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Author Topic: INDIAN 741 Supercharged...See you in 2011  (Read 190557 times)
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gearheadeh
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« Reply #315 on: June 19, 2010, 09:28:17 AM »

i use a dodge starter motor. powered
by 2 -12 volt batts.(24 volt)

if you go that route, put two handles on it.

maybe my pm didn't go through.
let me know if anything besides $ is needed for bub.

franey
Instead of 2 handles, use 1 handle and a large Stud that locates with a hole on the engine. This with control the torque.
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octane
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The INDIAN "Saltcracker" 650 A-VBF




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« Reply #316 on: June 26, 2010, 03:08:56 PM »

F I N A L L Y  !!!!! ....I am off from work.

.-)


Jeff, Franey, Gearhead...thanks a lot for you input !!!

I'm afraid I disregarded it ( I may very well regret that later )  and went on with my plan:
how to make a roller-starter with the fewest (and cheapest) parts possible:



..so I spend a late night at my friend Jacobs place.
Jacob is quite brilliant working a lathe and a mill.
It all goes down in his basement, with an old cassette-tape player playing fifties jazz music in the background
and once in a while his wife comes down and offers refreshments.......bloody nice!

The rollers were rounded in the ends , incorporating a small 'neck'




..holes were cut in the delrin using a thingy in the mill
that I have no clue what is called in English.
Sort of a head with an adjustable cutting tip for extremely accurate hole-cutting




Then I cut off the snout of the starter , and cut down the starter-axle
and another guy made me an axle
with a hole bored in it that fitted exactly on to the starters axle ( as to keep them 'in line' )
and the 'new' axle was welded to the starter-axle / cog-wheel



...a corresponding hole was bored in one of the rollers to accept the motor-axle.


Cut down the delrin, and cut off the top of the aluminum bar.
Insert rollers




Bushings for the starter motor




Test the set-up and mark where to make threads for the bolts that will hold things together




The delrin is absolutely wonderful to work on.
You can use a pair of scissors as a smoothing plane to make a real nice surface-finish




..and at the same time you can cut a thread that really is surprisingly strong







Do a bit of cutting, and set up for welding a ramp




Cut a hose left-over from the blower intake,
that happened to have the exact right diameter,
to keep the dirt and salt from entering the starter moter




...bore through the roller/axle and insert locking-pin






...and ( fanfare ) you have the LEGO of roller starters






Mission accomplished; it works !!!....................erh........so far.


For battery I am contemplating maybe using one of these tiny nifty things:

MOTYDESIGN lightweight batteries



That done, it's time to start up the darn bike.
Wish me luck !!


Have a splendid weekend ya'all!









« Last Edit: June 26, 2010, 03:28:38 PM by octane » Logged

"A designer knows he has achieved perfection
not when there is nothing left to add
but when there is nothing left to take away"

Antoine de Saint-Exupery
ironwigwam
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« Reply #317 on: June 26, 2010, 03:59:36 PM »

Wish you luck!
  Thanks for update!
    I can see the trees in forest now.
   Rocky
   1957 S/VG
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charlie101
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Indian 101 buff




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« Reply #318 on: June 26, 2010, 10:50:16 PM »

Simplicity, beauty and style. I hate when people do this to me! Weld a tube to the sprocket, lock with a pin. Bushings that double as rails and a simple frame with a ramp.
Why didn't I think of that. cheers
Mind you, without effort I can put all kind of layers of complicity to a problem, and make it work but the ingenious is to reduce a problem to its bare bones. Thank you. I'd test it however in an oven to ensure the rollers don't drag in the hot bonneville sun.
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desperate
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« Reply #319 on: June 29, 2010, 06:04:32 AM »

I'll keep my fingers crossed for the start-up Lars, but I bet it fires up first go.
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wobblywalrus
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« Reply #320 on: June 29, 2010, 01:18:37 PM »

Lars, there is a post on the Team Go Dog, Go build site about some basic things to check before start up.  Some might help you.  Good luck with the initial run.  This is always an anxious time.   
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charlie101
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Indian 101 buff




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« Reply #321 on: June 29, 2010, 04:49:28 PM »

I've been looking and listen around high and low for a long time what is used, what's available and where to get build sheets and/or build diarys and only got run around answers like "It's easy, just use excel"  or "buy this and that and you're set!"  Most had incomplete information or are restricted to a narrow goal. Mostly Lotso$$$ and/or useless for motorbikes, I didn't find what I wanted. It's difficult to know how to set up and know what kind of data you need, when you haven't done it before. When you look at Wobblywalrus pen and paper buildsheet it looks simple but requires a lot of thought and experience to get that clear and sorted. Nowhere but on Team Go dog, Go have I seen an explanation or description that clear and systematic on how to sort and put up the data that is needed and required. I saved all pages on my harddrive and hope he continues!
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octane
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The INDIAN "Saltcracker" 650 A-VBF




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« Reply #322 on: July 01, 2010, 01:16:52 AM »

Thanks Rocky, WW and Charlie.

I'll keep my fingers crossed for the start-up Lars, but I bet it fires up first go.

Thanks............ but nope!
.-(




BUMMER BUMMER BUMMER !

Talk about a bad start; the big moment arrived and a bunch of guys came over to give a helping hand

..first my nifty ( or so I thought ) roller starter had...er...technical problems
so I borrowed a chunky chain-saw driven roller starter

..got the bike on it and ran it;
aourgh; methanol all over the floor pouring from the carb.
Long story, but fixed it

..ran the bike again.....bike didn't as much as fart.
Lot's of checking and found this: two halves of the rotor tumbling about inside the ignition distributor



WTF; that's a new one to me: the rotor in the distributor had disintegrated.

Explanation:
Turns out the POS rotor was really badly made;
the metal-thingy on the left sat , ever so slightly, too far away from center,
(compared to the upper one we pulled from my friend Allan's Indian.)



Not only that, but it didn't sit tight in the recess (recess to wide) so it could therefore move about, ("turn")
become askew ( is that the word ?)
 ...hit the brass-thingy hi-tension take-ups in the cover (evidenced by the presence of brass-dust in the distributor)
and thereby brake the rotor.

...ran the bike again.....nothing happened except it backfired and shot... WHAM!... out the
safety pop-up valve on the intake plenum.
At least the pop-up valve has now proved it's value.


Then I gave up. Gotta re-re-re-check everything.

Somethings seriously wrong here. I am ( was ) sure I checked it,
but something tells me I timed the ignition not on the compression stroke
as I'm supposed to.

Here's a short video of the disaster;
You can't hear it over the noise from the chain-saw engine
but at the end you see the camera(man) jump (and yours truly too, I'm afraid,)
as it explodes out the pop-up valve. ( ...and I remark; "That's what a pop-up valve is for ")

The video is filed under "Comedy"

( Click the image to see video)




No one told me this was gonna be easy.
« Last Edit: July 01, 2010, 06:21:49 PM by octane » Logged

"A designer knows he has achieved perfection
not when there is nothing left to add
but when there is nothing left to take away"

Antoine de Saint-Exupery
ironwigwam
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« Reply #323 on: July 01, 2010, 04:20:03 AM »

Hang in there, remember your first trip there and what was endured?
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wobblywalrus
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« Reply #324 on: July 01, 2010, 05:43:40 PM »

Fuel?  Spark?  Compression?  You are sooo close.  Good luck!
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bak189
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« Reply #325 on: July 01, 2010, 07:49:28 PM »

You can always run that fine looking BSA you have there.....fine looking bike it is......and maybe even faster then the Redskin....you think........................don't give up...you will get it sorted out..............
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bak189
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« Reply #326 on: July 01, 2010, 07:55:03 PM »


What ever you run at the BUB.......if and when you need welding equipment come to our trailer and you are welcome to use it..........we are all one big happy family.......................
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saltwheels262
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LTA 7/2013




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« Reply #327 on: July 02, 2010, 08:55:57 AM »


What ever you run at the BUB.......if and when you need welding equipment come to our trailer and you are welcome to use it..........we are all one big happy family.......................

that is great to know. had to run into town for a
broken alum. chainguard bracket at '09 bub.

franey
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bub '07 - 140.293 a/pg   120" crate street mill      
max 10/07 - a/pf   d license
bub '08 - 153.697 a/pf   pump gas
bub '09 - 156.377 aps/pf  ran out of gear
lta  '10 - 158.208  2 much gear 2x
bub '10 - 158.100  sweetooth gear
lta  7/11 -163.389  7/17/11; 3 run avg.-162.450
                probably it for that mill, as is.
ohio - (1) 185.076 w/#684                                 
          (2) 182.xxx w/20+ mph winds
lta  9/12  -148mph  in 3rd gear w/new #262 ( couldn't
                pull the rear gear in 4 much less 5 )
ohio - (4)  -153.x~in 4th.(+4 @the rear & leaving 1k+
      rpm on the table)

" it's not as easy as it looks. "
                            - franey  8/2007
AHG
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« Reply #328 on: July 02, 2010, 10:45:58 AM »

Suggestion - Make sure you didn't accidently set your timing 180 degrees off
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octane
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The INDIAN "Saltcracker" 650 A-VBF




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« Reply #329 on: July 04, 2010, 04:09:06 AM »

Thanks guys for your advise
and thanks Franey for your kind offer.
May come in handy.

As I suspected and as Drew pointed out ;
the ignition timing was all wrong.

Don't know how that happened. Must have been done on a late night
or maybe I'm just dumb.
I should have checked all this before attempting a start-up,
but it's just that I had just got the roller-starter and there was a bunch of guy offering their help
and I just thought; why not have a go at it.
Dumb.

Pulled the distributor to get to the cam follow'er covers
so I could open them up and check the position of the valves



...which in retrospect was dumb, because by fooling around , turning the engine with the distributor removed,
I 'lost' the present ignition timing, ( and hence not being able to check it )
but  I tried to "re-construct" the position and I'm quite sure
I had it wrong, as in: not set on the compression stroke.
Anyhow; I got all confused as things simply wouldn't add up.

Lots of head-scratching until I checked the installation of the little "electronic/magnet"
'trigger-gizmo' .



...there's a little punch-mark there. It's supposed to be positioned with this mark
right over the biggest slope/cam on the distributor-shaft. ( Triggering the front cylinder spark )
Mr. Dumb here had positioned it over the other cam.



Goodness; I better give all my work a proper check :
did I really put the front-wheel at the front and the rear-wheel at the rear ?
Did I put gas in the gas-tank and oil in the oil-tank ?

Jezz !

 
« Last Edit: July 04, 2010, 04:11:36 AM by octane » Logged

"A designer knows he has achieved perfection
not when there is nothing left to add
but when there is nothing left to take away"

Antoine de Saint-Exupery
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