Author Topic: more production questions  (Read 4073 times)

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Offline sanger351

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more production questions
« on: June 08, 2008, 03:35:56 PM »
First, I must say thank everyone for all the help so far in my other posts.  A few more questions realated to the production class.

Radiator must be in stock location and of same year???  Obviously they do not want a radiator designed to run a 200 hp street car to run a 500+ hp racing car?  Right?  Can you run an aftermarket radiator close to the orginal dimensions and what qualifies as stock location the front or back of the radiator? 

Headlight air intake not allowed....  Can you pick up air behind the grill and duct it to the intake through the radiator support assuming the radiator is not moved?  I am trying to figure out how to get air to the custom intake build.  If air is picked up behind the grill is this considered a blocked off radiator even though much of the radiator is not obstructed?

Am I over thinking the rule book?  Thank You


Offline RichFox

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Re: more production questions
« Reply #1 on: June 08, 2008, 04:53:30 PM »
I have known a person to run the stock raditior and a holding tank in line with the raditior. Had some sort of thermostat in it that allowed cold water to circluate as needed. I believe you can run a hood scoop or pick up hot air behind the raditior. Why? You can not remove your headlights and run ducting from there to the air box.

Offline Dynoroom

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Re: more production questions
« Reply #2 on: June 08, 2008, 07:15:55 PM »
Radiator must be in stock location and of same year???  Obviously they do not want a radiator designed to run a 200 hp street car to run a 500+ hp racing car?  Right? 

No where does it say you must "use" the stock radiator.

Headlight air intake not allowed....  Can you pick up air behind the grill and duct it to the intake through the radiator support assuming the radiator is not moved? 

Doesn't even say that all the radiator tubes need to be used.............

Am I over thinking the rule book? 

No, but it's a real good idea to look at other cars you might be racing & keep asking lots of questions.
It's also important to know and understand as much lsr history as you can imo.
Michael LeFevers
Kugel and LeFevers Pontiac Firebird

Without Data You're Just Another Guy With An Opinion!

Racing is just a series of "Problem Solving" events that allow you to spend money & make noise...

Offline sanger351

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Re: more production questions
« Reply #3 on: June 08, 2008, 11:50:14 PM »
I am trying to get opinions on the "spirit" of the rules.  After reading some of the other posts about the "spirit", I thought I better ask.  Mr. Warner's input, along with everyones else is welcome. 

Mr. LeFevers brings up some points that I will consider.  By the way, If I may ask where, what or how did you coat the Viper intake you made on you website.

Thanks 

Offline Rick Byrnes

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Re: more production questions
« Reply #4 on: June 09, 2008, 11:29:09 AM »
Tell us what kind of Ford you are building.
but, we will help anyways.

To further the conversation, and discuss the limit of Production rules relative to radiators and air inlet systems, you need to look at one of the most successful Production/GC/ALT cars in recent years.  Doll-Fox-Christopherson Camero.  They made every record in every class they chose to run in, and did it with very sound physics and engineering.  AND, an open mind.

Think charge air cooling.  It does work for N/A as well as boosted motors.
Their Chebby used the production radiator, but not for cooling the engine.  Ice water flowed thru the rad, and well sealed duct work provided cool, high pressure air to the carb inlet. 
Engine cooling was performed with a tank in the rear of the car, and a really well thought out thermostat system.
I copied their system when I went to GC and Altered with the Merk and used a split radiator.  one for air cooling and the other for engine cooling.  Not as efficient as theirs, but it worked well for me.  I rented a couple of records in F class.
I cannot find photos of their car   #757, but here is the Merk.
The system is a little complex, but as you will find a car optomized for for Bville is completely unlike other venues, and does tend to be a little complex.  That is part of the challenge.  How to put 10 pounds of sh#* in a 2 pound bag.  The pleasure and task of building the car to take the best advantage of the rules is half the battle and at least half the fun.

Good luck with your efforts


 
« Last Edit: June 09, 2008, 02:20:04 PM by Rick Byrnes »
Rick

Offline Stan Back

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Re: more production questions
« Reply #5 on: June 09, 2008, 01:53:50 PM »
Off the subject (as usual) -- the DFC Camaro is one hell of a car!  But they couldn't get the C/FALT record until the Batchelor-Benham built Monza was peeled off into Classic.  One year they had the record (and got in the Two Club!) for about 20 minutes until Batchelor returned after them about 20 MPH faster.
Past (Only) Member of the San Berdoo Roadsters -- "California's Most-Exclusive Roadster Club" -- 19 Years of Bonneville and/or El Mirage Street Roadster Records

Offline Rick Byrnes

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Re: more production questions
« Reply #6 on: June 09, 2008, 03:41:52 PM »
No disrespect intended.
I was mostly trying to point out the unique use of the production radiator.
AND, the process of being open minded.
I WON"T say thinking outside the box, because I HATE that term, but these guys had a really nice approach.  AND, I don't know if they were first, but charge air cooling has proven itself time after time.

Best Regards
Rick

Offline sanger351

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Re: more production questions
« Reply #7 on: June 09, 2008, 04:01:11 PM »
Thanks Rick, your comments have opened up many options for us.  The pic's of your cars set up help also.  I hope the photo archieves on the site get back up soon which may help answer some of my questions.

Offline Milwaukee Midget

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Re: more production questions
« Reply #8 on: June 22, 2008, 02:45:25 PM »
Can you pick up air behind the grill and duct it to the intake through the radiator support assuming the radiator is not moved?  I am trying to figure out how to get air to the custom intake build. 

As an aside to that thought, my Midget has a ducting hole punched into the stock radiator support that is intended to direct air to the heater.  It is my intention to redirect the vent to a cold air box for intake, and find a different location for cabin air intake.

Heck, the simplest cold air intake I recall was built for the I/PRO Subaru - cardboard and duct tape, and according to the Subaru rag I get every so often, it was done as a last-minute idea right on the salt.  Don't know that they'd let it race today, but it holds the record.
"Problems are almost always a sign of progress."  Harold Bettes
Well, I guess we're making a LOT of progress . . .  :roll: