Poll

Should motorcycle engines be allowed in all car classes except production

absolutely
13 (31%)
all but vintage
18 (42.9%)
no
11 (26.2%)

Total Members Voted: 40

Author Topic: moto roadsters  (Read 33355 times)

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Offline desotoman

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #30 on: May 24, 2008, 07:32:41 PM »
Is this a one way street? Or would you call it discrimination?

Tom, since the car guys make the car rules are we guilty of discriminating against ourselves?

If so, I both confess and demand reparations  :-P

Good one John ya got me on that one, point taken.  I always think of the SCTA as one, not Motorcycles vs. Cars. With that said the next paragraph will explain where I am coming from.

This may be before your time so be patient.  Back in the 1960's there were two brothers by the name of Rickman who made motorcycle frames for different English Motorcycle motors. They made Road Race frames and Competition desert frames. They also made a 8 valve conversion head for the 650 Triumph twin. One day they decided they wanted to be a complete motorcycle manufacturer, so they went to Weslake and asked him to develop a twin cylinder motor for their frames using the 8 valve conversion head that already existed. Weslake made the bottom end, but by the time it was finished, the Rickman brothers were barly hanging on and could not afford to buy the motor. So Weslake decided to sell it himself as the Weslake twin. Later he sold the rights to the motor and all the tooling to one of his machinists by the name of Nourish. To my knowledge these motors never made it into a production type of bike. According to the SCTA rule book they are not legal to run in the motorcycle classes. I am sure there are more motors out there that would fall into this category. With that said I will now go to the SCTA website and put in for a rule change that will allow any motor to be run in the Motorcycle Special Construction and Streamliner Classes.

Tom G.
« Last Edit: May 24, 2008, 11:02:22 PM by desotoman »
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Offline willieworld

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #31 on: May 24, 2008, 07:58:01 PM »
tom  i think other than production and modified production  that you can run that engine --wouldnt have an extra one you want to sell would you also im looking for a 500cc lay down speedway motor  willie buchta
« Last Edit: May 24, 2008, 08:07:51 PM by willieworld »
willie-dpombatmir-buchta

Offline desotoman

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #32 on: May 24, 2008, 08:16:54 PM »
Willie,

I am the only person I know who has one or two. Sorry but I don't want to sell them. I have owned them since 1982. I plan on putting them into the two Rickman Roadrace chassis's I have of which one did run at Daytona out of Pafferman (sp) shop in Santa Monica. When finished I will have 2 bikes that the Rickman Brother's wanted to build and sell to the public.

See a Roadster guy can be a Bike guy too.

If I hear of anything I will let you know.

Tom G.
I love the USA. How much longer will we be a free nation?

Asking questions is one's only way of getting answers.

The rational person lets verified facts form or modify his opinion.  The ideologue ignores verified facts which don't fit his preconceived opinions.

bak189

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #33 on: May 24, 2008, 08:41:38 PM »
Very interesting discussion......................................
For approx. 4 years (when I was racing with BNI)
I ran a 125c.c. Rotax engine Model 129 in my own built frame.............however, the Model 129 was and is
a kart motor.....so under SCTA/BNI rules not legal.
I was never challenged in Tech.........but I had paper work that showed the engine Model 129
made by Rotax was used by Aprilla (with their
mods.) in their factory roadracers..........so it was a legal M/C. engine under SCTA/BNI rules...........
As noted above it was never challenged..............
It is a difficult "grey" area..........................................
Another bike I build in 1980 again using Rotax
power (500c.c. Twin) the engine was a proto type
for the Can-Am street bike (that never did go into production)  Tom Evans (BNI Tech) told me at that time the bike was not legal ......It was not a known M/C engine.  I had no problem with his decision
we only wanted to see how fast it would go.......
so ran for time only..............
So "only M/C/" can be a real challenge for the officials........................................................................

bak189

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #34 on: May 24, 2008, 08:49:23 PM »
I got one, desotoman.........they made a outstanding sidecar roadracing engine...........and NO I don't plan to sell it..............................................

John Romero

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #35 on: May 24, 2008, 09:38:10 PM »
Is this a one way street? Or would you call it discrimination?

Tom, since the car guys make the car rules are we guilty of discriminating against ourselves?

If so, I both confess and demand reparations  :-P

Good one John ya got me on that one, point taken.  I always think of the SCTA as one, not Motorcycles vs. Cars. With that said the next paragraph will explain where I am coming from.

This may be before your time so be patient.  Back in the 1960's there were two brothers by the name of Rickman who made motorcycle frames for different English Motorcycle motors. They made Road Race frames and Competition desert frames. They also made a 8 valve conversion head for the 650 Triumph twin. One day they decided they wanted to be a complete motorcycle manufacturer, so they went to Westlake and asked him to develop a twin cylinder motor for their frames using the 8 valve conversion head that already existed. Westlake made the bottom end, but by the time it was finished, the Rickman brothers were barly hanging on and could not afford to buy the motor. So Westlake decided to sell it himself as the Westlake twin. Later he sold the rights to the motor and all the tooling to one of his machinists by the name of Nourish. To my knowledge these motors never made it into a production type of bike. According to the SCTA rule book they are not legal to run in the motorcycle classes. I am sure there are more motors out there that would fall into this category. With that said I will now go to the SCTA website and put in for a rule change that will allow any motor to be run in the Motorcycle Special Construction and Streamliner Classes.

Tom G.

I swear to god Tom, One of these weekends I have to come out and see your stash of parts...

Offline desotoman

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #36 on: May 24, 2008, 09:56:45 PM »

I swear to god Tom, One of these weekends I have to come out and see your stash of parts...

John,

I really don't have much stuff compared to other Land Speed Racers but the stuff I do have I like and think is neat. The deluxe tour will take all of 10 minutes. You are welcome anytime.

Tom G.
I love the USA. How much longer will we be a free nation?

Asking questions is one's only way of getting answers.

The rational person lets verified facts form or modify his opinion.  The ideologue ignores verified facts which don't fit his preconceived opinions.

Offline desotoman

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #37 on: May 24, 2008, 10:01:22 PM »
I got one, desotoman.........they made a outstanding sidecar roadracing engine...........and NO I don't plan to sell it..............................................

Bak,

Do you have the 925 or 950cc motor? The ones I have are 750's with 180 degree cranks. Is Nourish still in buisness?

Tom G.
I love the USA. How much longer will we be a free nation?

Asking questions is one's only way of getting answers.

The rational person lets verified facts form or modify his opinion.  The ideologue ignores verified facts which don't fit his preconceived opinions.

Offline Nortonist 592

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #38 on: May 24, 2008, 10:26:28 PM »
Tom,  Nourish is alive and well.  doing business as Nourish Racing Engine Co.  (NRE).  And its Weslake.  Westlake is a village in L.A.


Willie,  Dave Brant's son Scott has a speedway shop here in Riverside.  He might be able to help.  His phone number is (951) 688-0011.
Get off the stove Grandad.  You're too old to be riding the range.

bak189

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #39 on: May 24, 2008, 10:35:25 PM »
Desotoman..........mine is also a 750c.c
and, yes, they are still in business in the U.K. and are involved with vintage racing:
NOURISH RACING ENG. CO
13 Manor lane, Langham, Oakham
Rutland LE15 7JL England
Tel: 01572-722712
Fax:...........-722688
"Complete Nourish Racing 8 valve twin cyl. engines....500c.c. 750c.c. 850c.c. 900c.c Each engine built to order...racing or street use. Avaiable for alternator if required. Large stock of spares available for immediate despatch"

P.S. what trans. are you planing to use?

Offline desotoman

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #40 on: May 24, 2008, 10:47:22 PM »
Guys,

Thanks for the information. I have not bought any parts from Dave since 1982. I have some Norton AMC type 4 speed transmissions I was going to use behind the motors.

Tom G.
I love the USA. How much longer will we be a free nation?

Asking questions is one's only way of getting answers.

The rational person lets verified facts form or modify his opinion.  The ideologue ignores verified facts which don't fit his preconceived opinions.

Offline Nortonist 592

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #41 on: May 24, 2008, 10:49:54 PM »
Hey Tom,  You wouldn't have a spare AMC box that you could be talked into selling?
Get off the stove Grandad.  You're too old to be riding the range.

bak189

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #42 on: May 24, 2008, 11:00:48 PM »
A few post back it was noted " This rule was tested by the BUB #7 streamliner....with a hand built one-off engine"
The rule may have been tested if Denis was racing against a AMA record.  However, #7 is racing for the FIM World Records ( he holds at the present time) FIM, has to my knowledge,
no engine restrictions as long as the engine meets the displacement.
Some of you U.K., German,and "Down Under"
correct me if I am mistaken, because that means I will have to stop work on my Offy powered sidecar streamliner................Oh, Well......................

Offline desotoman

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Re: moto roadsters
« Reply #43 on: May 24, 2008, 11:15:40 PM »
Hey Tom,  You wouldn't have a spare AMC box that you could be talked into selling?

No, I only have 2 units for the two motors I have. But I just looked on Ebay and there is one for sale there.
Item number: 130223975927 ends in a day or so. Hope this help you.

Tom G.
I love the USA. How much longer will we be a free nation?

Asking questions is one's only way of getting answers.

The rational person lets verified facts form or modify his opinion.  The ideologue ignores verified facts which don't fit his preconceived opinions.

Offline John Noonan

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« Last Edit: May 24, 2008, 11:49:01 PM by John Noonan »