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Author Topic: Milwaukee Midget  (Read 2238017 times)

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Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5340 on: October 16, 2015, 06:45:28 AM »
OK, Here is where the idea guys get separated from the "finishers" . . . . . . . . .

midget,

Brilliant concept, now comes the labor of the fit up . . . . . . . .

Mike dropped off the assembly with the mock up adaptor plate yesterday afternoon, see below.   I think some trimming of the adaptor plate is going to be required to fit the assembly to the car.   My band saw is at the ready.
         

AND, as was anticipated, the starter is going to be a hurdle, see below.
        

Since the assembly uses 6 metric bolts to attach the engine to the adaptor plate, I am reluctant to suggest that the Rover block be "neutered" to fit the stock BMC starter, thereby losing one of the 12mm mounting bolts with one of the two the locating sleeves.   Although, the addition of extra dowels/location pins and/or mounting bolts/studs to the adaptor/mounting plate, can certainly be a possibility.     The more I think about that idea, the better I like it.

Some other possibilities:
1)  Remote starter pinion, as used on the Swift DB1,    OR
2)  Reverse rotation starter, mounted off the back of the bellhousing,    OR
3)  Slight radial repositioning of the starter, with smaller starter mounting nose,    OR
4)  Slight radial repositioning of the block to the trans, say 5/6 degree RH layover, giving more room to mount standard starter,   (shortens inlet tract though, so not an idea I like . . . )       OR
5)  Other ideas? ? ? ?

I think we are going to have to crack open that bottle of Schnaps to solve this one.
 :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
Fordboy
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5341 on: October 16, 2015, 06:47:54 AM »

Between the Harleys, Healeys and MGs, I suspect the parking lot looked like the aftermath of the Exxon Valdez by Saturday night.


I hope you made the Healey guys pay to reseal the parking lot!!!!!!

 :dhorse:
Fordboy
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5342 on: October 16, 2015, 07:15:37 AM »
I/GT Trivia Contest


midget, et all,

Guess what this is:




Ahh, it's either a heavy duty cup cover for a 7-11 Big Gulp, or a prototype hockey puck with safety wire provisions to prevent unaware spectators from losing their teeth while eating nachos at the United Center.

It'll look nice once it's chromed.

"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5343 on: October 16, 2015, 08:18:51 AM »

I hope you made the Healey guys pay to reseal the parking lot!!!!!!

 :dhorse:
Fordboy

Poor guys are driving Healeys - haven't they suffered enough under the yoke of economic extortion?  :wink:
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline wisdonm

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5344 on: October 16, 2015, 09:01:01 AM »
Having worked on FF's, I thought of #1 immediately.   :cheers:
Stand on it....brakes only slow you down.

Has a checkered past.

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5345 on: October 16, 2015, 09:54:31 AM »
Having worked on FF's, I thought of #1 immediately.   :cheers:

Don, the nice part about that is that there are a number of unused bosses on the side of the block to mount the starter motor to.   :cheers:
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5346 on: October 16, 2015, 11:01:39 AM »
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline Crackerman

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5347 on: October 20, 2015, 06:13:12 PM »
A myriad of jap cars use small gear reduction starters. Such as hondas, Mitsubishi and especially toyota. They use two,bolts and have an open snout allowing them to be mated almost anywhere flat.

Its for smacking or pressing in bearings or bushings.

Offline Rex Schimmer

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5348 on: October 20, 2015, 07:28:42 PM »
Looks like mounting the starter on the block side is at first cut the best way to go. You need to get a crank in it and a flywheel on to check the depth dimensions but block side certainly looks easiest (well the least hassle). I think I would wack away some of the "wing" that sticks out from the block to provide starter clearance and keep the starter low. Doesn't look like it is doing much anyway. That Harley starter is butt ugly and looks giant, should be something else you could find. I agree with Crackerman the rice burners have lots of neat small starters also my Zetec starter looks like it could fit. As they say: "If it was easy everyone would be doing it"!

Rex
Rex

Not much matters and the rest doesn't matter at all.

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5349 on: October 20, 2015, 07:47:00 PM »
Hey, I have no problem with the Toyota style starter - in fact, both the MGB and the Midget utilize precisely the unit of which you speak.  And yes, it is smaller than the (cough) Lucashit piece it replaces.  There is a whole cottage industry of adapter makers that recognize the advantages these units provide over the originals, the least of which is a smaller footprint.

Part of this exercise is seeing what will fit where.  I like the Harley piece - if it can be made to work - because it actually sits higher, and will not require a possible frame notch.  Driving it from the transmission side remains an option as well, and I saw a really cool Tilton reverse rotation gearset that might be utilized as well.  Both Mark and Don pointed out the Swift set-up - seeing as the FF stuff is still out there on a lot of shelves, it might be a go-to.

GT requires a starter - We'll make it happen.  :cheers:
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll:

We are NOT rebuilding . . . We are reloading.

GOD SAVE MG - The Queen can take care of herself!

Offline Elmo Rodge

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5350 on: October 20, 2015, 09:11:37 PM »
The starter for my Flathead appears to be one of them and is indexable. I have duly indexed the little fellow to accomodate the headers I built and to clear the frame.  Quite handy.   :-) Wayno

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5351 on: October 21, 2015, 12:03:00 AM »
Another candidate for the miget class.  It looks like it will be a lot of fun.  www.bbc.com/autos/story/20151019-toyotas-tiny-terror   

Offline tauruck

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5352 on: October 21, 2015, 12:40:48 AM »
I/GT Trivia Contest


midget, et all,

Guess what this is:




Ahh, it's either a heavy duty cup cover for a 7-11 Big Gulp, or a prototype hockey puck with safety wire provisions to prevent unaware spectators from losing their teeth while eating nachos at the United Center.

It'll look nice once it's chromed.



That puck is non regulation. It's supposed to have the NHL logo on it and it doesn't look frozen to -4.  :-D

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5353 on: October 21, 2015, 05:46:24 AM »
OK, answers to the trivia contest . . . . . .

Since a picture is worth a thousand words, AND, I am still a slow and crappy typist . . . . . . . . .

         


         


The "Hockey Puck" has been re-machined to fit up to its' intended original purpose:  As a cylinder barrel removal tool.

 :cheers:
Fordboy
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein

Offline fordboy628

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Re: Milwaukee Midget
« Reply #5354 on: October 21, 2015, 06:26:52 AM »
So much for following the shop manual instructions . . . . . . . . .

The factory folks who pen the service manual, obviously do not deal with parts or assemblies that have been: "IN SERVICE" . . . . . . . .

From the factory manual:

Cylinder Removal.

1)   Turn stripped cylinder block assembly on its' side,
2)   "Push" cylinder barrels out individually.

Unfortunately, this does not take "in service" water jacket corrosion into account.

However, somebody (I wonder who) has trodden this path before with some Renault and Ferrari blocks/barrels . . . . . . . .

         

A steel "barrel removal adaptor", combined with:

1)    Some proper length wood 4x4's
2)    A hardwood "barrel removal extension"
3)    A "BFH" persuader . . . . . .
4)    Some judicious application of heat . . . . . .
5)    Something "soft" for the barrel to land upon . . . . . .
6)    Luckily, a "lack" of extensive corrosion.

and:  voilĂ !!!!

Naked (undamaged) cylinder block!!!!

         



         

Just like the Le Crazy Horse de Paris . . . . . . . .   well, sort of . . . . . .  if you are into engines in some sick and twisted way . . . . . . . .

Time to crack that bottle of Schnapps   :-D

Fortunately, it appears that the corrosion is confined to the interface between the barrel and the block at the bottom of the water jacket.    And it was easily "broken" with a bit of localized heat from a propane torch and a BFH.   More extensive corrosion might have needed an acetylene torch with a rosebud, but, again,

Dumb luck is your friend.     :dhorse:

Some corrosion removal is in order here.   Perhaps bead, or other media, blasting, of the localized, corroded areas of both the block and the barrels.

Going "off the grid" for a bit.     Mrs. Fordboy undergoes second procedure today.

 :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
BFHboy
Science, NOT Magic . . . .

I used to be a people person.  But people changed that relationship.

"There is nothing permanent except change."    Heraclitus

"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."     Albert Einstein