Sidecar rule 7.I.11 for 2008?

[bak189]

Rule 7.I.11 to read:  (SCTA/BNI)
Passenger accommodations:
The sidecar platform must be large enough to allow a passenger to safely ride in a sitting, kneeling or prone position in the sidecar.  In addition there should be designated handholds mounted for the passenger.  The sidecar mounting hardware and/or ridged bars can not be used as passenger handholds.  In lieu of a passenger
a minimum ballast/weight of 132lbs. must be securly carried in the sidecar. The ballast/weight to be checked at Tech. inspection.

Any comments???

[JackD]

REMARKABLE
Without even the 07 rules in hand, the 08 rules are a bit premature.
Without prior notice or input from the MC community we are falling into the same trap that has plagued us in the recent past.
If the rule is enacted I would expect all side car records set to a lesser standard would be retired and off the shelf.
That has not been the case with other rule changes has it ?
Credibility and responsibility go hand in hand and I think I see a problem.

[Nortonist 592]

How interesting.  It appears to be output with no input.  Could I get my Suburban to use gas that way I'd be a rich man.  Having not seen or even had a hint of the possible rule changes I can't comment.  You say "in lieu of a passenger".  Is that to be interpreted s we can carry a passenger?  If such a ballast rule is enacted will the current records be retired?  Or do those in power care?  Or is it a subtle effort to rid the SCTA of those meddlesome bikes?

[dwarner]

Why are rule change suggestions being presented here instead per procedures? How do you know that this rule has not been modified for 2007 anyway?

DW

[Nortonist 592]

I can't speak for bak189 or where he obtained the information but on the SCTA website it says the bike rule changes will be announced Dec.7.  At the last club (Tues. 12th.) meeting it was announced that the bike changes had not yet been released.  Add to the fact that rule books don't get out until well into the new year and the above proposed rule change is a major change.  Hence the concern.

[JackD]

Why are rule change suggestions being presented here instead per procedures? How do you know that this rule has not been modified for 2007 anyway?

DW

The rules are being cussed and discussed here because with respect to the MC entries the procedure has broken down and even the SCTA Club members have not been advised of the potential changes unlike the car methods..
Various participants that are SCTA members and not , submit the requests as per the rules and never hear about them again.
The lack of a budget to accomodate a MC meeting at Bonneville was a fall down laffer, and the reasoning given for the maximum tank size in A was and is incorrect (lie) and a number of other unsupervised changes designed to profit 1 person.
The S+S case case has done more harm to the field than has been imagined and it is getting worse.
When they say they are getting back to their roots they must mean no bikes.

"Failed as designed or designed to fail?"

[bak189]

HEY,HEY,HEY people don't get so excited......
this is MY rule proposal for 2008, not the SCTA/BNI M/C committee, they have not seen it.......I just put it out there for DISCUSSION......you all feel better now!!!!

[bak189]

WOW, I do hope you people are feeling better NOW..........this is just for INPUT and
DISCUSSION.....something that as not been done regarding the SCTA/BNI M/C rule changes in the past.   WOW ,WOW

[Nortonist 592]

My apologies.  The way the initial post was written I took it as it was a proposed rule change.  If the SCTA does not allow passegers why have hand holds fitted?  If ballast would be required will you word your proposal in such a way that previous sidecar records are removed and we start with a clean slate?

[JackD]

Rule changes by just the Rulers = HOT BUTTON
Bob's suggestion for a rule change deserves publication and discussion.
Like it or not, you are entitled to comment and this is a good place to start.
Surprises are worse.

[SPARKY]

Geeezz , and I thought the sidecar bike guys--were about to be as much fun as they are at Pike's Peak---where they race with their "MONKEYS" as part of the "Race to the Clouds" ---what a team effort !!!!!!!

[Nortonist 592]

We are still searching for a peak on the lakebed.  Fortunately we haven't found any.  Some have reported a peak right at the lights.

[bak189]

To explain my proposed rule change for 2008 (7.I.11) To allow passengers back in the sidecar.....However, one must run ballast/weight  if no passenger is used.
(the same rule that is used for International
Speed Trials = 60kg = 132lbs.)
Leave the records for sidecars now in the book alone.  This has been done in the past.......example: my sidecar record set in 1991 in SCA-BG for 1300c.c. was changed
(without consultation) to SC-BG 1350c.c. and it is still in the book as a record.
If the team plans to use a passenger, the proper handholds for safety reasons (as noted) must be installed.  This rule change allow the sidecars
now running or in the process of being build
to race as is.  I see no problems.........it only allows us to fall in line with the International
rules regarding sidecars.

[bak189]

Regarding the Pikes Peak International
Hill Climb......been there.....done that......1998,
1999,2000,2001,2002, After 02 I was to old!!!!
Oh,  we used passengers.....................................

[Sumner]

Rule 7.I.11 to read:  (SCTA/BNI)
Passenger accommodations:
The sidecar platform must be large enough to allow a passenger to safely ride in a sitting, kneeling or prone position in the sidecar.  ........................Any comments???

From someone who likes things spelled out the above seems open to interpretation to me.  What is large enough for one might be too small or too large for an other and what I might feel is safe might not be someone else's idea of what is safe.

I know it is hard to pin this down, but I would think you need a min. dimension or something in the rule so this isn't open to the participants or inspectors interpretation.

I think it is safe for me to sat that this rule will never effect me though .

c ya,

Sum