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Author Topic: Attaching your spindles......Need help.  (Read 17677 times)

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Offline Sumner

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #15 on: March 02, 2008, 09:44:23 AM »
If you had a 22 inch diameter tire that is 5 inches wide, then the kingpin offset works out to 2.95" from the center of the tire to the center of the kingpin. This allows the tire to pivot around that point.

If you have a 14 inch diameter tire that is 5 inches wide, then with the same wheel offset you would be inside the center of the contact patch and instead of pivoting around the same point, the tire will swing in an arc. This changes the relationship between the fixed rear wheels and the swinging front wheels, and not in a good way.

You need 1.88 inches to bring the 14" tires to the correct contact patch.



What you need to determine is where exactly your tires and wheels will land. The offset of the wheel is the determining factor. The 14" wheel may have a very different offset. You could be right where you need to be, or way worse.

The two possibilities for adjusting are to have either the kingpin made at a different angle to match the tire diameter and wheel offset, or change the wheel offset to match the kingpin. The offset can be changed with a spacer if you are outside the contact point. If you are inside then the wheel has to be modified or find a wheel with a different offset.

Nice drawings Dean. One other thing that will effect it is caster.  The more caster the further out front that point where it hits the ground is and the further out from the car the point will be.  It is like going to a larger dia. wheel/tire combo, so that has to be taken into consideration.  At least I think it does and hope that it does,

Sum
« Last Edit: March 02, 2008, 12:10:55 PM by Sumner »

Offline interested bystander

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #16 on: March 02, 2008, 11:55:19 AM »
another handy device you might consider in setting up your front end is Mark Williams part #33600

Ive attached new front ends on cars with this device by just clamping it on the frame, or you can adapt it to a chassis jig- as it shows the axle is held parallel to the bar belosw- all you need to worry about is getting caster the same both sides
5 mph in pit area (clothed)

Offline Jonny Hotnuts

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #17 on: March 02, 2008, 02:01:05 PM »
When I acquired the tires/ wheels (4 tires and 4 wheels) they came with a very trick set of machined billet aluminum and some.....lesser cool Weld Racing stamped wheels.

Come to find out the wheel offset for the Weld wheel is considerably more inset then the billet wheels.

From the pic does it look like it will be an acceptable angle for the more inset Weld wheels?
The only option I have is to have some custom wheels made or return the pre-hung kingpin spindles and order just the spindle and weld it up my own spindles to the king pin boss at a steeper angle.....both IMO will suck.


Thanks for all replies, will look at the Mark Williams part.





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"Sometimes it is impossible to deal with her, but most of the time she is very sweet, and if you caress her properly she will sing beautifully."
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Offline 1212FBGS

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #18 on: March 02, 2008, 02:25:27 PM »
how heavy is your front end.?..... how fast ya plannin to go with those tires.?....well forget those questions.... dude, dont put those tires on your car.!......
kent

Offline interested bystander

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #19 on: March 02, 2008, 02:33:11 PM »
What you have are the old top fuel front wheels and tires no longer legal. plenty of runs in the1/4 over 300 with them- they are actualy 13" dia. there's many out there on smaller landspeed vehicles. i'd be nervous about a lot of nose weight-
 the wheels steve leach (he makes top fuel and funny car starter mechanisms) made back in the day were even more friendly towards scrub, but I never heard of handling problems with any in drag use.

welds are preferable- maybe more accurate, too.

I still have a "sticker" set for who knows what in the future. not 4 sale.
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Offline bvillercr

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #20 on: March 02, 2008, 02:49:08 PM »
Those tires are old funny car fronts?

Offline sheribuchta

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #21 on: March 02, 2008, 03:26:48 PM »
the tires and wheels you have are old dragster fronts  --they worked good on a very light dragster --they had a problem of tripping the lights and causing a red light (that race was over for you) do not  DO NOT put those wheels and tires on your car--i have 3 sets of the same wheels and tires i use them for building sidecars --less than 200 mph with 62 lbs of sidecar i wouldnt be afraid to run them to 300 on a side car but wont run them on the front because of a rule on minimum rim size--- doesnt the car rules have a minimum rim size
just some thoughts  willie buchta

Offline bvillercr

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #22 on: March 02, 2008, 03:49:50 PM »
What year dragsters are we talking about here, 1970's?  Or were those the tiny fronts they experimented with in the mid 80's and early 90's?
« Last Edit: March 02, 2008, 03:52:14 PM by bvillercr »

Offline interested bystander

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #23 on: March 02, 2008, 03:55:45 PM »
Bernstein ran the first 300 mph run on them in '92- they were built by Goodyear out of necessity because Don Garlits showed up a year or so before with first belts on his wheels and later aircraft tires- I witnessed Big Daddy changing his front end at Bkersfield after the belts flung off as he replaced them with the airplane rubber.
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Offline Jonny Hotnuts

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #24 on: March 02, 2008, 04:32:46 PM »
Quote
What you have are the old top fuel front wheels and tires no longer legal

I know of a number of people using them currently. When did they become illegal?

Quote
how heavy is your front end.?..... how fast ya plannin to go with those tires.?....well forget those questions.... dude, dont put those tires on your car.!......

A: not sure yet but fairly light (car is a mid engine)
B: I dont think it will make 200 this year
C: I was told the tires were LSR proven, they were legal and were good to 250.





jonny_hotnuts@hotmail.com

"Sometimes it is impossible to deal with her, but most of the time she is very sweet, and if you caress her properly she will sing beautifully."
*Andres Segovia
(when Im not working on the car, I am ususally playing classical guitar)

Offline interested bystander

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #25 on: March 02, 2008, 04:38:28 PM »
illegal for top fuel/top alcohol probably for ten years.-call NHRA, but I would get Goodyear's opinion if I had a nose-heavy, high front downforce or just plain heavy vehicle.

keep them out of light,like mushrooms.
5 mph in pit area (clothed)

Offline Jonny Hotnuts

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #26 on: March 02, 2008, 04:38:59 PM »
Cars that have (and currently except the NT2) run the same tire at speed much faster than I will be going.

jonny_hotnuts@hotmail.com

"Sometimes it is impossible to deal with her, but most of the time she is very sweet, and if you caress her properly she will sing beautifully."
*Andres Segovia
(when Im not working on the car, I am ususally playing classical guitar)

Offline Jonny Hotnuts

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #27 on: March 02, 2008, 04:48:38 PM »
I am building an aerodynamically neutral front end....I learned last year that aerodynamic weight does not in fact equal physical weight. The design will not progressively increase a percentage of lateral pressure, lift or down force.

I have already designed a safety skid that will act like a ski on the salt if a tire comes apart. This skid will allow the vehicle to be controlled, not have a section of frame "dig", potentially flip the car and to prevent or limit damage to the salt and could very well save the car (or person driving) if there is a tire failure. I will post concept designs soon.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2008, 04:50:23 PM by Jonny Hotnuts »
jonny_hotnuts@hotmail.com

"Sometimes it is impossible to deal with her, but most of the time she is very sweet, and if you caress her properly she will sing beautifully."
*Andres Segovia
(when Im not working on the car, I am ususally playing classical guitar)

Offline interested bystander

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #28 on: March 02, 2008, 05:26:31 PM »
Don't want to turn this in to a P#####g contest but aerodynamicly neutral sounds like the lady on TV that used to say her coffee was "the richest kind" WTF does that mean?

Aerodynamic weight certainly isn't the same as physical weight.- abour 25 years ago I built a wing for an open competion "modified" of some sort and at the Copper Classic the car blew BOTH rear tires!

CAREFULL!
5 mph in pit area (clothed)

Offline sheribuchta

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Re: Attaching your spindles......Need help.
« Reply #29 on: March 02, 2008, 07:47:56 PM »
j does your wheels have the bearings for the anglia spindle --i have the right spindles for that type of wheel only thing is they are for a 5/8 in. bearing --for a rear engine dragster --also the wheel with the right setup has much more  back space but even the right one doesnt have a perfect scrub line but it is close --another place i could see a problem is with the stud size it has to be 1/2 in  i also am posting some pics  --- maybe you could change the backspace to get the scrub to come around.   williebuchta