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Author Topic: Smartcarb  (Read 1311 times)

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Offline neandethal

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Smartcarb
« on: September 14, 2019, 11:09:06 AM »
Has anyone used a smarcarb at Bonneville. They and some people on various forums, claim they don't need adjustment for either temperature variations or altitude. I am sure having issues getting jetting right on  my 2 stroke due to altitude, and if these work they are worth the investment of $500.
Any feedback appreciated. Ian

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2019, 01:03:21 AM »
A link to some info on a smart carb will help.

Offline neandethal

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2019, 03:50:28 AM »
here we go, they website claims they will solve all my issues and more, wondered if anyone had real world experience.
https://technologyelevated.com/shop/

Offline TheBaron

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2019, 09:18:40 AM »
Zero tech info I could find,,,Be Very Careful Here{with only testimonials to go by}.....

Robert

Offline Mystifier

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #4 on: September 22, 2019, 10:01:34 PM »
Has anyone used a smarcarb at Bonneville. They and some people on various forums, claim they don't need adjustment for either temperature variations or altitude. I am sure having issues getting jetting right on  my 2 stroke due to altitude, and if these work they are worth the investment of $500.
Any feedback appreciated. Ian

They definitely work as advertised with several records set at Pikes Peak. The majority of the interest in the SmartCarb is from the Enduro and Motocross world. Currently most of the land speed interest is coming from Australia.


Offline jacksoni

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #5 on: September 23, 2019, 07:11:11 AM »
I have looked around as well and indeed most "reviews" are opinions only, no real testing. Some good and some bad reviews. One guy gave significant bad review taking his well sorted carb off  a modified bike and replaced it with a SmartCarb out of the box which didn't run quite right and it was therefore deemed terrible. I don't think most folks would take a carb new out of the box and install it and expect it to be perfect regardless of what expert built it in the first place. Some car guru's pronounced that it can't work ( I asked a few) as advertised. Anything will likely need some tweeking to get right and then maybe it will do more or less as advertised. I hope to follow your progress. Let us know how it works if you go that way.
Jack Iliff
 G/BGS-250.235 1987
 G/GC- 176.245  2018
 G/GMS-182.144 2019

Offline Mystifier

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #6 on: September 23, 2019, 11:43:36 AM »
I have looked around as well and indeed most "reviews" are opinions only, no real testing. Some good and some bad reviews. One guy gave significant bad review taking his well sorted carb off  a modified bike and replaced it with a SmartCarb out of the box which didn't run quite right and it was therefore deemed terrible. I don't think most folks would take a carb new out of the box and install it and expect it to be perfect regardless of what expert built it in the first place. Some car guru's pronounced that it can't work ( I asked a few) as advertised.

People will always mock what they don't understand. There is actually a huge amount of third party testing and validation if you know where to look.

What has been accomplished in the 10 years that we have been developing the SmartCarb include numerous Pikes Peak 1st place wins and world records with modified 2 and 4 stroke quads and 250-500+cc motorcycles. Altitude and mileage records. Twice EPA/ARB certified for on-road use in class 1B and 2B motorcycles and scooters. (Without the use of precious metal catalysts) a first, and also the lowest evaporative emissions ever recorded from a mechanical fuel system.

We continue to win international and national championships with professional riders in Hard Enduro, WESS, Extreme Offroad and Drag Scooters. Don Short set the Australian 50cc Land Speed record last fall and thousands of units have been sold for general consumer use in over 53 countries.

We also supply to Paramotor manufacturers and military heavy fuel submersible outboards and have Beta, Sherco and Yamaha factory riders working with their respective factories. We have validated the system in Asia for emissions compliance.

The ambient air density correction circuit senses boost in the same way it reads air density. We have turbocharged applications beginning to compete in a variety of venues and have a couple of people preparing turbo setups for Bonneville, it's likely some of you will have a chance to see one first hand on the salt before long.   

Quote
Anything will likely need some tweeking to get right and then maybe it will do more or less as advertised. 

As with any unfamiliar product it really just comes down to education and in a lot of cases "unlearning" what you think you have already mastered.



F/BFL-262.52  Speedweek 1996
« Last Edit: September 23, 2019, 04:46:50 PM by Mystifier »

Offline jacksoni

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #7 on: September 23, 2019, 11:52:51 AM »
Thanks for this added information. I did not mean to suggest that I had done some in depth searching as I have not nor did I mean to imply that this system doesn't work (maybe I did but I had not found a lot of positive to support and as I said some people suggest it doesn't/wont work). As you say "if you know where to look" is important. I had done a simple google search and came up with what I suggested. I would be happy to see better test/science if you would care to provide some links. Meantime, good going on your projects and results.

Since I may be in a position where this technology would be a benefit, I am interested and will continue to follow. Thanks.
Jack Iliff
 G/BGS-250.235 1987
 G/GC- 176.245  2018
 G/GMS-182.144 2019

Online gowing

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #8 on: September 23, 2019, 01:51:25 PM »
according to the ad: +10-14% more HP

Mystifier,  do you have any testing data that you could share ?

I am confident that there are others here that are interested in your carbs as I am.
If they really works as claimed,  it could be a huge benefit for lsr bikes spending a lot of their time re-jetting.

Offline Mystifier

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #9 on: September 24, 2019, 08:40:18 AM »
Thanks for this added information. I did not mean to suggest that I had done some in depth searching as I have not nor did I mean to imply that this system doesn't work (maybe I did but I had not found a lot of positive to support and as I said some people suggest it doesn't/wont work). As you say "if you know where to look" is important. I had done a simple google search and came up with what I suggested. I would be happy to see better test/science if you would care to provide some links. Meantime, good going on your projects and results.

Since I may be in a position where this technology would be a benefit, I am interested and will continue to follow. Thanks.

No problem, we understand the skepticism.

The first thing to consider is that this technology and science has been in development for over 50 years. It's not some new flash in the pan miracle carburetor. The science is sound and is proven out in real world situations every day. The people that suggest that it doesn't or cannot work simply do not understand the system. The lineage comes from the Gardner carb that the Brit's lay claim to, and the seemingly concurrent work done by Edmonston on this side of the pond. Those include the Lake Injector (1968), Pos-A-Fuel, Lectron, EI Blue Magnum and the Quiksilver I and II.

Improved efficiency is measured in several distinct ways. The one we all know and love is improved torque and horsepower, the second and somewhat less interesting is fuel economy, lastly decreased emissions. LeRoy would always say it's all about the fueling, and the reason he and Stu Hilborn brought the goods when it came to their Bonneville records. I concur. Nitro and/or Methanol do not appreciate extremely fine atomization, in fact the wetter the better in most applications. Gasoline engines on the other hand, within the tolerances of fuel stability at big HP numbers and the ever present detonation and pre-igntion concerns can greatly benefit from very fine vapor. This is the first important aspect of this fuel system. The flat ground metering rod, working as a wake generator, creates very small vortices that further amplify the vaporization potential of the fuel, in addition to the high velocity effect provided by the unique patented venturi shape.


The float bowl pressurization circuit is also unique and provides both ambient air density correction and top end fueling performance. The air entering the scoop remains relatively stagnant through the majority of throttle opening until somewhere near 7/8th to wide open where it then turns into dynamic flow, pushing the fuel out of the bowl at greater than atmospheric pressure. This is where the experts get confused, and I won't go into any great detail, but where they err is that they have a hard time recognizing the fluid communication between air and a liquid. It's literally an inverse power-jet, or annular booster if you will, instead of sucking fuel up a hose or passageway and then discharging it directly into the air stream, it hammers fuel up the main circuit (metering rod) where it can still benefit from the atomization effect of the metering rod. Unlike a booster which is in effect simply raw fuel.

I apologize to have started the intrigue and then have to duck off of here for a week or so while we attend the AIMExpo. After I return I will provide more information.

Disclaimer: I am the founder and Chief Technology Officer of Technology Elevated, SmartCarb. My Dad is LeRoy Neumayer and I am a Bonneville veteran. It's likely I have already met some of you. The last thing I want to do is to get on here and appear markety, my only intent is to provide clarification so I will do my best to keep it to the facts.~Corey
« Last Edit: September 24, 2019, 10:42:49 PM by Mystifier »

Offline jacksoni

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #10 on: September 24, 2019, 08:45:36 AM »
Many thanks for the clarification!!! :clap
Jack Iliff
 G/BGS-250.235 1987
 G/GC- 176.245  2018
 G/GMS-182.144 2019

Offline flyonly

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #11 on: October 02, 2019, 06:01:57 PM »
Has anyone used a smarcarb at Bonneville. They and some people on various forums, claim they don't need adjustment for either temperature variations or altitude. I am sure having issues getting jetting right on  my 2 stroke due to altitude, and if these work they are worth the investment of $500.
Any feedback appreciated. Ian

They definitely work as advertised with several records set at Pikes Peak. The majority of the interest in the SmartCarb is from the Enduro and Motocross world. Currently most of the land speed interest is coming from Australia.



I have run the Smartcarb at salt racing here for the last two years.  I have run it on two different bikes and its been flawless.  The first year my engine guy thought a 28mm would be too big for a 50cc but because of the venturi design and how well the fuel is atomized it has not been a problem.

When I was justifying the cost I considered how much a good range of jets was going to cost me so I could get a good tune on a dyno.  This could easily be $100.  What I didn't factor in was the savings in dyno time.  To make a jet change on a normal carb would take say 5 mins.  With this carb its seconds.  Full throttle, turn the knob, left for leaner, right for richer and ready for another dyno run.  I got so much better value out of my dyno time because it was so easy to make changes.

At the lake, I didn't make any changes from the dyno runs.  I did constantly inspect the plug and it all looked great.  I am currently in the process of fitting a data logger to record O2 and EGT so I can see what it happening.  This should allow me to get a better read on the tune than just reading the plug.

Its a great carb.

Offline neandethal

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #12 on: October 06, 2019, 06:10:40 PM »
Thanks for the thoughts and debate, lets develop it a bit further.
current set up is 100cc capacity, Honda CR85 reed block, massively ported crankcases, Borg warner KO3 turbo, upto 10 psi boost, 34mm dellorto carb, 43 bhp at 13,800 rpm.
Smart carb list either a 28mm - good air velocity but does it matter with a turbo, or a 36mm - surely better for WOT. which to buy?

Views, opinions, contradictions welcomed.

Offline wobblywalrus

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #13 on: October 07, 2019, 12:10:16 AM »
Does the smart carb use a butterfly valve in the throttle venturi or a slide?

Online RidgeRunner

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Re: Smartcarb
« Reply #14 on: October 07, 2019, 05:07:44 AM »
      Slide per the pictures and drawings I've seen.

                Ed