential problem in filling out the EM entry form I am being part of the solution. As I said originally I was not pointing any fingers, I just did not want to see this happen again to anyone.

Knowledge is power, and the more people you can get the word out to the less mistakes will be made.

Respectfully,

Tom G.
I love the USA. How much longer will we be a free nation?

Asking questions is one's only way of getting answers.

The rational person lets verified facts form or modify his opinion.  The ideologue ignores verified facts which don't fit his preconceived opinions.

landracing

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Re: Observations at El Mirage
« Reply #44 on: May 27, 2009, 09:20:38 PM »
Back on subject, yes, one text file and a few lines of code would eliminate the redundancy, yet keep the code if you need them.   This is 30 year old BASIC:

10 INPUT "What is the class?"; ENTRYCLASS$
20 OPEN "CLASSLIST.TXT" FOR INPUT AS #1
30 READ #1; CLASSNAME$, ENGINECODE, BODYCODE
40 IF CLASSNAME$ = "ENDOFLIST" THEN 100
50 IF CLASSNAME$ = ENTRYCLASS$ THEN 70
60 GOTO 30
70 PRINT "For ";ENTRYCLASS$; ", the body code is ";BODYCODE;".  The engine code is ";ENGINECODE
80 CLOSE #1
90 GOTO 120
100 PRINT "Not a valid class name.  Try again."
110 CLOSE #1
120 END

No comments on my rotten coding style, but it's not very much code, and can be done in less than 1 hour to existing code, regardless of the programming language.


McRat,

Wow does that bring up some memories.... I started on the TI-99-4A  ... Most who were into computer can relate.... BASIC was the most basic thing you could write... I remember writing those stupid 200 line programs that would bounce a stupid ball around the screens.... good ole monochrome monitor...

Jonamo