Cylinder pump procedure - question?

[dieselgeek]

Guys, we're prepping the Ferrari F40 for speedweek 2007...  and we have a dilemna we "never quite figured out" last year.  Should we find ourselves in impound, we literally have no way of disabling the valvetrain in one cylinder, the cam belts are buried at the front of the motor (rear engine car) behind the driver...


is there an alternate procedure or suggestions on how to handle this on the salt?   we were 3mph short of a record last year - our hopes are high to end up in impound this year!

what's the best course of action here?  Can we get the motor pumped beforehand when it's out of the car and have it "sealed" similar to the fueling procedure in gas classes?

-scott

[dwarner]

Scott,

Check you PMs.

DW

[dieselgeek]

Wow - thanks Dan for the quick response.


For anyone else with this question, the tech officials are so kind as to be present during reassembly of the motor and will measure, and seal, the motor for us.



How's that for personal treatment?


As always, you landracing guys are great to deal with,

-scott

[Seldom Seen Slim]

Did he tell you how much beer to have in stock?  If not, be sitting down when he does.

And worse still -- the beers are for AFTER the engine is measured.

[Dynoroom]

Slim's right, it starts out "I remember back in.....     

[dieselgeek]

Slim's right, it starts out "I remember back in.....     

HAHA

I've found, as a newb to the Salt this last year, that it's wise to sit back and take in all the "old stories" I can possibly hear.  With this crowd, there's an unusually high signal-to-noise ratio.  Lots of good stuff buried in those history lessons...!

[saltsho1]

   I also would like to know how the cylinder pump works as we also were within 7 miles of our record in F/PRO and we were running the stock inj's and mass air sensor after trouble with the larger ones.

Thanks for the help, and it's cold in Salt Lake City
Ernie

[JackD]

Why not use a dipstick and not go into the motor more than removing a spark plug ?
Do you have the spark plug straight in to the center of the chamber ?

[saltsho1]

Yes, the plug is in the center of the chamber, the motor is the 24 valve double overhead cam yamaha motor from ford.

I have no idea what they use or how they do a cylinder test.

Ernie

[JackD]

Why take it apart at all if you don't have to ?
A simple mechanical device can direct measure the stroke and verify the bore size without disabling the valve train.
You can make it yourself and bring it along or have it made for you.

[saltsho1]

I'm sorry, but I'm knew to this part of it, I can figure the measuring of the stroke with a rod or something but how about the bore size, I've been told it was some kind of air pump that is screwed into the plug hole.

[JGMagoo]

I'm dying of curosity!  I'd love to know how to make this 'simple' device to accurately measure bore and stroke through the (centered) spark plug hole.

I'm building an engine that will be an absolute b***h to disassemble and re-assemble, and I'd love to know how to verify bore and stroke in some other manner than removing the cylinder head. (The engine does NOT HAVE a removable cylinder head---similar to an Offenhauser)

I understand and have seen the 'pump' system in operation, but as I understand it, the 'pump' is only usefull or accurate within a certain percentage. If it gets real close, they will want to do a physical B & S measurement.

[JackD]

Don't let curiosity kill you or taking a motor apart when you don't have to either.
Check your PMs in a bit and if you can build a motor, this tool is very simple to make.
Jack

[saltsho1]

  A very big thanks to Jack for the info on the measuring tool.  It will really save me time if I can ever get into impound.

Ernie

[jimmy six]

I thought Dan may answer this but we have the ability to physically measure an engine with a CENTER spark plug. We have a tool for the bore and one for the stroke. It is kept in impounds. I have personally measured the Ford "Yamaha" engine at El Mirage and so far it has not been a problem. If you are having an engine builder assemble your engine a copy of the build sheet is always helpful. Stating bore, stroke, etc:

The pump is a very good device when operated properly. I send them out for servicing/certification usually every other year. There is definately a proper way of handling them. Internal temperature of the engine is a must as there are formulas for expansion. We have measured engines are 304" and later pumped then at exactly the same.   
About 4 years ago I pumped an engine which was supposedly built at over the 441 limit to be in "A". It continued to pump 436 on every cylinder we checked. The competitor took off one of the heads and we measured it 436". He had been given a different stroke than he was told.

Cammmers are always a problem and it's the competitors responsibilty to make a way for us to check the displacement not the SCTA's. We have done them through the pan but it is not the preferred way and may not be done. Good Luck...J.D.