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Author Topic: UK Lakester build G/GL  (Read 103475 times)

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Offline WOODY@DDLLC

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Offline Stainless1

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #361 on: June 22, 2019, 09:32:36 AM »
Ours looks like this... we use if blown to supply air to the turbo and unblown to supply pressurized air to the throttle bodies.  It has been years since we instrumented the airbox, but I suspect we still get pressure.
Stainless
Red Hat 228.039, 2001, 65ci, MSA Bockscar Lakester with a little N20 
MSA Bockscar Lakester #1000 my fastest mile 245 and change, 84 ci turbobusa motor... but Corey's 233 MPH H/BFL record is still 3MPH faster than mine.

Offline Sumner

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #362 on: June 22, 2019, 01:44:19 PM »
I'll add the following.  I had a person who I won't identify, but will say they hold a world record, tell me that they use a NACA duct on their vehicle which is blown (turbo) but wouldn't consider using one if it was NA unless a lot of effort was put into designing one for their "specific vehicle".

Stainless's lakester has shown that what they have works in their situation with their body and where it is located.  Doesn't mean that the same duct would work on yours unless the the body was exactly the same.

Personally I'd start with a scoop and take no chances on supplying the required air.  You could always change down the road or possibly make them interchangeable to some degree.  A properly designed scoop doesn't have to hurt much aero wise as it should be taking in the column of air that it is confronting.

Some Scoop Theory ...

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/bvillecar/bville-scoop%20info-1.html

A Spreadsheet to help with inlet size (at top of the general spreadsheets)...

http://purplesagetradingpost.com/sumner/bvillecar/bville-spreadsheet-index.html

Sumner


Offline Lemming Motors

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #363 on: June 26, 2019, 05:21:51 AM »
Thanks guys. I think the NACA will be a suck it and see experiment but I would like to get it as right as I can.

I note in the original NACA data they profile the ramp floor (in end elevation) to the fuselage curvature in one experiement but for some reason show it with curved edges (floor to sides) contrary to the vortex discusion.

I suspect to really understand them requires arcane knowledge that involves secret passwords and handshakes.
A Bonneville Lakester please barman.
Certainly sir; a lick of salt, a sip of gas and a twist of Lemming. More Lemming sir?
Just a squeeze.

A Squeeze of Lemming it is sir.

Offline Lemming Motors

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #364 on: June 26, 2019, 05:27:50 AM »
In other news the rad in tank is being built now - I thought it was started several weeks ago but when I rang to enquire the top man I was dealing with realised he hadn't assigned a works order to the job so the fabricators hadn't started work on it.

In the meantime I have been looking for homes for things in the engine area. It is so easy to forget that a throttle cable passes through a space or a fuel pump needs room for inlet and outlet lines and the lines need space to go around corners wihout moocking things up. Whoever commented that things get tight real fast in a Lakester / Liner was spot on.

It looks like the fuel pump and filters will have a nice out of the way home under the tail piece of the gearbox, and hats a low point in terms of fuel flow to them from the tank which is good too.
A Bonneville Lakester please barman.
Certainly sir; a lick of salt, a sip of gas and a twist of Lemming. More Lemming sir?
Just a squeeze.

A Squeeze of Lemming it is sir.

Offline Lemming Motors

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #365 on: June 26, 2019, 05:38:15 AM »
I initially mocked the engine up (canted over) assuming that the flat surface where the original gear shift mounts was horizontal (I now know it isn't - weird).

In the donor vehicle the engine, some subsequent research revealed, is at 15 degrees. I have now used a digital inclinometer to go from mockup to positioning - taking 20mm out of one of the engine mount legs in he process - solved some problems, created others.

I was closer to 22 degrees and have now split the difference at 18 for packaging purposes - now the oil filter just hits a chassis rail (small relief required instead of major circular routing) but now the water pump inlet hose just hits the rail on the other side - great compromise that - almost win / lose. The water inlet neck has been sliced and is off to a welder of aluminium to see if he can do magic - it will point up slightly if that works.
A Bonneville Lakester please barman.
Certainly sir; a lick of salt, a sip of gas and a twist of Lemming. More Lemming sir?
Just a squeeze.

A Squeeze of Lemming it is sir.

Offline Lemming Motors

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #366 on: June 26, 2019, 05:54:18 AM »
I mocked up a battery (lighter than a proper one and less risk of damage test fitting in awkward spaces).

This is becoming a game of tetris. Fuel pump, filters and pressure regulator (with gauge), fuses and relays, battery, fuel tank, extinguisher bottles, cup holder, ice box for inlet air (long shot it will have any effect), airbox and ducting for ITBs, inlet air NACA/ scoop ducting etc.

Dimensionally my mock up battery is just like the one in the catalogue but it won't hold a charge - what did I do wrong?  :-D

Pictured sitting on a chassis rail; this will not be its home. It will weigh around 15 lb - ideally I would like to move it forward under the seat for (slight) weight distribution benefits but that means more holes in the already crowded firewall (most of which will be occluded by the radiator tank). Current count is: shifter rod, throttle cable, clutch and brake line, some wiring from the instruments, chute cable, extinguisher cable times two and extinguisher hose for cockpit nozzles. If the ECU goes in the cockpit that's a large bundle of nerve fibres to pass back to the engine bay and a long wiring run for them too.

At this stage (avoiding the exhaust side of the engine) the battery could sit next to the gear box but that shifts the tank backwards as that is likely to sit in the space on the left of the gearbox (behind the scattershield) too.
The fuel weight being on the left of the vehicle will offset some of the weight of the engine top end canted to the right.
A Bonneville Lakester please barman.
Certainly sir; a lick of salt, a sip of gas and a twist of Lemming. More Lemming sir?
Just a squeeze.

A Squeeze of Lemming it is sir.

Offline Lemming Motors

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #367 on: July 17, 2019, 09:35:04 AM »
The radiator is on its way from the builder so I will soon be able to finalise my engine position and work up the chassis rail bracing from the firewall rearwards. Best I cut some 2mm panel steel and commit to a firewall too.

The tank has a radiator tube top and bottom plus a smaller diameter drain / circulation tube top and bottom - I am thinking of a small water pump to ensure that the tank water is 'mixed' during engine running.

Counting down the days now till we are visiting SW 2019.
$ notes are in the suitcase Rex.
A Bonneville Lakester please barman.
Certainly sir; a lick of salt, a sip of gas and a twist of Lemming. More Lemming sir?
Just a squeeze.

A Squeeze of Lemming it is sir.

Offline Rex Schimmer

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #368 on: July 17, 2019, 11:42:41 AM »
Steering rack and pinion is in a "Bonnevile travel box" awaiting the exchange! Good thinking about a pump to recirculate water in the box.

Rex
Rex

Not much matters and the rest doesn't matter at all.

Offline Lemming Motors

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #369 on: August 01, 2019, 04:55:06 AM »
Message for UK builders
I have two Moon disc dzus tag welding jigs you are welcome to borrow (15" and 17"). I ordered the Moons and associated hardware through JackHammer Hot Rod and Kustom in Farnborough (disclaimer; no affiliation).

I can't find the recent post that was from the Isle of Man (iirc) regarding a Lakester in build in the UK - pm me if you read this and we can help each other.

Three more days at work and its big metal bird time; LHR to LAX to SLC and drive to the Bonneville Salt Flats to watch and learn - yeah  8-).
A Bonneville Lakester please barman.
Certainly sir; a lick of salt, a sip of gas and a twist of Lemming. More Lemming sir?
Just a squeeze.

A Squeeze of Lemming it is sir.

Offline ronnieroadster

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #370 on: August 01, 2019, 01:31:10 PM »
 John your going to be overwhelmed by what you see and the people you meet.  Lots to see and learn your going to enjoy this for sure. If your around the pits in the area of the second row stop by and say hi car is number 8150 front is a drop tank the rear is a roadster  Im hoping were just relaxing and not working on her but thats usually impossible running our vintage engine.   :cheers:
 Ronnieroadster
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Offline Lemming Motors

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #371 on: August 27, 2019, 07:39:23 AM »
Had a great SW, met lots of cool people and learned a lot; I highly recommend a scoping trip to explore (with limited watching of race cars) to get a feel for things - simple things like refueling, wheres the laundromat etc. Even took time to chat at the VP fuel truck and now that is not a mystery.

Came back all inspired and I am determined to get the rear chassis and suspension sorted over the next couple of months. The rear axle build is happening in parallel - the rusty one is for mock-up.

The scalloping of tubing has been simplified, as previously stated, using pvc tube. I found some (sink waste) that is 40mm od and that happens to sleeve over 1.5" OD cds (dom) tubing so its quick to transfer the pattern to the steel and cut with confidence and it is super close - all the junk ones are in plastic - cheaper and quicker. Clarification: the main roll structure is 1.625" tube. The lower rear rail is 1.625" supporting the engine and box etc and the rest (rear of the firewall) is 1.5".

I have given myself the option of sliding block or watts for the rear axle - once the 4 bars etc are done I will noodle on that.   :|

Yes, there is a pile of abandoned scalloped steel tubes in the pic but that's because I did a rethink to work around the motor mounts and the scatter-shield without leaving gaps. I usually get to version 3 before I am happy. Steve's wife very helpfully suggested skipping v.1 and v.2 as that would save time.

Again - thanks to everyone for the chats, the insights and the help.
A Bonneville Lakester please barman.
Certainly sir; a lick of salt, a sip of gas and a twist of Lemming. More Lemming sir?
Just a squeeze.

A Squeeze of Lemming it is sir.

Offline Lemming Motors

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #372 on: August 27, 2019, 07:45:27 AM »
Radiator / water tank.
A Bonneville Lakester please barman.
Certainly sir; a lick of salt, a sip of gas and a twist of Lemming. More Lemming sir?
Just a squeeze.

A Squeeze of Lemming it is sir.

Offline ggl205

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #373 on: August 27, 2019, 09:32:56 AM »
Just noticed your shifter is on the left hand side, John. Are you left handed or is it a UK thing (lol)?

Are you going to use a swirl pot located well above the cylinder head to add coolant?

John
« Last Edit: August 27, 2019, 09:38:07 AM by ggl205 »

Offline kiwi belly tank

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Re: UK Lakester build G/GL
« Reply #374 on: August 27, 2019, 09:48:25 AM »
Right hand drive comfort zone John! I'd be screwed right now if I didn't live in the US as I don't have the use of my left hand.
  Sid.