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Author Topic: Milwaukee Midget  (Read 2031541 times)

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Offline Dr Goggles

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6720 on: February 01, 2018, 01:50:44 PM »
Can't you leave the water pump in place and "decomision" it?.....re-route the belt and machine off the impeller? We're going electric mostly for space (and a little power) but it's those little motors that pick up the most power proportionately yeah?
Few understand what I'm trying to do but they vastly outnumber those who understand why...................

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Current Australian E/GL record holder at 215.041mph

THE LUCKIEST MAN IN SLOW BUSINESS.

Offline kiwi belly tank

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6721 on: February 01, 2018, 02:13:16 PM »
Just knock the guts out of the pump & bang a freeze plug in the hole from the inside, then you get to keep the whole housing & bypass hose.
  Sid.

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6722 on: February 01, 2018, 05:36:09 PM »
It's not what one would call a traditional pump set-up.

Actually, the only thing "Traditional" about it is that it's "English Weird" . . .

This water pump arrangement is more akin to an old-school flathead 4 one would see on a stationary engine, or a tractor, or maybe a bulldozer, except it's driven by a toothed belt that also drives the cams.

Inlet comes from behind the pump, parallel with the side of the block, then back through the cylinder case and head.

This year, the plan is just to get it running well.  Mark has said we'd have to be brain-dead if we can't top the Grenade in output.  I know he's not - I just hope I'm not bringing down the curve too far.

We'll prove the hypothesis this year, and then chase down those incremental ponies next year - possibly in Oz.
« Last Edit: February 01, 2018, 05:37:50 PM by Milwaukee Midget »
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline Dr Goggles

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6723 on: February 01, 2018, 06:41:54 PM »
Let me guess. There's a steel pipe with a collar and an o-ring that is held in place just by the force of the pump being bolted to the block? It's be a great idea if electrolysis wasn't a thing.... :roll:
Few understand what I'm trying to do but they vastly outnumber those who understand why...................

http://thespiritofsunshine.blogspot.com/

Current Australian E/GL record holder at 215.041mph

THE LUCKIEST MAN IN SLOW BUSINESS.

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6724 on: February 01, 2018, 07:12:39 PM »
Let me guess. There's a steel pipe with a collar and an o-ring that is held in place just by the force of the pump being bolted to the block? It's be a great idea if electrolysis wasn't a thing.... :roll:

Actually, the pump housing is integral to the aluminum block.

The steel pipe - plastic was an option - is held in place by cute little metal tabs.

And in classic British tradition, the bosses that the tabs are bolted to are oversized to the point that you could use them for motor mounts.

Which is the plan . . .
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6725 on: February 02, 2018, 07:27:55 AM »
midget,

CD of ultra secret Rover information should be dead dropped @ Select Sound today . . . . . . . . .

 :dhorse:
Moose&squirrel
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Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6726 on: February 02, 2018, 08:04:46 AM »
midget,

CD of ultra secret Rover information should be dead dropped @ Select Sound today . . . . . . . . .

 :dhorse:
Moose& squirrelly
That trick never works . . .
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6727 on: February 03, 2018, 05:44:21 AM »

Can't you leave the water pump in place and "decomision" it?.....re-route the belt and machine off the impeller? We're going electric mostly for space (and a little power) but it's those little motors that pick up the most power proportionately yeah?


Well, we COULD "decommission it, but as simple as rerouting the belt sounds, it turns out that it is not that simple.    It is an 8mm pitch HTD drive, and belts are only available in certain lengths.    I'm sure I could come up with something, but it is more a matter of time.    There is simply too much other stuff to get done for this year.

Such as pistons . . . . . . .    More on this later.

 :dhorse:  :dhorse:  :dhorse:
AndI'mthehorseboy
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I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6728 on: February 03, 2018, 05:54:21 AM »

Just knock the guts out of the pump & bang a freeze plug in the hole from the inside, then you get to keep the whole housing & bypass hose.
  Sid.


We would have to keep the guts for now at least, to retain the cog on the belt drive, so we do not have to re-engineer all of that.     We could remove the impeller blades only, if we could figure out a way to disassemble the pump with out destroying the parts.     And I'm not sure if there is a way to machine the impeller blades off, while the pump is assembled.    Both manual and a water pump rebuild service I know state that the pumps are NOT serviceable or rebuildable.     It appears that the impeller is the last item pressed on to the assembly, without provision for removal . . . . . .

 :dhorse:  :dhorse:  :dhorse:
Deadhorseboy
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6729 on: February 03, 2018, 06:18:22 AM »

Let me guess. There's a steel pipe with a collar and an o-ring that is held in place just by the force of the pump being bolted to the block? It's be a great idea if electrolysis wasn't a thing.... :roll:


You have traveled on this road then.    Bumpy as the "trail" to "Gairdner" . . . . . .

AND THEN . . . . .    they bolted a batch of other bits to tabs welded on the water inlet "pipe", as if 18ga erw steel tube could pass for a "structural element" . . . . . .

I'm sure some "twit" thought that this was a "great idea" . . . . .  lots of "cost savings" for the bean counters.


The very same bean counters that perpetrated on an unsuspecting the public:

A/   the wet sleeve/open deck architecture with the bonus of lack of lateral support;
2/   the combo head/main bolt novelty with the bonus low clamp load! !
d/   the thermostat located in a position to allow easy and convenient re-heat treating of the castings, while still in the vehicle! !
z/   a cooling system water fill procedure so complicated, that even the factory trained mechanics complained about it.

I could go on, but I already have a headache from my blood pressure . . . . . .

A cooling system such as this one could only work in a country where the "sweltering" summer temperature is 78 degrees F . . . . . .   and it did not pass that test! !

 :dhorse:
Tryin'tokeepthepressuredownboy
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6730 on: February 03, 2018, 06:25:04 AM »
midget,

Friday afternoon Diamond sent me an email that the chamber casting is unsuitable for their inspection equipment.    Too soft for their inspection probes.    (Alien probing? ? ? ?)

I'm awaiting a response as to whether the print will be adequate for design purposes.

Or a material suggestion for a chamber casting that would be usable.

 :dhorse:  :dhorse:  :dhorse:
Sigh
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline jacksoni

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6731 on: February 03, 2018, 06:40:53 AM »
midget,

Friday afternoon Diamond sent me an email that the chamber casting is unsuitable for their inspection equipment.    Too soft for their inspection probes.    (Alien probing? ? ? ?)

I'm awaiting a response as to whether the print will be adequate for design purposes.

Or a material suggestion for a chamber casting that would be usable.

 :dhorse:  :dhorse:  :dhorse:
Sigh
What did you use to make the mold? I did it with some bondo and it seemed OK. PITA all around though. I thought people with 3D printers had a scanning gadget you can hand hold to replicate stuff.
Jack Iliff
 G/BGS-250.235 1987
 G/GC- 176.245  2018
 G/GMS-182.144 2019

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6732 on: February 03, 2018, 07:21:31 AM »
midget,

Friday afternoon Diamond sent me an email that the chamber casting is unsuitable for their inspection equipment.    Too soft for their inspection probes.    (Alien probing? ? ? ?)

I'm awaiting a response as to whether the print will be adequate for design purposes.

Or a material suggestion for a chamber casting that would be usable.

 :dhorse:  :dhorse:  :dhorse:
Sigh
What did you use to make the mold? I did it with some bondo and it seemed OK. PITA all around though. I thought people with 3D printers had a scanning gadget you can hand hold to replicate stuff.

I used some high density silicone based molding compound.    Retains the shape, but IS slightly flexible.    I suspect Bondo or another body filler would be OK.     Would need to use a very good mold release though.

 :cheers:
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline jdincau

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6733 on: February 03, 2018, 08:13:52 AM »
Can you use the silicone plug to make a plaster cast giving them the actual chamber?
Unless it's crazy, ambitious and delusional, it's not worth our time!

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #6734 on: February 03, 2018, 08:31:49 AM »
Mark -

Did anybody at Diamond tell us that they actually make a kit to do this?

I don't think they did . . .

http://www.diamondracing.net/about/how-to-videos.php#howtopour
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!