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Author Topic: Milwaukee Midget  (Read 2280817 times)

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Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7020 on: April 09, 2018, 11:08:23 PM »
   I have used allen head in tight spots ..

Yes.   A bit of an explanation is in order.     shcs is the abbreviation for Socket Head Cap Screws, the generic term for the Trademarked name of the Allen Co product:  the Allen cap screw.

So we are talking about the same thing.

It's like calling all facial tissues "Kleenex".

But, big suppliers like Grainger and McMaster-Carr have to use generic terms to describe non-branded products.     Or, deal with litigation . . . . . . .

I use the generic terms from habit, since if you specify a brand in a purchase order to a big supplier, you get zero parts and a note saying they don't carry your specified brand.    :-(

 :cheers:
F/b
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Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7021 on: April 09, 2018, 11:37:25 PM »
Mark,
Regarding your thread choice for the oil block, do you have a -10 "O" ring seal porting tool? Probably not but I'll bet you have a 1/2 NPT tap. I am not a real fan of pipe threads but a -10 port tool is probably $50+..

Looking good, the flywheel retention and location devices look good for at least 350HP+!

rex

Hi Rex,

I do not have a "unitized" -10 o-ring port tool, as you suspected.    I do have all the straight & NPT taps and counterbores though, so I could machine it in one setup per fitting, 3/4 separate operations, a pain in the butt.    Not sure which choice will be made at this point.    The carbide bladed -12 fuel injection rail drill/reamer/spotfacer combo tool set the shop back approx $220 . . . . . .  for occasional use . . . . . . .


I also dislike NPT threads on race engines.    I've seen too many "mechanics" "reef in" tapered fittings.    The result is a cracked casting, often not repairable.    Good judgment and the proper sealant prevents this situation.    But I have given up on my personal crusade to "cure" "stupid".    I'm sorry to report my efforts resulted in limited to no success, and only succeeded in raising my blood pressure.

In spite of the large size of the remote oil filter fitting block, because of the way the internal drilling(s) must match the existing oil passages, there is limited room for one of the fittings to extend into the adaptor block.    I have not decided how to handle this yet.

On the crank/flywheel bolts and dowels, the pattern is from the original BMC so we could reuse the flywheel.   It looks like "overkill" but BMC's with the 3.200" stroke are vicious "shakers".     I've seen 1275 race BMC's without hardened dowels and upgraded bolts "shed" the flywheel at high rpm.    Always bad news.    The 999cc "Grenade" with its' shorter stroke was "less" of a shaker.    And the Rover, with an even shorter stroke, will be even less so.    But all Inline 4's have an inherent secondary imbalance, so best to be prepared, since there will NOT be any harmonic damper on the front of this crank.   No room for fitment . . . . .

The crankshaft from Rody is really a nice piece of work, a work of art really.    He did a fantastic job, especially considering all the changes that were specified.    For anybody needing a billet 4 cylinder crankshaft, he should be considered.

 :cheers:
F/b
« Last Edit: April 09, 2018, 11:55:13 PM by fordboy628 »
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7022 on: April 10, 2018, 05:39:39 AM »
What a fine valedictory, Chris -- and you aren't even retiring.  Thank you very much for helping us remember why we do this stuff -- the rewards are SO COOL.
Jon E. Wennerberg
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Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7023 on: April 10, 2018, 07:57:14 AM »
Monday Update . . . . .

Starter Photos . . . . .

midget,

Mike Hart called and stopped by the skunkworks late yesterday morning.    He brought the lexan adaptor plate with the final starter placement modifications.

Here are the photos:

In place on modified plate.


Still clocks in tight.


There will be just barely enough room to "sneak in" the inboard attachment bolt using a ball end driver into an allen bolt.    Safety wired after installation.


The starter nose will need to be reduced in diameter to allow adequate material to be retained in the plate to provide threads for the 2 starter mounting bolts.    Mike is going to do this additional bit of machine work.

We suggest that the mock up plate be used for the offer up into the chassis again.    Then Mike can add dyno mounting "wings" onto the new aluminum adaptor plate.    Those wings can be eliminated for final installation into the car.

Your thoughts?

 :cheers:
Photoboy
« Last Edit: April 10, 2018, 08:01:09 AM by fordboy628 »
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7024 on: April 10, 2018, 08:46:55 AM »
If you can finish off the pan and the oil fittings, I'll come down and get it.  I have to work Saturday morning, but I can stop down Saturday afternoon and grab it, check it to the new driveshaft tunnel, confirm the engine set-back and have it back to you in a fortnight.

This will also let us get an idea as to how to proceed with the header.  I'll do a mock-up with the armored BX, but we need to confirm what size collector we'll need - I'll need that for the mock-up.

I question if the wings will fit in the chassis of the Midget. If you can superimpose the wings for the dyno adapter over the drawing of the Rover/MG adapter, I can do some measurements once the engine is in place.

I want to get the engine running in the chassis - at least able to start and idle - before we spend a lot of time in what is clearly becoming a very busy dyno room.  I don't want to waste anybody's time in the dyno room trying to get this thing to simply fire when we could be churning water, editing the MAP, and taking measurements.

This time -no inverted electrical pins and no leaks!

Yeah - that was me . . .
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7025 on: April 10, 2018, 09:17:15 AM »
If you can finish off the pan and the oil fittings, I'll come down and get it.  I have to work Saturday morning, but I can stop down Saturday afternoon and grab it, check it to the new driveshaft tunnel, confirm the engine set-back and have it back to you in a fortnight.

This will also let us get an idea as to how to proceed with the header.  I'll do a mock-up with the armored BX, but we need to confirm what size collector we'll need - I'll need that for the mock-up.

I question if the wings will fit in the chassis of the Midget. If you can superimpose the wings for the dyno adapter over the drawing of the Rover/MG adapter, I can do some measurements once the engine is in place.

I want to get the engine running in the chassis - at least able to start and idle - before we spend a lot of time in what is clearly becoming a very busy dyno room.  I don't want to waste anybody's time in the dyno room trying to get this thing to simply fire when we could be churning water, editing the MAP, and taking measurements.

This time -no inverted electrical pins and no leaks!

Yeah - that was me . . .

midget,

I'll try to get those finished this week, but I have a limited availability schedule due to other commitments.

I'll need to check with Mike on the schedule for the adaptor plate delivery.    Not sure what his schedule is.    PLUS, I'm thinking you will want the starter attached this time around.

I don't think they will fit either.    I'll have Mike make some full size "paper doll wings" out of cardboard for the fitup.    If they don't fit, we will have to use other options, such as "wing plates" for the dyno mounts, OR, perhaps using the BMC dyno adaptor plate to bolt up to the 902's scattershield.

Thoughts?
 :cheers:
F/b
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7026 on: April 10, 2018, 10:33:54 AM »
OR, perhaps using the BMC dyno adaptor plate to bolt up to the 902's scattershield.[/b][/color]

Thoughts?
 :cheers:
F/b


I like the idea of not reinventing the wheel.  The dyno has a starter built in, so I can't imagine why we shouldn't be able to adapt an adapter that's intended for a BMC bolt pattern to a plate that was designed to adapt a BMC bolt pattern to a Chevy bellhousing.  Key will be where the splines mount up - we're adding another 1/2 inch there.

Get done what you can get done - I've got plenty to finish in the garage.

(tick-tock-tick-tock-tick-tock . . . )
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline WOODY@DDLLC

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7027 on: April 10, 2018, 11:21:04 AM »
What a fine valedictory, Chris -- and you aren't even retiring.  Thank you very much for helping us remember why we do this stuff -- the rewards are SO COOL.

I might even Xerox that!  :-D :evil: :cheers:
All models are wrong, but some are useful! G.E. Box (1967) www.designdreams.biz

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7028 on: April 10, 2018, 12:18:21 PM »
OR, perhaps using the BMC dyno adaptor plate to bolt up to the 902's scattershield.[/b][/color]

Thoughts?
 :cheers:
F/b


I like the idea of not reinventing the wheel.  The dyno has a starter built in, so I can't imagine why we shouldn't be able to adapt an adapter that's intended for a BMC bolt pattern to a plate that was designed to adapt a BMC bolt pattern to a Chevy bellhousing.  Key will be where the splines mount up - we're adding another 1/2 inch there.

Get done what you can get done - I've got plenty to finish in the garage.


Uhhhmm . . . . NO.   We will not be "adding".    We will be "making up" to BMC standard crank/block relationship.

After careful, additional consideration, the BMC dyno plate WILL BE REQUIRED.    Crank hub height on the K was designed to match the BMC crank hub to interface with the BMC trans.
Ergo, setup will be correct with original BMC dyno adaptor mated between the new adaptor plate and the T&T SuperFlow 902 scattershield . . . . . .

See, simple cognitive power wins out . . . .  :wink:

Think about it if some more if you are not sure.

 :cheers:
Thinkyboy
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I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

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Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7029 on: April 10, 2018, 12:46:03 PM »
Got it - the distance from the face of the new K hub to the back of the new A-K adapter plate is the same as the distance from the original A hub to the original transmission plate.

Ergo, the dyno adapter worked on the A, and will work on the K.

So why were we talking about wings?  I prefer tacos.  :wink:

"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7030 on: April 10, 2018, 01:11:24 PM »
Got it - the distance from the face of the new K hub to the back of the new A-K adapter plate is the same as the distance from the original A hub to the original transmission plate.

Ergo, the dyno adapter worked on the A, and will work on the K.

So why were we talking about wings?  I prefer tacos.  :wink:



Mmmmm . . . . especially dollar tacos . . . . .   :-D

 :-D  :wink:  :-D
NowI'mhungryboy
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I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

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"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7031 on: April 10, 2018, 03:43:47 PM »
Mike reports starter modified and mockup plate modified, plus drilled and tapped for the starter mounting.    He's going to drop it off at T&T tomorrow for a fit check to the block . . . . .

Photos then.

TTFN
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7032 on: April 10, 2018, 04:46:53 PM »
DSCN1205 by Chris Conrad, on Flickr
DSCN1204 by Chris Conrad, on Flickr
DSCN1203 by Chris Conrad, on Flickr
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline 4-barrel Mike

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7033 on: April 10, 2018, 05:01:55 PM »
Aren't those pretty!   :cheers:

Mike
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Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #7034 on: April 10, 2018, 05:21:22 PM »
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!