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Author Topic: Milwaukee Midget  (Read 2233677 times)

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Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7485 on: November 06, 2018, 09:02:52 AM »
Midget looks a bit haggard, no doubt mostly due to "job pressures" . . . . . . 'cause we all know racing is nothing but FUN! ? ! ? ? ? ? ?   right?

The problem with managing "Human Resources" is that one tends to have to deal extensively with the first half of the title, while actually being the second half of the title.

I'm the one who raised his hand . . .

Not really complaining - I can't think of 50 other people I'd rather be working with.  But it's insurance renewal time, we've got a VP of Sales retiring, a CEO with an engineering and operations background stepping down, a new CEO stepping up from the marketing side, some client and customer demands regarding state mandated certifications of the staff.

Back to the K.

I'm getting it to pop on start-up, wanting to run, but the minute I hit the accelerator, it dies.  Plugs are carboned up, so I'm running rich.  Right now, the fuel rail is showing 43 lbs, and I'm debating whether to roll back the pressure or shorten up the injector pulse.  They're 36 lb injectors, which seem huge for a 1 liter, but for a 1 liter intended to run full open for 3 minutes, I'm told the shorter duty cycle will give me better injector control above 7K.

I'll start with the fuel pressure reduction before I delve into the madness of the programming - let's just see if I can get it to idle.  
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline WOODY@DDLLC

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7486 on: November 06, 2018, 09:24:40 AM »
Chris, it looks like you're the second LSR nut to do 500!  :-o :-D :cheers:
All models are wrong, but some are useful! G.E. Box (1967) www.designdreams.biz

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7487 on: November 06, 2018, 10:06:04 AM »
Chris, it looks like you're the second LSR nut to do 500!  :-o :-D :cheers:

Chris,

WOW! !   500 pages . . . .   "We come far, you and I."

Who knew? ? ?     Whoever it was . . . .  they should be punished . . . . . severely . . . . .

God save the Oktoberfest.

 :dhorse:
Deadhorseboy
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"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

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Offline Stainless1

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7488 on: November 06, 2018, 10:24:41 AM »
Chris, don't go too low on fuel pressure.... high 30s... 38, 39 would be a minimum.  Better to adjust injector PW... the more you do it, the easier it gets.
 :cheers:
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, MSA Bockscar Lakester with a little N20 
MSA Bockscar Lakester #1000 my fastest mile 245 and change, 84 ci turbobusa motor... but Corey's 233 MPH H/BFL record is still 3MPH faster than mine.

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7489 on: November 06, 2018, 11:34:57 AM »
Chris, don't go too low on fuel pressure.... high 30s... 38, 39 would be a minimum.  Better to adjust injector PW... the more you do it, the easier it gets.
 :cheers:

Bob, I was thinking of doing the math to get the pressure down to where they would deliver about a 20lb/hour at 80% duty cycle.  That's what virtually every calculator I've used tells me I should be at.

You're advising against that method.

Are you thinking fuel spray pattern and atomization issues at the lower pressure?  :|
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline Stainless1

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7490 on: November 06, 2018, 12:07:06 PM »
I'm not a FI guru but I can tell you I used 32 lb injectors at 41 PSI on the NA 1000... Yes it revved higher than yours..... I was well above 80% if I remember correctly.
But I have to wonder how spray and pattern is affected by the lower pressures.  What pressures are suggested by the manufacturer... stick with those. 
 :cheers:
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, MSA Bockscar Lakester with a little N20 
MSA Bockscar Lakester #1000 my fastest mile 245 and change, 84 ci turbobusa motor... but Corey's 233 MPH H/BFL record is still 3MPH faster than mine.

Offline forker

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7491 on: November 16, 2018, 09:27:12 AM »
Chris, don't go too low on fuel pressure.... high 30s... 38, 39 would be a minimum.  Better to adjust injector PW... the more you do it, the easier it gets.
 :cheers:

Bob, I was thinking of doing the math to get the pressure down to where they would deliver about a 20lb/hour at 80% duty cycle.  That's what virtually every calculator I've used tells me I should be at.

You're advising against that method.

Are you thinking fuel spray pattern and atomization issues at the lower pressure?  :|

I'd think you do need more than 20lb/hr; pro-rated from current engine data from the, shall we say, related design group 130hp wants about 23lb/hr, 140hp wants about 25lb/hr and 150hp wants about 27lb/hr. Of British 98RON pump gasoline, that is.

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7492 on: November 23, 2018, 10:42:44 AM »
midget,

Now that the "Holiday Lassitude" is in full swing, a gentle reminder that the DOHC K16 crankshaft/engine needs to be turned 180 degrees every couple of weeks.

This prevents valve spring pairs from being at full lift, and full tension, for extended periods of time.   NOT a good idea.

And since the old OHV method of removing the rocker shaft to unload the valve springs is now "unavailable", it's back to "monotonous servitude" . . . .

BTW, turning the crankshaft to vary the valve spring load is is a good idea for all race engines that remain assembled.    The formula for rotation degrees for 4 strokes is:    720/# of cylinders = rotation amount every 2 weeks.

This public service message provided by your friendly, local valve spring supplier . . . . . .


 :cheers:  :dhorse:  :cheers:
Preventyboy
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7493 on: November 23, 2018, 10:53:22 AM »
And . . . . SSS,

Since I know you peruse the
midget's thread from time to time, I'd like to make a request:

Perchance, might it be possible to, say, temporarily, make available a Holiday Themed icon/Smiley? ? ?

I vote for "Beat a dead Reindeer".
   (beat a dead elf was too close to ummm, aahhh, a ummm . . . . midget . . . . .)

 :cheers:  :cheers:  :cheers:
IntheHolidaySpiritbutstillsensitiveboy       (yeah, that's it)
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7494 on: November 23, 2018, 11:06:33 AM »
I'm on it, oh long-suffering, but now elated fan of the Chicago Bears.  Best defense in the division.

In fact, I'm a bit ahead of the curve, in that I did get the water drained out and replaced with anti-freeze before playhouse temps nosedived.

As to beating a dead reindeer - all one needs to do is drive at twilight on any given Wisconsin trunk highway with your Go-Pro on, and with a little time, you'll have sufficient footage to make your own GIF.

Happy Thanksgiving, to all who missed my note yesterday.
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Online jdincau

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7495 on: November 23, 2018, 11:13:46 AM »
Permanent note on my calendar; turn the crank 180 every week and charge the battery every month.
Unless it's crazy, ambitious and delusional, it's not worth our time!

Offline Koncretekid

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7496 on: November 23, 2018, 03:46:29 PM »
"BTW, turning the crankshaft to vary the valve spring load is is a good idea for all race engines that remain assembled.    The formula for rotation degrees for 4 strokes is:    720/# of cylinders = rotation amount every 2 weeks."

So for a single cylinder, 720 degrees/1 every 2 weeks.  Won't that put it on exactly the same valve spring position?  Of course, for a single cylinder motor, we can just put it at TDC on compression stroke and the valves will all be closed anyway!

Tom
« Last Edit: November 23, 2018, 03:49:31 PM by Koncretekid »
We get too soon oldt, and too late schmart!
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Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7497 on: November 23, 2018, 06:48:44 PM »
I'm on it, oh long-suffering, but now elated fan of the Chicago Bears.  Best defense in the division.   Might be a bit better than that after Turkey day . . .

In fact, I'm a bit ahead of the curve, in that I did get the water drained out and replaced with anti-freeze before playhouse temps nosedived.    x-lent

As to beating a dead reindeer - all one needs to do is drive at twilight on any given Wisconsin trunk highway with your Go-Pro on, and with a little time, you'll have sufficient footage to make your own GIF.

Happy Thanksgiving, to all who missed my note yesterday.

IF, you live long enough, every worm can turn . . . . . . .   :dhorse:
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7498 on: November 23, 2018, 06:53:42 PM »
"BTW, turning the crankshaft to vary the valve spring load is is a good idea for all race engines that remain assembled.    The formula for rotation degrees for 4 strokes is:    720/# of cylinders = rotation amount every 2 weeks."

So for a single cylinder, 720 degrees/1 every 2 weeks.  Won't that put it on exactly the same valve spring position?  Of course, for a single cylinder motor, we can just put it at TDC on compression stroke and the valves will all be closed anyway!

Tom

Hi Tom,

Of course you are right, the "formula" (rule of thumb? ?) doesn't work out for 1 or 2 cylinder motorcycle engines.   It's intended for multi-cylinder applications starting at 4 cyl inline.

But, clever bike guy that you are, you already have a solution.

 :cheers:  :dhorse:  :cheers:
F/b
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7499 on: November 25, 2018, 04:15:39 PM »
midget,

Snowmageddon @ the "ranch".   12+ inches forecast for north eastern portion of the Illini nation . . . .  3" to 4" already on the ground here, and the "big blow" has not arrived yet . . . . . BUT, my TORO started on the second pull.

Hope you are prepared . . . .   Looks like the forecast for Beerhaven is a bit kinder . . .   ONLY 6+ inches.

Welcome back to Hoth, Earthlings . . . . . .

 :cheers:  :dhorse:  :cheers:
Retiringsomewherewarmerboy
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein