Author Topic: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls  (Read 11100 times)

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Offline Loose Goose-Terry#1

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Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« on: February 04, 2007, 12:43:00 PM »
Since you drive a sidecar streamliner more like a car than a bike, would it be acceptable to use a ?butterfly? steering wheel and turn the front wheel?  :? I am trying to determine if I should use a ?handlebar? type setup and push-pull direct linkage to the front wheel or if I can use the direct link type and ?turn? the steering wheel to turn the front wheel similar to the setup used on a Kart. Very simple and very strong. I realize that on a conventional sidecar rig ?handlebars? are required, but a streamliner is open to innovation.

Next question. Can I use foot controls for throttle, clutch, and brake or does the throttle and clutch have to be on the handlebars (assuming that I have to use the handlebars :| )? It appears to me as though it would be safer to use the feet to do some of the work.
If I had it all to do over again...I would!

Offline Nortonist 592

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #1 on: February 04, 2007, 01:07:29 PM »
Yes, yes,no,  Yes you can use a butterfly steering wheel.  Yes you can use just about any steering you devise except no cable steering.  Yes you can use foot controls.  No the controls don't have to be on the "handlebars".
« Last Edit: February 04, 2007, 02:02:35 PM by Nortonist 592 »
Get off the stove Grandad.  You're too old to be riding the range.

Offline 1212FBGS

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2007, 02:56:19 PM »
nope!!!!! you "CAN NOT" use a steering wheel on a motorcycle classified vehicle (encluding a streamliner). you have to steer with handlebars and the controls dont have to be on the bars
kent

Offline JackD

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2007, 06:24:03 PM »
The second word in the question was
"STREAMLINER" and the rest is history
that is not to be confused with "KNEE JERK"
that can obscure you vision.
"I would rather lose going fast enough to win than win going slow enough to lose."
"That horrible smell is dirty feet being held to the fire"

Offline Loose Goose-Terry#1

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #4 on: February 04, 2007, 07:35:51 PM »
 :-D Jack, does that mean I ?CAN? or ?CANNOT? use a butterfly steering wheel? :? Boy, I thought the designing was going to be the easy part, but every time I learn something, I end up with more questions. It would be a lot simpler if I lived somewhere where there were motorcycle streamliners that I could look at. I just saved all the pictures of Ack Attack so I could study them later. No use trying to re-invent the wheel. :lol: Might as well borrow some design from one that has already been there. :evil:
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Offline JackD

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #5 on: February 04, 2007, 08:40:44 PM »
Now that you are sitting up and for sure read it again, one of the longest passages in the MC rules addresses steering in streamliners and only mentions handlebars.
While butterflies and cables have both been tried by some very experienced builders, they fail to work well in use.
The rules are hopefully designed to be as simple as can be so the interpretation is limited.
Experiences that got them there would fill several books.
It should never hurt to ask because your new ideas may already have been tried with either success or failure.
The rules should evolve with those inputs but remain simple enough for Everybody to understand equally.
The car stuff gets pretty good . widespread, and prompt attention but the bikes are not as lucky.
TOUGH  JOB   !!!
« Last Edit: February 05, 2007, 11:42:35 AM by JackD »
"I would rather lose going fast enough to win than win going slow enough to lose."
"That horrible smell is dirty feet being held to the fire"

Offline 1212FBGS

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2007, 12:25:56 AM »
I tried a wheel on one of my bike liners in 03. Didnt work, guess it might have if I had never counterstered a bike before. any how didnt work, dont waist your time and the rules prohibit it.
kent

bak189

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2007, 11:37:48 AM »
Terry....like I told you "many Moons" ago....put it on paper and send it to SCTA/BNI, and hopefully get a anwer...................
Goog Luck..............................

bak189

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #8 on: February 05, 2007, 11:42:10 AM »
I mean GOODDDDDDD LUCK

Offline JackD

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #9 on: February 05, 2007, 11:46:52 AM »
Terry....like I told you "many Moons" ago....put it on paper and send it to SCTA/BNI, and hopefully get a anwer...................
Goog Luck..............................
The answer is clearly printed in the rule book now.
Deviation from that without good cause will generate some of the problems that plague the MC program today.
"I would rather lose going fast enough to win than win going slow enough to lose."
"That horrible smell is dirty feet being held to the fire"

Offline tortoise

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #10 on: February 05, 2007, 12:34:30 PM »
Seems to me if you omit the bottom horizontals from a butterfly wheel, and make it out of tubing, you're left with an "M" shaped thing which you might well call a handlebar. Difference in safety/function?
« Last Edit: February 05, 2007, 12:42:42 PM by tortoise »

Offline JackD

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #11 on: February 05, 2007, 01:22:21 PM »
A straight tubing that worked like a steering wheel will produce the same bad result as a butterfly or anything else that required a simular motion.
You will also notice the MC requirement for specified things be operated without removing the hands from he steering.
The range of motion,direction of operation, and level of concentration are quite different in a bike liner.
"I would rather lose going fast enough to win than win going slow enough to lose."
"That horrible smell is dirty feet being held to the fire"

Offline tortoise

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #12 on: February 05, 2007, 02:33:07 PM »
A straight tubing that worked like a steering wheel will produce the same bad result as a butterfly or anything else that required a simular motion.
I wasn't suggesting it's a good idea, just that the rules (perhaps unfortunately) don't preclude it.
Quote
The range of motion,direction of operation, and level of concentration are quite different in a bike liner.
Undoubtedly. The system some liners do use successfully, of two vertical levers pivoting forward and back, doesn't seem to meet the letter of the rules any more than a wheel-like system. It's great for entry/exit and visibility.

Offline Sumner

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #13 on: February 05, 2007, 03:16:38 PM »
............. The system some liners do use successfully, of two vertical levers pivoting forward and back, doesn't seem to meet the letter of the rules any more than a wheel-like system. It's great for entry/exit and visibility.

Are you talking about Denis's BUB liner or others??  I have a feeling his would not be legal at a SCTA meet.  He runs under different rules and FIM probably doesn't care at all.

c ya,

Sum

Offline JackD

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Re: Sidecar Streamliner Steering and Controls
« Reply #14 on: February 05, 2007, 03:50:48 PM »
One of the last cable linkage setups was produced by Manning and it failed the test before it was submitted for competition.
He owns his event and is the final approval for those rules and procedures.
As such, those rules and procedures may not be adopted by other sanction bodies if they are found to not be suitable for their event.
A fold out of the way bar system is quite easy to make and allows easy exit from the driver position and access for medical help as required.
"I would rather lose going fast enough to win than win going slow enough to lose."
"That horrible smell is dirty feet being held to the fire"