Fun with Nitrous, how to torch cut a valve under load...

[racin jason]

do you think that nitrous has more peak cylinder pressure during combustion and maybe turbos have more average cylinder pressure?
hence the reason that nitrous is harder on rods?

then again i have seen one racer window half a dozen sets of cases with a turbo bike.

tuned properly either will live.

[joea]

stainless...jason...my point exactly.....  (and the fact
that the rod comes back to top against a little cushion)...

with enough nitrous........your often trying to manage varying amounts
of detonation....(provides abit more peak cylinder pressure .... )......

scott how much increase in hp are you looking for relative to the base
engine hp..?......

and.....scott how long are you wanting this to stay alive.......near max power and speed for
120 ft.........or for 5280 to 11,000 ft.....?.......

[KZScott]

A stock zx12r makes about 165hp. Garys makes around 200 NA and Im guessing mine is around 185-190. Looking to add 80hp for initial LSR testing and possibly 110 later on. 1 mile run, but I can delay the nitrous based on gear position. possibly a 2 mile course is being setup that I want to try

[joea]

scott, so you are looking to keep it near max power and speed for around 60-120 ft
ie the length of a maxton, texas etc timing trap.....ie you will need to maintain that
speed and power for around 60-120 ft

some venues base records on a timing trap that is 5280 ft long......of which there
are 3 of them that start after the 2 mile mark.........meaning you may be near max speed
and power for 2-3 miles........

this is a distinction that can drastically impact many factors in your setup.......

scott, so your looking for around a %50 increase in power.......

have you considered trying to master a 25% increase first...?........

Joe

[Stainless1]

We were adding about 100 HP to a 140 HP motor, the compression seemed to be fading in #2 a little more than the others.  Dropped 10 psi in the qualifier, another 10 in the record run.  Turned up the juice, a little,    went 230.5 against the 228, dropped another 10 compression so I turned up the juice again to make up for the loss of compression and to try to get a 235....  at the 4 we had a little issue  and this happened.  The piston looked like the others except for the marks when it went to the top.  Figured out where the compression was going during the autopsy.  Counter weight tagged the rod, it cut the case in two...    However I was on track for a really great run 
Joe, you are on the money about pressures with N20, as I said earlier, you are always on the edge of disaster with N20, it just takes a little issue to burn one up, or maybe start a bend in a rod. 
This one ran about 19 miles after the rod started bending before it quit... maybe those guys make pretty good rods

[2fast4u2c]

not me, but Joea has a ton of time slips on the juice.  I'm keeping close to the vest on this subject.  Nitrous tune-ups are a very personal subject.  What works for one, doesn't work for others.  Joea has it correct, what do you want? 1/4 mile, 1 mile or 2-3 mile?  Each one is different.  I'm struggling to push the 400hp barrier so everything I know is a waste because I really know nothing at all.  This next year is a whole new animal for me.  New system, new tune-up, new everything.  Doing the same thing and expecting different results is a fruitless endeavor.

Good luck on your quest with the juice.

Guy

[joea]

ditto Guy.....

im more than happy to share knowledge....but i always do so with
a big grain of salt......

i very much want to help as many folks as i can....but as with Guy...I find
it very, very tough to try and tell someone what to do with nitrous with
extreme specificity........d/t SO MANY VARIABLES THAT ARE NOT THE SAME...
from application to application........and the significantly narrow window of error....

Guy, Stainless and so many others have a wealth of info.....and all know so all
too well the devastation that can ensue....

and yes Scott, what you and Wayne did is great....would that setup work at Bonne..?..
application specific..

[KZScott]

Ive allready done 90 hp drag racing(60 wet, 30 dry)(which got me to 161mph in 1320 feet ), and Im going with 110 this year(80 wet, 30 dry). I want to use the same basic setup for lsr. initially just use the wet shot, and if all is well with that, maybe try both stages. Im looking at trying an event like Maxton, but if the new track in Maine is set up for 2 miles, then thats where I will run because its so much closer. The reason Im asking so many questions is to try and avoid potential problems that might come up from being very new to all of this, but still wanting to go very fast. I agree I should start out conservative, but thats just not me so Ill try to learn as much as possible before I try it. I greatly appreciate all the help you guys have to offer

[TRNorBRN6001]

Thanks Guy, Thank You much JoeA, it really means a lot to have you fellas help out like you do. I completely understand how all these different venues are very different animals when it comes to set up. Thank you all much again and do not hesitate to comment on stuff and  share your knowledge. I really enjoy it.

I completely understand where KZ is comming from, just wait till he runs an event, he'll really have the Bug then!!!!!

Hope to see you at Maxton in April Guy, and maybe sometime this year I might make it out to the great white dyno to spectate first and maybe get a chance to meet you JoeA.

Thank your brother JoeA for the CF slope Busa tank, it will stay in the LSR community and be used for a designated race bike my Brother and I should have ready this next season.

TWO FAT BOYS DREAMING OF GOING FAST




The Big guy in the picture is my brother Robert. He is 6'6" and around 400lbs. We are hoping to have him run 200mph on the new nitrous bike. His best at the Texas Mile was 191 on his regular street burgandy and gray Busa in the back ground. It is a very conservative 1397 with around 185-190HP and 285HP on N2O.

Gary

[TRNorBRN6001]

Thank you as well Mr. Guthrie and your wife for them cookies, I was very sad I did not see her at the Texas Mile this last event. Hope all is well and hope to see you soon. JohnnyCheese was tickled pink you helped him out so much!

[Cajun Kid]

TFA,  where do you big boys get leathers?  I am 6ft, 378  hope to be a nimble 330 to 350 by Maxton in April.

Not that I will  suit up again for 2 wheeled competition, but nice to have options. I have not raced a bike since 1992 (a nimble 250lbs back then, prior to the big 13 broke bones get off)..

Charles

[TRNorBRN6001]

I am 255lbs and 6', It ain't easy finding leathers for us big bone folk! Cajun, you are proper TFA material, might have to see about bringing you a T the next time we run at Maxton! 

[joea]

you guys have the unfair advantage........movable ballast...

as aero changes.......you guys can move the center of gravity...

and for that matter.....the center of pressure.....at will during the run...

i see a protest in the works...


trn if you use the ratios stainless mentioned proper timing and most of all
proper fuel
you will be fine......people want to out smart the basics and get into
trouble...


kzscott........i never hurt anything with nitrous at the dragstrip or the
street .....

[McRat]

I have only ignited aluminum pistons using nitrous.  Get your cylinder pressure high enough (300 bar), and some solid EGT's (1800+) and the nitrous becomes a catalyst for turning your pistons into fuel.  Makes great power, but a little pricey.  A/F ratio doesn't even matter if you have the right conditions, the fuel is just an innocent bystander.  I know I have some pictures somewhere...

Beauty behind nitrous is it's not affected much if any by poor DA. 

[KZScott]

haha yeah I thought 161 was fast cant wait to try a track 4 times longer! Nice looking busa you and Robert are putting together Gary. is that a Doug Ray arm or a Coby Adams?
Joea, your kidding right? guys blow stuff up all the time where I come from lol Im thinking that if I can run that much nitrous on 91 octane in the 1/4 that switching the fuel in my little tank for the wet kit to c16 should keep it a lot safer for 1 mile right? and since these event are in the states I can put 93 in the bike tank for a couple more points of "safety"...is that enough?