cid vs number of cyldiners

[desotoman]

Rich if you wanted couldn't you run the 235 in E as long as you didn't want to run vintage?? 

YES.

[RichFox]

Sum. The short answer is NO. We wanted to run a 248 GMC with an Arias head in E and were informed several times that it was a XXO motor. So we went with the later 250 Chevy six and had to answer questions in impound about weather or not it was a legal XO motor. You can use a turbo on a X type motor in a late body (My Vega) or a 'liner and I guess a lakester. But not in a roadster or Vintage coup. Ardun Doug, Bill Carlson and I tried to get the F through C engine sizes approved at that time, but no go.

[desotoman]

Rich,
   As I recall a few years ago I asked and was told the opposite. This gets interesting. I was told if I wanted to run a vintage engine with a turbo in a vintage car class I could. I just could not run in the XF vintage engine class, I would have to run against modern engines and engine size breaks. I was also told I would be able to run electronics since I would not be in the Vintage motor class.

I guess my question would be has something changed in the last few years?

Tom G.

[RichFox]

If you look at the XO/Alt record from 1980 that is my Vega with a 270 bored to 292. Before that I had the motor in my 32 Ford coup. The powers that were at that time decided that turbos would no longer be allowed on Vintage engines in Vintage bodys. So I put the GMC in the at that time 8 year old Vega and ran XX/Altered. I put a 12 port 320 inch GMC in the coup and ran XX/VAlt. The 248 deal was 12 or 15 years ago. The feeling was that you couldn't have an engine legal for X class and E (my 248) at the same time. I thought and still think it's a bogus rule, but you can see that no other engines are legal for two classes at the same time. I guess that it might change depending on to whom you spoke. The turbo deal seems to be a conumdrum

[depdawg]

always seems like more questions than answers, but I appreciate everbody that has responded, I do agree on the cu in aspect, if I can find a gimmy I;lll go with a puched 302. and do xo

[jimmy six]

To fuel to fire, the X classes are 0 to 325" ....................you choose what cubes to run. Same with V4's 0 to 220....If you want to run a vintage type engine in a modern vehicle you can by using a Turbo, EFI,  or other modifications not allowed in the vintage class vehicle go ahead. My opinion is you would not be competitive but who's to say.

A 248 GMC as a "E" with a crossflow head, Turbos, EFI. Fuel may go 245 in a roadster but I think not. Unblown 231, Blown gas 236, Unblown gas 202.  Same for altered coupes: blown fuel 248. Unblown 235, Blown Gas 275. Unblown gas 216. Gas Coupes both over 200.

If we had a E and D class in the X's all my stock bore blocks would be worth a mint. JD

[RichFox]

Jim; Puting a turbo on a 270 in a modern vehicle (Vega) and it's still an XO/BAlt. Don't know what EFI would do to it. Don't much care. Hope you make some good money on those blocks.

[panic]

If this were parsed as a social trend, or a virus, the projection would be that in 20 years:
Every politically prominent person would have their own class (separated by color of car, which bobble-head doll is in the window, which station is on the radio).
Everyone else would run heads up together - pedal car, MIG17, convalescent walker, human cannonball, everything.

If I sense any tendency for rules to make sense, or even someone notice that they currently don't, I'll stop.

[/rant]

[Sumner]

Jim; Puting a turbo on a 270 in a modern vehicle (Vega) and it's still an XO/BAlt. Don't know what EFI would do to it. Don't much care. Hope you make some good money on those blocks.

Not to beat this to death, but we are looking at some options for Hooley's Stude in the future and the '07 rule book states:

----------------------------------------
For reasons of economy and historical authenticity, vintage engine modification are restricted to older technology levels, so far as is practical.  Accordingly, in classes XO, XF, XXF,XXO, and V4 & V4F, using Vintage bodies:

1.  Turbochargers are not permitted.
2.  Computers are allowed for data collection purposes only.
3.  Electronic Fuel Injection prohibited.
4.  Any ignition system may be used.

---------------------------------------------

Ok where I've been screwed up in reading this is the part at the very end of the lead-in that states using Vintage bodies:.  So now I assume it to to mean that if you aren't using a vintage body, as in our case with a '53 Stude, you can run a vintage 6, 4, flathead and put a turbo on it and electronic fuel injection or anything else you want to do to it.  As long as the bock is a '59 or earlier overhead 6 or flathead (not a ford) or a 53 or earlier ford flathead you will be in the XO, XF, XXF,XXO engine break.

In our case lets say we put a pre '60 XO OHV 6 in the stude and left the car as a comp coupe and put a turbo and EFI on the motor and ran gas.  Now we would be XO/BGCC.

Someone please tell me if I finally have this figured out, Rich I think you probably already have.

Thanks,

Sum

[dwarner]

Sum and Rich are correct, Rich has been there and done that.

DW

[desotoman]

A couple of questions:

1. In a vintage car class what would the engine class be for a 50 ford V-8 based motor running Overhead cams on a specialty head? Would this run heads up in the normal classes?

2. Are the rules now set up so that any block that now qualifies for vintage engine class is stuck in that class, and can only run in the vintage engine class?

3. If you use a french Flathead block as you motor base, then can you run heads up in the regular classes.

4. If you are running something on a vintage motor that makes it illegal in the vintage motor class, why does that make you illegal to run in the normal class. The motor can only be legal for one class or the other on a given setup.

Tom G.

PS. I know many many years ago I was collecting Ford-Lincoln motors to run in the flathead class. I was told they were illegal since they were not Ford motors. Little did they know Ford used the same motor in the F-8 Trucks and had ford script on the head. When I showed a head that said ford on it, the next year in the rule book it stated Ford passenger car  motors only for the vintage flathead class.

[Sumner]

A couple of questions:

1. In a vintage car class what would the engine class be for a 50 ford V-8 based motor running Overhead cams on a specialty head? Would this run heads up in the normal classes?

I think the engine class would be called "A LOT OF WORK" class  .

Sorry, guess that wasn't too helpful,

Sum

[desotoman]

A couple of questions:

1. In a vintage car class what would the engine class be for a 50 ford V-8 based motor running Overhead cams on a specialty head? Would this run heads up in the normal classes?

I think the engine class would be called "A LOT OF WORK" class  .

Sorry, guess that wasn't too helpful,

Sum

Sum,

ROTFLMAO, you are correct.

Tom G.

[power58]

Saw a 3.8 Ford Eaton supercharger on a Ford model A  4 banger last year at speed week looked really cool. If you can make it work rulebook  wise, It would be a good low buck blower. Please keep us posted with your progress. Sounds like a good project.

[RichFox]

IMHO the Eaton blower on a Dodge Bros. flathead four would make a better V4F/BGR motor.