Tire for Sam

[PorkPie]

Talked today to Heinz (50th Anniversary NSU Delphin III 200 mph record).

Asked him about the tire for Sam Wheeler and for a general line of highspeed tire for the record breaking.

Unfortunately the answer was not this what we like to hear.

The producer checked everything and at last they was coming to the position to stay away from so tires.
They don't like to risk that they are coming into the responsibility if by some reason something happened.

Heinz has Sam informed.

Sorry folks, for this news

[wheelspin]

I am sure there is a reason he has not considered just running a solid aluminum wheel  ( no tire) If you profiled ( cambered) and knurled the contact surface this is probably the easiest solution, if not the most cost effective to redesigning the whole front of the motorcycle. Anyone know why this isnt considered an option??

[Glen]

Sam has already tried the solid front wheel with poor results and salt packing on it.

[wheelspin]

Any way I can get in touch with him ( Sam) to discuss the problems, or do you know the specifics of his problems? I am designing a streamliner and had planned to use  solid wheels and I would like to learn from his experience if he is willing to share.

[PorkPie]

The real problem is the weight and the balance.

The only solution is the way as Craig Breedlove done the wheels/tires for the SoA Sonic Arrow, but nobody can pay this.....

[JackD]

The real problem is the weight and the balance.

The only solution is the way as Craig Breedlove done the wheels/tires for the SoA Sonic Arrow, but nobody can pay this.....

The real problem is not weight and balance but lack of contact patch and the required lateral traction needed to keep a MC in hand.
They work on jet cars in the dirt because they displace the surface to get the required side bite.

[wheelspin]

Do you think it is possible to counteract the lack of a compliant ( I use the term "compliant" very loosely as the tire has little compliance at 350MPH due to cintrifugal reactions and the high starting pressures) contact patch by profiling the solid wheel in a similar way to a standard motorcycle tire and machining radial blade like protrusions around the wheel, after all there is little lateral force to contend with and no longitudinal force on the front wheel. I am assuming that if the streamliner is balanced correctly in aerodynamic Cp and Cg locations that the only lateral force that needs to be contended is from side loading from crosswinds. Any ideas?

[JackD]

It won't work any better than an aluminum wheel on a glass table.

[wheelspin]

Jack,
Why?

[JackD]

Jack,
Why?

All of that has been covered extensively on landracing.
In short the altitude record for aluminum front wheels is held by one that was shaped like an Avon Speedmaster.
Tricks you can do at home :
Take a hard disk of any size that is slightly larger than an available rubber band and slide it around a hard surface like a table top.
Then fasten the rubber band to the outside of the disk and try it again.
If the neighbors are not looking you can do the same with your bicycle by starting with the tires off an going round the block.
A DOT approvet helmet should be just fine.
Gather all your conclusions together while on the walk back and let us know how you do.

[wheelspin]

Jack , I believe you , thanks for saving me the expense and trouble of building it only to find out that it diddnt work. At the same time I just cant see how any molecular interlocking can happen at 350MPH with the pressure and centrifugal reaction the tire must be hard as a rock. I am not talking about the rear tire where there is a longitudinal force , only the front where essentially, in my mind, it will never see any lean angle and simply needs to create a small centering force and basically act as a rudder for small corrections in trajectory. I dont have time to read the entire landracing web site, even though I have tried and rarely chime in at that I would still like to have the information. Anybody have a link to the forum Jack is referring to?
Thanks
Nathan

[JackD]

I don't mean to "SHORT SHEET" you but I do encourage a search on this site to see the various information available.
A further illustration is 2 of the bikes that crashed at the hands of some very experienced riders went on to run well over 300 after returning to a  pneumatic tire.
Their have been failures with tires also but is was a combination of old age and the misuse of a design that was intended for something else to start.
Sadly, most of the failures of that type go mis or under reported and that dooms the new comer to repeat.
This is where the experince level and intent of the sanction body rulers begins to really show.

[JackD]

OBTW : Lean angle and the ability of the bike liner to counter act the forced of invisible cross winds is all you have to stay up.
A top side rider uses body English as a natural reaction that a liner driver does not have.
Some of the reasons bike liners crash more is they are subject to the track conditions more than an open bike because of the aerodynamics.
The open bike rider scares easier and won't take it as far.
Rider protection from themselves is one of the main objectives of a ruling body.
Failed innovation, revelation ,and correct resolution are not shared often enough .

[PorkPie]

The real problem is not weight and balance but lack of contact patch and the required lateral traction needed to keep a MC in hand.
They work on jet cars in the dirt because they displace the surface to get the required side bite.
[/quote]
You know how Craigs wheels/tires are built and looks?

[JackD]

Yes I do and  have seen it run on both salt and the dirt.
The mark it leaves in the dirt is the only corrective steering bite he has and other than altering the aerodynamic shape to steer it he has nothing.
It is easy to forget the tremendous power that has to be devoted just to keep it on the ground.
A transonic shock wave is equal on all sides.