FWD Streamliner differentials

[adamadam]

Hi,
I'm just looking for information on front wheel drive streamliner diff options. Ive heard of a few streamliners like Danny Boy and Ken Walkey's streamliner using Halibrand quick changes, but I was after some more specifics. Has anyone had any experience using/building/modifying a fwd streamliner

Is something like a Dana front diff from a Bronco/F truck, cut and narrowed an option or are there particular problems with this setup? One problem I thought was availability of low gears, hence the quick changes in the faster streamliners. Is a full custom diff the only real option? Unless you have a lot of money to spend, are you better off to go rear wheel drive?

Any thoughts on the subject would be greatly appreciated. I tried a few searches and found bit and pieces here and there, but not a whole lot. If there are any links please let me know.

Thanks
Adam

[desotoman]

Adam,

I am sure there are a lot of people on this forum who can answer your question but if you want a good answer you must be more specific. What works for a 500 HP motor might not work for a 2000 HP motor. What are your goals? More specific how fast do you want to go? What will you motor red line be? What tire size? Once you figure that out then you know what ratio you will need for a ring and pinion. Or what ratio you will need to get out of a quick change.

You might want to check out what Sparky is doing on his new lakester build.

Tom G.

[SPARKY]

I am using a GM 10/12 8 7/8 "caddy center section with 2.28 and installed GM 1/2 ton outers and hubs

[adamadam]

A few more specifics are, a blown 383 Chev with 5-6000 rpm peak power turning 25 inch Goodyear LSR's. I'm looking for around 7-800hp, and I will be trying for 150-200mph first up, but I would like some room to move.

I'm not after a specific ratio answer for now, more just an opinion of whether or not it is worth going FWD over RWD. If a lot of custom (or V. Expensive) work will be needed then i might just shorten my 9 inch rear, and sort some steering out front. I'm just looking at options and seeing what is out there, and what other people have come up with at the moment. Brainstorming, or barnstorming.

Thanks
Adam

[Joe Timney]

Winters Quick Change Company offers a rear called a front quick change with the input going thru the back of the rear cover. I have sold several of them but I would recommend the reversed R&P and turn the housing around and drive it thru the front. A QC will give you a wide gear selection. You can get up to a 2:18 Final drive with the 4:12 R&P. They also offer a 3:08 and 2:00 R&P but not in reverse R&P.
Hope this helps.

Joe

[adamadam]

Thanks for the info guys, that's the sort of stuff I was after.

Anyone else using a 4wd front end? Sparky, I haven't seen your car,  did you narrow the front end much/at all? If you did as it a home job or did someone do it for you? Ive read about shortening the dana's by grinding the welds off the nuckle/tube joint, knocking it off then welding it back on. That was for 4x4's though, a little slower.

Thanks
Adam

[Sumner]

A few more specifics are, a blown 383 Chev with 5-6000 rpm peak power turning 25 inch Goodyear LSR's. I'm looking for around 7-800hp, and I will be trying for 150-200mph first up, but I would like some room to move.............

The 383 really puts you at a disadvantage as you will be at the bottom of the B motor class.  The blown gas record is around 308 (pretty low and who knows how long it will be that low) and the blown fuel around 380 I believe.  Front wheel drive can offer a lot of advantages, but is going to me more expensive and complex and if you want to run that motor which would be very hard to be competitive with I'd just go with the rear drive.  Now if you intend to build a 439 cu. in. B motor that would be a different deal.

One of my "someday" things to do is to try making a box using over the over the counter quick change gears with an input and output both pointed in the same direction.  It would go in front of one of "Sparky's" GM low gear ratio differentials.  The motor would be in the car just behind the front diff with the aft end pointing forward with a drive line under the front differential (to the side of the pumpkin) to the quick change box's input shaft.  The output from the quick change would go via a drive-shaft to the differential that has it's input facing forward.  Very similar to a V drive setup.  Except for making the box this would use low cost items.  I think the box could be made fairly simply using two stock quick change input shafts with their bearings and such from a current quick change.  That way stock gears could be used and the only machining would be a box to hold the gears/seals and a stock quick change rear cover.

c ya and good luck,

Sum

[adamadam]

Thanks Sum,
I'm not too worried about records at the moment, I'm in Australia, and there aren't any streamliner records set, so you could pick an engine class and get a record IF you make it down and back. That is until someone else gets the same idea. For now, I just want to get to the salt and get even more addicted.

Your idea sounds quite interesting it would take some work but there's no reason why it couldn't happen. I intend on building a bigger small block down the track, but I already have the 383 sorted, and my first year will be more of a shakedown run. If the car runs well, I will go all out. We only get to run once a year over here though. There's talk of short testing days at some airports, so hopefully something will come of them, but you cant do too much when you only have a mile from go to whoa.

Thanks
Adam

[SPARKY]

I would not try a FWD without some sort of freewheeling provision---talk to Johnson with the SALTASOUROUS--- when you backout or blow up  it gets real intresting with FWD---I am planning on using my GV which I ordered with the freewheeling option---much to my regrett we have 2 experiences how this helps---even with rear wheel drive when you kick one out at speed.

[sockjohn]

---talk to Johnson with the SALTASOUROUS--- when you backout or blow up  it gets real intresting with FWD---

I have photos of a dented up nose on the  SALTASOUROUS but never saw the incident or got to ask them what happened.

What's the story on that one?  I've always been fond of that car.

[racergeo]

    Sockjohn, the dent was caused by hitting the four and a half mile marker on my record back up run. I didn't see it, nor can you see it by watching the DVD one frame at a time. The DVD is Marks 07 World Finals coverage from the SCTA.
   Fact is I built a front wheel drive because I planned on converting to a streamliner after sorting everything out at the slower lakester speeds. If I had it to do over I would build a car that looks like the Markley Bros. streamliner and run the wheels out side the body as a lakester. Then I would tuck the steering and diff inside the body and run it as a rear wheel drive streamliner. I had too little experience and no mentor with first hand experience when I built my car. If I had to start now and build FWD I would just copy the fellows that have the front wheel lakester in the build diaries. That is a stroke of genius. If you do run FWD check with a number of experts as the front end geometry is very different with FWD.

[SPARKY]

I do not think the "Strange Days" car has any freewheeling provision.

[racergeo]

  Sparky, I just asked the boss at TSR racing if that would concern him and he confirmed what TCI told me and that was "when motor locks up front pump is no longer turning and clutches are not applied."
   He wrote a widely used book on the racing power glide and I except his explanation. He said they would release almost instantly or at least as fast as you could clutch a stick shift.

[SPARKY]

nice to know----I am willing to bet they learn to shift to netrual as they put the chute out or berfore they lift

[Chaz]

   Here's a look at the diff in the Strange Day bellytank. The rear is a Winters with bassakward gearing I purchased from Joe Timney. Joe is great to work with. The steering box is a sweet. The knuckles are Jeep Cherokee switched right to left. Axles were converted to Dana 44. Hope this helps. Tread width is four feet.
  We are real believers in front wheel drive for the salt. The weight is where it should be, and the car should be pretty spinproof. Of course we havent been on the salt yet, so my two cents worth may be worth just that.